Overheard at Work

[pancakes]

I had to look up what a K-Cup is and and I'm afraid to say that I'd either go without coffee or buy it from a cafe.

I try not to be overly snobby about a lot of things but coffee I can't let go of. I also can't look past how wasteful those coffee pods are. At least most cafes around me will let me byo cup (though not many will give a discount for it)

[mtn]

I had to look up what a K-Cup is and and I'm afraid to say that I'd either go without coffee or buy it from a cafe.

I try not to be overly snobby about a lot of things but coffee I can't let go of. I also can't look past how wasteful those coffee pods are. At least most cafes around me will let me byo cup (though not many will give a discount for it)

This, for me. At work, we have a coffee pot with mediocre coffee, and the K-cups (which can be very good). I'm going to buy a reusable K-cup filter and bring in my own coffee. Will be much cheaper and will be better coffee as well.

[I'm a red panda]

Also its less hassle.

This part can't be right. Because they complain about how long the Java House line was, or the drive through or whatever.  I'm sure you're right that it is just routine, but what a waste of money!

If we didn't get to request the type of coffee we wanted, that would make more sense- but you can ask for the kind you want, so preference isn't really a thing.  K-cup is brewed coffee, not instant crystals (there is a filter in them). 

I hate the waste though. That's why I generally don't use them, but I just don't drink coffee on most days and drink water.

[dandarc]

I went with a buddy of mine to Walmart.  He wanted to pick up some stuff to make green bean casserole.  He somehow ended up spending over $200.

I'm assuming he didn't have any way to cook the casserole, and so purchased an oven or a microwave or a grill or something similar.

[Zikoris]

Not overheard, but an observation about work.
Our office provides 10 different types of coffee K-cups, 5 teas, and 2 hot chocolates.  You can request specifically the ones you want.  We have a fridge where you can store milk and creamer, and cabinets where you can put flavor syrups (some people do).

Why do people STILL go to coffee shops and buy their coffee?

I think some of it is wanting to get out of the office.

[Le Barbu]

Not overheard, but an observation about work.
Our office provides 10 different types of coffee K-cups, 5 teas, and 2 hot chocolates.  You can request specifically the ones you want.  We have a fridge where you can store milk and creamer, and cabinets where you can put flavor syrups (some people do).

Why do people STILL go to coffee shops and buy their coffee?

I think some of it is wanting to get out of the office.

what they dont realize is the more they get out of the office to buy a coffee, the latter they will get out forever

[dorothyc]

I had to look up what a K-Cup is and and I'm afraid to say that I'd either go without coffee or buy it from a cafe.

I try not to be overly snobby about a lot of things but coffee I can't let go of. I also can't look past how wasteful those coffee pods are. At least most cafes around me will let me byo cup (though not many will give a discount for it)

This, for me. At work, we have a coffee pot with mediocre coffee, and the K-cups (which can be very good). I'm going to buy a reusable K-cup filter and bring in my own coffee. Will be much cheaper and will be better coffee as well.

I have a reusable KCup filter that came with the machine I bought, but just be aware that they have a very small capacity so make pretty weak coffee. I use a Bodum Cafe solo when I want different coffee than comes in the KCups, or I have a double walled steel Bodum Columbia pot if I want to make more. We also have a KCup machine at work, which is bring your own, or pre ground coffee which is pretty burnt and dire tasting, for free.

[I'm a red panda]

I think some of it is wanting to get out of the office.

This would make sense if they were going during the day, but we just don't have time for that (we get 30 minutes for lunch)

They bring a cup in with them in the morning.  (I also can't think it is needing coffee for a long commute, because these are the people who live 10-15 minutes away.)

[eyePod]

An acquaintance just told me that her and her husband have racked up a combined $700,000 in student loans!!!  When a relative gave her a thousand dollars for Christmas gift, she went out and spent it on fancy Tory Burch bags.

Her husband and her are both doctors and their loans are in forebearance while they finish their residency programs.  I have no idea what they are going to do once they enter repayment.

