Do You Adhere to a Paleo Diet?

[use2betrix]

See this wikipedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study

The China Study is " ... based on the China-Cornell-Oxford Project, a 20-year study – described by The New York Times as "the Grand Prix of epidemiology" – conducted by the Chinese Academy of Preventive Medicine, Cornell University and the University of Oxford."

This study included participants from 65 rural counties in China, each of which had followed basically the same diet for their whole life and each of which consumed varying levels of animal protein.  Blood cholesterol levels were closely correlated with consumption of animal protein, and to the development of Western diseases such as " ... coronary heart disease, diabetes, leukemia, and cancers of the colon, lung, breast, brain, stomach and liver".  The higher the level of animal protein consumed, the higher the level of disease.

And leave it to a paleo thread to bring the vegetarians/vegans out of the woodwork.

[andy85]

See this wikipedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study

The China Study is " ... based on the China-Cornell-Oxford Project, a 20-year study – described by The New York Times as "the Grand Prix of epidemiology" – conducted by the Chinese Academy of Preventive Medicine, Cornell University and the University of Oxford."

This study included participants from 65 rural counties in China, each of which had followed basically the same diet for their whole life and each of which consumed varying levels of animal protein.  Blood cholesterol levels were closely correlated with consumption of animal protein, and to the development of Western diseases such as " ... coronary heart disease, diabetes, leukemia, and cancers of the colon, lung, breast, brain, stomach and liver".  The higher the level of animal protein consumed, the higher the level of disease.

And leave it to a paleo thread to bring the vegetarians/vegans out of the woodwork.

and here is a great China Study rebuttal for anybody interested

http://rawfoodsos.com/the-china-study/

the long version
http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/08/06/final-china-study-response-html/#con

[Bucksandreds]

See this wikipedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study

The China Study is " ... based on the China-Cornell-Oxford Project, a 20-year study – described by The New York Times as "the Grand Prix of epidemiology" – conducted by the Chinese Academy of Preventive Medicine, Cornell University and the University of Oxford."

This study included participants from 65 rural counties in China, each of which had followed basically the same diet for their whole life and each of which consumed varying levels of animal protein.  Blood cholesterol levels were closely correlated with consumption of animal protein, and to the development of Western diseases such as " ... coronary heart disease, diabetes, leukemia, and cancers of the colon, lung, breast, brain, stomach and liver".  The higher the level of animal protein consumed, the higher the level of disease.

And leave it to a paleo thread to bring the vegetarians/vegans out of the woodwork.

and here is a great China Study rebuttal for anybody interested

http://rawfoodsos.com/the-china-study/

the long version
http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/08/06/final-china-study-response-html/#con

The China Study is one extreme and Atkins is the other.  Paleo is way too close to Atkins to be ideal.   

[Astro Camper]

This was on the BBC news today. Little islands where everyone is obese and diabetic because they started to eat meat like the western countries.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35346493

Rice makes you fat, it's a fact.

[mm1970]

In terms of lbs on the scale it makes zero difference what you eat. 1000 calories of chicken and rice is the same as 1000 calories of ice cream in that regard.

You have to consider the effect of chicken and rice on blood sugar and insulin.  It does, in fact, make a difference.

I've been experimenting a lot the last couple of years in  my attempt to lose the baby weight.  I'm more of a middle of the road eater. 

When I was pregnant with my first child, we were mostly vegetarian - would only cook/ eat meat a couple of times a month.  I ate similarly a few years later while training for a half marathon.

As I got older, I realized that I couldn't handle carbs quite like that anymore.

I kind of like Dr. Mark Hyman's "Paleo-Vegan" suggestion, or Jules from Stonesoup's version of paleo (she eats beans and cheese). 

For weight control, I need to limit carbs.  But they can't be zero or I get a brain fog.

For the planet and health, I do worry about the amount of meat that is eaten in a paleo diet.

I'm still experimenting. 

November 2014, I gave up wheat, sugar, alcohol for a month and dropped 7 lbs, caloric intake not changing (the 3 prior months was 2 lbs a month).
November 2015, I decided to do it again.  I lost 6 lbs before the whole family got the stomach flu.

However, in November 2015 I was experimenting with a beachbody program the "Ultimate Reset", which starts healthy and ends vegan by the end of the first week.  It's 21 days.

I found that it also worked for me - especially when I had PMS and was craving carbs.  Permission to have oatmeal for breakfast and beans and rice for dinner?  Yes please.

Still trying to find that right balance of what will work for me long term.  I'm not interested in giving up any one food group.

[Philociraptor]

This was on the BBC news today. Little islands where everyone is obese and diabetic because they started to eat meat like the western countries.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35346493

Rice makes you fat, it's a fact.

That's a massive misrepresentation of the article.

If by 'meat' you mean mutton flaps (which are similar to bacon) and fatty canned meat (like spam), then yes, 'meat' is the problem. No mention of chicken or leaner cuts of pork or beef (aka what is recommended on a Paleo diet). They import only the worst kinds of meat and gain weight, shocker.

"And then there are fizzy drinks." "We used to watch American movies and TV shows and everyone was drinking soda. We sat there and thought, 'Wow, I would love to drink soda and we're poor because we're drinking water.' But now everyone's drinking water and we are drinking soda!" - sounds like a recipe for obesity and diabetes to me.

Then there's this gem:
But there's no question the role that society plays here. "The bigger you are, that's beauty," says Drew Havea, chair of the civil Society Forum of Tonga. Size and status in Tonga have often gone together. The Tongan King Tupou IV, who died in 2006, holds the Guinness record for being the heaviest-ever monarch - 200kg (33 stone, or 440lbs). Being thin would traditionally have indicated a position lower in the social pecking order.

[andy85]

This was on the BBC news today. Little islands where everyone is obese and diabetic because they started to eat meat like the western countries.

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35346493

Rice makes you fat, it's a fact.

