Author Topic: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?  (Read 32195 times)

JJ-

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #150 on: October 06, 2021, 08:47:57 AM »
Has anyone left after five years but well before MRA and anticipates a small pension at 62? That will likely be our situation. Can't imagine hanging around for another 15 years.

Yes.  I left after 15 years, but well before MRA.  As things stand now, I'm planning on taking my pension when I reach MRA (about 57 for me), because cFiresim says I'll come out slightly better that way than waiting until age 62.  The pension won't be a lot, but it will help (along with SS) in providing a modest guaranteed income floor.

A key point is the fact that I signed on with Uncle back when the FERS employee contribution was miniscule.  So it would be crazy for me to cash out those contributions and forgo the pension.  If you are paying the current onerous employee contribution, your situation likely is quite different.  Especially if you only have 5 years in - your pension likely won't amount to anything, especially after inflation eats away at it for a few decades.

Fascinating that the math works out to take it at 57 instead of 62. I always assumed waiting the five extra years to waive the ~25% penalty was the better play. I guess I should start running numbers.

I'll end up having closer to 17 years but the last (next) 5-7 are expected to be at 3/4 time. No way I'm doing 20-22 more years to hang on for max pension+fehb at MRA.

Yes, it works out the same way for SS - slightly better outcome (in terms of max SWR) if I take it at 62 vs waiting until 67.  Both SS and the FERS pension are designed to be actuarially neutral.  You get the same expected lifetime payout regardless of when you start taking it.  Starting as early as possible reduces withdrawals from your portfolio a little earlier, which mitigates sequence of return risk to a small degree, and perhaps gives a little boost from the presumably higher rate of return earned by your invested assets.  However, this is all highly situation dependent, based on the amount of your pension/SS, the size of your portfolio, how you have it invested, your age and assumed life expectancy, etc., etc.  I would encourage everyone to run their own numbers based on their own situation.  And re-run them right before starting any benefits.

I was curious so I started tinkering around last night and found that there is a 100% success rate waiting until 67 and a 98.8% (1/86 failures) taking at 62 with a 4.5% portfolio withdrawal rate. The big eye opener though was how much smaller the portfolio needed to be with both SS and pension factored into the equation. I needed ~$250k less than I thought I estimated. This may bump up the timeline by 1-2 years.

While the pension is OK - in the Foreign Service we get 1.7% x High-3 x years for the first 20 years, 1.0% for every year thereafter - I think the FEHB benefit is much more valuable, even if the employee's contribution to health care has been increasing faster than inflation.  Thoughts?

FEHB is a very nice perk to have, though if you're FI + cost of insurance I would doubt it's worth hanging on for for 5 years Have you looked into comparable ACA plans where you plan on retiring? I saw in the 2026 thread you're really not enjoying work and if you can bail, what's holding you back?
« Last Edit: October 06, 2021, 08:50:36 AM by JJ- »

Sugaree

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #151 on: October 06, 2021, 10:05:46 AM »
For me, the appeal of the FEHB is that there are options that are appropriate for ex-pats which I plan on being.

Catbert

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #152 on: October 06, 2021, 10:58:28 AM »
FEHB is great for a retiree!  You have all the choices and costs you do as an employee.  My Family plan is under $300 a month for great coverage with a large HMO.  A Sugaree pointed out, I have coverage while traveling overseas (assuming I ever travel again) with Medicare doesn't cover.

What has been the most advantageous in the long run is that I'm wasn't required to take  Medicare when I turned 65.   Medicare part B is ~$150 per person (no family plan) plus maybe a drug or Medi-gap plan so my FEHB plan is cheaper to start.  If your income is high in retirement (over ~175K for MFJ), Medicare will cost you more.  Maybe you think you'll never have that much taxable income, but wait until you have a large capital gain from selling real estate.

I was a CSRS employee and retired in my mid-50s so keeping FEHB was never a question.   

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #153 on: October 06, 2021, 05:46:34 PM »
A key point is the fact that I signed on with Uncle back when the FERS employee contribution was miniscule.  So it would be crazy for me to cash out those contributions and forgo the pension.  If you are paying the current onerous employee contribution, your situation likely is quite different.  Especially if you only have 5 years in - your pension likely won't amount to anything, especially after inflation eats away at it for a few decades.

That's a huge point, and makes staying on more costly for people who started working for the man more recently.

Fortunately, like @Monkey Uncle I joined early enough to maximize my return on that miniscule investment.

While the pension is OK - in the Foreign Service we get 1.7% x High-3 x years for the first 20 years, 1.0% for every year thereafter - I think the FEHB benefit is much more valuable, even if the employee's contribution to health care has been increasing faster than inflation.  Thoughts?

If your MAGI is modest, an ACA silver plan is less expensive than FEHB.  Whether or not it is good insurance depends entirely on where you live.  I am lucky that I can get essentially the same BCBS plan that FEHB offers, and I pay a lot less for it.  This is another one of those things that is highly situation dependent.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #154 on: October 06, 2021, 08:10:13 PM »
A key point is the fact that I signed on with Uncle back when the FERS employee contribution was miniscule.  So it would be crazy for me to cash out those contributions and forgo the pension.  If you are paying the current onerous employee contribution, your situation likely is quite different.  Especially if you only have 5 years in - your pension likely won't amount to anything, especially after inflation eats away at it for a few decades.

That's a huge point, and makes staying on more costly for people who started working for the man more recently.

Fortunately, like @Monkey Uncle I joined early enough to maximize my return on that miniscule investment.

While the pension is OK - in the Foreign Service we get 1.7% x High-3 x years for the first 20 years, 1.0% for every year thereafter - I think the FEHB benefit is much more valuable, even if the employee's contribution to health care has been increasing faster than inflation.  Thoughts?

It is for us SCE’s that can retire at say 47 with 25 years (speaking for myself).  That’s 18 years of FEHB before Medicare.  Again a benefit that isn’t so great of a deal if you are staying to 57+

DeniseNJ

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #155 on: October 07, 2021, 09:06:13 AM »
Those of you considering ACA plans as a reasonable alternative to FEHB, beware.  Once you are eligible for Medicare, you can no longer have an ACA plan.  This means that your alternative to your FEHB for most of your life is Medicare.  That's about $150 per person (no family plan) plus a supplemental for the remaining 20% that Medicare doesn't cover or Medicare Advantage plan, many of which cost extra.

Your options are not between FEHB and ACA.  Your options are between FEHB and Medicare as soon as you turn 65.  FEHB does not require you to take Medicare when you are eligible, unlike almost every other insurance, so you can keep your FEHB your entire life and never have to pay Medicare premiums.

This isn't as relevant if you are 40 but if you are closer to MRA, there are good reasons to stay.

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #156 on: October 07, 2021, 06:38:15 PM »
I'm not terribly worried about Medicare costs (well I am concerned about Medicare's long-term funding problems, but that's another story).  My wife is already on Medicare.  She has the part B supplement that covers essentially everything.  I consider it to be a good deal, all things considered.  Her total premiums for part B, the supplement, and the part D drug plan are a little under $3k a year (part A has no premium).  Her only out of pocket cost is the part B deductible (currently $203) and any new prescriptions she might get that aren't fully covered by the part D drug plan. 