There are non-profit options where they can work for something like 5 or 10 years and have the entire loan forgiven...

which options are those ? all the non profit options i thought were like 15/20 years. alot of you prime earning years

Article is from 2012 but this only required 3 years.

http://www.usnews.com/education/blogs/medical-school-admissions-doctor/2012/02/20/explore-new-options-to-repay-medical-school-loans

[skunkfunk]

I went with a buddy of mine to Walmart.  He wanted to pick up some stuff to make green bean casserole.  He somehow ended up spending over $200.  But, I didn't plan on buying anything, and then I spent 5 dollars!  So who's the real anti-mustachian here?!

Percentage wise you are more over budget so I think you are.

I disagree.

Friend's budget for green bean casserole: $10 (To make the math easier.)
Friend's spending: $200
Over budget amount: $190
Percentage over budget: $190/$10 = 19 = 1,900%

Robotclown's budget: $0
Robotclown's spending: $5
Percentage over budget: $5/$0 = DIVISION BY ZERO ERROR

Robotclown's spending as a percentage cannot be calculated, so you can't say that it's greater than his friend's.

or it's just infinity

That's what by thought, doesn't division b zero create an asymptote that leads to +/- infinity? Math geeks please chime in, since I can't remember anything from Partial Diff Eq.

I think we had that discussion on like page 80. Whenever people were talking about gambling odds. tl;dr it's not interesting.

You approach from + and get +infinity. You approach from - and get -infinity. The both sides don't converge to the same number, so it's some undefined number between those two, or basically anything. That's my remembering anyways.

In the physics world, occasionally you just throw a number at it that makes your stuff work out correctly. Much hand-waving!

[greenmimama]

I was speaking to a co-worker of mine (we're good friends) and we started talking about her husband's business.  She tells me that he drives a truck full of cars from Miami to NY and back, and does this every other week.  I ask her more about the business (I was genuinely interested) and after working out the numbers, she tells me that he makes about $6,500 every 2 weeks, or $170,000/yr shipping cars.  He has been doing this for 10 years now.   He could do it every week ( and earn $6,500 per week, but doesn't like being away of the house so often).

Me:  Wow, I would have quit working a long time ago, why do you even work?  Live the life!
CW: I need to work because we are going to buy a house soon and I need to show income in order to qualify for the mortgage.  My husband gets paid mostly in cash, and it's harder to qualify for a loan that way.
Me: Why do you need a loan?  Just buy it cash.
CW: You can't buy a good house for cash!  Also, we don't have $150,000 cash!

Yeah, I guess after earning $1.7 million in then years, there is no way anyone could save money for a house.  Also, since my CW is trying to show high income in order to qualify for the mortgage, she is working about 65-70 hours a week to earn overtime.  She also always complains that when she gets home her kids are asleep, and that she barely spends any time with them.  The worst part of it all is that she believes that she is doing things the right way, and that the only way to buy this house is to keep working these crazy hours in order to qualify for the mortgage.

Wow, that is really sad, but I bet that $170 is before expenses, which area really high with trucking, fuel, upkeep, new truck? not cheap at all, and even with all that they still could have saved up $150 if they were just a little careful

No.  The 170k is after expenses.  I still can't believe it.

Wow, that is especially sad, where did all their money go, is it tied up in investments?

[mtn]

I went with a buddy of mine to Walmart.  He wanted to pick up some stuff to make green bean casserole.  He somehow ended up spending over $200.  But, I didn't plan on buying anything, and then I spent 5 dollars!  So who's the real anti-mustachian here?!

Percentage wise you are more over budget so I think you are.

I disagree.

Friend's budget for green bean casserole: $10 (To make the math easier.)
Friend's spending: $200
Over budget amount: $190
Percentage over budget: $190/$10 = 19 = 1,900%

Robotclown's budget: $0
Robotclown's spending: $5
Percentage over budget: $5/$0 = DIVISION BY ZERO ERROR

Robotclown's spending as a percentage cannot be calculated, so you can't say that it's greater than his friend's.

or it's just infinity

That's what by thought, doesn't division b zero create an asymptote that leads to +/- infinity? Math geeks please chime in, since I can't remember anything from Partial Diff Eq.

I think we had that discussion on like page 80. Whenever people were talking about gambling odds. tl;dr it's not interesting.

You approach from + and get +infinity. You approach from - and get -infinity. The both sides don't converge to the same number, so it's some undefined number between those two, or basically anything. That's my remembering anyways.

