Overheard at Work

[arebelspy]

That's an urban legend. Sharks don't have to continually move.

[EricL]

That's an urban legend. Sharks don't have to continually move.

He's a nice guy.  So I hope that's true for him too!

[gooki]

That's an urban legend. Sharks don't have to continually move.

About time I had an opportunity to pimp my friends move. Go watch Ghost Shark 2: Urban Jaws http://www.ghostshark2.com

[cripzychiken]

That's an urban legend. Sharks don't have to continually move.

Semi urban legend.  While some sharks can stop moving and still are able to pump water over their gills (nurse sharks) other sharks are not able to (great whites, hammer heads).  They might be able to stop if they find a particularly O2 rich area until the O2 is used up, but if they stop moving for too long, they stop getting fresh O2 from the water, they don't breathe, they die. 

[merula]

More sea foam: Some sharks need to move to breathe, some don't, but all need to move in order to avoid sinking because of the lack of a swim bladder.

Source: http://www.amnh.org/learn/pd/sharks_rays/rfl_myth/index.html

The metaphor still works: if this entrepreneur stops swimming, he'll sink into the murky depths.

[crispy]

Met a client today named Om'Unique.  It did happen at work.

Oh, and a coworker mentioned that she owes $120K in student loans for her degree in social work. I can't even understand why someone would do that.

[I'm a red panda]

Met a client today named Om'Unique.  It did happen at work.

Oh, and a coworker mentioned that she owes $120K in student loans for her degree in social work. I can't even understand why someone does.

I have a cousin who complains non-stop about how much her student loans are, and how she will be in debt for the rest of her life.  I have no idea what her undergrad is, but her Master's degree and now PhD are in Sign Language Interpretation. From a really expensive private school.  Maybe the M.A. has value, but that seems like a prime example of a PhD not to get if you don't have an employer paying for it.

[Papa Mustache]

My little brother is a commercial truck driver, and for a while was over the road. One of the things that I thought was really cool was the way the engines were setup. There is like a 'sleep' mode for sleeping in the cab. It keeps the engine off, but when the temp drops, it starts it up in some weird mode just to make sure the driver doesn't freeze. Just a really neat piece of technology that I didn't even know existed.

Had to watch a building one night that had a fire earlier in the evening at work. I was the reflash watch. Was COLD so I idled the engine all night. It was a V-6 and used 3/8 of a tank of fuel as I recall. I tried running the engine part time and really the interior of the car cooled off so quickly that the engine was not off very long.

I wonder how much fuel a big truck burns idling all night. I know diesels can be very efficient.

A few times per year I travel for work and I bought a generator with my work budget. It is a 6500W Honda generator. They make a simple gen set with a lawnmower engine and the amount of noise you might expect. They make another series of gen sets like mine which are so quiet and efficient that you can stand beside them while they run and have a conversation. Good on fuel too. Expensive. Have often wondered why big trucks don't have something like this incorporated into the vehicle that starts and stops on demand to keep the interior warm or cool as the case maybe. Maybe have a couple of onboard batteries to power everything but the heat or a/c which prob pull far too much to run on batteries - unless a Prius style HVAC system was battery friendly - which they might be.

Am sure it is a matter of $$$ spent and $$$ saved. When it makes $ sense, it'll be done. 

[Papa Mustache]

So, the car was in a campus building (non-residential) parking lot. Probably not a child paying with it.  Not a cop car. Newer model.

Beware of these things. My sister-in-law and family woke one night to find their Kia minivan idling in the garage. Apparently the keyfob lost it's mind and started the engine. Who knows how long it had been running but the exhaust was so thick in the garage that they could not go out to shut off the engine. They had to open the garage door from the other car parked outside and wait for the exhaust to dissipate. Brother-in-law disabled the keyfob and never used it again.

All I could think of was the CO risk to the interior of the house.

[GatewayTwo]

@Joe Average

Typically, newer on-highway trucks do one of two things - one is a small diesel genset - just for running the "hotel" loads.  The other is to use a super-efficient engine operating point when the engine is just idling (unless they have to regenerate the emissions equipment, then it really gets loud).

Fleet owners go for whichever provides better fuel savings, as even small amounts of money makes a big impact over the number of vehicle miles they drive.  Individual owner-operators are more likely to go for customized trucks that do not have the same fuel saving technologies.

(Worked as a powertrain engineer for Detroit Diesel / Freightliner / Western Star a few years back)

[gimp]

All I could think of was the CO risk to the interior of the house.

CO detectors are cheap. Especially if your garage is part of the house... come on, people.

[eljefe-speaks]

My mom is a public school teacher, and she's heard some odd names over the years. One that always sticks with me is Lord Dorian. That whole thing is his first name, by the way. His mother "didn't want him to be disrespected". I don't think she was aware of what middle school kids are like.

Talk about unintended consequences...

An actual example of irony (not as its used today post Jagged Little Pill, to mean coincidental)!

fify

[gimp]

Speaking of foam, here's some foam

[forummm]

It's a foam party!

