Electric Cars: Can they finally become popular in the United States?

[GuitarStv]

Glad I could help.

Couple more things: the Leafs all show the battery condition in the menu next to the steering wheel accessed through the steering wheel buttons. Most modern EVs hide that info. LeafSpy is a paid app you can add to your phone and paired with a bluetooth OBDII adapter you can check for weak cells in the battery if you are shopping for a car. Seems like a wise thing to check. Reccurent dot com also can help you get a battery report for some EVs. Not sure how they gather the info.

The Leaf battery does okay even in non-Southwest type summer weather under normal use conditions. It doesn't get too hot. Park it in the shade if available. I've never overheated one except when DCFC in 95F weather. It will go into turtle mode though if pushed really hard like on a track.

The further north, the longer the battery will last b/c cooler weather.

I'm guessing that humidity doesn't matter, just the absolute temperature with regards to the battery?  Usually our temperatures (only) aren't as high, but we're regularly over 110F in the summer if you count humidity.

[Just Joe]

I'm unsure.

The battery is sealed so the humidity should be the same inside the battery as the humidity inside the air conditioned factory (in TN) when the battery was assembled.

I'm guessing the humidity makes no difference. Perhaps someone else can lay it out better than my guess.

[Just Joe]

AI says: Yes, humidity affects the interior temperature of a closed container because it influences the air's ability to hold heat. Higher humidity can make the air feel warmer, while lower humidity can lead to cooler temperatures, especially when condensation occurs.

[RWD]

AI says: Yes, humidity affects the interior temperature of a closed container because it influences the air's ability to hold heat. Higher humidity can make the air feel warmer, while lower humidity can lead to cooler temperatures, especially when condensation occurs.

That sounds like AI completely missing the context.

[RWD]

This article doesn't mention humidity at all except in relation to tire degradation.
https://www.evengineeringonline.com/how-does-hot-weather-affect-electric-vehicles/

[neo von retorch]

I'm terrible at in-person fact-checking.

At my conservative cousin's place for his kid's graduation and his friend was saying he knows a guy who just bought a Lexus Hybrid for $80k, and the battery is only good for 100k, and then it's $15k to replace it. I suggested batteries can go 300k, and he said the average is 150k. I just kind of dropped it at that point.

But I just looked up the Prius, and the cost is closer to $2500-5500 depending on used or new battery, and of course where you have the labor done. Plus the batteries tend to live 180-200k and can go longer.

[NorCal]

I'm unsure.

The battery is sealed so the humidity should be the same inside the battery as the humidity inside the air conditioned factory (in TN) when the battery was assembled.

I'm guessing the humidity makes no difference. Perhaps someone else can lay it out better than my guess.

Humidity should have zero impact on most any EV battery.

I could see where it might impact the Leaf specifically, as the Leaf is the only EV on the market with an air-cooled battery.  So maybe humidity impacts the cooling systems ability to transfer heat?  This would be the same impact that higher humidity has on an air conditioners efficiency. 

It's just a guess though, and it would be a Leaf-specific impact. 

[Bartlebooth]

re: the Ram range-extended hybrid EV;

Well that's a twist.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/2025-ram-1500-ramcharger-smashes-ev-range-with-690-miles-v6-range-extender

Ram EV following in the footsteps of the Chevrolet Volt and BMW i3 (R.I.P.) (and a few others).

690 mile range is certainly a headline. Prices yet to be announced...

Would pretty much be the first mass-sold series hybrid, right?  I like it, but I'll believe it when I see more than one driving down the road.

I completely agree. I'd love for this to happen, but lets see if it actually gets to production...

A delay for the Ramcharger was announced about a month ago.  People are speculating that the series hybrid setup is no good.  https://old.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1kndmj5/report_ram_delays_ramcharger_phev_and_electric/

[NorCal]

re: the Ram range-extended hybrid EV;

Well that's a twist.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/2025-ram-1500-ramcharger-smashes-ev-range-with-690-miles-v6-range-extender

Ram EV following in the footsteps of the Chevrolet Volt and BMW i3 (R.I.P.) (and a few others).

