How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?

[DeniseNJ]

I think it's agency specific?  Go to your main intranet page and under the employee stuff there should be a link.

[sparkytheop]

...

For me, personally, all but 2 years of my 17 year working career have been Fed (military and now civilian). I've still got another 22 years til MRA.

Assuming we keep investing as we have been since we found MMM, we'd end up with something like a 0.4% withdrawal rate before even considering the pension part (~$10M assets with a $40k withdrawal). I don't know what the actual pension would look like by then, but I imagine it'd drop it down to 0.2% or even 0.1%.

We could probably do a coast FI (stop contributing to any investment accounts) til MRA, but even then we'd be at about $4M. That gives us a 1% SWR before considering the pension.

As you can see, there's almost zero reason for me to stick around for MRA. Every scenario leads to working decades longer than necessary.

I'm in the same boat as you. MRA is... 25 years away :)

I'm in the middle of creating a spreadsheet that will calculate my reduced pension at 62 (or 60 with the 20 years of service), assuming 3% inflation, and reduce my expenses at 62 (or 60) by that much.  That way I can play around with what year do I actually retire and I can easily see how much that effects me later on and help me define an actual FIRE number. I could do it manually year by year, but this is more fun.   

But realistically, I like my job.  A government engineer who actually gets to do design work! I'm probably going to milk this for another year or two, then start ramping down to part-time with a goal of eventually hitting 20 hrs/wk.  I figure I can maintain that indefinitely.  We have a couple (older) contractors who do that, so it's definitely a thing, just no one on the government side does it.  The only problem is that employee FEHB payments go up in proportion to few hrs/wk worked, so it ends up being a pretty bad deal the lower you go.

Will you be able to hit 25 years before your MRA?  I don't consider MRA a reduction in benefits, I consider staying until 62 (to get the 1.1%) a bonus.  A bonus that is not worth me staying longer than my MRA.  The supplement more than makes up for that extra .1% IMO (I'll already have 36 years in if I have to stay to my MRA, which is painful.)

[x02947]

...

For me, personally, all but 2 years of my 17 year working career have been Fed (military and now civilian). I've still got another 22 years til MRA.

Assuming we keep investing as we have been since we found MMM, we'd end up with something like a 0.4% withdrawal rate before even considering the pension part (~$10M assets with a $40k withdrawal). I don't know what the actual pension would look like by then, but I imagine it'd drop it down to 0.2% or even 0.1%.

We could probably do a coast FI (stop contributing to any investment accounts) til MRA, but even then we'd be at about $4M. That gives us a 1% SWR before considering the pension.

As you can see, there's almost zero reason for me to stick around for MRA. Every scenario leads to working decades longer than necessary.

I'm in the same boat as you. MRA is... 25 years away :)

I'm in the middle of creating a spreadsheet that will calculate my reduced pension at 62 (or 60 with the 20 years of service), assuming 3% inflation, and reduce my expenses at 62 (or 60) by that much.  That way I can play around with what year do I actually retire and I can easily see how much that effects me later on and help me define an actual FIRE number. I could do it manually year by year, but this is more fun.   

But realistically, I like my job.  A government engineer who actually gets to do design work! I'm probably going to milk this for another year or two, then start ramping down to part-time with a goal of eventually hitting 20 hrs/wk.  I figure I can maintain that indefinitely.  We have a couple (older) contractors who do that, so it's definitely a thing, just no one on the government side does it.  The only problem is that employee FEHB payments go up in proportion to few hrs/wk worked, so it ends up being a pretty bad deal the lower you go.

Will you be able to hit 25 years before your MRA?  I don't consider MRA a reduction in benefits, I consider staying until 62 (to get the 1.1%) a bonus.  A bonus that is not worth me staying longer than my MRA.  The supplement more than makes up for that extra .1% IMO (I'll already have 36 years in if I have to stay to my MRA, which is painful.)

I'll hit 25 years of service when I'm 45, and my MRA is 57.  I'm not a LEO or ATC or anything.  I'll happily be prepared for and jump on any VERA that comes my way, but I'm not counting on it as it is completely outside my control.

[sparkytheop]

...

For me, personally, all but 2 years of my 17 year working career have been Fed (military and now civilian). I've still got another 22 years til MRA.

Assuming we keep investing as we have been since we found MMM, we'd end up with something like a 0.4% withdrawal rate before even considering the pension part (~$10M assets with a $40k withdrawal). I don't know what the actual pension would look like by then, but I imagine it'd drop it down to 0.2% or even 0.1%.

We could probably do a coast FI (stop contributing to any investment accounts) til MRA, but even then we'd be at about $4M. That gives us a 1% SWR before considering the pension.

As you can see, there's almost zero reason for me to stick around for MRA. Every scenario leads to working decades longer than necessary.

