Overheard at Work

[gimp]

The hell? Mint 17 mate looks hardly different from mint 14 mate. Windows 8 is fine once you get over their stupid icon startup crap, and 8.1 is better. Macs work fine. Pretty much any major linux distro works fine, though I'm not a fan of the ubuntu UI. New office works fine, even if sometimes you need to google where options got moved.

Adapt or die, old schmucks. Or go back to full-screen terminal. It works great, why do we need windows? Get a nice ras pi and sit in text mode.

Whine whine whine...

[frugalnacho]

It's not the adapting part everyone hates, it's the unnecessary need to constantly adapt.  I'm all for adapting if it actually improves performance or functionality. Not so much when it doesn't.

[skunkfunk]

The hell? Mint 17 mate looks hardly different from mint 14 mate. Windows 8 is fine once you get over their stupid icon startup crap, and 8.1 is better. Macs work fine. Pretty much any major linux distro works fine, though I'm not a fan of the ubuntu UI. New office works fine, even if sometimes you need to google where options got moved.

Adapt or die, old schmucks. Or go back to full-screen terminal. It works great, why do we need windows? Get a nice ras pi and sit in text mode.

Whine whine whine...

As much as I prefer working in a terminal to clicking about sometimes useless menus, I think we all know the advantages of a good GUI.

It's not the look I hate about mint (though I do have other personal preferences, LXDE tickles my own fancy) it is the hours I spent editing config files to get his peripherals working. That bug with the dual monitors is stupid, has been around for years. - mdm.conf was nowhere near well enough documented. Working to get the right xinput command for his mouse was a big pain too.

It was great until he decided to do something other than open it up and use a web browser.

Change is frequently not well executed. Talk to me about "adapting" to PulseAudio when it first came out! For the most part, though, software gets better (if more bloated) over time, albeit with missteps.

Going way out of bounds for an overheard at work thread, I think. Whatever. [/foams over]

I had trouble with the dual monitor thing, too, until I switched to the Xfce version of Mint. 

Is there a package he can point apt-get towards to automatically set that up on his current install?

[zephyr911]

One of my coworkers just bought a Tesla. I don't know much about his financial situation, other than that he's an upper-level engineer who probably makes $150-200k, so it's possible this was a well thought out, responsible purchase... but I doubt it.

However, he took us all for short rides around the parking garage today and man, that is the coolest, most futuristic car I've ever seen.

I know the sticker price makes it patently ridiculous to anyone living even remotely MMM-ish, but Tesla gets a pass from me. Their current offerings are but a step toward their well-publicized goal of making electric transportation affordable for the masses within a few years. And the vastly lower cost of operation of even the current high-end cars can actually put TCO below that of average-priced family vehicles within 5 years of purchase. There's an often-cited case study where the Model S came out ahead of a Honda Odyssey that quickly.
Since most of our nation is not going to start biking to work any time soon, I'm all for replacing idling gas-guzzlers with silent, minimally polluting AC induction motors, and I'm not the only one who would consider spending (significantly) more on a car just to be part of making that happen. FIRE is a high priority, but it does get weighed against other things.
At least he's not like my retired NCO friend, who is only still working so he can pay for his $80,000 Audi coupe that gets 14mpg (on a 60-mile RT commute in shitty traffic). For that much money he could at least have an S85 and never buy gas again :P

[dude]

Oh man, a friend tells me the brand new high-end SUV he picked me up in is (a) leased, (b) gets 17 mpg, and (c) sits in the driveway most of the time because they just got it for loading up and getting out of town on weekends.  In the same conversation, he admits to being $7K in credit card debt, to his live-in girlfriend (with whom he shares the leased SUV) having a shitload of high-interest student loan debt, and to only saving 5% in his company 401k.  I talked to him subtly about various MMM principles, and the following day sent him the MMM "Start Here" page, saying, hey man, this is that shockingly simple math thing I was telling you about . . .

I hope it opens his eyes a bit.

[fantabulous]

The hell? Mint 17 mate looks hardly different from mint 14 mate. Windows 8 is fine once you get over their stupid icon startup crap, and 8.1 is better. Macs work fine. Pretty much any major linux distro works fine, though I'm not a fan of the ubuntu UI. New office works fine, even if sometimes you need to google where options got moved.

Adapt or die, old schmucks. Or go back to full-screen terminal. It works great, why do we need windows? Get a nice ras pi and sit in text mode.