That's a massive misrepresentation of the article.

If by 'meat' you mean mutton flaps (which are similar to bacon) and fatty canned meat (like spam), then yes, 'meat' is the problem. No mention of chicken or leaner cuts of pork or beef (aka what is recommended on a Paleo diet). They import only the worst kinds of meat and gain weight, shocker.

"And then there are fizzy drinks." "We used to watch American movies and TV shows and everyone was drinking soda. We sat there and thought, 'Wow, I would love to drink soda and we're poor because we're drinking water.' But now everyone's drinking water and we are drinking soda!" - sounds like a recipe for obesity and diabetes to me.

Then there's this gem:
But there's no question the role that society plays here. "The bigger you are, that's beauty," says Drew Havea, chair of the civil Society Forum of Tonga. Size and status in Tonga have often gone together. The Tongan King Tupou IV, who died in 2006, holds the Guinness record for being the heaviest-ever monarch - 200kg (33 stone, or 440lbs). Being thin would traditionally have indicated a position lower in the social pecking order.

agreed...dont forget this as well

"Some scientists believe Tonga's problem is partly down to genetics - that Pacific islanders in the past had to survive long periods without food so their bodies are programmed to cling on to fats."

pretty sure anybody would gain weight going from eating fish to 1kg of mutton flaps in 1 sitting...especially with a society that puts a premium on being heavy and with a genetic predisposition to 'clinging onto fat'.

[acanthurus]

I've been eating nothing but protein, fat, and leafy green vegetables for almost four months now. I've lost 36lbs as of today, and my bloodwork last week was spot on perfect (I can go find numbers if you guys want, but HDL, LDL, all that jazz was in the desired ranges). It's also controlled my diabetes like no other diet has.

Haters gonna hate, and that's fine. More people should be vegan so my steak dinners don't cost so much.

[esq]

I am eating generic low carb to control T2 diabetes. Four months ago I weighed 300lbs, with an A1C of 11.0, and my lipid panel was so terrible I can't even remember the numbers (everything was out of whack).

I got blood work back last week. HDL, LDL, total cholesterol, triglycerides were all in their desired range and A1C was fantastic. Specifically my A1C went from 11.0 to 5.8, and I also managed to lose 35 lbs. The weight loss is continuing and my guess is that in 6 months my A1C will settle out around 5.5 and I should lost at least another 30lbs (started at 300, now 265, hoping for 235 by summer and 200 by end of year).

Congratulations on your new found health.  My blood panel also benefited greatly from LC.  I was pre-diabetic, which is a nice word for Stage 1 diabetes.  I also lost 30 lbs and my stenosing tenosynovitis is 95% cured, despite the fact the doctor told me I was headed towards diabetes and carpal tunnel.  Makes me wonder what the "LC is nothing but a placebo effect" crowd has to say about all this?

A few more thoughts: 

1.  Was talking the other day to some friends about the fact that for decades, children with epilepsy have been put on a high fat diet, which helps eliminate seizures.  The mechanism has something to do with dietary fat helping protect the fatty myelin sheathing around cranial nerves.  There is now research being conducted into the brain protective effect of a LCHF diet as associated with dementia and Alzheimer's.

2.  "On May 8, 2015 the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics (formerly the American Dietetic Association) made its official comments on the 2015 Dietary Guidelines for Americans, and recommend dropping saturated fat from nutrients of concern due to the lack of evidence connecting it with cardiovascular disease."  Read the rest here:  http://fitteru.us/2015/05/earth-shattering-pigs-flying-hell-freezing-nutrition-news/

[big_slacker]

ct of a LCHF diet as associated with dementia and Alzheimer's.

2.  "On May 8, 2015 the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics (formerly the American Dietetic Association) made its official comments on the 2015 Dietary Guidelines for Americans, and recommend dropping saturated fat from nutrients of concern due to the lack of evidence connecting it with cardiovascular disease."  Read the rest here:  http://fitteru.us/2015/05/earth-shattering-pigs-flying-hell-freezing-nutrition-news/

The same group that was taking sponsorship money from Coke, Mars candy, the cattleman's association and other food companies and was shamed away when they got outed for planning to put their seal on Kraft cheeselike products as part of a kids healthy eating campaign?

I'm not arguing against paleo but that group is pretty suspect.

[letired]

I have no experience with it myself, but my friend who was pre-diabetic and also suffered from autoimmune issues had great success with the Whals Protocol. It's pretty similar to many other low-carb diets with a focus on including a variety of nutrient-dense veggies. I believe there is a book you can buy, but probably a ton of info online.

I can say that my friend did lose weight (was also exercising), and saw dramatic improvement in their bloodwork and overall wellbeing.

[totoro]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I don't think anyone can dismiss the science for any particular diet that has shown health benefits long-term for people without reading the scientific studies and then taking a diy approach for what works for them. 

What I have noticed is that people have a lot of very set beliefs that may or may not be true.  Meat is good, Med diet is good, Okinawa diet is best, carbs are bad, dairy is horrible, vegans are not healthy, eat anything if it is whole foods, eat anything in moderation.  I don't think anyone has exactly the magic bullet answer and we've seen how medical advice has changed over time.

I thought this site had some interesting information and Dr. Eade takes a scientific and balanced approach to reviewing current diet approaches such as Paleo/Atkings/South Beach/Ketogenic: http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/about-dr-ede/

I particularly like the analytical approach she takes to the existing studies on diet.

Currently we are eating a keto diet.  We'll try low carb paleo-ish next.  Neither of us have known sensitivities to anything, but increasing energy and longevity plus keeping to a recommended weight and body fat % seem like good goals.  I'm pretty convinced that reducing sugar, alcohol and refined foods has been helpful for us - as has meal planning and prep on Sundays.  Keto works a charm for rapid fat loss.  We'll see if Paleo is good for energy. 

