Author Topic: Wood Stoves  (Read 7013 times)

brokescientist

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Wood Stoves
« on: July 21, 2016, 09:49:14 PM »
Does anyone use a wood stove for primary heat?  Tell me your story?  Do you like it?  Do you hate it?  Do you enjoy splitting wood?  Is it worth it?  Where do you get wood?  How much do you pay?  Do you consider it safe?    Should I just buy a pellet stove instead and succumb to the pellet man corporations?  I want to know!

Thanks!

NV Teacher

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2016, 10:01:35 PM »
My brother uses a wood stove to heat his house.  He goes through about 4 cords of split wood a winter.  He gets the wood off of public land and pays $40 for the permit.  He doesn't like what it takes to get the wood but he likes being able to heat his house for less than $100 a year.  He just replaced his stove last summer and the new one is much more efficient so it's worth investing in a quality stove.  He also has a pellet stove in the basement.  It does the job but the wood stove is much cheaper to use for heat.

MrsPB

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2016, 03:17:24 AM »
We have one we use part time. We got most of the wood for free but did buy a cord one time. My DH splits and stacks it. We get our chimney swept once a year and got a heat gauge on it so you can be in the right burn zone to a avoid creosote deposits which increase fire risk. Ours is in the basement and will heat the whole house but it can be too warm at night so we usually close bedroom doors and have windows in there open a crack. We have wood piles everywhere for drying wood out. I love it but can't use when out for day and does require attention, especially when lighting, which isn't always possible with two little kids to look after upstairs. Hence the part time usage. I sure love knowing we are heating our house for free though!!

Alternatepriorities

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2016, 03:55:34 AM »
I spent the last two years heating almost exclusively with wood in a little Alaskan town on the bank of the Yukon river. Heating oil was $7 a gallon and based on my landlords estimated fuel consumption saved about $5,000 over two winters. I spent $600 on the chain saw and sold it for $400 last spring when we moved. I also cut more wood than I needed and sold the surplus wood for another $400 so that was a net gain. I like cutting wood, hauling it, splitting it and stacking. If the work stopped there I calculate cutting wood saved me better than $50 an hour. The one thing I don't like about burning wood is it the daily process of feeding the fire.

I wrote this post after my first fall cutting wood:
http://alternatepriorities.blogspot.pt/2014/10/of-wood-wealth.html?m=0

lthenderson

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2016, 04:43:28 AM »
I lived for nearly two decades with wood heat as the only heat source.  Do I like it? Yes. Having a direct heat source to cozy up to in the winter can't be replaced by any forced air system. Splitting wood is excellent exercise and can be meditative. However, it is a lot of time and work that one can spend doing other things. We lived in the country with a thousand acres of land so there was always wood to be had for "free". Woodburning is totally safe but there is more to know and do to keep it that way. It isn't dummy proof as just setting a thermostat and forgetting about things. Probably the number one thing people forget about when contemplating woodburning in a climate that may freeze is that every time they are gone for more than a day, they have to winterize their house, i.e. drain the pipes so things don't freeze. Some other drawbacks of of burning wood is that it is a really dry heat and a dirty heat unless you have your heat source in a basement or outside the house. A big plus is that you never worry about power outages in the winter because you have heat and a place to cook food.

The big question of is it worth it? In a strict financial sense, I would say absolutely not if you include your labor and have to pay for your wood. But there is something to be said for the ambiance of burning wood and the security of it not being tied to a market or grid for support.

futurehermit

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2016, 05:15:26 AM »
As others have explained, there are many variables which help to decide whether it is a good decision for you.

In April 2015 we moved into a 1,000 sq ft plus ranch off the southeast corner of lake Ontario north of Syracuse, NY.  Included was a free standing wood stove and a forced air propane furnace.

The house appears to have R -13 insulation.  Winters include at least one week of sub-zero nights, often more.

Last year (a fairly mild winter), I burned a little over 10 cords of wood.  Wood was $40 a cord cut into blocks needing splitting, or $50 a cord split and delivered.  These are fairly cheap prices, even in the Northeast where hardwood is plentiful. 

My wife doesn't care that we have a woodpile running the length of the property to season the requisite 6 to 12 months to dry.  To some, the sight would be offensive, and a shed would be needed.

Without the propane furnace, we would never be able to leave for an overnight, unless we drained the pipes and winterized the house.

