Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond!

[Taran Wanderer]

New thread name:  Race from $2M to $4M...and Beyond Beyond!

[EscapeVelocity2020]

For those of us in one of the Beyond categories (Beyond beyond?  it begins to sound meaningless LOL) I thought this post by WhiteCoatInvestor was interesting - 7 Things Wealthy People Don’t Have to Worry About (and 7 They Do)

I find that #1 in the 'things they do have to worry about' is also my number one worry.  Maybe I'm overcompensating by driving a 2015 Honda Fit and freezing my single-millionaire lifestyle in place?  DS just started a part time job at McDonalds and told me the other day that a colleague wondered why he had to work since his DD was a ChE...  We laughed it off, but I guess that is the meta now that rich kids are expected to know how much their parents have and play the 'finding a job is too hard or too beneath me' card once they figure it out...  Still holding the line on getting crazy with the hedonism, but also not living as large as we ostensibly could...

[Dicey]

I just updated my tracking spreadsheet and discovered that we are now above $9M in investments 😳. There's actually more: both my wife and I are entitled to pensions but I'm not including them until they are actually in hand.

Our annual core expenses (housing, food, cars, hobbies and online stuff) remains below $90k. In terms of discretionary spending, we spent $60k on travel in 2024 - which is a record for us. But I think we have hit a limit - I doubt we will be spending more on travel than this.

You certainly could...

[MaybeBabyMustache]

I just updated my tracking spreadsheet and discovered that we are now above $9M in investments 😳. There's actually more: both my wife and I are entitled to pensions but I'm not including them until they are actually in hand.

Our annual core expenses (housing, food, cars, hobbies and online stuff) remains below $90k. In terms of discretionary spending, we spent $60k on travel in 2024 - which is a record for us. But I think we have hit a limit - I doubt we will be spending more on travel than this.

You certainly could...

Agree with Dicey.  I can help you plan fun vacations that will help you spend way more! Not sure how many people are traveling, but we regularly pay for four (our own family) & often my parents, my sister, sometimes my nephews, etc. We also ski, which is insanely expensive. Judging by my travel budget for 2024, I feel like I could spend a lot (more) if I loosened the reins.

[Fomerly known as something]

For those of us in one of the Beyond categories (Beyond beyond?  it begins to sound meaningless LOL) I thought this post by WhiteCoatInvestor was interesting - 7 Things Wealthy People Don’t Have to Worry About (and 7 They Do)

Great article.  I’ll say on the things “I don’t worry about”. I’m still in the habit of worrying about them but then I actually look at the numbers and oh “never mind”.

For #3 ont the things to worry about, um that’s what created my wealth, thankyou rich and/or powerful people.

[oldtoyota]

For those of us in one of the Beyond categories (Beyond beyond?  it begins to sound meaningless LOL) I thought this post by WhiteCoatInvestor was interesting - 7 Things Wealthy People Don’t Have to Worry About (and 7 They Do)

Great article.  I’ll say on the things “I don’t worry about”. I’m still in the habit of worrying about them but then I actually look at the numbers and oh “never mind”.

For #3 ont the things to worry about, um that’s what created my wealth, thankyou rich and/or powerful people.

I enjoyed reading the article and several points resonated with me. We paid off our debt. It's just simpler. I appreciate the article's author simply stating this as a possible reason.

The point about withdrawal rate is a good one too. I've seen that debated many a time!

"If you just leave your money alone, it doubles every 7-10 years. If you're adding to it, your money may double in just 3-5 years. If you had enough five years ago to live on 4%, now you have enough to live on 2%. Only the truly paranoid worry about a sub-2% withdrawal rate." -- from the article

[oldtoyota]

What's that expression, if you don't fly first class your heirs will.

Possible tattoo for me? lol

[oldtoyota]

You all talking about business class, which I've considered recently, reminded me that we wanted to eat in a "fancy" restaurant before attending a concert. We had tickets in the 9th row, and the concert was amazing.

We feel slightly more ready to spend a little more than we did in the "accumulation" years yet not quite 100% comfortable with the idea. 

I'm trying to get into this mindset as well, especially with the booming market this year. I listened to a podcast interview with Bill Perkins (Die With Zero), and he said something that resonated with me: "When's the party?"

In other words, when do we give ourselves permission to stop worrying about money? When are we rich enough to stop fretting about small expenses and start enjoying all this money we've saved up?

