America on the precipice: What are you doing?

[MilesTeg]

Bluntly, I think there is a risk of severe social upheaval within the next weeks or months. Certain elements of our society have demonstrated that they are completely willing to resort to violence to get their way.

While I don't think there is an extreme risk, I think the risk is high enough to warrant some preparedness.

What, if anything, are you doing with your home, your finances, to ensure you and your family's safety, etc.?

[jehovasfitness23]

I'm with you. This is long from over. State Capitols will be soon.

We have 1 gun and I've thought about buying another. Other than that, not much else I can do.

I've struggled in the past if I should cut ties with fam and friends that are MAGAs but let it stand. No more. If they don't denounce him I can't be around them.

I think it's safe to say 60-70% of cops are conservatives and a large chunk of that are sympathetic to MAGA world. If stuff devolves too much that will not be good as sides will need to be chosen.

[American GenX]

I avoid discussing politics with people.  I don't care what other people's opinions are about political policies, whether they are a socialist or a capitalist.

I watched some morning news and am getting to watch some of the NFL playoffs this afternoon putting everything else out of my mind.  I'm not living in fear because of a small group of radical Trump protestors anymore than I was during the riots, looting, and burning of cities over the summer.

[TheContinentalOp]

Ignoring all media.

Going for a hike.

Reading old books.

[jehovasfitness23]

I avoid discussing politics with people.  I don't care what other people's opinions are about political policies, whether they are a socialist or a capitalist.

I watched some morning news and am getting to watch some of the NFL playoffs this afternoon putting everything else out of my mind.  I'm not living in fear because of a small group of radical Trump protestors anymore than I was during the riots, looting, and burning of cities over the summer.

Polling shows a majority of republicans support storming the Capitol. This is not a small group. Governors had kidnapping plans against them. Don't keep your head buried in the sand. That's how nazis rose to power.

edit: sorry 45% https://www.news10.com/news/us-capitol-coverage/poll-one-fifth-of-voters-almost-half-of-republicans-agree-with-storming-of-us-capitol/

[American GenX]

I avoid discussing politics with people.  I don't care what other people's opinions are about political policies, whether they are a socialist or a capitalist.

I watched some morning news and am getting to watch some of the NFL playoffs this afternoon putting everything else out of my mind.  I'm not living in fear because of a small group of radical Trump protestors anymore than I was during the riots, looting, and burning of cities over the summer.

Polling shows a majority of republicans support storming the Capitol. This is not a small group. Governors had kidnapping plans against them. Don't keep your head buried in the sand. That's how nazis rose to power.

Uhhh.... you are talking about something completely different vs. what I stated.  I was referring to the group that rushed the Capital building.  So, out of a country the size of the U.S., that's a small group.  I'm not concerned about them coming to my house.

You can live in fear if you choose to, but I will not.  I watched news as recent as this morning - as I stated earlier, so that's far from keeping my head in the sand.  Now, I'm enjoying some football.  I am not going to waste the whole day on news or worrying about things.

[MilesTeg]

For my part, we are:

On the emergency preparedness side (mostly in good shape due to COVID vigilance):

1. Ensuring all family vehicles are in good repair, fully fueled and stocked with emergency supplies
2. Ensuring we still have 2-3 months of food on hand (pretty much had that since the beginning of COVID)
3. Refreshing emergency supplies in home (batteries, medicines, etc.)
4. Considering what to do for emergency heating/cooking if it becomes necessary

On the financial side, I don't really know what we will do if anything. If we start seeing more insurrection attempts I can't imagine that would be even remotely good for investments. If it were to get bad enough, it would likely have a big affect the value of the dollar even. While I don't plan to do anything right now I am very glad that we haven't just dumped everything into VTI and USD like is suggested around here by some and instead own things of intrinsic value like metals, real estate, etc.

[jehovasfitness23]

I avoid discussing politics with people.  I don't care what other people's opinions are about political policies, whether they are a socialist or a capitalist.

I watched some morning news and am getting to watch some of the NFL playoffs this afternoon putting everything else out of my mind.  I'm not living in fear because of a small group of radical Trump protestors anymore than I was during the riots, looting, and burning of cities over the summer.

Polling shows a majority of republicans support storming the Capitol. This is not a small group. Governors had kidnapping plans against them. Don't keep your head buried in the sand. That's how nazis rose to power.