Last year, I kept the house about 70 degrees in rooms immediately adjacent to the stove.  This means 90 degrees at the stove and 60 degrees at the furthest point away from the stove.  At about 0 degrees outside sustained, I had troubles keeping the inside temperatures consistent with just the wood stove. 

The value of drinking a cup of french press and reading the newspaper while watching a fire flicker on a 10 degree day and being toasty: ...

The value of "having" to go out and split wood with a maul when the newborn is fussy: ...

So, basic variables include: insulation of your house, efficiency/size of your stove, back-up source of heat, winter temperatures, access to fuel, storage of fuel, tools/labor to prepare it should you buy uncut/unsplit wood, and then:

As alluded to, the actual act of heating full time with a wood stove requires quite a bit of skill.  It is difficult to keep temperatures even in your house, as well as to be able to fill a stove before bed, not let your house get too cold overnight, and then fill it first thing in the morning.  Otherwise, plan on filling it when you get up to use the bathroom during the night.  If you are young enough to not have to use the bathroom in the middle of the night, don't blink, cause soon you won't be...

For us there is quite a bit of value in heating with wood, among my newborn escape plan, the warmth it provides, the free exercise, and the fact that if we loose power we can still stay warm.

Off to work on firewood,
Futurehermit

Fishindude

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2016, 05:35:52 AM »
We have a wood stove in back porch that we burn pretty steady during cold weather to help reduce our heating costs, plus the good hot wood fire just feels awfully good on a cold day or night.
Further, It gives peace of mind having a secondary source of heat, knowing the house and plumbing can't freeze up if power goes out.   Also have a wood stove in the barn that I fire up when out there in the winter.  It warms the place up quick.   You can't beat good wood heat for comfort on a cold day, and there is something kind of relaxing about hearing the fire pop & crackle.

We live on a farm and pretty much have an unlimited source of free wood cleaning up dead and fallen trees, so that isn't an issue.   I have also geared myself up well with a tractor, wagon, chain saws, wood splitter and a wood shed to store it in.  Iit's tough work, but good outdoor exercise and I enjoy it.  With the right tools you can process a lot of wood in a day.  Even if I didn't have a farm, I doubt we would have to buy wood.  I would just ask around and clean up dead and fallen trees for people.   Some tree trimmers will also dump you a load of logs for free.

No way I would have a pellet stove.  You are locked in to burning those pellets forever.
Too much easy free wood out there to be had.


Stachetastic

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2016, 06:01:36 AM »
We had a wood burning insert installed Fall 2015, and love it. We had a very mild winter last year, so we didn't go through wood as quickly as we projected. However, we just use ours to supplement our high efficiency gas furnace. My husband does get up at night and tend to it, and we are typically home for lunch to throw more wood in. I love the fact that I can curl up on my couch in an 80 degree room all winter long, without worrying about what my utility bills will run. We got our wood from trees we had removed on our property, and the tree company told us they'd be happy to drop off loads of wood any time we need more. In fact, we just had three more trees removed last month, and we had the company haul them away completely. We just don't have the time to deal with all that wood right now with other projects going on (it would have taken up our entire back yard until we could get to it), and we know we can give them a call and have a pile in our driveway any time.

Spork

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2016, 06:28:12 AM »
We have a non-catalyst Vermont Castings wood stove that is our primary heat source in the winter for a 2400 sqft house.  We do have central heat (propane) but try not to use it. 

We didn't design the house well when it comes to the wood heat... It does heat a central open area very well.  It has a hard time making it to the "corners" of the house.

It is a very pretty stove.... but... I am not convinced I would re-buy.  It has a pretty expensive internal re-burner chamber.  The first one lasted us 2 years.  I was thinking it was going out (after another 3 years) ... but pulled it out in the spring and it looked intact.  When it burns out, the wood burns up pretty quickly.

We live on ~8 acres in the woods, so all the wood comes from our land.  I generally wait for a tree to die/fall.  (I love trees and hate to take out a nice hardwood for heat.)  We live pretty far south, so our heating needs are not too high.  We  usually burn 4-6 cords of wood a winter.  Last winter was really mild and I bet we burned 2-3.  My wood pile still looks like it has 2+ in it.


When it comes to splitting wood: I'm a sissy.  I have a hydraulic splitter.  Punch me.

mbl

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2016, 06:35:01 AM »
We've used our wood stove to heat our 1200 sq ft ranch for over 15 years.
We have a propane furnace for backup, usually set to 55 degrees in winter.
Also use propane for our kitchen stove.

