Author Topic: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!  (Read 801905 times)

JoJoP

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4550 on: February 20, 2021, 08:19:31 AM »
The thing is I think Tesla is aiming to be a power company, a transportation company, and an exploration company. If you had a solar roof and a power wall on Texas to go with your Tesla, you were fine during the storm. No one reported on that though because it wasn’t cool news.

We found out during our power outage for a day that having redundancies and overlap is a good thing. Being rich during a power outage is certainly easier than being poor. We didn’t fly to Cancun or anything, but we had gas/electric/solar/propane options available to us. Other neighbors needed support. Heck, we used our Tesla as a movie theater that night and it was cozy warm.

I don’t know that the current valuation is supported (and we only have 1/4 of our prior position), but it’s not just cars. I can also tell you that the 3 year old Tesla still seems light years ahead of the 3 year old Pathfinder because it keeps getting updates just like an Apple phone. With a solar roof, you have your own power plant, to power your transportation. Is that worth a 30K-40K cost now? It’s like getting a fixed rate mortgage as an inflation hedge against future power price increase. Somewhere like CA I think it makes a ton of sense. Alaska, not so much.

One of the reasons I'm working a bit longer is because I want some cool energy independence systems.  I want solar panels, powerwalls and a Cybertruck.  I also want a 1000 gallon propane tank buried on-site that will run a generator for at least a week if needed.  I like my back-ups to have back-ups.

We live in a somewhat rural area and rely less on city services than, say, condominium residents.  We have a generator, swimming pool, and lots of fruit trees.  And wine in the wine cellar and plenty of food in the cupboard.  We use our wood burning stove for heat most of the time anyway, and have a propane furnace and an electric one.   We're on solar, but it feeds back into the grid.   If the grid were off line, we wouldn't have power, but we could make a phone call on our landline, heat the house and cook on the bbq (also propane).  Since we're farm owners, we also have plenty of things like chain saws,  backhoes/skip loaders, 4wd rovers, etc.     We could easily survive days or even weeks if necessary.   Our risk would be wildfires.   We also have a pump that could drain the pool.   The biggest flaw with all these resources is that they aren't standing by ready to go.  If speed was crucial, we'd fail the test.   The generator lives on our farm, a few miles from our home.  I wouldn't even know where to look for the water pump, it's around here somewhere.    I try to also keep some ready cash, filled medical prescriptions and gas in the cars and trucks. 

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4551 on: February 20, 2021, 11:35:28 AM »
We've survived multiple natural disasters.  Being younger, affluent and somewhat of a preppers helped us to overcome the suck. 

flyingaway

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4552 on: February 22, 2021, 08:55:31 AM »
When there comes the next winter storm and I am retired, I will just fly to Cancun for a week of sunshine. Why fight the nature when yo are flexible?

SwordGuy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4553 on: February 22, 2021, 08:58:48 AM »
When there comes the next winter storm and I am retired, I will just fly to Cancun for a week of sunshine. Why fight the nature when yo are flexible?

As long as you don't hold a position of trust and responsibility you're shirking when you go, I think it's an excellent idea!

Exflyboy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4554 on: February 22, 2021, 01:25:11 PM »
When there comes the next winter storm and I am retired, I will just fly to Cancun for a week of sunshine. Why fight the nature when yo are flexible?

Probably a lot cheaper to fly to Canun than to pay the power bill for the power you don't have! After you drain down all the pipes in your house beforehand of course.

PhrugalPhan

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4555 on: February 22, 2021, 02:05:44 PM »
Probably a lot cheaper to fly to Canun than to pay the power bill for the power you don't have! After you drain down all the pipes in your house beforehand of course.
Oh yeah.  Long ago (maybe 20 years?) I planned to visit my grandmother for two weeks and set everything down to minimum when I left.  A bad cold snap hit for those two weeks.  When I got my power bill (I used heat pump) that covered that time, I estimated the cost of driving (gas & wear and tear on the car) was less than if stayed home those two weeks and didn't go anywhere and paid for extra utilities.  Hopefully I can make this a common saving technique (snowbird-ing) when I retire.