In practice, you can't get a negative here, so you would be able to ignore that side and approach the limit from only one direction--although that is not a complete proof, it is what works in the real world. When we start getting into 4+ dimensions this won't work.

EDIT: Assuming you don't find  or earn money on the trip that you would not have otherwise found or earned, you can't get a negative.  Just to be clear.

[notquitefrugal]

When I first heard people talking about k-cups, I thought it was a new larger size of designer fake boobs. Larger than a D-cup, which is already larger than I find attractive.

[Eric]

Wow, that is especially sad, where did all their money go, is it tied up in investments?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!  Oh, greenmimama, you're too much!  Now might be a good time to read the other 132 pages in this thread.  :)

[robotclown]

So my coworker (he of the $35000 sports car at 8% interest) has more to contribute.  He's ALREADY dissatisfied, so he's looking to add a turbocharger and $4000 rims (because those are the best rims, you see.)  I told him $4000 was more than my entire car.

[Elliot]

When I first heard people talking about k-cups, I thought it was a new larger size of designer fake boobs. Larger than a D-cup, which is already larger than I find attractive.

You realize that K is already a size? Not a particularly uncommon one, relegated to Penthouse spreads?

[kathrynd]

Some people have more money than brains.

[horsepoor]

Coworker who needs to work past minimum retirement age supposedly due to her ex husband's bonehead financial maneuvers showed me her $300 Bose earbuds this morning, then later told me she's replacing her Sleep Number bed with a tricked out top of the lone Sleep Number that is "a major expenditure."

[CDP45]

I was dreaming out loud about a full size pick up to a coworker, who chimined in yea those are spendy! I said, right?? They want $27k for a 4x4 crew cab f150, crazy. He said ohh it's more than that, I always get a higher package with leather , radio, and an upgraded horsepower engine etc...more like $55k. His current truck is a Nissan Frontier, basically a jalopy for broke contractors, that he has leather in! And the upgraded radio! Said he doesn't want to regret the better options down the road. Best part, he lives in attached housing with no yard and has been and will be a desk jockey paper pusher his whole life. wtf??

1. How can they charge double for basically adding lipstick?
2. Wtf I though girls were crazy spending on clothes, but $20k on a truck in the city??

[Khaetra]

1. How can they charge double for basically adding lipstick?
2. Wtf I though girls were crazy spending on clothes, but $20k on a truck in the city??

You would be amazed at how many trucks I see that are lifted, with expensive off-road tires and blinged out on a daily basis.  Supposedly you're cool if you have one of these.  I think I'll keep my money and remain uncool.

[benjenn]

We have a coffee pot that uses the k-cups (it was a gift).  We purchased a huge amount of k-cups on-line for WAY less than they would cost in the stores but it was still too costly (even though we bought them before finding MMM). Someone cautioned me against the refillable cups but I found just lids for the k-cups that are reusable.  So you just rinse out the used k-cups, fill them with the coffee of your choice, plug in the new lid and you're good to go.  You have to get the cup lined up (the machine puts a hole in the bottom the first time you use it) but it makes great coffee and the cost is so much less than the k-cups.  You can re-use the cups multiple times by just rinsing them out.  We probably have 100 or so empty k-cups just waiting to be used.  We've gone through less than two bags of coffee in just over a month which is WAY cheaper than buying more k-cups.  I would guess we'll be set on k-cups for at least the next year, possibly longer.

[rocksinmyhead]

1. How can they charge double for basically adding lipstick?
2. Wtf I though girls were crazy spending on clothes, but $20k on a truck in the city??

You would be amazed at how many trucks I see that are lifted, with expensive off-road tires and blinged out on a daily basis.  Supposedly you're cool if you have one of these.  I think I'll keep my money and remain uncool.

oh yeah. that's a really big thing here. a lot of them barely fit in our parking garage.

[greenmimama]

Wow, that is especially sad, where did all their money go, is it tied up in investments?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!  Oh, greenmimama, you're too much!  Now might be a good time to read the other 132 pages in this thread.  :)

I've read it all, I guess It's just hard to imagine, although not really, but they don't own a house yet? I also like to try and believe the best about people, but that is passing quickly about finances.

I have said before we don't have money for that, but really technically I meant, I don't want to spend money on that. But people don't really get it when you say it like that do they?

