Poll: Who will win the 2020 U.S. Presidential Election?

[nereo]

Unfortunately it’s pretty common for people not to understand what impeachment actually is. Ironically, I saw a poll where more people thought Nixon was impeached (he wasn’t) than Clinton (who was impeached).

The same misunderstanding about trump and his impeachment hat cropped up here too,

[sherr]

The Arizona conservative talk radio spin on this post-election activity is basically, Well, if the situation was reversed the Democrats would be acting the same way.

And unfortunately I can see a lot of Republican voters nodding their heads with that suggestion.  I'd love it if someone would outline all of the ways that this is so very different than, e.g., the pushback in 2004 from the Democrats, but alas I think it would be another exercise in futility because facts just interfere with their  siege mentality that allows them to be constantly aggrieved.

I had an extended family member share something on social media complaining about how the same people who spent four years refusing to accept the results of an election are now telling people to accept the results of the election. I pointed out that Clinton's concession speech was the morning after election day.  Shockingly, I did not get a response.

Relevant article on FiveThirtyEight today. After 2016 28% of Democrats said they were "not confident" that the vote was counted accurately (along with 28% of Independents and 22% of Republicans). Today those numbers are somewhere around 66% of Republicans (and 8% of Democrats).

There's simply no comparison. The GOP is now completely a lying conspiracy-theory party.

[sherr]

Unfortunately it’s pretty common for people not to understand what impeachment actually is. Ironically, I saw a poll where more people thought Nixon was impeached (he wasn’t) than Clinton (who was impeached).

Well to be fair Nixon absolutely would have been impeached (and removed from office) if he didn't beat them to the punch by resigning in disgrace first. But yeah, technically he never was impeached.

[sherr]

You know that your conspiracy-theory plot to overthrow democracy is in trouble when even Tucker Carlson is calling you out for not having any evidence.

[nereo]

Unfortunately it’s pretty common for people not to understand what impeachment actually is. Ironically, I saw a poll where more people thought Nixon was impeached (he wasn’t) than Clinton (who was impeached).

Well to be fair Nixon absolutely would have been impeached (and removed from office) if he didn't beat them to the punch by resigning in disgrace first. But yeah, technically he never was impeached.

No arguments here. And articles of impeachment has been drafted but not voted upon. It’s similar to a person facing a felony investigation that dies before charges can be filed. Technically s/he was never charged with a crime, despite any and all evidence.

[frugalnacho]

One argument I keep hearing from conservatives is that liberals reacted the exact same in 2016, and pushed the hoax that Russia interfered with the election because they couldn't cope with the reality of losing.  Then of course the russia thing was proven to be a hoax made up by liberals with absolutely no evidence to support it.   Now there is TONS of evidence that liberals committed massive fraud and stole this election.

It's so insane and maddening.  They aren't living in reality.     

[sherr]

It's so insane and maddening.  They aren't living in reality.     

Correct, they aren't. They haven't been for a while, but it's only getting worse. I have no idea how we proceed as a country when slightly under half of the voters are living in a conspiracy-theory delusion and have no interest in actual evidence or facts or logic.

[GuitarStv]

It's so insane and maddening.  They aren't living in reality.     

Correct, they aren't. They haven't been for a while, but it's only getting worse. I have no idea how we proceed as a country when slightly under half of the voters are living in a conspiracy-theory delusion and have no interest in actual evidence or facts or logic.

Release a series of videos making the choice not to commit suicide a Democratic party thing heavily supported by the blue party, along with a couple conspiracy videos asking why the Democrats are so interested in preventing the suicides of real heartland America.  Then just allow Republican's natural hatred of doing anything that Ds suggest take it's natural course.

[WhiteTrashCash]

It's so insane and maddening.  They aren't living in reality.     

Correct, they aren't. They haven't been for a while, but it's only getting worse. I have no idea how we proceed as a country when slightly under half of the voters are living in a conspiracy-theory delusion and have no interest in actual evidence or facts or logic.