The drug plan is the trickiest part.  It's relatively easy to find a plan that covers your particular prescriptions at little or no out of pocket cost, but if you get a new prescription during the year and it happens to not be fully covered by your plan, you're stuck paying for it until you can switch plans in the fall.

Yes, her premiums are likely to go up every year, but that's also the case with FEHB, and every other form of health insurance other than a fully subsidized ACA plan.

afox

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #157 on: October 07, 2021, 08:59:42 PM »
Those of you considering ACA plans as a reasonable alternative to FEHB, beware.  Once you are eligible for Medicare, you can no longer have an ACA plan.  This means that your alternative to your FEHB for most of your life is Medicare.  That's about $150 per person (no family plan) plus a supplemental for the remaining 20% that Medicare doesn't cover or Medicare Advantage plan, many of which cost extra.

Your options are not between FEHB and ACA.  Your options are between FEHB and Medicare as soon as you turn 65.  FEHB does not require you to take Medicare when you are eligible, unlike almost every other insurance, so you can keep your FEHB your entire life and never have to pay Medicare premiums.

This isn't as relevant if you are 40 but if you are closer to MRA, there are good reasons to stay.

You can have FEHB and medicare at the same time in retirement if you want. $150 per person (assume per month) sounds like less than any FEHB plan.

marion10

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #158 on: October 08, 2021, 10:18:05 PM »
When you add your Part B premium and Part D (drug coverage) and a Medicare Supplement you are talking more than $150 a month.

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #159 on: October 09, 2021, 04:29:09 AM »
When you add your Part B premium and Part D (drug coverage) and a Medicare Supplement you are talking more than $150 a month.

You also need to consider your out of pocket costs.  With traditional Medicare, part B supplement, and Part D drug coverage, your premiums will be higher, but your potential out of pocket costs are lower.  Of course whether this is a good deal or not depends on your health status.  As people get older, traditional Medicare becomes a better deal.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #160 on: October 09, 2021, 10:07:56 AM »
Yes, her premiums are likely to go up every year, but that's also the case with FEHB, and every other form of health insurance other than a fully subsidized ACA plan.

As a data point, our FEHB premiums - we're in GEHA HDHP, family - will increase 5.0% in 2022.

Meanwhile, Uncle Joe seems fixed on giving Federal employees a 2.2% raise + 0.5% for locality pay adjustments in 2022 (source:  https://federalnewsnetwork.com/pay/2021/08/biden-formally-announces-plans-to-give-employees-a-federal-pay-raise-in-2022/).  That's lower than the inflation rate, and pay raises have consistently trailed the increases in health insurance premiums, eroding our discretionary income every year.

JJ-

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #161 on: October 09, 2021, 01:29:39 PM »
Yes, her premiums are likely to go up every year, but that's also the case with FEHB, and every other form of health insurance other than a fully subsidized ACA plan.

As a data point, our FEHB premiums - we're in GEHA HDHP, family - will increase 5.0% in 2022.

Meanwhile, Uncle Joe seems fixed on giving Federal employees a 2.2% raise + 0.5% for locality pay adjustments in 2022 (source:  https://federalnewsnetwork.com/pay/2021/08/biden-formally-announces-plans-to-give-employees-a-federal-pay-raise-in-2022/).  That's lower than the inflation rate, and pay raises have consistently trailed the increases in health insurance premiums, eroding our discretionary income every year.

I know that it's pretty easy to compare % to % and is a common complaint, but a 5% raise on employee premiums for GEHA HDHP comes out to about $400. A 2.2% increase on a $95k salary comes out to ~$2k. My guess is yours is higher between base salary and locality. Hopefully the difference helps keep your discretionary income the same.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #162 on: October 10, 2021, 09:17:46 AM »
Yes, her premiums are likely to go up every year, but that's also the case with FEHB, and every other form of health insurance other than a fully subsidized ACA plan.

As a data point, our FEHB premiums - we're in GEHA HDHP, family - will increase 5.0% in 2022.

Meanwhile, Uncle Joe seems fixed on giving Federal employees a 2.2% raise + 0.5% for locality pay adjustments in 2022 (source:  https://federalnewsnetwork.com/pay/2021/08/biden-formally-announces-plans-to-give-employees-a-federal-pay-raise-in-2022/).  That's lower than the inflation rate, and pay raises have consistently trailed the increases in health insurance premiums, eroding our discretionary income every year.

I know that it's pretty easy to compare % to % and is a common complaint, but a 5% raise on employee premiums for GEHA HDHP comes out to about $400. A 2.2% increase on a $95k salary comes out to ~$2k. My guess is yours is higher between base salary and locality. Hopefully the difference helps keep your discretionary income the same.

An increase in nominal dollars does not compensate for the loss of real value of discretionary income.

Even without considering the current inflation rate (5.25% annually at the end of August, 2021), the fact that insurance premiums are rising at a faster rate than salaries means a reduction in purchasing power, no matter the (much lower) base of the insurance premium.

frugalecon

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #163 on: October 10, 2021, 12:41:14 PM »
Yes, her premiums are likely to go up every year, but that's also the case with FEHB, and every other form of health insurance other than a fully subsidized ACA plan.

As a data point, our FEHB premiums - we're in GEHA HDHP, family - will increase 5.0% in 2022.

Meanwhile, Uncle Joe seems fixed on giving Federal employees a 2.2% raise + 0.5% for locality pay adjustments in 2022 (source:  https://federalnewsnetwork.com/pay/2021/08/biden-formally-announces-plans-to-give-employees-a-federal-pay-raise-in-2022/).  That's lower than the inflation rate, and pay raises have consistently trailed the increases in health insurance premiums, eroding our discretionary income every year.

I know that it's pretty easy to compare % to % and is a common complaint, but a 5% raise on employee premiums for GEHA HDHP comes out to about $400. A 2.2% increase on a $95k salary comes out to ~$2k. My guess is yours is higher between base salary and locality. Hopefully the difference helps keep your discretionary income the same.

An increase in nominal dollars does not compensate for the loss of real value of discretionary income.

Even without considering the current inflation rate (5.25% annually at the end of August, 2021), the fact that insurance premiums are rising at a faster rate than salaries means a reduction in purchasing power, no matter the (much lower) base of the insurance premium.

A complicating factor in these kinds of comparisons is that health care premiums are rising for health care that is arguably improving every year. There are more effective treatments for many conditions now, or treatments for conditions that had no treatment options at all. We are definitely spending more and more of our incomes on health care, but that doesn’t necessarily mean we are worse off.  That said, the pay increase that Biden has proposed for Feds is less than inflation, so there will be some erosion of real purchasing power. FERS and CSRS annuitants will get bigger increases than active Feds, I think!