I'm in the same boat as you. MRA is... 25 years away :)

I'm in the middle of creating a spreadsheet that will calculate my reduced pension at 62 (or 60 with the 20 years of service), assuming 3% inflation, and reduce my expenses at 62 (or 60) by that much.  That way I can play around with what year do I actually retire and I can easily see how much that effects me later on and help me define an actual FIRE number. I could do it manually year by year, but this is more fun.   

But realistically, I like my job.  A government engineer who actually gets to do design work! I'm probably going to milk this for another year or two, then start ramping down to part-time with a goal of eventually hitting 20 hrs/wk.  I figure I can maintain that indefinitely.  We have a couple (older) contractors who do that, so it's definitely a thing, just no one on the government side does it.  The only problem is that employee FEHB payments go up in proportion to few hrs/wk worked, so it ends up being a pretty bad deal the lower you go.

Will you be able to hit 25 years before your MRA?  I don't consider MRA a reduction in benefits, I consider staying until 62 (to get the 1.1%) a bonus.  A bonus that is not worth me staying longer than my MRA.  The supplement more than makes up for that extra .1% IMO (I'll already have 36 years in if I have to stay to my MRA, which is painful.)

I'll hit 25 years of service when I'm 45, and my MRA is 57.  I'm not a LEO or ATC or anything.  I'll happily be prepared for and jump on any VERA that comes my way, but I'm not counting on it as it is completely outside my control.

That's about where I am too (I'll have my 25 in at 46).

Are you looking at the deferred pension then? (the "reduced pension" at such a high age threw me, but it makes since if you're calculating for a deferred pension)

[Phenix]

For those that are just around the corner from their MRA this article discusses the best dates to retire for 2020-2023.
https://www.myfederalretirement.com/best-dates-retire/

I'm still 26 years away from MRA, so I should hit my FI goal well before then.  That being said, I love working in financial management and there are thousands of FM jobs in my current location.  So if I get a bad boss or the office turns bad, finding another office would not be difficult.  If an opportunity comes up to work part time later in my career, I might just do that.  Between compressed work schedule, working from home, 160 hours annual leave, 104 hours sick leave, and 10 holidays every year, it rarely feels like a long span between times I don't have to show up to the office for a week or more.

[Dragonswan]

I started my federal career at 38 so I will be here until age 60 (maybe 58 if a VERA presents itself and I think I can swing it).  There's a huge difference in monthly income between retiring at 56 and two months and 60, mainly because of the reduction in pension vs full pension, and the number of years to multiple my high 3 by.  If the supplement is still around when I retire in 2025, that's a nice parting bonus, but I'm not counting on it as it seems to be put on the chopping block every time they want to reduce fed pensions.  If I wait until age 62 I could get ~$800/month more between increased pension and increased SS.

[x02947]

... removed for ease of reading...

That's about where I am too (I'll have my 25 in at 46).

Are you looking at the deferred pension then? (the "reduced pension" at such a high age threw me, but it makes since if you're calculating for a deferred pension)

Sorry for being unclear - by reduced I meant "reduced due to inflation" on the deferred pension, not the 5% a year reduction.  The whole wait until 62 thing came about so that I would not have to take the 5% reduction. The way I figure, I have 3 options:
     1) Work till my MRA of 57 and draw an immediate pension
     2) Work until I have 20+ years of service, quit, and draw a deferred pension at age 60. 
     3) Work until I have less than 20 years of service, quite, and draw a deferred pension at age 62 so as to avoid the 5% reduction.

Option 2 seems most likely to me.  I want to be able to be able to add the pension into my FIRE calculations, but in order to play with my FIRE date I need to be able to recalculate the different years of service, inflation reduction, and (theoretical) High-3 for each date.  Not difficult, I know, but now that the holidays are over I might find some time to actually do it. 

[FIREandMONEY]

33 Here.  Started with the Feds in Fall of '10, so coming up on my 10-year anniversary.

I've been maxing out my TSP and just been focusing on pumping as much cash into tax-advantaged accounts as I can.  I would love to be able to "retire" to a side-hustle type job in the ~2030ish time range. 

I have some questions for the other Feds here.  If I was to leave Federal service at 2030 at age 43 (20 years service), what benefits would I really be giving up by not officially "retiring" from Federal service?

I still have my TSP and can roll that over to an IRA and start a Roth ladder ASAP.  I will still be able to collect Social Security at 67.  I will still be able to collect my deferred annuity (starting at ages 57 to 62).  I believe if I wait til age 62 to start collecting my annuity, I will get 20% of my high 3 annual salary.  If I collect at 57, I get penalized at 5% a year.

So, the big thing that I will be giving up by not officially retiring, is the healthcare benefits right?  Is this really the only thing?  I currently pay ~$360/mo for family plan healthcare, and the Govt pays ~$1000 as their portion.  Okay...$1000 a month that I don't have to pay is pretty nice, but in my research on the ACA subsidy...if in retirement I have a total income of ~$40,000 with a family of 4, I could receive a 1000-1100 monthly healthcare subsidy.  So, basically, I would be paying the same amount of money for healthcare.

