Would you spend more if highly paid?

[BussoV6]

I would slightly increase our travel budget and also buy slightly better wine than I do now.

I would spend more on investments and retire earlier though!

[Freedomin5]

When our household gross income was $37200 per year, we definitely thought about money differently than we do now, when our household gross income is a lot higher. While the principles of frugality still hold true (how can we optimize this expense? Is this something we really need or that will truly bring value and joy to our lives?), we find ourselves more willing to spend on slightly nicer items. We’ve increased our savings rate though, from 25% of net income ($500/month) to 75-80% of net income. If we were at the $500k range, I don’t think our spending would go much higher because we already have everything we could want or need.

[js82]

I am very impressed by you guys who wouldn't change your lifestyles at all. While I am thankful for the willpower to be frugal, I guess I am just naturally not that way.

------------------- (list of spending)

All right - y'all can face punch me all over the place. But that is absolutely what I would do if I was making major bucks every year :) I found this very fun to think about actually.

I don't see your list as odd at all, if you were making a ton of money.  I think nearly all of us would increase our spending - it's more of a question of how quickly we'd increase our spending relative to our income.  At some point a fancier car/house/business class plane tickets/hired help for cooking/cleaning become easy decisions for people because they have so much money and the expense is a trivial fraction of their income - it's just that the threshold at which people feel this way varies a lot from person to person.  Some people(generally not on this forum) are content with a 10-20% savings rate, even at high incomes.  Some people (severely over-represented on this forum) don't want to increase their spending at all until they exceed a 50%, or even a 75% savings rate.

It's merely a question of how heavily you weight those additional luxuries relative to early retirement/occupational flexibility/etc. that you get from having a lot of savings.  Different strokes for different folks.

[anotherAlias]

I have actually been thinking about something similar lately. If the ACA is repealed and I have to work until I qualify for Medicare, I have vastly over saved for traditional retirement age.  So I could stop all saving and still have about three times my current spending available at 67yo.  That would leave me with some serious cash each paycheck to spend and yes I will spend it.  I would build my dream net zero home with a home gym and knitting nook.  Vacations will be at nice hotels or home rentals. I will pay for a meal planning service to eliminate my most hated chore.  I'd also hire a cleaning service to eliminate my second most hated chore.

[Kris]

I am very impressed by you guys who wouldn't change your lifestyles at all. While I am thankful for the willpower to be frugal, I guess I am just naturally not that way.

------------------- (list of spending)

All right - y'all can face punch me all over the place. But that is absolutely what I would do if I was making major bucks every year :) I found this very fun to think about actually.

I don't see your list as odd at all, if you were making a ton of money.  I think nearly all of us would increase our spending - it's more of a question of how quickly we'd increase our spending relative to our income.  At some point a fancier car/house/business class plane tickets/hired help for cooking/cleaning become easy decisions for people because they have so much money and the expense is a trivial fraction of their income - it's just that the threshold at which people feel this way varies a lot from person to person.  Some people(generally not on this forum) are content with a 10-20% savings rate, even at high incomes.  Some people (severely over-represented on this forum) don't want to increase their spending at all until they exceed a 50%, or even a 75% savings rate.

It's merely a question of how heavily you weight those additional luxuries relative to early retirement/occupational flexibility/etc. that you get from having a lot of savings.  Different strokes for different folks.

I agree. And the responses might also vary based on the respondent’s current income and how far along they are on the FI journey. I answered that I wouldn’t do much differently, but I’m already FI, my husband is retired, our house is paid off, and we basically already buy whatever we want, if we really want it. So, if we made a lot more money, buying more things would just mean impulse buying crap we didn’t truly want.

My response to this question would have been a lot different if I had answered it in my early thirties instead of at fifty-three.

[Captain Cactus]

@StarBright it's no judgement from me! We have tried some pricier things and learned where we will actually get an increase in joy from an increase in spend. So we cook almost all our food, not because we are frugal but because it tastes better. It being cheaper and healthier is a nice side effect. I recently spent a week consideringl buying an Hermés handbag and then realised I would rather spend that money on getting a local tailor to make me a bunch of clothes that were crafted to me AND a local leather worker to make me a nice bag. Staying at super ritzy hotels in the UAE wasn't worth it, flying business class for long haul trips? Absolutely worth it.

How much IS a Hermes bag?

I can't even imagine what using a tailor to make clothes for me would BE like...I like the idea though... my whole life I have felt like my clothes never fit me all that well and I always look schleppy.  I'm 5'10'', 170lbs...not grossly fat or skinny...  How does one find a tailor?  And how expensive is it?  Do they only do things like business suits?  Or could they make casual clothes?  Would the clothes look that much better than stuff bought off the rack?  PS, I haven't gone clothes shopping in a long time...     

[Captain Cactus]

PS...How does one get a job that pays $500K/year?  I've heard that it's possible, but I just don't know who makes that kind of money without a medical degree.  I'm in medical sales...where do I go from here?!

Get really lucky on Youtube?

And as the old saying goes, if you have to ask...

???  I don't get it...

[StarBright]

@StarBright it's no judgement from me! We have tried some pricier things and learned where we will actually get an increase in joy from an increase in spend. So we cook almost all our food, not because we are frugal but because it tastes better. It being cheaper and healthier is a nice side effect. I recently spent a week consideringl buying an Hermés handbag and then realised I would rather spend that money on getting a local tailor to make me a bunch of clothes that were crafted to me AND a local leather worker to make me a nice bag. Staying at super ritzy hotels in the UAE wasn't worth it, flying business class for long haul trips? Absolutely worth it.

How much IS a Hermes bag?

I can't even imagine what using a tailor to make clothes for me would BE like...I like the idea though... my whole life I have felt like my clothes never fit me all that well and I always look schleppy.  I'm 5'10'', 170lbs...not grossly fat or skinny...  How does one find a tailor?  And how expensive is it?  Do they only do things like business suits?  Or could they make casual clothes?  Would the clothes look that much better than stuff bought off the rack?  PS, I haven't gone clothes shopping in a long time...   

