Author Topic: Race from $2M to $3M  (Read 18474 times)

Mr Griz

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 42
  • Location: Texas
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #100 on: October 14, 2017, 05:42:42 AM »
We’re about 6 months from FIRE and I’ve been simplifying our various investment and bank accounts. Each one tells a story and it’s been interesting to relive all the financial blunders we’ve made over the years. Despite all, the stache is well above $2M. It’s truly been as straightforward as JL Collins & Mr. MM describe it.

bigchrisb

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #101 on: October 17, 2017, 02:13:02 AM »


35 Engineer here. Self made through investment, both listed stocks and private businesses (invested in and grew my former employer before selling the company).  My wife is a public servant, but we have not combined finances.  If we had, we would be in the race to 4m. 

Mostly invested in stocks with a bit of leverage.  The first million took 7 years, the second 3.5, and the next 900k was under a year.  I always knew the theory that it would turn exponential, but I'm still a bit disbelieving of the reality.

So, this month I started a trial fire with 2.9m. 10 days post job and the rallying markets have done enough to bump me over the $3m Mark.  Aside from staying the investment course, it was all down to what the market did. 

Being in a draw down phase for at least a couple of years I expect the accumulation pace to slow down now.

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #102 on: October 17, 2017, 07:17:54 AM »
35 Engineer here. Self made through investment, both listed stocks and private businesses (invested in and grew my former employer before selling the company).  My wife is a public servant, but we have not combined finances.  If we had, we would be in the race to 4m. 

Mostly invested in stocks with a bit of leverage.  The first million took 7 years, the second 3.5, and the next 900k was under a year.  I always knew the theory that it would turn exponential, but I'm still a bit disbelieving of the reality.
So, this month I started a trial fire with 2.9m. 10 days post job and the rallying markets have done enough to bump me over the $3m Mark.  Aside from staying the investment course, it was all down to what the market did. 

Being in a draw down phase for at least a couple of years I expect the accumulation pace to slow down now.
Congratulations, bigchrisb!
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

Exflyboy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4626
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #103 on: October 17, 2017, 09:57:50 AM »
^^^^ Excellent^^^^^

EscapeVelocity2020

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1521
  • Age: 44
  • Location: Houston
    • EscapeVelocity2020
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #104 on: October 17, 2017, 10:42:02 PM »
Is there a race from $3M to $4M thread?  If not, maybe bigchrisb can start it! 
Transitioning to FIRE'd albeit somewhat cautiously...

Jill P

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 54
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #105 on: October 21, 2017, 09:46:07 PM »
Maybe a thread title change: "Race from $2M and beyond..."

Exflyboy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4626
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #106 on: October 22, 2017, 07:36:56 AM »
Hehe.. this is starting to sound like one of those philosophical discussions.. Like "How much is too much?"...:)

Or even "how much is enough?"

My "number" is $5m.. or roughly double what I have now..;)

itchyfeet

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 382
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #107 on: October 22, 2017, 10:04:52 AM »
I would never say $5 million USD is too much.

DW and I could certainly find a way to spend it.

But for us, the tipping point at which the extra spending power isn't worth the extra days spent in an office falls short of $5M.

About half of that number will do for us 2.5M USD= ~ 3.3M AUD. yep enough 👍 .

Maybe I will have some kind of encore career that will see us get us a little closer to $5M. who knows.

(I am talking today's $ above. I am sure one day my stash will be $5million, but it will be worth half as much as $5m today.)

mjr

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 110
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Brisbane, Qld
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #108 on: October 22, 2017, 05:13:51 PM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

concealed stache

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 36
  • Do you have a permit for that thing?
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #109 on: October 22, 2017, 07:28:18 PM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

I find myself in the same boat - although I don't run complete numbers during the month, it's quite clear that I've rolled over into 2.x territory this month - of course that could all change by month end. Given that I've handed in my notice I expect to be riding the local train for the next gains instead of the express it's been of late.

itchyfeet

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 382
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #110 on: October 22, 2017, 09:28:43 PM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

The $2.5m I am talking about above is really $1.8M plus PPOR.