[steveo]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

[andy85]

Death by Food Pyramid - A pretty good book that goes over the politics and history on how the current food pyramid originated.

Also recently found Dr. Perlmutte...neurologist who advocates for a high fat diet.

But even before the paleo/primal fad came onto the scene i always found the traditional food pyramid completely upside down. Diabetes is skyrocketing in the US. The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes. Am I the only one who finds this crazy? I'm not saying this holds true for all people, but logically, how could have this not have been the outcome with a carb based food pyramid? Fat has far less impact on blood glucose levels.

[JoshuaSpodek]

The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes.

Carbohydrates includes dietary fiber, which is healthy.

I'm not defending the pyramid. Only pointing out that carbs does not equal sugar. Carbohydrates includes sugar but also fiber. Sugar equals sugar.

[andy85]

The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes.

Carbohydrates includes dietary fiber, which is healthy.

I'm not defending the pyramid. Only pointing out that carbs does not equal sugar. Carbohydrates includes sugar but also fiber. Sugar equals sugar.

Fair enough...and i understand that.

[big_slacker]

Death by Food Pyramid - A pretty good book that goes over the politics and history on how the current food pyramid originated.

Also recently found Dr. Perlmutte...neurologist who advocates for a high fat diet.

But even before the paleo/primal fad came onto the scene i always found the traditional food pyramid completely upside down. Diabetes is skyrocketing in the US. The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes. Am I the only one who finds this crazy? I'm not saying this holds true for all people, but logically, how could have this not have been the outcome with a carb based food pyramid? Fat has far less impact on blood glucose levels.

Do you think diabetes rates are skyrocketing because people are eating home cooked oatmeal, brown rice and sweet potatoes or is it happening because people eat a bacon double cheeseburger, extra large fries and wash it down with a large coke that has 100+ grams of simple sugar? I think we know that answer to that one.

When we talk about the Standard American Diet and it's rates of obesity and disease it's all about a massive surplus of calories and a massive deficit in nutritional quality. Truthfully Paleo, Atkins, Vegan, Vegetarian, etc. all shouldn't be arguing about which of those ways of eating is 'best' when the elephant in the room is how we've allowed convenience and the profit of food companies to destroy the health of our nation.

[totoro]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

What studies are you relying on for these assertions?  I'd like to read them.  I've read a fair bit that contradicts this information as well. 

[andy85]

Death by Food Pyramid - A pretty good book that goes over the politics and history on how the current food pyramid originated.

Also recently found Dr. Perlmutte...neurologist who advocates for a high fat diet.

But even before the paleo/primal fad came onto the scene i always found the traditional food pyramid completely upside down. Diabetes is skyrocketing in the US. The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes. Am I the only one who finds this crazy? I'm not saying this holds true for all people, but logically, how could have this not have been the outcome with a carb based food pyramid? Fat has far less impact on blood glucose levels.

Do you think diabetes rates are skyrocketing because people are eating home cooked oatmeal, brown rice and sweet potatoes or is it happening because people eat a bacon double cheeseburger, extra large fries and wash it down with a large coke that has 100+ grams of simple sugar? I think we know that answer to that one.

When we talk about the Standard American Diet and it's rates of obesity and disease it's all about a massive surplus of calories and a massive deficit in nutritional quality. Truthfully Paleo, Atkins, Vegan, Vegetarian, etc. all shouldn't be arguing about which of those ways of eating is 'best' when the elephant in the room is how we've allowed convenience and the profit of food companies to destroy the health of our nation.

No, I tend to agree with you. My feelings on the food pyramid are still the same though. I am a believer in a HFLC diet as opposed to the opposite.

I also agree with your other point. Paleo, atkins, vegan, vegetarian...we probably wouldnt be having this convo if convenience foods didnt exist because we'd only be eating meats, veges, fruits, and nuts...all to varying degrees depending on your diet.

all this food talk...could really go for a pizza and beer right now...im starving

[coppertop]

Death by Food Pyramid - A pretty good book that goes over the politics and history on how the current food pyramid originated.

Also recently found Dr. Perlmutte...neurologist who advocates for a high fat diet.

But even before the paleo/primal fad came onto the scene i always found the traditional food pyramid completely upside down. Diabetes is skyrocketing in the US. The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes. Am I the only one who finds this crazy? I'm not saying this holds true for all people, but logically, how could have this not have been the outcome with a carb based food pyramid? Fat has far less impact on blood glucose levels.

Do you think diabetes rates are skyrocketing because people are eating home cooked oatmeal, brown rice and sweet potatoes or is it happening because people eat a bacon double cheeseburger, extra large fries and wash it down with a large coke that has 100+ grams of simple sugar? I think we know that answer to that one.

When we talk about the Standard American Diet and it's rates of obesity and disease it's all about a massive surplus of calories and a massive deficit in nutritional quality. Truthfully Paleo, Atkins, Vegan, Vegetarian, etc. all shouldn't be arguing about which of those ways of eating is 'best' when the elephant in the room is how we've allowed convenience and the profit of food companies to destroy the health of our nation.

[mm1970]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

Citations please?

Not that I'm disagreeing, but I'd like a definition of what "high meat" is, also.

One can be paleo without a "high meat" diet, as you can get plenty of calories from fat.

[mm1970]

Death by Food Pyramid - A pretty good book that goes over the politics and history on how the current food pyramid originated.

Also recently found Dr. Perlmutte...neurologist who advocates for a high fat diet.

But even before the paleo/primal fad came onto the scene i always found the traditional food pyramid completely upside down. Diabetes is skyrocketing in the US. The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes. Am I the only one who finds this crazy? I'm not saying this holds true for all people, but logically, how could have this not have been the outcome with a carb based food pyramid? Fat has far less impact on blood glucose levels.

Do you think diabetes rates are skyrocketing because people are eating home cooked oatmeal, brown rice and sweet potatoes or is it happening because people eat a bacon double cheeseburger, extra large fries and wash it down with a large coke that has 100+ grams of simple sugar? I think we know that answer to that one.