Depends on the bag and the leather. But used Kelly and Birkin styles go for thousands. Several years ago a new Birkin had a couple year waitlist and can be tens of thousands.

I actually sold my Kelly to finish paying off my grad school loans in one chunk.

[bluebelle]

@StarBright it's no judgement from me! We have tried some pricier things and learned where we will actually get an increase in joy from an increase in spend. So we cook almost all our food, not because we are frugal but because it tastes better. It being cheaper and healthier is a nice side effect. I recently spent a week consideringl buying an Hermés handbag and then realised I would rather spend that money on getting a local tailor to make me a bunch of clothes that were crafted to me AND a local leather worker to make me a nice bag. Staying at super ritzy hotels in the UAE wasn't worth it, flying business class for long haul trips? Absolutely worth it.

How much IS a Hermes bag?

I can't even imagine what using a tailor to make clothes for me would BE like...I like the idea though... my whole life I have felt like my clothes never fit me all that well and I always look schleppy.  I'm 5'10'', 170lbs...not grossly fat or skinny...  How does one find a tailor?  And how expensive is it?  Do they only do things like business suits?  Or could they make casual clothes?  Would the clothes look that much better than stuff bought off the rack?  PS, I haven't gone clothes shopping in a long time...   

When I was wearing suits/pantsuits to work, the last few years I would buy off the rack and have them altered.   Wasn't that expensive, but boy did they fit better.   I am very short waisted with broad shoulders, to get a jacket to fit my shoulders/bust, it was always baggy around my waist.  Most slacks would be very baggy at the waist to hang the way I wanted around the hips and thighs.   I even had a few shirts tailored.   I found it alot cheaper to buy clothes off the rack and have them tailored than to have them tailored from scratch (same place - made no sense)

[mm1970]

I am very impressed by you guys who wouldn't change your lifestyles at all. While I am thankful for the willpower to be frugal, I guess I am just naturally not that way.

I would pay someone to prep meals for me for at least a year and eat out!

We would take vacations to places that were more luxurious. We have found that places that are better fits for our very intense kids tend to pricier. So we just don't go on vacation as much now. And by luxurious I mean a few hundred a night vs. the cheapest we can find.

I would landscape my yard exactly how I wanted.

I would probably upgrade my house to have a nice separate guest suite for family (or an au pair in the current climate).

We would get hotels instead of staying with family when we visit them across the country.

I would update my car to something not slightly rusted and something that is hybrid or electric.

I'd put in a pool for my kids!

I would get weekly massages for at least a year.

I would get my hair done every 12 weeks. And get facials a few times a year.

I would buy clothes - I love clothes! And I would get a personal trainer.

All right - y'all can face punch me all over the place. But that is absolutely what I would do if I was making major bucks every year :) I found this very fun to think about actually.

My response to this question would have been a lot different if I had answered it in my early thirties instead of at fifty-three.

This is possibly the case for me too.  Maybe.  In my early 30s, I didn't have kids though.

I guess:
- I like cooking

- My kids hate travel.  So, luxury travel?  Sort of a waste (although we had planned a pretty sweet trip to Hawaii before COVID snatched it away).

- We need to landscape our yard, but are kinda just the DIY kind.

- I could upgrade my house but...well this is where the age thing comes in.  We are in our 50s, so I just can't imagine buying a $1.3M house that would be bigger with a possible second unit - and end up paying $15k+ a year for property taxes forever and ever.  Not to mention a 30 year mortgage at $6000 a month when I've got kids to put through college, and soon.  Because, while $500k would be nice, we are old enough to not be able to rely on having that income for even 15 years, much less 30.  Does that make any sense?

- We like staying with family, although next time we go, if we take the dog, we will need to get our own place.

- I can afford a new car, but why?  My car functions.

- We have no room for a pool

- Massages, hair, facials...just not my thing

- I used to have 3 gym memberships.  One of them a smaller expensive gym.  It closed, but I loved it.


I think the fact that we make quite a bit of money already (and don't spend it) and are in our 50s - this probably shapes our decisions about what we'd do if we made more.  I'd still save it, and I'd still try to talk my kids into going to state schools.

[MonkeyJenga]

I would spend more, mostly to make my life and surroundings more sustainable and eco-friendly. I'm already FIRE and get most of my stuff secondhand. Pre-pandemic, I even got most of my food for free. I don't want a car or a bigger house, and I don't need to upgrade my air travel because I'm not flying for environmental reasons.

* Funnel way more into my donor-advised fund
* Buy groceries from more sustainable sources
* Pay someone to meal prep
* Buy high-quality compost and native seeds and plants to speed up my pollinator strip (I'm trying to slowly cobble together free supplies now)
* Allow my bf to go part-time so he has more time to hang out in the garden with me
* If there's no pandemic, then probably a climbing gym membership and dance lessons

I'd still be picking berries on my walks, though. Free berries!

This isn't all academic for me - my investments increased so much after quitting my job that I set a high charity goal and switched some spending to the grocery co-op, and I felt comfortable buying a pandemic bike.

[Miss Prim]

I'm retired now, but when I was working, as soon as our house was paid off and my husband was making more money, I switched to part-time work.  So thinking about this question, I would not spend more, I would work less.  I was in the healthcare field and it's easy to work part-time.  If I was in a highly paid job that I couldn't work part-time, I would just sock all the money away to retire early.  I would maybe let my lifestyle creep up a bit, but as my husband used to say, "you can't beat the cheap out of me"!

[Monerexia]

PS...How does one get a job that pays $500K/year?  I've heard that it's possible, but I just don't know who makes that kind of money without a medical degree.  I'm in medical sales...where do I go from here?!

Get really lucky on Youtube?

And as the old saying goes, if you have to ask...

???  I don't get it...