Exflyboy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4556 on: February 22, 2021, 02:43:37 PM »
Probably a lot cheaper to fly to Canun than to pay the power bill for the power you don't have! After you drain down all the pipes in your house beforehand of course.
Oh yeah.  Long ago (maybe 20 years?) I planned to visit my grandmother for two weeks and set everything down to minimum when I left.  A bad cold snap hit for those two weeks.  When I got my power bill (I used heat pump) that covered that time, I estimated the cost of driving (gas & wear and tear on the car) was less than if stayed home those two weeks and didn't go anywhere and paid for extra utilities.  Hopefully I can make this a common saving technique (snowbird-ing) when I retire.

I just read about one Vietnam Vet in TX that just got a bill for $16,000 for power that he barely used, and barely worked during the cold snap!

My cheapo generator would have been thrashed mercilessly if they jacked up my rates that high... $9 per KWhr!!!!

JoJoP

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4557 on: February 22, 2021, 06:33:01 PM »
Probably a lot cheaper to fly to Canun than to pay the power bill for the power you don't have! After you drain down all the pipes in your house beforehand of course.
Oh yeah.  Long ago (maybe 20 years?) I planned to visit my grandmother for two weeks and set everything down to minimum when I left.  A bad cold snap hit for those two weeks.  When I got my power bill (I used heat pump) that covered that time, I estimated the cost of driving (gas & wear and tear on the car) was less than if stayed home those two weeks and didn't go anywhere and paid for extra utilities.  Hopefully I can make this a common saving technique (snowbird-ing) when I retire.

I just read about one Vietnam Vet in TX that just got a bill for $16,000 for power that he barely used, and barely worked during the cold snap!

My cheapo generator would have been thrashed mercilessly if they jacked up my rates that high... $9 per KWhr!!!!

I heard about that, also. $9 a KWhr is crazy.  I guess there was no cap on potential charges.  Can you imagine the shock of opening up a bill like that?   It's all the worse for not knowing how much it might be, but knowing that it could be bad, and then finding that bad doesn't begin to cover it.   Those poor people. 

SwordGuy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4558 on: February 22, 2021, 07:02:20 PM »
Probably a lot cheaper to fly to Canun than to pay the power bill for the power you don't have! After you drain down all the pipes in your house beforehand of course.
Oh yeah.  Long ago (maybe 20 years?) I planned to visit my grandmother for two weeks and set everything down to minimum when I left.  A bad cold snap hit for those two weeks.  When I got my power bill (I used heat pump) that covered that time, I estimated the cost of driving (gas & wear and tear on the car) was less than if stayed home those two weeks and didn't go anywhere and paid for extra utilities.  Hopefully I can make this a common saving technique (snowbird-ing) when I retire.

I just read about one Vietnam Vet in TX that just got a bill for $16,000 for power that he barely used, and barely worked during the cold snap!

My cheapo generator would have been thrashed mercilessly if they jacked up my rates that high... $9 per KWhr!!!!

I heard about that, also. $9 a KWhr is crazy.  I guess there was no cap on potential charges.  Can you imagine the shock of opening up a bill like that?   It's all the worse for not knowing how much it might be, but knowing that it could be bad, and then finding that bad doesn't begin to cover it.   Those poor people.

On social media, the same folks I've seen defend Trump seem to think that those folks deserve what they got, after all, they signed the contract.   No empathy.   No caring.    Just dog eat dog, screw'em all.

Taran Wanderer

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4559 on: February 22, 2021, 09:18:25 PM »
People love the free market until it works against them. I read that the people on the variable rate got 5 cent/kWh residential electricity, which is basically industrial rate power in the Pacific Northwest, one of the areas with the lowest electricity costs in the country. They weren’t complaining then. But now that they experience a high marginal rate @ 180x the cost, they see their insane bills and are shocked. It’s basically newbies playing the commodity market and getting burned. I sympathize, but my sympathy only goes so far.  $16,000 is ridiculous, but maybe $1,600 would be enough to force them to re-think which plan to sign up for.

SwordGuy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4560 on: February 22, 2021, 09:27:40 PM »
The basic problem is that most people have zero idea that this could happen.   It's so outside their experience that they are blindsided by it.     You don't know what you don't know.