[EricL]

If a shark is swimming in the foam and it stops, will it die?   Or does that only apply to sharks with names like Tan'iqua?   Will the PC Police, grammar nazis, etc rescue it?  And if the shark dies will evidence be documented on an orange box or a black box?

[SMP]

If a shark is swimming in the foam and it stops, will it die?   Or does that only apply to sharks with names like Tan'iqua?   Will the PC Police, grammar nazis, etc rescue it?  And if the shark dies will evidence be documented on an orange box or a black box?

Nice summary of this thread ;-)

[dunny]

I'm going to go ahead and just assume that it was a warning based on his own experience. Viper mentioned that they weren't trying to be negative, just giving a head's up. That would be an interesting journey to follow though.

Hey Viper: What would you say to starting a thread in either the journal's section or the Ask a Mustachian section, documenting your efforts to get rid of that annoying boredom you are experiencing. I'd definitely be interested in that!!

I guess that because being retired bores me instead of doing meaningful work that I loved...well I guess I'm just a loser. To each his own...what do I know?

That's kind of what I was trying to figure out. I don't hear often from those who get bored in retirement. I was merely suggesting that some may find value in how you can beat those feelings, and it would be a journal thing I would read.
The caveat being that there would need to be some desire to address (or look into) the boredom instead of complaining about it and projecting your experiences onto everyone else.

Let me know if you do that though, otherwise best of luck with the rest of your retirement.

I can see both sides of this I think.  I am not bored "doing nothing" in retirement and yet I am restless for adventure, so maybe that's being bored?  I am always looking for the right mix of chilling at home and travel.  More and more travel is going in the right direction.  Actually, I do find a lot of "retirement" activities boring --- organized activities, volunteer work, clubs, annual events/festivals.  Also, I find some retired people are not that adventurous or physically fit or even sociable.  So at home, I work out, walk for miles, attend to investments, watch movies, garden, read, shop and cook, take a few courses, and plan the next year's travel.  I do miss some of my old jobs, for the satisfaction of accomplishment a very hard task, as well as the pleasure of the doing.  So to give myself the equivalent, I try to make more money every year and do ever more challenging trips.

[dunny]

I have heard very similar lines from CWs about the cost of fresh produce.  I think the people that say this are just trying to justify not eating healthily.  GF and I eat very little that is packaged (frozen berries and oats come in packages but that's a grey area to me.) and while we do spend quite a bit on groceries we both feel we are eating a ton of very high quality, delicious, healthy, fresh food.  I think the health benefit easily offsets the labor cost of slicing up my veggies! =)

I have found that many of these people are the same ones that eat out all of the time. I always counter back with "well the good produce is expensive, but it's still cheaper than eating out." They usually nod in agreement.

I agree, I eat very well on a lot less than people spend on fake food in grocery stores and fast food. Waste is rampant. At a garden party yesterday, mostly retirees in attendance, I mentioned I was going to a farm to buy blueberries and cherries for the freezer. (I also get pushback on how much work this is and how costly it is.  Yet it is only minutes to freeze enough for a year, and much less costly and healthier and tastier than out of season produce.)

Retiree #1 (well-off, former engineer): I should get a freezer again.  We used to have one and buy a side of beef and a lamb every year, but we still had a lot of lamb left by the time the next year's lamb (pre-ordered) was coming. So I had to barbecue all the meat and invite everybody we know to eat it all.  Or the meat got freezer burn because we didn't eat it and we had to throw it out.  So it's a waste of money.

Retire #2 (small pension, no assets, former nurse): You end up with all this meat in the freezer for years and it's a waste of money. (I happen to know her well and she moves a freezer full of ancient frozen meat from place to place. She often mentions she has to "clean out the freezer" but can't because she needs a cooler to put the meat in while she is "sorting".  I have told her a few times in the past I would do it for her in 10 minutes without a cooler. Just throw out anything that you don't know for sure is less than 1 year old and you're done).

Me: I don't buy more meat until I have eaten what is in the freezer (about 3 month's worth maximum) and then buy another 3 months' worth. Anything left in the freezer when the new meat goes in, goes into the freezer compartment of the fridge and gets eaten within a week or two.

Retiree #1: Yeah, but…. (shrug)

Retiree #2: But you're so organized (deprecating tone).

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.  So, I no longer feel sorry for people because they knowingly bring it all onto themselves.

[Hedge_87]

I have heard very similar lines from CWs about the cost of fresh produce.  I think the people that say this are just trying to justify not eating healthily.  GF and I eat very little that is packaged (frozen berries and oats come in packages but that's a grey area to me.) and while we do spend quite a bit on groceries we both feel we are eating a ton of very high quality, delicious, healthy, fresh food.  I think the health benefit easily offsets the labor cost of slicing up my veggies! =)

I have found that many of these people are the same ones that eat out all of the time. I always counter back with "well the good produce is expensive, but it's still cheaper than eating out." They usually nod in agreement.