To put this into practice, I'm trying to be deliberate about spending more on experiences I enjoy. I took my son to the Nightmare Before Christmas light show at the New York Botanical Gardens, which cost $140 for tickets, and the Luna Luna art exhibit in Manhattan, which was $175. Both of those were pricy, but they were well worth it. I'm glad I went.

Also, my wife is a WNBA fan and wants to go to opening day next year, but the tickets were $400. She felt guilty about spending that much. In the past, I would've flinched a little too. But we're multimillionaires, and it's silly to miss out because of the cost when we can easily afford it.

I'm happy to hear you are finding ways to enjoy experiences with the money you have. Living a good life and feeling joyful in the process is important. If we don't have that, what do we really have?

We purchased club level tickets to a professional team sport. We all love the sport, and attending the games make us so happy. I'm really glad we did that and mentioned to the family that I want to continue once our current plan ends.

I see you're from NYC. I was just there and happily paid for dinner for two friends.

A friend put me up, and I think I paid for a second meal and ordered a very nice gift (high-quality coffee for a month or so), which was well received!

Being able to do that without it being a big deal brought me a lot of happiness and hopefully was fun and enjoyable for my friends too.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

For those of us in one of the Beyond categories (Beyond beyond?  it begins to sound meaningless LOL) I thought this post by WhiteCoatInvestor was interesting - 7 Things Wealthy People Don’t Have to Worry About (and 7 They Do)

Great article.  I’ll say on the things “I don’t worry about”. I’m still in the habit of worrying about them but then I actually look at the numbers and oh “never mind”.

For #3 ont the things to worry about, um that’s what created my wealth, thankyou rich and/or powerful people.

I enjoyed reading the article and several points resonated with me. We paid off our debt. It's just simpler. I appreciate the article's author simply stating this as a possible reason.

The point about withdrawal rate is a good one too. I've seen that debated many a time!

"If you just leave your money alone, it doubles every 7-10 years. If you're adding to it, your money may double in just 3-5 years. If you had enough five years ago to live on 4%, now you have enough to live on 2%. Only the truly paranoid worry about a sub-2% withdrawal rate." -- from the article

I have a feeling folks like ExFlyBoy and several others that have been around for a while would do well to think deeply on this.  Nothing to be ashamed of...  but why be exited by a sub-3% withdrawal rate?  Maybe when times are tough and markets are flat or dropping, but it's been a long time since 2008 eh?

[Fomerly known as something]

Had another circular argument with one of the supervisors (not mine) in the office today. 

Me:  I’m retiring July 18

Him: our job is comparatively easy for the next couple of years.  Why not earn easy money.

Me: earning money on my couch is even easier (pension). 

Basically even an easy job is still a job.  I have plans non employment plans.  I’d be on his side if I was getting a retirement job but I’m not.  I can retire, build wealth and keep spending at pre retirement levels.  (If not higher).

[2sk22]

I just updated my tracking spreadsheet and discovered that we are now above $9M in investments 😳. There's actually more: both my wife and I are entitled to pensions but I'm not including them until they are actually in hand.

Our annual core expenses (housing, food, cars, hobbies and online stuff) remains below $90k. In terms of discretionary spending, we spent $60k on travel in 2024 - which is a record for us. But I think we have hit a limit - I doubt we will be spending more on travel than this.

You certainly could...

Agree with Dicey.  I can help you plan fun vacations that will help you spend way more! Not sure how many people are traveling, but we regularly pay for four (our own family) & often my parents, my sister, sometimes my nephews, etc. We also ski, which is insanely expensive. Judging by my travel budget for 2024, I feel like I could spend a lot (more) if I loosened the reins.

Loosening the reins on travel spending has been a gradual process for us. There was a long period until a couple of years ago when we were simply not able to travel for leisure. My dad had Alzheimers and mom had heart problems. I used to spend all my "vacation" time helping them out.

After their passing, we have been ramping up travel spending but it's taken us a little while to figure out what really works for us which is short but comfortable vacations. My wife is still working and I really enjoy my hobbies so neither of us want to be away for a long time.

Talk about splurge: We just got back from our highlight trip of 2024, a destination wedding (my nephew) in Southeast Asia. This trip alone cost about $25k. My wife and I traveled in business class and we bought premium economy for my daughters and their SOs. We all had such a great time that we are going to do it again next year.

[MaybeBabyMustache]

@2sk22 - your trip sounds fantastic! And yes, all of our most expensive trips have been with us paying for extra folks. We met DH's family in Dubai (they are in Iran, so finding places to mutually meet is near impossible) & we paid for the hotels for the entire group, and flights for our four, plus we gave everyone money while we were there. It was just under a week, and was half of our (generous) travel budget.