Exflyboy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4561 on: February 22, 2021, 09:45:58 PM »
The basic problem is that most people have zero idea that this could happen.   It's so outside their experience that they are blindsided by it.     You don't know what you don't know.

Exactly.. And hey.. At least its not Socialism right?

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4562 on: February 22, 2021, 10:02:34 PM »
Glad I'll be living in Florida. 

markbike528CBX

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4563 on: February 23, 2021, 12:36:33 AM »
Glad I'll be living in Florida.
It gets cold in Florida too, remember the Challenger Disaster.   below freezing at 28.0 to 28.9 °F (−2.2 to −1.7 °C)

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4564 on: February 23, 2021, 06:00:02 AM »
Glad I'll be living in Florida.
It gets cold in Florida too, remember the Challenger Disaster.   below freezing at 28.0 to 28.9 °F (−2.2 to −1.7 °C)

It was 27 at our Florida house recently.  Felt great.

SwordGuy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4565 on: February 23, 2021, 07:21:57 AM »
Glad I'll be living in Florida.
It gets cold in Florida too, remember the Challenger Disaster.   below freezing at 28.0 to 28.9 °F (−2.2 to −1.7 °C)

I was teaching a class in Miami in December years ago.   It got cold enough I turned on the heater in the hotel room.

Big mistake.  Those dust bunnies in the heating system started stinking to high heaven so I turned off the heater.

Then it set off the fire alarm in the entire wing of the hotel.   Everyone had to evacuate.

Mum's the word...

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4566 on: February 23, 2021, 07:58:22 AM »
Glad I'll be living in Florida.
It gets cold in Florida too, remember the Challenger Disaster.   below freezing at 28.0 to 28.9 °F (−2.2 to −1.7 °C)

I was teaching a class in Miami in December years ago.   It got cold enough I turned on the heater in the hotel room.

Big mistake.  Those dust bunnies in the heating system started stinking to high heaven so I turned off the heater.

Then it set off the fire alarm in the entire wing of the hotel.   Everyone had to evacuate.

Mum's the word...

I've installed mini split heat pumps in our Florida home.  The coils are never really that hot.  If using induction heat it's basically a toaster with a fan.  That dust, human hair, pet dander and insect nest burning smell is horrible.

tooqk4u22

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4567 on: February 23, 2021, 10:52:20 AM »
Probably a lot cheaper to fly to Canun than to pay the power bill for the power you don't have! After you drain down all the pipes in your house beforehand of course.
Oh yeah.  Long ago (maybe 20 years?) I planned to visit my grandmother for two weeks and set everything down to minimum when I left.  A bad cold snap hit for those two weeks.  When I got my power bill (I used heat pump) that covered that time, I estimated the cost of driving (gas & wear and tear on the car) was less than if stayed home those two weeks and didn't go anywhere and paid for extra utilities.  Hopefully I can make this a common saving technique (snowbird-ing) when I retire.

I just read about one Vietnam Vet in TX that just got a bill for $16,000 for power that he barely used, and barely worked during the cold snap!

My cheapo generator would have been thrashed mercilessly if they jacked up my rates that high... $9 per KWhr!!!!

I heard about that, also. $9 a KWhr is crazy.  I guess there was no cap on potential charges.  Can you imagine the shock of opening up a bill like that?   It's all the worse for not knowing how much it might be, but knowing that it could be bad, and then finding that bad doesn't begin to cover it.   Those poor people.

On social media, the same folks I've seen defend Trump seem to think that those folks deserve what they got, after all, they signed the contract.   No empathy.   No caring.    Just dog eat dog, screw'em all.

The main problem is that the utilities had to go buy natural gas on the spot market because they didn't lock in sufficient contracts for demand.   The futures contracts were before, during and now around $3+/- but the spot market skyrocketed to $300+ because of the immediate demand of a once in a 30-100 year event.  I believe in open markets but there is point where some protection from a significant adverse event occurs like when insurance companies reconcile for the year and then spread the difference over next years premiums so they don't collect up front but don't lose either.

On the other hand its almost exactly how the medical system works.....you know, nobody knows what anything costs or what's covered until you get a bill.   Could be $100 or $10,000. 

