Overheard at Work

[dmac680chi]

...
And a work friend said ...

Two words that should not be next to each other, IMHO.

Co-workers are co-workers, and friends are friends, and the never the twain shall meet.

You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but some of the best people I know I met through work. There are different boundaries when we're actively working together, but I would've missed out on some great friendships if I had rejected all of the people I spend 40+ hours a week with.

No offense taken.
I have very good co-workers, technically fantastic, but peel back that layer to reveal the non-work person and I'll bipedal skedaddle.

Count me in this camp.  I'm in an industry, accounting, that isn't really Mustachian-friendly.  My boss has talked about how he feels like he doesn't see any of his paycheck, that it all goes to car payments, rent, insurance, etc, and he probably makes at least $150k.  I'm in a HCOL area, but still it's pretty ridiculous.  The Mustachian lifestyle was brought up once, but everyone seemed to agree that living on $40k (!) annually would be way too difficult/limiting.

Also, in general, I think it's really hard to develop friendships with coworkers because you have to be so cautious about controversial topics, which seem to be everything these days (or maybe it was always this way?).  There is a mainstream view for everything and to go against that invites judgment and ridicule.  For example, people at my company constantly make anti-Trump statements/jokes.  I'm not a fan of Trump, but it just gets really annoying.

And then of course the sharing of your personal life.  In my company these conversations seem to be subtle (and occasionally not subtle at all) competitions to brag about who has the best house/spouse/car/etc.  I'm a young single person who doesn't go out to bars every weekend, so some people wonder what is wrong with me. 

If I happen to hit it off with a coworker and we have similar interests, then absolutely I would puruse a friendship outside of work.  But in general I don't look to become friends with coworkers.  Just because we're in the same office for 40+ hours a week doesn't mean we have to be friends.

I dislike Trump too but have a friend who every time I talk to him he mentions Trump. I've gotten to the point where I can't talk politics with him as its rather annoying. I think people tend to just accept everything they hear. Not saying Trump is right but at the same Tim I'd rather not get in drawn out conversations about his impeachment or not. I have family that voted for Trump, I still like them despite our opinions being different.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[paddedhat]

Hey, hey, hey, back off the Timmies.

Oh, quite the opposite, my good friend. There is a rational reason to wait in line for Timmies. Wasting fifteen minutes of your morning commute blocking the Starbucks parking lot, not so much. Intelligence test, pay $4 for a cup of burnt and bitter, waste a quarter hour of your life=fail.

In Canada a Starbucks Venti (20 oz, largest size available) coffee is $2.17, Tim Horton large (20 oz)is $1.99, the X-Large is 24 oz, $2.19. You can tell which people don't actually pat attention to prices when they say Starbucks costs $4 for a coffee. If you're going to mock people, at least get it right.

Waiting in either drive thru is a fail.

Seriously, what rock do you live under? I have stood in lines at coffee shops, Starbucks included, and the majority of folks end up requesting far more than a black cup of basic brewed coffee, Their trendy selections are quite a step up from a plain old coffee, and believe it or not, this silliness runs four bucks (USD) on up. So, I have it right, and I'll mock away, thank you very much.

[coconutindex]

One of my colleagues was during the lunch break telling us about her weekend. It was her friend's birthday. The friend had been asking her for a long time to join her in an obstacle race (running 6km with obstacles like climbing a wall and wading through mud and such. She gave the friend for her birthday a night in a hotel for both of them, a party and two tickets for such an obstacle race. Afterwards there was also a lot of party and a lot of alcohol in a country where alcohol is the most expensive in the world. My colleagues was also telling us about all the races she was planning to do. Obviously a lot of her money is going to that sort of events. She is not a big spendypants in general, but obviously prioritizes her spending in this sort of stuff.

I think this must be a typical Norwegian way to spend your money. My coworkers seem to be forever hopping on planes to travel to competitions or even just to spend a week cycling or whatnot somewhere warm. At least they're in great physical shape! But definitely an expensive way to break a sweat. I even read somewhere about a woman paying a rather obscene amount (13 500 euros) for the privilege of running a marathon on the North Pole!

[icbatbh]

Not overheard as such, more of an observation.

Over the last month or so in the UK we've had a couple of "heatwaves" with temperatures sometimes reaching around 32°C (89°F). I arrived at work this morning to discover that a colleague had left a portable air conditioning unit on all night so that it wasn't too warm in the office when he walked in. On a number of occasions over the last few weeks he has been sitting at his desk with his fan on full blast while wearing his outdoor coat.

This same colleague is the first to get out the electric convector heaters as soon as the weather turns slightly colder at the beginning of Autumn.

Apart from being a huge waste of energy and money, I think this also demonstrates the fact that there is a growing weather wussy culture in the UK, presumably due to the fact that the media are always seriously dramatising the weather here.

[Linea_Norway]

Today at the lunch break I was telling about my summer vacation to come. I had to answer the same person several times that "yes, I will be sleeping in a tent". Obviously this is not completely normal behaviour for a person of my age (44) with no children.

[shelivesthedream]

Not overheard as such, more of an observation.

Over the last month or so in the UK we've had a couple of "heatwaves" with temperatures sometimes reaching around 32°C (89°F). I arrived at work this morning to discover that a colleague had left a portable air conditioning unit on all night so that it wasn't too warm in the office when he walked in. On a number of occasions over the last few weeks he has been sitting at his desk with his fan on full blast while wearing his outdoor coat.

This same colleague is the first to get out the electric convector heaters as soon as the weather turns slightly colder at the beginning of Autumn.