When we talk about the Standard American Diet and it's rates of obesity and disease it's all about a massive surplus of calories and a massive deficit in nutritional quality. Truthfully Paleo, Atkins, Vegan, Vegetarian, etc. all shouldn't be arguing about which of those ways of eating is 'best' when the elephant in the room is how we've allowed convenience and the profit of food companies to destroy the health of our nation.

Well, you also have to factor in exercise too - I know it's mostly diet - but consider that your blood sugar and insulin levels are affected both by diet and exercise - if you "burn it off", so to speak, the carbs you eat (whether they be brown rice or white bread) will have less of an effect on the blood sugar.

One reason why if you compare various "diets" it doesn't tell you the whole story.  Activity matters.

[iamlittlehedgehog]

If I throw my chocolate bar in the bush and have to forage for it, does that make it Paleo?

Sorry. I couldn't help it. Thanks to PCOS induced IR (insulin resistance) I'm always one step away from Diabetes. So low carb is a way of life with me. You should see how my sugar shoots up if I eat pasta or rice (yes, even whole grain).

Breakfast: varies every week, sometimes it will be a Keto muffin, egg fritta, breakfast sausage ball

Lunch: 2 cups of veggies including leafy greans, this is about 90% of my daily carbs.

Snacks: almonds, walnuts, cheese sticks. If I'm feeling decadent I'll make myself prosciutto cover mozzarella sticks for my post-workout snack

Dinner: lean meats (DH doens't like beef or steak too much) and usually a veggie of some sort

Sweets: low carb popsicles, or "fat bombs" sweetened with Stevia. I'm not a big fan of synthetic sugars so I try to only use these is extreme craving emergencies.

[mm1970]

If I throw my chocolate bar in the bush and have to forage for it, does that make it Paleo?

Sorry. I couldn't help it. Thanks to PCOS induced IR (insulin resistance) I'm always one step away from Diabetes. So low carb is a way of life with me. You should see how my sugar shoots up if I eat pasta or rice (yes, even whole grain).

Breakfast: varies every week, sometimes it will be a Keto muffin, egg fritta, breakfast sausage ball

Lunch: 2 cups of veggies including leafy greans, this is about 90% of my daily carbs.

Snacks: almonds, walnuts, cheese sticks. If I'm feeling decadent I'll make myself prosciutto cover mozzarella sticks for my post-workout snack

Dinner: lean meats (DH doens't like beef or steak too much) and usually a veggie of some sort

Sweets: low carb popsicles, or "fat bombs" sweetened with Stevia. I'm not a big fan of synthetic sugars so I try to only use these is extreme craving emergencies.

This is pretty fascinating.  I read a blog of a woman with diabetes.  She did a short-lived period of time of low carb, and had a really hard time with her insulin.  She was used to giving herself a lot more, but needed less, and at different times, when she was low carb.

[steveo]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

What studies are you relying on for these assertions?  I'd like to read them.  I've read a fair bit that contradicts this information as well.

The best site on the web is http://nutritionfacts.org/.

Basically though the evidence is overwhelming when it comes to the best diets to protect against food related diseases. I'd like to see any thing you can find that contradicts what I've stated. Facts should always provide the basis for making these decisions but from what I can see it's a one sided beat down. The facts that are perpetuated by the low carb community (Atkins/Paleo) etc aren't really facts. They are just anecdotal evidence. There will be a study or two stating that what they are doing is correct but it will probably be a massive twist of the actual study or completed by an interest group.

There was a youtube discussion that I watched that was Atkins vs nutritionists and it was hilarious. They asked him why there hasn't been one study to back up his dietary approach and his response was their was no money in it. In reality the money has been on the side of the meat industry.

[steveo]

If I throw my chocolate bar in the bush and have to forage for it, does that make it Paleo?

Sorry. I couldn't help it. Thanks to PCOS induced IR (insulin resistance) I'm always one step away from Diabetes. So low carb is a way of life with me. You should see how my sugar shoots up if I eat pasta or rice (yes, even whole grain).

Breakfast: varies every week, sometimes it will be a Keto muffin, egg fritta, breakfast sausage ball

Lunch: 2 cups of veggies including leafy greans, this is about 90% of my daily carbs.

Snacks: almonds, walnuts, cheese sticks. If I'm feeling decadent I'll make myself prosciutto cover mozzarella sticks for my post-workout snack

Dinner: lean meats (DH doens't like beef or steak too much) and usually a veggie of some sort

Sweets: low carb popsicles, or "fat bombs" sweetened with Stevia. I'm not a big fan of synthetic sugars so I try to only use these is extreme craving emergencies.

This is pretty fascinating.  I read a blog of a woman with diabetes.  She did a short-lived period of time of low carb, and had a really hard time with her insulin.  She was used to giving herself a lot more, but needed less, and at different times, when she was low carb.

Insulin is spiked via eating meat.

[big_slacker]

Death by Food Pyramid - A pretty good book that goes over the politics and history on how the current food pyramid originated.

Also recently found Dr. Perlmutte...neurologist who advocates for a high fat diet.

But even before the paleo/primal fad came onto the scene i always found the traditional food pyramid completely upside down. Diabetes is skyrocketing in the US. The base of the food pyramid is carbs. Carbs = sugar. Sugar = Diabetes. Am I the only one who finds this crazy? I'm not saying this holds true for all people, but logically, how could have this not have been the outcome with a carb based food pyramid? Fat has far less impact on blood glucose levels.

Definitely. You've got dudes like the 30 bananas a day guy that's eating all fruit but biking some insane amount, I'm sure the sugar from the fruit is fueling that activity.

Do you think diabetes rates are skyrocketing because people are eating home cooked oatmeal, brown rice and sweet potatoes or is it happening because people eat a bacon double cheeseburger, extra large fries and wash it down with a large coke that has 100+ grams of simple sugar? I think we know that answer to that one.