JJ-

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #164 on: October 10, 2021, 01:14:38 PM »
An increase in nominal dollars does not compensate for the loss of real value of discretionary income.

Even without considering the current inflation rate (5.25% annually at the end of August, 2021), the fact that insurance premiums are rising at a faster rate than salaries means a reduction in purchasing power, no matter the (much lower) base of the insurance premium.

On a global level i agree that it's a cause for concern. On a personal finance level i never understood it. The way fed salaries have always registered in my mind is that each grade supports a certain lifestyle and between the steps every 2 years and hopefully COLAs that lifestyle doesn't really change. Both the increases of premiums and inflation are so far outside of my sphere of control this is the easiest way for me to just shrug it all off.

That said, the pay increase that Biden has proposed for Feds is less than inflation, so there will be some erosion of real purchasing power. FERS and CSRS annuitants will get bigger increases than active Feds, I think!

This doesn't shock me at all and I'm pretty sure civil servants have been on the low end compared to retirees and active duty since as long as I can remember. It's because the retirees have a formula attached to CPI (i think), but active duty and civil servants are political.

The real way to increase purchasing power is to find new jobs, higher graded or private sector that pay more. It's not "supposed" to be that way, but I think feds have it better than most for preserving lifestyle spending and purchasing power compared to those who need to job hop, or are stuck without raises for years.

Sugaree

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #165 on: October 12, 2021, 04:37:05 AM »
Yes, her premiums are likely to go up every year, but that's also the case with FEHB, and every other form of health insurance other than a fully subsidized ACA plan.

As a data point, our FEHB premiums - we're in GEHA HDHP, family - will increase 5.0% in 2022.

Meanwhile, Uncle Joe seems fixed on giving Federal employees a 2.2% raise + 0.5% for locality pay adjustments in 2022 (source:  https://federalnewsnetwork.com/pay/2021/08/biden-formally-announces-plans-to-give-employees-a-federal-pay-raise-in-2022/).  That's lower than the inflation rate, and pay raises have consistently trailed the increases in health insurance premiums, eroding our discretionary income every year.


Laughs in Special Rate Table. 

DeniseNJ

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #166 on: October 12, 2021, 09:51:35 AM »
When you add your Part B premium and Part D (drug coverage) and a Medicare Supplement you are talking more than $150 a month.

With NALC (an FEHB plan) you can pay as little as 100 bucks or as much as 250 per month for two people.  Even if you pick a much more expensive plan, you can change it if you need to every year.  With Medicare for 2 ppl you are looking at at least 300 for just Part B.  Add Part D and a supplemental plan and it gets pretty expensive.  Then consider the stuff that is statutorily not covered, like dental, glasses, hearing aides, and some other stuff, and it does start to get expensive.

Not saying which is best since it depends on your own situation and lots of luck, but just saying that maybe now your alternative might be FEHB to ACA, but soon it will be FEHB to Medicare.  Might not be worth working another 10 yrs for, but it might be worth sticking it our a few more years if you are close to MRA.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2021, 07:55:14 AM by DeniseNJ »

afox

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #167 on: October 14, 2021, 10:39:59 AM »
As many probably know, if you retire under the “MRA+10” status and take an immediate annuity, your FERS pension is reduced by 5% for every year until 62, and there is no inflation adjustment until 62. That is a pretty big haircut. But I recently learned that, if you have 20+ years of service, you can get an unreduced annuity if you postpone taking it until 60, since you would have been eligible for an unreduced annuity under the “60+20” status. As long as you can cover health insurance another way (spouse, COBRA, ACA), that can be a pretty good trade.
It is a big haircut but presumably the toughest years to weather will be the ones from retirement to just before SS kicks in.  That is, even though the pension haircut is permanent for each year of retirement, the FERS Supplement can help.  By the time SS starts being collected, feds could have more than they know what to do with so a reduced pension (as opposed to no pension due to delaying to avoid the reduction) could make sense in some situations.

For instance, if I stop working once I hit 30 years, here is what my access (I'm aware there are more ways to access, I mean access easily without any hoops to jump through) would look like:
Age 54 (retirement), Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 55, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 56, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 57, pension, FERS supplement, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 58, pension, FERS supplement, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 59, pension, FERS supplement, TSP, Roth IRA (partial), taxable account
Age 60, pension, FERS supplement, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 61, pension, FERS supplement, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 62, pension, FERS supplement (partial), TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 63, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 64, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 65, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account, HSA
Age 66, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account, HSA
Age 67+, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account, HSA, SS

Honestly, I think my plan would look similar if I don't make it to MRA.  I would just need even more from my Roth IRA contributions and taxable account to bridge the gap as well as more exposure to SORR.  I'll run realistic numbers when I get closer to see when I would take my pension and start the FERS Supplement (if under 62).

The earlier years of retirement require the most planning as access to all retirement accounts isn't there yet.  Thus I could envision scenarios where someone decides to take a pension ASAP even at a reduced amount as opposed to waiting.

Im trying to understand the FERS supplement and everything I read says you cant retire on anything but immediate annuity (no deferred, early, etc) and get the Social security supplement. Are you sure your information by age is correct and you could get the supplement years before getting your FERS benefit?

simonsez

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #168 on: October 14, 2021, 01:46:54 PM »
As many probably know, if you retire under the “MRA+10” status and take an immediate annuity, your FERS pension is reduced by 5% for every year until 62, and there is no inflation adjustment until 62. That is a pretty big haircut. But I recently learned that, if you have 20+ years of service, you can get an unreduced annuity if you postpone taking it until 60, since you would have been eligible for an unreduced annuity under the “60+20” status. As long as you can cover health insurance another way (spouse, COBRA, ACA), that can be a pretty good trade.
It is a big haircut but presumably the toughest years to weather will be the ones from retirement to just before SS kicks in.  That is, even though the pension haircut is permanent for each year of retirement, the FERS Supplement can help.  By the time SS starts being collected, feds could have more than they know what to do with so a reduced pension (as opposed to no pension due to delaying to avoid the reduction) could make sense in some situations.

For instance, if I stop working once I hit 30 years, here is what my access (I'm aware there are more ways to access, I mean access easily without any hoops to jump through) would look like:
Age 54 (retirement), Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 55, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 56, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 57, pension, FERS supplement, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 58, pension, FERS supplement, Roth IRA contributions, taxable account
Age 59, pension, FERS supplement, TSP, Roth IRA (partial), taxable account
Age 60, pension, FERS supplement, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 61, pension, FERS supplement, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 62, pension, FERS supplement (partial), TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 63, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 64, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account
Age 65, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account, HSA
Age 66, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account, HSA
Age 67+, pension, TSP, Roth IRA, taxable account, HSA, SS

Honestly, I think my plan would look similar if I don't make it to MRA.  I would just need even more from my Roth IRA contributions and taxable account to bridge the gap as well as more exposure to SORR.  I'll run realistic numbers when I get closer to see when I would take my pension and start the FERS Supplement (if under 62).