I agree, I eat very well on a lot less than people spend on fake food in grocery stores and fast food. Waste is rampant. At a garden party yesterday, mostly retirees in attendance, I mentioned I was going to a farm to buy blueberries and cherries for the freezer. (I also get pushback on how much work this is and how costly it is.  Yet it is only minutes to freeze enough for a year, and much less costly and healthier and tastier than out of season produce.)

Retiree #1 (well-off, former engineer): I should get a freezer again.  We used to have one and buy a side of beef and a lamb every year, but we still had a lot of lamb left by the time the next year's lamb (pre-ordered) was coming. So I had to barbecue all the meat and invite everybody we know to eat it all.  Or the meat got freezer burn because we didn't eat it and we had to throw it out.  So it's a waste of money.

Retire #2 (small pension, no assets, former nurse): You end up with all this meat in the freezer for years and it's a waste of money. (I happen to know her well and she moves a freezer full of ancient frozen meat from place to place. She often mentions she has to "clean out the freezer" but can't because she needs a cooler to put the meat in while she is "sorting".  I have told her a few times in the past I would do it for her in 10 minutes without a cooler. Just throw out anything that you don't know for sure is less than 1 year old and you're done).

Me: I don't buy more meat until I have eaten what is in the freezer (about 3 month's worth maximum) and then buy another 3 months' worth. Anything left in the freezer when the new meat goes in, goes into the freezer compartment of the fridge and gets eaten within a week or two.

Retiree #1: Yeah, but…. (shrug)

Retiree #2: But you're so organized (deprecating tone).

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.  So, I no longer feel sorry for people because they knowingly bring it all onto themselves.

Can't you just put the "old" meat on top of the new meat? Kind of like the grocery store does with all of their products? This is what we do when we order meat.

[tofuchampion]

This foam is fucking hilarious

Special MMM foam - it's a shaving product AND a desert topping

and a sex toy!

[MgoSam]

I have heard very similar lines from CWs about the cost of fresh produce.  I think the people that say this are just trying to justify not eating healthily.  GF and I eat very little that is packaged (frozen berries and oats come in packages but that's a grey area to me.) and while we do spend quite a bit on groceries we both feel we are eating a ton of very high quality, delicious, healthy, fresh food.  I think the health benefit easily offsets the labor cost of slicing up my veggies! =)

I have found that many of these people are the same ones that eat out all of the time. I always counter back with "well the good produce is expensive, but it's still cheaper than eating out." They usually nod in agreement.

I agree, I eat very well on a lot less than people spend on fake food in grocery stores and fast food. Waste is rampant. At a garden party yesterday, mostly retirees in attendance, I mentioned I was going to a farm to buy blueberries and cherries for the freezer. (I also get pushback on how much work this is and how costly it is.  Yet it is only minutes to freeze enough for a year, and much less costly and healthier and tastier than out of season produce.)

Retiree #1 (well-off, former engineer): I should get a freezer again.  We used to have one and buy a side of beef and a lamb every year, but we still had a lot of lamb left by the time the next year's lamb (pre-ordered) was coming. So I had to barbecue all the meat and invite everybody we know to eat it all.  Or the meat got freezer burn because we didn't eat it and we had to throw it out.  So it's a waste of money.

Retire #2 (small pension, no assets, former nurse): You end up with all this meat in the freezer for years and it's a waste of money. (I happen to know her well and she moves a freezer full of ancient frozen meat from place to place. She often mentions she has to "clean out the freezer" but can't because she needs a cooler to put the meat in while she is "sorting".  I have told her a few times in the past I would do it for her in 10 minutes without a cooler. Just throw out anything that you don't know for sure is less than 1 year old and you're done).

Me: I don't buy more meat until I have eaten what is in the freezer (about 3 month's worth maximum) and then buy another 3 months' worth. Anything left in the freezer when the new meat goes in, goes into the freezer compartment of the fridge and gets eaten within a week or two.

Retiree #1: Yeah, but…. (shrug)

Retiree #2: But you're so organized (deprecating tone).

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.  So, I no longer feel sorry for people because they knowingly bring it all onto themselves.

I'm buying my first house, closing date is August 14th, and I plan on getting a chest freezer so I can get a side of beef. Thinking of getting an eigth, and looking it down to nothing before buying any more meat (except for occasionally chicken or fish).

[forummm]

How much is a side of beef and how much does that weigh in actual edible meat (not counting bones)? Is it enough to be cheaper than going to the grocery store and the cost of the freezer and electricity for the freezer, and eating the cuts of meat you don't like as much, etc?

[zolotiyeruki]

How much is a side of beef and how much does that weigh in actual edible meat (not counting bones)? Is it enough to be cheaper than going to the grocery store and the cost of the freezer and electricity for the freezer, and eating the cuts of meat you don't like as much, etc?

I have a couple brothers who have done it.  For them, the cost-per-pound of meat was (if memory serves) about $4/lb.  Not worth it if you're just using it for ground beef, but definitely worth it if you're cooking steaks.