Whine whine whine...

Given my profession, "sysVinit vs systemd" is something I've actually overheard at work. But it's not really comical in a financial manner.

[sol]

New office works fine, even if sometimes you need to google where options got moved.

Hilarious.  You just said "this company's product works just fine, as long as you use their competitor's product to figure it out." 

[/foams over]

Hardly.  Have you actually been reading this thread?

[skunkfunk]

[/foams over]

Hardly.  Have you actually been reading this thread?

I have posted embarrassingly often to this thread. Can't say I've read the whole thing, came on board somewhere around page 40.

[skyrefuge]

Them:  Honestly one of the smartest things I've heard of doing when you have an extra $50 is to buy a $50 grocery store gift card.  If, when you're going paycheck to paycheck, you have some extra cash on hand, it's a great idea.  Then you won't starve when you're strapped for cash.

For people who always spend their whole paycheck or never know where their money goes, it's a method of forced savings--putting $50 aside in a form that they won't just blow. So it isn't a terrible idea, although a much better idea would be to stop living paycheck to paycheck.

Yep, it's a smart idea, just like buying a length of cast-iron pipe is a smart idea if you frequently stick your dick in a wood-chipper.

[MooseOutFront]

Oh man, a friend tells me the brand new high-end SUV he picked me up in is (a) leased, (b) gets 17 mpg, and (c) sits in the driveway most of the time because they just got it for loading up and getting out of town on weekends.  In the same conversation, he admits to being $7K in credit card debt, to his live-in girlfriend (with whom he shares the leased SUV) having a shitload of high-interest student loan debt, and to only saving 5% in his company 401k.  I talked to him subtly about various MMM principles, and the following day sent him the MMM "Start Here" page, saying, hey man, this is that shockingly simple math thing I was telling you about . . .

I hope it opens his eyes a bit.

I typed up an email to a coworker last week with the start here link and the shockingly simple math link.  Ultimately I decided she was not worthy so I deleted it.  The search continues.

[APowers]

I call it the "one bad day" club.  I'm more-or-less in it at this point (except-- and it's a powerful exception-- I need the excellent health insurance provided by my employer), and it's a comfort to know that I could walk away any day, if things get to be too much.

I'm also in the "one bad day" club. I'm not FI yet, but I'm finally in a position where if I decided to quit on the spot, We'd make it all right. My current supervisor is bad enough that I expect that day sooner than later.

[zephyr911]

I co-founded a 3-member LLC in April to buy rental property. Partner #2 is an awesome guy but behind the saving curve - he and DW surely clear at least 200k but nice things eat nearly all of it (in AL... somehow). I've accumulated a pile of miscellaneous $5 and $10 receipts for rental supplies, and after a $97 recore job this week, I mentioned I was adding it all up to pull a payment (thinking, maximize LLC deductions for the tax year).
Response: "Oh, for Christmas, right?"
I hadn't even budgeted for the income - just been too damn busy to work it into my projections. Oddly though, the $200 or so in question pretty much covers our holiday season expenses.
BTW, since I just started posting after a long lurk... I'm a recovering compulsive spender, and this site is the best damn thing to happen to me all year. I'm surrounded by candidates for this thread and looking forward to many more bouts of hilarity.

[Cheddar Stacker]

I co-founded a 3-member LLC in April to buy rental property. Partner #2 is an awesome guy but behind the saving curve - he and DW surely clear at least 200k but nice things eat nearly all of it (in AL... somehow). I've accumulated a pile of miscellaneous $5 and $10 receipts for rental supplies, and after a $97 recore job this week, I mentioned I was adding it all up to pull a payment (thinking, maximize LLC deductions for the tax year).
Response: "Oh, for Christmas, right?"
I hadn't even budgeted for the income - just been too damn busy to work it into my projections. Oddly though, the $200 or so in question pretty much covers our holiday season expenses.
BTW, since I just started posting after a long lurk... I'm a recovering compulsive spender, and this site is the best damn thing to happen to me all year. I'm surrounded by candidates for this thread and looking forward to many more bouts of hilarity.

Welcome to the forum. $200 for Christmas is pretty impressive for a newbie.