Am I missing some other benefit of "official" FERS retirement?  Cause honestly, I see about 0% incentive (besides more years of TSP growth/contributions and the 1% annuity per year) for someone younger such as myself to move their proposed retirement from 40-45 to 57 MRA.

Any help/thoughts would be appreciated.  If this needs it's own thread, let me know, but I figured any Feds on this board are already on this one.

[sparkytheop]

33 Here.  Started with the Feds in Fall of '10, so coming up on my 10-year anniversary.

I've been maxing out my TSP and just been focusing on pumping as much cash into tax-advantaged accounts as I can.  I would love to be able to "retire" to a side-hustle type job in the ~2030ish time range. 

I have some questions for the other Feds here.  If I was to leave Federal service at 2030 at age 43 (20 years service), what benefits would I really be giving up by not officially "retiring" from Federal service?

I still have my TSP and can roll that over to an IRA and start a Roth ladder ASAP.  I will still be able to collect Social Security at 67.  I will still be able to collect my deferred annuity (starting at ages 57 to 62).  I believe if I wait til age 62 to start collecting my annuity, I will get 20% of my high 3 annual salary.  If I collect at 57, I get penalized at 5% a year.

So, the big thing that I will be giving up by not officially retiring, is the healthcare benefits right?  Is this really the only thing?  I currently pay ~$360/mo for family plan healthcare, and the Govt pays ~$1000 as their portion.  Okay...$1000 a month that I don't have to pay is pretty nice, but in my research on the ACA subsidy...if in retirement I have a total income of ~$40,000 with a family of 4, I could receive a 1000-1100 monthly healthcare subsidy.  So, basically, I would be paying the same amount of money for healthcare.

Am I missing some other benefit of "official" FERS retirement?  Cause honestly, I see about 0% incentive (besides more years of TSP growth/contributions and the 1% annuity per year) for someone younger such as myself to move their proposed retirement from 40-45 to 57 MRA.

Any help/thoughts would be appreciated.  If this needs it's own thread, let me know, but I figured any Feds on this board are already on this one.

First, if you work until 57, retire, and start collecting a pension, the pension will not have the 5% reduction (because you will have worked more than 25 years).  If you quit and do a deferred retirement, then yes, you'd be dealing with reductions.

The healthcare is one benefit of waiting.  One thing I like about the healthcare is that you do not have to take medicare if you don't want to (I have no clue yet if I'll want to, but if things go as planned, I'll be retiring as a high earner, so would have to pay more than standard).

The other big benefit of waiting is the Social Security Supplement.  This won't be as much as SS itself (well, depending on the state of SS), but is still a decent chunk of change.  It also helps fill the "no COLA on pension until 62" gap.  Finally, going at your MRA gives you instant access to all your tsp and pension, without penalties and reductions.

My job and schedule make the waiting worth it (even though I started at 21).  However, if the healthcare-for-life and SSS ever go away, I may just retire much, much earlier.

[sparkytheop]

... removed for ease of reading...

That's about where I am too (I'll have my 25 in at 46).

Are you looking at the deferred pension then? (the "reduced pension" at such a high age threw me, but it makes since if you're calculating for a deferred pension)

Sorry for being unclear - by reduced I meant "reduced due to inflation" on the deferred pension, not the 5% a year reduction.  The whole wait until 62 thing came about so that I would not have to take the 5% reduction. The way I figure, I have 3 options:
     1) Work till my MRA of 57 and draw an immediate pension
     2) Work until I have 20+ years of service, quit, and draw a deferred pension at age 60. 
     3) Work until I have less than 20 years of service, quite, and draw a deferred pension at age 62 so as to avoid the 5% reduction.

Option 2 seems most likely to me.  I want to be able to be able to add the pension into my FIRE calculations, but in order to play with my FIRE date I need to be able to recalculate the different years of service, inflation reduction, and (theoretical) High-3 for each date.  Not difficult, I know, but now that the holidays are over I might find some time to actually do it.

My retirement spreadsheet has 10 tabs (and I only account for retiring at 46, 51, and 57 with an early out, so the full retirement benefits.  I do run the EBIS (or whatever the new system is) to see how deferred retirements would work out, but since I'm not really considering deferred at the moment, they haven't made the spreadsheet).  All that to say, I totally get it!

I've seen a lot of people get the VERA/VSIP the last few years, so while I can't hope for it too much, I haven't given up all hope.

[afox]

Seems like for most the question of whether to "hang on for MRA" is a big one since in most cases retiring at the MRA means very little retirement savings will be needed. Id imagine 5% contributions to the TSP to get the matches would be more than sufficient for most retiring at the MRA. The decision should be easier for FERS-FRAE employees who are contributing significantly more for the same FERS benefit: https://www.fedsmith.com/2019/08/19/means-fers-rae-fers-frae/
A part time schedule in order to stay long enough to meet the MRA seems like a good option for those that have the opportunity.