Well, if we take the percentage of conspiracy theorists from the Trump voters, we end up with about 49 million, so while that's a high number, it's not really all that high of a percentage of the population (about 15%). A large portion of Trump voters aren't conspiracy theorists and only voted for him because he was the Republican candidate. So while the problem is alarming, it's not an overwhelming problem and it can be dealt with.

[ixtap]

It's so insane and maddening.  They aren't living in reality.     

Correct, they aren't. They haven't been for a while, but it's only getting worse. I have no idea how we proceed as a country when slightly under half of the voters are living in a conspiracy-theory delusion and have no interest in actual evidence or facts or logic.

I am old enough to remember when we justified a whole war by claiming we had evidence of WMD that no one else had, and especially not the international inspectors.

[sherr]

It's so insane and maddening.  They aren't living in reality.     

Correct, they aren't. They haven't been for a while, but it's only getting worse. I have no idea how we proceed as a country when slightly under half of the voters are living in a conspiracy-theory delusion and have no interest in actual evidence or facts or logic.

Well, if we take the percentage of conspiracy theorists from the Trump voters, we end up with about 49 million, so while that's a high number, it's not really all that high of a percentage of the population (about 15%). A large portion of Trump voters aren't conspiracy theorists and only voted for him because he was the Republican candidate. So while the problem is alarming, it's not an overwhelming problem and it can be dealt with.

15% of the population is irrelevant (and incorrect, you don't know how many kids etc will also become conspiracy-theorists). That's 31% of the people who voted this year. And - far more importantly - a 66% supermajority of one of the two main parties. The party that has an enormous advantage in Senate / Electoral College / and even House because of their distribution in rural areas and small states (and gerrymandering).

The conspiracy theorists have complete control of the Republican party, and Republicans have outsized control of the Federal Government. That's not just a "minor but concerning problem that can be dealt with".

[bacchi]

You know that your conspiracy-theory plot to overthrow democracy is in trouble when even Tucker Carlson is calling you out for not having any evidence.

He's now being called "Cucker," scorned by the monster he created. He'll have to double down to get back into their graces.

[nereo]

You know that your conspiracy-theory plot to overthrow democracy is in trouble when even Tucker Carlson is calling you out for not having any evidence.

He's now being called "Cucker," scorned by the monster he created. He'll have to double down to get back into their graces.

If we look at historical examples of when organizations glued together by a shared identity (e.g. political parties, cults, etc)  collapse, it often involves A bunch of internal strife where the most vocal proponents get scorned by the group, and if often gets ugly.

[OtherJen]

You know that your conspiracy-theory plot to overthrow democracy is in trouble when even Tucker Carlson is calling you out for not having any evidence.

He's now being called "Cucker," scorned by the monster he created. He'll have to double down to get back into their graces.

If we look at historical examples of when organizations glued together by a shared identity (e.g. political parties, cults, etc)  collapse, it often involves A bunch of internal strife where the most vocal proponents get scorned by the group, and if often gets ugly.

So maybe they'll eventually turn on Trump for being a whiny crybaby and shitty loser and on the Trump family for being freeloaders on the taxpayers' dime?

[ixtap]

You know that your conspiracy-theory plot to overthrow democracy is in trouble when even Tucker Carlson is calling you out for not having any evidence.

He's now being called "Cucker," scorned by the monster he created. He'll have to double down to get back into their graces.

If we look at historical examples of when organizations glued together by a shared identity (e.g. political parties, cults, etc)  collapse, it often involves A bunch of internal strife where the most vocal proponents get scorned by the group, and if often gets ugly.

So maybe they'll eventually turn on Trump for being a whiny crybaby and shitty loser and on the Trump family for being freeloaders on the taxpayers' dime?

Most of the Trump supporters I know are whiny crybabies and shitty losers themselves...some are even freeloaders on the taxpayers' dime, although they will tell you that while welfare is ruining everything for minorities, they themselves would be negligent if they didn't take advantage of existing programs that they are eligible for.

