Overheard at Work

[seanc0x0]

In general I definitely agree with the "spend a little more for quality so you can keep it for longer" but I bought a pair of $15 sunglasses 7 years ago and the only reason I stopped using them is because I needed prescription ones. Granted, I haven't tried high quality so maybe if I did I'd see the value of it

I used to buy in the $100 range. Similar to the designer brands, but without the brand premium. Same light, durable, comfortable construction. Usually last 4-5 yrs. Last pair broke on a trip, and I had to downgrade a bit, went with drugstore cheapies. Found some that are almost as comfortable, only a bit heavier, and not quite as durable (expect will last 3-4 years based on wear).  They were $20. 

I do suspect that mileage varies a lot more in this price range than if you go more upscale, though.

[frugalnacho]

I like the buy it for life attitude and have no problems buying something of quality that will last for a life time, but I have a hard time believing $200-400 sunglasses will function any better than my $10 pair.  Especially once they get stepped on or forgotten somewhere.

[galliver]

Replacing sunglasses is cheap, but replacing eyes can get expensive. ;)

That said I wear $5 ones from Ross. But my bf has pointed out to me, after we've taken a 6 hr drive and I got a splitting headache, that the polarization and better tinting/coating on expensive glasses (I believe his were in the 200-300 range but he got them for $100ish after discounts or gifts?) in general tends to offer significantly better protection from the glare. So the expensive glasses could be an investment from a health & sanity point of view. Driving, hiking, skiing, boating or any other activity in a bright environment is probably much more enjoyable for oneself and one's companions without the headache (and eventual eye damage).

[dycker1978]

Yep. Like with a lot of things, the ridiculous difference in quality isn't apparent until you actually try it. You go, "woah, amazing." And then you use it for years and years and end up paying less than it costs to replace shittier versions.

I can't see how that's true.

Dollar store sunglasses last me about a year (maybe six months if I lose them or they break early, but typically closer to a year).  So if yours last forever, you will come out ahead in approximately.. 200-400 years.

But I clearly don't care that much about sunglasses - my last pair was held together by a paperclip (after one of the screws fell out) for about six months before I stopped being lazy and bought a new $1 pair.  :)

I dont care how much my sunglasses cost as long as they come in a orange box, that people call black...

[NumberCruncher]

I just gotta say this - at $400 for a pair of sunglasses, you are paying for the label  (and maybe design/fashion) more than the quality.

Sure there's a quality difference between $1-$20 drugstore sunglasses and $400 designer sunglasses, but I'd be willing to wager that $100 online at Zenni or something would give you the same quality (probably including a prescription as well).

[RyanAtTanagra]

I dont care how much my sunglasses cost as long as they come in a orange box, that people call black...

I'm drowning in foam

[skunkfunk]

Yep. Like with a lot of things, the ridiculous difference in quality isn't apparent until you actually try it. You go, "woah, amazing." And then you use it for years and years and end up paying less than it costs to replace shittier versions.

I can't see how that's true.

Dollar store sunglasses last me about a year (maybe six months if I lose them or they break early, but typically closer to a year).  So if yours last forever, you will come out ahead in approximately.. 200-400 years.

But I clearly don't care that much about sunglasses - my last pair was held together by a paperclip (after one of the screws fell out) for about six months before I stopped being lazy and bought a new $1 pair.  :)

I just gotta say this - at $400 for a pair of sunglasses, you are paying for the label  (and maybe design/fashion) more than the quality.

Sure there's a quality difference between $1-$20 drugstore sunglasses and $400 designer sunglasses, but I'd be willing to wager that $100 online at Zenni or something would give you the same quality (probably including a prescription as well).

Right on, guys. Personally, I have needed them maybe twice in the last ten years and I do spend a significant amount of time outside. Never seen the point in it.

My wife did insist on fancy sunglasses however, due to headaches or some such. At the suggestion of somebody on this forum we had a pair delivered from zenni optical, $20 total, 100% satisfied, she can't even tell the difference between those and the $200+ stuff.

[HairyUpperLip]

I dont care how much my sunglasses cost as long as they come in a orange box, that people call black...

you bastard...

lol

[HairyUpperLip]

Are black people really orange? ....

[Le Barbu]

I just bought sunglasses with orange tinted lens and now every box I look is ORANGE!