[zephyr911]

I've been holding a bunch of these while catching up on reading.
I have a really cool co-worker (he's one of the reasons I'll probably stay at my job a little longer than I need to) who just refinanced his house to pay off his truck and all but $16K of credit card debt. Yeah, that's just what's left. They both work, total probably over 100K and not super-extravagant by most standards, so they aren't struggling (he just reiterated that it's not paycheck-to-paycheck), but I don't think they're saving anything. I may have talked him into sending 5% to TSP (maximize match) when he goes federal next month, but we'll see.
CW drives a lifted Nissan Titan to work, alone, and gives me shit in a good-natured way for not doing the same; his wife has an FJ Cruiser (midsize SUV). 1-2 small kids sometimes ride along. I guess the FJ is getting old (looks fine to me...) because he told me the other day they were thinking about buying a new Tahoe!
After the obligatory facepalm, I pointed out that it was a six-figure lifetime commitment and I think the idea has fallen by the wayside... but gawd...

[zephyr911]

Welcome to the forum. $200 for Christmas is pretty impressive for a newbie.

Thanks!
I've had years where individual presents to each of my immediate family members ran more than that, but I was bored, lonely, and making six figures in a cheap town. Really, my family did a lot to start me out on the right foot... we're all pretty reasonable and good at math.

[Goldielocks]

Them:  Honestly one of the smartest things I've heard of doing when you have an extra $50 is to buy a $50 grocery store gift card.  If, when you're going paycheck to paycheck, you have some extra cash on hand, it's a great idea.  Then you won't starve when you're strapped for cash.

For people who always spend their whole paycheck or never know where their money goes, it's a method of forced savings--putting $50 aside in a form that they won't just blow. So it isn't a terrible idea, although a much better idea would be to stop living paycheck to paycheck.

Yep, it's a smart idea, just like buying a length of cast-iron pipe is a smart idea if you frequently stick your dick in a wood-chipper.

Really, I don't see how waiving an iron pipe in your left hand prevents the on-going wood-chipper safety issue...   /sarcasm.

Buying a grocery card is almost identical to advice to putting the $50 onto your debt.... especially for those people in bankruptcy or with credit issues, that have no outstanding debt, and no credit room, but live paycheck to paycheck.  The original advice was to sock it away against your future needs, so you don't spend it on consumerist items...
Could be worse.

[arebelspy]

To multiple people in the last dozen posts: Mint.com is different from the Linux Mint Distribution.  That might clear up some of your confusion.  :)

[sol]

To multiple people in the last dozen posts: Mint.com is different from the Linux Mint Distribution.  That might clear up some of your confusion.  :)

Really rebs?  Way to ruin the joke.

Skunk started out obviously juxtaposing the two, and everyone else seemed to follow suit by studiously discussing them separately in the same posts.  I was rather enjoying it, actually.

[arebelspy]

My bad.

[dragoncar]

To multiple people in the last dozen posts: Mint.com is different from the Linux Mint Distribution.  That might clear up some of your confusion.  :)

What ever happened to good old version numbers?  You know, so people could immediately identify the newer version?

Pepper Ridge farm remembers.

[infogoon]

What ever happened to good old version numbers?  You know, so people could immediately identify the newer version?

Were you around for any of the epic "Why should I run Linux kernel 2.2.x when 2.3 exists?" conversations back in the day?

Version numbers have juuuuust enough strange use cases to make them unreliable without additional research.

Apologies for the foamy contribution.

[gimp]

Don't even get me started on gcc version numbers...

[dragoncar]

What ever happened to good old version numbers?  You know, so people could immediately identify the newer version?

Were you around for any of the epic "Why should I run Linux kernel 2.2.x when 2.3 exists?" conversations back in the day?

Version numbers have juuuuust enough strange use cases to make them unreliable without additional research.

Apologies for the foamy contribution.

No I don't run Linux because it's crap.  Solaris 4lyfe!  I mean open Solaris.  I mean open Indiana... Oh nevermind

[space]

No I don't run Linux because it's crap.  Solaris 4lyfe!  I mean open Solaris.  I mean open Indiana... Oh nevermind

Oracle now releases a version of Solaris 11 that's actually free for personal use at least, though it's not open source.

[dude]

Yep, it's a smart idea, just like buying a length of cast-iron pipe is a smart idea if you frequently stick your dick in a wood-chipper.

great fkng line, and I'm totally stealing it for future use!