Anyway, glad I could make you laugh.

[zephyr911]

We're attempting to add direct deposit capabilities to our payroll, and I was discussing it with our employees (8 guys, all h.s. educated but not much if any more).  While talking about their pay just being deposited each week and receiving a paper showing your 401k deduction and taxes paid each week instead, the boss mentioned the possibility of changing to paying biweekly.  One guy says "well the paycheck will be bigger, so the government will take more taxes out, and I'll get less money".  I explained how our payroll systems takes the amount of any one week check, figures out how much this would be over a year, and that same tax rate would be applied to a paycheck over two weeks.  Nope, he's convinced a biweekly paycheck would mean less net pay because the government is evil. Oy.

I've pretty much given up arguing with people who reject such irrefutably simple math+logic arguments. There's something going on behind the face there that will drive you crazy if you try to reason with it.

[johnny847]

We're attempting to add direct deposit capabilities to our payroll, and I was discussing it with our employees (8 guys, all h.s. educated but not much if any more).  While talking about their pay just being deposited each week and receiving a paper showing your 401k deduction and taxes paid each week instead, the boss mentioned the possibility of changing to paying biweekly.  One guy says "well the paycheck will be bigger, so the government will take more taxes out, and I'll get less money".  I explained how our payroll systems takes the amount of any one week check, figures out how much this would be over a year, and that same tax rate would be applied to a paycheck over two weeks.  Nope, he's convinced a biweekly paycheck would mean less net pay because the government is evil. Oy.

I've pretty much given up arguing with people who reject such irrefutably simple math+logic arguments. There's something going on behind the face there that will drive you crazy if you try to reason with it.

Yea you can't really reason with the doesn't want to learn crowd.

Though I will mention there is actually an interesting corner case where switching to biweekly can cause an increase in taxes. Apparently this occurs once every five years or so? but it is possible to have 27 biweekly paychecks in a calendar year, instead of 26, since 52*7 = 364 =/= 365. This year is such an example - for those whose biweekly paychecks start 1/1 or 1/2. For those who start 1/1, they will get a 27th paycheck on 12/31. For those who start 1/2, they would get a paycheck on 1/1/2016, but some employers will issue a paycheck one day early in the case of a bank holiday. I'm paid biweekly and got my first paycheck on 1/2, so I may end up in this situation this year. I won't know until my employer publishes their pay schedule for the next fiscal year, which ends in June, not December.
Hence, once every 5(?) years, more of your income will be subject to your marginal rate, and hence, you will pay more in taxes.

But obviously, that's not what Apples's coworkers were talking about.

[zephyr911]

Yeah I hear ya, but for me, it is music to my ears! As a wholesaler, we don't sell much in the first quarter because retailers don't have much demand from their customers (many are tapped out after Christmas), but things perk up around mid-March as customers start collecting their tax returns.

Forgive the pedantry, but we're all financial hackers here, or at least trying to be, and precision counts: you submit a return to the government; you receive a refund.
--a former tax prep guy

[mm1970]

We're attempting to add direct deposit capabilities to our payroll, and I was discussing it with our employees (8 guys, all h.s. educated but not much if any more).  While talking about their pay just being deposited each week and receiving a paper showing your 401k deduction and taxes paid each week instead, the boss mentioned the possibility of changing to paying biweekly.  One guy says "well the paycheck will be bigger, so the government will take more taxes out, and I'll get less money".  I explained how our payroll systems takes the amount of any one week check, figures out how much this would be over a year, and that same tax rate would be applied to a paycheck over two weeks.  Nope, he's convinced a biweekly paycheck would mean less net pay because the government is evil. Oy.

I've pretty much given up arguing with people who reject such irrefutably simple math+logic arguments. There's something going on behind the face there that will drive you crazy if you try to reason with it.

Yea you can't really reason with the doesn't want to learn crowd.