We live a few miles south of Lake Ontario in Western NY.
DH and DS get wood from the thousands of acres around us and other random places depending on the situation.

They cut and split it all by hand.  The cost is the fuel to haul it in using our truck and whatever it costs to fuel the chain saw, sharpen the chain and buy new chains.  Also, the cost of having the stove and chimney cleaned and inspected each year.
Unless it is an especially cold winter, we rarely have to buy any extra wood to get us through.

Our stove is in the family room in our basement.
It keeps that room warm and the rest of the house tolerable.
The bedrooms are very cold but we're fine under the down quilts.

It also serves as a place to dry clothing arranged on racks around it.

It is a lot of work but DH enjoys it.
There really isn't any big skill to using the stove.  The heat and longevity of the wood depends on what type you're burning.
In the mornings on the weekend, DH usually can start a new fire with the embers but often will want to clean the ash out and start anew....not a big deal when you're used to it.

We don't attempt to keep a fire going 24 hours a day.  As I said, we keep the furnace at 55 to prevent the pipes from freezing and make a fire when we get home from work....keep it going until bedtime and don't make another one until the following evening.   Most people wouldn't be comfortable with the house so cold when getting home from work but I don't mind and we're used to it.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2016, 06:39:20 AM by mbl »

Fishindude

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2016, 07:05:47 AM »
Interesting comments by Spork about the Vermont Castings wood stove.
I too had one of those real pretty, enameled finish Vermont stoves.   Used it one season and got rid of it.   Did not like the internal combustion chamber stuff as it just did not draft very well and if the wood wasn't at optimum dryness, it would not burn well.   Swapped it out for a a simple welded Buck brand stove and it works like a champ.

poorboyrichman

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2016, 07:12:28 AM »

going2ER

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2016, 07:20:05 AM »
We looked at getting a woodstove a number of years ago, but the increased cost to insurance just wasn't worth it. Just wondering for all of you wood burners, what is the cost of your house insurance? and are they aware that you have a wood stove?

hoosier

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2016, 07:56:32 AM »
Does anyone use a wood stove for primary heat?  Tell me your story?  Do you like it?  Do you hate it?  Do you enjoy splitting wood?  Is it worth it?  Where do you get wood?  How much do you pay?  Do you consider it safe?    Should I just buy a pellet stove instead and succumb to the pellet man corporations?  I want to know!

Thanks!

Having dry firewood (moisture content of about 15% or less) usually takes a year of sitting in a sunny/breezy spot.  Dry wood makes burning so much easier and safer (less chance of creosote and chimney fire). 

Go cut/split/stack a cord of wood and see if you have any interest in the process.  If you do, buy a wood stove.  If you don't, sell the firewood on CL.  Do this before you seriously consider getting a stove.

I burn wood and enjoy the entire process, but it isn't for everyone.

Syonyk

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2016, 08:01:27 AM »
Probably the number one thing people forget about when contemplating woodburning in a climate that may freeze is that every time they are gone for more than a day, they have to winterize their house, i.e. drain the pipes so things don't freeze.

I don't heat with wood, but my inlaws do.  They've got electric radiant heat (very expensive to run), so what they'll do is set that thermostat at 50F, and use the wood stove for normal heat (which explains why my wife likes it hot - their place is 85F+ in the winter with that thing running).  If they're away, the house won't freeze, but the electric is almost never on.

I've hauled a cord or two up to their place, with a lot more to go.  I appreciate having a place to get rid of dead trees, and they appreciate the free firewood. :)

Spork

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2016, 08:30:07 AM »
Interesting comments by Spork about the Vermont Castings wood stove.
I too had one of those real pretty, enameled finish Vermont stoves.   Used it one season and got rid of it.   Did not like the internal combustion chamber stuff as it just did not draft very well and if the wood wasn't at optimum dryness, it would not burn well.   Swapped it out for a a simple welded Buck brand stove and it works like a champ.

We have a long chimney and roof line combination such that our stove drafts really well.  If the internal combustion chamber were less fragile and/or less expensive to replace, I'd love this thing.  As it is: I think I will likely replace it in the next few years.

Stachetastic

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2016, 12:21:20 PM »
We looked at getting a woodstove a number of years ago, but the increased cost to insurance just wasn't worth it. Just wondering for all of you wood burners, what is the cost of your house insurance? and are they aware that you have a wood stove?