So, how do I know if it's a real black box or not?

Help me, I'm doomed!!!!

[RWD]

I prioritize protection from the sun when choosing my sunglasses. The $1 ones aren't going to cut it, but I don't need to spend $100+ either. I ended up with some Eagle Eyes for around $50.

[dycker1978]

I just bought sunglasses with orange tinted lens and now every box I look is ORANGE!

So, how do I know if it's a real black box or not?

Help me, I'm doomed!!!!

Look for the Red one!

[Le Barbu]

Are black people really orange? ....

I can't tell you, right now, everyone I look at is orange (because of my new sunglasses) I barely can make the difference between people and boxes actually. Sorry !

[fantabulous]

So he spent $1,350 on iPhones within a month! Now he's complaining he doesn't have money for winter tires to put on his brand new (earlier this year) Mazda Miata.

I don't know if I could have avoided saying something along the lines of "There's an app for budgeting so that you don't spend $1400 on phones and don't have the money for winter tires."

[Le Barbu]

So he spent $1,350 on iPhones within a month! Now he's complaining he doesn't have money for winter tires to put on his brand new (earlier this year) Mazda Miata.

I don't know if I could have avoided saying something along the lines of "There's an app for budgeting so that you don't spend $1400 on phones and don't have the money for winter tires."

Is this app could be handled by an obsolete IPhone 5 ?

[Le Barbu]

I just bought sunglasses with orange tinted lens and now every box I look is ORANGE!

So, how do I know if it's a real black box or not?

Help me, I'm doomed!!!!

Look for the Red one!

Thank for the tip, unfortunatly, it was my lunch box I was looking at. If you open it, you could track what I ate for lunch but no flight data or recording of any kind

[dycker1978]

I just bought sunglasses with orange tinted lens and now every box I look is ORANGE!

So, how do I know if it's a real black box or not?

Help me, I'm doomed!!!!

Look for the Red one!

Thank for the tip, unfortunatly, it was my lunch box I was looking at. If you open it, you could track what I ate for lunch but no flight data or recording of any kind

MMMM Lunch... Maybe dont report that one to the FBI?

[sol]

If you paid $200 for a pair of sunglasses, most likely you would take better care of them. I have one pair of sunglasses that I paid about that much for in 2004. So $20/year and decreasing each year.

I used to believe this was true.  I spent over $100 on fancy sunglasses back in 2000 or so.  I lost them two months later, so bought another expensive pair, which lasted almost six months before getting crushed.

I had a pair of $6.99 sunglasses last for three years.  Using the above method, less than $2.40 per year!  Am I genius?

[franklin w. dixon]

At this point, people say to themselves -- work overtime for only $25 per hour in my pocket, instead of $30 per hour during normal hours?

Oh my gosh I have heard this so often about overtime.

I've heard exactly the same thing, it boggles my mind.. If the withholding is to high, you still get it back after taxes are calculated!  Just because you don't have it now doesn't mean it doesn't exist! 

I guess that's just the other side to the huge spending holiday when everyone gets their tax returns...

What really irritates me is that I hear it so often in relation to people on benefits where their benefits get gradually withdrawn the more they earn.  It can mean that there is a high marginal rate of tax on their earnings over a certain level, but they still end up with more money that they are providing for themselves and on the first step to getting off benefits.  But no, it's "not worth it".

Principally due to the phaseout of EITC and certain state tax incentives at low income levels there are times when an additional dollar of income is taxed at an effective rate of over 100%, particularly when other non-income benefits like food stamps, utilities assistance etc. are taken into account. The big picture (whether the effective rate of taxation is 80% of 95% or 110%) is that there's a big doldrums where for income levels between roughly $18,000 and $32000 annually, increasing income doesn't translate into increased buying power. So no, for many people it's not worth it to kill yourself putting in overtime hours at your job at Big Lots in order to received no material recompense. An easy solution would be to use a guaranteed minimum income system instead of EITC but fat chance of that ever happening here in neoliberal utopia.

[gimp]

Yep. Like with a lot of things, the ridiculous difference in quality isn't apparent until you actually try it. You go, "woah, amazing." And then you use it for years and years and end up paying less than it costs to replace shittier versions.