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4568 on: February 23, 2021, 05:09:45 PM »
Glad I'll be living in Florida.
It gets cold in Florida too, remember the Challenger Disaster.   below freezing at 28.0 to 28.9 °F (−2.2 to −1.7 °C)

It was 27 at our Florida house recently.  Felt great.

It was 82 inside my parents 3 season porch in Michigan today.  The cat decided it was too warm and went inside the house.

begood

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Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #4569 on: March 05, 2021, 05:04:38 AM »
Dicey, if you don't mind my asking, how do you assign a value to your husband's defined benefit pension? My husband should get about $27K/year (flat,non-COLA'd, 50% joint survivor) starting in 13 years.

Well, you didn't ask me :-), but what I do is divide by .04, to figure how how much the "'stache-equivalent" amount is.  E.g., to take out $27K/yr at the 4% rule, I'd need $675K.  Now, that is the 'stache-equivalent in 13 years, when he is eligible for that $27K/yr.  So if you want the current value of that, you could present-value it back to today's dollars.  But personally, I don't care that much -- I just like to know that, hey, in 13 years, I will have the equivalent of $675K more in my 'stache. 

But actually, even that is bass-ackwards, because the whole point of the 'stache is to throw off income -- so when you already know the income, you don't even need to calculate an equivalent 'stache value.  So in your case, I'd just knock the $27K off of the annual income you need, and then figure out how much else you need to save to cover the delta.  E.g., I need $40K/yr, I have $27K/yr already guaranteed, so my delta is $13K/yr.  Ergo, 4% rule, I need $13K x 25 = $325K more in my 'stache in 13 years.

Here's a good quote from page 1 one the thread.   With the amazing gains that the stock market has seen, most of you must be soaring by the goals of several years ago.

I'm the original poster who asked the question about how to assign a value to a defined pension benefit. Now we only have nine more years to wait for it to kick in! Like many others here, our portfolio has grown nicely over the past four years, and that includes us taking out expected college tuition over the past four years and sticking it in a money market account for safekeeping. Our kid ended up taking a gap year (graduated from high school in the class of 2020 - oof), and there have been expenses related to that as well, but I've never regretted the opportunity cost of removing those funds from the market during the run-up. I sure would have hated to need them and not have them had the opposite been true.

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4570 on: March 05, 2021, 08:03:56 AM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.

Much Fishing to Do

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4571 on: March 05, 2021, 08:29:58 AM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.

Looks like I'm down about 4% from the high.  Its really not until it hits about 8% from the high that I even consider it a 'dip' given how fast the markets fluctuate (though I totally agree that seems crazy when thinking about it on an absolute level, that the account dropping more than a year of living expenses is not even a an event....)

Dicey

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4572 on: March 05, 2021, 08:38:20 AM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.
Dip? What dip? I'm not paying any attention. I didn't increase any spending when the markets were running up and I'm not going to change my spending if it's going down. If things really take a dive, I'll move some of our dry powder into the market, but otherwise, it's business as usual at our house.

PS - It's nice to see some activity on this thread. It has been uncharacteristically quiet of late.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 08:40:18 AM by Dicey »

G-dog

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4573 on: March 05, 2021, 08:57:22 AM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.
Dip? What dip? I'm not paying any attention. I didn't increase any spending when the markets were running up and I'm not going to change my spending if it's going down. If things really take a dive, I'll move some of our dry powder into the market, but otherwise, it's business as usual at our house.

PS - It's nice to see some activity on this thread. It has been uncharacteristically quiet of late.

Well, it’s a big jump from $2MM to $4MM. 

I watch market dips and jumps (but don’t change spending) but this strikes me as normal volatility so far. 

rmorris50

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4574 on: March 05, 2021, 09:10:45 AM »
At least my 2.5 mortgage is winning! Will we ever move again???


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Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4575 on: March 05, 2021, 09:14:00 AM »
I put a limit order on ARKK for $99 a share.  That's about another 10 percent drop.  If the Covid relief package is delayed I think we see a bigger drop in general coming.  Buying opportunity if so desired.

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4576 on: March 05, 2021, 09:16:27 AM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.

Looks like I'm down about 4% from the high.  Its really not until it hits about 8% from the high that I even consider it a 'dip' given how fast the markets fluctuate (though I totally agree that seems crazy when thinking about it on an absolute level, that the account dropping more than a year of living expenses is not even a an event....)