[nereo]

It depends on how effective Trump and his remaining allies can sell this (or another) new narrative.

With a loss to BIden as an incumbent it’s clear he’s not some political savant with an unbeatable base of support.  The only way that narrative survives is if he convinces enough people that he DID win.

[sherr]

You know that your conspiracy-theory plot to overthrow democracy is in trouble when even Tucker Carlson is calling you out for not having any evidence.

He's now being called "Cucker," scorned by the monster he created. He'll have to double down to get back into their graces.

If we look at historical examples of when organizations glued together by a shared identity (e.g. political parties, cults, etc)  collapse, it often involves A bunch of internal strife where the most vocal proponents get scorned by the group, and if often gets ugly.

So maybe they'll eventually turn on Trump for being a whiny crybaby and shitty loser and on the Trump family for being freeloaders on the taxpayers' dime?

No, Republicans will never admit that they were wrong. Take ixtap's example: go find a Republican today and ask them whether there were WMDs in Iraq. They will never turn on Trump. What might happen is that they split into two warring camps of "people who adore and worship Trump" and "people who merely love Trump", and they hate each other.

[BicycleB]

Republicans will never admit that they were wrong. Take ixtap's example: go find a Republican today and ask them whether there were WMDs in Iraq. They will never turn on Trump. What might happen is that they split into two warring camps of "people who adore and worship Trump" and "people who merely love Trump", and they hate each other.

Wowww. I had not thought of that.

Staying tuned.

[wenchsenior]

Republicans will never admit that they were wrong. Take ixtap's example: go find a Republican today and ask them whether there were WMDs in Iraq. They will never turn on Trump. What might happen is that they split into two warring camps of "people who adore and worship Trump" and "people who merely love Trump", and they hate each other.

Wowww. I had not thought of that.

Staying tuned.

Behold.  You can watch it happen in real time in the comments here:  https://redstate.com/bonchie/2020/11/20/tucker-carlson-discounts-sidney-powells-election-claims-she-responds-on-fox-news-n282614

[Montecarlo]

Look, more republicans out to destroy democracy:

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michigan-gop-lawmakers-reject-trumps-brazen-effort-overturn/story?id=74317220&cid=clicksource_4380645_2_heads_hero_live_hero_hed

Oh, maybe I misread that.  Hmm, maybe I should have a more nuanced and balanced opinion than to judge everybody by party affiliation

[GuitarStv]

Look, more republicans out to destroy democracy:

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michigan-gop-lawmakers-reject-trumps-brazen-effort-overturn/story?id=74317220&cid=clicksource_4380645_2_heads_hero_live_hero_hed

Oh, maybe I misread that.  Hmm, maybe I should have a more nuanced and balanced opinion than to judge everybody by party affiliation

It's good that they are willing to fight the leader of their party and the will of those who vote for their party in order to obey the law.  Kudos to some Republicans for (eventually, and only after much deliberation and consternation) behaving like anyone in that position should.

[ixtap]

Look, more republicans out to destroy democracy:

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michigan-gop-lawmakers-reject-trumps-brazen-effort-overturn/story?id=74317220&cid=clicksource_4380645_2_heads_hero_live_hero_hed

Oh, maybe I misread that.  Hmm, maybe I should have a more nuanced and balanced opinion than to judge everybody by party affiliation

It's good that they are willing to fight the leader of their party and the will of those who vote for their party in order to obey the law.  Kudos to some Republicans for (eventually, and only after much deliberation and consternation) behaving like anyone in that position should.

The only problem is that they shouldn't have met with him in the first place, they should have told him to present his evidence in court/to the SoS.

[scottish]

I've been impressed with how well the "checks and balances" are working to prevent the orange twerp and certain Republicans from subverting the election.