The earlier years of retirement require the most planning as access to all retirement accounts isn't there yet.  Thus I could envision scenarios where someone decides to take a pension ASAP even at a reduced amount as opposed to waiting.

Im trying to understand the FERS supplement and everything I read says you cant retire on anything but immediate annuity (no deferred, early, etc) and get the Social security supplement. Are you sure your information by age is correct and you could get the supplement years before getting your FERS benefit?
No, I am not sure my information was/is correct, thanks for pointing that out!  Then again, I might not be a fed next year let alone ~20 years from now.  My options would be to 1) retire without it, assuming I still leave at 54 with 30 years, 2) quit working at 54 and get a fed job at age 57 and then retire soon after, 3) hope for a RIF at the opportune time or major re-org if I retired "involuntarily", or 4) work until MRA (57).

Can you clarify your last question?  I never intended to receive my FERS supplement before my annuity/pension (assuming this is what you mean by FERS benefit).  I was thinking they would kick in at the same time - but upon further reading it seems you are correct, that I would only qualify for the FERS supplement IF I had an immediate retirement after aging to at least 57 with 30 years of service.  If I retired voluntarily at 54 with 30 years in and had my deferred pension start at 57 at my MRA, I would not qualify for the FERS supplement since the pension is deferred and voluntary.  A rough estimate for my FERS supplement would be about 18k/year ($2000 monthly SS at age 62 *30 years of service / 40 ), so choosing to retire voluntarily at 54 and never coming back instead of waiting to 57 would result in about 90k min to 108k max worth of FERS supplement benefits I'd be missing out on covering years 57-62.

afox

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #169 on: October 14, 2021, 03:46:41 PM »
@simonsez yes, I think we both understand the supplement better, this benefit is not available unless retiring with an immediate annuity at MRA. Talk about golden handcuffs! The conundrum for federal employees is one of why bother saving more than maxing out TSP if you plan to work until MRA. Doubt anyone needs more income/benefits in retirement than TSP, FERS, SS, SS Supplement, FEHB.

DoneFSO

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #170 on: October 20, 2021, 11:45:27 PM »
I see there are a good number of federal excepted service careers represented here, including others in the Foreign Service.  Our MRA is 20/50 (20 years in, 50 years of age).  It just so happens that I joined when I was 29, so I will be right at 20 years in the year I turn 50 (2029).  I am sticking it out because 7 years feels very close at this point.  I can feel the wind picking up at my feet, and I can almost see the finish line; I can definitely sense it on the horizon. 

What would I give up by leaving earlier?  A supplemental annuity worth what Social Security would pay if I were eligible to receive it at age 50 and which would then run until full SS age (62), my Cadillac health insurance plan (which I get to keep for life after retirement and which, supplemented by Medicare Part B, will reduce health care expenses to practically nothing after age 65)… anything else?  Let’s see…  oh, my pension calculation will go from 1.7%/year to 1%/year.  That’s significant.  Payout of my sick leave, of which I use very little, so probably $30k worth of that.  A few more things I am probably forgetting.

In short, in my circumstances, with only seven years to go, the juice seems worth the squeeze, as the saying goes.  I will say this:  I have been in for over 12 years at this point; I though the time would pass slowly, but it has passed very quickly.  That said, I know some folks are looking at a much longer horizon, and I understand the hesitancy to stick it out if you are looking at 20 more years or more. 

Then again… it does go quicker than we think when all is said and done, no?

DeniseNJ

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #171 on: October 21, 2021, 07:59:02 AM »
Quote
What would I give up by leaving earlier?  A supplemental annuity worth what Social Security would pay if I were eligible to receive it at age 50 and which would then run until full SS age (62), my Cadillac health insurance plan (which I get to keep for life after retirement and which, supplemented by Medicare Part B, will reduce health care expenses to practically nothing after age 65)… anything else?  Let’s see…  oh, my pension calculation will go from 1.7%/year to 1%/year.  That’s significant.  Payout of my sick leave, of which I use very little, so probably $30k worth of that.  A few more things I am probably forgetting.

Adding Medicare Part B won't reduce your expenses really, since you'll have to pay for Part B which is about $150 a month now.  You don't need to get Part B if you have FEHB.  You can just keep your FEHB, any plan you choose, an leave it at that.

I also have 7 years.  I plan on just keeping my FEHB and not getting Part B.

afox

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #172 on: October 21, 2021, 10:53:23 AM »
I see there are a good number of federal excepted service careers represented here, including others in the Foreign Service.  Our MRA is 20/50 (20 years in, 50 years of age).  It just so happens that I joined when I was 29, so I will be right at 20 years in the year I turn 50 (2029).  I am sticking it out because 7 years feels very close at this point.  I can feel the wind picking up at my feet, and I can almost see the finish line; I can definitely sense it on the horizon. 

What would I give up by leaving earlier?  A supplemental annuity worth what Social Security would pay if I were eligible to receive it at age 50 and which would then run until full SS age (62), my Cadillac health insurance plan (which I get to keep for life after retirement and which, supplemented by Medicare Part B, will reduce health care expenses to practically nothing after age 65)… anything else?  Let’s see…  oh, my pension calculation will go from 1.7%/year to 1%/year.  That’s significant.  Payout of my sick leave, of which I use very little, so probably $30k worth of that.  A few more things I am probably forgetting.

In short, in my circumstances, with only seven years to go, the juice seems worth the squeeze, as the saying goes.  I will say this:  I have been in for over 12 years at this point; I though the time would pass slowly, but it has passed very quickly.  That said, I know some folks are looking at a much longer horizon, and I understand the hesitancy to stick it out if you are looking at 20 more years or more. 

Then again… it does go quicker than we think when all is said and done, no?

THis is absolute best case scenario for a federal career/retirement, either you planned perfectly or you are very lucky.

DoneFSO

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #173 on: October 21, 2021, 12:12:42 PM »
Adding Medicare Part B won't reduce your expenses really, since you'll have to pay for Part B which is about $150 a month now.  You don't need to get Part B if you have FEHB.  You can just keep your FEHB, any plan you choose, an leave it at that.

I also have 7 years.  I plan on just keeping my FEHB and not getting Part B.

I think I will be one of those people who will get it and pay the premiums just to have it "in case" -- as "insurance" against problems with my insurance, and for the flexibility and network options for coverage under a wider variety of circumstances.  But you're right -- it does entail a premium cost that might not be the best financial option for most people.

THis is absolute best case scenario for a federal career/retirement, either you planned perfectly or you are very lucky.

I didn't plan for this, per se, at least not from the beginning.  Once savings began to accumulate early in my career, I started my personal finance journey, educating myself and investing, and the rest is history.  My original plan was to stick it out to 50, but 2029 seemed too far away toward the beginning of my career, so I shifted to a "FIRE" plan, intensified my savings, and took some high-paying assignments to further supercharge the savings.  I blinked twice, woke up one morning, and realized that I had already been in for 12 years.  How time flies.  I decided not to FIRE for a number of reasons (you can read my case study thread if you are interested), so it seems I will end up a rich man, but that was never my original goal.

