Oh, Florida!!! Covid19 Response

[Roots&Wings]

Hopefully the preliminary cruise ruling will hold. DeSantis' authoritarian approach to limiting how private businesses can choose to operate and how local communities can govern themselves is so far from "Republican".

Thought this was an interesting article from Global Times, Questions mounting over deleted early COVID-19 data and layoff of analyst in Florida, hinting on possible cases before Wuhan: https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202108/1230808.shtml 

How ironic if US turns out to be a covid virus source with how Republicans have slandered China. Interesting to see Chinese perspective, and seems FL conveniently deleted early case data showing the dates of symptom onset. 

[ixtap]

Hopefully the preliminary cruise ruling will hold. DeSantis' authoritarian approach to limiting how private businesses can choose to operate and how local communities can govern themselves is so far from "Republican".

As someone who has lived in Texas, this is exactly what Republicans have been pushing for a very long time. State rights over everything! The Feds can't tell you what to do THAT IS OUR JOB!

[OtherJen]

A week later, things aren't better: Central Florida hospitals pushed to the brink as COVID-19 cases continue to surge (WFTV)

ORLANDO, Fla. — Florida health officials are worried as records continue to be set in the COVID-19 pandemic.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported nearly 24,000 new cases in Florida on Friday.

Also, nearly 14,000 (edit to fix typo) people are currently hospitalized for COVID-19 across the state.

Channel 9 spoke with an area doctor who is seeing the spike in hospitalizations firsthand.

The internal medicine specialist said of those nearly 14,000 patients, 43% are in the ICU as of Sunday night and many of them are in Central Florida.

“AdventHealth system is still on status black,” said Dr. Aftab Khan. “Status black means we are up to the brink, where we cannot have any more patients in our hospitals.”

[OtherJen]

Texas does not appear to be faring much better, and tens of thousands of students should arrive at UT-Austin this month: Austin in 'dire' situation with rise in COVID-19 hospitalizations, officials warn (Austin American-Statesman)

Available hospital space for COVID-19 patients in the Austin area continued to be a source of anxiety over the weekend, leading officials to redouble their efforts to persuade residents to get vaccinated as a means of slowing new cases driven by the delta variant.

An automated phone message distributed by the city encouraged residents who have not received a vaccination to "not wait to get one." The warning also recommended staying home and wearing face coverings in the presence of others.

"The COVID-19 situation in Austin is dire. Health care facilities are open, but resources are limited due to a surge in cases," the message warned in English and Spanish.

The warning came as intensive care units in the five-county area neared capacity with 184 COVID-19 patients. That number was frighteningly close to the 200 ICU beds available to those patients and inched closer to the all-time record during the pandemic of 190 patients.

[PDXTabs]

On the surface, I’m sure it sounds great but you have to dive into the long-term and short-term effects of these decisions. Long Covid and death is not good. Losing income is not good.

Seems relevant: The Kids Are Alright, Why now is the time to rethink COVID safety protocols for children — and everyone else (from left leaning, highly factual, and highly credible publication New York Magazine).

[wenchsenior]

Just had a specialist appointment at one of the two major medical centers in our north Texas city. Doc scheduled me for a follow up in three months and said, "I hope we can keep it...it's going to be disaster here in another month...we're already starting to cancel and reschedule surgeries and procedures that are not crucial". 

[Abe]

On the surface, I’m sure it sounds great but you have to dive into the long-term and short-term effects of these decisions. Long Covid and death is not good. Losing income is not good.

Seems relevant: The Kids Are Alright, Why now is the time to rethink COVID safety protocols for children — and everyone else (from left leaning, highly factual, and highly credible publication New York Magazine).

From this article: “ In countries like this one, with mass vaccination of the elderly already behind us, we could track the course of the disease instead through hospitalizations or deaths, which now have a very different relationship to case numbers than they did a year ago. ”

It’d be ironic if the willfully unvaccinated adults’ precious little angels whose rights they are so worried about (or maybe their control over them, rather than the child’s actual rights - but that’s another topic) are the ones who land them in the hospital with covid. At least the kids are smiling!