I can't see how that's true.

Dollar store sunglasses last me about a year (maybe six months if I lose them or they break early, but typically closer to a year).  So if yours last forever, you will come out ahead in approximately.. 200-400 years.

But I clearly don't care that much about sunglasses - my last pair was held together by a paperclip (after one of the screws fell out) for about six months before I stopped being lazy and bought a new $1 pair.  :)

You will also note that I have a $50 pair, not a $400 pair. But of course, if you consider the time to go pick decently-fitting, comfortable, and otherwise acceptable sunglasses, and determine the time cost of doing so, $50 pays for itself... fairly quickly. A few years than you quoted!

Maybe if I lose / break these I will change my tune. I'll be sure to let you know, verbosely. :)

[cavewoman]

If you paid $200 for a pair of sunglasses, most likely you would take better care of them. I have one pair of sunglasses that I paid about that much for in 2004. So $20/year and decreasing each year.

I used to believe this was true.  I spent over $100 on fancy sunglasses back in 2000 or so.  I lost them two months later, so bought another expensive pair, which lasted almost six months before getting crushed.

I had a pair of $6.99 sunglasses last for three years.  Using the above method, less than $2.40 per year!  Am I genius?

yes.

[nawhite]

If you paid $200 for a pair of sunglasses, most likely you would take better care of them. I have one pair of sunglasses that I paid about that much for in 2004. So $20/year and decreasing each year.

I used to believe this was true.  I spent over $100 on fancy sunglasses back in 2000 or so.  I lost them two months later, so bought another expensive pair, which lasted almost six months before getting crushed.

I had a pair of $6.99 sunglasses last for three years.  Using the above method, less than $2.40 per year!  Am I genius?

I was the same way. I would buy decent glasses and lose them or break them. Then one of my friends who works on oil rigs introduced me to how amazing safety sunglasses are: http://smile.amazon.com/3M-Virtua-Protective-Eyewear-11327-00000-20/dp/B007JZD754/

$26 for 20 ($1.30 each) and they are nearly indestructible. You can sit on them, keep them in your pocket with keys, or drop them and they won't break. And, even if you lose them they only cost $1.30.

[rocksinmyhead]

I just gotta say this - at $400 for a pair of sunglasses, you are paying for the label  (and maybe design/fashion) more than the quality.

Sure there's a quality difference between $1-$20 drugstore sunglasses and $400 designer sunglasses, but I'd be willing to wager that $100 online at Zenni or something would give you the same quality (probably including a prescription as well).

agreed. there's no way $400 sunglasses can ever be justified as BIFL. that said, I've been wearing cheap or free sunglasses for years and FINALLY bought a $95 Warby Parker pair this summer because I really wanted some polarized glasses for sailing. they are definitely noticeably higher quality and I haven't lost or broken them yet, so that's good (biggest difference being that I actually keep them in a case...)

[gimp]

I was the same way. I would buy decent glasses and lose them or break them. Then one of my friends who works on oil rigs introduced me to how amazing safety sunglasses are: http://smile.amazon.com/3M-Virtua-Protective-Eyewear-11327-00000-20/dp/B007JZD754/

$26 for 20 ($1.30 each) and they are nearly indestructible. You can sit on them, keep them in your pocket with keys, or drop them and they won't break. And, even if you lose them they only cost $1.30.

Dude, awesome. Question. Do they have a version of these that is polarized? And how does it feel to wear them for extended periods of time (5, 10, 15 hours)?

[nawhite]

I was the same way. I would buy decent glasses and lose them or break them. Then one of my friends who works on oil rigs introduced me to how amazing safety sunglasses are: http://smile.amazon.com/3M-Virtua-Protective-Eyewear-11327-00000-20/dp/B007JZD754/

$26 for 20 ($1.30 each) and they are nearly indestructible. You can sit on them, keep them in your pocket with keys, or drop them and they won't break. And, even if you lose them they only cost $1.30.

Dude, awesome. Question. Do they have a version of these that is polarized? And how does it feel to wear them for extended periods of time (5, 10, 15 hours)?

I haven't found polarized ones but they are absolutely comfortable to me (I'll wear them under a kayaking helmet for 8+ hours without issue).