Uhhh.... you are talking about something completely different vs. what I stated.  I was referring to the group that rushed the Capital building.  So, out of a country the size of the U.S., that's a small group.  I'm not concerned about them coming to my house.

You can live in fear if you choose to, but I will not.  I watched news as recent as this morning - as I stated earlier, so that's far from keeping my head in the sand.  Now, I'm enjoying some football.  I am not going to waste the whole day on news or worrying about things.

"small group"

You realize there are likely millions of them across the country that are thinking the same as them and when push comes to shove they're not far from doing the same.

again, don't rationalize what we all saw as "small group"

[maizefolk]

Thanks to COVID I'm already set up to not have to leave the house to go to the grocery store for several weeks to a month (though meals would get quite boring towards the end) or leave the house for other reasons for that matter. I also have a bit over a thousand dollars in cash on hand because why not? It's a trivial fraction of my net worth and I might need it someday in a prolonged power outage (more likely) or cyberattack on payment processors (less likely).

More generally, I live in a relatively low density, lower middle class neighborhood -- not the rich part of town rioters would head towards, nor the higher density part of town where protests tend to initially form -- and my guess is that none of my neighbors know who I voted for (and I intent to keep it that way). I try to follow patterns of speech/language to the point I can meet a group of people who are either quite liberal or quite conservative and talk in a way so I don't sound like one of the bad people they're angry at. I think it is likely that this same ability to linguistically/culturally code-switch is what got me out of a speeding ticket/car search when I was pulled over in the middle of the country in a car with California plates years ago. Motivated me to work at it more in the years since.

Oh and I'm FI. That provides a lot more flexibility to make life choices to avoid putting myself into harms way if things get worse.

I certainly hope we don't end up with "severe social upheaval" in the next few months, or any time in my lifetime for that matter.

[Just Joe]

Not really too worried. We live among a majority of MAGA supporters which by the way might have been surprised by the events at the Capitol. Our MAGA flag flying neighbor for the past several years has suddenly pulled down his flag. The late comer neighbor who had just started flying a MAGA flag after the elections suddenly pulled down his too.

Have thought about buying a hunting rifle aka 30-06 with scope for some time in case we needed to hunt for dinner. I'm not a hunter. Also a good weapon if we had violent people coming on our rural property BUT shoot one and all their friends are coming back later to make a point. Just isn't going to happen. I'm not shooting, no hotheads coming here. Not really. Better to talk than resort to violence. There are pistols here anyhow.

We DIY alot so we could take care of ourselves in lean times. I'd rather to continue to be a "moderate" to my neighbors than the liberals we really are. Easier for them to get along with us. We chose to not post any Biden signs last year. Wouldn't change any minds anyhow but we didn't invite vandals either.

We have food, fuel, generator, and plenty of transportation. Not sure where we would go except to fetch family and bring them here. We have the most resources and space. Lots of camping gear should walking to Canada or Mexico become important. (Not happening but I'm watching "The Stand" on CBS right now).

[John Galt incarnate!]

Bluntly, I think there is a risk of severe social upheaval within the next weeks or months. Certain elements of our society have demonstrated that they are completely willing to resort to violence to get their way.

While I don't think there is an extreme risk, I think the risk is high enough to warrant some preparedness.

What, if anything, are you doing with your home, your finances, to ensure you and your family's safety, etc.?

During this period of  heightened  political unrest America's governmental architecture of separation of powers, checks and balances, and dispersion of power, in combination with all   of her  long-standing institutions of ordered liberty, preordain only one outcome: America will not falter.

"This too shall pass."

I am not making any changes to my financial position.

I live a million miles from nowhere so there is zero possibility of rioters/looters/vandals/arsonists.

If I lived in a city/neighborhood where this  sort of trouble could erupt I'd  arm myself with a 12-gauge shotgun which I would deploy only  if I faced an actual, imminent threat of being killed.

[bmjohnson35]

I don't plan to do anything remarkably different. I am happy that I don't live in D.C., Detroit, Chicago, New York or some other large densely populated city.  I will avoid engaging in political discussions with strangers, but I generally do that anyway.    I agree that the events of the capital was shocking, but I don't think they represent the majority of Trump supports. There are probably a lot more Americans out there that sympathize with Trump's propoganda, but I don't think they are prepared to start looting or taking up arms to march on government buildings.   

P.S.  I am hoping the new administration will do a better job of managing COVID and improve the efficiency of the vaccination roll-out.