When we talk about the Standard American Diet and it's rates of obesity and disease it's all about a massive surplus of calories and a massive deficit in nutritional quality. Truthfully Paleo, Atkins, Vegan, Vegetarian, etc. all shouldn't be arguing about which of those ways of eating is 'best' when the elephant in the room is how we've allowed convenience and the profit of food companies to destroy the health of our nation.

Well, you also have to factor in exercise too - I know it's mostly diet - but consider that your blood sugar and insulin levels are affected both by diet and exercise - if you "burn it off", so to speak, the carbs you eat (whether they be brown rice or white bread) will have less of an effect on the blood sugar.

One reason why if you compare various "diets" it doesn't tell you the whole story.  Activity matters.

[Bucksandreds]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

Spot on. Some people here are confusing losing weight and good bloodwork with being the total indicator of health. Cancer risk doesn't tend to show up in the typical blood work.  Beef and pork consumption as well as processed meats of all kinds are proven to drastically increase your risk of cancer. My source is the World Health Organization study of studies from October 2015. It's proven.

[gt7152b]

Another source is Dr. William Li who gave an awesome TED talk on using diet to prevent angiogenesis which is the formation of new blood vessels. In this case it's what feeds a cancer cell and turns it from something benign into a malignant tumor. Meat was one of the foods he mentioned that promotes angiogenesis. 

https://www.ted.com/talks/william_li?language=en

[totoro]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

What studies are you relying on for these assertions?  I'd like to read them.  I've read a fair bit that contradicts this information as well.

The best site on the web is http://nutritionfacts.org/.

Basically though the evidence is overwhelming when it comes to the best diets to protect against food related diseases. I'd like to see any thing you can find that contradicts what I've stated. Facts should always provide the basis for making these decisions but from what I can see it's a one sided beat down. The facts that are perpetuated by the low carb community (Atkins/Paleo) etc aren't really facts. They are just anecdotal evidence. There will be a study or two stating that what they are doing is correct but it will probably be a massive twist of the actual study or completed by an interest group.

Thanks, I'll read through it.  Here is some of what I've read that supports a paleo diet as being good for disease control and long-term health.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17522610

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407

http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/faq/#meat

[totoro]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

Spot on. Some people here are confusing losing weight and good bloodwork with being the total indicator of health. Cancer risk doesn't tend to show up in the typical blood work.  Beef and pork consumption as well as processed meats of all kinds are proven to drastically increase your risk of cancer. My source is the World Health Organization study of studies from October 2015. It's proven.

And some people here might be posting without actually reading the studies or the information on alternate diets. 

The report from the World Health Organization has concluded that there is clear scientific evidence that eating processed meat causes cancer.  In particular, the WHO specifically mentioned processed pork products such as bacon, sausages and hot dogs. 

I'm not sure how this is now a debate centred around processed meat which is not part of a paleo or keto diet in any event:
http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-paleo-recipes/2/#axzz3xpPHa4yO
http://www.ketogenic-diet-resource.com/low-carb-recipes.html

In fact, a paleo diet can and often is centred around vegetables and other types of protein and fat like nuts, fish, seafood, eggs, cheese, chicken and olive oil.

And as far as "drastically increase the risk of cancer" - that is overblowing it.  The report notes that red meat might be linked to an increase in cancer risk but that the WHO could not rule out other factors being responsible for this.

Also, I looked at the  http://nutritionfacts.org/ site and it is the opinion one doctor who has embraced veganism and completely avoids the research that does not support his position.  In fact, a bunch of other md's have posted a review of his claims here: https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/death-as-a-foodborne-illness-curable-by-veganism/   His diet might be good, but his science is not particularly balanced.

I agree accounting for activity level is important and a lot of the studies do not do this on both sides of any theory.  I don't know the truth of the best diet in the world but it probably can't be separated from stress, activity and genetics.  I think you need to find the best peer-reviewed information you can and then try some stuff out and see how you feel.

Our plan is to spend more for high quality grass-fed meat, fish ourselves, continue to grow stuff and eat it and experiment. 

[Bucksandreds]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

What studies are you relying on for these assertions?  I'd like to read them.  I've read a fair bit that contradicts this information as well.

The best site on the web is http://nutritionfacts.org/.

Basically though the evidence is overwhelming when it comes to the best diets to protect against food related diseases. I'd like to see any thing you can find that contradicts what I've stated. Facts should always provide the basis for making these decisions but from what I can see it's a one sided beat down. The facts that are perpetuated by the low carb community (Atkins/Paleo) etc aren't really facts. They are just anecdotal evidence. There will be a study or two stating that what they are doing is correct but it will probably be a massive twist of the actual study or completed by an interest group.

Thanks, I'll read through it.  Here is some of what I've read that supports a paleo diet as being good for disease control and long-term health.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17522610

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407

http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/faq/#meat

You question the veracity of other studies (ones using real science on a large scale) yet include links that is one Drs opinion (third link) and another (first link) that talks about how limited it is.  None of these links you posted address increased cancer risk.

[boarder42]

i've been doing 4 hour body on and off for almost 4 years now.  The "off" is when i travel for work and am notpaying for my beer or meals.  its quite similar to paleo but you're not allowed fruit, but allowed beans.  it makes feeling full much easier b/c of all the beans.  you can make chili's etc. on 4 hour body slow carb.  i drop on avg 5 lbs per week on it and i only add back in cheese once i get to my ideal weight.  i even have recipes for a garbanzo bean pizza crust/chips/ whatever you want to use it for thats really good.  i think paleo and 4 hour and primal or whatever you want to do all work very well.  and i have the vital signs to prove it.  all my blood work is off the charts great whenever i'm sticking to one of these cold turkey.