I personally think the death rates will be quite a bit lower than prior peaks, but there will be a lot of long-term sequelae for people who overestimated their physical health. I will be interested in seeing SSDI claims data next year.

[PDXTabs]

On the surface, I’m sure it sounds great but you have to dive into the long-term and short-term effects of these decisions. Long Covid and death is not good. Losing income is not good.

Seems relevant: The Kids Are Alright, Why now is the time to rethink COVID safety protocols for children — and everyone else (from left leaning, highly factual, and highly credible publication New York Magazine).

From this article: “ In countries like this one, with mass vaccination of the elderly already behind us, we could track the course of the disease instead through hospitalizations or deaths, which now have a very different relationship to case numbers than they did a year ago. ”

It’d be ironic if the willfully unvaccinated adults’ precious little angels whose rights they are so worried about (or maybe their control over them, rather than the child’s actual rights - but that’s another topic) are the ones who land them in the hospital with covid. At least the kids are smiling!

That's kind of the point, right? Why should the 5-11 crowd have to suffer because adults won't get vaccinated?

[Abe]

On the surface, I’m sure it sounds great but you have to dive into the long-term and short-term effects of these decisions. Long Covid and death is not good. Losing income is not good.

Seems relevant: The Kids Are Alright, Why now is the time to rethink COVID safety protocols for children — and everyone else (from left leaning, highly factual, and highly credible publication New York Magazine).

From this article: “ In countries like this one, with mass vaccination of the elderly already behind us, we could track the course of the disease instead through hospitalizations or deaths, which now have a very different relationship to case numbers than they did a year ago. ”

It’d be ironic if the willfully unvaccinated adults’ precious little angels whose rights they are so worried about (or maybe their control over them, rather than the child’s actual rights - but that’s another topic) are the ones who land them in the hospital with covid. At least the kids are smiling!

That's kind of the point, right? Why should the 5-11 crowd have to suffer because adults won't get vaccinated?

That’s true. Sock it to them, kiddos! ER gurneys and low O2 supplies for everyone!

Of course I’m being facetious. Just don’t want any whining about why surgery is getting delayed, why ICU patients are stuck in hallways in the ER, or why we’re sending non-critical people home to suck on room air and feeling like garbage for 2 weeks. For example:  https://abc13.com/amp/covid-hospitals-houston-texas-surge/10941386/

Play stupid games and win stupid prizes. I guess the difference is now all the people who thought us healthcare personnel are dispensable will not be able to get us sick. Though getting a room full of delta during an intubation is a bit concerning either way.

[PDXTabs]

Just don’t want any whining about why surgery is getting delayed, why ICU patients are stuck in hallways in the ER, or why we’re sending non-critical people home to suck on room air and feeling like garbage for 2 weeks. For example:  https://abc13.com/amp/covid-hospitals-houston-texas-surge/10941386/

Well, I live in Oregon where we have 1.6 hospital beds per 1k residents. Which makes us the worst in the country and on par with Rwanda and Peru. Given how much I pay for health care, I'll complain as much as I want.

Play stupid games and win stupid prizes.

Absolutely. But is the stupid game failing to get vaccinated or letting your kid go to school without a mask?

[Abe]

Just don’t want any whining about why surgery is getting delayed, why ICU patients are stuck in hallways in the ER, or why we’re sending non-critical people home to suck on room air and feeling like garbage for 2 weeks. For example:  https://abc13.com/amp/covid-hospitals-houston-texas-surge/10941386/

Well, I live in Oregon where we have 1.6 hospital beds per 1k residents. Which makes us the worst in the country and on par with Rwanda and Peru. Given how much I pay for health care, I'll complain as much as I want.

Play stupid games and win stupid prizes.

Absolutely. But is the stupid game failing to get vaccinated or letting your kid go to school without a mask?

Oh sure you can complain. But it won’t change the facts on the ground. Also, dealing with pandemic surges is not cheap if the cost is your concern.