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #111 on: October 22, 2017, 09:47:30 PM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

The $2.5m I am talking about above is really $1.8M plus PPOR.
Principal Place of Residence? Possible Place of Refuge? Perinatal Periods of Risk?

Are your numbers in USD or AUS?
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

mjr

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 110
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Brisbane, Qld
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #112 on: October 23, 2017, 12:18:03 AM »
Aussie dollars, of course.  We can't spend US dollars here :-)

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #113 on: October 23, 2017, 07:55:29 AM »
Haha. I'll happily spend some more USD in your part of the world if ever I get the chance to return. But seriously, what the hell is PPOR?
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

EscapeVelocity2020

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1521
  • Age: 44
  • Location: Houston
    • EscapeVelocity2020
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #114 on: October 23, 2017, 08:00:10 AM »
Principal Place of Residence?  Potential Prodigious Onset of Revenue? 

And 2M AUS is 'merely' 1.56M USD, you've not even made it to the starting line :)
Transitioning to FIRE'd albeit somewhat cautiously...

itchyfeet

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 382
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #115 on: October 23, 2017, 12:27:51 PM »
Yes, PPOR is an Australian taxation acronym for the house you live in, and get a capital gains tax exemption for. Principal Place of Residence. Should just call it home like everyone else I suppose.

I didn't join this thread till I passed $2M USD, which occurred several months back when the USD dropped v the AUD.

With the USD slowly regaining ground there is a small risk I could drop below $2M USD once more.

wannabe-stache

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 38
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #116 on: October 31, 2017, 02:35:49 PM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

The $2.5m I am talking about above is really $1.8M plus PPOR.

Same here. $2.65M with home equity. so close...

edited to add that i am sitting in my office wearing loafers i bought at a thrift store, ate lunch at my desk and took the train to work today. what a nice day.

EscapeVelocity2020

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1521
  • Age: 44
  • Location: Houston
    • EscapeVelocity2020
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #117 on: October 31, 2017, 11:22:33 PM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

The $2.5m I am talking about above is really $1.8M plus PPOR.

Same here. $2.65M with home equity. so close...

edited to add that i am sitting in my office wearing loafers i bought at a thrift store, ate lunch at my desk and took the train to work today. what a nice day.

Not trying to make waves, but since I'm doing well on NW already, just being at work seems to give me the liberty to buy a fresh $5 salad most days (when I have to buy for myself - most times I have lunch meetings) and splurge a little on good shoes

To each their own, but none of these things seems to move the needle much for me either way, other than knowing I am eating healthier and taking good care of my gait.  Low stress job, so I'm OK with working as long as they'll have me.  And it looks like I'll get some plum international travel in 2018...
Transitioning to FIRE'd albeit somewhat cautiously...

wannabe-stache

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 38
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #118 on: November 01, 2017, 07:16:10 AM »

[/quote]

Same here. $2.65M with home equity. so close...

edited to add that i am sitting in my office wearing loafers i bought at a thrift store, ate lunch at my desk and took the train to work today. what a nice day.
[/quote]

Not trying to make waves, but since I'm doing well on NW already, just being at work seems to give me the liberty to buy a fresh $5 salad most days (when I have to buy for myself - most times I have lunch meetings) and splurge a little on good shoes

To each their own, but none of these things seems to move the needle much for me either way, other than knowing I am eating healthier and taking good care of my gait.  Low stress job, so I'm OK with working as long as they'll have me.  And it looks like I'll get some plum international travel in 2018...
[/quote]

No worries, like you i tend not to begrudge others' choices. i buy a diet coke every day for lunch and my wife and i still occasionally treat ourselves to good wine from our napa valley wineries.  that's the refreshing part of this particular thread, it's less dogmatic than most.

what MMM and others have opened my eyes to was seeing value in purchases. i didn't really value my BMW, or cable TV, or my landscaper, so i cut them out. but you can take my pinot or my diet coke from my cold, dead hands.


Car Jack

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 474
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #119 on: November 01, 2017, 10:37:41 AM »
Ah, you guys should loosen up and live a little!  (I say, then realize I'm wearing sneakers that one of my kids got sick of and pants inherited from my dad)

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #120 on: November 01, 2017, 11:48:15 AM »
Ticked over $2m ex-PPOR today.  I think my race has been run, I don't see how I can possibly stay working until the $3m mark, but at least I can join this race in a casual saunter.