[zataks]

How much is a side of beef and how much does that weigh in actual edible meat (not counting bones)? Is it enough to be cheaper than going to the grocery store and the cost of the freezer and electricity for the freezer, and eating the cuts of meat you don't like as much, etc?

I have a couple brothers who have done it.  For them, the cost-per-pound of meat was (if memory serves) about $4/lb.  Not worth it if you're just using it for ground beef, but definitely worth it if you're cooking steaks.

That sounds about right.  I've found around that price for direct-from-the-rancher sorts of places that slaughter, butcher, and package the meat for you too.

[dunny]

I have heard very similar lines from CWs about the cost of fresh produce.  I think the people that say this are just trying to justify not eating healthily.  GF and I eat very little that is packaged (frozen berries and oats come in packages but that's a grey area to me.) and while we do spend quite a bit on groceries we both feel we are eating a ton of very high quality, delicious, healthy, fresh food.  I think the health benefit easily offsets the labor cost of slicing up my veggies! =)

I have found that many of these people are the same ones that eat out all of the time. I always counter back with "well the good produce is expensive, but it's still cheaper than eating out." They usually nod in agreement.

I agree, I eat very well on a lot less than people spend on fake food in grocery stores and fast food. Waste is rampant. At a garden party yesterday, mostly retirees in attendance, I mentioned I was going to a farm to buy blueberries and cherries for the freezer. (I also get pushback on how much work this is and how costly it is.  Yet it is only minutes to freeze enough for a year, and much less costly and healthier and tastier than out of season produce.)

Retiree #1 (well-off, former engineer): I should get a freezer again.  We used to have one and buy a side of beef and a lamb every year, but we still had a lot of lamb left by the time the next year's lamb (pre-ordered) was coming. So I had to barbecue all the meat and invite everybody we know to eat it all.  Or the meat got freezer burn because we didn't eat it and we had to throw it out.  So it's a waste of money.

Retire #2 (small pension, no assets, former nurse): You end up with all this meat in the freezer for years and it's a waste of money. (I happen to know her well and she moves a freezer full of ancient frozen meat from place to place. She often mentions she has to "clean out the freezer" but can't because she needs a cooler to put the meat in while she is "sorting".  I have told her a few times in the past I would do it for her in 10 minutes without a cooler. Just throw out anything that you don't know for sure is less than 1 year old and you're done).

Me: I don't buy more meat until I have eaten what is in the freezer (about 3 month's worth maximum) and then buy another 3 months' worth. Anything left in the freezer when the new meat goes in, goes into the freezer compartment of the fridge and gets eaten within a week or two.

Retiree #1: Yeah, but…. (shrug)

Retiree #2: But you're so organized (deprecating tone).

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.  So, I no longer feel sorry for people because they knowingly bring it all onto themselves.

Can't you just put the "old" meat on top of the new meat? Kind of like the grocery store does with all of their products? This is what we do when we order meat.

Yes, any kind of system will work of course.  Just passing along mine.

[dunny]

I have heard very similar lines from CWs about the cost of fresh produce.  I think the people that say this are just trying to justify not eating healthily.  GF and I eat very little that is packaged (frozen berries and oats come in packages but that's a grey area to me.) and while we do spend quite a bit on groceries we both feel we are eating a ton of very high quality, delicious, healthy, fresh food.  I think the health benefit easily offsets the labor cost of slicing up my veggies! =)

I have found that many of these people are the same ones that eat out all of the time. I always counter back with "well the good produce is expensive, but it's still cheaper than eating out." They usually nod in agreement.

I agree, I eat very well on a lot less than people spend on fake food in grocery stores and fast food. Waste is rampant. At a garden party yesterday, mostly retirees in attendance, I mentioned I was going to a farm to buy blueberries and cherries for the freezer. (I also get pushback on how much work this is and how costly it is.  Yet it is only minutes to freeze enough for a year, and much less costly and healthier and tastier than out of season produce.)

Retiree #1 (well-off, former engineer): I should get a freezer again.  We used to have one and buy a side of beef and a lamb every year, but we still had a lot of lamb left by the time the next year's lamb (pre-ordered) was coming. So I had to barbecue all the meat and invite everybody we know to eat it all.  Or the meat got freezer burn because we didn't eat it and we had to throw it out.  So it's a waste of money.

Retire #2 (small pension, no assets, former nurse): You end up with all this meat in the freezer for years and it's a waste of money. (I happen to know her well and she moves a freezer full of ancient frozen meat from place to place. She often mentions she has to "clean out the freezer" but can't because she needs a cooler to put the meat in while she is "sorting".  I have told her a few times in the past I would do it for her in 10 minutes without a cooler. Just throw out anything that you don't know for sure is less than 1 year old and you're done).

Me: I don't buy more meat until I have eaten what is in the freezer (about 3 month's worth maximum) and then buy another 3 months' worth. Anything left in the freezer when the new meat goes in, goes into the freezer compartment of the fridge and gets eaten within a week or two.