They've spent millions of dollars as well as lots of media effort and they haven't moved the needle even a little bit.    Every attempt to block Biden has failed, from gerrymandering, voter suppression, false claims of fraud, questionable lawsuits, (really) fake news and ballot recounts has gone nowhere.

If only we could be as impressed with the ethics of most of the Republican politicians...

[OtherJen]

I've been impressed with how well the "checks and balances" are working to prevent the orange twerp and certain Republicans from subverting the election.

They've spent millions of dollars as well as lots of media effort and they haven't moved the needle even a little bit.    Every attempt to block Biden has failed, from gerrymandering, voter suppression, false claims of fraud, questionable lawsuits, (really) fake news and ballot recounts has gone nowhere.

If only we could be as impressed with the ethics of most of the Republican politicians...

Imagine if they worked half as hard at their jobs as they did at their attempts to cheat the electoral system. We might actually have another COVID relief plan or a coherent national strategy.

[Poundwise]

Look, more republicans out to destroy democracy:

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michigan-gop-lawmakers-reject-trumps-brazen-effort-overturn/story?id=74317220&cid=clicksource_4380645_2_heads_hero_live_hero_hed

Oh, maybe I misread that.  Hmm, maybe I should have a more nuanced and balanced opinion than to judge everybody by party affiliation

It's good that they are willing to fight the leader of their party and the will of those who vote for their party in order to obey the law.  Kudos to some Republicans for (eventually, and only after much deliberation and consternation) behaving like anyone in that position should.

The only problem is that they shouldn't have met with him in the first place, they should have told him to present his evidence in court/to the SoS.

Whatever their words, I am doubtful.
https://twitter.com/lawindsor/status/1329823196321902597
https://twitter.com/lawindsor/status/1330156815909326850

Maybe they just like traveling. We'll see, won't we.

[jim555]

Once Trump sees he has exhausted all avenues he will turn on the Republicans because they didn't stand by him and get him back in.  MAGA boycott in Georgia runoffs to teach them a lesson????

[ixtap]

Once Trump sees he has exhausted all avenues he will turn on the Republicans because they didn't stand by him and get him back in.  MAGA boycott in Georgia runoffs to teach them a lesson????

I like your optimism.

[OtherJen]

Look, more republicans out to destroy democracy:

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michigan-gop-lawmakers-reject-trumps-brazen-effort-overturn/story?id=74317220&cid=clicksource_4380645_2_heads_hero_live_hero_hed

Oh, maybe I misread that.  Hmm, maybe I should have a more nuanced and balanced opinion than to judge everybody by party affiliation

It's good that they are willing to fight the leader of their party and the will of those who vote for their party in order to obey the law.  Kudos to some Republicans for (eventually, and only after much deliberation and consternation) behaving like anyone in that position should.

The only problem is that they shouldn't have met with him in the first place, they should have told him to present his evidence in court/to the SoS.

Whatever their words, I am doubtful.
https://twitter.com/lawindsor/status/1329823196321902597
https://twitter.com/lawindsor/status/1330156815909326850

Maybe they just like traveling. We'll see, won't we.

As am I. Detroit Free Press: Michigan GOP asks state board to delay certifying election results

The alleged irregularities claimed by Trump, even if true, would not overturn the results in the state. Election law experts have said the board is required to certify the results. Civil rights leaders have said the delay in certifying the results would disenfranchise mostly minority voters. 

The staff of the state board released a report Friday recommending certification of the vote and saying Detroit experienced fewer problems in the Nov. 3 general election than the August primary and the 2016 presidential election.

And here we are.

[bacchi]

To see how off the rails Rudy and the Trump campaign is, a Federalist Society US District Judge (Brann) dismissed the PA lawsuit with prejudice.

The Motion to Dismiss intro is eminently readable.

https://www.democracydocket.com/cases/pennsylvania-democratic-counties-challenge/

Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence.

[Travis]

To see how off the rails Rudy and the Trump campaign is, a Federalist Society US District Judge (Brann) dismissed the PA lawsuit with prejudice.