The $2.5m I am talking about above is really $1.8M plus PPOR.

Same here. $2.65M with home equity. so close...

edited to add that i am sitting in my office wearing loafers i bought at a thrift store, ate lunch at my desk and took the train to work today. what a nice day.
HeHe, just wait until you're FIRE.
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

honeyfill

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 39
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Tucson
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #121 on: November 01, 2017, 10:06:46 PM »
Sitting at 2.35M here. 2.5 with home equity.  We are 60/58 and retiring some time in the next 10 months so its highly unlikely we reach 3m, but its fun to track it and to watch others go for the big 3.0. We 've hit our number and built u a couple of years of cash reserves so we really don't need any more.  Dropped savings to just hit the max match on the 401k.  Now just paying down some debt, and building up a cash reserve to pay for a kitchen remodel and a semi-luxury retirement celebration vacation in France. 



Exflyboy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4626
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #122 on: November 01, 2017, 11:05:09 PM »
Very nice..:)

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #123 on: November 02, 2017, 12:07:50 AM »
Sitting at 2.35M here. 2.5 with home equity.  We are 60/58 and retiring some time in the next 10 months so its highly unlikely we reach 3m, but its fun to track it and to watch others go for the big 3.0. We 've hit our number and built u a couple of years of cash reserves so we really don't need any more.  Dropped savings to just hit the max match on the 401k.  Now just paying down some debt, and building up a cash reserve to pay for a kitchen remodel and a semi-luxury retirement celebration vacation in France.
Okay, I admit it, I am confused. You have only 150k in home equity and you're paying down "some debt". You have 2.5M, but you're waiting up to ten more months to retire? Something's  missing here. More info please?
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

Exflyboy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4626
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #124 on: November 02, 2017, 01:02:34 AM »
I assumed they were still paying off the mortgage.. But the $2.35M was the net value of cash plus investments.. yes?

As to the 10 months.. Clearly love their jobs way more than I did..:)

Car Jack

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 474
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #125 on: November 02, 2017, 06:46:42 AM »
Seems reasonable to me.  60/58, kids are likely out of the house.  Sounds like a mortgage is still in place but perhaps they're part of the "never pay your mortgage off" crowd (nothing wrong with that).  At $2.35M, they could be in a place where they realize that they are FI but don't want to stop working yet for whatever reason.  That's fine too. 

honeyfill

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 39
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Tucson
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #126 on: November 03, 2017, 04:54:51 PM »
Seems like there are some questions out there about our plans, so I thought I would give some more details.  I am not a true mustachian , I only discovered the site a few months ago. We had built up a nice nest egg of 1.7M in 2016 by maxing out the 401k since the first day they were offered.  But while we never wasted money , we spent a lot.  Lots of credit card debt , paid for daughter’s tuition, lots of nice things. So we had no money in taxable accounts, and I did not want to take money out of the 401ks. 
So we always thought retirement was sometime in the future and didn’t really plan for it. Plus I am an engineer and I do like my job.
Then I got an inheritance, 500k. It took a few months to for everything to really settle in mentally but I realized maybe I could retire. 
I figured the first thing to do was to get my debt in order.  Refinanced the house at 3.5% 270K loan, 150k equity on a 420k house.  Put all the credit cards on 0% interest.  Then started to blast through the debt.  I decided to start pulling 7 k a month out of our investments. Paid off our 2nd mortgage , paid off a ton of student debt, paid off lots of credit cards.  So why wait 10 more months?  Partly one more year, partly more debt.  21k on wife’s car 2.99%.  7 k on credit cards 0% , 7 k left on daughters student debt 4%, That’s 5 months.  Then we want to remodel the kitchen and take a luxury retirement celebration vacation. I figure that is 35k and 5 months more.  The final complications are that my in-laws have moved in with us and my daughter has health problems , which have prevented her from working since the summer.  Fortunately all their health issues seem to have stabilized. Our daughter is back on her feet and sending out resume’s.  My inlaws have set up a support system and our not really a financial drain. They pay all the medical and care givers , we just kick in a place to live, food and shelter.  The 10 months will give us a chance to mentally prepare, get our spending down to something more mustache like and to figure out how we handle health care between now and medicare.