The stupid game is failing to get vaccinated and extra points for sending your kids without a mask. I send my son to school with a mask because I want to minimize his chance of a week of feeling terrible, but other parents can make their own decision and live with the results.

[PDXTabs]

Oh sure you can complain. But it won’t change the facts on the ground.

Indeed. It's not like we've spent trillions of dollars on the pandemic or have a literal Army Corps of Engineers. Seriously, WTF was the plan if we got invaded and needed field hospitals, just let all the civilians die?

[GuitarStv]

Play stupid games and win stupid prizes.

Absolutely. But is the stupid game failing to get vaccinated or letting your kid go to school without a mask?

Yes.

[JoJo]

And... Florida has had over 28,000 positive cases each of the last two days, a 20% positive rate for those who do get tested, news that there aren't enough testing... holy cow how high can they go? 

[bacchi]

And... Florida has had over 28,000 positive cases each of the last two days, a 20% positive rate for those who do get tested, news that there aren't enough testing... holy cow how high can they go?

Florida population of 21M
- fully vaccinated of ~10M
- children of 4M
= around 7 million possibilities

Answer: It can go a lot higher.

[OtherJen]

Perhaps we should add South Dakota to the WTF list: Official: Sturgis Motorcycle Rally is the busiest in years (AP News)

STURGIS, S.D. (AP) — Law enforcement officials say the first few days of this year’s Sturgis Motorcycle Rally have been among the busiest they’ve seen.

Some 700,000 people were expected to celebrate their enthusiasm for motorcycles at the 10-day event that kicked off Friday in the western South Dakota city.

They’ve learned nothing from last year (perhaps not surprising, given how far in the Q-cult their governor lives): CDC: 2020 Sturgis Motorcycle Rally led to 'widespread transmission' of COVID-19 (KARE 11)

[ixtap]

Perhaps we should add South Dakota to the WTF list: Official: Sturgis Motorcycle Rally is the busiest in years (AP News)

STURGIS, S.D. (AP) — Law enforcement officials say the first few days of this year’s Sturgis Motorcycle Rally have been among the busiest they’ve seen.

Some 700,000 people were expected to celebrate their enthusiasm for motorcycles at the 10-day event that kicked off Friday in the western South Dakota city.

They’ve learned nothing from last year (perhaps not surprising, given how far in the Q-cult their governor lives): CDC: 2020 Sturgis Motorcycle Rally led to 'widespread transmission' of COVID-19 (KARE 11)

Yeah, at this point, Sturgis is 0% about motorcycles and 100% about being a "rebel" who doesn't care how many people die for your cause.

[DarkandStormy]

Can't decide who is winning the Darwin games this season...Abbott (Texas gov) or DeSantis (FL gov).

[ncornilsen]

Can't decide who is winning the Darwin games this season...Abbott (Texas gov) or DeSantis (FL gov).

They'll only win if Cuomo's all time record and subsequent coverup is considered last season...

[Kris]

Can't decide who is winning the Darwin games this season...Abbott (Texas gov) or DeSantis (FL gov).

They'll only win if Cuomo's all time record and subsequent coverup is considered last season...

Well, Cuomo just resigned, so… looks like it’s still between Abbott and DeSantis.

[ncornilsen]

Oh, I hadn't seen that!

[Fishindude]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

[dougules]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

That's not necessarily true.  I only tangentially follow the news about COVID.  I personally look at the numbers on the worldometer site.  Just numbers.  No sensationalism. 

Me and most people I know that haven't gotten COVID haven't gotten very sick.  But I lost my therapist to it, and a close friend (only early 40s) was hospitalized for 5 days with it.   My mom didn't end up in the hospital, but was close.  It's not a doomsday virus, and most people don't get that sick.  But the severity really is all over the place, and losing a few people still has a pretty big impact. 

It's not like anybody is being asked to quarantine any more.  Wearing a mask and getting vaccinated aren't really big sacrifices. 