The Motion to Dismiss intro is eminently readable.

https://www.democracydocket.com/cases/pennsylvania-democratic-counties-challenge/

Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence.

"With prejudice" means "and don't come back," correct?

[EscapeVelocity2020]

To see how off the rails Rudy and the Trump campaign is, a Federalist Society US District Judge (Brann) dismissed the PA lawsuit with prejudice.

The Motion to Dismiss intro is eminently readable.

https://www.democracydocket.com/cases/pennsylvania-democratic-counties-challenge/

Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence.

"With prejudice" means "and don't come back," correct?

With prejudice = fuck off forever

[PhilB]

To see how off the rails Rudy and the Trump campaign is, a Federalist Society US District Judge (Brann) dismissed the PA lawsuit with prejudice.

The Motion to Dismiss intro is eminently readable.

https://www.democracydocket.com/cases/pennsylvania-democratic-counties-challenge/

Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence.

"With prejudice" means "and don't come back," correct?

With prejudice = fuck off forever

And the horse you rode in on.

[OtherJen]

To see how off the rails Rudy and the Trump campaign is, a Federalist Society US District Judge (Brann) dismissed the PA lawsuit with prejudice.

The Motion to Dismiss intro is eminently readable.

https://www.democracydocket.com/cases/pennsylvania-democratic-counties-challenge/

Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence.

The whole Motion to Dismiss is a thing of beauty.

However, Individual Plaintiffs fail to establish that Defendant Counties or Secretary Boockvar actually caused their injuries. First, Defendant Counties, by Plaintiffs’ own pleadings, had nothing to do with the denial of Individual Plaintiffs’ ability to vote. Individual Plaintiffs’ ballots were rejected by Lancaster
and Fayette Counties, neither of which is a party to this case. None of Defendant Counties received, reviewed, or discarded Individual Plaintiffs’ ballots. Even assuming that Defendant Counties unconstitutionally allowed other voters to cure their ballots, that alone cannot confer standing on Plaintiffs who seek to challenge the denial of their votes.

In other words, they didn't even file against the counties that actually canceled the plaintiffs' votes. Can this level of legal incompetence be real, or are we all being trolled?

[OtherJen]

Although it turns out that the legalese for "Fuck off forever" was not an effective deterrent against further filings.

Trump’s lawyer Rudy Giuliani said in a statement he was disappointed with the ruling and will appeal. “Today’s decision turns out to help us in our strategy to get expeditiously to the U.S. Supreme Court,” he said.

The campaign will ask the 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Philadelphia to review the ruling on an accelerated timetable, according to Giuliani. A majority of that circuit’s judges were nominated by Republican presidents. Four were nominated by Trump.

(Source: https://reut.rs/33nUEX5)

[habanero]

The US courts frankly seems to be the last place where some dignity is still left. The last line of defense against raving madness seems to be holding its stand.

[BicycleB]

Although it turns out that the legalese for "Fuck off forever" was not an effective deterrent against further filings.

Trump’s lawyer Rudy Giuliani said in a statement he was disappointed with the ruling and will appeal. “Today’s decision turns out to help us in our strategy to get expeditiously to the U.S. Supreme Court,” he said.

The campaign will ask the 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Philadelphia to review the ruling on an accelerated timetable, according to Giuliani. A majority of that circuit’s judges were nominated by Republican presidents. Four were nominated by Trump.

(Source: https://reut.rs/33nUEX5)

According to my friend the lawyer, that's the expected procedure. US District Court is the first level to file the case; you appeal that to the US Circuit Court; if that rules against you, you appeal to the Supreme Court. Just like Rudy says. And an accelerated ruling, as he requests, is appropriate - it's better to resolve the case quickly and definitely than to have its unsettled status available as an excuse for other procedures related to the seating of electors.