soccerluvof4

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2764
  • Location: Artic Midwest
  • Retired at 50
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #127 on: November 05, 2017, 07:13:12 AM »
With my house I'm 2.9 and some change maybe could also get a few more dollars for the house. W/O house 2.6 and some change but its been kinda stagnant for me the last 6 months +/- as I have spent more than the budget because of the market rise. Remodeling etc.. things i know I would need to do down the line so I have taken out more than my normal withdrawal rate would be.
" In life you don't get what you deserve you get what you negotiate"

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #128 on: November 11, 2017, 11:18:36 AM »
Thanks for filling in some of the blanks, honeyfill. (Hee!)

Due to a bout of insomnia last night, I read through some of the lower goal races. I noticed a lot of people post updates monthly. Their passion and zeal is fun to see/remember.

This group seems to be a lot more relaxed, which is kind of a reward unto itself. Up to a certain point, it's a race. After that, it's a coast.

In news of the bizarre, a house in the neighborhood, but not nearly as new or as nice as ours, sold for $1.26M on 10/24/17. Zillow now says it's worth  $1,277,205, for an increase of $59,965 in 18 days!! They still think ours is "only" worth  $1.34M. Yawn. Whatever.*

I think I'll go make some scratch waffles with fresh berries for breakfast/brunch in my garage sale purchased waffle iron, then head over to my favorite thrift store. I just discovered that all clothing is half off on Saturdays. Whoop!

*I just found this on Zillow. "When it comes to unique homes (e.g., luxury mansions, unusual designs) we are less accurate in our Zestimates." No kidding.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2017, 11:36:33 AM by Dicey »
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

itchyfeet

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 382
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #129 on: November 11, 2017, 11:33:24 AM »
Thanks for filling in some of the blanks, honeyfill. (Hee!)

Due to a bout of insomnia last night, I read through some of the lower goal races. I noticed a lot of people post updates monthly. Their passion and zeal is fun to see/remember.

This group seems to be a lot more relaxed, which is kind of a reward unto itself. Up to a certain point, it's a race. After that, it's a coast.

I am not particularly wanting to coast to my number and to FIRE. But, with my NW now above $2M, I can't really drive it up fast by saving more. The growth of the stash these days is more reliant on returns than my savings efforts. I just have to wait for time to do its magic, and I will be where I want to be. In any case, I do update my progress on a monthly basis on the 2019 thread.

I should hit $3M Aussie pesos by the end of 2018, but that is only 2.3M USD.... def not racing to $3M USD.

Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #130 on: November 11, 2017, 11:45:06 AM »
Maybe you're not experiencing as much of a bull market as the US is? Also, as you approach the equivalent of $2-3M USD, perhaps you'll feel a little differently. However, "just...wait[ing] for time to do its magic" kinda sounds like we're talking about the same thing.

I admit, I don't follow the cohort threads too closely, because I hit FIRE "too early"* Such a FWP!

*ETA: To clarify, there's no such thing as retiring too early. The cohorts didn't begin until I was out the corporate door, is what I meant. If someone wants to start one for 2012 retroactively,  I'll play along. Maybe ;-)

And you refrigerator people: get over it! The newer models are so much more energy efficient, they will pay for themselves in time. As long as you didn't buy some crazy-ass thing with Bluetooth, go optimize somewhere else, (Frank) and stop looking at that new shiny thing in your kitchen. No time for guilt here!!
« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 10:40:34 PM by Dicey »
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...

Exflyboy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4626
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #131 on: November 13, 2017, 11:42:53 AM »
Stop talking about my fridge.. I already feel guilty sitting here looking at it..:)

It is nice not to have to repack the frigging freezer everytime we go shopping though!

Jill P

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 54
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #132 on: November 13, 2017, 10:00:54 PM »
I have a new fancy pants fridge.  We got by on an avocado shade one till it died, then a teeny full sized one that fit in our teeny house and came with us when we moved.  There was about an extra foot of space that it didn't fill up in the kitchen fridge cubby.  It was white and everything else in the kitchen was black.  I know it shouldn't matter, but it did look stupid.  We had it about 6 years.    Now we splurged (after bargain hunting at Home Depot, on sale, using our 5% off cards,).  The fridge is great.  The French doors allow you to easily see everything in there, and the drawer is a great invention and leaves the cold air in the main part undisturbed.  It even makes our ice.  Face punch, right?  When I use the "cost per use" analysis, it was a good purchase.  We do use it everyday, after all... 