Apart from being a huge waste of energy and money, I think this also demonstrates the fact that there is a growing weather wussy culture in the UK, presumably due to the fact that the media are always seriously dramatising the weather here.

Tell me about it. I know we love to complain about the weather, but it's supposed to be *complain*, not *do stuff about*. We get about three scorchers a year, we are well able to suffer through them. And don't get me started on winter! The people walking round outside in flimsy Primark polycotton and fabric ballet pumps when it's chucking it down. And then they come inside and turn the heating way up. I cannot believe it is that hard to buy a wool jumper or a pair of actual shoes.

[JordanOfGilead]

...
And a work friend said ...

Two words that should not be next to each other, IMHO.

Co-workers are co-workers, and friends are friends, and the never the twain shall meet.

You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but some of the best people I know I met through work. There are different boundaries when we're actively working together, but I would've missed out on some great friendships if I had rejected all of the people I spend 40+ hours a week with.

With as much as I travel for work, often in groups with my co-workers, it makes life a lot easier to be friends with at least a couple of them. Doesn't hurt that I went to school with a handful too.

[jinga nation]

..there is a freakin' WAWA within sight of this mess.

Mmmmmm...Wawa hoagies...Thanks for reminding me that it's Hoagiefest right now!

One of the great parts of being FIREd is leaving the northeast and hiding in Florida in the winter. A few years ago it got even  better, WAWA decided to branch out to central FL. It was all good until I was in the land of Palm trees and left a shiny new WAWA with a Philly pretzel. It was awful, fetted dreck. Philly my ass. I later asked about the tasteless mulch that that had been erroneously placed in the WAWA Philly pretzel wrapper, that I purchased?  Turns out they "bake" then in Tampa. Apparently the contracted the work to a tire recycling facility or something, since it sure as hell wasn't made in a bakery.  Apparently the sacred tastiness of PA. does not travel well, as on several occasions I have also had a Yuengling, brewed in Florida, that would of made a warm, skunky Busch lite taste good.

I live in Tampa. We don't eat WaWa. Go get a Tampa Cuban sandwich from a local shop or at least a Publix.
I drink cold Yuengling's, brewed here, right across from my alma mater USF.
But then I drink a lot of local craft/microbrews, however, I'm not a beer snob.

...
And a work friend said ...

Two words that should not be next to each other, IMHO.

Co-workers are co-workers, and friends are friends, and the never the twain shall meet.

You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but some of the best people I know I met through work. There are different boundaries when we're actively working together, but I would've missed out on some great friendships if I had rejected all of the people I spend 40+ hours a week with.

No offense taken.
I have very good co-workers, technically fantastic, but peel back that layer to reveal the non-work person and I'll bipedal skedaddle.

Count me in this camp.  I'm in an industry, accounting, that isn't really Mustachian-friendly.  My boss has talked about how he feels like he doesn't see any of his paycheck, that it all goes to car payments, rent, insurance, etc, and he probably makes at least $150k.  I'm in a HCOL area, but still it's pretty ridiculous.  The Mustachian lifestyle was brought up once, but everyone seemed to agree that living on $40k (!) annually would be way too difficult/limiting.

Also, in general, I think it's really hard to develop friendships with coworkers because you have to be so cautious about controversial topics, which seem to be everything these days (or maybe it was always this way?).  There is a mainstream view for everything and to go against that invites judgment and ridicule.  For example, people at my company constantly make anti-Trump statements/jokes.  I'm not a fan of Trump, but it just gets really annoying.

And then of course the sharing of your personal life.  In my company these conversations seem to be subtle (and occasionally not subtle at all) competitions to brag about who has the best house/spouse/car/etc.  I'm a young single person who doesn't go out to bars every weekend, so some people wonder what is wrong with me. 

If I happen to hit it off with a coworker and we have similar interests, then absolutely I would puruse a friendship outside of work.  But in general I don't look to become friends with coworkers.  Just because we're in the same office for 40+ hours a week doesn't mean we have to be friends.

I dislike Trump too but have a friend who every time I talk to him he mentions Trump. I've gotten to the point where I can't talk politics with him as its rather annoying. I think people tend to just accept everything they hear. Not saying Trump is right but at the same Tim I'd rather not get in drawn out conversations about his impeachment or not. I have family that voted for Trump, I still like them despite our opinions being different.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In addition to the "in polite company" rules of not talking about politics and religion, add sex, money, and science (especially if you live in conservative areas or the south).

I work in the DoD, in the IT field, and you'd be surprised how many people are anti-science, pro-<insert mainstream religion>. IDGAF on people working 2nd careers after their military retirement, blowing money and propping up the economy. They ain't planning on FIREing, that concept is even more alien than outer space aliens.

[infogoon]

The wife and I call our local Starbucks, "the intelligence test", because during peak coffee demand times, you have to be an idiot to waste 10-15 minutes at their drive-thru... It's like Tim Horton's for stupid people.

So, it's like Tim Hortons?

[LennStar]

For example, people at my company constantly make anti-Trump statements/jokes.

Gallows humor.

If you see a not only totally incometent, but also bloody idiotic man laboring under adviseimmunity being the head of your state, you can only survive with either Stockholm Syndrome or a near-lethal dose of sarcastic humor.

[ShoulderThingThatGoesUp]

I disagree. I think political jokes should stay out of work.

(I voted against Trump)

[honeybbq]

Re: Starbuck's.