Retiree #1: Yeah, but…. (shrug)

Retiree #2: But you're so organized (deprecating tone).

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.  So, I no longer feel sorry for people because they knowingly bring it all onto themselves.

I'm buying my first house, closing date is August 14th, and I plan on getting a chest freezer so I can get a side of beef. Thinking of getting an eigth, and looking it down to nothing before buying any more meat (except for occasionally chicken or fish).

Sides of beef can be expensive if you don't usually eat the high-end or low-end cuts.  The quality/taste is usually much better and you can't go back to the factory meat after that.   However, you can buy other than whole sides.  You can specify your cuts and buy them in bulk, or buy what is called a "hip" which is smaller. You can also buy from Costco and repackage it yourself.  I did this for many years (now I travel too much to make it work), and then I got good quality, good price, and only specifically the cuts I need/use, and I also get more variety including chicken, pork, etc.

[dragoncar]

I have heard very similar lines from CWs about the cost of fresh produce.  I think the people that say this are just trying to justify not eating healthily.  GF and I eat very little that is packaged (frozen berries and oats come in packages but that's a grey area to me.) and while we do spend quite a bit on groceries we both feel we are eating a ton of very high quality, delicious, healthy, fresh food.  I think the health benefit easily offsets the labor cost of slicing up my veggies! =)

I have found that many of these people are the same ones that eat out all of the time. I always counter back with "well the good produce is expensive, but it's still cheaper than eating out." They usually nod in agreement.

I agree, I eat very well on a lot less than people spend on fake food in grocery stores and fast food. Waste is rampant. At a garden party yesterday, mostly retirees in attendance, I mentioned I was going to a farm to buy blueberries and cherries for the freezer. (I also get pushback on how much work this is and how costly it is.  Yet it is only minutes to freeze enough for a year, and much less costly and healthier and tastier than out of season produce.)

Retiree #1 (well-off, former engineer): I should get a freezer again.  We used to have one and buy a side of beef and a lamb every year, but we still had a lot of lamb left by the time the next year's lamb (pre-ordered) was coming. So I had to barbecue all the meat and invite everybody we know to eat it all.  Or the meat got freezer burn because we didn't eat it and we had to throw it out.  So it's a waste of money.

Retire #2 (small pension, no assets, former nurse): You end up with all this meat in the freezer for years and it's a waste of money. (I happen to know her well and she moves a freezer full of ancient frozen meat from place to place. She often mentions she has to "clean out the freezer" but can't because she needs a cooler to put the meat in while she is "sorting".  I have told her a few times in the past I would do it for her in 10 minutes without a cooler. Just throw out anything that you don't know for sure is less than 1 year old and you're done).

Me: I don't buy more meat until I have eaten what is in the freezer (about 3 month's worth maximum) and then buy another 3 months' worth. Anything left in the freezer when the new meat goes in, goes into the freezer compartment of the fridge and gets eaten within a week or two.

Retiree #1: Yeah, but…. (shrug)

Retiree #2: But you're so organized (deprecating tone).

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.  So, I no longer feel sorry for people because they knowingly bring it all onto themselves.

I'm buying my first house, closing date is August 14th, and I plan on getting a chest freezer so I can get a side of beef. Thinking of getting an eigth, and looking it down to nothing before buying any more meat (except for occasionally chicken or fish).

Sides of beef can be expensive if you don't usually eat the high-end or low-end cuts.  The quality/taste is usually much better and you can't go back to the factory meat after that.   However, you can buy other than whole sides.  You can specify your cuts and buy them in bulk, or buy what is called a "hip" which is smaller. You can also buy from Costco and repackage it yourself.  I did this for many years (now I travel too much to make it work), and then I got good quality, good price, and only specifically the cuts I need/use, and I also get more variety including chicken, pork, etc.

I've never found Costco to have cheap meat.  Large quantity, yes.  Possibly higher quality.  But similar price to my local grocery (and higher than my grocery's sale prices)

[Bumbling Bee]

(Relatively junior) CW 1: I'm super excited that the wallpaper I wanted is on sale!
CW2: Really? The mica (?!?) one?
CW1: Yeah, it's normally $600 a roll, but it's on sale for $350! I think I need about eight rolls...

She lives in a rental apartment, and is not sure if she wants to renew the one-year lease when it comes up.

[PARedbeard]

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.

Apart from the few people who have just never been taught anything about money, this is completely true and concisely put.

[Malaysia41]

(Relatively junior) CW 1: I'm super excited that the wallpaper I wanted is on sale!
CW2: Really? The mica (?!?) one?
CW1: Yeah, it's normally $600 a roll, but it's on sale for $350! I think I need about eight rolls...

She lives in a rental apartment, and is not sure if she wants to renew the one-year lease when it comes up.