690 mile range is certainly a headline. Prices yet to be announced...

Would pretty much be the first mass-sold series hybrid, right?  I like it, but I'll believe it when I see more than one driving down the road.

I completely agree. I'd love for this to happen, but lets see if it actually gets to production...

A delay for the Ramcharger was announced about a month ago.  People are speculating that the series hybrid setup is no good.  https://old.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1kndmj5/report_ram_delays_ramcharger_phev_and_electric/

I remain skeptical that the EREV concept will take off.  Mainly because my expectation that it will come with a higher price tag than an EV while being less useful because of less storage space.

But I'll reserve final judgement until real models are on the market.  They'll probably do decently well if prices are comparable or lower than full EV prices. 

I'm interested to see what the new Scout brand comes up with as well. 

[GilesMM]

I'm terrible at in-person fact-checking.

At my conservative cousin's place for his kid's graduation and his friend was saying he knows a guy who just bought a Lexus Hybrid for $80k, and the battery is only good for 100k, and then it's $15k to replace it. I suggested batteries can go 300k, and he said the average is 150k. I just kind of dropped it at that point.

But I just looked up the Prius, and the cost is closer to $2500-5500 depending on used or new battery, and of course where you have the labor done. Plus the batteries tend to live 180-200k and can go longer.

Lexus provides a battery warranty for 150,000 miles which tells me that it is expected to last a great deal longer than that.  Not many people drive their cars more than 150k from new.

[neo von retorch]

I'm terrible at in-person fact-checking.

Lexus provides a battery warranty for 150,000 miles which tells me that it is expected to last a great deal longer than that.  Not many people drive their cars more than 150k from new.

Yeah like, that's what I mean. Their arguments against the cars were not based on real facts but I'm not good at loading up and delivering any of that information quickly and confidently in person. So I give up and let them be misinformed commoners.

But I'd like to be better at having those facts at my disposal and sharing them... even if it's still very unlikely to change minds.

[GilesMM]

I'm terrible at in-person fact-checking.

Lexus provides a battery warranty for 150,000 miles which tells me that it is expected to last a great deal longer than that.  Not many people drive their cars more than 150k from new.

Yeah like, that's what I mean. Their arguments against the cars were not based on real facts but I'm not good at loading up and delivering any of that information quickly and confidently in person. So I give up and let them be misinformed commoners.

But I'd like to be better at having those facts at my disposal and sharing them... even if it's still very unlikely to change minds.

You will find they prefer their own version of "the facts" that fits their narrative.  It is way better to just say "that's interesting about cars.  Say, how is your favorite baseball team doing this summer?"

[JLee]

re: the Ram range-extended hybrid EV;

Well that's a twist.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/2025-ram-1500-ramcharger-smashes-ev-range-with-690-miles-v6-range-extender

Ram EV following in the footsteps of the Chevrolet Volt and BMW i3 (R.I.P.) (and a few others).

690 mile range is certainly a headline. Prices yet to be announced...

Would pretty much be the first mass-sold series hybrid, right?  I like it, but I'll believe it when I see more than one driving down the road.

I completely agree. I'd love for this to happen, but lets see if it actually gets to production...

A delay for the Ramcharger was announced about a month ago.  People are speculating that the series hybrid setup is no good.  https://old.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1kndmj5/report_ram_delays_ramcharger_phev_and_electric/

I remain skeptical that the EREV concept will take off.  Mainly because my expectation that it will come with a higher price tag than an EV while being less useful because of less storage space.

But I'll reserve final judgement until real models are on the market.  They'll probably do decently well if prices are comparable or lower than full EV prices. 

I'm interested to see what the new Scout brand comes up with as well.

EREVs would typically have a much smaller battery, though - which reduces cost substantially.  I'd expect the EREV to be the same or slightly less cost vs an EV.

[Tyson]

I'm terrible at in-person fact-checking.