For 2024, our most expensive trip will be five days of skiing with six people. The passes are what really add up, but needing two rooms for the four teens is also a killer. And, feeding four teen boys will also be... pricey, shall we say. ;-)

[Bateaux]

Out of my element. My wife and I are visiting friends and staying with them in their 15000 square foot home. It's amazing and it's snowing outside. We're leaving today and we're borrowing their truck to drive to Mohegan Sun Resort. I live between Gulf coastal Louisiana and Florida. I don't drive in snow. I want to just Uber, but they insist on us borrowing their 4wd truck. New England is beautiful and it looks like Christmas here. Wish me luck as I white knuckle drive in the snow.

[tooqk4u22]

For those of us in one of the Beyond categories (Beyond beyond?  it begins to sound meaningless LOL) I thought this post by WhiteCoatInvestor was interesting - 7 Things Wealthy People Don’t Have to Worry About (and 7 They Do)

Great article.  I’ll say on the things “I don’t worry about”. I’m still in the habit of worrying about them but then I actually look at the numbers and oh “never mind”.

For #3 ont the things to worry about, um that’s what created my wealth, thankyou rich and/or powerful people.

I enjoyed reading the article and several points resonated with me. We paid off our debt. It's just simpler. I appreciate the article's author simply stating this as a possible reason.

The point about withdrawal rate is a good one too. I've seen that debated many a time!

"If you just leave your money alone, it doubles every 7-10 years. If you're adding to it, your money may double in just 3-5 years. If you had enough five years ago to live on 4%, now you have enough to live on 2%. Only the truly paranoid worry about a sub-2% withdrawal rate." -- from the article

I suspect that is true, assuming spending stays in check then a 2% WR or less has almost always been covered by dividends and interest alone.    I will let you know if I ever get there but it will take longer for me because of a more balanced portfolio.

[oldtoyota]

Out of my element. My wife and I are visiting friends and staying with them in their 15000 square foot home. It's amazing and it's snowing outside. We're leaving today and we're borrowing their truck to drive to Mohegan Sun Resort. I live between Gulf coastal Louisiana and Florida. I don't drive in snow. I want to just Uber, but they insist on us borrowing their 4wd truck. New England is beautiful and it looks like Christmas here. Wish me luck as I white knuckle drive in the snow.

Safe travels! How many bedrooms is that house? 15,000 square feet is quite something!

[Taran Wanderer]

Yikes! 15,000?  I stayed in a 10,000 sf home once, and I thought that was huge!

Good luck with the driving.  Just remember that four-wheel-drive does not mean four-wheel-stop.  Slow and gentle.

[jrhampt]

Out of my element. My wife and I are visiting friends and staying with them in their 15000 square foot home. It's amazing and it's snowing outside. We're leaving today and we're borrowing their truck to drive to Mohegan Sun Resort. I live between Gulf coastal Louisiana and Florida. I don't drive in snow. I want to just Uber, but they insist on us borrowing their 4wd truck. New England is beautiful and it looks like Christmas here. Wish me luck as I white knuckle drive in the snow.

Welcome to my neighborhood!  Are you seeing anything fun at the Sun?

[Bateaux]

Out of my element. My wife and I are visiting friends and staying with them in their 15000 square foot home. It's amazing and it's snowing outside. We're leaving today and we're borrowing their truck to drive to Mohegan Sun Resort. I live between Gulf coastal Louisiana and Florida. I don't drive in snow. I want to just Uber, but they insist on us borrowing their 4wd truck. New England is beautiful and it looks like Christmas here. Wish me luck as I white knuckle drive in the snow.

Welcome to my neighborhood!  Are you seeing anything fun at the Sun?

All went well in Connecticut and we had fun at Mohegan Sun. We got upgraded to a heavknof a suite and held our preparty in our room. We were there to watch LSU girls basketball play Seton Hall and UConn play Iowa State. Yesterday we flew to Chicago and will be watching LSU girls play UIC. Looks like we lucked out with weather again in Chicago. We'll fly back to New Orleans Friday. Loving the freedom of retirement.

[lhamo]

Out of my element. My wife and I are visiting friends and staying with them in their 15000 square foot home. It's amazing and it's snowing outside. We're leaving today and we're borrowing their truck to drive to Mohegan Sun Resort. I live between Gulf coastal Louisiana and Florida. I don't drive in snow. I want to just Uber, but they insist on us borrowing their 4wd truck. New England is beautiful and it looks like Christmas here. Wish me luck as I white knuckle drive in the snow.