[Monkey Uncle]

33 Here.  Started with the Feds in Fall of '10, so coming up on my 10-year anniversary.

I've been maxing out my TSP and just been focusing on pumping as much cash into tax-advantaged accounts as I can.  I would love to be able to "retire" to a side-hustle type job in the ~2030ish time range. 

I have some questions for the other Feds here.  If I was to leave Federal service at 2030 at age 43 (20 years service), what benefits would I really be giving up by not officially "retiring" from Federal service?

I still have my TSP and can roll that over to an IRA and start a Roth ladder ASAP.  I will still be able to collect Social Security at 67.  I will still be able to collect my deferred annuity (starting at ages 57 to 62).  I believe if I wait til age 62 to start collecting my annuity, I will get 20% of my high 3 annual salary.  If I collect at 57, I get penalized at 5% a year.

So, the big thing that I will be giving up by not officially retiring, is the healthcare benefits right?  Is this really the only thing?  I currently pay ~$360/mo for family plan healthcare, and the Govt pays ~$1000 as their portion.  Okay...$1000 a month that I don't have to pay is pretty nice, but in my research on the ACA subsidy...if in retirement I have a total income of ~$40,000 with a family of 4, I could receive a 1000-1100 monthly healthcare subsidy.  So, basically, I would be paying the same amount of money for healthcare.

Am I missing some other benefit of "official" FERS retirement?  Cause honestly, I see about 0% incentive (besides more years of TSP growth/contributions and the 1% annuity per year) for someone younger such as myself to move their proposed retirement from 40-45 to 57 MRA.

Any help/thoughts would be appreciated.  If this needs it's own thread, let me know, but I figured any Feds on this board are already on this one.

Due to a low nominal income and the PTC that goes along with that, I pay considerably less for my ACA insurance than I used to pay for FEHB.  And the insurance plan is just as good.  But the quality of ACA plans varies considerably from state to state, so it's something you'd really want to look into for your particular situation.  And of course there is the risk that the ACA rug might get yanked out from under us entirely.

[the_fixer]

Is it not possible to stop working as a fed and take retirement at a later date?

I could have sworn that I read that if you have 5 years as a fed and stop working you can take retirement later once you reach retirement age?

Thought it also included the health benefits if you had fed benefits for a certain amount of time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sparkytheop]

Is it not possible to stop working as a fed and take retirement at a later date?

I could have sworn that I read that if you have 5 years as a fed and stop working you can take retirement later once you reach retirement age?

Thought it also included the health benefits if you had fed benefits for a certain amount of time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, you can take a deferred retirement.  No, health benefits do not apply to deferred retirements (you can only take the health benefits if you have been covered the last 5 years and you are eligible for an immediate pension.)  There are some people who are able to leave federal service for many years, and then come back for one last round of five years in order to boost their high-three, and carry the health benefits into retirement.  Of course, there is no guarantee you can get hired to do those five years.

[the_fixer]

Are you sure you have to put in another 5 to get the Health?

“Examples #1 of Eligibility
Susan elected FEHB coverage on July 5, 2010, and had a "break in service" from Jan 1, 2016, to Jan 1, 2017. When she returned she elected to enroll from the time she was eligible Jan 1, 2017, and will remain enrolled until she retires Dec 1, 2018. She would be eligible to continue FEHB when she retires since she will have been continuously enrolled for 5 years of service prior to retirement.”

———-
So work as fed for 5 years and elect FEHB for the entire 5 years.

Break in service (FIRE for 5 years for example?)

Take whatever FED job you can get just before retirement age elect FEHB day one and retire a year later

The way I read the example this would work as you were continually enrolled in FEHB in the prior 5 years





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[fattest_foot]

... removed for ease of reading...

That's about where I am too (I'll have my 25 in at 46).

Are you looking at the deferred pension then? (the "reduced pension" at such a high age threw me, but it makes since if you're calculating for a deferred pension)

Sorry for being unclear - by reduced I meant "reduced due to inflation" on the deferred pension, not the 5% a year reduction.  The whole wait until 62 thing came about so that I would not have to take the 5% reduction. The way I figure, I have 3 options:
     1) Work till my MRA of 57 and draw an immediate pension
     2) Work until I have 20+ years of service, quit, and draw a deferred pension at age 60. 
     3) Work until I have less than 20 years of service, quite, and draw a deferred pension at age 62 so as to avoid the 5% reduction.

Option 2 seems most likely to me.  I want to be able to be able to add the pension into my FIRE calculations, but in order to play with my FIRE date I need to be able to recalculate the different years of service, inflation reduction, and (theoretical) High-3 for each date.  Not difficult, I know, but now that the holidays are over I might find some time to actually do it.

I don't think option B works how you've laid it out. It only applies if you're doing an immediate retirement at age 60 with 20 years of service. You work from ages 20-40, defer it until 60, and avoid the penalty. You'd still be subject to the normal rules. Essentially, if you're deferring, the number of years makes no difference as long as you're over 5 (outside of calculating how much you get, obviously).