QED. Probably something like over a couple decades learning how to create immense value in a particular industry, e.g., working your way up to VP and beyond. Old Munger said one time that the best way to get a corner office is to deserve one. This means developing one's own competence so you can Price's Law it up in an area where you have a comparative advantage.

[mspym]

@StarBright it's no judgement from me! We have tried some pricier things and learned where we will actually get an increase in joy from an increase in spend. So we cook almost all our food, not because we are frugal but because it tastes better. It being cheaper and healthier is a nice side effect. I recently spent a week considering buying an Hermés handbag and then realised I would rather spend that money on getting a local tailor to make me a bunch of clothes that were crafted to me AND a local leather worker to make me a nice bag. Staying at super ritzy hotels in the UAE wasn't worth it, flying business class for long haul trips? Absolutely worth it.

How much IS a Hermes bag?

I can't even imagine what using a tailor to make clothes for me would BE like...I like the idea though... my whole life I have felt like my clothes never fit me all that well and I always look schleppy.  I'm 5'10'', 170lbs...not grossly fat or skinny...  How does one find a tailor?  And how expensive is it?  Do they only do things like business suits?  Or could they make casual clothes?  Would the clothes look that much better than stuff bought off the rack?  PS, I haven't gone clothes shopping in a long time...   

An Hermés bag of the sort I am looking at -> $7-12k AUD, secondhand. I posted it in the Stupidest Things You are Lusting Over thread. You can get a lot of clothes for that sort of money.

It is definitely worth getting things tailored or at least adjusted at a tailor. I get clothes that fit at the critical points (pants-> seat & rise, jacket -> shoulders and ability to button it up, tops -> shoulder & bustline) and then have the waist, sleeve length, trouser length etc adjusted. Everything just looks smarter and feels more comfortable.

[Dicey]

I would totally spend more. I'd buy more real estate, flip or BRRR a couple more houses, and add a zero to the Donor Advised Fund. Except, there's no way in hell I'm going back to work. Still, a fun thought exercise.

[Metalcat]

I am very impressed by you guys who wouldn't change your lifestyles at all. While I am thankful for the willpower to be frugal, I guess I am just naturally not that way.

------------------- (list of spending)

All right - y'all can face punch me all over the place. But that is absolutely what I would do if I was making major bucks every year :) I found this very fun to think about actually.

I don't see your list as odd at all, if you were making a ton of money.  I think nearly all of us would increase our spending - it's more of a question of how quickly we'd increase our spending relative to our income.  At some point a fancier car/house/business class plane tickets/hired help for cooking/cleaning become easy decisions for people because they have so much money and the expense is a trivial fraction of their income - it's just that the threshold at which people feel this way varies a lot from person to person.  Some people(generally not on this forum) are content with a 10-20% savings rate, even at high incomes.  Some people (severely over-represented on this forum) don't want to increase their spending at all until they exceed a 50%, or even a 75% savings rate.

It's merely a question of how heavily you weight those additional luxuries relative to early retirement/occupational flexibility/etc. that you get from having a lot of savings.  Different strokes for different folks.

Not all of us.

In past lives, I've lived very luxuriously and I don't miss it.

Hedonic adaptation is a very real thing. At a certain point, few luxuries feel luxurious anymore and everything not luxurious feels like shit. So basically, it's a great way to make a lot of life uncomfortable by comparison.

I found that lifestyle tedious and depressing, but also morbidly addictive. Not my thing anymore.

Not all of us want more. Some of us really are happy with our current spend because that's exactly the lifestyle we chose. We just downsized dramatically a year ago and are so much happier.

Don't get me wrong, we have plenty of luxuries, and don't hesitate to spend on them, but we're a lot like Pete. We live the way we do because that's our best life, which we've spent years figuring out and working towards.

It's not at all what we pictured when we started out, but as time has gone on, we've pared away more and more and been happier and happier.

That's not everyone's path, and I totally understand why PP wants landscaping and facials and a guest house. Everyone needs to figure out their own ideal life. I just think it's a little weird to generalize that we would *all* choose to spend more if we could on a forum that has a lot of people who find happiness in spending a lot less than we can afford to.

[Metalcat]

@StarBright it's no judgement from me! We have tried some pricier things and learned where we will actually get an increase in joy from an increase in spend. So we cook almost all our food, not because we are frugal but because it tastes better. It being cheaper and healthier is a nice side effect. I recently spent a week considering buying an Hermés handbag and then realised I would rather spend that money on getting a local tailor to make me a bunch of clothes that were crafted to me AND a local leather worker to make me a nice bag. Staying at super ritzy hotels in the UAE wasn't worth it, flying business class for long haul trips? Absolutely worth it.

How much IS a Hermes bag?

I can't even imagine what using a tailor to make clothes for me would BE like...I like the idea though... my whole life I have felt like my clothes never fit me all that well and I always look schleppy.  I'm 5'10'', 170lbs...not grossly fat or skinny...  How does one find a tailor?  And how expensive is it?  Do they only do things like business suits?  Or could they make casual clothes?  Would the clothes look that much better than stuff bought off the rack?  PS, I haven't gone clothes shopping in a long time...   

An Hermés bag of the sort I am looking at -> $7-12k AUD, secondhand. I posted it in the Stupidest Things You are Lusting Over thread. You can get a lot of clothes for that sort of money.

It is definitely worth getting things tailored or at least adjusted at a tailor. I get clothes that fit at the critical points (pants-> seat & rise, jacket -> shoulders and ability to button it up, tops -> shoulder & bustline) and then have the waist, sleeve length, trouser length etc adjusted. Everything just looks smarter and feels more comfortable.

Re: tailoring clothes, yeah, I honestly don't get why more people don't do this. It really does make a huge difference, and it's really not expensive. I even tailored my scrubs in school. It cost $20 and made them much more comfortable/less terrible.

I pretty much stopped wearing the kind of clothes that need tailoring though, and stopped carrying handbags. I'm a running shoes and backpack kind of lady now.