My friend suspects the Trump team incorrectly thinks the Supreme Court will bail them out. Along this line, he believes the judge did a superb job of explicitly summarizing the case so that it is clear that the Supreme Court will need to either uphold the original decision or be seen to be unwarrantedly pressing their finger on the scales.

[OtherJen]

Seriously, how long are we going to keep up this charade?

NPR: Trump Requests Georgia Recount, Meaning 5 Million Votes Will Be Tabulated A 3rd Time

[nereo]

Seriously, how long are we going to keep up this charade?

NPR: Trump Requests Georgia Recount, Meaning 5 Million Votes Will Be Tabulated A 3rd Time

[Travis]

Seriously, how long are we going to keep up this charade?

NPR: Trump Requests Georgia Recount, Meaning 5 Million Votes Will Be Tabulated A 3rd Time

The first recount was a mandatory state audit. They're supposed to do a recount of one of the races, and picked the presidential slate. Trump's recount request is because the race was so close that he's permitted the recount.

[bacchi]

Although it turns out that the legalese for "Fuck off forever" was not an effective deterrent against further filings.

Trump’s lawyer Rudy Giuliani said in a statement he was disappointed with the ruling and will appeal. “Today’s decision turns out to help us in our strategy to get expeditiously to the U.S. Supreme Court,” he said.

The campaign will ask the 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Philadelphia to review the ruling on an accelerated timetable, according to Giuliani. A majority of that circuit’s judges were nominated by Republican presidents. Four were nominated by Trump.

(Source: https://reut.rs/33nUEX5)

According to my friend the lawyer, that's the expected procedure. US District Court is the first level to file the case; you appeal that to the US Circuit Court; if that rules against you, you appeal to the Supreme Court. Just like Rudy says. And an accelerated ruling, as he requests, is appropriate - it's better to resolve the case quickly and definitely than to have its unsettled status available as an excuse for other procedures related to the seating of electors.

My friend suspects the Trump team incorrectly thinks the Supreme Court will bail them out. Along this line, he believes the judge did a superb job of explicitly summarizing the case so that it is clear that the Supreme Court will need to either uphold the original decision or be seen to be unwarrantedly pressing their finger on the scales.

In this case, they're appealing the possibility of an amendment or, it seems, the "with prejudice" part of the dismissal. Once amended, it's back in District Court with Brann where it'll be decided on the merits.

Appellants’  appeal  concerns  only  the  decision  denying  leave  to  amend  for  the above reason, a narrow issue.  Appellants will request that this Court reverse denial of the Motion to Amend and direct the District Court to promptly decide it on the merits....

The Second Amended Complaint will probably correct the counties (hahaha).

This is the 2nd suit with the wrong county. The other lawsuit (Lin Wood's Georgia lawsuit?) was about problems with a county in another state, even.

[nereo]

The glaring mistakes in many of these court filings makes me wonder whether they are intentional. Knowing there’s no merit and they’ll get tossed quickly, perhaps the drafting attorneys are like: “Hey, let’s just make this as quick and painless as we can and give the judge a near instant reason to toss this case...”
Either that or “the best money can buy” attorneys for Trump really are about as good as a bunch of 1st year law students.

[Travis]

The glaring mistakes in many of these court filings makes me wonder whether they are intentional. Knowing there’s no merit and they’ll get tossed quickly, perhaps the drafting attorneys are like: “Hey, let’s just make this as quick and painless as we can and give the judge a near instant reason to toss this case...”
Either that or “the best money can buy” attorneys for Trump really are about as good as a bunch of 1st year law students.

Someone just filed a complaint in to have Giuliani disbarred for his ravings at the mic and grade school-level performance in the courtroom.  I don't know how the lawyer world polices itself, but could any of these folks see sanctions for participating in a string of frivolous suits?