On a very rare instance I'll hop over to Starbuck's with my co-workers. I always order a large drip coffee. First, they always have to clarify... "you want... drip?" because literally NOBODY actually orders "coffee" at Starbuck's. Second, when they ask me if I want room for cream they often ask me twice because they can't believe it when I say no. I actually want black coffee. That's right. I want coffee and I want to to taste like coffee. Shocker.

But yeah, most my coworkers have at least a $25/week habit (once per day) and some are more like $50+ (going multiple times, getting breakfast there, etc). 

Usually I just drink the free swill that's offered here.

[Acastus]

This isn't so much overheard at work, but seen. I have an intern that I am grateful for (hard working nice guy). What I've observed is that some of the lowest paid employees drive the newest cars. I talked about cars with my intern, which is always a bit awkward since I am the only person at work with 1 car in the family, and it is in the bottom 1/3 in cost (if you count the security guard and a few others). He explained that he bought an almost new Nissan Altima (currently 3 years old). I don't feel jealous, it just puzzles me. Maybe his personal business has made him wealthy and he only interns for fun, I don't know. It just does not make sense for him, a guy without kids or spouse (has girlfriend) to open up the wallet so much.

Then there is my friend with a fancy Nissan almost undriveable due to being super low (he uses it for drifting), who also owns a huge, raised brand new (well, maybe 1 year old now) full size pick up truck. This fella is a single parent. I'm not sure if he still owns the fancy motorcycle. What cracks me up about the truck is that our parking lot is pretty lame and hard to park large vehicles. He makes good money but I think what comes in, also goes out.

Then there is our security guard. This guy has probably a '95 Honda Accord, and an early 90s Pathfinder. It sounds like that one of the vehicles belongs to his wife, and it just depends who has it. All day this guy sees above average cars come in and out of the parking lot, since that is his job. I can only imagine when he talks to his wife he says "man, these people sure know to blow money."

Cars are definitely a status where I live.

A new car can be a good option, especially if you are not mechanically inclined. I do not want to put in the time to find a good used car, and I do not trust my instincts. I don't want someone else's lemon. A new car is a known quantity. It does not need any repairs for several years. Over 10-12 years, it will need tires, brakes, battery a couple times each, and some random repairs, but you can see most of these coming so costs are more predictable. I am assuming normal american driving at 10k/year or so. If you mostly bike, the thing could last 20 years. Keep your desires modest, drive it until it dies, and the overall cost can be reasonable.

If you buy a tricked out sports car, you are obviously spending too much, or it is a luxury you are choosing to prioritize.

[AnswerIs42]

Over the last month or so in the UK we've had a couple of "heatwaves" with temperatures sometimes reaching around 32°C (89°F). I arrived at work this morning to discover that a colleague had left a portable air conditioning unit on all night so that it wasn't too warm in the office when he walked in.

In our old office, someone once asked me not to turn the heating off on Friday night when I left, so it would still be turned on on Monday morning when they got in and they wouldn't have to wait for it to warm up.

I ignored them and turned the heating off anyway.

[AnnaGrowsAMustache]

Talking to a young chap (early twenties) at work about lottery tickets. I worked out for him that if he saved the $15 a week he was spending on tickets, just in an ordinary bank account at 3%, he would have around $22,000 by retirement age. First he was shocked that it was 'only' $22,000, and declared that he'd rather have nothing and the chance of winning the lottery. Then he thought I was making things up when I pointed out that his and my chance of winning said lottery, him with a ticket and me without, were the same to 7 decimal places ie zero. Another round of shock when I suggested that he might be living on $22,000 a YEAR when he retired. No way anyone can do that, apparently, not possible. And THEN he proceeded to tell me that my calculations were stupid and I must not know that much about money because he was getting 17.5% interest in his employee matched retirement savings fund. 17.5% is the tax rate he's on for the scheme..... but I guess he's enrolled in the scheme, so that's something, right? Although it probably because you have to opt out in NZ, not in, so his laziness got him on it.

I also got told off by a colleague for even having the conversation because it's his choice what he spends his money on - which of course it is, but clearly that choice is based on a bit of ignorance. Where are you supposed to learn this stuff if people don't tell you???

[dmac680chi]

..there is a freakin' WAWA within sight of this mess.

Mmmmmm...Wawa hoagies...Thanks for reminding me that it's Hoagiefest right now!

One of the great parts of being FIREd is leaving the northeast and hiding in Florida in the winter. A few years ago it got even  better, WAWA decided to branch out to central FL. It was all good until I was in the land of Palm trees and left a shiny new WAWA with a Philly pretzel. It was awful, fetted dreck. Philly my ass. I later asked about the tasteless mulch that that had been erroneously placed in the WAWA Philly pretzel wrapper, that I purchased?  Turns out they "bake" then in Tampa. Apparently the contracted the work to a tire recycling facility or something, since it sure as hell wasn't made in a bakery.  Apparently the sacred tastiness of PA. does not travel well, as on several occasions I have also had a Yuengling, brewed in Florida, that would of made a warm, skunky Busch lite taste good.

I live in Tampa. We don't eat WaWa. Go get a Tampa Cuban sandwich from a local shop or at least a Publix.
I drink cold Yuengling's, brewed here, right across from my alma mater USF.
But then I drink a lot of local craft/microbrews, however, I'm not a beer snob.

...
And a work friend said ...

Two words that should not be next to each other, IMHO.

Co-workers are co-workers, and friends are friends, and the never the twain shall meet.

You're entitled to your opinion, of course, but some of the best people I know I met through work. There are different boundaries when we're actively working together, but I would've missed out on some great friendships if I had rejected all of the people I spend 40+ hours a week with.