Hospitals being slammed full lags the wave of people getting sick.  Just because you're not seeing it now doesn't mean you won't. 

And while you're right that the media has a lot of bias and sensationalism, vilifying the media is a really good way to corral people into an information bubble where you can manipulate them. 

[jrhampt]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

Most people I've known with COVID have recovered (as we would expect from the stats), but I do know of several deaths in my circle over the past year and a half (not including the 20 lost over a two week period at my FIL's nursing home last spring), and one friend's unvaccinated BIL has been on ECMO for the past week with COVID pneumonia in both lungs and cardiac failure, so this is not over yet.  I've also got family and friends in medical fields, and one in particular in Louisiana is seeing large patient numbers right now.  The "media" is getting its numbers from sources like Johns Hopkins, which is a credible source, and I go directly to Johns Hopkins or worldometers.  People can believe what they want to believe, of course, but that's going to be irrelevant if they get unlucky with COVID.

[ncornilsen]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

Personally, quarantining, daycare shutdowns, employees being quarantined, etc have all had a far greater impact on me than the disease itself. I got lucky and got the vaccine before I got the bug, so I'm glad of that.

And while dying is obviously a horrible thing and 600,000 people have had that outcome, it's probably not the worse thing about covid at the moment. It seems that all of the savable people needing intervention are swamping our healthcare system, which is going to cause deaths from other things that could be prevented, burnout of staff, etc.

I'm not panicking or advocating a lockdown. I don't have to, because I got the vaccine, And you should to, barring some of the situations where you're likely to have an adverse reaction... in which case its more important that everyone who can get it, gets it.

[DarkandStormy]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

LOL

Anecdotes aren't data.

The media is reporting data, which is compiled by our hospitals and health care system.  So you can try to blame the big bad media all you want, but they aren't compiling the data or stats.

My friend just got offered (and took) a $7,200/week job to go work in Florida (as a nurse) because they're overrun.  See how I can take any anecdote and try to pass it off as fact?  (The story is true, btw)

[MrGreen]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

Consider yourself quite lucky! I suspect you are in the overwhelming minority at this point. I've had dead and almost dead family and friends with blood clots and heavy bleeding during childbirth. It's pretty ugly out there. Avoiding death definitely isn't the measure of success.

[Abe]

The problem with the stats is they're not credible due to the people who are reporting them, but your anecdotes are more credible? Ok.

[OtherJen]

The problem with the stats is they're not credible due to the people who are reporting them, but your anecdotes are more credible? Ok.

Yeah, that post was an example of some seriously faulty logic.

As long as we're sharing anecdotes, I knew two people who died of COVID (pre-Delta) and several who have been sick enough with it that their day-to-day lives and health are affected even after weeks or months.

[Kris]

The problem with the stats is they're not credible due to the people who are reporting them, but your anecdotes are more credible? Ok.

Yeah, that post was an example of some seriously faulty logic.

As long as we're sharing anecdotes, I knew two people who died of COVID (pre-Delta) and several who have been sick enough with it that their day-to-day lives and health are affected even after weeks or months.

It is so depressing that there are still so many people whose critical thinking skills are so bad. Especially on this forum.

[blue_green_sparks]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

Consider yourself quite lucky! I suspect you are in the overwhelming minority at this point. I've had dead and almost dead family and friends with blood clots and heavy bleeding during childbirth. It's pretty ugly out there. Avoiding death definitely isn't the measure of success.

Yep, same here. Have a friend in the ICU for weeks with blood clots and low O2. Worried about the effects of the 'experimental' vaccines. Now scared of dying. Hmmm, 4.5 billion experimental shots given so far..

[dougules]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility.   A large percentage of society has totally checked out from listening to or believing the media due to so many contradicting opinions and obvious B.S. being spouted non stop.

Personally, I've seen very little ill effects from Covid, the few I've known that tested positive had zero symptoms, or only flu like symptoms for a couple days, nobody close has been hospitalized, and I'm unaware anyone that died from it.   I've got family and friends in medical fields , and our hospitals aren't slammed full.   Lot's of doom and gloom in our local news, but many of us just are not seeing the need to panic and lock down.   