[Sugaree]

Is it not possible to stop working as a fed and take retirement at a later date?

I could have sworn that I read that if you have 5 years as a fed and stop working you can take retirement later once you reach retirement age?

Thought it also included the health benefits if you had fed benefits for a certain amount of time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, you can take a deferred retirement.  No, health benefits do not apply to deferred retirements (you can only take the health benefits if you have been covered the last 5 years and you are eligible for an immediate pension.)  There are some people who are able to leave federal service for many years, and then come back for one last round of five years in order to boost their high-three, and carry the health benefits into retirement.  Of course, there is no guarantee you can get hired to do those five years.

There is also apparently a way to postpone retirement payments for a couple of years.  You wouldn't have the FEHB coverage during those years, but can pick it back up after that time period is up.  I can see this being helpful if you want to go at MRA, but maybe need a few low-earning years to kick off a Roth conversion ladder.  Or if you were at MRA, but didn't have the full time in service.


https://www.govexec.com/pay-benefits/2007/06/deferred-vs-postponed/24758/

[x02947]

... removed for ease of reading...

That's about where I am too (I'll have my 25 in at 46).

Are you looking at the deferred pension then? (the "reduced pension" at such a high age threw me, but it makes since if you're calculating for a deferred pension)

Sorry for being unclear - by reduced I meant "reduced due to inflation" on the deferred pension, not the 5% a year reduction.  The whole wait until 62 thing came about so that I would not have to take the 5% reduction. The way I figure, I have 3 options:
     1) Work till my MRA of 57 and draw an immediate pension
     2) Work until I have 20+ years of service, quit, and draw a deferred pension at age 60. 
     3) Work until I have less than 20 years of service, quite, and draw a deferred pension at age 62 so as to avoid the 5% reduction.

Option 2 seems most likely to me.  I want to be able to be able to add the pension into my FIRE calculations, but in order to play with my FIRE date I need to be able to recalculate the different years of service, inflation reduction, and (theoretical) High-3 for each date.  Not difficult, I know, but now that the holidays are over I might find some time to actually do it.

I don't think option B works how you've laid it out. It only applies if you're doing an immediate retirement at age 60 with 20 years of service. You work from ages 20-40, defer it until 60, and avoid the penalty. You'd still be subject to the normal rules. Essentially, if you're deferring, the number of years makes no difference as long as you're over 5 (outside of calculating how much you get, obviously).

I agree with "work from ages 20-40, defer it until 60, and avoid the penalty.  You'd still be subject to the normal rules."  Normal rules being no FEHB, no SS supplement, no COLA until I draw it, etc.

I don't quite understand how the number of years (of service) makes no difference, though.  If I'm over 20 years of service I get to draw my pension at 60 with no penalty.  If I'm under, I have to wait until 62 to avoid the penalty.  That means two more years of inflation and living purely off the stash.  I don't intend for 2 years to make or break my FIRE, but I do need to account for it.

[moneypitfeeder]

We've weighed our options and I'm leaving after the golden 5 yrs (plus buying back some military time) and when I'm of age, I'll collect a small annuity. Just too far away from my MRA for me to hang in there. We have a main military pension, and this will only be used as an extra money benefit.

[frugalecon]

Woke up this a.m. and realized that I am now one year away from my MRA. That seems like a bit of a milestone. It will be interesting to see where we are at then, it terms of thinking about moving on to the next phase of life.

[sparkytheop]

1 year away is a great place to be! 

[FI-in-no-time]

Waiting until MRA means an additional 2-years beyond what I have planned (from Feb 2022 to April 2024).  If I'm enjoying work or my financial projections don't pan out then I'll probably stay until MRA. 

If you are planning to retire at MRA and postpone your FERS annuity until 62 to avoid the 5%/year reduction, I'd recommend doing a Net Present Value (NPV) calculation.  You might be surprised at the results.

In my case I come out $4K on the plus side taking the annuity at 57 even with the reduction.  I assumed a life expectancy of 80 and a discount rate of 4% for the calculation.  Using a different discount rate and life expectancy will of course change the results.
***Edited - forget to add this calculation is without the social security supplement since I won't have enough years in at MRA to qualify

[Goatee Joe]

Woke up this a.m. and realized that I am now one year away from my MRA. That seems like a bit of a milestone. It will be interesting to see where we are at then, it terms of thinking about moving on to the next phase of life.

Congrats!  That final year will fly by.  I'm at 5.5 years to my MRA, gonna stick it out till then, which is late 2025.  I don't mind my job right now, but working past my MRA... I can think of lots better things to do with my time.  I'm extremely close to FI now, somewhat set back by the COVID situation, but hopefully will recover and hit FI by end of this year or sometime in 2021.  Haven't given too much thought to what I might do after "retiring", but it'll rhyme with "whatever I damn well please."

