Author Topic: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'  (Read 44513 times)

arebelspy

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #200 on: October 06, 2016, 09:45:07 AM »
So you don't believe the personal responsibility things you type, you just type them in the hopes that they'll allow you to control the behavior of others?

Not quite.

A more accurate way of putting is that it's conceivable, even likely, that some people's actions are determined by algorithms that place a lot of weight on whether, in their mind, it's possible for them to do something. If we let those people know that, in fact, something is within their control and ability, the algorithms governing their actions may take that into account and then they may actually be able to do those things. After that happens, the original claims that I made will end up being true in a self-fulfilling way.

Or to say it a more artful, but less parsable, way: By promoting personal responsibility, we can actually have the effect of creating personal responsibility. The difference between somebody making bad choices and somebody making good choices could be that one of them didn't believe that it was possible to make the good choices, and we can change that.

I would further add that even if we don't have free will, we feel like we do, and we must necessarily act like we do.   We can use the determination information to our advantage though, especially when trying to cultivate empathy for others ("if I was in their same circumstances, with the same background, parents, beliefs, experiences, etc. etc., I'd be acting exactly as they are").
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Chris22

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #201 on: October 06, 2016, 09:45:50 AM »
As someone mentioned, it takes hard work, talent, and luck to be successful.  Obviously, only one of the 3 is within one's control.   Do the math.

You know, it's amazing. The harder I work and the more I plan things, the luckier I seem to be.

There were two instances where I was extremely lucky:

1.  Born to affluent parents in the US who emphasized hard work and education
2.  Graduated from college in 2004 in a time of relative economic prosperity

Almost everything else has been the result of hard work and planning, such as having specifically chosen a college major with lots of opportunities, intentionally chosen jobs that will give diverse experiences that will be valuable to my career, choosing to live in an area with lots of opportunities, deciding to spend my free time going back to school for an advanced degree, etc etc.

I didn't know you were a gay black woman, Chris.

???  I don't get the reference.

dignam

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #202 on: October 06, 2016, 09:45:55 AM »
My gosh, this thread is a perfect example of why I sparingly visit this site...so much complaining, personal attacks and butt hurt all around.

Millennials blaming Boomers for the recent recession(s) because of their "lust for more".  Boomers using the tried and true "younger generation is just lazy and entitled".  I mean, come on...

Take what you will from the OP's data.  Placing blame does absolutely nothing to help anyone.

I can also add my anecdote about how I graduated college in 2009 during probably the absolute worst time to look for a job.  But really, who cares?

This thread and site should be about providing insight and advice to help people achieve the financial standing they want.  It helped me see that even though I wasn't dealt a great hand in terms of timing, I still made boneheaded decisions financially after college.  What good does placing blame do?

GuitarStv

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #203 on: October 06, 2016, 09:46:19 AM »
So you don't believe the personal responsibility things you type, you just type them in the hopes that they'll allow you to control the behavior of others?

Not quite.

A more accurate way of putting is that it's conceivable, even likely, that some people's actions are determined by algorithms that place a lot of weight on whether, in their mind, it's possible for them to do something. If we let those people know that, in fact, something is within their control and ability, the algorithms governing their actions may take that into account and then they may actually be able to do those things. After that happens, the original claims that I made will end up being true in a self-fulfilling way.

Or to say it a more artful, but less parsable, way: By promoting personal responsibility, we can actually have the effect of creating personal responsibility. The difference between somebody making bad choices and somebody making good choices could be that one of them didn't believe that it was possible to make the good choices, and we can change that.

Thanks for this reply.  It really makes your frame of mind and argument clear to me.  This and your previous post have given me a lot to think about.

GuitarStv

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #204 on: October 06, 2016, 09:48:52 AM »
As someone mentioned, it takes hard work, talent, and luck to be successful.  Obviously, only one of the 3 is within one's control.   Do the math.

You know, it's amazing. The harder I work and the more I plan things, the luckier I seem to be.

There were two instances where I was extremely lucky:

1.  Born to affluent parents in the US who emphasized hard work and education
2.  Graduated from college in 2004 in a time of relative economic prosperity

Almost everything else has been the result of hard work and planning, such as having specifically chosen a college major with lots of opportunities, intentionally chosen jobs that will give diverse experiences that will be valuable to my career, choosing to live in an area with lots of opportunities, deciding to spend my free time going back to school for an advanced degree, etc etc.