I called our insurance company when we were initially discussing the wood stove insert, and they said it would not make a difference in our premiums. Once it was in, I called to officially add it to our policy, and told them it had been professionally installed. (But they said they did not need proof of this.)

Glenstache

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2016, 12:33:20 PM »
I grew  up heating our house with a wood stove. It is really nice to lay out in front of the fire on a cold winter night. Truly a creature comfort. That said, if you live in an evenly modestly dense rural area, the smoke can really suck for your neighbors and possibly even for you. In addition to being an irritant, many of the combustion byproducts are carcinogenic. A number of my neighbors head with wood and it absolutely affects my ability to breathe in my own home in the winter, especially first thing in the morning when getting a cold fire back up and running. The modern efficient stoves are a lot better (and I honestly doubt those in my 'hood have them), but they are still not a panacea.

abner

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #18 on: July 22, 2016, 03:05:02 PM »
I installed an outdoor wood boiler 24 years ago when I built my house. I absolutely love the fact that I can turn up the heat to whatever I want in the winter. I also think it is one way I save money.

However.... I always caution anyone thinking of going this route that you better not mind cutting wood. You will cut wood if you use one. Not really anymore than a regular woodstove though.
I had high pressure jobs earlier in life and getting out on the weekend to do primal things like cutting wood for my own survival had a certain relaxing quality about it. Just me and the wood. No phone calls or deadlines or screaming bosses.
But I also don't care for fishing or hunting so my weekend was somewhat free.

I also refused to buy wood. I've told my wife that the day I buy wood will be the day I quit burning wood. Too much dead trees and storm blowdowns around my parts for that to happen.

All in all it's not for everyone. But it works for me.

Spork

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #19 on: July 22, 2016, 03:16:06 PM »
I installed an outdoor wood boiler 24 years ago when I built my house. I absolutely love the fact that I can turn up the heat to whatever I want in the winter. I also think it is one way I save money.

However.... I always caution anyone thinking of going this route that you better not mind cutting wood. You will cut wood if you use one. Not really anymore than a regular woodstove though.
I had high pressure jobs earlier in life and getting out on the weekend to do primal things like cutting wood for my own survival had a certain relaxing quality about it. Just me and the wood. No phone calls or deadlines or screaming bosses.
But I also don't care for fishing or hunting so my weekend was somewhat free.

I also refused to buy wood. I've told my wife that the day I buy wood will be the day I quit burning wood. Too much dead trees and storm blowdowns around my parts for that to happen.

All in all it's not for everyone. But it works for me.

I had a friend that lived in a pretty northern climate and had one of these (and loved it).  His would take gigantic logs.  He loaded it with a front end loader.  Some cutting required, but minimal.  And no splitting.

Mtngrl

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2016, 04:21:59 PM »
We have used a wood stove as our primary heat source for 18 years. We do have a gas boiler as backup -- as someone else mentioned, we keep this set at about 55. I wouldn't want to rely solely on a stove -- too much risk of pipes freezing if the fire goes out.
We're in Colorado at 8000 feet and our house is very efficient, so we burn about 4 cords of wood each winter. We get our wood from the national forest, at a cost of $10 a cord (plus the gas to go get it.) We split it with a hydraulic splitter we inherited from my dad.
We have the chimney swept once a year at a cost of about $90. In our previous house, my husband swept the chimney himself, with a set of brushes he purchased. But this house has a very steeply pitched metal roof and a stovepipe with an L -- so we have it professionally done.
Pros -- the house is warm all winter, no matter the outside temp.
The ambiance of a fire can't be beat.
I also cook a little on the fire -- a pot of beans or stew on an iron trivet on top, or baked potatoes or apples in the fire.
If the power goes out, we still have heat and are able to cook.
I also like building fires -- very satisfying to get one going with a single match.

Cons -- cleaning the ashes a couple times a week and safely disposing of said ashes. We have two covered ash buckets. We let the ashes sit for about a week, then bury them in the snow in the woods on our property.
The work of getting the wood -- though we enjoy it -- with our truck and trailer we can haul 1 cord of wood. It takes the two of us about 5 hours to drive to the woods, cut and load the wood and come home. We take a picnic lunch and it's a beautiful outing. It then takes my husband another 4 or 5 hours to split and stack that cord. Multiply times four.  I can see a point when we are older where we won't physically be up to this, but for now that's a ways off. Wood sells for about $150 a cord here, delivered.
The house is cold when we get up in the morning. Not horribly so, but the first order of business -- even before getting dressed -- is to get the fire going.