Though I will mention there is actually an interesting corner case where switching to biweekly can cause an increase in taxes. Apparently this occurs once every five years or so? but it is possible to have 27 biweekly paychecks in a calendar year, instead of 26, since 52*7 = 364 =/= 365. This year is such an example - for those whose biweekly paychecks start 1/1 or 1/2. For those who start 1/1, they will get a 27th paycheck on 12/31. For those who start 1/2, they would get a paycheck on 1/1/2016, but some employers will issue a paycheck one day early in the case of a bank holiday. I'm paid biweekly and got my first paycheck on 1/2, so I may end up in this situation this year. I won't know until my employer publishes their pay schedule for the next fiscal year, which ends in June, not December.
Hence, once every 5(?) years, more of your income will be subject to your marginal rate, and hence, you will pay more in taxes.

But obviously, that's not what Apples's coworkers were talking about.

A lot of companies actually figured this out and decreased the bi-weekly paycheck to make the annual amount the same (for exempt)

[johnny847]

A lot of companies actually figured this out and decreased the bi-weekly paycheck to make the annual amount the same (for exempt)

Oh that's good to hear.
But for people paid hourly, such as myself, this is still an issue (and I realize you know this - just pointing it out for others).

[Timmmy]

Yeah I hear ya, but for me, it is music to my ears! As a wholesaler, we don't sell much in the first quarter because retailers don't have much demand from their customers (many are tapped out after Christmas), but things perk up around mid-March as customers start collecting their tax returns.

Forgive the pedantry, but we're all financial hackers here, or at least trying to be, and precision counts: you submit a return to the government; you receive a [/i]refund[/i].
--a former tax prep guy

If we expect people to learn about this stuff, we need to make sure we are using the right terminology.  Otherwise it's confusing for the people that are trying to learn. 

[gimp]

I was dreaming out loud about a full size pick up to a coworker, who chimined in yea those are spendy! I said, right?? They want $27k for a 4x4 crew cab f150, crazy. He said ohh it's more than that, I always get a higher package with leather , radio, and an upgraded horsepower engine etc...more like $55k. His current truck is a Nissan Frontier, basically a jalopy for broke contractors, that he has leather in! And the upgraded radio! Said he doesn't want to regret the better options down the road. Best part, he lives in attached housing with no yard and has been and will be a desk jockey paper pusher his whole life. wtf??

1. How can they charge double for basically adding lipstick?
2. Wtf I though girls were crazy spending on clothes, but $20k on a truck in the city??

Yup. So if you're going to spend that much on a pickup to look cool, at least get a raptor. Then you look 'cool.' Or get an actually fun car, that isn't a fucking pickup truck, because you'll at least get some enjoyment out of it.

I mean, or don't spend nearly that much, but if you are... why the fuck would you get an f150?

[gimp]

Yeah, I have 27 paychecks this year I think. Slightly higher taxes this, slightly less next, I don't give a fuck.

[Future Lazy]

"It's so expensive to eat healthy. It's cheap to eat unhealthy."

The same person, minutes later...

"I've never eaten raw green beans before! I didn't know you even could eat raw green beans..."

[johnny847]

Yeah, I have 27 paychecks this year I think. Slightly higher taxes this, slightly less next, I don't give a fuck.

I think you're missing the point that I was trying to make. Using a biweekly system for hourly paid jobs raises taxes once every X years compared to a semimonthly or monthly pay cycle.

[MgoSam]

"It's so expensive to eat healthy. It's cheap to eat unhealthy."

The same person, minutes later...

"I've never eaten raw green beans before! I didn't know you even could eat raw green beans..."

Eating healthy doesn't necessarily need to be expensive nor difficult, I do recommend trying to encourage ways for her to be healthy.

[gimp]

I agreed with your point, actually. I just added that I am happy to be in a position where it doesn't affect me materially.

[fantabulous]

I was dreaming out loud about a full size pick up to a coworker, who chimined in yea those are spendy! I said, right?? They want $27k for a 4x4 crew cab f150, crazy. He said ohh it's more than that, I always get a higher package with leather , radio, and an upgraded horsepower engine etc...more like $55k. His current truck is a Nissan Frontier, basically a jalopy for broke contractors, that he has leather in! And the upgraded radio! Said he doesn't want to regret the better options down the road. Best part, he lives in attached housing with no yard and has been and will be a desk jockey paper pusher his whole life. wtf??

1. How can they charge double for basically adding lipstick?
2. Wtf I though girls were crazy spending on clothes, but $20k on a truck in the city??