[mydogismyheart]

Ok, I heard a good one at work yesterday.  All sales positions at my work have been hired as independent contractors for the last few years, and therefore, didn't qualify to participate in the company 401K.  Officially as of October 1 we were hired on as full time employees and qualify for all benefits including 401K and a 3% 401K match.  During one of the meetings about it back in September, it was highly recommended that while participation in the 401K is optional, employees should at least contribute the 3% in order to get the match.

So yesterday, we're in a class at the main office, and I hear a guy complaining about the $69 that he was forced to have come out of his paycheck for retirement.  He didn't like that this was being taken out and he was going to put a stop to it immediately. 

I just don't really get it... why wouldn't you want to have that $69 taken out?  Every $69 he has taken out is another $69 matched by the company. $69X 26 paychecks = $1794 in FREE money!!!

[arebelspy]

For someone like that you should explain the math of making the deposit to get the match and then immediately withdrawing the contribution and taking the 10% penalty they'll come out ahead. Just do the math for how much and show them.

If you care.

[civil]

Oh, the joys of a joint service environment. Today:

Sailor: I can't afford anything. I don't know where I'm gonna live.
Civilian 1: We have an internal roommates board you can look at. A room is usually six to eight hundred a month around here.
Sailor: I won't live with other people, that sh!t's for civilians. And married people.
Civilian 2: Your BAH [tax-free housing allowance] should cover an apartment, apartments are like 1400 for a one-bedroom or 1500 for a two-bed.
Sailor: BAH is only 1900. I shouldn't have to live in a two-bedroom! This is so f'd up. Besides, my BAH already goes to the car [a new WRX].
Civilian 1: Dude, your BAH alone is more than my paycheck. You can make it work.
Civilian 2: Well, if you're worried about money, there are lots of military benefits you can take advantage of. Go to the commissary! My husband goes there, and you can save 50% easy, if you shop right!
Sailor: Yeahhhhh... I don't use the commissary, because that's... a Navy thing. And I don't really like things that have to do with the Navy.
Civilian 2: You're an idiot.

Sadly, this earned the civilians a talking-to from the Navy chief.
 
The Army officer across the hall is some sort of super-Mustachian who takes home the civilian-equivalent of a 193K salary and lives in an 8x8 room. Wish we could get him to give lessons.

[vern]

The Army officer across the hall is some sort of super-Mustachian who takes home the civilian-equivalent of a 193K salary and lives in an 8x8 room. Wish we could get him to give lessons.

That reminds me...I once watched a Warrant Officer 4 eat out of the garbage because he wouldn't pay the 85 cents it cost for breakfast in the mess hall.

[former player]

What really irritates me is that I hear it so often in relation to people on benefits where their benefits get gradually withdrawn the more they earn.  It can mean that there is a high marginal rate of tax on their earnings over a certain level, but they still end up with more money that they are providing for themselves and on the first step to getting off benefits.  But no, it's "not worth it".

Principally due to the phaseout of EITC and certain state tax incentives at low income levels there are times when an additional dollar of income is taxed at an effective rate of over 100%, particularly when other non-income benefits like food stamps, utilities assistance etc. are taken into account. The big picture (whether the effective rate of taxation is 80% of 95% or 110%) is that there's a big doldrums where for income levels between roughly $18,000 and $32000 annually, increasing income doesn't translate into increased buying power. So no, for many people it's not worth it to kill yourself putting in overtime hours at your job at Big Lots in order to received no material recompense. An easy solution would be to use a guaranteed minimum income system instead of EITC but fat chance of that ever happening here in neoliberal utopia.

I'm sure you are right for the USA.  I should have said that I was thinking of the UK, where the benefits/tax credit system pretty much removes the problem of losing money but does mean that extra money earned means more money in the pocket, giving it a high marginal "tax" rate in lost benefits which is too often translated to "it's not worth it because I lose so much".  There's a learned dependence which means that far too often people limit their own horizons, to their own long-term detriment.

[frugalnacho]

For someone like that you should explain the math of making the deposit to get the match and then immediately withdrawing the contribution and taking the 10% penalty they'll come out ahead. Just do the math for how much and show them.

If you care.

I was under the impression that the matched money is not truly yours until you have been an employee for a certain length of time, and you have not withdrawn it.  To prevent exactly what you are describing. 