[Bloop Bloop]

@StarBright it's no judgement from me! We have tried some pricier things and learned where we will actually get an increase in joy from an increase in spend. So we cook almost all our food, not because we are frugal but because it tastes better. It being cheaper and healthier is a nice side effect. I recently spent a week considering buying an Hermés handbag and then realised I would rather spend that money on getting a local tailor to make me a bunch of clothes that were crafted to me AND a local leather worker to make me a nice bag. Staying at super ritzy hotels in the UAE wasn't worth it, flying business class for long haul trips? Absolutely worth it.

How much IS a Hermes bag?

I can't even imagine what using a tailor to make clothes for me would BE like...I like the idea though... my whole life I have felt like my clothes never fit me all that well and I always look schleppy.  I'm 5'10'', 170lbs...not grossly fat or skinny...  How does one find a tailor?  And how expensive is it?  Do they only do things like business suits?  Or could they make casual clothes?  Would the clothes look that much better than stuff bought off the rack?  PS, I haven't gone clothes shopping in a long time...   

An Hermés bag of the sort I am looking at -> $7-12k AUD, secondhand. I posted it in the Stupidest Things You are Lusting Over thread. You can get a lot of clothes for that sort of money.

It is definitely worth getting things tailored or at least adjusted at a tailor. I get clothes that fit at the critical points (pants-> seat & rise, jacket -> shoulders and ability to button it up, tops -> shoulder & bustline) and then have the waist, sleeve length, trouser length etc adjusted. Everything just looks smarter and feels more comfortable.

Considering that private schools in Australia cost $30k per child per year, I'd say an Hermes bag is one of the more productive and higher-returning investments you could make in this day and age.

The average aspirational Australian family could buy 3 or 4 such bags a year, send their kids to a public school down the road and everyone would be better off.

[NorthernMonkey]

My income has almost doubled in the last 4 years through a series of promotions. In that time my expenses have dropped slightly.

Now I can afford anything I want (within reason) I realize there isn't really anything I want

[bbqbonelesswing]

Short answer: yes.

My income has roughly tripled over the past five years, and this has allowed us to spend more on things that make life more enjoyable. I'm not running out to lease a new BMW, but we have done things like dine out more and move into the city to eliminate our commute. At some point, there is a diminishing return, though. I don't get a lot of joy from simply spending on luxury goods, but for something that will eliminate a chore or leave us with a happy memory? Count me in.

[Maverick1]

1 year ago i was at a job that worked me too hard and paid me too little. I didn’t think there was much better out there, which in part drove me to save a high percentage of our income.

Last November I unexpectedly found a new job that gave me a large raise, with great future potential. The job is more enjoyable and less hours. My wife stays home with the kids but works 10 hours/week to keep her designation active and take advantage of our country’s progressive tax rates. We’re saving ~28.5% of our income and comfortable with our lifestyle. The increased income has lead to some silly purchases but it’s been fun. Our travel budget has been cut this year due to COVID so it kind of washes out.

[MoneyTree]

I wouldn't buy MORE, but I'd buy BETTER.

I don't like having stuff. But for the stuff that I do already have, there are better versions that I could upgrade to.

For example:
Airpods instead of knockoff earbuds.
A nice Tuft & Needle bed, instead of our Costco mattress.
Nice, sturdy furniture instead of all of our current IKEA furniture that we got when we first got married.
Peloton bike instead of the squeaky Sunny Fitness bike we got for ~$150
Nice wooden clothes hangers rather than the flimsy plastic ones

I'm content with the things we have now, but if we were already FI and had more money than we knew what to do with, I'd start upgrading things.

[happy]

I would have definitely been saving/investing a huge proportion of that 500k, and have retired earlier.

I would spend more, but not proportionally to that huge salary.

I probably would increase spending by being more willing to  spend on ethical purchases that cost more eg ethical clothing, locally sourced organic food and supporting smaller artisanal makers of quality goods.  I wouldn't  buy more food/cloths/stuff.

I would increase charitable donations.

Overseas travel is not high on my priorities ( especially now) but if I were to travel on flights of >10 hours I'd pay for business class.

I'd pay a bit more upfront to get my garden setup properly, rather than doing it in small steps, using free stuff and things on specials, like I have done until now.

[bmjohnson35]

FIRED at end of February.  With this in mind, starting early retirement at the beginning of world pandemic and all of the potential economic fallout of such an event, we are watching our spending closer than usual.  One of the greatest risks to the 4% rule, is starting retirement at the beginning of a bear market. We are spending less 4% and we will have various income streams kick in over the next 5 yrs, but this is not how we envisioned our start to FIRE. Furthermore, using Obamacare requires us to stay within a MAGI range, which automatically limits our spending. 

I left a secure higher than average paying career.  We saved/invested a significant portion of our income while employed.  Even so, I think I would be lying to myself if I claimed that I wouldn't spend more if I was still employed. It wouldn't be significantly more, but I suspect we would spend a little more.

[Tinker]

lifestyle creep is something to be wary of. Putting less consideration into what, why and when you make purchases can quickly grow into a problem

[nirodha]

To some extent, you have to. High earning tends to come with greater demands on your time, an expectation to travel, expensive locations, a requirement to entertain, maintenance of a personal brand, etc. Supporting all of that requires infrastructure. Growing from that point, even more. Were I down that path, I'd absolutely use the extra money as a tool. Burnout is the other option.

I'm saving 60-75% of my household income. I've been able to sustain my job by having groceries delivered, building a home gym, hiring someone to clean, etc. I'll occasionally indulge myself with an expensive bottle of alcohol or video game when work stress is getting the better of me. Those patterns would definitely escalate. 

Free, magic money? I'd move to a house with indoor/outdoor swimming options and pay someone else to take care of it. I'd buy top of the line X when I had a need and if it sucked give it away.

[Rosy]

Yes, I would.

A few years back my income doubled unexpectedly.
I used the extra income to fix my financial life and at the same time slowly check-marked everything off my long list of all the things I wanted to do.
I'm done - I'm content.