[nereo]

The glaring mistakes in many of these court filings makes me wonder whether they are intentional. Knowing there’s no merit and they’ll get tossed quickly, perhaps the drafting attorneys are like: “Hey, let’s just make this as quick and painless as we can and give the judge a near instant reason to toss this case...”
Either that or “the best money can buy” attorneys for Trump really are about as good as a bunch of 1st year law students.

Someone just filed a complaint in to have Giuliani disbarred for his ravings at the mic and grade school-level performance in the courtroom.  I don't know how the lawyer world polices itself, but could any of these folks see sanctions for participating in a string of frivolous suits?

Attorneys are self-policed by the bar association. Being “dis-barred” is a very real thing, and prevents you from practicing law. Certain things will get you automatically disbarred, like a felony conviction. Of course there are politics too - the bar association is loathe to reprimand high-profile lawyers for the same things they regularly reprimand junior law partners for. I’m relatively certain if any attorney who was not connected to the President acted like Guilliani they would be in front of the bar, pronto. 

[OtherJen]

Seriously, how long are we going to keep up this charade?

NPR: Trump Requests Georgia Recount, Meaning 5 Million Votes Will Be Tabulated A 3rd Time

The first recount was a mandatory state audit. They're supposed to do a recount of one of the races, and picked the presidential slate. Trump's recount request is because the race was so close that he's permitted the recount.

Yes, I do understand that, but how likely is this to change the results? The race has already been counted twice. The outcome didn’t change. From an outsider’s perspective, it certainly looks like “keep counting until I get the result I want,” especially as it’s not on Trump’s dime.

[nereo]

Seriously, how long are we going to keep up this charade?

NPR: Trump Requests Georgia Recount, Meaning 5 Million Votes Will Be Tabulated A 3rd Time

The first recount was a mandatory state audit. They're supposed to do a recount of one of the races, and picked the presidential slate. Trump's recount request is because the race was so close that he's permitted the recount.

Yes, I do understand that, but how likely is this to change the results? The race has already been counted twice. The outcome didn’t change. From an outsider’s perspective, it certainly looks like “keep counting until I get the result I want,” especially as it’s not on Trump’s dime.

Extraordinarily unlikely, but imagine for a second what would happen if the third Recount actually DID result in a different outcome. Team Biden would (rightfully) point to the original tally and the TWO previous recounts and ask Why those should be invalidated.  There would be an epic legal fight and investigations about which recount was most “valid”. It would be a damn mess.

Granted, with Pennsylvania, Nevada and Arizona all in the Biden column it woulnd’t change the outcome, but it would call into question every close total and every recount, ever.  Anytime a race was within 15k votes it would be recount after recount after recount....

[BicycleB]

I suspect the real goals of these suits are:
1. Please the sad boss
2. Play for time until the dispute gives legislatures an excuse to nominate alternate electors
3. Provide a fig leaf for claims to the base that It Was Rigged
4. Present the defeated president as battler, not loser (again, to the base)

I'm assuming 2 won't really happen, but the rest look unfortunately viable.

[OtherJen]

The two Republicans on Michigan's board of canvassers are arguing with a former state director of elections over why they can't adjourn and wait the 40-day max period specified in law, and what the state Supreme Court meant by the word "shall."

Jesus.

[caracarn]

The two Republicans on Michigan's board of canvassers are arguing with a former state director of elections over why they can't adjourn and wait the 40-max period specified in law, and what the state Supreme Court meant by the word "shall."

Jesus.

I was so praying that this would all just pass quietly today and adults would prevail.  Seems maybe not?

[Sandi_k]

@OtherJen, I think you dropped a word.

"wait the 40-max period specified in law..."

Did you mean 40 DAY max period?

The two Republicans on Michigan's board of canvassers are arguing with a former state director of elections over why they can't adjourn and wait the 40-max period specified in law, and what the state Supreme Court meant by the word "shall."

Jesus.

[caracarn]

I found a live stream from the Detroit Free Press and watching now.  Glad to see some voices of reason that they need to do their duty and certify and that audits can happen to improve things but certification is not the point to create drama.