[Le Barbu]

Yep, it's a smart idea, just like buying a length of cast-iron pipe is a smart idea if you frequently stick your dick in a wood-chipper.

great fkng line, and I'm totally stealing it for future use!

This line is so fkng great indeed!

But I rushed to buy a cast-iron pipe just in case of my dick get stuck anywhere :/

[eyePod]

To multiple people in the last dozen posts: Mint.com is different from the Linux Mint Distribution.  That might clear up some of your confusion.  :)

Damn it, why'd you have to say anything. I was about to go and swap the two out back and forth in the same paragraph.

[Manguy888]

Asked a coworker what he was up to for the weekend. He told me that he was actually going on vacation the next week.

When I pressed for details, I learned that he was flying across the country to Portland OR to go car shopping with his 30-yo married daughter and buy her a car!

We're in engineering, and I'm sure he makes decent money, but wow. Way to set your daughter up to succeed on her own.

[robotclown]

On the way home from work I saw THREE cars with bows on them.  My first instinct was to assume they're Christmas gifts, but I'm going to give people the benefit of the doubt this time and assume they're just being festive. 

[dragoncar]

On the way home from work I saw THREE cars with bows on them.  My first instinct was to assume they're Christmas gifts, but I'm going to give people the benefit of the doubt this time and assume they're just being festive.

Yep, likely festive. Some folks here put a wreath on the front grill.

[Middlesbrough]

Well, I got called a "minimalist" at work today. It actually hurt more than I thought. My mental strength just isn't what I thought it was. I have had to defend myself before or deflect some thing before, but this one hurt because it was nonchalant and not actually spoken directly to me.

(Enough complainy pants)

We got paid our end of the year bonuses today. Same coworker mentioned above says he is going to go rob his bank. (We had a good year within our company.) He also complained over lunch all the bs extra taxes taken out on bonuses. I have tried explaining before that you get that money back anyway based on your actual income and federal tax brackets, but it falls on deaf ears. I guess I am just the happy little minimalist.

[MikeBear]

Well, I got called a "minimalist" at work today. It actually hurt more than I thought. My mental strength just isn't what I thought it was. I have had to defend myself before or deflect some thing before, but this one hurt because it was nonchalant and not actually spoken directly to me.

(Enough complainy pants)

We got paid our end of the year bonuses today. Same coworker mentioned above says he is going to go rob his bank. (We had a good year within our company.) He also complained over lunch all the bs extra taxes taken out on bonuses. I have tried explaining before that you get that money back anyway based on your actual income and federal tax brackets, but it falls on deaf ears. I guess I am just the happy little minimalist.

I'd have looked them IN THE EYE, and said: "DAMN STRAIGHT"! Then keep looking at them without saying another word until they slinked off...

[Le Barbu]

Yep, it's a smart idea, just like buying a length of cast-iron pipe is a smart idea if you frequently stick your dick in a wood-chipper.

great fkng line, and I'm totally stealing it for future use!

This line is so fkng great indeed!

But I rushed to buy a cast-iron pipe just in case of my dick get stuck anywhere :/

If it gets stuck somewhere (I.e. Cannot extra ate), then you need a crowbar.
If you are sticking it somewhere hazardous (i.e., wood chipper line of fire), then you need th cast iron pipe.

Man, it´s getting worst. Maybe I should carry both (crow bar & cast iron pipe) just in case. And Maybe a fork if I have a zipper issue.

[johnintaiwan]

On the way home from work I saw THREE cars with bows on them.  My first instinct was to assume they're Christmas gifts, but I'm going to give people the benefit of the doubt this time and assume they're just being festive.

That makes me think of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fl5kwJ7eJSo

[auntie_betty]

I had three people ask me today if I thought we were going to get our yearly bonuses, since today is payday. They were all extremely upset that we didn't get them after the day was over. I thought about asking why they were so upset, but I'm sure they expected that money today and had made plans to spend it for Christmas.

I mentioned to a CW that our salary is usually in the bank around 10pm the night before pay day (found out by chance and now I start my money shuffle a day early :) ). Next thing she's on the phone to her mother who also works with us and they're arranging to meet outside Asda at 10pm............ Is it wrong of me to sort of hope they get to the till with shed loads of junk food (which is what they live on) and can't pay for it?

Man, it´s getting worst. Maybe I should carry both (crow bar & cast iron pipe) just in case. And Maybe a fork if I have a zipper issue.

And some local anesthetic?