[Kris]

What am I doing?

Staying far, far away from Trump supporters.

[Channel-Z]

I live in one of those funny states where almost everyone in state government is a Republican... except for the governor. I'm not concerned about that kind of violence here. Drug and domestic violence is far more common.

While we have plenty of people out there with revolutionary hero fantasies, they're also quite lazy. It's easier to complain on Facebook than to take up arms.

[Dibbels81]

Today was a chill day--took a nice long winter walk, grabbed a beer and now I'm watching some football. Tomorrow I'll head to work and then make dinner. I booked a trip to trip to Vegas in March--hopefully thing will be more open by then.

The world is not ending.

EDIT: I tasted my 6 gallon jug of apple wine aging in the chilly attic--I'm worried it may have spoiled. I'm hoping it's just the oak chips giving it a quirky flavor for the moment. I racked it to another container.

[Morning Glory]

I am scared to death. I know enough about the runup to the Nazis and other nasty things in history. I don't know what I can do though. My husband thinks I am being foolish.  I've had a rough year.

 I don't think it would help to hoard things or change my asset allocation. I keep a pretty low profile and only talk politics with certain close friends, never on social media.  The area where I live is fairly buttoned up. We had a very peaceful BLM protest in June.

 I/ my family wouldn't be a first target by a long shot, but I worry about friends who would. I have British citizenship but it's not much better there right now.

I don't watch the news too closely. I keep an eye on the headlines and my dad sends me an article sometimes. I don't watch video news at all because seeing Trump is an anxiety trigger for me.

I am not religious but I am praying in my foxhole for a peaceful next ten days. Maybe even an impeachment.

[Much Fishing to Do]

"The element" as it was put by the OP (the poor & uneducated) in this country has always caused a lot of noise, burned down some crap, beaten up some people, gotten on the news, stolen some TVs, and gotten some politicians to back them over the decades.  But in the past they've never gotten very far because, face it, they are poor and uneducated in America.  I agree this feels different because its a "different" element this time, but I have no doubt will go the same nowhere as usual.

I've been beaten to a pulp by a bunch of angry young poor black men in the past and am sure today it may be a bunch of angry young white men instead, except I got educated and made a little money and moved out of the element since then, out of that crappy poor rural county I grew up in, and stay out of all those violent cities as well.  Other than that I'm gonna just ignore the news.

[Metalcat]

I just arrived in SW Florida today, my family was *freaked* that I was coming down here and kept warning me about all the unrest.

Well, where I am is very chill. Excellent mask wearing everywhere, very calm, people seem pretty chill. My friend was like "don't let anyone know you're Canadian! You don't get how bad it is down there right now".

Obviously there's a ton of conflict right now, but the way the news presents it, my friends and family practically thought I was flying into a war zone.

Incidentally, I'm in snow bird territory, so everyone I've spoken to has been like "oh yay! Canadian!! There's so few of you guys here this year, we miss you"

Suffice to say, no riots in the streets and no being accosted for wearing a mask, as my loved ones quite seriously worried about.

I *was* however charged by a giant fucking bird.
Turns out it's a Wood Stork. Fuck they're huge!

[Fomerly known as something]

I just arrived in SW Florida today, my family was *freaked* that I was coming down here and kept warning me about all the unrest.

Well, where I am is very chill. Excellent mask wearing everywhere, very calm, people seem pretty chill. My friend was like "don't let anyone know you're Canadian! You don't get how bad it is down there right now".

Obviously there's a ton of conflict right now, but the way the news presents it, my friends and family practically thought I was flying into a war zone.

Incidentally, I'm in snow bird territory, so everyone I've spoken to has been like "oh yay! Canadian!! There's so few of you guys here this year, we miss you"

Suffice to say, no riots in the streets and no being accosted for wearing a mask, as my loved ones quite seriously worried about.

I *was* however charged by a giant fucking bird.
Turns out it's a Wood Stork. Fuck they're huge!

My sister misses the Canadian Snowbirds, she lives on the Panhandle, you can drive better than the Texans, even those of you who don’t see so well anymore.  BTW, if it gets “cold” watch for iguanas falling out of the trees.

[Kazyan]

It's pretty wacky out there, but I'm just going to stay the course of keeping my head down.