I grew up with a wood stove, so it's routine for me to have one, and I would sorely miss it if we moved to a house without one.

There was no change in our insurance rates with or without a wood stove.

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2016, 08:34:29 AM »
I grew up in a house with a woodstove in the otherwise unheated, finished basement (other two floors were electric heat).  I guess if you didn't heat the finished basement it didn't count as finished on your property taxes.  Anyways, it was basically a pain in the ass, in order to use the room you had to plan hours in advance to start the fire and heat the room up before you needed it, and even then you got a short window of time when it was comfortable, then it got HOT.  Also, frequently the flu wouldn't warm up fast enough and you'd get smoke in the house, plus you're dragging in and storing LOTS of wood which is messy.  After about two decades of dealing with it, my dad is in love with his gas fireplace in the house they built that he can start with a remote control. 

thd7t

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2016, 09:47:42 AM »
So, for people who have installed wood stoves, or paid for installation, what did it cost? Do you have any other recommendations?

Kitsune

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2016, 10:04:40 AM »
We have a Vermont Castings wood stove on the main floor of our house (about 1800 sq ft on 2 floors, plus basement). We live in Quebec, high altitude, with the North wind coming off the lake and hitting out front door most of the winter.

We mostly heat with wood, with electric furnace as a back-up and electric baseboards in the basement (convenient: we can heat JUST the home office when working from home, or heat up the guest room individually, as needed). Electric heating back-up was running about 75$/month on top of our wood cost, for last winter. We bought stacked/split wood (for a variety of reasons, and we'll be doing the same this year): 80$/cord, and we went through 6 cords and it was a mild winter; we'll likely get 8 this year.  Brings our winter heating costs to a total of approximately 800$.

For comparision sake: my parents have a house that's about the same size, and insulated about as well. They heat with propane, and it cost them over 1800$ for the winter.

WranglerBowman

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #25 on: July 25, 2016, 11:02:41 AM »
Does anyone use a wood stove for primary heat?  Tell me your story?  Do you like it?  Do you hate it?  Do you enjoy splitting wood?  Is it worth it?  Where do you get wood?  How much do you pay?  Do you consider it safe?    Should I just buy a pellet stove instead and succumb to the pellet man corporations?  I want to know!

Thanks!

Having dry firewood (moisture content of about 15% or less) usually takes a year of sitting in a sunny/breezy spot.  Dry wood makes burning so much easier and safer (less chance of creosote and chimney fire). 

Go cut/split/stack a cord of wood and see if you have any interest in the process.  If you do, buy a wood stove.  If you don't, sell the firewood on CL.  Do this before you seriously consider getting a stove.

I burn wood and enjoy the entire process, but it isn't for everyone.

Hoosier gave some pretty good advice to see if it's for you.  Wood burning for primary heat is def not for everyone, as it is a lot of work, and may not be worth the time to everyone.  Burning wood can save a decent amount of money if you're getting decent wood for free.  I've also saved about $1,800/year in oil by heating with wood.  If you plan to just buy firewood you might as well go with a pellet stove.  I live in Maryland and I've been heating almost entirely with wood for 9 years now and have learned a lot along the way.  By the time I cut, haul, unload, split, stack, and cover 1 cord of wood I'm generally about 5-6 hours in and I think I'm pretty efficient.  If you decide a wood stove is what you want to use as a primary heating source I would focus a lot on efficiency and find a good used stove, preferably catalytic.  If you just going to heat occasionally as a secondary heat source I would NOT get a catalytic stove.   

Fishindude

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #26 on: July 25, 2016, 11:50:24 AM »
So, for people who have installed wood stoves, or paid for installation, what did it cost? Do you have any other recommendations?

Just did a brand new installation in our cabin.
Purchased a new small non catalytic wood stove for $750, cost of the flue pipe and all accessories $700, then had a mason lay a rock wall behind the stove for another $1800.

My builder installed the triple wall flue system from ceiling up, I'd guess that to be a +/- 8 man hour job.
Myself and a helper set stove and installed the interior flue in a couple hours.
The masonry rock wall behind stove was not necessary, but I like the looks of it and the rock holds some radiant heat.