Consider yourself quite lucky! I suspect you are in the overwhelming minority at this point. I've had dead and almost dead family and friends with blood clots and heavy bleeding during childbirth. It's pretty ugly out there. Avoiding death definitely isn't the measure of success.

Yep, same here. Have a friend in the ICU for weeks with blood clots and low O2. Worried about the effects of the 'experimental' vaccines. Now scared of dying. Hmmm, 4.5 billion experimental shots given so far..

It's exasperating to hear people talking about their concerns and fears about the "experimental" vaccines without even stopping to compare it to a virus that we know less about.  Any time anyone says anything about the vaccine, the next sentence needs to be about COVID. 

[Zamboni]

@Fishindude, sometimes I think you are a troll. But then I think about my co-worker in the office next to me. Very country Southern guy, smart, tough, etc. early 40's. His brother died of the virus this spring. His sister and brother-and-law got it too . . . gave it to his elderly mom, then she got very sick and spent a month in the hospital and another month in a rehab facility. She likely only survived bc my co-worker took it all very seriously and rushed to get her care when everyone else in her family was gas lighting her, telling her she'd be fine, they'd pray for her, etc. And this is after her son DIED!

And now he's telling me that BIL told him he still thinks it's a hoax, won't get vaxxed, doesn't need any shots to bc he had it, etc. They won't help with his Mom, although maybe that is a good thing at this point? I mean it's all just beyond stupid. How can one maintain that level of ignorance in the face of family tragedy that could have been prevented?

One of my student's Dads died this past fall. 18 yo kid, lost his Dad. I don't think the media is a problem at all. In fact, here's a vid for you:
https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000007578176/covid-icu-nurses-arizona.html?smid=tw-share

Peace.

[wenchsenior]

The problem with the stats is they're not credible due to the people who are reporting them, but your anecdotes are more credible? Ok.

Yeah, that post was an example of some seriously faulty logic.

As long as we're sharing anecdotes, I knew two people who died of COVID (pre-Delta) and several who have been sick enough with it that their day-to-day lives and health are affected even after weeks or months.

It is so depressing that there are still so many people whose critical thinking skills are so bad. Especially on this forum.

Yup.  On a forum predicated on analyzing actual data to keep our lizard brains from making faulty assumptions about financial risk, we still get posts like this. WTF.

[blue_green_sparks]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

[OtherJen]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

One would hope, but even on these forums multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die.

[HPstache]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

One would hope, but even on these forums multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die.

Could you provide data on the Delta variant that shows there is a drastic difference for kids vs. the earlier variants?  This is what I found at first glance:

"The tracking numbers show that the rate of pediatric COVID-19 hospitalizations is about the same as it has been for earlier variants, varying between 0.1% and 1.9% depending on the state.  "While we are seeing an increase in overall cases, our hospitalization rate for COVID has remained the same," Green said.  The AAP agrees, saying that "at this time, it appears that severe illness due to COVID-19 is uncommon among children."  Some doctors seeing more severe COVID in children as cases rise.  But one front-line doctor disagrees, suspecting that Delta is indeed harder on kids although there's currently no hard numbers to prove it."

"Hysmith thinks "there's something about Delta that's a little different, in that we are seeing more severe disease."  Other experts aren't so sure, instead wondering if the sheer number of new cases caused by the Delta variant has simply led to a misperception of that strain's severity.  "I think the jury's still out. There's not enough data at this point to say for sure if it's going to be more severe," said Dr. Kristin Oliver, an assistant professor of pediatrics with the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, in New York City."

So are there hard numbers to prove it?

[Roots&Wings]

Temporary restraining orders in Texas for the school mask mandates, hopefully Florida judges will follow soon:

On Monday, Dallas County Judge Clay Jenkins asked a court for a temporary restraining order against the order, saying the governor "attempted to prohibit local elected officials from making a different decision, in response to local conditions, to protect their own communities."