[dignam]

I live in a state capitol in a swing state and I've been telling people I'm a bit nervous about future unrest.  We saw major damage during BLM protests (yes I know it was likely from individuals who just want to break shit, not necessarily BLM activists), and I wouldn't doubt we'd see major damage done from the trump zealots/cultists.  To top it off, our mayor is absolutely terrible and has no backbone or leadership ability.  Her response to the BLM unrest here was to basically ignore it and let it go away while cop cars were burning in the streets and businesses were being destroyed. I have no idea how she was elected.

Anyway, my plan is to keep my head down, ears sharp and always have an out.

[Just Joe]

I don't really expect anything but maybe a real estate bubble to pop at some point. Thus lean times while the economy catches its breath.

[mathlete]

It’s morbidly funny to me that violent insurrectionists can storm the capitol, murder a cop, and get within minutes, maybe seconds of putting our elected officials in mortal peril and some people are still like,

“I don’t do politics. Low info diet bro.”

At the very least, you should probably at least concern yourself with the risk free interest rate if your interest in the world begins and ends with FIRE.

[fattest_foot]

Some of you people are amazing.

[MOD NOTE: TROLL HAS BEEN BANNED]

[mathlete]

Worthless and stunningly ignorant.

[mathlete]

Though I do have to note that “hyperventilating” is an interesting pejorative to use against people with rational concerns about their government in a year that has seen massive excess mortality due to an incompetent government response to a respiratory illness.

Anyone who has studied history or been lucky enough to travel to world should understand that stable governments and economies don’t happen on accident. They require participation. I support taking a walk or chilling out and playing video games or whatever your cup of tea is, as a means of distraction on this. But after you’ve made yourself an informed citizen and called your state and federal reps about this issue.

OP asked what I’m doing. That’s what I’m doing. This stuff is important to me and I don’t care if it ruffles feathers or causes Pete Adney’s website to be a fraction less affiliate friendly. This is the shit that needs to be done.

[fattest_foot]

Worthless and stunningly ignorant.

Stunning rebuttal.

[MOD NOTE: TROLL HAS BEEN BANNED]

[mathlete]

Worthless and stunningly ignorant.

Stunning rebuttal.

Do you just not remember Kavanaugh? Maybe because everyone didn't throw a massive hissy fit in the media about how our Democracy was in danger?

HUNDREDS of protestors broke into the Capitol then. Over 300 were arrested. They refused to cooperate with law enforcement and broke into Senators offices.

How was that celebrated as an exercise of First Amendment rights, but this is some kind of massive travesty? Is it because Trump told his supporters to go home, but the media interpreted that as "burn down the city?" I'm honestly curious what you think happened that was egregious.

Evidently I remember Kavanaugh much better than you do. Reading your ignorant mischaracterization of that incident was right around when I decided “worthless” was an apt descriptor.

It was the Hart building, not the Capitol.

They didn’t break in, it’s open to the public.

They did a sit in. They didn’t smash windows, trample someone to death, beat a cop to death, and seek to overturn the results of a legitimate election on this wishes of a lame duck who has been feeding them anti democracy conspiracy theories for months.

And perhaps most notably of all, they were arrested. Their charge? Unlawful assembly. They were allowed in the Hart building. They were allowed to assemble. But not both. So they were arrested. Fair enough.

What an odd comparison.

[mathlete]

Edit: I just want you to see the hypocrisy here. And also acknowledge that the technocracy in this country effectively silenced the President.

This is absurd. He’s the president of the United States. He can convene the press pool in the west wing and it will be covered by most major press outlets and likely run on most major networks.

He can write an op Ed that hundreds of newspapers would publish.

The White House can issue press releases and these will be reported on by virtually every news organization in the country.

He’s personal friends with media mogul Rupert Murdoch. He can likely get an hour on Fox any time he wants and reach tens of millions of viewers.

He can put out statements on his personal website.

He can call into syndicated talk radio.

He can send out emails to a mailing list of millions.

He can put out an RSS feed that will auto dump audio to anyone who subscribes.

This is all literally off the top of my head. There are ways to communicate outside of Twitter and Facebook.

[shuffler]

The technocracy in this country effectively silenced the President.

Bullshit.  He can hold a press conference any time he's not afraid to stand in front of reporters.

[dang1]

Trump, at the rally, before the violence:

"we’re going to have to fight much harder"
“We’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them, because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong.”

“When you catch somebody in a fraud, you are allowed to go by very different rules."