Welcome to my neighborhood!  Are you seeing anything fun at the Sun?

All went well in Connecticut and we had fun at Mohegan Sun. We got upgraded to a heavknof a suite and held our preparty in our room. We were there to watch LSU girls basketball play Seton Hall and UConn play Iowa State. Yesterday we flew to Chicago and will be watching LSU girls play UIC. Looks like we lucked out with weather again in Chicago. We'll fly back to New Orleans Friday. Loving the freedom of retirement.

SEE -- WE TOLD YOU!!!!

Seriously, I know you had your reasons for continuing to work as long as you did, but it is sure nice to see that when you finally took the leap you found that retirement does indeed suit you very well indeed.

[Bateaux]

Out of my element. My wife and I are visiting friends and staying with them in their 15000 square foot home. It's amazing and it's snowing outside. We're leaving today and we're borrowing their truck to drive to Mohegan Sun Resort. I live between Gulf coastal Louisiana and Florida. I don't drive in snow. I want to just Uber, but they insist on us borrowing their 4wd truck. New England is beautiful and it looks like Christmas here. Wish me luck as I white knuckle drive in the snow.

Welcome to my neighborhood!  Are you seeing anything fun at the Sun?

All went well in Connecticut and we had fun at Mohegan Sun. We got upgraded to a heavknof a suite and held our preparty in our room. We were there to watch LSU girls basketball play Seton Hall and UConn play Iowa State. Yesterday we flew to Chicago and will be watching LSU girls play UIC. Looks like we lucked out with weather again in Chicago. We'll fly back to New Orleans Friday. Loving the freedom of retirement.

SEE -- WE TOLD YOU!!!!

Seriously, I know you had your reasons for continuing to work as long as you did, but it is sure nice to see that when you finally took the leap you found that retirement does indeed suit you very well indeed.

I had to go till 55 for my benefits package and it was worth it. In fact the benefits are what makes the over 100K paper loss in net worth no big deal. I'm hopeful I'll be calm my first bear market recession. The last two years have been Disneyland for investors. You can smell the bear coming, but is it months away or years away? None of us know. I'm just hopeful we see some new highs in January and I'm going to pull enough money to last a year.

[Fomerly known as something]

Yippee government shutdown looks to be coming.  I sent out an email to my younger coworkers who weren’t around for Trump 2019.  It was after our boss sent out a more official one with much government speak.  Mine was what happens from a practical standpoint.  Aka we still get paid tomorrow for work from last week.  We will get a partial check in 2 weeks if there is a prolonged one for the same reason.  After that it’s an IOU.  I hope for their sake we don’t get that far.

[Exflyboy]

There is one thing.. The after tax VTSAX dividend check still shows up next week.

As we live pretty much on our rental income plus dividends (free of Fed income tax), the value of our portfolio really doesn't make any difference..:)

[tooqk4u22]

Yippee government shutdown looks to be coming.  I sent out an email to my younger coworkers who weren’t around for Trump 2019.  It was after our boss sent out a more official one with much government speak.  Mine was what happens from a practical standpoint.  Aka we still get paid tomorrow for work from last week.  We will get a partial check in 2 weeks if there is a prolonged one for the same reason.  After that it’s an IOU.  I hope for their sake we don’t get that far.

Maybe shut downs would be avoided if the government employees didn't always get back pay for not working as has been the case for a long time now, at least for those deemed non-essential.   I am pretty sure the employees and unions would be putting significant pressure on congress and the president to avoid this at all costs if there was no pay, instead its a nice little vacation where everyone has already stopped working just in case and when the shutdown ends everyone will take an additional two weeks to ramp back up their productivity.  Essential employees who still have to work with a delay in their pay also slow down tremendously even if still working. 

[ROF Expat]

Do I understand correctly that you're asserting that government employees are somehow responsible for Congress' inability/unwillingness to pass a budget? 

[SwordGuy]

Do I understand correctly that you're asserting that government employees are somehow responsible for Congress' inability/unwillingness to pass a budget?

I think they're saying that if congress didn't give back pay, the federal workers would vote against incumbents en masse, and therefore congressmembers wouldn't play these destructive games.

They're not responsible, but they do have significant power to stop it that they are not using.

[Fomerly known as something]

Yippee government shutdown looks to be coming.  I sent out an email to my younger coworkers who weren’t around for Trump 2019.  It was after our boss sent out a more official one with much government speak.  Mine was what happens from a practical standpoint.  Aka we still get paid tomorrow for work from last week.  We will get a partial check in 2 weeks if there is a prolonged one for the same reason.  After that it’s an IOU.  I hope for their sake we don’t get that far.