[frugalecon]

Accumulated annual leave plus accumulated sick leave now exceed the time until MRA...I don’t know why, but that seems significant. At this point, my accumulated annual leave plus what I will earn exceeds a quarter of my remaining weeks until MRA, so I could drop down to four day weeks if I truly wanted to, with leave to spare.

I guess I might keep working after that point, but I might also be asking myself, “why?”

[Monkey Uncle]

Accumulated annual leave plus accumulated sick leave now exceed the time until MRA...I don’t know why, but that seems significant. At this point, my accumulated annual leave plus what I will earn exceeds a quarter of my remaining weeks until MRA, so I could drop down to four day weeks if I truly wanted to, with leave to spare.

I guess I might keep working after that point, but I might also be asking myself, “why?”

Well, I'll sure as hell ask why.  I mean, unless you just really love working, I can't imagine why you would continue to work after you're eligible for your pension, SS supplement, and retiree health insurance.

[frugalecon]

Accumulated annual leave plus accumulated sick leave now exceed the time until MRA...I don’t know why, but that seems significant. At this point, my accumulated annual leave plus what I will earn exceeds a quarter of my remaining weeks until MRA, so I could drop down to four day weeks if I truly wanted to, with leave to spare.

I guess I might keep working after that point, but I might also be asking myself, “why?”

Well, I'll sure as hell ask why.  I mean, unless you just really love working, I can't imagine why you would continue to work after you're eligible for your pension, SS supplement, and retiree health insurance.

I won’t be eligible for the SS supplement, since I would be MRA + 10. Unless there is a VERA, I think. We will see whether that happens.

[horsepoor]

Good info in this thread!  I need to go back and read in more detail when I have some time.

I have 17 years in, and plan to go at MRA or just a bit over (14 years, 1.5 months).  I'm hoping at 57 I'm healthy and fit enough to go on to some sort of part-time horse related work.  I'm a senior level ecologist so I would also have consulting options that would bring in more $$ per hour if I felt like doing some work in my professional line after retiring from my federal career. I'm lucky to get satisfaction out of my work, so I'm not in a rush to retire before MRA. So my strategy is to retire without a mortgage or any other debt, and my TSP stash filled up, and not touch it, or only use a small amount of it for my first few years of retirement. My plan is pretty rough though, and I need to sit down and do some more detailed calculations like some of you in this thread have spelled out.

[ospreyjp]

DoD Fed here with 11months and 20 days until I hit my MRA+10.  I am so ready!  COVID telework has felt like a preview of retirement albeit a more stressful one than I envision real retirement to be. 

The pension is incrementally better than if I had already left, but FEHB is the real reason that I am hanging in there.  With three school-age kids and a SAH spouse, there is not way I would be in a position to FIRE. 

I just have to try to keep focused somehow  as a manager and an employee to see it across the finish line next September.  I wish there were away to move the clock ahead...

[CapLimited]

I have 85 weeks to MRA + 10, so I'm definitely staying until then.  We are pretty much FI -- husband is a 63-year-old Fed with 21 years in, so fully eligible for his pension.  He's still working because his job is cushy and well-paid and we're in a pandemic so we can't travel, anyway.  He's talking about retiring next summer.  When he retires, he will have his Fed pension and may take Social Security also, and we already have over $1,000,000 in retirement accounts.  At 4% withdrawal, that puts us at about $80,000 before taxes.  We also have quite a lot in home equity.

In May 2022, I will hit my MRA, but I will only have 19 years, 2 months.  Working that extra 10 months to get my 20 years of service is tempting, but I probably won't unless I can negotiate a lot of nice perks like extended telework and no business travel.  I'm good at my job, but just really bored.  The plan is to hit MRA and do a postponed retirement, starting the annuity and restarting my own FEHB again at 62.  Between 57 and 62, I could go on my husband's FEHB and start taking TSP distributions (yes, it's allowed without penalty if you leave federal service at 55 or later).  My back-of-the envelope calculation indicates that if I don't do those 10 months, I would be giving up about $160,000, between income not earned and TSP withdrawals taken during those 10 months, and the unreduced pension and Social Security Supplement I could have received between 60 and 62.

If we were sticking around in the DC area, staying for the extra 10 months would be a no-brainer, but we really want to move to France sooner rather than later.  The extra money won't make a difference -- we will already have everything we need or want.  Maybe some college costs for the granddaughters, but who knows if they will even care about going?  It's not looking so good at the moment!  So, it's early June 2022 unless I can telework for a couple months at a time from France during those last 10 months from June 2022 through March 2023.

[partgypsy]

Hanging on for MRA and more. I'm just shy of 6 years away from MRA but plan to work to 62. It's possible I could retire at 60 depending on whether I am eligible for that supplemental ss thing, otherwise, 62. I am lucky that I generally enjoy my job but it can be stressful at times (deadlines and goals). Part of the explanation is that I'm more of a get rich slowly person, other part is that I got divorced a couple years ago where assets were split (but I kept the house). I've never been a big spender, but was late in getting a regular paycheck (took 3 years off between college and grad school, got a doctorate, did a 3 year post doc before getting a regular job). I'm also motivated to continue working because I promised DD I would help with her college costs because that's important to me.