Now, back to my regularly scheduled thrift store shopping.

Secretly Saving

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 405
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #133 on: November 14, 2017, 06:27:31 AM »
We just got a new one too.  Our old one was rusting through the front of it, but it was working so why bother changing something that still served it's purpose?  New fridge is fancy pants -- husband loves all the extra ice.  I kinda miss the old one.

itchyfeet

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 382
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #134 on: November 14, 2017, 10:07:24 AM »
We rent a place that came with a fridge, dishwasher, washing machine etc, so no white goods shopping for us these days.

markbike528CBX

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 521
  • Location: the Everbrown part of the Evergreen State (WA)
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #135 on: November 14, 2017, 02:55:03 PM »
...big snip here, I find it is more obvious to markbike528 the reader to snip than to bold key points.......

So, this month I started a trial fire with 2.9m. 10 days post job and the rallying markets have done enough to bump me over the $3m Mark.   .... snip....

On one hand it is nice to see someone who's finished this race taking a "trial" FIRE, as I'm in the same place on being tentative FIREing.
But on the other hand, good golly bigcrhisb.. you should have been done long ago.     

I can imagine people on this board wondering the same thing about me, even though I've just started this race, many others at lower NW have FIREd long ago.

Bateaux

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 861
  • Location: Port Vincent
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #136 on: November 14, 2017, 07:27:02 PM »
Hey everybody.  Looks like a lot of ya have migrated here from the 1 to 2.  I've been having some fun the last few weeks and even spending some money.  I went on a fishing trip with some friends, we even caught some.   Flew down to Mexico with the wife and another couple.  We did a lot of cool stuff.  Had a new roof put on the house.  We even sent some cash off for storm victims.  After all that, there's more in the bank than before.
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”
 ― Antoine de Saint Exupery-

Class of 2019

Exflyboy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4626
  • Age: 56
  • Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #137 on: November 14, 2017, 08:32:24 PM »
Hey everybody.  Looks like a lot of ya have migrated here from the 1 to 2.  I've been having some fun the last few weeks and even spending some money.  I went on a fishing trip with some friends, we even caught some.   Flew down to Mexico with the wife and another couple.  We did a lot of cool stuff.  Had a new roof put on the house.  We even sent some cash off for storm victims.  After all that, there's more in the bank than before.

Great job.. And there was me "scared" to look at my accounts after the massive pullback we have just had..:)

itchyfeet

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 382
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #138 on: November 14, 2017, 09:32:58 PM »
...big snip here, I find it is more obvious to markbike528 the reader to snip than to bold key points.......

So, this month I started a trial fire with 2.9m. 10 days post job and the rallying markets have done enough to bump me over the $3m Mark.   .... snip....

On one hand it is nice to see someone who's finished this race taking a "trial" FIRE, as I'm in the same place on being tentative FIREing.
But on the other hand, good golly bigcrhisb.. you should have been done long ago.     

I can imagine people on this board wondering the same thing about me, even though I've just started this race, many others at lower NW have FIREd long ago.

Personal finance is indeed extremely personal.

There can be no fixed rule about what is the right amount as there are so many variables that are different for each person.

Many on these boards say “if I had more money I wouldn’t know what to do with it”. I don’t have this problem. My imagination is pretty active.

So for me deciding what is “enough” is a constant weighing up of what I am sacrificing by being a wage slave versus what I’d be sacrificing by FIREing today. I certainly have enough stash to FIRE, but I am still not quite at my personal tipping point where I am willing to lock myself into the lifestyle that my stash would finance, when a couple of years of extra work will provide a few extra options which seem worth working for today. That being said, if I lost my job I am not sure I’d bother looking for a replacement.