I didn't know you were a gay black woman, Chris.

???  I don't get the reference.

If you were born a straight white man with no physical or mental handicaps, you were extremely lucky as well.  You seemed to have left these benefits off your list of lucky things.

Chris22

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #205 on: October 06, 2016, 09:50:04 AM »
As someone mentioned, it takes hard work, talent, and luck to be successful.  Obviously, only one of the 3 is within one's control.   Do the math.

You know, it's amazing. The harder I work and the more I plan things, the luckier I seem to be.

There were two instances where I was extremely lucky:

1.  Born to affluent parents in the US who emphasized hard work and education
2.  Graduated from college in 2004 in a time of relative economic prosperity

Almost everything else has been the result of hard work and planning, such as having specifically chosen a college major with lots of opportunities, intentionally chosen jobs that will give diverse experiences that will be valuable to my career, choosing to live in an area with lots of opportunities, deciding to spend my free time going back to school for an advanced degree, etc etc.

I didn't know you were a gay black woman, Chris.

???  I don't get the reference.

If you were born a straight white man with no physical or mental handicaps, you were extremely lucky as well.  You seemed to have left these benefits off your list of lucky things.

Fair enough, lump them in with #1, it's the same principle.

cheapass

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #206 on: October 06, 2016, 09:51:16 AM »
If you were born a straight white man with no physical or mental handicaps, you were extremely lucky as well.  You seemed to have left these benefits off your list of lucky things.

Quite true. We should penalize him in some manner to level the playing field. Maybe deny him entry to university based on his race?

GuitarStv

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #207 on: October 06, 2016, 09:58:47 AM »
If you were born a straight white man with no physical or mental handicaps, you were extremely lucky as well.  You seemed to have left these benefits off your list of lucky things.

Quite true. We should penalize him in some manner to level the playing field. Maybe deny him entry to university based on his race?

Of course not.  When examining our own success though, it's important to remember the many things that were given to us that helped us out.  Forgetting them, or pretending that they weren't important tends to lead down a path of indifference to the plight of others, or even outright cruelty in word and deed.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2016, 10:04:30 AM by GuitarStv »

arebelspy

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #208 on: October 06, 2016, 10:03:09 AM »


My gosh, this thread is a perfect example of why I sparingly visit this site...so much complaining, personal attacks and butt hurt all around.

Millennials blaming Boomers for the recent recession(s) because of their "lust for more".  Boomers using the tried and true "younger generation is just lazy and entitled".  I mean, come on...

Take what you will from the OP's data.  Placing blame does absolutely nothing to help anyone.

One can recognize and be grateful for one's privileges, or disadvantages, without placing blame or complaining.

It's interesting to look at the state of the world, postulate on why things are the way they are, and how we can improve them.  Coming up with explanations for this isn't "placing blame."

This is a case of seeing what you expect to see, IMO.


If you were born a straight white man with no physical or mental handicaps, you were extremely lucky as well.  You seemed to have left these benefits off your list of lucky things.

Quite true. We should penalize him in some manner to level the playing field. Maybe deny him entry to university based on his race?

No one said anything about leveling a playing field, but when listing advantages to leave off some big ones (race and gender) seem pretty important.

I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
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I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

ender

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #209 on: October 06, 2016, 10:34:59 AM »
My gosh, this thread is a perfect example of why I sparingly visit this site...so much complaining, personal attacks and butt hurt all around.

Millennials blaming Boomers for the recent recession(s) because of their "lust for more".  Boomers using the tried and true "younger generation is just lazy and entitled".  I mean, come on...

Take what you will from the OP's data.  Placing blame does absolutely nothing to help anyone.

I can also add my anecdote about how I graduated college in 2009 during probably the absolute worst time to look for a job.  But really, who cares?

This thread and site should be about providing insight and advice to help people achieve the financial standing they want.  It helped me see that even though I wasn't dealt a great hand in terms of timing, I still made boneheaded decisions financially after college.  What good does placing blame do?

Overreaction much?

I've found this to be one of the most intellectually stimulating discussions I've participated in on these forums in quite some time.


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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #210 on: October 06, 2016, 10:48:55 AM »
So you don't believe the personal responsibility things you type, you just type them in the hopes that they'll allow you to control the behavior of others?