Spork

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #27 on: July 25, 2016, 12:34:34 PM »
So, for people who have installed wood stoves, or paid for installation, what did it cost? Do you have any other recommendations?

Just did a brand new installation in our cabin.
Purchased a new small non catalytic wood stove for $750, cost of the flue pipe and all accessories $700, then had a mason lay a rock wall behind the stove for another $1800.

My builder installed the triple wall flue system from ceiling up, I'd guess that to be a +/- 8 man hour job.
Myself and a helper set stove and installed the interior flue in a couple hours.
The masonry rock wall behind stove was not necessary, but I like the looks of it and the rock holds some radiant heat.

I can second the numbers above... and I was building from scratch.  The stove is not the expensive part.  The flue is.

Kitsune

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #28 on: July 25, 2016, 12:39:14 PM »
So, for people who have installed wood stoves, or paid for installation, what did it cost? Do you have any other recommendations?

Just did a brand new installation in our cabin.
Purchased a new small non catalytic wood stove for $750, cost of the flue pipe and all accessories $700, then had a mason lay a rock wall behind the stove for another $1800.

My builder installed the triple wall flue system from ceiling up, I'd guess that to be a +/- 8 man hour job.
Myself and a helper set stove and installed the interior flue in a couple hours.
The masonry rock wall behind stove was not necessary, but I like the looks of it and the rock holds some radiant heat.

I can second the numbers above... and I was building from scratch.  The stove is not the expensive part.  The flue is.

I will third that ratio. The numbers for us were more expensive, but we're in rural Canada (crap exchange rate + duties + expensive transit costs for heavy materials like cast iron). The chimney and flue were the same price as the stove, more or less.

rocketpj

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2016, 01:55:25 PM »
Depends on your wood supply.

My parents had an 80 acre hobby farm which included 20ish acres of poplar trees, which live for about 30ish years.  In order to prevent a big fire, my dad spent a fair amount of time hauling out dead trees and burning them in a big bonfire every winter.  He took a small percentage of that annual burn and bucked/split it to heat the house all winter.

So zero cost for the wood.  He had a little truck he was already using for the farm (which never left the property) and rented a wood splitter once a year for about 30 dollars.  A couple days of labour each year and they were set for the following year's heat.

They did have a gas furnace which came with the house, but they kept the thermostat at about 5C so it only came on when they were away or hadn't lit the stove.

All of the above may be a big part of why they have been retired for a long time.

MilesTeg

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #30 on: July 25, 2016, 02:35:40 PM »
If you are concerned about heating costs, you are typically much, much better off improving the energy efficiency of your home + using less heat than you are trying to find the cheapest possible way to heat your house.

Even with a fairly large home we spent only ~$300/yr in heating costs despite not trying too hard to be energy efficient. Insulation and smart use of sunlight/windows really does make a huge difference.

In addition, putting a wood stove in your home will do little or nothing to improve the value of your home, whereas making energy efficiency upgrades will, which reduces your effective energy costs possibly even tipping them to 0 or negative (if you plan to sell).

Digital Dogma

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #31 on: July 25, 2016, 04:24:49 PM »
I've grown up with wood heat, my family had an old Jøtul wood stove with a cracked side panel which we used through all 18 winters of my life till I moved out. About 5 years ago I helped to replace it, we got a new heavy duty cast iron stove with a nice glass face on the long side that doubles as a door. The damn thing weighed 400 pounds without the doors installed, and we had to lift it onto a 6X4 foot slab of granite 8 inches off the ground to install it in the center of the house. My advice is, hire someone to move the stove in place and then install the piping to your chimney with as few turns as possible (for example try to use two 15 degree elbows instead of a 30 degree elbow if you need to adjust the alignment).

The positive part is that you can't beat a wood stove for warmth, you can cook on it, you can humidify the house by putting a pot of water on top of the stove, and you can dry clothing near it. The negative part is waking up several times through the night to check on the stove, staying up for 20 minutes to make sure the wood you stoked actually caught fire so you can turn the air vent back down, and that paranoid feeling that you're burning your house down every time you leave the room your stove is in without triple checking the air vent.