[mm1970]

If I throw my chocolate bar in the bush and have to forage for it, does that make it Paleo?

Sorry. I couldn't help it. Thanks to PCOS induced IR (insulin resistance) I'm always one step away from Diabetes. So low carb is a way of life with me. You should see how my sugar shoots up if I eat pasta or rice (yes, even whole grain).

Breakfast: varies every week, sometimes it will be a Keto muffin, egg fritta, breakfast sausage ball

Lunch: 2 cups of veggies including leafy greans, this is about 90% of my daily carbs.

Snacks: almonds, walnuts, cheese sticks. If I'm feeling decadent I'll make myself prosciutto cover mozzarella sticks for my post-workout snack

Dinner: lean meats (DH doens't like beef or steak too much) and usually a veggie of some sort

Sweets: low carb popsicles, or "fat bombs" sweetened with Stevia. I'm not a big fan of synthetic sugars so I try to only use these is extreme craving emergencies.

This is pretty fascinating.  I read a blog of a woman with diabetes.  She did a short-lived period of time of low carb, and had a really hard time with her insulin.  She was used to giving herself a lot more, but needed less, and at different times, when she was low carb.

Insulin is spiked via eating meat.

That's interesting because her meat intake did not change, she just cut back on carbs. 

So her normal breakfast would be, for example, eggs and carbs.  She would aim for a particular blood sugar level and give herself a certain amount of insulin before her lunch time workout.

When she cut the carbs, her blood sugar was a lot lower when she checked it - so, for example, she'd end up taking less insulin and/or skipping her workout.

[boarder42]

http://www.marksdailyapple.com/insulin-index/#axzz3xu8muxAv

here a thing from mark's daily apple on how Meat affects insulin and at the bottom he addresses that low carb is beneficial even for diabetics.

and a whole article focused on it

http://www.marksdailyapple.com/diabetes/#axzz3xu8muxAv

[SilveradoBojangles]

I think the most interesting thing about this thread is that the people who have seen tremendous benefits from switching to Paleo diets were people who were substantially overweight and had diabetes or other health problems. I imagine they would have seen major improvements with any drastic dietary switch that included more vegetables/lean proteins and less processed foods/sugars, regardless of the underlying philosophy. But maybe the Paleo diet was easier for them to stick with, and thus could be deemed more successful? Do whatever works for you.

For my part, I have no specific dietary philosophy or strict rules, but my diet could best be described as a mediterranean diet. We eat whole grains like farro and barley, we make our own bread, we eat yogurt and occasional cheese, beans, lots of veggies, meat or fish a couple times a week, and very little sugar. It's all about moderation. If we have a big italian meal and over do it on the carbs one day, we'll balance with a big salad or a fritatta the next. We maintain our weights and seem to be healthy, so I see no reason to change.

[boarder42]

I think the most interesting thing about this thread is that the people who have seen tremendous benefits from switching to Paleo diets were people who were substantially overweight and had diabetes or other health problems. I imagine they would have seen major improvements with any drastic dietary switch that included more vegetables/lean proteins and less processed foods/sugars, regardless of the underlying philosophy. But maybe the Paleo diet was easier for them to stick with, and thus could be deemed more successful? Do whatever works for you.

For my part, I have no specific dietary philosophy or strict rules, but my diet could best be described as a mediterranean diet. We eat whole grains like farro and barley, we make our own bread, we eat yogurt and occasional cheese, beans, lots of veggies, meat or fish a couple times a week, and very little sugar. It's all about moderation. If we have a big italian meal and over do it on the carbs one day, we'll balance with a big salad or a fritatta the next. We maintain our weights and seem to be healthy, so I see no reason to change.

you're making a pretty grand assumption.  just b/c the biggest affects are seen in people coming from a very bad scenario doesnt mean the affects dont work on others.  i was a slightly overweight (by BMI) 26 year old male when i found a paleo like diet.  it has still improved my health. 

but the simple fact is when we first walked this earth we werent eating grains and fruits at the current level we consume them and our bodies havent really adjusted to the extra glucose and sedentary lifestyles.

[boarder42]

staggering results are in your body... after only 3 months on this diet ( i was already within all healthy ranges) my body weight had dropped from 215-195 (i'm 6/4)

and my blood work was

HDL's 50
LDL's 88
TRY's 50
Glucose 75

[Philociraptor]

I think the most interesting thing about this thread is that the people who have seen tremendous benefits from switching to Paleo diets were people who were substantially overweight and had diabetes or other health problems.

I'd say the most interesting thing in this thread is how the folks who don't subscribe to a Paleo diet are the most active when the OP initially asked for folks with experience in the diet to give meal advice.

In the spirit of the OP, here's a picture of a pretty typical lunch of mine. Dinner is typically identical, with breakfast consisting of 3 eggs and 2 slices of bacon:

[Bucksandreds]

I think the most interesting thing about this thread is that the people who have seen tremendous benefits from switching to Paleo diets were people who were substantially overweight and had diabetes or other health problems.

I'd say the most interesting thing in this thread is how the folks who don't subscribe to a Paleo diet are the most active when the OP initially asked for folks with experience in the diet to give meal advice.

In the spirit of the OP, here's a picture of a pretty typical lunch of mine. Dinner is typically identical, with breakfast consisting of 3 eggs and 2 slices of bacon:

How would anyone's body respond to eliminating simple sugar?  Paleo is for people who otherwise stretch the definition of refined sugar.  It's better than eating twinkies and drinking pop all day. It's not ideal. The reason why so many people like Atkins or Paleo is because they don't have to think when it comes to carbs.  Examples would be if 100% whole grain bread is good for you but I like the softness of this 'multigrain,' I can just eat the multigrain. If Greek Yogurt is healthy then I don't need to get the plain and add fruit, I can get the one with flavoring (sugar) already added.  Paleo and Atkins give significant weight loss and lab number improvement for the vast majority of Americans.  The VAST VAST majority of Americans aren't going from Mediterranean to Paleo. They're going from disgusting to Paleo.  In that case, Paleo is a gigantic improvement. If you think that bacon is healthier than 100% whole grain toast or Oatmeal for breakfast then I'm not sure were going to agree on much.