She must wear Bad Idea Jeans

[wenchsenior]

(Relatively junior) CW 1: I'm super excited that the wallpaper I wanted is on sale!
CW2: Really? The mica (?!?) one?
CW1: Yeah, it's normally $600 a roll, but it's on sale for $350! I think I need about eight rolls...

She lives in a rental apartment, and is not sure if she wants to renew the one-year lease when it comes up.

OMFG

You guys, some of these stories...I can't even...

[Bumbling Bee]

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.

Apart from the few people who have just never been taught anything about money, this is completely true and concisely put.

I think you're right, but I think (from an "And I, worst of all" perspective) that people also tend to understand how to do things in theory, but can get derailed by little things. I also think people have a tendency to overestimate the importance of things like willpower and underestimate the power of putting things in automatic mode, if that makes sense.

[Rollin]

That's an urban legend. Sharks don't have to continually move.

Need a current if they are to stay still for too long.

[TheGrimSqueaker]

I used to pass on information on how to manage money, how to get organized, how to eat healthy, but I realized that people already know how to do it. They just don't want to and try to justify instead of change.

Apart from the few people who have just never been taught anything about money, this is completely true and concisely put.

I think you're right, but I think (from an "And I, worst of all" perspective) that people also tend to understand how to do things in theory, but can get derailed by little things. I also think people have a tendency to overestimate the importance of things like willpower and underestimate the power of putting things in automatic mode, if that makes sense.

There's a big gap between gnosis and praxis.

It's the same with money management as it is with a lot of other things ranging from fitness to martial arts to skill on the guitar. People want desperately to believe in a few magic secrets that make everything easy, but they're seldom willing to actually do what they're taught. So they buy large amounts of instruction on the theory of A, B, or C. But then they refuse to actually do it. (That, I think, is why Wang Yangming once said: "To know, but not to do, is to not truly know.")

[infogoon]

One of our coworkers retired last week. He's in his early fifties, so it's "early" by the standards of most people.

His retirement came up in our staff meeting - the response was "Can you even imagine having the kind of money that you could just stop working?"

The next topic was that our bonuses look good for this year - the response was "Great, I can take my family on vacation out of the country!"

I don't think people connected the two topics.

[Papa Mustache]

What an adrenaline junkie! I would be perfectly happy with a '84 Honda Rabbit

My roomie used to have a Dodge Horizon with a VW engine (from the factory came this way). My in-laws had a Saturn Vue with a Honda engine (from the factory). My antique VW Westfalia has a Corvair engine/transmission. I did that conversion. Twice the HP, very little cost. No alterations of the vehicle.

[mtn]

What an adrenaline junkie! I would be perfectly happy with a '84 Honda Rabbit

My roomie used to have a Dodge Horizon with a VW engine (from the factory came this way). My in-laws had a Saturn Vue with a Honda engine (from the factory). My antique VW Westfalia has a Corvair engine/transmission. I did that conversion. Twice the HP, very little cost. No alterations of the vehicle.

I almost bought a [Stock] Lincoln with a BMW engine.

[Papa Mustache]

Ugh, that gives off a really pathetic faux-macho vibe like the whole "man cave" phenomenon. I have the image of a bunch of dumpy 30-somethings in there trying to relive their frat days.

I've got to say - I love the old school barber I visit occasionally. I get my hair cut about four times per year and get my hair cut pretty short. ~$10. Then let it grow until I can't stand it again and it's time for another "scalping". People at work notice when I get my hair cut.

Everything is old in that shop - the barbers, the clientèle, etc. ;) It was last redecorated in about 1965 but it's clean. Heard some very entertaining old men tell some very tall tales there. I usually go on Sat morning and plan for an hour or so for my turn. Everybody is well mannered and the place is kid friendly.

[Papa Mustache]

me: how's wedding planning going? Excited for the small/destination wedding?

cw: well...wife's family veto'd that; we're doing the big 200 person thing

me: too bad, I think small weddings are more fun/intimate, and a lot less expensive than the big circus wedding

cw: yeah, we stated pricing things out, we could do $30k "on the cheap" but if we're going to do it, we're going to do it right, probably will be more like $50,000.

me: poker face...long pause
me: yeah, got to enjoy it and all that...thinking, sure, spending the AVERAGE ANNUAL american HOUSEHOLD income on a one night party for yourself makes sense

What i ALWAYS think of is is what a kick-ass down payment that would make on a mortgage. You'd be WAY ahead of the average family towards a paid off mortgage - which to me is a very important thing.

And there is a ~52% chance in the USA that the big one night party will be all for naught. (divorce).

[Papa Mustache]

So my coworker (he of the $35000 sports car at 8% interest) has more to contribute.  He's ALREADY dissatisfied, so he's looking to add a turbocharger and $4000 rims (because those are the best rims, you see.)  I told him $4000 was more than my entire car.

And the turbo might very well shorten the life of that already expensive engine... And the $4K rims will need $4K tires... GRIN!

[Papa Mustache]

It's pretty disturbing that people who think like this are so heavily armed.

Haven't you heard? Obama is coming for their guns and bullets. And has been for nearly 8 years now...