[Loretta]

2593 days but who's counting. 

[elysianfields]

I'm in the Foreign Service, serving in Africa these days, and have 5+ years to go.

We're FIRE already, and we like the FS lifestyle, the cheap living & HH help in AF, and the free rent (which we value at $45k - tax-free - compared to living in DMV, thank you, American taxpayers!).  Post ("hardship") differential on top of that, while taxed, helps us cover college tuition.  Even before I became a Fed, we maxed both our Roth IRAs every. single. year.  Except for my first year in the FS, we've always maxed my TSP and contributed heavily to DS's, and we've probably over-contributed; Our pensions will keep us from solving the RMD problem, as pensions fill the bottom tax brackets and keep us from making free or inexpensive Roth conversions.  That's a nice problem to have, I suppose, and will force us to repay much of that free rent after we hit age 72.

My forced contributions to the FSPS (1.35% of pay) are relatively affordable compared to colleagues who joined after 2014 and pay 4.95%.

On healthcare, we don't have any chronic conditions and so use an HDHP with an HSA; I've grown my HSA investments to > $50k in under six years.  We can always change to a Cadillac plan during open season, before or after retirement, should issues arise.  Given the crazy US healthcare system, we value the FEHB more than the pension, frankly.  That may change should we decide to retire abroad.

I do have some job stress, but nothing like what I'd face in the private sector, and we love traveling to new places and discovering different cultures.

While gigs in other Federal agencies aren't as good a deal as previously, the Foreign Circus still provides plenty of tools for reaching FI/RRE (relatively early).

[flannel]

Has anyone looked at retiring early but then going back into federal service at their MRA to get the immediate pension, social security supplement, and FRHB?  Obviously you couldn’t count on being rehires, but seems like it could work?  If I, for example, leave at 50 and defer the pension, I wouldn’t get a pension until 62 and would lose FEHB. It’s tempting to stay until MRA...but hate to lose those seven years.  Wha if I left at 50, then returned for a year at 56?

[Phenix]

Has anyone looked at retiring early but then going back into federal service at their MRA to get the immediate pension, social security supplement, and FRHB?  Obviously you couldn’t count on being rehires, but seems like it could work?  If I, for example, leave at 50 and defer the pension, I wouldn’t get a pension until 62 and would lose FEHB. It’s tempting to stay until MRA...but hate to lose those seven years.  Wha if I left at 50, then returned for a year at 56?

You have to be enrolled in FEHB 5 years leading up to your retirement to qualify for FEHB in retirement.  So you would need to return for 5 years at 52.

[Saffron]

I'm expecting to hit my fire number of $1.5M around 2032. I'm 32 now, putting that when I'm 44. At point I'll have 17 years in as a fed. I'm not really counting on the FEHB benefit in retirement, and my FI number factors in for a proportionally similar healthcare cost right now.

I'm counting on the years between 45 and 57 to be active and fun years where I can spend time with my family, travel well, and pursue my passions. Waiting for a 60% healthcare discount isn't going to deter that.

[DeniseNJ]

Has anyone looked at retiring early but then going back into federal service at their MRA to get the immediate pension, social security supplement, and FRHB?  Obviously you couldn’t count on being rehires, but seems like it could work?  If I, for example, leave at 50 and defer the pension, I wouldn’t get a pension until 62 and would lose FEHB. It’s tempting to stay until MRA...but hate to lose those seven years.  Wha if I left at 50, then returned for a year at 56?

You have to be enrolled in FEHB 5 years leading up to your retirement to qualify for FEHB in retirement.  So you would need to return for 5 years at 52.

It's 5 of the last 5 yrs you were eligible.  they don't count a break in service, so you could go back and work a year and still be good.
https://www.opm.gov/faqs/QA.aspx?fid=fd635746-de0a-4dd7-997d-b5706a0fd8d2&pid=86c7b3a5-d614-42eb-8070-9f3d3f5068dd

[flannel]

Thanks Phenix and Denise NJ! I hadn’t thought through the five year FEHB requirement, so this is really helpful!

[Phenix]

Has anyone looked at retiring early but then going back into federal service at their MRA to get the immediate pension, social security supplement, and FRHB?  Obviously you couldn’t count on being rehires, but seems like it could work?  If I, for example, leave at 50 and defer the pension, I wouldn’t get a pension until 62 and would lose FEHB. It’s tempting to stay until MRA...but hate to lose those seven years.  Wha if I left at 50, then returned for a year at 56?

You have to be enrolled in FEHB 5 years leading up to your retirement to qualify for FEHB in retirement.  So you would need to return for 5 years at 52.