No offense taken.
I have very good co-workers, technically fantastic, but peel back that layer to reveal the non-work person and I'll bipedal skedaddle.

Count me in this camp.  I'm in an industry, accounting, that isn't really Mustachian-friendly.  My boss has talked about how he feels like he doesn't see any of his paycheck, that it all goes to car payments, rent, insurance, etc, and he probably makes at least $150k.  I'm in a HCOL area, but still it's pretty ridiculous.  The Mustachian lifestyle was brought up once, but everyone seemed to agree that living on $40k (!) annually would be way too difficult/limiting.

Also, in general, I think it's really hard to develop friendships with coworkers because you have to be so cautious about controversial topics, which seem to be everything these days (or maybe it was always this way?).  There is a mainstream view for everything and to go against that invites judgment and ridicule.  For example, people at my company constantly make anti-Trump statements/jokes.  I'm not a fan of Trump, but it just gets really annoying.

And then of course the sharing of your personal life.  In my company these conversations seem to be subtle (and occasionally not subtle at all) competitions to brag about who has the best house/spouse/car/etc.  I'm a young single person who doesn't go out to bars every weekend, so some people wonder what is wrong with me. 

If I happen to hit it off with a coworker and we have similar interests, then absolutely I would puruse a friendship outside of work.  But in general I don't look to become friends with coworkers.  Just because we're in the same office for 40+ hours a week doesn't mean we have to be friends.

I dislike Trump too but have a friend who every time I talk to him he mentions Trump. I've gotten to the point where I can't talk politics with him as its rather annoying. I think people tend to just accept everything they hear. Not saying Trump is right but at the same Tim I'd rather not get in drawn out conversations about his impeachment or not. I have family that voted for Trump, I still like them despite our opinions being different.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

In addition to the "in polite company" rules of not talking about politics and religion, add sex, money, and science (especially if you live in conservative areas or the south).

I work in the DoD, in the IT field, and you'd be surprised how many people are anti-science, pro-&lt;insert mainstream religion&gt;. IDGAF on people working 2nd careers after their military retirement, blowing money and propping up the economy. They ain't planning on FIREing, that concept is even more alien than outer space aliens.

Is that just a matter of how people are raised in bringing up sex, politics, or religion. I only have a few friends I'm willing to talk about that stuff with, never in usual company.  Still wild to me how people blow money like crazy!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Linea_Norway]

Talking to a young chap (early twenties) at work about lottery tickets. I worked out for him that if he saved the $15 a week he was spending on tickets, just in an ordinary bank account at 3%, he would have around $22,000 by retirement age. First he was shocked that it was 'only' $22,000, and declared that he'd rather have nothing and the chance of winning the lottery. Then he thought I was making things up when I pointed out that his and my chance of winning said lottery, him with a ticket and me without, were the same to 7 decimal places ie zero. Another round of shock when I suggested that he might be living on $22,000 a YEAR when he retired. No way anyone can do that, apparently, not possible. And THEN he proceeded to tell me that my calculations were stupid and I must not know that much about money because he was getting 17.5% interest in his employee matched retirement savings fund. 17.5% is the tax rate he's on for the scheme..... but I guess he's enrolled in the scheme, so that's something, right? Although it probably because you have to opt out in NZ, not in, so his laziness got him on it.

I also got told off by a colleague for even having the conversation because it's his choice what he spends his money on - which of course it is, but clearly that choice is based on a bit of ignorance. Where are you supposed to learn this stuff if people don't tell you???

I only told 3 people about the option of early retirement. One is an old friend and colleague who is more frugal than me in many ways. Except for spending a lot of his saving on going to concerts. The second is a young colleague who already told us he was very good at saving. The third is a colleague who is approaching his last decade at work before normal retirement age. I got the impression from talking to him before that he is doing financially very well. I asked him why he didn't retire early. But he thinks sitting at home with his wife all day is not his idea of having a good time. So he choose to work long hours for 4 days a week, sleeping at the office, and having a long weekend every week, living 2 hours driving from work. Still making 40 hours a week.

I am not sure we need to teach everybody about it. I think the general population might not grab it anyway, they just like spending. We should perhaps focus on those who show some interest in the subject.

[Feivel2000]

Over the last month or so in the UK we've had a couple of "heatwaves" with temperatures sometimes reaching around 32°C (89°F). I arrived at work this morning to discover that a colleague had left a portable air conditioning unit on all night so that it wasn't too warm in the office when he walked in.

In our old office, someone once asked me not to turn the heating off on Friday night when I left, so it would still be turned on on Monday morning when they got in and they wouldn't have to wait for it to warm up.

I ignored them and turned the heating off anyway.

Well, sweating or freezing is probably not part of their job description and if the employer is to cheap to install time controlled heating, that's what he get.

[AnnaGrowsAMustache]

Talking to a young chap (early twenties) at work about lottery tickets. I worked out for him that if he saved the $15 a week he was spending on tickets, just in an ordinary bank account at 3%, he would have around $22,000 by retirement age. First he was shocked that it was 'only' $22,000, and declared that he'd rather have nothing and the chance of winning the lottery. Then he thought I was making things up when I pointed out that his and my chance of winning said lottery, him with a ticket and me without, were the same to 7 decimal places ie zero. Another round of shock when I suggested that he might be living on $22,000 a YEAR when he retired. No way anyone can do that, apparently, not possible. And THEN he proceeded to tell me that my calculations were stupid and I must not know that much about money because he was getting 17.5% interest in his employee matched retirement savings fund. 17.5% is the tax rate he's on for the scheme..... but I guess he's enrolled in the scheme, so that's something, right? Although it probably because you have to opt out in NZ, not in, so his laziness got him on it.