FL and TX gov's can share the gold for Darwin Awards. FL and TX have highest pediatric hospitalization rate and total numbers: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/florida-sees-highest-rate-of-children-hospitalized-with-covid-in-us/

While the data shows that Florida is reporting the highest rate of children hospitalized with COVID-19, the federal government's hospital capacity data shows that Texas is seeing the highest total number of children hospitalized with the virus.

As of August 11, healthdata.gov showed that Texas had 259 total pediatric patients hospitalized with COVID-19, the most in the U.S., while Florida followed with 194.

While speaking with the Miami Herald this week, Dr. Ronald Ford, chief medical officer for the Joe DiMaggio Children's Hospital in Hollywood, said: "The rate of rise has been really more than what we in the children's hospital have seen at any point in time in this pandemic....That to me is concerning."

"In our previous iteration of the pandemic, it was more they're positive but they're not sick or minimally sick," Ford told the Herald. "This is different....There's a much higher percentage of pediatric patients becoming infected and symptomatic."

[blue_green_sparks]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

One would hope, but even on these forums multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die.

Could you provide data on the Delta variant that shows there is a drastic difference for kids vs. the earlier variants?  This is what I found at first glance:

"The tracking numbers show that the rate of pediatric COVID-19 hospitalizations is about the same as it has been for earlier variants, varying between 0.1% and 1.9% depending on the state.  "While we are seeing an increase in overall cases, our hospitalization rate for COVID has remained the same," Green said.  The AAP agrees, saying that "at this time, it appears that severe illness due to COVID-19 is uncommon among children."  Some doctors seeing more severe COVID in children as cases rise.  But one front-line doctor disagrees, suspecting that Delta is indeed harder on kids although there's currently no hard numbers to prove it."

"Hysmith thinks "there's something about Delta that's a little different, in that we are seeing more severe disease."  Other experts aren't so sure, instead wondering if the sheer number of new cases caused by the Delta variant has simply led to a misperception of that strain's severity.  "I think the jury's still out. There's not enough data at this point to say for sure if it's going to be more severe," said Dr. Kristin Oliver, an assistant professor of pediatrics with the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, in New York City."

So are there hard numbers to prove it?

I think so, Yes, per the CDC. You can easily see the top three colors (younger people) growing proportionally larger starting back in Jan. Now that schools are in attendance again...I would think in about a month or two we will know for certain if this is headed in a bad direction the youngsters.
https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/COVIDNet/COVID19_5.html

[OtherJen]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

One would hope, but even on these forums multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die.

Could you provide data on the Delta variant that shows there is a drastic difference for kids vs. the earlier variants?  This is what I found at first glance:

"The tracking numbers show that the rate of pediatric COVID-19 hospitalizations is about the same as it has been for earlier variants, varying between 0.1% and 1.9% depending on the state.  "While we are seeing an increase in overall cases, our hospitalization rate for COVID has remained the same," Green said.  The AAP agrees, saying that "at this time, it appears that severe illness due to COVID-19 is uncommon among children."  Some doctors seeing more severe COVID in children as cases rise.  But one front-line doctor disagrees, suspecting that Delta is indeed harder on kids although there's currently no hard numbers to prove it."

"Hysmith thinks "there's something about Delta that's a little different, in that we are seeing more severe disease."  Other experts aren't so sure, instead wondering if the sheer number of new cases caused by the Delta variant has simply led to a misperception of that strain's severity.  "I think the jury's still out. There's not enough data at this point to say for sure if it's going to be more severe," said Dr. Kristin Oliver, an assistant professor of pediatrics with the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, in New York City."

So are there hard numbers to prove it?

Not yet. That's my entire point. It seems a bit silly to make future projections about pediatric safety using data collected on a less infectious and possibly less virulent strain of the virus. We're still learning how Delta acts in fully vaccinated adults.

[JGS1980]

I would add that there is a proportionally higher ratio of pediatric admissions because 0% of those 12 and under have been vaccinated in the US, whereas 80% of those 65 and over have been vaccinated.