[ender]

For someone like that you should explain the math of making the deposit to get the match and then immediately withdrawing the contribution and taking the 10% penalty they'll come out ahead. Just do the math for how much and show them.

If you care.

I was under the impression that the matched money is not truly yours until you have been an employee for a certain length of time, and you have not withdrawn it.  To prevent exactly what you are describing.

This varies by company and plan.

Mine has a 3 year vesting period, but once you are after that time all company contributions are immediately vested.

What's more important is being able to take inservice withdrawals as I don't think I can actually withdraw money from my 401k directly unless I put it into an IRA. Then I can cash it out completely when I leave, weeee!

[frugalnacho]

For someone like that you should explain the math of making the deposit to get the match and then immediately withdrawing the contribution and taking the 10% penalty they'll come out ahead. Just do the math for how much and show them.

If you care.

I was under the impression that the matched money is not truly yours until you have been an employee for a certain length of time, and you have not withdrawn it.  To prevent exactly what you are describing.

This varies by company and plan.

Mine has a 3 year vesting period, but once you are after that time all company contributions are immediately vested.

What's more important is being able to take inservice withdrawals as I don't think I can actually withdraw money from my 401k directly unless I put it into an IRA. Then I can cash it out completely when I leave, weeee!

The person he was advising just became an employee on Oct 1 though.  I've never heard of a company that didn't have a vesting period.

[arebelspy]

They can't withdraw their own money though?  Or just the matched money?

[RFAAOATB]

Sailor: BAH is only 1900. I shouldn't have to live in a two-bedroom! This is so f'd up. Besides, my BAH already goes to the car [a new WRX].

Basic Allowance for HOUSING used for a car?  Guess the car just got promoted to house.  Dude can live in the parking lot.

[mm1970]

Oh, the joys of a joint service environment. Today:

Sailor: I can't afford anything. I don't know where I'm gonna live.
Civilian 1: We have an internal roommates board you can look at. A room is usually six to eight hundred a month around here.
Sailor: I won't live with other people, that sh!t's for civilians. And married people.
Civilian 2: Your BAH [tax-free housing allowance] should cover an apartment, apartments are like 1400 for a one-bedroom or 1500 for a two-bed.
Sailor: BAH is only 1900. I shouldn't have to live in a two-bedroom! This is so f'd up. Besides, my BAH already goes to the car [a new WRX].
Civilian 1: Dude, your BAH alone is more than my paycheck. You can make it work.
Civilian 2: Well, if you're worried about money, there are lots of military benefits you can take advantage of. Go to the commissary! My husband goes there, and you can save 50% easy, if you shop right!
Sailor: Yeahhhhh... I don't use the commissary, because that's... a Navy thing. And I don't really like things that have to do with the Navy.
Civilian 2: You're an idiot.

Sadly, this earned the civilians a talking-to from the Navy chief.
 
The Army officer across the hall is some sort of super-Mustachian who takes home the civilian-equivalent of a 193K salary and lives in an 8x8 room. Wish we could get him to give lessons.

Sigh.

So the sailor doesn't like Navy things?  Or is this a Coast guard sailor?

[4alpacas]

For someone like that you should explain the math of making the deposit to get the match and then immediately withdrawing the contribution and taking the 10% penalty they'll come out ahead. Just do the math for how much and show them.

If you care.

I was under the impression that the matched money is not truly yours until you have been an employee for a certain length of time, and you have not withdrawn it.  To prevent exactly what you are describing.

This varies by company and plan.

Mine has a 3 year vesting period, but once you are after that time all company contributions are immediately vested.

What's more important is being able to take inservice withdrawals as I don't think I can actually withdraw money from my 401k directly unless I put it into an IRA. Then I can cash it out completely when I leave, weeee!

The person he was advising just became an employee on Oct 1 though.  I've never heard of a company that didn't have a vesting period.

I've never dealt with a vesting period.  I've only worked at two companies though.  But the match was mine as soon as it hit my account!

[GuitarStv]

Not overheard at work, but the previous company I slaved for gave us stock options one year.  I was like "Sweet, I've totally heard about this!  I'm going to make some money by immediately selling my options!"