“We fight like hell, and if you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore.”
"we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you. … We are going to the Capitol,"
"give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.”


mob chants of “Hang Mike Pence,” with a gallows erected outside of the Capitol.

[mathlete]

The technocracy in this country effectively silenced the President.

Bullshit.  He can hold a press conference any time he's not afraid to stand in front of reporters.

President Trump hasn’t made a public appearance since Wednesday and the White House press secretary hasn’t issued a briefing or remarks since Thursday. It’s crazy how Twitter turned him invisible and literally took away McEnany’s ability to talk ;)

Really though. Trump is making a big deal out of the social media thing (through his congressional and media surrogates) because he’s desperate to talk about anything other than the fact that he riled up supporters with lies about election fraud to the point where they stormed to Capitol looking for blood.

In reality, only 20% of US adults even use Twitter. Just 42% of those use it for politics and only 19% followed the president. The idea that social media has become “the new public forum” is massively oversold.

[dang1]

help identify fascist traitors https://mobile.twitter.com/jsrailton/status/1348115530654347266

[Trifle]

Not really too worried. We live among a majority of MAGA supporters which by the way might have been surprised by the events at the Capitol. Our MAGA flag flying neighbor for the past several years has suddenly pulled down his flag. The late comer neighbor who had just started flying a MAGA flag after the elections suddenly pulled down his too.

We've noticed this too!  We live in a rural area with lots of Trump supporters.  All of a sudden -- overnight -- the flags and bumper stickers have disappeared.  It's hopeful I guess.  I like to think at least some of our neighbors are having second thoughts about supporting that evil lunatic. 

ETA:  Lots of church-goers here too, and although they voted for Trump in droves, I really can't see those people supporting the actions of the fascist far-right wing mob last week.  I think a lot of them will abandon Trump now.   

[jrhampt]

What am I doing?

Contacting my congressional representative and senators to demand accountability for the insurrection, whether by 25th, impeachment, censure, disqualification from holding public office, whatever means within their control. 

Other than that, nothing.  There's still a pandemic going on, so the small changes I made to my investment allocation, emergency cash on hand, and stock of toilet paper months ago still stand.

[Paper Chaser]

I'm with you. This is long from over. State Capitols will be soon.

We have 1 gun and I've thought about buying another. Other than that, not much else I can do.

I've struggled in the past if I should cut ties with fam and friends that are MAGAs but let it stand. No more. If they don't denounce him I can't be around them.

I think it's safe to say 60-70% of cops are conservatives and a large chunk of that are sympathetic to MAGA world. If stuff devolves too much that will not be good as sides will need to be chosen.

If one is concerned about growing division in society, doesn't "denouncing" friends and family only perpetuate that division? The entire reason people do desperate things is because they already feel like their voice isn't being heard.

Doesn't the fact that you're assuming 60-70% of police are MAGA supporters indicate that you've already divided society in your head, and ensure that "Sides will need to be chosen"? Haven't you already assigned people you've never met to a "side" because of the way that they look, or the job they hold, or where they live? Is a person building a bunker out of fear that they'll be shot any different from a person building a bunker out of fear that their guns will be taken?

Violent acts should be denounced. It's fine to point out things that are untrue and baseless to avoid spreading false information. And there's nothing wrong with eliminating negativity from your life. But responsibility for the division in the US falls on both sides of the aisle refusing to see the humanity in anyone that dares to have a different outlook. We've failed to realize that we often have far more in common with others than we have in difference. We've failed to retain any commonality or shared community. At one point, our differences made us stronger. America was a melting pot and better for it. Now, they weaken us. If you truly want that to change, it starts with you (collective). Talk to some neighbors about their kids or pets. Compliment them on the latest home project they completed, or their new hairstyle, or the band on their shirt. Ask them some questions, and you'll find some things in common pretty fast. Restoring some empathy and understanding of our commonalities is the only way that I see any of this getting any better.

[jehovasfitness23]

Sorry if it's divisive to denounce friends and fam that are still MAGAs, I want to be divided against those that stand for nazis and traitors.

[Paper Chaser]

Sorry if it's divisive to denounce friends and fam that are still MAGAs, I want to be divided against those that stand for nazis and traitors.

Like any conflict, there are ways to escalate the situation, or de-escalate. I don't see a lot of de-escalation in your words, and if enough people are feeling the same way, then the conflict you fear is almost guaranteed. If you (again collective 'you') truly want to avoid making the conflict worse, I think that requires some introspection. It's like two countries on that are on the path to war  claiming that they want to avoid the conflict, all the while cranking out as many bullets and bombs as they can.