OF COURSE, there will be a proportional number of pediatric admissions.  What's more important are the outcomes of those hospital admissions, and that will come out over time.

[HPstache]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

One would hope, but even on these forums multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die.

Could you provide data on the Delta variant that shows there is a drastic difference for kids vs. the earlier variants?  This is what I found at first glance:

"The tracking numbers show that the rate of pediatric COVID-19 hospitalizations is about the same as it has been for earlier variants, varying between 0.1% and 1.9% depending on the state.  "While we are seeing an increase in overall cases, our hospitalization rate for COVID has remained the same," Green said.  The AAP agrees, saying that "at this time, it appears that severe illness due to COVID-19 is uncommon among children."  Some doctors seeing more severe COVID in children as cases rise.  But one front-line doctor disagrees, suspecting that Delta is indeed harder on kids although there's currently no hard numbers to prove it."

"Hysmith thinks "there's something about Delta that's a little different, in that we are seeing more severe disease."  Other experts aren't so sure, instead wondering if the sheer number of new cases caused by the Delta variant has simply led to a misperception of that strain's severity.  "I think the jury's still out. There's not enough data at this point to say for sure if it's going to be more severe," said Dr. Kristin Oliver, an assistant professor of pediatrics with the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, in New York City."

So are there hard numbers to prove it?

Not yet. That's my entire point. It seems a bit silly to make future projections about pediatric safety using data collected on a less infectious and possibly less virulent strain of the virus. We're still learning how Delta acts in fully vaccinated adults.

I interpreted your post as criticizing parents who are making their decisions for their kids based on data from the earlier variants... did I read you correctly?  If so, and you don't have data to back up your criticisms, you are the one spreading incorrect emotion-based opinions... not the "multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die".  And to be clear, I am interpeting "almost never get sick with Covid and never die" as a percentage statement.

[OtherJen]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

One would hope, but even on these forums multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die.

Could you provide data on the Delta variant that shows there is a drastic difference for kids vs. the earlier variants?  This is what I found at first glance:

"The tracking numbers show that the rate of pediatric COVID-19 hospitalizations is about the same as it has been for earlier variants, varying between 0.1% and 1.9% depending on the state.  "While we are seeing an increase in overall cases, our hospitalization rate for COVID has remained the same," Green said.  The AAP agrees, saying that "at this time, it appears that severe illness due to COVID-19 is uncommon among children."  Some doctors seeing more severe COVID in children as cases rise.  But one front-line doctor disagrees, suspecting that Delta is indeed harder on kids although there's currently no hard numbers to prove it."

"Hysmith thinks "there's something about Delta that's a little different, in that we are seeing more severe disease."  Other experts aren't so sure, instead wondering if the sheer number of new cases caused by the Delta variant has simply led to a misperception of that strain's severity.  "I think the jury's still out. There's not enough data at this point to say for sure if it's going to be more severe," said Dr. Kristin Oliver, an assistant professor of pediatrics with the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, in New York City."

So are there hard numbers to prove it?

Not yet. That's my entire point. It seems a bit silly to make future projections about pediatric safety using data collected on a less infectious and possibly less virulent strain of the virus. We're still learning how Delta acts in fully vaccinated adults.

I interpreted your post as criticizing parents who are making their decisions for their kids based on data from the earlier variants... did I read you correctly?  If so, and you don't have data to back up your criticisms, you are the one spreading incorrect emotion-based opinions... not the "multiple posters are presenting pre-Delta variant data to claim that kids almost never get sick with COVID and never die".  And to be clear, I am interpeting "almost never get sick with Covid and never die" as a percentage statement.

Not emotional. Pointing out the facts that so far, Delta seems to behave differently in terms of transmissibility and virulence, and therefore it is premature to claim that its effects on kids will be identical to those of earlier variants. I actually hope the effects are similarly mild. I have a niece and nephew scheduled to go back to elementary school later this month. My friend's 7-year-old became very ill last month from a bout of Delta variant (outbreak at her day camp), and I sincerely hope that she has no long-term side effects.