Maybe shut downs would be avoided if the government employees didn't always get back pay for not working as has been the case for a long time now, at least for those deemed non-essential.   I am pretty sure the employees and unions would be putting significant pressure on congress and the president to avoid this at all costs if there was no pay, instead its a nice little vacation where everyone has already stopped working just in case and when the shutdown ends everyone will take an additional two weeks to ramp back up their productivity.  Essential employees who still have to work with a delay in their pay also slow down tremendously even if still working.

Well wouldn’t you only do actual essential work if you were being paid an IOU and procrastinate on the other stuff.  I’m essential.  Those that didn’t work weren’t essential until 2019 were not guaranteed pay after it was over.  They always got it.  But it had to be voted on specifically by congress so no not paying workers doesn’t move the needle.

[Fomerly known as something]

Also on well voting for their representatives. 

There are only 2.3 million federal employees.  Of that 150,000 are in my State of California which is 0.8% of the states work force.  We are not a significant voting block.

ETA:  by volume CA has the most federal workers of any State BTW.  Texas also has a high number.  Mostly due to DOD and being boarder states.

[tooqk4u22]

Do I understand correctly that you're asserting that government employees are somehow responsible for Congress' inability/unwillingness to pass a budget?

I think they're saying that if congress didn't give back pay, the federal workers would vote against incumbents en masse, and therefore congressmembers wouldn't play these destructive games.

They're not responsible, but they do have significant power to stop it that they are not using.

That is correct.  There are 3 million feds, roughly 2/3rds non-essential, so it is a formidable force that can mobilize union leaders to exert pressure on politicians.

Yippee government shutdown looks to be coming.  I sent out an email to my younger coworkers who weren’t around for Trump 2019.  It was after our boss sent out a more official one with much government speak.  Mine was what happens from a practical standpoint.  Aka we still get paid tomorrow for work from last week.  We will get a partial check in 2 weeks if there is a prolonged one for the same reason.  After that it’s an IOU.  I hope for their sake we don’t get that far.

Maybe shut downs would be avoided if the government employees didn't always get back pay for not working as has been the case for a long time now, at least for those deemed non-essential.   I am pretty sure the employees and unions would be putting significant pressure on congress and the president to avoid this at all costs if there was no pay, instead its a nice little vacation where everyone has already stopped working just in case and when the shutdown ends everyone will take an additional two weeks to ramp back up their productivity.  Essential employees who still have to work with a delay in their pay also slow down tremendously even if still working.

Well wouldn’t you only do actual essential work if you were being paid an IOU and procrastinate on the other stuff.  I’m essential.  Those that didn’t work weren’t essential until 2019 were not guaranteed pay after it was over.  They always got it.  But it had to be voted on specifically by congress so no not paying workers doesn’t move the needle.

I am a private employee and don't have a choice - no work, no pay even if its the company's fault.   Guaranteed back pay makes it irrelevant and just a timing issue - all feds know this but still bitch that "Oh they are not paying me and I still have to work, but I am going to barely do the bare minimum and may not show up at all."  Anyway that's not the point but you went there.  Point is fed force would have some sway.

Anyway the Feds in this thread don't need to worry about it so back on topic......good to be here.

[Fomerly known as something]

Do I understand correctly that you're asserting that government employees are somehow responsible for Congress' inability/unwillingness to pass a budget?

I think they're saying that if congress didn't give back pay, the federal workers would vote against incumbents en masse, and therefore congressmembers wouldn't play these destructive games.

They're not responsible, but they do have significant power to stop it that they are not using.

That is correct.  There are 3 million feds, roughly 2/3rds non-essential, so it is a formidable force that can mobilize union leaders to exert pressure on politicians.

Yippee government shutdown looks to be coming.  I sent out an email to my younger coworkers who weren’t around for Trump 2019.  It was after our boss sent out a more official one with much government speak.  Mine was what happens from a practical standpoint.  Aka we still get paid tomorrow for work from last week.  We will get a partial check in 2 weeks if there is a prolonged one for the same reason.  After that it’s an IOU.  I hope for their sake we don’t get that far.

Maybe shut downs would be avoided if the government employees didn't always get back pay for not working as has been the case for a long time now, at least for those deemed non-essential.   I am pretty sure the employees and unions would be putting significant pressure on congress and the president to avoid this at all costs if there was no pay, instead its a nice little vacation where everyone has already stopped working just in case and when the shutdown ends everyone will take an additional two weeks to ramp back up their productivity.  Essential employees who still have to work with a delay in their pay also slow down tremendously even if still working.