I will take credit for humility, frugality, being a shrewd thinker, and being someone who takes advice.  I'm not a bad strategic planner, either, but anyone who has anything good going on for them got lucky to an extent.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #174 on: October 25, 2021, 12:34:13 AM »
I see there are a good number of federal excepted service careers represented here, including others in the Foreign Service.  Our MRA is 20/50 (20 years in, 50 years of age).  It just so happens that I joined when I was 29, so I will be right at 20 years in the year I turn 50 (2029).  I am sticking it out because 7 years feels very close at this point.  I can feel the wind picking up at my feet, and I can almost see the finish line; I can definitely sense it on the horizon. 

What would I give up by leaving earlier?  A supplemental annuity worth what Social Security would pay if I were eligible to receive it at age 50 and which would then run until full SS age (62), my Cadillac health insurance plan (which I get to keep for life after retirement and which, supplemented by Medicare Part B, will reduce health care expenses to practically nothing after age 65)… anything else?  Let’s see…  oh, my pension calculation will go from 1.7%/year to 1%/year.  That’s significant.  Payout of my sick leave, of which I use very little, so probably $30k worth of that.  A few more things I am probably forgetting.

In short, in my circumstances, with only seven years to go, the juice seems worth the squeeze, as the saying goes.  I will say this:  I have been in for over 12 years at this point; I though the time would pass slowly, but it has passed very quickly.  That said, I know some folks are looking at a much longer horizon, and I understand the hesitancy to stick it out if you are looking at 20 more years or more. 

Then again… it does go quicker than we think when all is said and done, no?

Welcome to another FSO and congratulations on your progress!  You're well-situated for an awesome retirement.  I'm a little ahead of you (< 5 years to go), but joined later in life.

One correction: Uncle Sam does not pay out unused sick leave, he applies it to your years of service upon retirement (though you cannot apply unused sick leave to reach your 20).  For this reason, it makes more sense to schedule any needed medical & dental appointments just before your retirement.  Unused sick leave => not paid out but added to your years of service; used sick leave => you get paid for it, and it's added to your years of service.  Use those last few weeks of federal employment to see your cardiologist, proctologist / gynecologist, PT, massage therapist, mental health professional to help deal with the burnout ...

OTOH Uncle does pay out unused annual leave.  You can see how much you'd receive at your current rate if you access HR applications -> Employee Retirement Portal -> Pay and Leave.  Once I hit 15 years of service and started accumulating annual leave at the rate of 8 hours / pay period, I realized the difficulty in using it all.  I expect a big payout of unused annual leave upon retirement.

I'll go check out your case study too.

Welcome!

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #175 on: October 25, 2021, 08:24:55 AM »
Welcome to another FSO and congratulations on your progress!  You're well-situated for an awesome retirement.  I'm a little ahead of you (< 5 years to go), but joined later in life.

One correction: Uncle Sam does not pay out unused sick leave, he applies it to your years of service upon retirement (though you cannot apply unused sick leave to reach your 20).  For this reason, it makes more sense to schedule any needed medical & dental appointments just before your retirement.  Unused sick leave => not paid out but added to your years of service; used sick leave => you get paid for it, and it's added to your years of service.  Use those last few weeks of federal employment to see your cardiologist, proctologist / gynecologist, PT, massage therapist, mental health professional to help deal with the burnout ...

OTOH Uncle does pay out unused annual leave.  You can see how much you'd receive at your current rate if you access HR applications -> Employee Retirement Portal -> Pay and Leave.  Once I hit 15 years of service and started accumulating annual leave at the rate of 8 hours / pay period, I realized the difficulty in using it all.  I expect a big payout of unused annual leave upon retirement.

I'll go check out your case study too.

Welcome!

Thank you for the warm welcome.  Thank you also for clarifying the S/L payout question, which I just confirmed on rnet.  We are only allowed to accumulate up to use-or-lose for A/L -- that is to say, at most, we could get a payout for 360 hours, correct?

JJ-

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #176 on: October 25, 2021, 08:48:10 AM »
Welcome to another FSO and congratulations on your progress!  You're well-situated for an awesome retirement.  I'm a little ahead of you (< 5 years to go), but joined later in life.

One correction: Uncle Sam does not pay out unused sick leave, he applies it to your years of service upon retirement (though you cannot apply unused sick leave to reach your 20).  For this reason, it makes more sense to schedule any needed medical & dental appointments just before your retirement.  Unused sick leave => not paid out but added to your years of service; used sick leave => you get paid for it, and it's added to your years of service.  Use those last few weeks of federal employment to see your cardiologist, proctologist / gynecologist, PT, massage therapist, mental health professional to help deal with the burnout ...

OTOH Uncle does pay out unused annual leave.  You can see how much you'd receive at your current rate if you access HR applications -> Employee Retirement Portal -> Pay and Leave.  Once I hit 15 years of service and started accumulating annual leave at the rate of 8 hours / pay period, I realized the difficulty in using it all.  I expect a big payout of unused annual leave upon retirement.

I'll go check out your case study too.

Welcome!

Thank you for the warm welcome.  Thank you also for clarifying the S/L payout question, which I just confirmed on rnet.  We are only allowed to accumulate up to use-or-lose for A/L -- that is to say, at most, we could get a payout for 360 hours, correct?

Carryover of AL is 240 hours, and depending on your leave category it could be as much as 208 hours accrued in a year if you're at the 8 hr / PP category. In theory that could be 448 hours? But if you're financially set why not take time off?

If you feel that you are struggling you can see about getting a note to take FMLA for mental health for the majority of your SL. 

DoneFSO

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #177 on: October 25, 2021, 09:47:20 AM »
Welcome to another FSO and congratulations on your progress!  You're well-situated for an awesome retirement.  I'm a little ahead of you (< 5 years to go), but joined later in life.

One correction: Uncle Sam does not pay out unused sick leave, he applies it to your years of service upon retirement (though you cannot apply unused sick leave to reach your 20).  For this reason, it makes more sense to schedule any needed medical & dental appointments just before your retirement.  Unused sick leave => not paid out but added to your years of service; used sick leave => you get paid for it, and it's added to your years of service.  Use those last few weeks of federal employment to see your cardiologist, proctologist / gynecologist, PT, massage therapist, mental health professional to help deal with the burnout ...

OTOH Uncle does pay out unused annual leave.  You can see how much you'd receive at your current rate if you access HR applications -> Employee Retirement Portal -> Pay and Leave.  Once I hit 15 years of service and started accumulating annual leave at the rate of 8 hours / pay period, I realized the difficulty in using it all.  I expect a big payout of unused annual leave upon retirement.

I'll go check out your case study too.

Welcome!

Thank you for the warm welcome.  Thank you also for clarifying the S/L payout question, which I just confirmed on rnet.  We are only allowed to accumulate up to use-or-lose for A/L -- that is to say, at most, we could get a payout for 360 hours, correct?