[dougules]

Fishindude, sometimes I think you are a troll. But then I think about my co-worker in the office next to me. Very country Southern guy, smart, tough, etc. early 40's. His brother died of the virus this spring. His sister and brother-and-law got it too . . . gave it to his elderly mom, then she got very sick and spent a month in the hospital and another month in a rehab facility. She likely only survived bc my co-worker took it all very seriously and rushed to get her care when everyone else in her family was gas lighting her, telling her she'd be fine, they'd pray for her, etc. And this is after her son DIED!

And now he's telling me that BIL told him he still thinks it's a hoax, won't get vaxxed, doesn't need any shots to bc he had it, etc. They won't help with his Mom, although maybe that is a good thing at this point? I mean it's all just beyond stupid. How can one maintain that level of ignorance in the face of family tragedy that could have been prevented?

One of my student's Dads died this past fall. 18 yo kid, lost his Dad. I don't think the media is a problem at all. In fact, here's a vid for you:
https://www.nytimes.com/video/opinion/100000007578176/covid-icu-nurses-arizona.html?smid=tw-share

Peace.

Never underestimate the level of obstinance and contrariness Southerners are capable of. 

[GodlessCommie]

The problem with all of these illness stats, death stats, etc. is we are all getting it from the news and media which has lost most of it's credibility. 

Just another reminder that anti-vax is a package deal.

[PDXTabs]

I would add that there is a proportionally higher ratio of pediatric admissions because 0% of those 12 and under have been vaccinated in the US, whereas 80% of those 65 and over have been vaccinated.

OF COURSE, there will be a proportional number of pediatric admissions.  What's more important are the outcomes of those hospital admissions, and that will come out over time.

Indeed, also it's 90% if you trust the Biden White House: https://twitter.com/whitehouse/status/1412579239765975041

[Sandi_k]

Now that it seems more kids and young people are getting seriously ill, perhaps people will become motivated to get the jab. Not really sure. In my jaded opinion, old folks are often out of sight, out of mind in the youth-oriented United States. When I was younger an older guy once told me "just wait till you get old, you become invisible", LOL. I have even read more than one social media post to the effect "who cares about this virus, the only ones dying are like 70 years old."

My 17 year old niece posted exactly that last year. Now her mom is saying that Covid deaths only happen to those who are obese, so why should she and her family have to get vaccinated just to travel or eat out at a venue that is requiring proof of vaccination?

1) My obesity won't kill you.
2) Obese people and elderly people are still Americans. And just like you don't have the right to yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater, others have the right not to be killed by your stupidity.

Gah.

[HPstache]

2) Obese people and elderly people are still Americans. And just like you don't have the right to yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater, others have the right not to be killed by your stupidity.

Others (obese and elderly) have the option to protect fully themselves with properly fitting P95/N95 or even 100% efficiency masks/respirators regardless of what the "stupidity" around them decides to do.

[PDXTabs]

2) Obese people and elderly people are still Americans. And just like you don't have the right to yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater, others have the right not to be killed by your stupidity.

Others (obese and elderly) have the option to protect fully themselves with properly fitting P95/N95 or even 100% efficiency masks/respirators regardless of what the "stupidity" around them decides to do.

I agree (mostly, I know a guy with no arms - mask guidelines say that he shouldn't wear one if he can't get it off in an emergency), but I also agree that they might deserve to have some of the hospital supply reserved for non-COVID related illness.

[Sandi_k]

2) Obese people and elderly people are still Americans. And just like you don't have the right to yell "FIRE" in a crowded theater, others have the right not to be killed by your stupidity.

Others (obese and elderly) have the option to protect fully themselves with properly fitting P95/N95 or even 100% efficiency masks/respirators regardless of what the "stupidity" around them decides to do.

Of course masking is happening. It's still not 100% - so no, they cannot "protect themselves fully".