I also got told off by a colleague for even having the conversation because it's his choice what he spends his money on - which of course it is, but clearly that choice is based on a bit of ignorance. Where are you supposed to learn this stuff if people don't tell you???

I only told 3 people about the option of early retirement. One is an old friend and colleague who is more frugal than me in many ways. Except for spending a lot of his saving on going to concerts. The second is a young colleague who already told us he was very good at saving. The third is a colleague who is approaching his last decade at work before normal retirement age. I got the impression from talking to him before that he is doing financially very well. I asked him why he didn't retire early. But he thinks sitting at home with his wife all day is not his idea of having a good time. So he choose to work long hours for 4 days a week, sleeping at the office, and having a long weekend every week, living 2 hours driving from work. Still making 40 hours a week.

I am not sure we need to teach everybody about it. I think the general population might not grab it anyway, they just like spending. We should perhaps focus on those who show some interest in the subject.

Yeah, should have kept my mouth shut but watching a kid spending his wages on lottery tickets is like watching a kid playing with matches - at what point are they old enough that you don't say something?? At least now he knows what the lottery odds actually are, and if wants to continue buying tickets, it's an informed choice. I won't be commenting on that.

[Feivel2000]

Talking to a young chap (early twenties) at work about lottery tickets. I worked out for him that if he saved the $15 a week he was spending on tickets, just in an ordinary bank account at 3%, he would have around $22,000 by retirement age. First he was shocked that it was 'only' $22,000, and declared that he'd rather have nothing and the chance of winning the lottery. Then he thought I was making things up when I pointed out that his and my chance of winning said lottery, him with a ticket and me without, were the same to 7 decimal places ie zero. Another round of shock when I suggested that he might be living on $22,000 a YEAR when he retired. No way anyone can do that, apparently, not possible. And THEN he proceeded to tell me that my calculations were stupid and I must not know that much about money because he was getting 17.5% interest in his employee matched retirement savings fund. 17.5% is the tax rate he's on for the scheme..... but I guess he's enrolled in the scheme, so that's something, right? Although it probably because you have to opt out in NZ, not in, so his laziness got him on it.

I also got told off by a colleague for even having the conversation because it's his choice what he spends his money on - which of course it is, but clearly that choice is based on a bit of ignorance. Where are you supposed to learn this stuff if people don't tell you???

I only told 3 people about the option of early retirement. One is an old friend and colleague who is more frugal than me in many ways. Except for spending a lot of his saving on going to concerts. The second is a young colleague who already told us he was very good at saving. The third is a colleague who is approaching his last decade at work before normal retirement age. I got the impression from talking to him before that he is doing financially very well. I asked him why he didn't retire early. But he thinks sitting at home with his wife all day is not his idea of having a good time. So he choose to work long hours for 4 days a week, sleeping at the office, and having a long weekend every week, living 2 hours driving from work. Still making 40 hours a week.

I am not sure we need to teach everybody about it. I think the general population might not grab it anyway, they just like spending. We should perhaps focus on those who show some interest in the subject.

Yeah, should have kept my mouth shut but watching a kid spending his wages on lottery tickets is like watching a kid playing with matches - at what point are they old enough that you don't say something?? At least now he knows what the lottery odds actually are, and if wants to continue buying tickets, it's an informed choice. I won't be commenting on that.

While this guy clearly hasn't his finances in order and I don't want to the gambling advocate here, I was also surprised that it's only $22,000. I guess you calculated with 20 years?
$22,000 might be a year of living expenses but won't save you from poverty. Also, with 3% you need to invest the money so the 22,000 aren't guaranteed in 20 years.
On the other hand, he buys himself 52*20=1040 dreams and micro-get-aways. So he's not getting nothing for his $15.

Also, his chances to win the jackpot are almost as slim as yours, but the jackpot is not the only prize. If the chances are similar to the German GlücksSpirale, he would buy 3 tickets and would have therefore every week the chance to win
10$ @ 3:10
20$ @ 3:100
...
100,000$ @ 6:1,000,000
2,000,000 @ 6:10,000,000

Of course, this is no wise investment, more a tax for those who are bad at math, but after 20 years he won't have nothing and every week he is getting something for his money, even if it is not worth $15 for you.

Acting like your (partly our) values should be universal is no good basis for a discussion. The German ZenDepot Blog had a great article about this.
Independence (as in FIRE) is only one of 16 basics needs according to Steven Reiss and for many Saving and Independence is simply not a priority.

Okay, now back to slamming those who aren't following the only true and right values!

I once had a colleague who bought a 1500€ gaming laptop to play the Sims. He also bought a 2000+€ Porsche bike. He wasn't very much into biking, he just earned money for the first time in his life and couldn't stop spending it.
He was fired after failing a training course twice...

[shelivesthedream]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

[cheapass]

I once had a colleague who bought a 1500€ gaming laptop to play the Sims. He also bought a 2000+€ Porsche bike. He wasn't very much into biking, he just earned money for the first time in his life and couldn't stop spending it.
He was fired after failing a training course twice...

Well, what else do you do with money besides spend it the second you earn it?

[TheGrimSqueaker]

I once had a colleague who bought a 1500€ gaming laptop to play the Sims. He also bought a 2000+€ Porsche bike. He wasn't very much into biking, he just earned money for the first time in his life and couldn't stop spending it.
He was fired after failing a training course twice...

Well, what else do you do with money besides spend it the second you earn it?