Wood supply is always an issue, we had enough land to harvest storm-fall exclusively for our fuel. We never purchased wood. That can get expensive for the buyer, and unprofitable for the seller very quickly. We used a combination of a big 4X4 tractor with a PTO powered winch mounted to the 3 point hitch, a good ol Husqvarna chainsaw, and a Super Split wood splitter to keep our pile stacked. We'd skid 4, 5, or 6 full tree length logs at a time out the woods and down the road to the house whenever we got a good heavy snow. By skidding all the logs out in the snow we avoided gashing the landscape, wrecking the environment, and all the swampy mud spots froze over so we'd skate right over without getting stuck.

If you plan on splitting the wood yourself, I can recommend a Super Split if you can find one. Its FAST, no waiting around on hydraulics. You can replace parts easily, we put a new Honda motor on ours and replaced the forged steel shaft, we hope to get another 30 years out of it. It relies on kinetic energy on a heavy duty cast iron fly wheel to drive the ram quickly, and a spring loaded return mechanism. It certainly beats splitting by hand based on production alone, you'll spend less time splitting logs than trying to dig your way out of a pile of split wood.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2016, 04:43:05 PM by Digital Dogma »

Fishindude

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #32 on: July 26, 2016, 05:12:53 AM »
Someone mentioned insurance costs.
I spoke to my State farm agent on another matter yesterday and quizzed them about this.   The answer was no extra premium charges if it is properly installed.

Vic99

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #33 on: July 26, 2016, 06:58:02 AM »
Been heating with a soapstone wood stove for 9 years 24/7, except for the occasional long weekend getaway. I love it.

First stove was a Hearthstone Heritage, but it had to work extra hard when temps got below 30 F for my 1600 sq ft house with average insulation.  Sold it and got a Woodstock Fireview.  Can't say enough good things about this company.  Customer service is top notch and the product is beautiful.  Has a catalytic combustor that needs to be replaced every 5-7 years I think.  Makes the stove really efficient with a typical burn of 8-12 hours depending on what I'm burning.  I think my record was 14 hours with a full load of seasoned hickory.  Bottom line - If your wood is dry, you will not be disappointed.

If you plan ahead it is likely you will love wood heat.  Start getting wood NOW. Wood must be stacked in wind and or sun.  Pine needs 6-9 months to season (yes you can burn seasoned pine), most hardwoods 1 year and dense woods like oak, hard maple, hickory need 2-3 years, but you can get away with 1 year, just less heat output.  I cover the top of the stacked pile, but some don't. 

How ever you get the install done, get it inspected.  Might even be worth getting the inspector to look at your set up first so it can be done right the first time.

If you are not going to buy your own wood, you could get it from neighbors with downed trees (tell everyone at work and in your area that you would be interested in wood and then make good on retrieving it), state parks with a permit if your state allows, tree service companies sometimes have more than they know what to do with - befriend someone who works there.  Untreated kiln dried pallets work in a pinch.  After a few fires, run a magnet to pick up nails at bottom of stove.

Buy a maul, not an axe.  I use an 8 lb.

I have Geico for insurance and they were not worried about a wood stove that was inspected.

Nothing like coming home to a wood fire.  Good luck.

Digital Dogma

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #34 on: July 26, 2016, 08:17:49 AM »
Oh, I should also add one point I haven't seen covered yet. Burning any wood creates a thick flammable coating in your chimney called creosote which acts like charcoal when it catches fire. Burning wet wood creates much more creosote than burning dry seasoned wood. You should clean your chimney prior to burning anything in your stove for the year, and you may need to do it more frequently depending on your wood source. If you build up a layer of creosote without cleaning your chimney(even a quarter inch), it can ignite and cause a chimney fire which is very difficult to put out, and could burn your house down.

Spork

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #35 on: July 26, 2016, 08:27:47 AM »
I might also mention: if you are okay with heights and don't have a terrible roof line...  Chimney sweeping is very DIY friendly.  This is especially true for wood stoves.  The dust/creosote will all fall into a nicely contained box.

Things I've learned:
* my stove has an easily damaged second stage.  If I keep the stove damper open, a nice bit of cast iron will cover the second stage and keep the chimney brush from hitting it.
* the bit of stove pipe that runs through my living room has a bend in it that is difficult to get the brush through.  I clean from the chimney down to the bend from above.  Then I take the interior pipe down and take it outside and clean it.
* get a brush type/size/shape that matches your chimney.  If you have stainless steel, use a plastic brush so that you don't scratch it.
* my roof is really steep.  I ended up putting in some D-rings so that I could tie myself off to it when I clean the chimney.