It isn't 500K territory but I would have treated it the same.
Our lifestyle isn't changing but the quality of our things has and we do indulge ourselves off and on.
I guess we upgraded across the board and we enjoy that we can without diminishing our stash.

[DadJokes]

Yes, we'd probably spend up to $20k or so more than the $55k we currently spend.

We don't deprive ourselves, but we also say no to some things that we want in order to maintain a 50% savings rate.

[Megs193]

Short answer: 
Yes.  Yes I would.

Longer answer with some explanation:
The extra amount we spend would depend on where we stand in relation to our FI goal.  If, today, I suddenly went from making $150,000/year to $500,000/year I think that I would simply feed the taxable brokerage account until FI.  From there I would continue accumulating cash and then pay off the mortgage (gasp!!!).  Then, if I was still inclined to work, I would accumulate enough cash to purchase either the place in the White Mountains or on the coast of Maine that I've been lusting after.  Of course at this point our cost of living would increase having the 2nd home, so we'd either sell our current residence and make the vacation home the primary residence (quitting the high paying job along the way...) or continue to grow the stach 'til it's big enough to account for the increased cost of living.

PS...How does one get a job that pays $500K/year?  I've heard that it's possible, but I just don't know who makes that kind of money without a medical degree.  I'm in medical sales...where do I go from here?!

Plenty of people in finance make over 500k. My husband makes about 450k but there are plenty of people in his company who make more than that. I would guess at least 5%  of the company.

To answer the question - we do spend more than most people on this board but we don’t spend as much as lot people we know. We do live in a large house, pay someone to clean it and pay landscapers. We travel a lot (at least we did pre-covid) and we prefer nicer hotels. We also do a lot of things people consider frugal because they aren’t important to us.  We drive our cars for 12-15 years, we don’t buy much “stuff”, we don’t buy designer clothes and we don’t eat at fancy restaurants. We have determined what things we believe add value to our life and are willing to spend money on those things.

[iris lily]

I am old,  retired, FI, and spending a shocking amount of money. In this Trump economy the money just keeps rolling in.

However, old habits die hard. I cannot bring myself to spend money on new clothes when Goodwill will provide all the Work clothes we need.  I’m looking out for a new crockpot at Goodwill and will find one eventually. I haven’t shopped in an actual mall for decades, but I do hit the thrift stores pretty often. That is,When Covid measures are allowing us to shop.

But given the fact that I could spend a whole lot more, there are many brakes on my spending, developed after decades of frugality. Every once in a while I get a wild hair and think to myself “why don’t you take a first class fare to Europe? “. And then I can’t believe the price! I’m not spending that kind of money and I could easily afford it.

Another example is the cost of Roman shades for windows for a house we’re renovating. I cannot believe people actually spend this much money on these commercially made Roman shades! For one window it’s about $800. One window! Good God.  And yes, I have seen them cheaper, I think around $400 or $500 but the fabric choices at those low end places limited. I think I’m going to sew our Roman shades and DH can figure out the hardware, that’s too complicated for me.

So yeah, I have internal blocks to spending shit tons of money on things not terrifically beautiful or necessary.

[iris lily]

I wouldn't buy MORE, but I'd buy BETTER.

I don't like having stuff. But for the stuff that I do already have, there are better versions that I could upgrade to.

For example:
Airpods instead of knockoff earbuds.
A nice Tuft & Needle bed, instead of our Costco mattress.
Nice, sturdy furniture instead of all of our current IKEA furniture that we got when we first got married.
Peloton bike instead of the squeaky Sunny Fitness bike we got for ~$150
Nice wooden clothes hangers rather than the flimsy plastic ones

I'm content with the things we have now, but if we were already FI and had more money than we knew what to do with, I'd start upgrading things.

This Focus on quality becomes more important as you get older, too. And sometimes that’s why I prefer to buy used stuff at the thrift stores because it’s more solid, although that is quickly changing and that stuff is being replaced by IKEA level stuff at thrift stores. Ick.

[StarBright]

I am very impressed by you guys who wouldn't change your lifestyles at all. While I am thankful for the willpower to be frugal, I guess I am just naturally not that way.

------------------- (list of spending)

All right - y'all can face punch me all over the place. But that is absolutely what I would do if I was making major bucks every year :) I found this very fun to think about actually.

I don't see your list as odd at all, if you were making a ton of money.  I think nearly all of us would increase our spending - it's more of a question of how quickly we'd increase our spending relative to our income.  At some point a fancier car/house/business class plane tickets/hired help for cooking/cleaning become easy decisions for people because they have so much money and the expense is a trivial fraction of their income - it's just that the threshold at which people feel this way varies a lot from person to person.  Some people(generally not on this forum) are content with a 10-20% savings rate, even at high incomes.  Some people (severely over-represented on this forum) don't want to increase their spending at all until they exceed a 50%, or even a 75% savings rate.

It's merely a question of how heavily you weight those additional luxuries relative to early retirement/occupational flexibility/etc. that you get from having a lot of savings.  Different strokes for different folks.

Not all of us.

In past lives, I've lived very luxuriously and I don't miss it.

Hedonic adaptation is a very real thing. At a certain point, few luxuries feel luxurious anymore and everything not luxurious feels like shit. So basically, it's a great way to make a lot of life uncomfortable by comparison.

I found that lifestyle tedious and depressing, but also morbidly addictive. Not my thing anymore.

Not all of us want more. Some of us really are happy with our current spend because that's exactly the lifestyle we chose. We just downsized dramatically a year ago and are so much happier.

Don't get me wrong, we have plenty of luxuries, and don't hesitate to spend on them, but we're a lot like Pete. We live the way we do because that's our best life, which we've spent years figuring out and working towards.

It's not at all what we pictured when we started out, but as time has gone on, we've pared away more and more and been happier and happier.