[SilveradoBojangles]

but the simple fact is when we first walked this earth we werent eating grains and fruits at the current level we consume them and our bodies havent really adjusted to the extra glucose and sedentary lifestyles.

We seem to have adjusted to the extra glucose just fine, as the dawn of agriculture and the resulting nutritional stability allowed for population expansion, reduced infant mortality, longer life spans, and the creation of civilization as we know it.

Am I saying people should live on processed corn and wheat alone? No. But I don't think grains are poison either unless you have celiac or some other intolerance. And I'm glad you feel healthier on your Paleo diet than on your previous _____ diet. You probably are healthier, and that is great. Though I suspect that pre-paleo it wasn't the case that you were eating super healthy but those pesky apples and whole grains you were consuming were just holding you back.

[totoro]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

What studies are you relying on for these assertions?  I'd like to read them.  I've read a fair bit that contradicts this information as well.

The best site on the web is http://nutritionfacts.org/.

Basically though the evidence is overwhelming when it comes to the best diets to protect against food related diseases. I'd like to see any thing you can find that contradicts what I've stated. Facts should always provide the basis for making these decisions but from what I can see it's a one sided beat down. The facts that are perpetuated by the low carb community (Atkins/Paleo) etc aren't really facts. They are just anecdotal evidence. There will be a study or two stating that what they are doing is correct but it will probably be a massive twist of the actual study or completed by an interest group.

Thanks, I'll read through it.  Here is some of what I've read that supports a paleo diet as being good for disease control and long-term health.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17522610

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407

http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/faq/#meat

You question the veracity of other studies (ones using real science on a large scale) yet include links that is one Drs opinion (third link) and another (first link) that talks about how limited it is.  None of these links you posted address increased cancer risk.

I think it is pretty clear that some of the studies relied upon in the blog link you provided as the best of the "overwhelming evidence" for a "one-sided beat down" that "most good stuff comes from plant stuff" are flawed.

I made no such similar assertion about Paleo being the answer, I only responded to your assertions and statement that the blog had the best proof you know of for your set of beliefs and you'd like me to provide evidence to the contrary.  I find the underlying data in that blog somewhat unreliable as support for the assertions made and I did provide alternative peer reviewed sources, including the links in Dr. Ead's site which I have read and it appears you may not have.

I'm not convinced that "meat" is evil.  I am convinced that processed meat is not good in that it does have a proven higher associated risk of colorectal cancer - not all cancer.  I've seen no similar evidence for other types of meat. There are studies on the Inuit that date back to contact and the rates of cancer are extremely low despite a diet based predominantly on meat and fat.  http://discovermagazine.com/2004/oct/inuit-paradox

And meat is a pretty big category to blacklist on scientific evidence.  There is evidence that fish may lower bowel cancer risk and chicken is recommended as an alternate to too many servings of red meat.  How the meat is cooked is a factor too.

http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/causes-of-cancer/diet-and-cancer/diet-facts-and-evidence
http://www.cancer.ca/en/cancer-information/cancer-101/what-is-a-risk-factor/diet/meat/?region=on

And I'm not here to convince you of anything in particular.  Eat what you want.  The only part that is a bit annoying is when someone professes to have the answer but hasn't actually done the research to back it up.  There is a self-reinforcing bias if you are looking for research that supports your belief.  Get's worse if someone is trying to sell something.  Sorting through it all takes time and even then I don't believe we have a definitive answer overall.  Just what is really bad, and what generally works better for some people and enough evidence that exercise is important and genetics are strongly linked to risk. 

I personally hold the unproven belief that animals that lead happy lives and eat well are better for me to eat, I admit I have not done the research to back this up but I'm okay to act on that for ethical reasons anyway.

[totoro]

I think the most interesting thing about this thread is that the people who have seen tremendous benefits from switching to Paleo diets were people who were substantially overweight and had diabetes or other health problems. I imagine they would have seen major improvements with any drastic dietary switch that included more vegetables/lean proteins and less processed foods/sugars, regardless of the underlying philosophy. But maybe the Paleo diet was easier for them to stick with, and thus could be deemed more successful? Do whatever works for you.

I haven't found this assertion to be supported by evidence, even anectodal.  Of course overweight people with a poor diet are going to experience improvement losing weight and improving their diet.  However, many people who are healthy to start with have also experienced health benefits from Paleo including:

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/18/the-amazing-waist-slimming-wallet-fattening-nutrient/

It might end up being another fad diet with a hidden dark side - who knows - remember when eggs were bad?  It is clear that that it has been useful for many already relatively healthy people.  I don't think the studies are really definitive.

http://authoritynutrition.com/5-studies-on-the-paleo-diet/
https://www.google.ca/search?q=paleo+science&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-CA:IE-Address&ie=&oe=&gfe_rd=cr&ei=wnahVoCmDeWh8weq7q6YDQ

[Bucksandreds]

I've recently become quite interested in nutrition.  I don't know what diet is best but I think it is good to read up and change up your diet and see how you feel. 

I agree but the jury is basically out on this stuff now. The scientific research pretty clearly states that a high meat diet is unhealthy. So are bad carbs. So is bad fat. Good fats and carbs and proteins are good for you.

Most good stuff comes from plant foods. Atkins/Paleo etc are all low carb/high meat diets that put the odds against you with regards to heart disease, cancer and lots of other diseases.

I'm not a vegan or a vegetarian but honestly do the research. It's a one sided beat down when it comes to long term health.

What studies are you relying on for these assertions?  I'd like to read them.  I've read a fair bit that contradicts this information as well.

The best site on the web is http://nutritionfacts.org/.