Looks like about 3 percent for us.  Hope we see a bit more of a drop.

Roland of Gilead

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4577 on: March 05, 2021, 09:45:30 AM »
4% doesn't sound as bad as being down $160,000 I guess.

SwordGuy

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4578 on: March 05, 2021, 10:12:44 AM »
A lot of our net worth is in rental real estate and a chunk of our stock/bond portfolio is in bonds.

A 1% change in the S&P 500 index a year ago was about a $10,000 change.  I guess it's more now that the index is higher but I haven't bothered to figure it out.

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4579 on: March 05, 2021, 11:43:50 AM »
I put a limit order on ARKK for $99 a share.  That's about another 10 percent drop.  If the Covid relief package is delayed I think we see a bigger drop in general coming.  Buying opportunity if so desired.

Well shit.  I should have bought when my finger was on the trigger.  ARKK shot up almost 10 percent since that bottom.  All that in the time it took for me to install a new bathroom heater.  I guess that's why I don't day trade.

Car Jack

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4580 on: March 05, 2021, 12:19:14 PM »
I put a limit order on ARKK for $99 a share.  That's about another 10 percent drop.  If the Covid relief package is delayed I think we see a bigger drop in general coming.  Buying opportunity if so desired.

Well shit.  I should have bought when my finger was on the trigger.  ARKK shot up almost 10 percent since that bottom.  All that in the time it took for me to install a new bathroom heater.  I guess that's why I don't day trade.


I bought 1 share of SCHB on market open.  (yah, big spender, eh?).  I simply add enough money to buy 1 more share after a buy, rather than leaving cash in there or ACHing it back to my checking account.

I think it maybe went up?  I don't know.  Not really tracking it.

pecunia

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4581 on: March 05, 2021, 12:23:39 PM »
Stock Markets actually look pretty flat for the past month.  Now if the Senate is to pass the next Covid bill it may drive more money in the system again bumping up the stock market.

GreenEggs

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4582 on: March 05, 2021, 12:53:25 PM »
I put a limit order on ARKK for $99 a share.  That's about another 10 percent drop.  If the Covid relief package is delayed I think we see a bigger drop in general coming.  Buying opportunity if so desired.

Well shit.  I should have bought when my finger was on the trigger.  ARKK shot up almost 10 percent since that bottom.  All that in the time it took for me to install a new bathroom heater.  I guess that's why I don't day trade.




Buy all you can & tell all your buddies to load up too.  I've been watching my shares crash day after, day after, day.....


It was a lot more fun to watch it climb.  ;)

Much Fishing to Do

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4583 on: March 05, 2021, 01:45:22 PM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.

Looks like I'm down about 4% from the high.  Its really not until it hits about 8% from the high that I even consider it a 'dip' given how fast the markets fluctuate (though I totally agree that seems crazy when thinking about it on an absolute level, that the account dropping more than a year of living expenses is not even a an event....)

Heh, it looks like in the 7 hours since I wrote this the market is halfway back now....

Bateaux

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4584 on: March 12, 2021, 09:02:59 AM »
How's everyone doing with the dip in the markets?

I'm down about 75K from the highpoint.  If we go lower I may buy a bit if ARRK.  It's still pricey.

Looks like I'm down about 4% from the high.  Its really not until it hits about 8% from the high that I even consider it a 'dip' given how fast the markets fluctuate (though I totally agree that seems crazy when thinking about it on an absolute level, that the account dropping more than a year of living expenses is not even a an event....)

Heh, it looks like in the 7 hours since I wrote this the market is halfway back now....

Almost all the way back now from the little dip.  I'm getting more confidence daily that the economy will recover quickly.  The vaccine distribution is going well and we'll be on the beaches this summer.  We're not waiting that long.  Next weekend we'll leave the work camp in Louisiana and get back to our Florida utopia.  We're headed down to Fort Lauderdale for a wedding during that time.  Trying to get the beach body in shape after a year of quarantine.  I've put some miles in on my bicycle this week.  Unfortunately my planned off-road bike camping trip this weekend will be postponed.  I have to work Saturday and Sunday to cover a coworker who lost a family member.  Hopefully I'll get some local bike miles in today.  We have bikes in Florida and it is bicycle Mecca in our area.  The end of April we'll take another beach trip to Hilton Head, South Carolina.  We'll be bringing bikes there and should be able to park the car.   There is a ferry from Hilton Head to Savannah that we hope to take.  The trees are budding out here with Spring.  Glad to have 2020 behind and looking forward to a fabulous 2021.