Bateaux

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 861
  • Location: Port Vincent
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #139 on: November 15, 2017, 03:53:18 AM »
/\

We're pretty much living now at a level below what our stach could support.  Nobody says you have to live on less in retirement than in working years.  We've missed out on a lot during our working years.  We we're saving tens of thousands of dollars and working overtime while others were out spending money cruising the seas, buying new cars and fancy houses.  We're still working a few more years.  Now back of the napkin math says we're gaining about 10k a year in potential spending at 4% withdrawl every year we work.  The current number we could spend if FIRED is about 75k at 4%.  2018 85k, 2019 95k, 2020 105k  These are very rough and conservative numbers but you see the progression.   The 1 million stash level is where you can be frugal and make it, the 2 million stash level is a tipping point. We have the choice to live at the 1 million stash level and have the other million working for us.  We can have cheap years and bonus years.  Most likely our stash will grow into legacy funds after reaching 2 million, certainly once the 3 million level is reached.   
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”
 ― Antoine de Saint Exupery-

Class of 2019

farmecologist

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 277
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #140 on: November 15, 2017, 07:43:03 AM »
/\

We're pretty much living now at a level below what our stach could support.  Nobody says you have to live on less in retirement than in working years.  We've missed out on a lot during our working years.  We we're saving tens of thousands of dollars and working overtime while others were out spending money cruising the seas, buying new cars and fancy houses.  We're still working a few more years.  Now back of the napkin math says we're gaining about 10k a year in potential spending at 4% withdrawl every year we work.  The current number we could spend if FIRED is about 75k at 4%.  2018 85k, 2019 95k, 2020 105k  These are very rough and conservative numbers but you see the progression.   The 1 million stash level is where you can be frugal and make it, the 2 million stash level is a tipping point. We have the choice to live at the 1 million stash level and have the other million working for us.  We can have cheap years and bonus years.  Most likely our stash will grow into legacy funds after reaching 2 million, certainly once the 3 million level is reached.

Yep, I agree that the 2M point ( in investable assets ) is a tipping point.  However, what keeps us up at night is the ongoing healthcare debacle.  We have a family member with significant chronic health issues and feel that we need to save an additional 'significant amount' just to cover the potential uncertainty of future healthcare.   

I think healthcare is one of the major influencing factors that keeps people from FIREing...even with a large stashe.  I wish we could at least get some stability..but not gonna happen in this political environment. 


« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 07:44:43 AM by farmecologist »

begood

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 919
  • Age: 53
  • Location: Mid-Atlantic
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #141 on: November 15, 2017, 07:51:10 AM »
/\

We're pretty much living now at a level below what our stach could support.  Nobody says you have to live on less in retirement than in working years.  We've missed out on a lot during our working years.  We we're saving tens of thousands of dollars and working overtime while others were out spending money cruising the seas, buying new cars and fancy houses.  We're still working a few more years.  Now back of the napkin math says we're gaining about 10k a year in potential spending at 4% withdrawl every year we work.  The current number we could spend if FIRED is about 75k at 4%.  2018 85k, 2019 95k, 2020 105k  These are very rough and conservative numbers but you see the progression.   The 1 million stash level is where you can be frugal and make it, the 2 million stash level is a tipping point. We have the choice to live at the 1 million stash level and have the other million working for us.  We can have cheap years and bonus years.  Most likely our stash will grow into legacy funds after reaching 2 million, certainly once the 3 million level is reached.

Yep, I agree that the 2M point ( in investable assets ) is a tipping point.  However, what keeps us up at night is the ongoing healthcare debacle.  We have a family member with significant chronic health issues and feel that we need to save an additional 'significant amount' just to cover the potential uncertainty of future healthcare.   

I think healthcare is one of the major influencing factors that keeps people from FIREing...even with a large stashe.  I wish we could at least get some stability..but not gonna happen in this political environment.