[Pooperman]

On the way home from work I saw THREE cars with bows on them.  My first instinct was to assume they're Christmas gifts, but I'm going to give people the benefit of the doubt this time and assume they're just being festive.

Yep, likely festive. Some folks here put a wreath on the front grill.

I've never seen this before! But we get snow here, so plush decorations would only last one year.

With a parking ticket?

[Le Barbu]

In Québec, there is volunteers doing this with their car for drunk driver in the office party period (nov.-déc.) Called "Red Nose Opération" (Rudolph operation)

[Louis the Cat]

On the way home from work I saw THREE cars with bows on them.  My first instinct was to assume they're Christmas gifts, but I'm going to give people the benefit of the doubt this time and assume they're just being festive.

Yep, likely festive. Some folks here put a wreath on the front grill.

I've never seen this before! But we get snow here, so plush decorations would only last one year.

With a parking ticket?

With a license plate in the window because the car lives in a front license plate state and you'd hate to ruin the lines of an M3 with a front plate. (Not mocking, it's a beautiful car!)

[rocketpj]

I'm a bit of a latecomer to this thread as a first poster on page one hundred whatever, but I can relate a mindblowing story from my fish boat days.

In the mid-90s I worked on trawlers off the West Coast of Canada.  Year round, very dangerous but very high income potential (more or less exactly the same as the guys on 'the Deadliest Catch').  It only took me a couple of years to know that it was not a future for me, in part because of the constant danger, but also I could never find a happy man working on any of the boats.

So towards the end of my life on fish boats (I left after ~3 years) I ended up on a 'freezer trip' on one of the biggest boats on the coast.  What that means is a 4-8 week trip offshore, basically the boat has freezers so you stay at sea until the boat is full.  This boat was huge and co-owned by 8 fellows, all of whom were on it at the time.

Here's the thing.  The boat and license were worth a combined $10 Million, maybe as much as $15 Million.  These guys spent >300 days/year offshore on the thing, with each other, for decades.  On average I think they all made about $200K/year, with good and bad years.  All of them were divorced (of course - who would stay married to a chronic absentee?).  Every one of them was a millionaire just in the value of their share of boat and license, not to mention what they may or may not have saved over the years (when would they spend money?).

So these guys all hated their jobs, hated each other, and hated their lives.  At that time there was a big shakeup going on in the offshore fleet, and they could have sold out for >$1.5 Million each easily.  But the very notion of giving up being fishermen and living on shore was not even in the equation.  Every one of them was miserable and rich, and could see no way out of that situation.

A month after I got off that boat I went back to college.  As far as I know they are still out there.

[Carless]

So, I finally have a story.  My supervisor took a bunch of us out to lunch at a nice sushi place, and somehow money came up in the conversation.  One of the fellows said something like "even if you got a million dollars you couldn't retire - the interest isn't enough to live on and with the way inflation is, it'll be worth less and less as time goes on".  So I asked him how much interest he figured you'd get, and he said 'about 50k yearly'.  So I asked him how much he was living on per year.  He didn't answer, but here's the punchline; we're all engineering grad students (masters or PhD).  NONE of us are making over 20K per year, except the prof.  Take away tuition and I'd be surprised if we're clearing 12K (of course almost no taxes...).  This guy doesn't own a car and lives with roommates to save money.  But somehow he hasn't figured out the logic here.  Hilarious.  On the plus side, when I finish, I figure I can live a posh life on 20k per year...

[arebelspy]

So, I finally have a story.  My supervisor took a bunch of us out to lunch at a nice sushi place, and somehow money came up in the conversation.  One of the fellows said something like "even if you got a million dollars you couldn't retire - the interest isn't enough to live on and with the way inflation is, it'll be worth less and less as time goes on".  So I asked him how much interest he figured you'd get, and he said 'about 50k yearly'.  So I asked him how much he was living on per year.  He didn't answer, but here's the punchline; we're all engineering grad students (masters or PhD).  NONE of us are making over 20K per year, except the prof.  Take away tuition and I'd be surprised if we're clearing 12K (of course almost no taxes...).  This guy doesn't own a car and lives with roommates to save money.  But somehow he hasn't figured out the logic here.  Hilarious.  On the plus side, when I finish, I figure I can live a posh life on 20k per year...