Spend it before it's been earned! Because credit is convenient.

[BuffaloStache]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

[Feivel2000]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

[shelivesthedream]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

[Bella78]

I have a co-worker who told me a couple of weeks ago that she was going to buy new kitchen appliances.  Today I overheard her tell someone else she spent $9,000.  That seems crazy to me.  I couldn't imagine spending even half of that on kitchen appliances.  I know she isn't made of money, because we were talking about heat pumps not too long ago, and she mentioned she would love to get a ductless heat pump to supplement her electric heat, but couldn't afford it.

[Cowardly Toaster]

I have a co-worker who told me a couple of weeks ago that she was going to buy new kitchen appliances.  Today I overheard her tell someone else she spent $9,000.  That seems crazy to me.  I couldn't imagine spending even half of that on kitchen appliances.  I know she isn't made of money, because we were talking about heat pumps not too long ago, and she mentioned she would love to get a ductless heat pump to supplement her electric heat, but couldn't afford it.

Good chance she put them on credit amirite?

[Daisy]

I have a co-worker who told me a couple of weeks ago that she was going to buy new kitchen appliances.  Today I overheard her tell someone else she spent $9,000.  That seems crazy to me.  I couldn't imagine spending even half of that on kitchen appliances.  I know she isn't made of money, because we were talking about heat pumps not too long ago, and she mentioned she would love to get a ductless heat pump to supplement her electric heat, but couldn't afford it.

Good chance she put them on credit amirite?

Better chance it is a show kitchen (not actually used for cooking but reheating takeout). Amirite?

[Bella78]

I have a co-worker who told me a couple of weeks ago that she was going to buy new kitchen appliances.  Today I overheard her tell someone else she spent $9,000.  That seems crazy to me.  I couldn't imagine spending even half of that on kitchen appliances.  I know she isn't made of money, because we were talking about heat pumps not too long ago, and she mentioned she would love to get a ductless heat pump to supplement her electric heat, but couldn't afford it.

Good chance she put them on credit amirite?

I'm not sure, but I wouldn't be surprised.  She financed a washer and dryer 1-2 years ago.

[Bella78]

I have a co-worker who told me a couple of weeks ago that she was going to buy new kitchen appliances.  Today I overheard her tell someone else she spent $9,000.  That seems crazy to me.  I couldn't imagine spending even half of that on kitchen appliances.  I know she isn't made of money, because we were talking about heat pumps not too long ago, and she mentioned she would love to get a ductless heat pump to supplement her electric heat, but couldn't afford it.

Good chance she put them on credit amirite?

Better chance it is a show kitchen (not actually used for cooking but reheating takeout). Amirite?

Not a show kitchen.  I'm pretty sure she does use her kitchen for cooking.

[With This Herring]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

Well, obviously you are playing it incorrectly.  The right way to play The Sims is to use cheat codes to get infinite money, then carefully craft ridiculous houses and populate them with characters you design to look exactly like your friends and family.  Right?  Right?  That's not just me, right?

[Pooperman]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

Well, obviously you are playing it incorrectly.  The right way to play The Sims is to use cheat codes to get infinite money, then carefully craft ridiculous houses and populate them with characters you design to look exactly like your friends and family.  Right?  Right?  That's not just me, right?

Stick sims that melt down into a 1x1 enclosed space until they become urns. Sell the urn for a profit.

[With This Herring]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

Well, obviously you are playing it incorrectly.  The right way to play The Sims is to use cheat codes to get infinite money, then carefully craft ridiculous houses and populate them with characters you design to look exactly like your friends and family.  Right?  Right?  That's not just me, right?

Stick sims that melt down into a 1x1 enclosed space until they become urns. Sell the urn for a profit.

I think you would enjoy RollerCoaster Tycoon.

[Pooperman]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

Well, obviously you are playing it incorrectly.  The right way to play The Sims is to use cheat codes to get infinite money, then carefully craft ridiculous houses and populate them with characters you design to look exactly like your friends and family.  Right?  Right?  That's not just me, right?

Stick sims that melt down into a 1x1 enclosed space until they become urns. Sell the urn for a profit.

I think you would enjoy RollerCoaster Tycoon.

The old Euthanasia Coaster or the what-angle-launches-people-the-farthest coaster. Sadly, I never played that game since Civ 3 grabbed my attention around that point.

[dragoncar]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

Well, obviously you are playing it incorrectly.  The right way to play The Sims is to use cheat codes to get infinite money, then carefully craft ridiculous houses and populate them with characters you design to look exactly like your friends and family.  Right?  Right?  That's not just me, right?

Stick sims that melt down into a 1x1 enclosed space until they become urns. Sell the urn for a profit.

I think you would enjoy RollerCoaster Tycoon.

The old Euthanasia Coaster or the what-angle-launches-people-the-farthest coaster. Sadly, I never played that game since Civ 3 grabbed my attention around that point.

http://imgur.com/gallery/Wxzbl

[shelivesthedream]

To play THE SIMS?!?!?! Wow. My old junk laptop played it just fine.

This. Even my old machine can run the newest versions of it.

It was 12 years ago and the newest Sims game at that time (2?3? I don't know, I think it's boring.)

I actually came across The Sims and all the expansion packs for 50p each in a charity shop (except Making Magic, my favourite) and plunked down £2 for a few hours of nostalgia. Sat down and realised... It is really boring! NOTHING happens! Even with all the pets and extra items and everything. I used to spend hours playing. I can't imagine why. I think I would still enjoy The Sims 2, though, because it does go somewhere (giant genetic experiment!) but the first one was a big disappointment, especially how much I enjoyed other games I've re-played lately.