It's 5 of the last 5 yrs you were eligible.  they don't count a break in service, so you could go back and work a year and still be good.
https://www.opm.gov/faqs/QA.aspx?fid=fd635746-de0a-4dd7-997d-b5706a0fd8d2&pid=86c7b3a5-d614-42eb-8070-9f3d3f5068dd

Thanks for the clarification!
It really surprises me that OPM interprets the 5 year FEHB requirement that way.  In my head I've always read it as being 5 consecutive years.

[frugalecon]

Given Trump’s EO creating Schedule F, I wonder if anyone who monitors this thread and was planning on going to MRA is having second thoughts about whether or not they will make it.

[Kierun]

Sorry I haven't been following the news, what's Schedule F and its impact on MRA?

[frugalecon]

Sorry I haven't been following the news, what's Schedule F and its impact on MRA?

The Executive Order creates a new class of employee that doesn’t have civil service protections. (See, e.g., https://www.govexec.com/management/2020/10/salary-council-chairman-resigns-protest-trump-order-politicizing-federal-workforce/169551/). It doesn’t directly impact MRA, though it potentially creates a situation where a person could be terminated involuntarily prior to reaching MRA. I suppose everyone has to wait to find out if they are in the new category.

[Monkey Uncle]

Sorry I haven't been following the news, what's Schedule F and its impact on MRA?

The Executive Order creates a new class of employee that doesn’t have civil service protections. (See, e.g., https://www.govexec.com/management/2020/10/salary-council-chairman-resigns-protest-trump-order-politicizing-federal-workforce/169551/). It doesn’t directly impact MRA, though it potentially creates a situation where a person could be terminated involuntarily prior to reaching MRA. I suppose everyone has to wait to find out if they are in the new category.

I'd wait until after the election before worrying about that.

[Kierun]

Thanks, that's interesting. I think I'm with Monkey Uncle on this one.

[frugalecon]

As of today, I am 100 days away from my MRA. Even if I don't pull the plug quite yet once I reach it, it will be interesting to see just how fast a 100-day countdown goes.

[economista]

As of today, I am 100 days away from my MRA. Even if I don't pull the plug quite yet once I reach it, it will be interesting to see just how fast a 100-day countdown goes.

That's wonderful!

It feels like I have forever to go until MRA. I started as a fed in 2012 a few days before I turned 23, so I will have 9 years of service this year but I'm only 31. I've considered the idea of getting to the 20 year mark and then retiring early, but deferring my pension until MRA. We would have the savings to make that work financially, but it is so tempting to just keep going to keep the health insurance. We'll see how I feel in another 11 years :D

[erutio]

If you're so young, if feels like working just to make MRA isn't worth it, especially if you have the savings to make it work financially, as you say.

[Goatee Joe]

As of today, I am 100 days away from my MRA. Even if I don't pull the plug quite yet once I reach it, it will be interesting to see just how fast a 100-day countdown goes.

This is awesome.  Enjoy those last 100 days!  It'll fly by, I'm guessing.  As for me (also a Fed) I've got just under 5 years till MRA, planning to stick around until then.  Per FIcalc, I'm already (or very close to) FI.  Still, I figure I'll put in 4.5 more years and walk away with pension and a very good deal on health insurance for life.  I'm not in love with the job, but it's not terrible and it's definitely worth putting in a few more years in order to snag full Fed retirement benefits.  Enjoy your soon-to-be retired life!

[RainyDay]

It feels like I have forever to go until MRA. I started as a fed in 2012 a few days before I turned 23, so I will have 9 years of service this year but I'm only 31. I've considered the idea of getting to the 20 year mark and then retiring early, but deferring my pension until MRA. We would have the savings to make that work financially, but it is so tempting to just keep going to keep the health insurance. We'll see how I feel in another 11 years :D

Same here!  9.5 years til MRA for me, so I'm not planning to stay that long.  Just til age 50 with 20 yrs of service, which is in 1 year, 11 months.  It still seems like forever, though.  I do NOT know how people do 35+ years!

[sparkytheop]

35+ year person here...  It's a long ass haul!  I have 20+ years in now, and just crossed the "15 years to MRA" mark.  I'm hoping for an early out (there have been a lot here the last few years).  I'm trying to make a new house happen, and then I can continue to set myself up to take the early out if it's ever offered, ideally around 51/52.  I'll go to MRA otherwise, since I have a pretty sweet gig and a great schedule (after a few years of frequently getting 1 to 2 weeks off, I don't know how I managed only getting 3 day weekends for so many years.)

I want to never have to think about money in retirement, and am on the "fatFIRE" path.  My schedule really helps make that work for me.

[partgypsy]

I'm not fire, just get rich slow. Which means my plan is to retire at 62 (which to me still feels early as both parents worked until their early or mid 70's). So yes the federal benefits are a big draw. I will hit mre in about 5 years and 62 in 9. Part of me is curious to figure out how I could "retire" at mre, but doesn't seem feasible unless something significantly changes (income goes up, expenses go down, partnered, etc). I'm fine with it.