Yup. So if you're going to spend that much on a pickup to look cool, at least get a raptor. Then you look 'cool.' Or get an actually fun car, that isn't a fucking pickup truck, because you'll at least get some enjoyment out of it.

I mean, or don't spend nearly that much, but if you are... why the fuck would you get an f150?

I've always wondered why Ford doesn't just sell F150 strapons for the men who are insecure in their masculinity and seek out a truck based on their insecurity.

[johnny847]

I agreed with your point, actually. I just added that I am happy to be in a position where it doesn't affect me materially.

Ah gotcha.

[zephyr911]

1. How can they charge double for basically adding lipstick?
2. Wtf I though girls were crazy spending on clothes, but $20k on a truck in the city??

You would be amazed at how many trucks I see that are lifted, with expensive off-road tires and blinged out on a daily basis.  Supposedly you're cool if you have one of these.  I think I'll keep my money and remain uncool.

oh yeah. that's a really big thing here. a lot of them barely fit in our parking garage.

Bama here. My office is full of people who drive full-size trucks and SUVs long distances carrying only themselves - and maybe a laptop - just to park at the office and sit in front of a computer all day. I don't get it. Some of them occasionally do outdoorsy stuff but most are sedentary retirees on their second career. Maybe they all make enough that gas doesn't figure in their equations, but every day when I walk in I just visualize huge piles of dollars going up in smoke.

[Bobberth]

My coworker has spent the last 8 weeks shopping for a car while at work.  I'm not sure what kind she finally settled on but it's a "good deal" for $38,600.  Talking to her during these last 2 months of shopping, and hearing about how stressful this search was, she mentioned one time they would have a baby in the next 1-2 years and another time a baby in 3-4 years and then at that point she would need to upgrade to a SUV for safety.  So sometime in the next 1-4 years, she will need to sell this car and buy a new expensive SUV.  I tried to talk her into keeping her current car-2009 VW Jetta with only 50k miles on it-until she has a baby and is ready to upgrade as it would relieve the stress and save money.  "I don't like to run my cars into the ground," was her response.

She also mentioned how she was going to go for the longer financing term because, "What if something comes up for $200, that lower payment can make a real difference."

[jordanread]

" that lower payment can make a real difference."

I suppose for her it would.

[notquitefrugal]

When I first heard people talking about k-cups, I thought it was a new larger size of designer fake boobs. Larger than a D-cup, which is already larger than I find attractive.

You realize that K is already a size? Not a particularly uncommon one, relegated to Penthouse spreads?

No, but that sounds unappealing.

[trailrated]

Just mentioned this guy in a new thread I started about tax returns... but same guy that maxed out his credit cards to buy a tactical fanny pack, knife, and few hundred dollar watch (that broke after a week on the job) went out and bough an AR-15 and two separate scopes for it... then was complaining that he had to wait two paychecks to afford bullets to go shooting (one paycheck went to the deposit to hold the gun, the next went to the other half of the gun....and the one he is waiting on will buy the bullets.

[trailrated]

He needed the deluxe version because.... it is more tactical?

[BryStachian]

CW was asking how I eat the same thing so many days in a row (my lovely girlfriend made some delicious homemade barbacoa). The same CW went to the Chipotle across the street 5/5 days for the same order.

[Wings5]

Bama here. My office is full of people who drive full-size trucks and SUVs long distances carrying only themselves - and maybe a laptop - just to park at the office and sit in front of a computer all day. I don't get it. Some of them occasionally do outdoorsy stuff but most are sedentary retirees on their second career. Maybe they all make enough that gas doesn't figure in their equations, but every day when I walk in I just visualize huge piles of dollars going up in smoke.

Yep, I work with a few people who own lifted full-size trucks to tow their boat. Then, they buy something else for around $10k that "gets good gas mileage and keeps mileage off my truck".

[Gilead1986]

Just mentioned this guy in a new thread I started about tax returns... but same guy that maxed out his credit cards to buy a tactical fanny pack, knife, and few hundred dollar watch (that broke after a week on the job) went out and bough an AR-15 and two separate scopes for it... then was complaining that he had to wait two paychecks to afford bullets to go shooting (one paycheck went to the deposit to hold the gun, the next went to the other half of the gun....and the one he is waiting on will buy the bullets.