Well, obviously you are playing it incorrectly.  The right way to play The Sims is to use cheat codes to get infinite money, then carefully craft ridiculous houses and populate them with characters you design to look exactly like your friends and family.  Right?  Right?  That's not just me, right?

Believe me, even that was dull! I just don't know what I saw in it. But I would give The Sims 2 another go, as the creator was much better and they actually grew up and got old and died. I used to make really wacky looking ones and breed them and see what came out when they did "woohoo" (or whatever they called it!)

+1 to Rollercoaster Tycoon, though. Not endless fun, but well worth a couple of quid for many hours of casual play. I want to find a copy of Zoo Tycoon, though! I remember the animals being really cool, especially the okapi.

[golden1]

I just started a new job two months ago, and the majority of the engineers in my group are below the age of 25.  Their financial antics entertain me.  I am trying my best to get them to think smart, but I can already see a few that are going to get themselves into trouble.

There is one girl in particular who is a real doozy.  She keeps complaining about being poor and needing to pay off student loans asap (great!).  Then I see her getting into her car - a brand new Audi.  Ok...benefit of the doubt.  Maybe it was a gift from her parents for graduating or something.  Nope.  She bought it when she got this job because “she loves Audis”.  She has the base level A3 and is lusting after a more expensive A7.  Yikes. 

[cheapass]

I just started a new job two months ago, and the majority of the engineers in my group are below the age of 25.  Their financial antics entertain me.  I am trying my best to get them to think smart, but I can already see a few that are going to get themselves into trouble.

Of all the people out there, you would think that engineers would understand exponential growth and the math behind early retirement better than just about anybody... Maybe when they see you retire early it will click.

[MrMoogle]

I just started a new job two months ago, and the majority of the engineers in my group are below the age of 25.  Their financial antics entertain me.  I am trying my best to get them to think smart, but I can already see a few that are going to get themselves into trouble.

Of all the people out there, you would think that engineers would understand exponential growth and the math behind early retirement better than just about anybody... Maybe when they see you retire early it will click.

I feel like I was taught to think for myself in college, although I'm sure there are some incorrect ideas I'm still stuck on due to society/my upbringing or whatever you want to call it.  It's hard to undo 20 years of watching commercials, watching other people, and hearing the illogical things they say.

[cheapass]

I just started a new job two months ago, and the majority of the engineers in my group are below the age of 25.  Their financial antics entertain me.  I am trying my best to get them to think smart, but I can already see a few that are going to get themselves into trouble.

Of all the people out there, you would think that engineers would understand exponential growth and the math behind early retirement better than just about anybody... Maybe when they see you retire early it will click.

I feel like I was taught to think for myself in college, although I'm sure there are some incorrect ideas I'm still stuck on due to society/my upbringing or whatever you want to call it.  It's hard to undo 20 years of watching commercials, watching other people, and hearing the illogical things they say.

Maybe they just haven't come to the conclusion yet that they don't want to sit in an office til they're 65 years old. Admittedly, at 25 I wasn't aware of early retirement. It took a few years of working to realize that work kinda sucks and I'd rather be doing what I want to do, not what I'm told to do..

[mm1970]

I just started a new job two months ago, and the majority of the engineers in my group are below the age of 25.  Their financial antics entertain me.  I am trying my best to get them to think smart, but I can already see a few that are going to get themselves into trouble.

Of all the people out there, you would think that engineers would understand exponential growth and the math behind early retirement better than just about anybody... Maybe when they see you retire early it will click.

I feel like I was taught to think for myself in college, although I'm sure there are some incorrect ideas I'm still stuck on due to society/my upbringing or whatever you want to call it.  It's hard to undo 20 years of watching commercials, watching other people, and hearing the illogical things they say.

Maybe they just haven't come to the conclusion yet that they don't want to sit in an office til they're 65 years old. Admittedly, at 25 I wasn't aware of early retirement. It took a few years of working to realize that work kinda sucks and I'd rather be doing what I want to do, not what I'm told to do..

Not even that - I think maybe they were never taught that debt is bad.  Mortgage debt aside - I was raised to believe that debt was bad.  I don't know when my dad got a credit card, but not when I was living with him.

So I bought a used car cheap, and worked hard at paying off my college loans (it was the early 90s, my interest rates were 8% and 10%).  It would not have occurred to me to buy an expensive new car when I had college loans to pay off.  I think these days, debt is "normal" and "no big deal".

[Playing with Fire UK]

Maybe they just haven't come to the conclusion yet that they don't want to sit in an office til they're 65 years old. Admittedly, at 25 I wasn't aware of early retirement. It took a few years of working to realize that work kinda sucks and I'd rather be doing what I want to do, not what I'm told to do..

When I was a 25 year old engineer I hadn't heard of early retirement, enjoyed my job enough that I thought I wanted to do it until I couldn't operate my graphic calculator, and figured that as my wages were going to rise over time it may sense to over spend on (low cost) credit to smooth out my fun curve over time.

I'm not saying that this was fantastic logic, but I did what made sense with the information I had at the time.

[Sarah Saverdink]

Maybe they just haven't come to the conclusion yet that they don't want to sit in an office til they're 65 years old. Admittedly, at 25 I wasn't aware of early retirement. It took a few years of working to realize that work kinda sucks and I'd rather be doing what I want to do, not what I'm told to do..

When I was a 25 year old engineer I hadn't heard of early retirement, enjoyed my job enough that I thought I wanted to do it until I couldn't operate my graphic calculator, and figured that as my wages were going to rise over time it may sense to over spend on (low cost) credit to smooth out my fun curve over time.