[maizefolk]

Sorry if it's divisive to denounce friends and fam that are still MAGAs, I want to be divided against those that stand for nazis and traitors.

Like any conflict, there are ways to escalate the situation, or de-escalate. I don't see a lot of de-escalation in your words, and if enough people are feeling the same way, then the conflict you fear is almost guaranteed.

Well said.

[jehovasfitness23]

Ahh yes, we should be friendly to traitors of this country and bargain with the terrorists.

LOL man some of you.

I'm not saying I want to fight with my fam/friends, I just don't want them in my life if they still support this president. Full stop.

[mathlete]

Reconciliation doesn't fall solely on the shoulders of the people who were right about Trump's cruelty and fascist tendencies from the beginning.

Even after insurrectionists were wound up by Trump, broke into the Capitol, and killed people, congress reconvened and over 100 congressmen voted to disenfranchise tens of millions of votes and overturn the results of a legitimate election in order to cater to Trump's baseless tin foil conspiracy theories.

Their constituents can, at any point, start pressuring those congressmen to admit fault and change course.

[Paper Chaser]

Ahh yes, we should be friendly to traitors of this country and bargain with the terrorists.

LOL man some of you.

I'm not saying I want to fight with my fam/friends, I just don't want them in my life if they still support this president. Full stop.

I think if you've made an honest effort to communicate with them, and understand why they hold different views than you do, it's fine to avoid contact. But I think as a society, we've pretty much failed to properly communicate for the last few decades, and simply started shouting at each other because taking an empathetic approach to civil disagreement and trying to understand a different viewpoint is a lot more work than just shouting.
The people that stormed the Capitol saw themselves as patriots defending their democracy from traitors. You see yourself as a patriot defending your democracy from traitors. Everybody thinks they're the good guy.

[Trifle]

I hear you @jehovasfitness23  -- I too have family members that are Trump supporters.  I'm still processing what's been going on, and struggling with how and if I should move forward with those family members. 

Although I'm very angry and part of me wants to cut them off, I think the wiser course of action for me is to maintain the connections if I can, try to find the common ground that we can, and try to work through it together.  I keep reminding myself that these are good people.  Different than I am, but fundamentally good people.  They are misinformed and scared right now. I'm going to try to be a voice of calm and reason, and demonstrate that not everyone on "the left" hates them. 

I talked with them after the mob violence last week, and they don't think Trump is to blame for it.  But -- they think what the rioters did was terrible.  OK, there's a tiny bit of common ground.  Let's all stay calm and try to build on that.   

And yes @mathlete, totally agree.  My congressman was one of the 100 who voted against the election results.  I have already reached out to his office, and will continue to do so. 

[jehovasfitness23]

Ahh yes, we should be friendly to traitors of this country and bargain with the terrorists.

LOL man some of you.

I'm not saying I want to fight with my fam/friends, I just don't want them in my life if they still support this president. Full stop.

I think if you've made an honest effort to communicate with them, and understand why they hold different views than you do, it's fine to avoid contact. But I think as a society, we've pretty much failed to properly communicate for the last few decades, and simply started shouting at each other because taking an empathetic approach to civil disagreement and trying to understand a different viewpoint is a lot more work than just shouting.
The people that stormed the Capitol saw themselves as patriots defending their democracy from traitors. You see yourself as a patriot defending your democracy from traitors. Everybody thinks they're the good guy.

It's hard to communicate with those that live in an alternate reality. They are lost souls.

I hear your last point but yeah, it's pretty easy to be anti-fascist and be the good guy.

[mathlete]

Ahh yes, we should be friendly to traitors of this country and bargain with the terrorists.

LOL man some of you.

I'm not saying I want to fight with my fam/friends, I just don't want them in my life if they still support this president. Full stop.

I think if you've made an honest effort to communicate with them, and understand why they hold different views than you do, it's fine to avoid contact. But I think as a society, we've pretty much failed to properly communicate for the last few decades, and simply started shouting at each other because taking an empathetic approach to civil disagreement and trying to understand a different viewpoint is a lot more work than just shouting.
The people that stormed the Capitol saw themselves as patriots defending their democracy from traitors. You see yourself as a patriot defending your democracy from traitors. Everybody thinks they're the good guy.