First of all, the number of options wasn't related to position in the company, salary, performance review, or any other factor we could figure out.  Eventually, running the numbers of the sixteen of us who were friends we determined that the options were given out based on employee height.  Our strike price for the stock options was the same as the market value of the stocks for the company (54 cents).  By the time our vesting period was over the company stock was worth just under a cent (it was delisted from the Toronto Stock Exchange a few months after that).

It was not a successful attempt to boost company morale.

[greenleaf]

Email from my boss:
I'm on vacation today, but will have my blackberry with me and will be returning calls and emails.

Dude.  That's not a vacation. 

And the higher-ups can't figure out why I don't want that job...

[thd7t]

The person he was advising just became an employee on Oct 1 though.  I've never heard of a company that didn't have a vesting period.

I work for the company with instant vesting!  It's awesome and I never expected it!

[Goldielocks]

Not overheard at work, but the previous company I slaved for gave us stock options one year.  I was like "Sweet, I've totally heard about this!  I'm going to make some money by immediately selling my options!"

First of all, the number of options wasn't related to position in the company, salary, performance review, or any other factor we could figure out.  Eventually, running the numbers of the sixteen of us who were friends we determined that the options were given out based on employee height.  Our strike price for the stock options was the same as the market value of the stocks for the company (54 cents).  By the time our vesting period was over the company stock was worth just under a cent (it was delisted from the Toronto Stock Exchange a few months after that).

It was not a successful attempt to boost company morale.

Yeah, I just received options this year, too and did not even read how many for several months.  After two of the companies between DH and I did not pan out, even after holding the blue chip one for 5-8 years, the rose colored glasses are broken. Especially when I was told that because they were paying me 20k below my peers (there can be a dividing line for women, but I ensure it doesn't last long), this was all my boss could get to compensate --a very generous number of options.

Right now though, our (new) company stock is up $10 per share, or almost 20%, and I vest the first wave in January.  Wahoo!  Maybe a bit of money this time, and you can bet I won't be holding on waiting for better returns.  I already have too much company stock in the matching company purchase plan.

[Timmmy]

Email from my boss:
I'm on vacation today, but will have my blackberry with me and will be returning calls and emails.

Dude.  That's not a vacation. 

And the higher-ups can't figure out why I don't want that job...

This is one of the reasons I left my last job.  Told my boss I was going on a week long vacation camping and he flipped out.  "How will you answer emails and texts?!? Will you have your laptop with you?!?" 

[frugalnacho]

They can't withdraw their own money though?  Or just the matched money?

Just the matched money.  But that would negate all the incentive to do the plan you proposed.  Apparently some companies don't have vesting periods (according to recent posts in this thread), but as far as I know a 3 year vesting period is typical.  Usually you get a certain percentage of the employer contribution after a year or so, and it increases with each passing year (or some other arbitrary length of time) until you are "fully" vested and all the matched contributions are yours.

[Goldielocks]

Email from my boss:
I'm on vacation today, but will have my blackberry with me and will be returning calls and emails.

Dude.  That's not a vacation. 

And the higher-ups can't figure out why I don't want that job...

This is one of the reasons I left my last job.  Told my boss I was going on a week long vacation camping and he flipped out.  "How will you answer emails and texts?!? Will you have your laptop with you?!?"

LOL. That's exactly why we plan to camp in the mountains each year.  No service even if you beg.

[BooksAreNerdy]

Not overheard at work, but the previous company I slaved for gave us stock options one year.  I was like "Sweet, I've totally heard about this!  I'm going to make some money by immediately selling my options!"

First of all, the number of options wasn't related to position in the company, salary, performance review, or any other factor we could figure out.  Eventually, running the numbers of the sixteen of us who were friends we determined that the options were given out based on employee height.  Our strike price for the stock options was the same as the market value of the stocks for the company (54 cents).  By the time our vesting period was over the company stock was worth just under a cent (it was delisted from the Toronto Stock Exchange a few months after that).

It was not a successful attempt to boost company morale.

Yeah, I just received options this year, too and did not even read how many for several months.  After two of the companies between DH and I did not pan out, even after holding the blue chip one for 5-8 years, the rose colored glasses are broken. Especially when I was told that because they were paying me 20k below my peers (there can be a dividing line for women, but I ensure it doesn't last long), this was all my boss could get to compensate --a very generous number of options.