That's not everyone's path, and I totally understand why PP wants landscaping and facials and a guest house. Everyone needs to figure out their own ideal life. I just think it's a little weird to generalize that we would *all* choose to spend more if we could on a forum that has a lot of people who find happiness in spending a lot less than we can afford to.

FWIW - I don't actually know if I would spend more for the rest of my life, or for a year or two. I definitely think my "spend all the moneeeyz" comes from wanting things to be easier during this covid craziness. I would spend a lot of money for a break right now, if I had that money, and I think that might be skewing my response.

[Luz]

If I enjoyed my work and found it meaningful, I would definitely spend more. So fun to consider the possibilities in terms of wealth-building, charitable giving, and quality of life upgrades (like the tuft and needle mattress someone mentioned) related to earning $500k/yr over a 25 year span. If I didn't enjoy the work, I would spend about the same as now and take 5 years to put away enough money to retire early, but at 2.5x our present income.

[iris lily]

Re: expensive bedding.

After I retired, and after we had stayed a couple times in hotels with nice mattresses, I decided I would get a nice mattress. We needed a new one. But I couldn’t really tell the difference between expensive ones and mid range ones, so we ended up spending about $500 each mattress. Then, I added on fluffyMattress topper. Then, I added on expensive sheets that were expensive because they have corners that never come off the mattress, guaranteed.I said top it all off with a wonderful soft but light comforter that I got at the thrift store for a couple of bucks.

And I consider this to be the most luxurious bedding I would ever want, but it is acres cheaper than what some people spend. And that’s OK, because it makes me happy I got to the level of satisfaction at a reasonable cost.

I remember the most luxurious car I ever had was a 1997 Ford Taurus. It had plush velveteen seats, electronic sear adjustment, electric windows, cruise control.  I did not have any of that in my prior cars.

To this day I’ve not had anything so luxe.

[mobileagent]

I have been fortunate to earn around $500K for the past four years and have also seen our income grow from $70K to this level over a course of 10 years. Our lifestyle has definitely creeped up even though we have been saving and investing 45-50% of our gross (no state income tax). This level of income has helped us to pay off our mortgage for an expensive house, now worth $1.5M, in a desirable US city and also save more than $2M in taxable and retirement funds. The power of compounding is starting to kick in and we have seen our networth grew by $500K on average for the past four years. We might be still saving the same percentage of the income, but we have more income to spend on vacations, restaurants, household help and family activities. We only spend money on experiences and things that we feel are giving us value. As an example, we don't have any luxury cars and use Japanese vehicles. As our networth is growing and income has been good, it is hard to be very frugal and justify it. If our income reduces, it is not that hard for us to slow down our spending as we still have a good life. However, it is hard to make a strong case on why we need to live frugally right now although we might be already living cheaper than my peers in the same income group. We are still saving a big percentage of our income, but our life style has definitely increased with higher income and networth.

[Monerexia]

PS...How does one get a job that pays $500K/year?  I've heard that it's possible, but I just don't know who makes that kind of money without a medical degree.  I'm in medical sales...where do I go from here?!

Get really lucky on Youtube?

And as the old saying goes, if you have to ask...

???  I don't get it...

QED. Probably something like over a couple decades learning how to create immense value in a particular industry, e.g., working your way up to VP and beyond. Old Munger said one time that the best way to get a corner office is to deserve one. This means developing one's own competence so you can Price's Law it up in an area where you have a comparative advantage.

And come to think of it, if all else fails just listen to Weird Al's Mission Statement, make it your new bible and follow it religiously for the next couple decades and you'll hit your max salary without fail.

[vand]

Yes, I'd spend more. But probably less proportionally than the extra I was bringing in, so saving rate would increase.
Ultimately when you are a very high earner time becomes the most precious resource you have, and having a lot of money allows you to trade income for time when the marginal utility of extra time is worth a lot more than an extra dollar.

[Metalcat]

I am very impressed by you guys who wouldn't change your lifestyles at all. While I am thankful for the willpower to be frugal, I guess I am just naturally not that way.

------------------- (list of spending)

All right - y'all can face punch me all over the place. But that is absolutely what I would do if I was making major bucks every year :) I found this very fun to think about actually.

I don't see your list as odd at all, if you were making a ton of money.  I think nearly all of us would increase our spending - it's more of a question of how quickly we'd increase our spending relative to our income.  At some point a fancier car/house/business class plane tickets/hired help for cooking/cleaning become easy decisions for people because they have so much money and the expense is a trivial fraction of their income - it's just that the threshold at which people feel this way varies a lot from person to person.  Some people(generally not on this forum) are content with a 10-20% savings rate, even at high incomes.  Some people (severely over-represented on this forum) don't want to increase their spending at all until they exceed a 50%, or even a 75% savings rate.

It's merely a question of how heavily you weight those additional luxuries relative to early retirement/occupational flexibility/etc. that you get from having a lot of savings.  Different strokes for different folks.

Not all of us.

In past lives, I've lived very luxuriously and I don't miss it.

Hedonic adaptation is a very real thing. At a certain point, few luxuries feel luxurious anymore and everything not luxurious feels like shit. So basically, it's a great way to make a lot of life uncomfortable by comparison.

I found that lifestyle tedious and depressing, but also morbidly addictive. Not my thing anymore.

Not all of us want more. Some of us really are happy with our current spend because that's exactly the lifestyle we chose. We just downsized dramatically a year ago and are so much happier.

Don't get me wrong, we have plenty of luxuries, and don't hesitate to spend on them, but we're a lot like Pete. We live the way we do because that's our best life, which we've spent years figuring out and working towards.

It's not at all what we pictured when we started out, but as time has gone on, we've pared away more and more and been happier and happier.

That's not everyone's path, and I totally understand why PP wants landscaping and facials and a guest house. Everyone needs to figure out their own ideal life. I just think it's a little weird to generalize that we would *all* choose to spend more if we could on a forum that has a lot of people who find happiness in spending a lot less than we can afford to.