I've listened to these kinds of arguments for years now. People spending vast sums of money (relative to their modest income levels) to buy guns and ammo before guns and ammo are outlawed. As if there isn't a paper trail leading the gov't agents to their door if the gov't DID decide to confiscate all these guns...

I've listened to guys setting up orders for boxes of ammo at the peak of the ammo "bubble". CW will drive up the highway (in his sub-15 mpg truck) to save $10 on ammo b/c they heard that dealer had the best prices and the best selection at this moment. Then next time it might be the next CW's turn to make the trek.

Now fast forward a few years and the "bubble" has popped somewhat and these guys have boxes of ammo they paid top prices for that ultimately will get used hunting or shooting cans.

Some of this ammo was going for 50 cents per round or more at one point. Now it is 50% less. I think I heard one say that one kind was going for $1 per round. Hundreds of dollars for ammo that will sit around until it is "wasted" idly plinking cans in the back yard. All spent by guys making under $30K per year. They above all need to be saving maximum $$$ for their old age.

I don't fear guns, and spent time in them military carrying them. This notion that a black president is a bigger threat than previous presidents to the good old boys is a head shaker though. Don't really want to see the laws change but I would like to see the fascination with them and this "angry" voter attitude that some have calm down a little. These "wedge issues" that the media and politicians spend so much time on isn't going to change anything.

I do wonder what the future holds. The minorities generally vote Democrat (at least here) and at some point in the future the minorities will collectively outnumber the white Republican voters. What happens at that point?

I'm hoping these conservative voters I live among will realize the world is not coming to an end. I don't expect any of the ones I know to do anything violent but there is much hand-wringing going on... ;)

[Papa Mustache]

A is 29, has a useless college degree in terms of defining a clear career path. Mommy and daddy: buy her clothes; paid for college; pay for 98% of her HORSE expenses; bought her a brand new Prius; and just recently basically told her that if she wanted to quit her current (sucky) job, they'd pay her living expenses and pay for more education if she wanted to. Until I started encouraging her to basically act like a grown up, she allowed her dad to handle all her finances. He still does at least 50% of it. She doesn't even get most of the bank statements - they all go to her parent's house.

I think I dated her doppleganger years ago. Once I figured her out I felt like I knew her life's trajectory I was soured on her. She was a good person but I knew I could never afford to support her lifestyle intentions (watch TV and shop). Was for the best (for me) when we went our different directions.

Years later - still single, still living a mile from Mama and Daddy and I wonder how much of the rest is the same as before?

[nobodyspecial]

And there is a ~52% chance in the USA that the big one night party will be all for naught. (divorce).

" the study found that women whose wedding cost more than $20,000 divorced at a rate roughly 1.6 times higher than women whose wedding cost between $5,000 and $10,000. And couples who spent $1,000 or less on their big day had a lower than average rate of divorce."

The more you spend the more likely you are to divorce - although the correlation/causation is probably backwards here.
 

[forummm]

And there is a ~52% chance in the USA that the big one night party will be all for naught. (divorce).

" the study found that women whose wedding cost more than $20,000 divorced at a rate roughly 1.6 times higher than women whose wedding cost between $5,000 and $10,000. And couples who spent $1,000 or less on their big day had a lower than average rate of divorce."

The more you spend the more likely you are to divorce - although the correlation/causation is probably backwards here.

Anecdotally, we spent about $5k and are very happy together. Some relatives spent easily over $100k and are probably headed to divorce shortly.

[gimp]

So my coworker (he of the $35000 sports car at 8% interest) has more to contribute.  He's ALREADY dissatisfied, so he's looking to add a turbocharger and $4000 rims (because those are the best rims, you see.)  I told him $4000 was more than my entire car.

And the turbo might very well shorten the life of that already expensive engine... And the $4K rims will need $4K tires... GRIN!

There are a lot of engines onto which you can put some form of forced induction, but generally you'd want one that is sold with forced induction in a different model so you know it's built for it. And of course, you also gotta usually do some work on intake, exhaust, etc, to make sure it matches. I've seen some horrifying hack jobs that ended up destroying the engine. I've also seen some insanely hilarious hack jobs. Anyone else love seeing random cars with massive hood scoops for a massive supercharger sitting on top? Just too funny.

$4K for rims, though, I'm not sure what the hell he's doing. I mean, don't get me wrong, if you want to spend $4K on extremely light, forged wheels, for a car you take racing, where the wheels are legitimately limiting what you can do in the race, well, that's your hobby, even if it is expensive. But if you're not racing, it's a waste of money. And on a $35k car, another 10% on wheels is fucking insane, there are way better things that can be done to make it faster or handle better than wheels.

[Papa Mustache]

Not at work, just a friend of ours. In one conversation (monologue, almost) he mentioned that...