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4585 on: March 12, 2021, 06:42:08 PM »
Looks to be back for a little while:

The Dow Jones Industrial Average climbed to a new high in today's stock market.

Uncle Sam is throwing money at the stock market.  Lots of money.  The money supply has been increased so much the government is ashamed to tell you what the money supply is.   Where does the money come from?  I think they are just printing it.

This could mean inflation. 

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4586 on: March 12, 2021, 07:23:23 PM »
Looks to be back for a little while:

The Dow Jones Industrial Average climbed to a new high in today's stock market.

Uncle Sam is throwing money at the stock market.  Lots of money.  The money supply has been increased so much the government is ashamed to tell you what the money supply is.   Where does the money come from?  I think they are just printing it.

This could mean inflation.

Printing money costs money.   It's cheaper to just have the Federal Reserve invent it out of thin air in digital form.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4587 on: March 12, 2021, 07:27:25 PM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

2sk22

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4588 on: March 13, 2021, 04:29:33 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

We have similar numbers in my household, except that we are a bit older, both in our 50s. We just crossed $5.6M in our invested net worth this week (IRA, 401k and after-tax).  I can understand that you want to stay where you are for continuity for your kids' school but it seems clear that you could retire right now if you wanted. I was curious as to why you are still working. Reading your journal, I have a hunch that either you or your husband is in a very similar line of work as I was.


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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4589 on: March 13, 2021, 04:44:40 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)


If you're ditching the house (and therefore the mortgage) in 4 years I don't think there's much reason for facepunch either way on your mortgage payoff decision (how you feel about it probably changes a lot anyway depending on whether we're talking the market today or the market in March of last year).  I enjoyed paying off my mortgage, but the house is probably only about 7% of my net worth so it just wasn't that significant a decision to make.  I think of it like a cash position in my portfolio that returns what the going mortgage rate is, and given how close I am to RE and how much I dislike bonds right now I think it makes sense given how much I already have in equities and how stomach churning last March already was.  Now If you were 28yo and 15 years from RE I'd facepunch you myself....

jeroly

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4590 on: March 13, 2021, 05:55:14 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

We have similar numbers in my household, except that we are a bit older, both in our 50s. We just crossed $5.6M in our invested net worth this week (IRA, 401k and after-tax).  I can understand that you want to stay where you are for continuity for your kids' school but it seems clear that you could retire right now if you wanted. I was curious as to why you are still working. Reading your journal, I have a hunch that either you or your husband is in a very similar line of work as I was.
Paying off the mortgage will have zero impact on your net worth. You will be reducing your assets and liabilities by the same amount. Either way, $5 million NW is enough to FIRE on quite comfortably.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4591 on: March 13, 2021, 07:46:35 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

We have similar numbers in my household, except that we are a bit older, both in our 50s. We just crossed $5.6M in our invested net worth this week (IRA, 401k and after-tax).  I can understand that you want to stay where you are for continuity for your kids' school but it seems clear that you could retire right now if you wanted. I was curious as to why you are still working. Reading your journal, I have a hunch that either you or your husband is in a very similar line of work as I was.

Very well done, @2sk22 . You are crushing it. I could FIRE right now, but I'll keep working until I have to go back to international travel (I'm guessing that will be required in ~1 year). We actually have quite a bit of our net worth tied up in retirement accounts ($2M), another paid off property (vacation house) & our house. So, it's more of a cash flow consideration that allows us to keep the rest of our investments as is, while we get our kids through high school. We could certainly make other choices.