Carryover of AL is 240 hours, and depending on your leave category it could be as much as 208 hours accrued in a year if you're at the 8 hr / PP category. In theory that could be 448 hours? But if you're financially set why not take time off?

If you feel that you are struggling you can see about getting a note to take FMLA for mental health for the majority of your SL.

And this is why I don't post on forums very often.  In my post, I commented that I thought I would get a payout for accrued S/L upon regular retirement.  elysianfields then responded by correctly noting that we do not get a payout for accrued S/L, so elysian fields suggested that, before I retire, I could use the accrued S/L for, among other things, "mental health professional to help deal with the burnout..."  But I did not mention burnout.  You are now concerned about my burnout and struggle and suggesting I get a note to take FMLA for mental health.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #178 on: October 25, 2021, 09:51:21 AM »
Thank you for the warm welcome.  Thank you also for clarifying the S/L payout question, which I just confirmed on rnet.  We are only allowed to accumulate up to use-or-lose for A/L -- that is to say, at most, we could get a payout for 360 hours, correct?

@JJ- is right - You *could* maximize things by carrying over 240 (domestic) or 360 hours (if eligible = overseas) to your final year, then not taking any leave your last year and leaving on December 31.  You'd get 8*26 = 208 + 360 = 568 hours paid out.  But unlike S/L, if you take A/L => you get paid and it's added to years of service, and if you get it paid out => you get paid, but not added to your years of service.

It's a question of how much leave & YOS maximization you want to do.

Sorry my joke about needing mental health services for the burnout was misinterpreted.  Mental health is not a joke! People who need help should seek it.

Working for Uncle Sugar sometimes is a joke, however...
« Last Edit: October 25, 2021, 09:55:00 AM by elysianfields »

JJ-

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #179 on: October 25, 2021, 10:23:34 AM »
@JJ- is right - You *could* maximize things by carrying over 240 (domestic) or 360 hours (if eligible = overseas) to your final year, then not taking any leave your last year and leaving on December 31.  You'd get 8*26 = 208 + 360 = 568 hours paid out.  But unlike S/L, if you take A/L => you get paid and it's added to years of service, and if you get it paid out => you get paid, but not added to your years of service.

It's a question of how much leave & YOS maximization you want to do.

Sorry my joke about needing mental health services for the burnout was misinterpreted.  Mental health is not a joke! People who need help should seek it.

Working for Uncle Sugar sometimes is a joke, however...

Didn't realize the limit was 360 overseas. Thanks.

And this is why I don't post on forums very often.  In my post, I commented that I thought I would get a payout for accrued S/L upon regular retirement.  elysianfields then responded by correctly noting that we do not get a payout for accrued S/L, so elysian fields suggested that, before I retire, I could use the accrued S/L for, among other things, "mental health professional to help deal with the burnout..."  But I did not mention burnout.  You are now concerned about my burnout and struggle and suggesting I get a note to take FMLA for mental health.

My intention was presenting an option for using SL. Nothing more. Sorry for hitting a sore spot for you.

Also, another option assuming you have a routine doctor visit (not implying you have a serious health condition or any other personal circumstance) - is that there is no limit on the time you can take for a doctor's visit if you read the regs. There is nothing to say you can't take a full day's worth of SL for an appointment that day. Whether you should is a different question and is entirely circumstantial and individual.

DoneFSO

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #180 on: October 25, 2021, 10:42:39 AM »
My intention was presenting an option for using SL. Nothing more. Sorry for hitting a sore spot for you.

The "sore spot" for me is the "telephone game" we are playing.  But you are right; it is another option for using S/L.

frugalecon

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #181 on: October 26, 2021, 07:00:27 PM »
OP here, 25 weeks after hitting my MRA. So ready to pull the rip cord…but rumors that VERA might be showing up at my agency in the next few months, so I am hanging on. Glad that this thread has proven useful to a fair number of people.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #182 on: December 19, 2021, 04:53:11 AM »
OP here, 25 weeks after hitting my MRA. So ready to pull the rip cord…but rumors that VERA might be showing up at my agency in the next few months, so I am hanging on. Glad that this thread has proven useful to a fair number of people.

Any news @frugalecon ?

Mine: another month behind me, 51 months to reach MRA.

frugalecon

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #183 on: December 19, 2021, 06:37:56 AM »
OP here, 25 weeks after hitting my MRA. So ready to pull the rip cord…but rumors that VERA might be showing up at my agency in the next few months, so I am hanging on. Glad that this thread has proven useful to a fair number of people.

Any news @frugalecon ?

Mine: another month behind me, 51 months to reach MRA.

Hey @elysianfields , thanks for asking. No real news on the VERA front…that may not resolve one way or another until spring, based on scuttlebutt. Given the recent increase inflation and the fact that I wouldn’t receive a COLA for a number of years, I am going to just keep motoring on for a bit longer, I think. Padding the pension and the ‘stache just seems to make sense.

Michael in ABQ

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #184 on: December 19, 2021, 08:43:44 AM »
I just submitted the form to get my pension contributions paid back to me. The frustrating part was that not only did  my wife have to sign an attached form acknowledging that she wouldn't get any survivors benefits from a pensions I never earned - but they required two witness signatures. WTF? Apparently they don't trust me not to forge my wife's signature. So we had two of our kids sign the witness blocks. Nothing in the form says those witnesses need to be over 18 - and there was no notary. It's just insulting frankly.

Also, this form has to be mailed in - because it's almost 2022 and the federal government can't figure out how to process a form online. Just another reminder that I'm glad to be out of that bureaucratic mess that is stuck decades behind the rest of the world in terms of technology, processes, policies, etc. Much happier owning and running my own business now.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #185 on: December 19, 2021, 10:55:00 AM »
I just submitted the form to get my pension contributions paid back to me. The frustrating part was that not only did  my wife have to sign an attached form acknowledging that she wouldn't get any survivors benefits from a pensions I never earned - but they required two witness signatures. WTF? Apparently they don't trust me not to forge my wife's signature. So we had two of our kids sign the witness blocks. Nothing in the form says those witnesses need to be over 18 - and there was no notary. It's just insulting frankly.

Also, this form has to be mailed in - because it's almost 2022 and the federal government can't figure out how to process a form online. Just another reminder that I'm glad to be out of that bureaucratic mess that is stuck decades behind the rest of the world in terms of technology, processes, policies, etc. Much happier owning and running my own business now.

Now that everything has moved to the cloud, I like to say that the USG provides BAAS - Bureaucracy as a Service.

I know that in many European countries, they have policies or laws that require the gov’t in question only to ask for a particular piece of information (e.g. your address, social insurance number, DOB, tel. no.) once, so they build robust systems to ensure you don’t have to keep resubmitting info that the gov’t already has.

@Michael in ABQ sorry you had such an unpleasant experience.  On the bright side, you’ll get your (most likely relatively small) pension contributions back.

I’ll continue to power through… we’re financing our last child’s higher ed expenses, paying down our HELOC, and continuing to build the stache.  After graduation, it’s less than three years to MRA, so the FSPS and FEHP make it worth the effort.