One of my co-workers does the same thing.  When I told him that he should be putting money into retirement or saving for his kid, he says "what's the point, the worlds going to end soon anyways, may as well buy guns, ammunition and knives now".  With the money he's spent on guns he'll never use he could have bought a lathe and made as many guns as he wanted, and a belt grinder to make as many knives as he wanted.   

[Apples]

We're attempting to add direct deposit capabilities to our payroll, and I was discussing it with our employees (8 guys, all h.s. educated but not much if any more).  While talking about their pay just being deposited each week and receiving a paper showing your 401k deduction and taxes paid each week instead, the boss mentioned the possibility of changing to paying biweekly.  One guy says "well the paycheck will be bigger, so the government will take more taxes out, and I'll get less money".  I explained how our payroll systems takes the amount of any one week check, figures out how much this would be over a year, and that same tax rate would be applied to a paycheck over two weeks.  Nope, he's convinced a biweekly paycheck would mean less net pay because the government is evil. Oy.

I've pretty much given up arguing with people who reject such irrefutably simple math+logic arguments. There's something going on behind the face there that will drive you crazy if you try to reason with it.

Yea you can't really reason with the doesn't want to learn crowd.

Though I will mention there is actually an interesting corner case where switching to biweekly can cause an increase in taxes. Apparently this occurs once every five years or so? but it is possible to have 27 biweekly paychecks in a calendar year, instead of 26, since 52*7 = 364 =/= 365. This year is such an example - for those whose biweekly paychecks start 1/1 or 1/2. For those who start 1/1, they will get a 27th paycheck on 12/31. For those who start 1/2, they would get a paycheck on 1/1/2016, but some employers will issue a paycheck one day early in the case of a bank holiday. I'm paid biweekly and got my first paycheck on 1/2, so I may end up in this situation this year. I won't know until my employer publishes their pay schedule for the next fiscal year, which ends in June, not December.
Hence, once every 5(?) years, more of your income will be subject to your marginal rate, and hence, you will pay more in taxes.

But obviously, that's not what Apples's coworkers were talking about.

They have 53 paychecks a year more often than the biweekly crowd has 27 paychecks a year, so this phenomenon happens to them more often than the office worker crowd that's getting all worked up about it this year (painting broad strokes here-not everyone cares/is getting worked up about it).  All but one are thrilled with their sizeable refunds each spring, so they probably don't notice the slightly higher effective tax rate.  But like zephyr said above, it's impossible to reason with people who don't want to learn and don' think this is a logical system that can be learned because the government is just out to take all their money.  So I just turn to this thread and share my frustrations with all of you enlightened folks :)

[eyePod]

"It's so expensive to eat healthy. It's cheap to eat unhealthy."

The same person, minutes later...

"I've never eaten raw green beans before! I didn't know you even could eat raw green beans..."

I didn't eat vegetables until I was out of college. It can happen. I really didn't like them at all and still don't love a lot of them. Peppers, onions, mushrooms, and sweet potatoes. That's all I'm comfortable with now. I'll eat pan fried green beans but they're not my top choice.

[rocksinmyhead]

"It's so expensive to eat healthy. It's cheap to eat unhealthy."

The same person, minutes later...

"I've never eaten raw green beans before! I didn't know you even could eat raw green beans..."

I didn't eat vegetables until I was out of college. It can happen. I really didn't like them at all and still don't love a lot of them. Peppers, onions, mushrooms, and sweet potatoes. That's all I'm comfortable with now. I'll eat pan fried green beans but they're not my top choice.

I feel like I have a pretty varied palate but I've never eaten raw green beans. I always cook them. Is that weird?

[Pooperman]

"It's so expensive to eat healthy. It's cheap to eat unhealthy."

The same person, minutes later...

"I've never eaten raw green beans before! I didn't know you even could eat raw green beans..."

I didn't eat vegetables until I was out of college. It can happen. I really didn't like them at all and still don't love a lot of them. Peppers, onions, mushrooms, and sweet potatoes. That's all I'm comfortable with now. I'll eat pan fried green beans but they're not my top choice.

I feel like I have a pretty varied palate but I've never eaten raw green beans. I always cook them. Is that weird?

Not weird. So long as they aren't limp I'm ok eating cooked vegetables. My mother hates cooked carrots, and another family member will only eat them cooked.