Right now though, our (new) company stock is up $10 per share, or almost 20%, and I vest the first wave in January.  Wahoo!  Maybe a bit of money this time, and you can bet I won't be holding on waiting for better returns.  I already have too much company stock in the matching company purchase plan.

What color does the box look now?

And are those designer?

[galliver]

Email from my boss:
I'm on vacation today, but will have my blackberry with me and will be returning calls and emails.

Dude.  That's not a vacation. 

And the higher-ups can't figure out why I don't want that job...

This is one of the reasons I left my last job.  Told my boss I was going on a week long vacation camping and he flipped out.  "How will you answer emails and texts?!? Will you have your laptop with you?!?"

I hope at some point you explained to him what a "vacation" was. Compared to "working remotely" or "on-call".

[Timmmy]

Email from my boss:
I'm on vacation today, but will have my blackberry with me and will be returning calls and emails.

Dude.  That's not a vacation. 

And the higher-ups can't figure out why I don't want that job...

This is one of the reasons I left my last job.  Told my boss I was going on a week long vacation camping and he flipped out.  "How will you answer emails and texts?!? Will you have your laptop with you?!?"

I hope at some point you explained to him what a "vacation" was. Compared to "working remotely" or "on-call".

I did.  He was none too happy.  I also explained to him that the three critical positions that I was covering for should not all be handled by one person because I could walk out the front door and get hit by a bus and they'd be screwed.  He didn't like that either.

Not that I had my phone on but he did call me several times while I was on my honeymoon in Jamaica...

[gimp]

Y'all have some shitty bosses, or you're in very high management positions.

There's "working from home" and there's "feeling sick but answering emails" and there's "taking a day to run errands" but a real vacation means "find people to take over your responsibilities entirely". I've yet to have a boss who doesn't understand this.

Besides which, the reason a company gives you vacation isn't because they're super nice - it's because they need you to occasionally get rest and come back recharged so you can keep working at a high level for years. A non-vacation vacation just means burnout, not giving a fuck, and/or leaving jobs. Replacing people is really, really fucking expensive - for quite a few jobs in my industry, averages are $50k+ per head. Let's do the math, $50k a head versus, what, twenty hours of productivity a year you might gain if you force people to respond to emails on vacation? More likely two than twenty, if things are properly structured.

[tmac]

Email from my boss:
I'm on vacation today, but will have my blackberry with me and will be returning calls and emails.

Dude.  That's not a vacation. 

And the higher-ups can't figure out why I don't want that job...

This is one of the reasons I left my last job.  Told my boss I was going on a week long vacation camping and he flipped out.  "How will you answer emails and texts?!? Will you have your laptop with you?!?"

I hope at some point you explained to him what a "vacation" was. Compared to "working remotely" or "on-call".

I did.  He was none too happy.  I also explained to him that the three critical positions that I was covering for should not all be handled by one person because I could walk out the front door and get hit by a bus and they'd be screwed.  He didn't like that either.

Not that I had my phone on but he did call me several times while I was on my honeymoon in Jamaica...

Dh and I worked at the same company years ago, and got back from a week-long trip to Mexico to find Dh's work voicemail overflowing with increasingly angry messages from the company president, even though he knew he was on vacation.

My favorite enraged quote: "How DARE you ignore me! I'm the fucking president of this god-damn company, and you WILL show me the respect I deserve!"

Riiight. We didn't last much longer there. Dh was fired within the month, and I walked out a month later.

[Joggernot]

They can't withdraw their own money though?  Or just the matched money?

Just the matched money.  But that would negate all the incentive to do the plan you proposed.  Apparently some companies don't have vesting periods (according to recent posts in this thread), but as far as I know a 3 year vesting period is typical.  Usually you get a certain percentage of the employer contribution after a year or so, and it increases with each passing year (or some other arbitrary length of time) until you are "fully" vested and all the matched contributions are yours.

As a contractor I worked 5 years with one company and was fully vested in their 401k.  When the new contractor took over, we all rebelled because we knew they couldn't get replacements to move where we lived.  We negotiated instant vesting in their 401k and got to keep our current level of vacation.  We did this same thing with the third company that took over the contract as well.  Remember to ask at your new company.  You might be pleasantly surprised.