Me too. My mister and I both have pre-existing conditions based on the most recent list that circulated. Without employer-supported insurance or some ACA-like insurance that's required to cover us, we could easily bankrupt ourselves with medical costs. To me, it's the splash of cold water on the face of FIRE. I don't Debbie Downer here because it's such a place of beautiful optimism, but I just can't get beyond the thought: "What if I can't get health care?"
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 07:11:19 AM by begood »

Bateaux

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 861
  • Location: Port Vincent
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #142 on: November 15, 2017, 11:13:28 AM »
Same here.  Any FIRE date prior to mid 2019 is not an option.  We have a cancer survivor son on my employer insurance who will be 26 in 2019.  Beyond that, FIRE may still be a dream if we must help with his healthcare costs.  Without the ACA we'd be in big trouble.
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”
 ― Antoine de Saint Exupery-

Class of 2019

bigchrisb

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #143 on: November 15, 2017, 03:08:34 PM »
/\

We're pretty much living now at a level below what our stach could support.  Nobody says you have to live on less in retirement than in working years.  We've missed out on a lot during our working years.  We we're saving tens of thousands of dollars and working overtime while others were out spending money cruising the seas, buying new cars and fancy houses.  We're still working a few more years.  Now back of the napkin math says we're gaining about 10k a year in potential spending at 4% withdrawl every year we work.  The current number we could spend if FIRED is about 75k at 4%.  2018 85k, 2019 95k, 2020 105k  These are very rough and conservative numbers but you see the progression.   The 1 million stash level is where you can be frugal and make it, the 2 million stash level is a tipping point. We have the choice to live at the 1 million stash level and have the other million working for us.  We can have cheap years and bonus years.  Most likely our stash will grow into legacy funds after reaching 2 million, certainly once the 3 million level is reached.

Yep, I agree that the 2M point ( in investable assets ) is a tipping point.  However, what keeps us up at night is the ongoing healthcare debacle.  We have a family member with significant chronic health issues and feel that we need to save an additional 'significant amount' just to cover the potential uncertainty of future healthcare.   

I think healthcare is one of the major influencing factors that keeps people from FIREing...even with a large stashe.  I wish we could at least get some stability..but not gonna happen in this political environment.

Agree 100% with healthcare being an issue.  I have a degenerative, progressive condition which will have increasing impacts over life - hence the extra padding.  I'm lucky to live in a country with good public healthcare (Australia) - its not quite universal, but good enough for intents and purposes.  However, beyond the direct healthcare costs, having something that will probably prevent you from going back to work in a failure scenario in ~20 years time is a strong incentive to pad the stash a bit more,  both to reduce failure probability, and to allow for an increased spending on disability care if needed.

bigchrisb

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1004
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #144 on: November 15, 2017, 03:31:40 PM »
...big snip here, I find it is more obvious to markbike528 the reader to snip than to bold key points.......

So, this month I started a trial fire with 2.9m. 10 days post job and the rallying markets have done enough to bump me over the $3m Mark.   .... snip....

On one hand it is nice to see someone who's finished this race taking a "trial" FIRE, as I'm in the same place on being tentative FIREing.
But on the other hand, good golly bigcrhisb.. you should have been done long ago.     

I can imagine people on this board wondering the same thing about me, even though I've just started this race, many others at lower NW have FIREd long ago.

Personal finance is indeed extremely personal.

There can be no fixed rule about what is the right amount as there are so many variables that are different for each person.

Many on these boards say “if I had more money I wouldn’t know what to do with it”. I don’t have this problem. My imagination is pretty active.

So for me deciding what is “enough” is a constant weighing up of what I am sacrificing by being a wage slave versus what I’d be sacrificing by FIREing today. I certainly have enough stash to FIRE, but I am still not quite at my personal tipping point where I am willing to lock myself into the lifestyle that my stash would finance, when a couple of years of extra work will provide a few extra options which seem worth working for today. That being said, if I lost my job I am not sure I’d bother looking for a replacement.

Indeed it is personal - I'd been more focused on the FI (which I hit a while ago), than the RE.  Multiple reasons for me, including:
- Health risks.  See one post up.
- Rate of change.  The snowballing had gotten to the point where "one more year" was adding multiple years of expenses, or increasing the potential draw down by $10k+ per year.
- A bit of "killing time". In the lead up my wife was pregnant with our first baby, so limited adventure potential in the last 3 months of the pregnancy.  Timing wise, we are going on a deployment for her work once the baby is 6 months, so it made for a natural exit point, where if it didn't work out, I could resume a career on return with a decent excuse for the gap in the CV.

