Author Topic: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?  (Read 6357 times)

TimmyTightWad

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Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« on: July 19, 2017, 07:07:42 PM »
I'm planning to fly from either DC or NYC to Bangkok and am seeing flights with layovers in Beijing and Hong Kong with 1 hour to 2 hour layovers. I will have to switch airlines during the layover and I'm wondering if these time limits are too tight. Why would the airlines sell connections that may be impossible to make?

The airlines I'll be connecting to would be Air China or Cathay Pacific, does anyone have any experience with those airlines? Or know if/how they would accommodate me if I miss my connection coming from an American airline like United

Zikoris

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2017, 07:27:55 PM »
I'm planning to fly from either DC or NYC to Bangkok and am seeing flights with layovers in Beijing and Hong Kong with 1 hour to 2 hour layovers. I will have to switch airlines during the layover and I'm wondering if these time limits are too tight. Why would the airlines sell connections that may be impossible to make?

The airlines I'll be connecting to would be Air China or Cathay Pacific, does anyone have any experience with those airlines? Or know if/how they would accommodate me if I miss my connection coming from an American airline like United

Hong Kong immigration/customs is smooth and efficient. No problem with a short layover there. China immigration/customs is a gong show, and I would not do a layover of less than three hours there.

As for why the airlines sell connections you might not be able to make - it's done by a computer that doesn't take into account things like a specific airport being designed/staffed by idiots, different standards for customs and immigration, and so on.

TimmyTightWad

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2017, 11:27:58 PM »
Hong Kong immigration/customs is smooth and efficient. No problem with a short layover there. China immigration/customs is a gong show, and I would not do a layover of less than three hours there.

As for why the airlines sell connections you might not be able to make - it's done by a computer that doesn't take into account things like a specific airport being designed/staffed by idiots, different standards for customs and immigration, and so on.

The layover in China is only 1 hour 10 minutes so sounds like that's not worth pursuing. I'll look into Hong Kong and Tokyo connections

johnnyd

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2017, 11:35:08 PM »
The Hong Kong connection would be best, but tight connections can also be fine in Tokyo.  I'd avoid routing through mainland China.  I've flown through HKG both Tokyo airports dozens of times and have never had issue and staff there have always been super helpful when things are tight.  I'd advise not having any checked bags and trying to the front if you're flying in economy.

Drifterrider

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2017, 05:21:56 AM »
If the layover is between connecting flights for an onward destination, does a person even have to go through customs???

If I have a plane change in the US, I prefer to have at least one hour between flights.  Two hours is a safety margin.  Once and only once I walked off the plane at gate "X" and got on the other plane at gate "Y".  Literally next to it.  ONCE :) (and that was in Atlanta.  I should have bought a lottery ticket that day).

Zikoris

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2017, 08:59:37 AM »
If the layover is between connecting flights for an onward destination, does a person even have to go through customs???

Yes, and it's always seemed kind of stupid to me.

cube.37

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2017, 10:41:56 AM »
If I remember correctly, I dont think any of my international layovers (layover not in the same country as departure or destination) required me to go through customs.

RobFIRE

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2017, 11:32:01 AM »
Hmm, I'd only consider a short layover of an hour if I had specific information/research that the airport ran efficiently, did not have to change terminal, and I did not have any checked-in luggage to deal with, and missing the connection would not significantly affect the rest of my trip. Even if the airport was a good one, I would still be nervous about a short layover at a major airport as from my experience of Heathrow and Gatwick in the UK, queues at security can sometimes take 20 to 30 minutes, as can passport control (though with a connection you might not pass through that), and gates can be a full 10 to 15 minute walk from departures area due to size of airport, even if the two flights are within the same terminal.

A friend of mine flew with Air China about 5 years ago and said the flight wasn't great because all the in-flight entertainment was on a central screen (no screens on backs of seats), along the lines of "History of Mao Tse-tung" parts 1 to 3, in Chinese with Chinese subtitles... He also said that the airport in China (don't recall if it was Beijing but probably) had multiple internal passport checkpoints within the same parts of the airport. Now things might be different of course...

Zamboni

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2017, 11:45:37 AM »
I've had to go through customs on some international layovers but not others.

I remember specifically that we all had to go through immigration and customs in Lisbon, for example, and the line was hellalong, but they had staff seeking out people who had tight connections and pulling them to the front of the line, which was nice. In Canada I haven't had to go through it (but I haven't flown through Canada recently, so could be different now.)

Honestly, the worst customs and immigration lines I've encountered have always been in the US . . . that's where they've made me almost miss connections. I almost missed a flight coming into San Francisco from Asia recently even though I had nothing to declare, I'm a US citizen, and I had more than a 3 hours layover. That pushed me over the edge: I have global entry now, thankfully.

Catbert

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2017, 12:55:45 PM »
If you want to research particular connections, got to:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum

There is an amazing wealth of knowledge over there.  I've seen people ask similar questions about particular flights and gotten answers from people who fly that particular route frequently.  Warning:  they can be mean.

JoJo

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2017, 02:12:00 PM »
Definitely check - you don't have to go thru customs everywhere, and that can save 5-60 minutes.  In Taipei, we just needed another carry on bag scan, which took maybe 5 minutes but no customs. 

VoteCthulu

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2017, 04:02:38 PM »
As a general rule I'd say 2 hours, but I've made 15 min layovers in Seoul, so it depends on how much risk you're willing to take. Leaving China I've had flights over 4 hours late, but that's too rare to plan around IMHO.