FWIW - I don't actually know if I would spend more for the rest of my life, or for a year or two. I definitely think my "spend all the moneeeyz" comes from wanting things to be easier during this covid craziness. I would spend a lot of money for a break right now, if I had that money, and I think that might be skewing my response.

That's kind of my point.
I don't feel the urge to spend more because my life is set up the way I want it to be. I don't take any issue with what people want to spend on, I take issue with the assumption that we would all spend more if we had more to spend.

That said, I will admit that I've just been made to realize that there's a certain threshold where my opinion changes. I have a certain ceiling of wealth where accumulating more just seems pointless, especially as we have no kids. I am, however, pretty hard pressed to figure out what I would spend on.

[mm1970]

Hedonic adaptation is a very real thing. At a certain point, few luxuries feel luxurious anymore and everything not luxurious feels like shit. So basically, it's a great way to make a lot of life uncomfortable by comparison.

This may seem silly, be we hit that with COVID.  We rarely eat out - maybe 1-2x a month.  During COVID, we increased that to weekly, sometimes 2x a week, simply to help the local economy.

It got old real fast.  The kids hit the hedonistic adaptation point, and wanted more and more.  Hubby and I, yeah no.

We are back to once every 2 weeks.

[Metalcat]

Hedonic adaptation is a very real thing. At a certain point, few luxuries feel luxurious anymore and everything not luxurious feels like shit. So basically, it's a great way to make a lot of life uncomfortable by comparison.

This may seem silly, be we hit that with COVID.  We rarely eat out - maybe 1-2x a month.  During COVID, we increased that to weekly, sometimes 2x a week, simply to help the local economy.

It got old real fast.  The kids hit the hedonistic adaptation point, and wanted more and more.  Hubby and I, yeah no.

We are back to once every 2 weeks.

For me it was luxury experiences that brought the worst out in life. Luxury items and experiences cost sooooo much more than the additional value that they add in general, that they often tend to feel like a subpar value for their cost.

That's why so many wealthy people bitch about what seems like little details. If I'm going to be paying several times the basic cost, then I expect it to be several times as nice! In reality, you pay several times as much for 20-150% nicer. As a result, luxury almost always falls short, unless you are getting it for free.

I had VIP Cirque de Soleil tickets last year, and they had an enormous premium for perks like VIP parking, access to a luxury private VIP tent, open bar, food, and a gift. I ended up pretty underwhelmed.

The parking wasn't valet, wasn't very close to the entrance, and was on gravel and hard to find. The tent in the photos looked magnificent, but was really just a little tent with some small sofas. There were a few little snacks, nothing special, and not enough to offset the over pouring by the bar staff. The open bar had mediocre wine, I would have preferred a cash bar with better options. The gift was a branded umbrella...weird.

I left the whole experience thinking "I'm pretty grateful I didn't pay for that". And that's what living in wealth felt like for me, a whole lot of failure to live up to expectations, but also getting so used to that level of luxury anyway that less-than-luxury feels even worse.

It's pretty lose-lose IMO.

Out of curiosity, in my recent contemplation of earning more than  I could possibly spend, I looked up what I would have to spend to find an apartment that I like substantially more than my own. It looks like I would have to spend more than *TEN TIMES* in order to get an apartment with a better view, bigger windows, and a bigger balcony or terrace. Oh, but the kitchen would be smaller and the indoor pool less than half the size...so...I guess I'm not upgrading anytime soon, even if I do come into millions.

[simonsez]

I'm sure I would -- I'd do a lot of my house projects faster instead of trickling them out over a couple of years.

This is a big part of it for me, I'd do more projects now which would seem like more spending but it's money I'd eventually be spending anyway.

Depending on how much more I earned, it gets into the territory of my lottery fantasy - which definitely coincides with more spending.

https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/antimustachian-wall-of-shame-and-comedy/do-you-have-a-lottery-fantasy-post-it-here/

[Cassie]

Definitely yes!

[mm1970]

Out of curiosity, in my recent contemplation of earning more than  I could possibly spend, I looked up what I would have to spend to find an apartment that I like substantially more than my own. It looks like I would have to spend more than *TEN TIMES* in order to get an apartment with a better view, bigger windows, and a bigger balcony or terrace. Oh, but the kitchen would be smaller and the indoor pool less than half the size...so...I guess I'm not upgrading anytime soon, even if I do come into millions.

For fun I decided to look up zillow to see what it would cost me right now to buy a house that would be tempting to actually move.

Requirements: a garage, a nice kitchen (not a small old kitchen), 3 BR and 1.5 BA, a decent sized lot.
A good school district (but meh...I'd prob just keep my kids where they are anyway). 
Air conditioning
I set the sq footage to 1250 to 1750.

So...the answer is $1.25M. 

The Zestimate on my house is $890k, though prob $850k is more reasonable considering COVID.

So...50% more.

[Bloop Bloop]

Hedonic adaptation is a very real thing. At a certain point, few luxuries feel luxurious anymore and everything not luxurious feels like shit. So basically, it's a great way to make a lot of life uncomfortable by comparison.

This may seem silly, be we hit that with COVID.  We rarely eat out - maybe 1-2x a month.  During COVID, we increased that to weekly, sometimes 2x a week, simply to help the local economy.

It got old real fast.  The kids hit the hedonistic adaptation point, and wanted more and more.  Hubby and I, yeah no.

We are back to once every 2 weeks.

For me it was luxury experiences that brought the worst out in life. Luxury items and experiences cost sooooo much more than the additional value that they add in general, that they often tend to feel like a subpar value for their cost.

That's why so many wealthy people bitch about what seems like little details. If I'm going to be paying several times the basic cost, then I expect it to be several times as nice! In reality, you pay several times as much for 20-150% nicer. As a result, luxury almost always falls short, unless you are getting it for free.

I had VIP Cirque de Soleil tickets last year, and they had an enormous premium for perks like VIP parking, access to a luxury private VIP tent, open bar, food, and a gift. I ended up pretty underwhelmed.