• He's really annoyed about all his creditors calling all the time to ask for their money, because...
• ...he's already paying a debt consolidation company to talk to them! And besides they really need to negotiate the amount down. (Apparently paying off only a fraction of your debt in some kind of right?)
• But they better negotiate it, because he hates his job so he's going to quit, and the new job he lined up pays less and is further away, so...
• ... he really needs to call the consolidator and make sure they'll take a smaller monthly payment. (Why would you ask about that beforehand?)
• He'll be giving notice while the boss is out of town on training. Which he's really mad he didn't get invited to, even though he couldn't go anyway because he's already prepaid $3500 for a trip to Vegas at the same time.
• So the boss can't just let him right away because there's nobody in the office (including my friend. The logic here escapes me.) But when she gets back he'll probably get let and then have a week long (probably unpaid) vacation!
• But they won't have health insurance for 90 days. So better not get sick, haha! (I tried to interject that he should look into the ACA requirements and maybe subsidies, but he talked over me. Guess he'll find out about that if/when they fine him for not having coverage. Didn't even get around to asking about what happens if the new job doesn't work out.)
• Both he and his wife are on daily meds for chronic conditions, which they already can't afford to pay out of pocket, so guess we better get a new 90-day supply before quitting day! (Didn't get a chance to point out that a 90-day supply ordered before quitting cannot possibly last until new insurance kicks in 90 days after new job starts.)

Then the conversation ended because he wanted to go get some fast food before we headed out to the (not free) activity for the evening. He turned down the freezer burritos and other stuff we had on hand.

Somewhere in there he also mentioned that they couldn't use home equity to pay off the other debts because they'd refi'd ~3 times in the last 10 years and were probably upside down. Which is going to be a problem, since they might have to get a new place so an aging parent can move in. And also his doctor keeps telling him that he needs a double joint replacement sometime soon. And he spent about $6k funding Kickstarter projects last year.

I really wish I was making this up. He's a nice enough guy, but it's depressing to listen to the way he runs his finances.

That is sickening.  I cannot imagine being in that situation and am thankful that I'm not even close.

Do these people feel compelled to share b/c they are sort of like the person standing on the 13th floor ledge - and secretly asking for help?

Help in the sense that they want someone to tell them what to do next to get out of their mess?

- or is it that they just want other people to agree that this is a big mess and everyone has the same financial mess to cope with (we're like you)???

It seems to me that most folks I've known that were in this mess would neither accept the advice a financially successful person offered "these are tough choices, you need to follow through with the suggested solutions" and "this is an emergency you need to start dealing with today".

[Bumbling Bee]

And there is a ~52% chance in the USA that the big one night party will be all for naught. (divorce).

" the study found that women whose wedding cost more than $20,000 divorced at a rate roughly 1.6 times higher than women whose wedding cost between $5,000 and $10,000. And couples who spent $1,000 or less on their big day had a lower than average rate of divorce."

The more you spend the more likely you are to divorce - although the correlation/causation is probably backwards here.

Anecdotally, we spent about $5k and are very happy together. Some relatives spent easily over $100k and are probably headed to divorce shortly.

Yeah, I sometimes shake my head at the bridezillas and groomthras who buy into the wedding industry's marketing and believe that spending all that money makes it the BEST DAY OF YOUR LIFE. Even if it were true, why would you want to know that everything afterwards, including the actual marriage, will be anticlimactic?

[sparky28]

Today, I had a rollercoaster of anti-mustachianism. Thought I was so close to a good conversation.

CW: Do you invest in international stocks in your 401k?
Me: Yes, why?
CW: I called my advisor, and she said that if you invested in international stocks, you aren't doing well right now because of Greece. (great insight, advisor)
Me: (getting excited about a conversation relevant to my interests) Maybe in the short term, but the whole point of a 401k and savings in general is for a longer horizon. Just look at how the market is rebounded since '08.
CW: I'm going to take out my 401k money, it's only a few grand anyway (she's been here for over 10 years). You can never trust the market and I've been thinking about upgrading my kitchen cabinets anyway.

Me: confused silence

[forummm]

Today, I had a rollercoaster of anti-mustachianism. Thought I was so close to a good conversation.

CW: Do you invest in international stocks in your 401k?
Me: Yes, why?
CW: I called my advisor, and she said that if you invested in international stocks, you aren't doing well right now because of Greece. (great insight, advisor)
Me: (getting excited about a conversation relevant to my interests) Maybe in the short term, but the whole point of a 401k and savings in general is for a longer horizon. Just look at how the market is rebounded since '08.
CW: I'm going to take out my 401k money, it's only a few grand anyway (she's been here for over 10 years). You can never trust the market and I've been thinking about upgrading my kitchen cabinets anyway.

Me: confused silence

But my financial advisor said that kitchen cabinet "upgrades" have a great financial return...

[RFAAOATB]

Me: confused silence

Why didn't you go for the direct response?:  "Don't be a dummy, save your money."

Really, more of these stories need to end with "You're dumb and will end up old and broken instead of living the sweet Florida retirement unless you change now." or "I'll think of you when I gaze upon the street people when I soon retire."