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #186 on: December 20, 2021, 06:31:19 AM »
I just submitted the form to get my pension contributions paid back to me. The frustrating part was that not only did  my wife have to sign an attached form acknowledging that she wouldn't get any survivors benefits from a pensions I never earned - but they required two witness signatures. WTF? Apparently they don't trust me not to forge my wife's signature. So we had two of our kids sign the witness blocks. Nothing in the form says those witnesses need to be over 18 - and there was no notary. It's just insulting frankly.

Also, this form has to be mailed in - because it's almost 2022 and the federal government can't figure out how to process a form online. Just another reminder that I'm glad to be out of that bureaucratic mess that is stuck decades behind the rest of the world in terms of technology, processes, policies, etc. Much happier owning and running my own business now.

This was the most frustrating part of rolling over an old IRA into my TSP.  I've also locked my TSP as a security measure, so when I get ready to make withdrawals I'll have to mail in a bunch of identity information. 

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frugalecon

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #188 on: December 25, 2021, 07:41:25 AM »
FYI 2022 pay tables are out.

https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/salaries-wages/2022/general-schedule/

Pretty big difference between the 2022 and 2019 pay scale, so high three will be going up about $270 every month, as 2019 months roll off and 2022 months roll into the calculation.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #189 on: January 18, 2022, 12:04:53 PM »
We’re at maximum telework these days, not that it makes much difference I’m afraid.  The vaccinated rate is so low because vaccines are expensive, keeping them cold is an insurmountable obstacle, the population is under-educated (so misinformation runs unimpeded) and the host government is corrupt and incompetent.  Hospitals are overrun and not up to the challenge under normal circumstances, COVID just makes it that much harder.  We’ve had lots of breakthrough cases, even among boosted adults.  Being vaccinated really does result in milder cases, from what I’ve observed.  But the poor infrastructure (power & internet) makes telework nearly impossible for many local staff.

A clock somewhere has struck, 50 months to go before I can take the golden handcuffs to the pawn shop.

As I mentioned in the 2026 Cohort thread, if the stock market continues to drop, I’ll accelerate my contributions & investments if I can.  While the market is priced for perfection, I suspect we’ll see good to great results when companies start announcing their Q4 results.

Chris Pascale

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #190 on: January 18, 2022, 03:03:42 PM »
Not hanging in for it, so much as it is just a part of the plan. About my youngest is in college I'll be hitting 20, so it's feasible I could do 25 if I like the work I'm doing and feel it has value. Teaching and grandparenting opportunities will also play a factor.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #191 on: January 18, 2022, 03:50:49 PM »
We’re at maximum telework these days, not that it makes much difference I’m afraid.  The vaccinated rate is so low because vaccines are expensive, keeping them cold is an insurmountable obstacle, the population is under-educated (so misinformation runs unimpeded) and the host government is corrupt and incompetent.  Hospitals are overrun and not up to the challenge under normal circumstances, COVID just makes it that much harder.  We’ve had lots of breakthrough cases, even among boosted adults.  Being vaccinated really does result in milder cases, from what I’ve observed.  But the poor infrastructure (power & internet) makes telework nearly impossible for many local staff.

A clock somewhere has struck, 50 months to go before I can take the golden handcuffs to the pawn shop.

As I mentioned in the 2026 Cohort thread, if the stock market continues to drop, I’ll accelerate my contributions & investments if I can.  While the market is priced for perfection, I suspect we’ll see good to great results when companies start announcing their Q4 results.

I was telling a Texas counterpart I’m with on a TDY in LA that they should send their covidiots to TDY in LA and NY, you know where the idiots wouldn’t be allowed to eat at a restaurant indoors.

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #192 on: January 18, 2022, 11:40:04 PM »
We’re at maximum telework these days, not that it makes much difference I’m afraid.  The vaccinated rate is so low because vaccines are expensive, keeping them cold is an insurmountable obstacle, the population is under-educated (so misinformation runs unimpeded) and the host government is corrupt and incompetent.  Hospitals are overrun and not up to the challenge under normal circumstances, COVID just makes it that much harder.  We’ve had lots of breakthrough cases, even among boosted adults.  Being vaccinated really does result in milder cases, from what I’ve observed.  But the poor infrastructure (power & internet) makes telework nearly impossible for many local staff.

A clock somewhere has struck, 50 months to go before I can take the golden handcuffs to the pawn shop.

As I mentioned in the 2026 Cohort thread, if the stock market continues to drop, I’ll accelerate my contributions & investments if I can.  While the market is priced for perfection, I suspect we’ll see good to great results when companies start announcing their Q4 results.

I was telling a Texas counterpart I’m with on a TDY in LA that they should send their covidiots to TDY in LA and NY, you know where the idiots wouldn’t be allowed to eat at a restaurant indoors.

Nah, let 'em stay in TX where they can die for their freedom.

the_fixer

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #193 on: January 19, 2022, 08:23:43 AM »
We’re at maximum telework these days, not that it makes much difference I’m afraid.  The vaccinated rate is so low because vaccines are expensive, keeping them cold is an insurmountable obstacle, the population is under-educated (so misinformation runs unimpeded) and the host government is corrupt and incompetent.  Hospitals are overrun and not up to the challenge under normal circumstances, COVID just makes it that much harder.  We’ve had lots of breakthrough cases, even among boosted adults.  Being vaccinated really does result in milder cases, from what I’ve observed.  But the poor infrastructure (power & internet) makes telework nearly impossible for many local staff.

A clock somewhere has struck, 50 months to go before I can take the golden handcuffs to the pawn shop.

As I mentioned in the 2026 Cohort thread, if the stock market continues to drop, I’ll accelerate my contributions & investments if I can.  While the market is priced for perfection, I suspect we’ll see good to great results when companies start announcing their Q4 results.
What country are you in?


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elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #194 on: January 19, 2022, 10:44:20 AM »
We’re at maximum telework these days, not that it makes much difference I’m afraid.  The vaccinated rate is so low because vaccines are expensive, keeping them cold is an insurmountable obstacle, the population is under-educated (so misinformation runs unimpeded) and the host government is corrupt and incompetent.  Hospitals are overrun and not up to the challenge under normal circumstances, COVID just makes it that much harder.  We’ve had lots of breakthrough cases, even among boosted adults.  Being vaccinated really does result in milder cases, from what I’ve observed.  But the poor infrastructure (power & internet) makes telework nearly impossible for many local staff.

A clock somewhere has struck, 50 months to go before I can take the golden handcuffs to the pawn shop.

As I mentioned in the 2026 Cohort thread, if the stock market continues to drop, I’ll accelerate my contributions & investments if I can.  While the market is priced for perfection, I suspect we’ll see good to great results when companies start announcing their Q4 results.
What country are you in?


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I’m going to keep that private for now, thanks for asking anyways.

ROF Expat

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #195 on: January 19, 2022, 12:39:26 PM »

[/quote]
What country are you in?