Lexus provides a battery warranty for 150,000 miles which tells me that it is expected to last a great deal longer than that.  Not many people drive their cars more than 150k from new.

Yeah like, that's what I mean. Their arguments against the cars were not based on real facts but I'm not good at loading up and delivering any of that information quickly and confidently in person. So I give up and let them be misinformed commoners.

But I'd like to be better at having those facts at my disposal and sharing them... even if it's still very unlikely to change minds.

You will find they prefer their own version of "the facts" that fits their narrative.  It is way better to just say "that's interesting about cars.  Say, how is your favorite baseball team doing this summer?"

A better response would be "I own an EV and it's been super easy to charge at home".  And then just let it go.

[Just Joe]

Well of course the Republicans are trying to kill off the USPS and the new USPS EV mail delivery vehicles:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2025/06/21/trump-usps-trucks-taxes/

Our rural route delivery person told us that they drive about 100 miles per day. Lower than I expected. Perfect application for an EV.

[neo von retorch]

Ferrari Is Apparently Delaying Its Second EV

"Zero" demand for high-performance electric cars

It's interesting to think about. Why do people buy 300HP+ cars?

Yesterday I saw a lovely white (with black accents) Corvette C8 (eighth generation, first mid-engine) ahead; then they got in the left turning lane and I got a good look. And when the light changed, it very slowly started to go, letting the car in front of them get ahead... then the engine growled and the car scooted forward. Personal note: irrational obsession with the Corvette since childhood - my dad has a '65 I never got to witness in person before he sold it, but I've looked longingly at a painting my mom made of it, and one or two Polaroid photos...

Did the driver do it for speed, attention, or the sound? Maybe a little of all three? No, I cannot read minds and answer this quiz accurately for you.

Let us not forget the Ioniq 5 N which basically makes video game engine noises for your driving pleasure, and reviewers so far actually really dig it.

So my point is... most people buying anything from the $30k base model Mustang or $30k $60k Charger R/T to the $80k Corvette, and beyond... all the way to $2 million+ McLaren and Bugatti... there's a desire to own such a thing, but also a desire to be noticed in them. The flashy body panels that whatever level of purchase affords the buyer help, the performance numbers are helpful when geeking out and debating which car is best, but the noise is something that (for now) is fundamental to the experience.

Now, to counterpoint, of course electric motors are increasingly phenomenal. And I can attest to the thoroughly unnerving launch capacity of 350kW / 476HP AWD despite weighing 5700 lbs that the Polestar 2 has. It's exciting and can give you an adrenaline boost. And perhaps puzzle onlookers since the noise to do so is so minimal... we've been long hearing about the speed that various Tesla models are capable of, especially in Plaid trim levels. Still, I've yet to once recognize any Tesla as Plaid, nor have it catch my attention the way that barebones low-trim level Corvette did yesterday barely accelerating from 0 to 40 mph.

And just going off the half a dozen or more truck owners I know, being loud is a feature for many.

Is any of this to say that electric trucks and super cars cannot sell here in the United States? Of course not. Political headwinds and cultural inertia aside, it's probably inevitable, and as the ratio of EVs to loud gas engines shifts, more of the next generation will have different ideas about what they want from their vehicles. (Including, for some, self-driving...) But I also think that the existing cultural momentum will be slow to peel back, especially for the most visceral of vehicle classes, which includes trucks, muscle cars, and exotic sports cars. Take a look at Porsche EV sales in 2024, keeping in mind that's global. They've got some of the (arguably) best cars you'd buy for excitement, driving experience, and flashiness, and they haven't sold all that many. Though Taycan sales are relatively close to say, the Corvette, which GM sold 33,331 of in 2024 in the U.S.

[GilesMM]

Ferrari Is Apparently Delaying Its Second EV

"Zero" demand for high-performance electric cars

It's interesting to think about. Why do people buy 300HP+ cars?