We are both in tech. My role is much more specialized than my husband's.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4592 on: March 13, 2021, 07:48:51 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)


If you're ditching the house (and therefore the mortgage) in 4 years I don't think there's much reason for facepunch either way on your mortgage payoff decision (how you feel about it probably changes a lot anyway depending on whether we're talking the market today or the market in March of last year).  I enjoyed paying off my mortgage, but the house is probably only about 7% of my net worth so it just wasn't that significant a decision to make.  I think of it like a cash position in my portfolio that returns what the going mortgage rate is, and given how close I am to RE and how much I dislike bonds right now I think it makes sense given how much I already have in equities and how stomach churning last March already was.  Now If you were 28yo and 15 years from RE I'd facepunch you myself....

:-) Fair enough. We're still really on the fence on where we'll move in four years, but we don't need to live in this VHCOL. We'll see how fire season & climate change impacts the temperature, but we also need to start looking around in other areas around California. That's our post kids out of the house plan.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4593 on: March 13, 2021, 07:49:59 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

We have similar numbers in my household, except that we are a bit older, both in our 50s. We just crossed $5.6M in our invested net worth this week (IRA, 401k and after-tax).  I can understand that you want to stay where you are for continuity for your kids' school but it seems clear that you could retire right now if you wanted. I was curious as to why you are still working. Reading your journal, I have a hunch that either you or your husband is in a very similar line of work as I was.
Paying off the mortgage will have zero impact on your net worth. You will be reducing your assets and liabilities by the same amount. Either way, $5 million NW is enough to FIRE on quite comfortably.

I'm aware of the math. Paying down the mortgage is an emotional consideration for me. I was unwilling to consider quitting work when we were sitting on a $2m mortgage.

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4594 on: March 14, 2021, 10:14:33 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)
Oh shit! I was going to say, go ahead, pay it off: until I saw your sidenote. In that position, I'd be mighty tempted to figure our how little that house would cost me until i sold it. Recast, refi or just make minimum payments on the existing loan (assuming it's cheap). A plan to spend as little on the house payments and keep the platoons of little green soldiers deployed in the stock market is definitely worth heavy consideration. Are there any maintenance or improvement projects that need to happen before you sell? That may be a more effective way to deploy soldiers as well.

And yeah, you're rich. Congratulations!

flyingaway

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4595 on: March 14, 2021, 02:57:58 PM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

We have similar numbers in my household, except that we are a bit older, both in our 50s. We just crossed $5.6M in our invested net worth this week (IRA, 401k and after-tax).  I can understand that you want to stay where you are for continuity for your kids' school but it seems clear that you could retire right now if you wanted. I was curious as to why you are still working. Reading your journal, I have a hunch that either you or your husband is in a very similar line of work as I was.

Very well done, @2sk22 . You are crushing it. I could FIRE right now, but I'll keep working until I have to go back to international travel (I'm guessing that will be required in ~1 year). We actually have quite a bit of our net worth tied up in retirement accounts ($2M), another paid off property (vacation house) & our house. So, it's more of a cash flow consideration that allows us to keep the rest of our investments as is, while we get our kids through high school. We could certainly make other choices.

We are both in tech. My role is much more specialized than my husband's.

We have decided to retire next year and are now focused on fun, no longer interested in racing to $$$.

Just book one trip to the Great Smoky Mountain in April and another one to Las Vegas and the Grand Utah Circle of National Parks. We will plan at least one international trip this year if the virus situation does not get worse from here. We will get vaccinated in early April. Life is short and I cannot wait anymore.

MaybeBabyMustache

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4596 on: March 14, 2021, 04:51:33 PM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)
Oh shit! I was going to say, go ahead, pay it off: until I saw your sidenote. In that position, I'd be mighty tempted to figure our how little that house would cost me until i sold it. Recast, refi or just make minimum payments on the existing loan (assuming it's cheap). A plan to spend as little on the house payments and keep the platoons of little green soldiers deployed in the stock market is definitely worth heavy consideration. Are there any maintenance or improvement projects that need to happen before you sell? That may be a more effective way to deploy soldiers as well.

And yeah, you're rich. Congratulations!