That's a perfect teachable moment.  If he's at that stage in life, he's clearly just parroting things he's heard about it not being enough to live on.. so you can tell him that, believe it or not, that 40-50k annually is enough (and in fact, is what the median household lives on).

[Travis]

So, I finally have a story.  My supervisor took a bunch of us out to lunch at a nice sushi place, and somehow money came up in the conversation.  One of the fellows said something like "even if you got a million dollars you couldn't retire - the interest isn't enough to live on and with the way inflation is, it'll be worth less and less as time goes on".  So I asked him how much interest he figured you'd get, and he said 'about 50k yearly'.  So I asked him how much he was living on per year.  He didn't answer, but here's the punchline; we're all engineering grad students (masters or PhD).  NONE of us are making over 20K per year, except the prof.  Take away tuition and I'd be surprised if we're clearing 12K (of course almost no taxes...).  This guy doesn't own a car and lives with roommates to save money.  But somehow he hasn't figured out the logic here.  Hilarious.  On the plus side, when I finish, I figure I can live a posh life on 20k per year...

That's a perfect teachable moment.  If he's at that stage in life, he's clearly just parroting things he's heard about it not being enough to live on.. so you can tell him that, believe it or not, that 40-50k annually is enough (and in fact, is what the median household lives on).

Not to mention he seems to think retirement income consists of living off of dividends from a money market account.

[Albert]

No one goes to grad school in engineering expecting to earn only average. It would make no sense given the sacrifice in years and long hours.

Anyway an engineering grad student currently living on 20k still has plenty of time to get his financial house in order. No reason to be worried just yet.

[kpd905]

My coworker told me that he and his wife have been paying $500/month to his son's student loans.  The kid is a pharmacist who makes more than both of them combined, and he is leasing a brand new Lexus.

To make it even worse, this guy's wife has a 100% match up to the IRS maximum on her 401k, and they are only putting in about $500/month.

[Hedge_87]

100% match?!?! Only putting in $500 a month?!?! (MIND EXPLODES) I think I'm cutting a fat hog at 6% match.

[kpd905]

100% match?!?! Only putting in $500 a month?!?! (MIND EXPLODES) I think I'm cutting a fat hog at 6% match.

Yeah he fully acknowledged how much they were missing out on.  I just could not convince him to do anything about it.

[Lookilu]

My former workplace was a goldmine of tragicomedy.

After receiving her first paycheck, one  of our new admin assistants went to the local 'outlet' mall and purchased: a pair of sunglasses that cost her entire paycheck (around $600). I did not know that sunglasses--even with a designer label--could cost that much unless they granted the wearer x-ray vision.

As I sat there, stunned, the rest of the admin assistants congratulated her on making such a smart buy.

[LennStar]

My former workplace was a goldmine of tragicomedy.

After receiving her first paycheck, one  of our new admin assistants went to the local 'outlet' mall and purchased: a pair of sunglasses that cost her entire paycheck (around $600). I did not know that sunglasses--even with a designer label--could cost that much unless they granted the wearer x-ray vision.

As I sat there, stunned, the rest of the admin assistants congratulated her on making such a smart buy.

just for sun or actual sight correctoin?
If its the sight correction you can get easily above that.

[Emilyngh]

My former workplace was a goldmine of tragicomedy.

After receiving her first paycheck, one  of our new admin assistants went to the local 'outlet' mall and purchased: a pair of sunglasses that cost her entire paycheck (around $600). I did not know that sunglasses--even with a designer label--could cost that much unless they granted the wearer x-ray vision.

As I sat there, stunned, the rest of the admin assistants congratulated her on making such a smart buy.

just for sun or actual sight correctoin?
If its the sight correction you can get easily above that.

And you can easily get below that as well, even if for correction.   I got my prescription sunglasses from Zenni for less than $30, and I have horrible eyes and serious prescription.

[GardenFun]

Well, I got called a "minimalist" at work today. It actually hurt more than I thought. My mental strength just isn't what I thought it was. I have had to defend myself before or deflect some thing before, but this one hurt because it was nonchalant and not actually spoken directly to me.

Been there - first from family, then from friends.  Definitely hurt the first time around because I thought we were living a good life, but being smart with purchases.  Funny part is that I now think we have way too much stuff and need to streamline what we already own. 

With recent knowledge, I agree with the poster who would 100% owe up to it.  It is our identity - buy what you need and what makes you happy, forget the rest.