Well wouldn’t you only do actual essential work if you were being paid an IOU and procrastinate on the other stuff.  I’m essential.  Those that didn’t work weren’t essential until 2019 were not guaranteed pay after it was over.  They always got it.  But it had to be voted on specifically by congress so no not paying workers doesn’t move the needle.

I am a private employee and don't have a choice - no work, no pay even if its the company's fault.   Guaranteed back pay makes it irrelevant and just a timing issue - all feds know this but still bitch that "Oh they are not paying me and I still have to work, but I am going to barely do the bare minimum and may not show up at all."  Anyway that's not the point but you went there.  Point is fed force would have some sway.

Anyway the Feds in this thread don't need to worry about it so back on topic......good to be here.

When I have to come to work for an IOU.  I work.  I should be paid for that work.  But I’m not going to go the “extra mile”. Nor am I going to be happy and cheerful.  Those who are essential are in fact working.  That is why they are essential.  When I speak of procrastination I’m speaking about those administrative tasks that we all do that are not essential.  If someone did what the government does in the private escort it is wage theft.  But I get it.  You are one of those people who think all Government workers are inherently lazy people who couldn’t be in the private sector.

[Geppetto]

If somebody told me my employer would slow-pay me once every couple of years, but in exchange I get the best benefits on earth and a pension worth millions for the rest of my life when I retire, I'd take that deal. With all due acknowledgment of the federal employees who give the public a hard day's work every day, I know all too well that you're in the minority, and nobody should be getting exercised about a brief government shutdown. They're always too brief. Count me as long past ready for the (extraordinarily non-mustachian) federal payroll to be cut in half or better. A guy can dream.

[oldtoyota]

I just updated my tracking spreadsheet and discovered that we are now above $9M in investments 😳. There's actually more: both my wife and I are entitled to pensions but I'm not including them until they are actually in hand.

Our annual core expenses (housing, food, cars, hobbies and online stuff) remains below $90k. In terms of discretionary spending, we spent $60k on travel in 2024 - which is a record for us. But I think we have hit a limit - I doubt we will be spending more on travel than this.

You certainly could...

I'd definitely be getting the sleeper seats for international travel! Congrats to you both!

[FireLane]

Count me as long past ready for the (extraordinarily non-mustachian) federal payroll to be cut in half or better. A guy can dream.

Just so we're clear on what this would entail: 70% of federal employees work in defense or national security.

Even if you fired every single employee in every other agency of the federal government, that wouldn't get you to your goal. To cut the payroll "in half or better," you'd have to lay off a large percentage, perhaps a majority, of the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Navy, the Army, the Air Force, and Homeland Security, which includes the TSA and Customs and Border Patrol. Is that something you'd support?

[SwordGuy]

Count me as long past ready for the (extraordinarily non-mustachian) federal payroll to be cut in half or better. A guy can dream.

Just so we're clear on what this would entail: 70% of federal employees work in defense or national security.

Even if you fired every single employee in every other agency of the federal government, that wouldn't get you to your goal. To cut the payroll "in half or better," you'd have to lay off a large percentage, perhaps a majority, of the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Navy, the Army, the Air Force, and Homeland Security, which includes the TSA and Customs and Border Patrol. Is that something you'd support?

There you go with facts.   Who needs facts when it comes to determining public policy?   

[AuspiciousEight]

2.1 million.

As someone from a LCOL area, I never thought I would be joining this thread, but here we are.

I feel sort of unmotivated to save more money now because there aren't any more race threads to join. I also don't have a lot of things left that I want in life to spend the money on really, and I don't share my net worth with people IRL, so I don't really derive any sort of status / ego from the money.

I am somewhere around 2.5-3% withdrawal rate, so saving more seems sort of pointless in that regard.

I have a very slight urge to go buy a used fire truck now, but I think I will resist, lol.

[2KidFIRE]

Congratulations!  You need to get to "beyond" so that you can afford a brand new fire truck!

[JupiterGreen]

congrats @AuspiciousEight

Guys, just checked my balance and somehow it creeped over 2m without me noticing. Pretty cool. We are going to be pulling a couple of hundred thousand sometime soon to throw at a new house. So we're on the edge here, but if we look at NW we're over by a bit. Hope it's still okay to join, it just felt like a milestone to see that balance today- yippee! happy new year y'all! can't wait to see how the other half (over here at 2m+) lives, hope I'm fancy enough. 