I'm not saying that this was fantastic logic, but I did what made sense with the information I had at the time.

Another engineer checking in. I hadn't heard of early retirement / FI until I was around 30. I enjoyed it for the most part, but "planned" to retire in my 50s/60s since that's what you do. Still, I was always taught to save money and not splurge on expensive, unnecessary purchases. When I got my first job, I immediately maxed out my 401k and Roth IRA. Husband followed a similar path (though not as aggressively). 10 years into our careers, we had already saved $1M and that's when the FIRE bug hit us.

Mind you, we still had some pretty face punch worthy purchases along the way - primarily two new vehicles (both in the mid-20s price range, so not TOO excessive). We bought a moderate house for our area. Nice 1,700 sq ft colonial - which is more than enough for two people, but it was much smaller and more modest than what many of our engineering peers were/are purchasing. I'm amazed at the number of engineers in my office who only contribute up to the company match on their 401k (6%) and call it a day. New car, expensive house, electronic gadgets... all more important to them than saving for retirement.

[ixtap]

I'm amazed at the number of engineers in my office who only contribute up to the company match on their 401k (6%) and call it a day. New car, expensive house, electronic gadgets... all more important to them than saving for retirement.

My FIL is disappointed that we don't live this lifestyle while preparing for a near traditional retirement. Commenting on TV shows, he literally thinks that people who choose smaller homes are mentally unstable.

[LennStar]

For all those who want to bath in game nostalgia - you may find it here:

http://gamesnostalgia.com/en/games

I think these days, debt is "normal" and "no big deal".

Well, somebody has to take the debt for all the non-stocks savings. If a billionaire puts 100 million into a bank account, you need 100'000 people to make 1000 debt for that savings.
 

[RWD]

I think these days, debt is "normal" and "no big deal".

Well, somebody has to take the debt for all the non-stocks savings. If a billionaire puts 100 million into a bank account, you need 100'000 people to make 1000 debt for that savings.

I don't think that's how it works...

[dragoncar]

I think these days, debt is "normal" and "no big deal".

Well, somebody has to take the debt for all the non-stocks savings. If a billionaire puts 100 million into a bank account, you need 100'000 people to make 1000 debt for that savings.

I don't think that's how it works...

Where do you think he got the 100 million from in the first place?

[marielle]

Maybe they just haven't come to the conclusion yet that they don't want to sit in an office til they're 65 years old. Admittedly, at 25 I wasn't aware of early retirement. It took a few years of working to realize that work kinda sucks and I'd rather be doing what I want to do, not what I'm told to do..

When I was a 25 year old engineer I hadn't heard of early retirement, enjoyed my job enough that I thought I wanted to do it until I couldn't operate my graphic calculator, and figured that as my wages were going to rise over time it may sense to over spend on (low cost) credit to smooth out my fun curve over time.

I'm not saying that this was fantastic logic, but I did what made sense with the information I had at the time.

I'm amazed at the number of engineers in my office who only contribute up to the company match on their 401k (6%) and call it a day. New car, expensive house, electronic gadgets... all more important to them than saving for retirement.

All my engineering classmates are like this and that's with being in the workforce 3 years or less. Pretty much everyone bought a new car or a slightly used fancy sports car/truck. Some bought a car immediately after graduation. One guy bought a house immediately after graduation! I'm still driving the used car I got in high school.

Something else that is ridiculous is people bragging about how they're "adulting" because they bought a car. Yeah...you didn't buy a car. Your bank did. The only requirement in financing a car is having a pulse. You don't even need any credit history. Even with buying a house, there are programs for first time home buyers that only allow you to put 5% down. So that's not really a sign of success either, especially if it's more house than you can afford when kids come into play...

Prime example attached below. Not pictured: Lexus he bought brand new.

[nobody123]

Maybe they just haven't come to the conclusion yet that they don't want to sit in an office til they're 65 years old. Admittedly, at 25 I wasn't aware of early retirement. It took a few years of working to realize that work kinda sucks and I'd rather be doing what I want to do, not what I'm told to do..

When I was a 25 year old engineer I hadn't heard of early retirement, enjoyed my job enough that I thought I wanted to do it until I couldn't operate my graphic calculator, and figured that as my wages were going to rise over time it may sense to over spend on (low cost) credit to smooth out my fun curve over time.

I'm not saying that this was fantastic logic, but I did what made sense with the information I had at the time.

I'm amazed at the number of engineers in my office who only contribute up to the company match on their 401k (6%) and call it a day. New car, expensive house, electronic gadgets... all more important to them than saving for retirement.

All my engineering classmates are like this and that's with being in the workforce 3 years or less. Pretty much everyone bought a new car or a slightly used fancy sports car/truck. Some bought a car immediately after graduation. One guy bought a house immediately after graduation! I'm still driving the used car I got in high school.

Something else that is ridiculous is people bragging about how they're "adulting" because they bought a car. Yeah...you didn't buy a car. Your bank did. The only requirement in financing a car is having a pulse. You don't even need any credit history. Even with buying a house, there are programs for first time home buyers that only allow you to put 5% down. So that's not really a sign of success either, especially if it's more house than you can afford when kids come into play...

Prime example attached below. Not pictured: Lexus he bought brand new.

The only thing I find objectionable is the use of the term "adulting."  They choose to spend/save their money in a way that is different from how you choose to spend/save your money.  Assuming they aren't hitting you up for a loan to subsidize their lifestyle, what business of it is yours?