Yesterday I saw a lovely white (with black accents) Corvette C8 (eighth generation, first mid-engine) ahead; then they got in the left turning lane and I got a good look. And when the light changed, it very slowly started to go, letting the car in front of them get ahead... then the engine growled and the car scooted forward. Personal note: irrational obsession with the Corvette since childhood - my dad has a '65 I never got to witness in person before he sold it, but I've looked longingly at a painting my mom made of it, and one or two Polaroid photos...

Did the driver do it for speed, attention, or the sound? Maybe a little of all three? No, I cannot read minds and answer this quiz accurately for you.

Let us not forget the Ioniq 5 N which basically makes video game engine noises for your driving pleasure, and reviewers so far actually really dig it.

So my point is... most people buying anything from the $30k base model Mustang or $30k $60k Charger R/T to the $80k Corvette, and beyond... all the way to $2 million+ McLaren and Bugatti... there's a desire to own such a thing, but also a desire to be noticed in them. The flashy body panels that whatever level of purchase affords the buyer help, the performance numbers are helpful when geeking out and debating which car is best, but the noise is something that (for now) is fundamental to the experience.

Now, to counterpoint, of course electric motors are increasingly phenomenal. And I can attest to the thoroughly unnerving launch capacity of 350kW / 476HP AWD despite weighing 5700 lbs that the Polestar 2 has. It's exciting and can give you an adrenaline boost. And perhaps puzzle onlookers since the noise to do so is so minimal... we've been long hearing about the speed that various Tesla models are capable of, especially in Plaid trim levels. Still, I've yet to once recognize any Tesla as Plaid, nor have it catch my attention the way that barebones low-trim level Corvette did yesterday barely accelerating from 0 to 40 mph.

And just going off the half a dozen or more truck owners I know, being loud is a feature for many.

Is any of this to say that electric trucks and super cars cannot sell here in the United States? Of course not. Political headwinds and cultural inertia aside, it's probably inevitable, and as the ratio of EVs to loud gas engines shifts, more of the next generation will have different ideas about what they want from their vehicles. (Including, for some, self-driving...) But I also think that the existing cultural momentum will be slow to peel back, especially for the most visceral of vehicle classes, which includes trucks, muscle cars, and exotic sports cars. Take a look at Porsche EV sales in 2024, keeping in mind that's global. They've got some of the (arguably) best cars you'd buy for excitement, driving experience, and flashiness, and they haven't sold all that many. Though Taycan sales are relatively close to say, the Corvette, which GM sold 33,331 of in 2024 in the U.S.

Zero demand sounds like hyperbole but demand low enough to make it unprofitable sounds about right.  It makes no sense for Ferrari (or other exotics) to go electric now.  Mainstream producers (like Porsche, Audi, Lexus, etc) will need to lead the way, probably through hybrid designs initially before going full EV.  Lexus has suggested the next generation of F cars will be hybrid - it will be interesting to learn what the LF exhaust sounds like.  They Taycan disaster has given everyone pause.

[NorCal]

re: the Ram range-extended hybrid EV;

Well that's a twist.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/2025-ram-1500-ramcharger-smashes-ev-range-with-690-miles-v6-range-extender

Ram EV following in the footsteps of the Chevrolet Volt and BMW i3 (R.I.P.) (and a few others).

690 mile range is certainly a headline. Prices yet to be announced...

Would pretty much be the first mass-sold series hybrid, right?  I like it, but I'll believe it when I see more than one driving down the road.

I completely agree. I'd love for this to happen, but lets see if it actually gets to production...

A delay for the Ramcharger was announced about a month ago.  People are speculating that the series hybrid setup is no good.  https://old.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1kndmj5/report_ram_delays_ramcharger_phev_and_electric/

I remain skeptical that the EREV concept will take off.  Mainly because my expectation that it will come with a higher price tag than an EV while being less useful because of less storage space.

But I'll reserve final judgement until real models are on the market.  They'll probably do decently well if prices are comparable or lower than full EV prices. 