Edit: okay my accounting was wrong by 200k because of the house money I set aside (I counted it twice), lol. We are 200k shy of 2mil, boo. So I am going to slink back to 1-2 thread and come back here whenever I've properly hit the 2 mark in investments. It was nice while it lasted and I guess now I know that I'm going to feel pretty damn good when we finally hit 2. I didn't feel that way at 1.

[AuspiciousEight]

Thanks @2KidFIRE , thanks @JupiterGreen

Also - congrats @JupiterGreen !!

[2sk22]

I have a very slight urge to go buy a used fire truck now, but I think I will resist, lol.

Congrats and I love this :-)

[Geppetto]

Count me as long past ready for the (extraordinarily non-mustachian) federal payroll to be cut in half or better. A guy can dream.

Just so we're clear on what this would entail: 70% of federal employees work in defense or national security.

Even if you fired every single employee in every other agency of the federal government, that wouldn't get you to your goal. To cut the payroll "in half or better," you'd have to lay off a large percentage, perhaps a majority, of the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Navy, the Army, the Air Force, and Homeland Security, which includes the TSA and Customs and Border Patrol. Is that something you'd support?

You make a fine point. As a taxpayer I’d be satisfied if we tried and missed the mark fractionally, after finding that more than 50% of the workforce is actually performing essential functions well.

The military is many things. It’s a fighting force, but it’s also a jobs program for the boys and girls. To the extent it’s a jobs program, no, I “wouldn’t buy it today.” As with any taxpayer funded initiative (or any company department, or any recurring household expenditure), it needs a gimlet eye turned on it occasionally to ensure it’s doing what it’s really meant to do at a fair price.

[Dicey]

Count me as long past ready for the (extraordinarily non-mustachian) federal payroll to be cut in half or better. A guy can dream.

Just so we're clear on what this would entail: 70% of federal employees work in defense or national security.

Even if you fired every single employee in every other agency of the federal government, that wouldn't get you to your goal. To cut the payroll "in half or better," you'd have to lay off a large percentage, perhaps a majority, of the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Navy, the Army, the Air Force, and Homeland Security, which includes the TSA and Customs and Border Patrol. Is that something you'd support?

You make a fine point. As a taxpayer I’d be satisfied if we tried and missed the mark fractionally, after finding that more than 50% of the workforce is actually performing essential functions well.

The military is many things. It’s a fighting force, but it’s also a jobs program for the boys and girls. To the extent it’s a jobs program, no, I “wouldn’t buy it today.” As with any taxpayer funded initiative (or any company department, or any recurring household expenditure), it needs a gimlet eye turned on it occasionally to ensure it’s doing what it’s really meant to do at a fair price.

Defunding the police didn't work so well. I wouldn't expect defending (<--I missed this autocarrot for defunding.) the military would be any better.

BTW, referring to people who put their lives on the line for the rest of us as "boys and girls" is ridiculously out of touch.

[Geppetto]

"Jobs program for the boys and girls" was a quote from a family member who made his career in the military.

Anyway I don't think it's worth arguing whether any department of government can be made better. Of course they all can be and they should be. "Defund the police" had nothing to do with making policing better. But if you ask any beat cop how many jobs over his head should be "de-funded", he or she wouldn't say "zero." Maybe there are people better positioned than the beat cop to decide exactly what bloat needs to be dealt with, and reasonable minds can disagree on the details. But I like to think a point of commonality here would be that the nation - i.e. the aggregate sum of our households - has some fiscal problems that might profit from attention. 

[Dicey]

It's still out of touch. While I appreciate your clarification, there are lots of words our older relatives used that are no longer, and for good reason. "Stewardess" is an easy example.

As to bloat, it's endemic in most, if not all organizations. You are suggesting huge cuts, which would likely leave our country vulnerable, same as defunding the police did in our cities.

As to your last sentence, I wholeheartedly agree, but it must happen prudently. Slashing and burning is not the answer.

[Fomerly known as something]

It’s super easy to “Monday Morning” QB the government and military.  Always talking about how this wouldn’t happen in private industry.  Well in general I’ve found private industry doesn’t want to do what the government does because there is “no profit” in it.  Especially when it is a service that is provided to all no matter if they can “afford” to pay it. 

[FireLane]

It’s super easy to “Monday Morning” QB the government and military.  Always talking about how this wouldn’t happen in private industry.  Well in general I’ve found private industry doesn’t want to do what the government does because there is “no profit” in it.  Especially when it is a service that is provided to all no matter if they can “afford” to pay it.