The parking wasn't valet, wasn't very close to the entrance, and was on gravel and hard to find. The tent in the photos looked magnificent, but was really just a little tent with some small sofas. There were a few little snacks, nothing special, and not enough to offset the over pouring by the bar staff. The open bar had mediocre wine, I would have preferred a cash bar with better options. The gift was a branded umbrella...weird.

I left the whole experience thinking "I'm pretty grateful I didn't pay for that". And that's what living in wealth felt like for me, a whole lot of failure to live up to expectations, but also getting so used to that level of luxury anyway that less-than-luxury feels even worse.

It's pretty lose-lose IMO.

Out of curiosity, in my recent contemplation of earning more than  I could possibly spend, I looked up what I would have to spend to find an apartment that I like substantially more than my own. It looks like I would have to spend more than *TEN TIMES* in order to get an apartment with a better view, bigger windows, and a bigger balcony or terrace. Oh, but the kitchen would be smaller and the indoor pool less than half the size...so...I guess I'm not upgrading anytime soon, even if I do come into millions.

I'd say this is spot on. Particularly when it comes to 'luxury experiences'. I know the common wisdom is that experiences make you happier than possessions. But I think luxury experiences are a unique brand of rip-off.

At the end of the day, unless you're paying for Giselle Bundchen to give you a hand job in a hot air balloon, most 'luxury' experiences don't offer anything more than their regular counterparts except a cheap delusion of exclusiveness. Concierge services are just a google web search dressed in a $300 suit. Business class flights offer fewer amenities than your living room at home, so why pay $8000 for the privilege of 24 hours' amenity? Valet parking involves putting your nice car into the hands of an underpaid teenager. Etc.

I'll never understand why people service their expensive cars at expensive dealerships, for example. You're paying a 200% mark-up just so the dealer can get the cheaply paid receptionist to make you a coffee, hand you a croissant, call you 'sir' and then wash your car on returning it. You can save $500-$1000 every time by going to an independent. It doesn't even void your warranty.

For all these reasons, the more I get paid, the more I recoil from most luxury experiences. If you think about it, they're actually unspeakably vulgar.

[2sk22]

I answered earlier in this thread but it just occurred to me that there is one thing which does seem to be worth the cost (for me at least) - traveling in business class for overnight long-distance flights. If you're careful, you can often find business-class fares which are no more than twice that of economy. I don't care much about the lounge, food and drinks but I do really like being able to sleep comfortably in a lie-flat seat. Before Covid, I traveled very long distances overseas to help look after aged relatives several times a year and this really made a big difference.

[Bloop Bloop]

Yeah, I agree, having a lie flat bed and having the access to a shower, massage and hot food in the lounge (particularly if you have a connecting flight) can be very helpful, although I don't know if it's several thousand dollars helpful.

[Trifle]

We are happily FIREd (lean FIRED, by the current standards of the forum).  If we had more money the only thing that we’d be tempted to spend it on would be more travel.  Not luxury stuff, just more slow-travel type trips.

[Metalcat]

I answered earlier in this thread but it just occurred to me that there is one thing which does seem to be worth the cost (for me at least) - traveling in business class for overnight long-distance flights. If you're careful, you can often find business-class fares which are no more than twice that of economy. I don't care much about the lounge, food and drinks but I do really like being able to sleep comfortably in a lie-flat seat. Before Covid, I traveled very long distances overseas to help look after aged relatives several times a year and this really made a big difference.

There are a number of things that are worth the cost, and those things vary depending on the person. I was not saying that no luxury is worth the cost.

It's really individual, which luxuries are worth it and which aren't, but the generalization stands that getting sucked into a life where you become accustom to premium luxury in virtually all aspects is likely to be perpetually disappointing and the hedonic adaptation is brutal.

I indulge in plenty of luxuries, the ones that I've decided add value. I'm just very judicious about letting luxury creep in, even if it's readily "affordable".

[HenryDavid]

Given more income, we’d make one specific costly purchase: a plug in hybrid electric car.

But the whole fun and motivation of frugality, for me, is to have great quality of life while costing The Earth way less. So increasing consumption cause “I can afford it” in dollar terms makes no sense, since i can’t afford it in environmental terms.

That said we have a ways to go yet....

[Much Fishing to Do]

Out of curiosity, in my recent contemplation of earning more than  I could possibly spend, I looked up what I would have to spend to find an apartment that I like substantially more than my own. It looks like I would have to spend more than *TEN TIMES* in order to get an apartment with a better view, bigger windows, and a bigger balcony or terrace. Oh, but the kitchen would be smaller and the indoor pool less than half the size...so...I guess I'm not upgrading anytime soon, even if I do come into millions.

For fun I decided to look up zillow to see what it would cost me right now to buy a house that would be tempting to actually move.

Requirements: a garage, a nice kitchen (not a small old kitchen), 3 BR and 1.5 BA, a decent sized lot.
A good school district (but meh...I'd prob just keep my kids where they are anyway). 
Air conditioning
I set the sq footage to 1250 to 1750.

So...the answer is $1.25M. 

The Zestimate on my house is $890k, though prob $850k is more reasonable considering COVID.

So...50% more.

When I hit FI and started considering RE, I was making enough $ I knew a year or two or three more of working now could make a huge difference versus what I could make if I decided to return to work later.  The only thing I could think of that would really cost that much would be a house, so I asked my wife to find the best one in the area for sale (knowing we would never want to move far) to see if I had a reason to plan to work longer than I was already planning.  We walked thru a $800k home and compared it to the $300k paid off home we live in in our MCOL area.  We just weren't that impressed, and not knowing if you'll actually like your neighbors as much as your current ones kinda made it a non-starter.

Unlike other mustachians we seem to have no problem finding things to spend money on and do let our spending increase annually to whatever 25x our investments are worth, but I can't think of anything we don't have that would make us any happier.