These people are objectively wrong though. The only reason they believe that is because The President, who is typically someone of authority, has been lying to them for years.

Myself and many others have been fighting the battle of, "Don't listen to Trump, he's a demonstrable liar" for five years now. Countless phone conversations with families. Email exchanges. Posts on this and many other forums.

[mathlete]

I actually do have sympathy for those that stormed the Capitol. Especially the woman who was shot and killed and the one who was trampled to death. They are clearly confused and yes, probably did hold genuine beliefs that they were saving democracy.

Who I have the biggest problem with, is the ~40% of the country who are presumably rational and right-thinking, but refuse to see the connection between MONTHS of,

"This will be the most fraudelant election of all time,"

"Stop the count!"

"Stop the steal!"

"This was a landslide victory that was stolen from us by our enemies."

"You have to show strength and fight."

"We will not go silently into the night."

"Trial by combat."

And what happened at the Capitol. Empty calls for unity from these folks are completely worthless. The ball is firmly in their court and I'm eagerly waiting for them to clear the lowest bar imaginable. I am an excellent fact-finder. I read a shit ton of fact based original reporting and I do lots of independent research as well. If they want some help coming to the truth, I'm always willing to do that. I don't even care if they've called me a college elitist or a snowflake or "blinded by fake news" in the past. That rolls right of my shoulders. Let's get this done.

[Paper Chaser]

Ahh yes, we should be friendly to traitors of this country and bargain with the terrorists.

LOL man some of you.

I'm not saying I want to fight with my fam/friends, I just don't want them in my life if they still support this president. Full stop.

I think if you've made an honest effort to communicate with them, and understand why they hold different views than you do, it's fine to avoid contact. But I think as a society, we've pretty much failed to properly communicate for the last few decades, and simply started shouting at each other because taking an empathetic approach to civil disagreement and trying to understand a different viewpoint is a lot more work than just shouting.
The people that stormed the Capitol saw themselves as patriots defending their democracy from traitors. You see yourself as a patriot defending your democracy from traitors. Everybody thinks they're the good guy.

These people are objectively wrong though. The only reason they believe that is because The President, who is typically someone of authority, has been lying to them for years.

Myself and many others have been fighting the battle of, "Don't listen to Trump, he's a demonstrable liar" for five years now. Countless phone conversations with families. Email exchanges. Posts on this and many other forums.

Agreed. The internet is powerful. It can be used to root out false information in the same way that it can be used to spread disinformation, but it takes work to root it out and confirmation bias is easy. That cuts both ways too. Lots of liberals stay in their liberal bubbles while conservatives stay in theirs.

My overall point, is that whatever the divisive issue is, we've gotten intellectually lazy. Every conflict is now "Us vs them" from both sides because that's easy. Black vs white, rich vs poor, police vs civilian, men vs women, republican vs democrat, gay vs straight, urban vs rural, etc. There's probably a very deep conflict out there somewhere between right handed people and left handed people that I'm just not aware of yet. The only way that any of these conflicts is de-escalated comes when we start to humanize those with differing views rather than disparaging them. You have to be the change you want to see in the world.

[mathlete]

I cannot accept "both sides"ing on this. That is also intellectually lazy IMO.

[Paper Chaser]

I cannot accept "both sides"ing on this. That is also intellectually lazy IMO.

What "Both sides"-ing? I agree that people were objectively wrong in this case. My point is not who is wrong or not on this specific issue. My point is that we don't come back from this unless we all work at it. There will always be another divisive issue brought to the forefront, and we need to do a better job of diffusing these types of conflict or it will tear us apart.
I guess if suggesting that we could all be more empathetic boils down to "both sides"-ing, then I'm guilty of that.

[ericrugiero]

I hear you @jehovasfitness23  -- I too have family members that are Trump supporters.  ...

I talked with them after the mob violence last week, and they don't think Trump is to blame for it.  But -- they think what the rioters did was terrible.  OK, there's a tiny bit of common ground.  Let's all stay calm and try to build on that.   

I live in an area with tons of Trumps supporters.  I've talked to a few and this is representative of what they think.  NOBODY I've talked to thinks it was OK to break into the capitol.  They think it's equivalent to the violence that happened in the BLM protests and are opposed to both.  I even know one person who was at the rally but not near the capitol building.  He said the overall vibe was extremely peaceful and respectful.  I honestly believe the folks who broke in or support that type of action are a very small minority of the Trump supporters.