I agree with that. To an extent, inefficiency is baked into what the government does, because it's supposed to serve all people regardless of whether it's profitable.

An "efficient" postal service, or school system, or fire department might provide no service to poor, thinly populated, or hard-to-reach areas, because it would cost more to do so than the people in those places were able to pay. An "efficient" health insurer would cancel the coverage of sick people who'd cost more to treat than they pay in premiums. An "efficient" court system would focus on issuing decisions as quickly as possible, without all that slow and burdensome stuff like due process and appeals.

Efficiency is all well and good - until you're on the wrong side of the balance sheet.

[ixtap]

Just did our first post retirement check in and we are up. That is nice to see given how little prep went into the retirement date (I thought he was going to work another six weeks) and that the friend he has been subsidizing hasn't put anything into the kitty in quite some time.

[Dicey]

It’s super easy to “Monday Morning” QB the government and military.  Always talking about how this wouldn’t happen in private industry.  Well in general I’ve found private industry doesn’t want to do what the government does because there is “no profit” in it.  Especially when it is a service that is provided to all no matter if they can “afford” to pay it.

I agree with that. To an extent, inefficiency is baked into what the government does, because it's supposed to serve all people regardless of whether it's profitable.

An "efficient" postal service, or school system, or fire department might provide no service to poor, thinly populated, or hard-to-reach areas, because it would cost more to do so than the people in those places were able to pay. An "efficient" health insurer would cancel the coverage of sick people who'd cost more to treat than they pay in premiums. An "efficient" court system would focus on issuing decisions as quickly as possible, without all that slow and burdensome stuff like due process and appeals.

Efficiency is all well and good - until you're on the wrong side of the balance sheet.

Thanks for saying it better than I did.

[SwordGuy]

It’s super easy to “Monday Morning” QB the government and military.  Always talking about how this wouldn’t happen in private industry.  Well in general I’ve found private industry doesn’t want to do what the government does because there is “no profit” in it.  Especially when it is a service that is provided to all no matter if they can “afford” to pay it.

I agree with that. To an extent, inefficiency is baked into what the government does, because it's supposed to serve all people regardless of whether it's profitable.

An "efficient" postal service, or school system, or fire department might provide no service to poor, thinly populated, or hard-to-reach areas, because it would cost more to do so than the people in those places were able to pay. An "efficient" health insurer would cancel the coverage of sick people who'd cost more to treat than they pay in premiums. An "efficient" court system would focus on issuing decisions as quickly as possible, without all that slow and burdensome stuff like due process and appeals.

Efficiency is all well and good - until you're on the wrong side of the balance sheet.

Thanks for saying it better than I did.

Agreed.   

[okparallax]

As of December 2024 we are now at $2 Million in Net Worth.

Our Balance Sheet looks like this:
$30K Cash
$1,630,000 Investments
$670,0000 Home Value

$330,000 Mortgage
No Other Debt

The mortgage though only 2.7% and a large property tax bill due to being in a HCOL area means that we will need to get the investments up to between 2 to 2.5 Million. My wife recently lost her job though and we are unsure on what the future holds there. I would like to have her not work but that means i will need to put in significantly more years then i was planning. We will see.

[ingrownstudentloans]

Joining this race after a short stint in the 1-2 race.  Focusing on continuing to double my money in as short a period of time as possible.

(tracking retirement accounts, taxable accounts and conservative equity in my rental properties, investment land and side businesses)

12/2014    $32,000
12/2016    $64,000 (24 months)
1/2018      $128,000 (25 months)
5/2019      $256,000 (16 months)
11/2020    $512,000 (19 months)
12/2021  $1,024,000 (13 months)
4/2022    $2,048,000 (4 months)
7/2023    $4,096,000 (16 months)
**Target**  12/2025  $8,192,000 (17 months)***

12/31/2022      $2,956,000
12/31/2023      $5,457,000
12/31/2024      $7,316,058

[Turtle]

As of December 2024 we are now at $2 Million in Net Worth.

Our Balance Sheet looks like this:
$30K Cash
$1,630,000 Investments
$670,0000 Home Value

$330,000 Mortgage
No Other Debt

The mortgage though only 2.7% and a large property tax bill due to being in a HCOL area means that we will need to get the investments up to between 2 to 2.5 Million. My wife recently lost her job though and we are unsure on what the future holds there. I would like to have her not work but that means i will need to put in significantly more years then i was planning. We will see.

Congrats and welcome to the thread!  It sounds like you are at least at a phase where your wife can be picky about choosing her next employment opportunity.