The loan is cheap - 2.5% - so, we're all good there. And yes, your mindset matches ours on the improvement projects that exist. There's a very small chance we'll keep the house. If the CA fire season is under control & we decide the property taxes are worth it, this is a pretty great place to live.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4597 on: March 17, 2021, 09:55:43 AM »
We crested way over the $5m mark, selling stock that was held in a company stock account. It added another $300k or so of value to our net worth. Unsurprisingly, this gives me a lot less satisfaction that paying down what we owe (mortgage). I know this is unreasonable & illogical, yet debt causes me more emotional angst that our portfolio gains generate. We paid our mortgage down to the half way point today (facepunches graciously accepted). It's a bay area mortgage, so we've paid off just over $1.8m of house in a 4 years. Feeling good about that. Eventually, we'll recast our mortgage to a point that I'll feel comfortable quitting my job. I did the math today, and ... it's not far off. Now that, that feels "rich". The $5m of net worth, or the $1m+ of mortgage paid off? It doesn't feel the same. But, financial flexibility & the ability to do whatever I want in the future? That feels pretty rich.

(Sidenote: our kids have four years left of school, and after that, we'll be ditching the VHCOL house & moving somewhere cheaper. This is a plan that helps us get through the next 4-5 years.)

We have similar numbers in my household, except that we are a bit older, both in our 50s. We just crossed $5.6M in our invested net worth this week (IRA, 401k and after-tax).  I can understand that you want to stay where you are for continuity for your kids' school but it seems clear that you could retire right now if you wanted. I was curious as to why you are still working. Reading your journal, I have a hunch that either you or your husband is in a very similar line of work as I was.

Very well done, @2sk22 . You are crushing it. I could FIRE right now, but I'll keep working until I have to go back to international travel (I'm guessing that will be required in ~1 year). We actually have quite a bit of our net worth tied up in retirement accounts ($2M), another paid off property (vacation house) & our house. So, it's more of a cash flow consideration that allows us to keep the rest of our investments as is, while we get our kids through high school. We could certainly make other choices.

We are both in tech. My role is much more specialized than my husband's.

We have decided to retire next year and are now focused on fun, no longer interested in racing to $$$.

Just book one trip to the Great Smoky Mountain in April and another one to Las Vegas and the Grand Utah Circle of National Parks. We will plan at least one international trip this year if the virus situation does not get worse from here. We will get vaccinated in early April. Life is short and I cannot wait anymore.

Just flew back from my own National Parks Vegas loop., Vegas, Grand Canyon, Sedona (motezuma’s castle and well), Zion/Bryce Valley of Fire State park on my way to the airport for a red eye.  Weather was good except 1 “travel day” and 1/2 day of snow at Zion, but the. I got to see Zion and Bryce with snow.  Great hiking weather. 

flyingaway

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4598 on: March 21, 2021, 07:24:05 PM »

We have decided to retire next year and are now focused on fun, no longer interested in racing to $$$.

Just book one trip to the Great Smoky Mountain in April and another one to Las Vegas and the Grand Utah Circle of National Parks. We will plan at least one international trip this year if the virus situation does not get worse from here. We will get vaccinated in early April. Life is short and I cannot wait anymore.

Just flew back from my own National Parks Vegas loop., Vegas, Grand Canyon, Sedona (motezuma’s castle and well), Zion/Bryce Valley of Fire State park on my way to the airport for a red eye.  Weather was good except 1 “travel day” and 1/2 day of snow at Zion, but the. I got to see Zion and Bryce with snow.  Great hiking weather.

That is great. Did you visit the Monument Valley? The web says it is closed, but someone said you can just go there on your own.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!
« Reply #4599 on: March 22, 2021, 04:20:20 PM »

We have decided to retire next year and are now focused on fun, no longer interested in racing to $$$.

Just book one trip to the Great Smoky Mountain in April and another one to Las Vegas and the Grand Utah Circle of National Parks. We will plan at least one international trip this year if the virus situation does not get worse from here. We will get vaccinated in early April. Life is short and I cannot wait anymore.

Just flew back from my own National Parks Vegas loop., Vegas, Grand Canyon, Sedona (motezuma’s castle and well), Zion/Bryce Valley of Fire State park on my way to the airport for a red eye.  Weather was good except 1 “travel day” and 1/2 day of snow at Zion, but the. I got to see Zion and Bryce with snow.  Great hiking weather.

That is great. Did you visit the Monument Valley? The web says it is closed, but someone said you can just go there on your own.

I didn’t try because the day that would have made sense was my 1 day of really bad weather.