YogiKitti

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2017, 05:43:45 PM »
Be careful and do your research. I once saw a mistake flight with an airport change in Tokyo, the layover was 30 minutes when the bus between the airports takes longer than that.

Kaybee

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2017, 06:55:08 PM »
I'm just curious (since I work for an airline and those should be "illegal" connections).  Are you finding these flight combos on the airline's site or through a site like Expedia with all the legs being attributed to the same airline?

My airline's software won't allow you to book connections without a minimum amount of time (depending on airport/whether customs must be cleared/etc) unless you do a manual override, which I'm not even sure can be done on the public site (I only know because I use an internal system).

Again, I'm just very curious because those connections DO seem problematic.

Drifterrider

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2017, 05:52:11 AM »
If the layover is between connecting flights for an onward destination, does a person even have to go through customs???

Yes, and it's always seemed kind of stupid to me.

OK, I guess I've never had that happen. 

TimmyTightWad

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2017, 06:56:22 AM »
I'm just curious (since I work for an airline and those should be "illegal" connections).  Are you finding these flight combos on the airline's site or through a site like Expedia with all the legs being attributed to the same airline?

My airline's software won't allow you to book connections without a minimum amount of time (depending on airport/whether customs must be cleared/etc) unless you do a manual override, which I'm not even sure can be done on the public site (I only know because I use an internal system).

Again, I'm just very curious because those connections DO seem problematic.

I'm searching primarily using Google flights.

TimmyTightWad

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2017, 06:58:11 AM »
If you want to research particular connections, got to:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum

There is an amazing wealth of knowledge over there.  I've seen people ask similar questions about particular flights and gotten answers from people who fly that particular route frequently.  Warning:  they can be mean.

I think I heard of this forum before, there was a thing a while ago on that site with people trying to manipulate reward credit card sign ups to get free flights or something

YogiKitti

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2017, 07:21:54 AM »
I'm just curious (since I work for an airline and those should be "illegal" connections).  Are you finding these flight combos on the airline's site or through a site like Expedia with all the legs being attributed to the same airline?

My airline's software won't allow you to book connections without a minimum amount of time (depending on airport/whether customs must be cleared/etc) unless you do a manual override, which I'm not even sure can be done on the public site (I only know because I use an internal system).

Again, I'm just very curious because those connections DO seem problematic.

My mistake flight was found on the American airlines website

MMMaybe

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2017, 07:39:37 AM »
I would have a minimum of 2-3 hours to be honest. No point in getting stressed out. Flights in and out of China are notoriously delayed. HK is not as bad but its rainy season now so bad weather can hold things up.

FiguringItOut

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2017, 07:47:58 AM »
Sorry to barge in with my own question.  But maybe someone knows the answer.

I have a flight from NY to Amsterdam through Dublin with 1 hr layover. 
And on the way back, I'm flying from Brussels to Miami with 2 hrs layover in London (Heathrow). 
I'll have to switch planes both times, but all four flights are British Airways flights. 

Will this be a problem?  I naively thought that because all flights are BA and I have American passport and don't need visas, then I shouldn't be concerned with moving around the airports at Dublin and London during layovers.  I also didn't think there are any customs to be worried about unless I'm leaving the airport, which I don't plan on doing.  Was I wrong?

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2017, 01:13:19 AM »
If the four flights are sold on one ticket, BA will take care of you if you miss the second flight, and will check your bags through to the final destination. Ask for the second boarding pass at the first check in.

At Heathrow you may need to change terminals, 2 hours is fine if you land on time and have bags checked through or hand luggage only. You will have a security check (including removing large liquids) and a passport/visa check, but it won't be the massive line to enter the UK. When you land at Heathrow follow the purple signs, and you can change terminal and stay airside.

If you don't check your bag all the way through, you will need to go through passport control, baggage reclaim, customs (not a big deal 99.9% of the time), and then check in again. This would be tight on time if you had a terminal change.

VoteCthulu

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2017, 09:01:49 PM »
Always take everything you'd need to overnight in a hotel in your carry-on, just in case. Even if you have plenty of time, flights get cancelled and airlines can bump you (hopefully less violently now days).

deborah

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #22 on: July 24, 2017, 04:55:56 AM »
Most countries I've been through make you go through customs if you are doing a lay over. A year or so ago I went through Atlanta and although I had a two hour lay over, I arrived at the departure gate with only three people left to board my onward flight! I had to go through customs there. Earlier this year, I caught a flight that went to Singapore. The people ahead of me in the check-in queue were going to Vietnam, and didn't have a visa for Singapore (they were only going to be there for a couple of hours for the connection). They were tossed off the flight. Make sure you have appropriate visas for your lay overs!

TimmyTightWad

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Re: Minimal amount of time for an international layover?
« Reply #23 on: July 24, 2017, 10:35:04 AM »
Most countries I've been through make you go through customs if you are doing a lay over. A year or so ago I went through Atlanta and although I had a two hour lay over, I arrived at the departure gate with only three people left to board my onward flight! I had to go through customs there. Earlier this year, I caught a flight that went to Singapore. The people ahead of me in the check-in queue were going to Vietnam, and didn't have a visa for Singapore (they were only going to be there for a couple of hours for the connection). They were tossed off the flight. Make sure you have appropriate visas for your lay overs!

O wow I didn't even consider visa issues, wish there was a centralized site or something where you could quickly research all of this

 

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