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I’m going to keep that private for now, thanks for asking anyways.
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Elysian Fields, DoneFSO, and any other FSOs on this thread 

Just a couple of thoughts from a retired FSO.

Unless the rules have changed, you can take the short retirement course up to five years before eligibility for retirement.  It is worth taking the course early.  It is the right place to ask specific questions like whether you need Medicare Parts B and D and how to use your benefits in the most advantageous manner while you still have time to plan.  Immediately before retirement, you can take the "long" retirement course.  That course is worth taking as well and includes some paid "job search" time, even if you aren't interested in looking for employment.  It is similar (but less generous) than the retirement program the military offers to retiring officers. 

BTW, the bureaucracy of retirement for FSOs is less than with most other agencies because State manages its own retirement system rather than running it through OPM.  The requirements are still the same (you, your spouse and two witnesses will still have to sign if you don't want to reserve the most generous retirement benefits for your spouse), but the office gives clear instructions about what you need to do to prepare and the process is straightforward.  I probably spent a few hours filling in forms and then less than 30 minutes in the office getting it processed.  Checking out with my bureau, turning in IDs and cell phones and canceling Diplomatic passports (which I still miss) took a few more hours.  State is normally very good about sending your first annuity payment on time and they usually give you cash from unused annual leave quickly as well. 

Consider doing the paperwork to be on Bureaus' WAE lists, and talking to the appropriate EX Directors, especially if you are in one of the cones where WAE work is more common.  I was not interested, but it works well for a lot of people. 

Retired FSO is a good gig. 

elysianfields

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #196 on: January 20, 2022, 06:37:08 AM »
Elysian Fields, DoneFSO, and any other FSOs on this thread 

Just a couple of thoughts from a retired FSO.

Unless the rules have changed, you can take the short retirement course up to five years before eligibility for retirement.  It is worth taking the course early.  It is the right place to ask specific questions like whether you need Medicare Parts B and D and how to use your benefits in the most advantageous manner while you still have time to plan.  Immediately before retirement, you can take the "long" retirement course.  That course is worth taking as well and includes some paid "job search" time, even if you aren't interested in looking for employment.  It is similar (but less generous) than the retirement program the military offers to retiring officers. 

BTW, the bureaucracy of retirement for FSOs is less than with most other agencies because State manages its own retirement system rather than running it through OPM.  The requirements are still the same (you, your spouse and two witnesses will still have to sign if you don't want to reserve the most generous retirement benefits for your spouse), but the office gives clear instructions about what you need to do to prepare and the process is straightforward.  I probably spent a few hours filling in forms and then less than 30 minutes in the office getting it processed.  Checking out with my bureau, turning in IDs and cell phones and canceling Diplomatic passports (which I still miss) took a few more hours.  State is normally very good about sending your first annuity payment on time and they usually give you cash from unused annual leave quickly as well. 

Consider doing the paperwork to be on Bureaus' WAE lists, and talking to the appropriate EX Directors, especially if you are in one of the cones where WAE work is more common.  I was not interested, but it works well for a lot of people. 

Retired FSO is a good gig.

@ROF Expat Welcome to the thread, thank you for your service, and thanks for this post!

The rules have changed: you may now take the five-day retirement seminar once a year.  DW and I will take it again during our next home leave.  We'll see whether the job-search seminar makes sense as an exit strategy.  As discussed above, I'm considering how to use as much of my sick and annual leave as possible before retirement (if used, you get paid for the time AND it counts in your Time of Service; unused sick leave isn't paid BUT counts toward your ToS; unused annual leave gets paid out BUT doesn't count toward your ToS).

I'm glad to hear that State provides less BAAS (Bureaucracy as a Service) than OPM.  An acquaintance just successfully retired after processing his retirement paperwork mere weeks before he pulled the ripcord.

I'm an IMS (~IT for non-State people reading along) and since State keeps neglecting to refill our ranks through recruitment, my services are in great demand.  I'll probably register for WAE (now called REA - Re-employed Annuitants), but not sure whether I'll actually participate.  We most likely won't need the money and we'll see whether I'm up for continuing the adventure a bit.

DeniseNJ

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #197 on: January 20, 2022, 07:51:47 AM »
Quote
As discussed above, I'm considering how to use as much of my sick and annual leave as possible before retirement (if used, you get paid for the time AND it counts in your Time of Service; unused sick leave isn't paid BUT counts toward your ToS

I don't see ow this is true.  If I can retire in 6 months and have 2 months of sick leave, then I work for 6 months and 2 months of "time" is added to my retirement date.  But if I use 2 month now and retire in 6 months, I got paid for not working but it won't be added to my retirement date.  My pension will be based on retiring in 6 months, rather than 8.  I retire in 6 months either way.  It seems more like you can use it if you don't feel like going into work, or it can be added on to your retirement date for the purposes of calculating your pension, but not both.

RainyDay

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #198 on: January 20, 2022, 08:16:40 AM »
Quote
As discussed above, I'm considering how to use as much of my sick and annual leave as possible before retirement (if used, you get paid for the time AND it counts in your Time of Service; unused sick leave isn't paid BUT counts toward your ToS

I don't see ow this is true.  If I can retire in 6 months and have 2 months of sick leave, then I work for 6 months and 2 months of "time" is added to my retirement date.  But if I use 2 month now and retire in 6 months, I got paid for not working but it won't be added to my retirement date.  My pension will be based on retiring in 6 months, rather than 8.  I retire in 6 months either way.  It seems more like you can use it if you don't feel like going into work, or it can be added on to your retirement date for the purposes of calculating your pension, but not both.

That's my understanding as well. I currently have 6+ months of sick leave in the bank, but I'm not planning to stay until MRA.  So I've been using it to take extra time off so I won't lose all of it. 

ROF Expat

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Re: How many Feds here hanging on for MRA?
« Reply #199 on: January 20, 2022, 10:12:22 AM »
Quote
As discussed above, I'm considering how to use as much of my sick and annual leave as possible before retirement (if used, you get paid for the time AND it counts in your Time of Service; unused sick leave isn't paid BUT counts toward your ToS

I don't see ow this is true.  If I can retire in 6 months and have 2 months of sick leave, then I work for 6 months and 2 months of "time" is added to my retirement date.  But if I use 2 month now and retire in 6 months, I got paid for not working but it won't be added to my retirement date.  My pension will be based on retiring in 6 months, rather than 8.  I retire in 6 months either way.  It seems more like you can use it if you don't feel like going into work, or it can be added on to your retirement date for the purposes of calculating your pension, but not both.

I think the idea is that there's a third option.  You use your leave, get paid while on leave, and are accruing time in service even though you're on leave.  You would delay your retirement date by the amount of leave time you take.  In this scenario, you might also get some other benefits (like locality pay) that you might not get if you take the cash value of leave.  I don't think taking a lot of unnecessary sick leave is going to pass anybody's smell test, but choosing to take one's annual leave while in service rather than as cash after retirement seems reasonable. 

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!