I'm interested to see what the new Scout brand comes up with as well.

EREVs would typically have a much smaller battery, though - which reduces cost substantially.  I'd expect the EREV to be the same or slightly less cost vs an EV.

That's always the argument.  The battery specs seem to be coming in at ~50% the size of a full EV.  The question is whether half of an EV battery is lower in cost than the entirety of the second drive train.  The drive trains on these fuller size vehicles will be very different than the small engines on something like the Volt.

If a larger format vehicle is getting 1.5mi/kWh while traveling 80mph, that means you need an engine that can output ~50kW to keep the battery charged.  Go online and find me a 50kW generator and see what it looks like.

I'm no engineer, so I could well be missing something.  But I struggle to see how the math works.

[RWD]

re: the Ram range-extended hybrid EV;

Well that's a twist.

https://www.thedrive.com/news/2025-ram-1500-ramcharger-smashes-ev-range-with-690-miles-v6-range-extender

Ram EV following in the footsteps of the Chevrolet Volt and BMW i3 (R.I.P.) (and a few others).

690 mile range is certainly a headline. Prices yet to be announced...

Would pretty much be the first mass-sold series hybrid, right?  I like it, but I'll believe it when I see more than one driving down the road.

I completely agree. I'd love for this to happen, but lets see if it actually gets to production...

A delay for the Ramcharger was announced about a month ago.  People are speculating that the series hybrid setup is no good.  https://old.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1kndmj5/report_ram_delays_ramcharger_phev_and_electric/

I remain skeptical that the EREV concept will take off.  Mainly because my expectation that it will come with a higher price tag than an EV while being less useful because of less storage space.

But I'll reserve final judgement until real models are on the market.  They'll probably do decently well if prices are comparable or lower than full EV prices. 

I'm interested to see what the new Scout brand comes up with as well.

EREVs would typically have a much smaller battery, though - which reduces cost substantially.  I'd expect the EREV to be the same or slightly less cost vs an EV.

That's always the argument.  The battery specs seem to be coming in at ~50% the size of a full EV.  The question is whether half of an EV battery is lower in cost than the entirety of the second drive train.  The drive trains on these fuller size vehicles will be very different than the small engines on something like the Volt.

If a larger format vehicle is getting 1.5mi/kWh while traveling 80mph, that means you need an engine that can output ~50kW to keep the battery charged.  Go online and find me a 50kW generator and see what it looks like.

I'm no engineer, so I could well be missing something.  But I struggle to see how the math works.

50 kW is about 67 horsepower which is in a realm of a Kei car engine (660 cc). I agree that I think it is unnecessary complexity but it doesn't require a large powerplant to make up a 50 kW gap.

[41_swish]

I don't know about "zero" demand. I have seen a few of the new Dodge Charger EVs around me. The high end EV sports car will always be a niche, but there will be demand for it.

[neo von retorch]

I don't know about "zero" demand. I have seen a few of the new Dodge Charger EVs around me. The high end EV sports car will always be a niche, but there will be demand for it.

https://www.motor1.com/news/755407/dodge-charger-ev-sales-2025/
https://www.carscoops.com/2025/04/dodge-sold-more-old-challengers-and-chargers-than-new-daytona-evs-in-q1/

Lots of low volume vehicles. EV or not. But the Daytona EV seems to have needed some serious discounts to help move them. And look at that sales drop... going from selling 20K sports cars a quarter to just 3K.

While certain levels of sports car are very niche, some are mainstream sports cars (e.g. Mustang, Charger, the once again dead Camaro.)

That might be... fine... for Dodge. Ferrari operates completely on low volume (but high desire, ample demand), but you can bet they do not want to build cars that need to be discounted heavily to sell.

Sure "zero" is hyperbole, but when it comes to Ferrari, it's probably barely hyperbole, because instead of expecting to sell 500 / year, they might be expecting only 50.

[41_swish]

You're right. The zero is hyperbole. A 20k to 3k drop is dramatic. Maybe people still want real sports cars