Basically though the evidence is overwhelming when it comes to the best diets to protect against food related diseases. I'd like to see any thing you can find that contradicts what I've stated. Facts should always provide the basis for making these decisions but from what I can see it's a one sided beat down. The facts that are perpetuated by the low carb community (Atkins/Paleo) etc aren't really facts. They are just anecdotal evidence. There will be a study or two stating that what they are doing is correct but it will probably be a massive twist of the actual study or completed by an interest group.

Thanks, I'll read through it.  Here is some of what I've read that supports a paleo diet as being good for disease control and long-term health.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17522610

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19604407

http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/faq/#meat

You question the veracity of other studies (ones using real science on a large scale) yet include links that is one Drs opinion (third link) and another (first link) that talks about how limited it is.  None of these links you posted address increased cancer risk.

I think it is pretty clear that some of the studies relied upon in the blog link you provided as the best of the "overwhelming evidence" for a "one-sided beat down" that "most good stuff comes from plant stuff" are flawed.

I made no such similar assertion about Paleo being the answer, I only responded to your assertions and statement that the blog had the best proof you know of for your set of beliefs and you'd like me to provide evidence to the contrary.  I find the underlying data in that blog somewhat unreliable as support for the assertions made and I did provide alternative peer reviewed sources, including the links in Dr. Ead's site which I have read and it appears you may not have.

I'm not convinced that "meat" is evil.  I am convinced that processed meat is not good in that it does have a proven higher associated risk of colorectal cancer - not all cancer.  I've seen no similar evidence for other types of meat. There are studies on the Inuit that date back to contact and the rates of cancer are extremely low despite a diet based predominantly on meat and fat.  http://discovermagazine.com/2004/oct/inuit-paradox

And meat is a pretty big category to blacklist on scientific evidence.  There is evidence that fish may lower bowel cancer risk and chicken is recommended as an alternate to too many servings of red meat.  How the meat is cooked is a factor too.

http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/causes-of-cancer/diet-and-cancer/diet-facts-and-evidence
http://www.cancer.ca/en/cancer-information/cancer-101/what-is-a-risk-factor/diet/meat/?region=on

And I'm not here to convince you of anything in particular.  Eat what you want.  The only part that is a bit annoying is when someone professes to have the answer but hasn't actually done the research to back it up.  There is a self-reinforcing bias if you are looking for research that supports your belief.  Get's worse if someone is trying to sell something.  Sorting through it all takes time and even then I don't believe we have a definitive answer overall.  Just what is really bad, and what generally works better for some people and enough evidence that exercise is important and genetics are strongly linked to risk. 

I personally hold the unproven belief that animals that lead happy lives and eat well are better for me to eat, I admit I have not done the research to back this up but I'm okay to act on that for ethical reasons anyway.

You are confusing me with Stevio, my friend.

[totoro]

Sorry.  Not sure how that happened.

[Bucksandreds]

Here is a New York Times article about how scientific evidence suggests starches were consumed by prehistoric man and that the consumption of starches played a large role in the evolution of man.  Much evidence suggests that the Paleo diet was concocted without true evidence of the diet of prehistoric man and just used the fringe diets (think Eskimos with 99% meat diets,etc) of the few hunter gatherer species that remain.  These people didn't win the exolutionary contest and that's why they lived at the margins of earth and were not integrated into the dominant society.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/13/science/for-evolving-brains-a-paleo-diet-full-of-carbs.html?_r=0

[Northwestie]

Paleo - what a crock.  People overthink this stuff, most often because they don't exercise enough.

Been climbing, back country skiing, road/mt biking, and hiking for 40 yrs.  Follow Michael Palin's advice (Omnivore's Dilemma):

Eat food (real food, not processed), not too much, mostly vegetables.

If you push your body you need carbs to perform, simple as that.  Keep the sugar down, moderate alcohol, avoid processed food. And exercise at least 5 days a week.  Cheers

[totoro]

From what I can tell Paleo is as much a "crock" as you decide it to be if you don't do your own research or try it out yourself.  I'd be much more inclined to pay attention to your views if you had tried it first or had credible research on the adverse health impacts.

What you are doing works for you.  Great.  Probably would work for others too.  No reason to change if you are not interested in it.

There is; however, a large body of anectodal evidence that supports low processed, low alcohol, low carb, low sugar, higher vegetable, higher fat and higher protein diets bringing good results for people too - whatever you want to call it.  The only difference between what you've followed and this diet appears to be the take on carbs.

As for the label "Paleo", I don't believe that the reason for the success rate for this diet for many people is because they are eating like cave people.  It likely is partly because it is an improvement on their current diet, but I think the focus on fat is interesting.  Fat used to be bad for you.  Now it is good for you.  I'd like to experiment with that because I happen to like fat and I don't much care about carbs - I can do without them.

My point is not that a low carb diet is the only way to go, but that the scientific and anecdotal evidence does appear to support the health benefits of this type of eating.  I'm convinced enough to give it a try and see if I have any benefits.  Why not?  If it isn't good for me I won't keep doing it and it is good to have a set of eating rules and patterns with health in mind.

I don't want to convince you to do it but I also dislike the dismissal of any diet without strong, credible scientific backing.   Your diet can be good for you and you don't have to call something else "crap" just based on belief.

[Northwestie]

Wait.  There will be another hipster urbanist trend soon enough.

Yea - I'm a scientist - "a large body of anectodal evidence....


Oh, now I'm convinced

[totoro]

Anecdotal evidence usually precedes scientific research.  If you scroll up you will see that I've posted links to some of the existing scientific research on this.  Read it first please before personally attacking and labelling me.  I have no interest in engaging in an exchange of personal insults when the question is one of what is the current state of our knowledge on this topic.  Focus on this, do some research, and if you find something that is identifies clear health concerns and substantiates your "crap" statement get back to me.  If it is correct that would be valuable information.