I usually clean mine once in mid-season (usually January) and once when the season ends.  The second cleaning, I disassemble the stove a bit and clean all the hard to reach spots.  The actual chimney cleaning part takes about 30-45 minutes.  You'll pay for the brushes and flexible pole in one cleaning.

Prairie Stash

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #36 on: July 26, 2016, 09:14:45 AM »
My parents use a Wood Boiler, it beats a wood stove for convenience and ease, approximate cost was $5k. In extreme cold, -40 F, needs loading once/day and in mild weather you can get a few days. It uses dampers to regulate the burn rate, it uses less wood that way and gives an even heat (many people with wood stoves over heat and need to open windows). You can plumb it into your hot water heater, cuts down on that bill too, you'll need to burn year round but in the summer you can go longer without reloading. The unit stays outside so you typically get an insurance reduction; it has no Carbon monoxide risk or fire risk for the house (no creosote chimney in the house, in an extreme case it will burn itself but your house will be fine). Since the wood stays outside its cleaner in the house, there's no loose bark or sawdust which is another bonus.

You can make these into a hybrid. My parents retrofitted an oil burning furnace to take advantage of the fan. If they wanted to they could buy oil to burn, say for a 3 week holiday in January, and not worry about getting a neighbor to stop by daily to reload it. They have a radiator filled with a glycol mixture that circulates out to the boiler, its pretty simple plumbing. You can also plumb in multiple buildings; garage shop, doghouse, second house, swimming pool or whatever to all run off one boiler system.

As for wood supply its a lot of exercise. I use to sell firewood to a lot of people, most people hate getting it. If you want to get into a wood stove start getting wood now and sell it. It's an easy way to determine how much you like/dislike getting it, you'll get paid to do research. I sold a small pile for $60 last weekend, it was a couple of trees I got from neighbours in the city. As a teenager I use to make a few grand a year selling wood, it was a multiple year payoff (cut/season/sell - at least a year to get paid).

Fishindude

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #37 on: July 26, 2016, 09:30:58 AM »
A good straight flue, and burning a hot fire with good dry wood eliminates most creosote issues and hazards.  Elbows in flues are collectors of this stuff and should be eliminated if possible.
I have three wood stoves in three different buildings, all straight flues.  They have rarely needed to be cleaned.

The outdoor wood boilers are definitely the most efficient and probably easiest wood heating method.  They will burn just about any kind of wood and will handle huge logs, all of the mess stays outdoors, and the fire hazard is away from the house.  A downside is, without electricity the recirculating pump won't run so no warm water is getting to the house to heat your furnace plenum.

What you don't get from the wood boilers is the nice radiant heat from a wood stove that is so nice to feel on a cold winter day.   Also, a standard wood stove can keep your house warm when the power is out via radiant heat.

slschierer

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #38 on: July 26, 2016, 10:52:59 AM »
We have a wood stove attached to our furnace.  In fact, at one point you could control the heat of the house through the thermostat even when the wood stove was the primary source of heat.  That function no longer works and hasn't as long as we've had the house.  The furnace is a natural gas furnace, and I have to say that the set up is handy!  The heat from the wood stove is blown through the house using the furnace's fan.  Because the thermostat no longer works, the fan automatically kicks on when the wood stove gets hot enough (I'm not exactly sure what what internal temperature that is).  The heat then spreads throughout the house. 

Wood stoves provide a great, warm heat.  It just feels nicer than the heat provided by just our natural gas furnace.  Plus, it's saving us tons of money as the wood we've used has thus far all been free.  My husband doesn't love the time he puts in splitting and cutting it, but he gets over it every winter when we get our utility bill!

Spork

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #39 on: July 26, 2016, 11:04:44 AM »
A good straight flue, and burning a hot fire with good dry wood eliminates most creosote issues and hazards.  Elbows in flues are collectors of this stuff and should be eliminated if possible.
I have three wood stoves in three different buildings, all straight flues.  They have rarely needed to be cleaned.

Someone put a truss right where the flue should have been in my house.  Hence: it has a 45 bend to the left and then another 45 degree bend right.  The framers made a bit of a mistake. 

aaron3719

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Re: Wood Stoves
« Reply #40 on: July 28, 2016, 07:33:32 AM »
There's a free online library that I use out in CA. free to sign up and read books online. pretty cool but i'll have to check out my local library too.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!