I think that these forums tend to draw in personalities that like to optimise.  I spent a lot of time optimising FI, but cared less about optimising the RE.  Others have a bigger focus on optimising the RE part, and hence wonder what people like me are thinking!


Koogie

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 173
  • Location: Toronto-ish
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #145 on: November 15, 2017, 05:04:09 PM »
I have a degenerative, progressive condition which will have increasing impacts over life - hence the extra padding.  I'm lucky to live in a country with good public healthcare (Australia) - its not quite universal, but good enough for intents and purposes.  However, beyond the direct healthcare costs, having something that will probably prevent you from going back to work in a failure scenario in ~20 years time is a strong incentive to pad the stash a bit more,  both to reduce failure probability, and to allow for an increased spending on disability care if needed.

Ditto (but in Canada).  DW has a degenerative neurological condition.  We have a large enough stash to accommodate our anticipated spending needs but not enough to feel perfectly safe from being ruined by future palliative care costs.   Hence, OMY syndrome.     

I have tried to make it easier on myself though by going semi-RE.   Quality of life NOW matters as well.    We aren't touching the stash as yet so it continues to feed itself and grow "organically"
Fermentation is a miracle of nature.
Distillation is a miracle of science.
Better living through Science !

Semi-ERd: September 2015 at 42.

DavidAnnArbor

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1380
  • Age: 52
  • Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #146 on: November 21, 2017, 09:16:10 AM »
You can almost have a mindset of retirement once you're financially independent.

Jill P

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 54
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #147 on: November 27, 2017, 10:35:11 PM »
You can almost have a mindset of retirement once you're financially independent.

This is a great point!  Once you're FI, more things become optional.  Not just working, but purchases, investments, lifestyle, staching.  I've been a stay at home mom for years, but still worked- as a realtor for the last 8-10 years.  I can choose my clients and workload, or farm it out for a referral fee.  I manage our rentals and investments.   It doesn't feel like a real job, since I can choose to work, or not.  The real estate license was most valuable as a tool for reducing purchase costs on our rental investments, and has saved us a bundle.    I can carry on like this for another couple of decades.  MMM encourages frugality by learning to fix things (hubs does that for us), while I push the paper and plan the strategy.   Someday, at true retirement, if we keep the investment properties, maybe I'll farm out the rental management to a management company, but, in the mean time, I'm earning my keep.   It's not structured enough to feel like I have to RE to escape it.  We are Mustachians in the sense that we are completely hands on in all areas.  As someone who's always been a self employed entrepreneur and business owner,  the line between working, retirement and semi-retirement is not so clear cut.

farmecologist

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 277
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #148 on: November 28, 2017, 08:31:31 AM »
You can almost have a mindset of retirement once you're financially independent.

This is a great point!  Once you're FI, more things become optional.  Not just working, but purchases, investments, lifestyle, staching.  I've been a stay at home mom for years, but still worked- as a realtor for the last 8-10 years.  I can choose my clients and workload, or farm it out for a referral fee.  I manage our rentals and investments.   It doesn't feel like a real job, since I can choose to work, or not.  The real estate license was most valuable as a tool for reducing purchase costs on our rental investments, and has saved us a bundle.    I can carry on like this for another couple of decades.  MMM encourages frugality by learning to fix things (hubs does that for us), while I push the paper and plan the strategy.   Someday, at true retirement, if we keep the investment properties, maybe I'll farm out the rental management to a management company, but, in the mean time, I'm earning my keep.   It's not structured enough to feel like I have to RE to escape it.  We are Mustachians in the sense that we are completely hands on in all areas.  As someone who's always been a self employed entrepreneur and business owner,  the line between working, retirement and semi-retirement is not so clear cut.


My 'problem' is that we are..or nearly are...financially independent.   However, this has really affected my work motivation lately.  Therefore, I may be 'retired' before I know it!   


Dicey

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6527
  • Age: 59
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Race from $2M to $3M
« Reply #149 on: November 28, 2017, 08:58:49 AM »
My 'problem' is that we are..or nearly are...financially independent.   However, this has really affected my work motivation lately.  Therefore, I may be 'retired' before I know it!
That's the very definition of an MPP!
I did it! I have a journal!
A Lot Like This
And hell yes, I am still moving confidently in the direction of my dreams...