Not quite.

A more accurate way of putting is that it's conceivable, even likely, that some people's actions are determined by algorithms that place a lot of weight on whether, in their mind, it's possible for them to do something. If we let those people know that, in fact, something is within their control and ability, the algorithms governing their actions may take that into account and then they may actually be able to do those things. After that happens, the original claims that I made will end up being true in a self-fulfilling way.

Or to say it a more artful, but less parsable, way: By promoting personal responsibility, we can actually have the effect of creating personal responsibility. The difference between somebody making bad choices and somebody making good choices could be that one of them didn't believe that it was possible to make the good choices, and we can change that.

So the function of a civilized society should be to make people aware of the choices available, holding them accountable for those choices in so much as it helps not to repeat them, while all the time realizing that neither society or the individual may have control over the choices that get made ?

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #211 on: October 06, 2016, 11:15:26 AM »
So you don't believe the personal responsibility things you type, you just type them in the hopes that they'll allow you to control the behavior of others?

Not quite.

A more accurate way of putting is that it's conceivable, even likely, that some people's actions are determined by algorithms that place a lot of weight on whether, in their mind, it's possible for them to do something. If we let those people know that, in fact, something is within their control and ability, the algorithms governing their actions may take that into account and then they may actually be able to do those things. After that happens, the original claims that I made will end up being true in a self-fulfilling way.

Or to say it a more artful, but less parsable, way: By promoting personal responsibility, we can actually have the effect of creating personal responsibility. The difference between somebody making bad choices and somebody making good choices could be that one of them didn't believe that it was possible to make the good choices, and we can change that.

So the function of a civilized society should be to make people aware of the choices available, holding them accountable for those choices in so much as it helps not to repeat them, while all the time realizing that neither society or the individual may have control over the choices that get made ?

One of the more interesting aspects of living as an expat abroad in a few different countries, and having family in the UK and Australia, is that you get to see how different socieities function.  Americans are probably more blind than they realize to just how different our society is to the UK (and much less informed on current events on that side of the pond).  Since the article was written about UK wealth, I think we've missed some key discussion points that their economy has been in a quagmire for quite some time.  The Brexit event didn't happen in isolation, but it also isn't a sign of better things to come.  I also think that an outsized chunk of the difference between generations NW comes from homeownership and investments and has very little to do with increased consumption or less income.   
« Last Edit: October 06, 2016, 11:17:08 AM by EscapeVelocity2020 »

teen persuasion

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #212 on: October 07, 2016, 07:04:22 AM »
So you don't believe the personal responsibility things you type, you just type them in the hopes that they'll allow you to control the behavior of others?

Not quite.

A more accurate way of putting is that it's conceivable, even likely, that some people's actions are determined by algorithms that place a lot of weight on whether, in their mind, it's possible for them to do something. If we let those people know that, in fact, something is within their control and ability, the algorithms governing their actions may take that into account and then they may actually be able to do those things. After that happens, the original claims that I made will end up being true in a self-fulfilling way.

Or to say it a more artful, but less parsable, way: By promoting personal responsibility, we can actually have the effect of creating personal responsibility. The difference between somebody making bad choices and somebody making good choices could be that one of them didn't believe that it was possible to make the good choices, and we can change that.

So the function of a civilized society should be to make people aware of the choices available, holding them accountable for those choices in so much as it helps not to repeat them, while all the time realizing that neither society or the individual may have control over the choices that get made ?

One of the more interesting aspects of living as an expat abroad in a few different countries, and having family in the UK and Australia, is that you get to see how different socieities function.  Americans are probably more blind than they realize to just how different our society is to the UK (and much less informed on current events on that side of the pond).  Since the article was written about UK wealth, I think we've missed some key discussion points that their economy has been in a quagmire for quite some time.  The Brexit event didn't happen in isolation, but it also isn't a sign of better things to come.  I also think that an outsized chunk of the difference between generations NW comes from homeownership and investments and has very little to do with increased consumption or less income.   

I think that even within the U.S. there are different local economies and societies, and I learn of them thru forums like this one.  The economies that many describe where $100k salary jobs are plentiful and common to achieve are completely foreign to me, regardless of education.  Sometimes the industry doesn't exist here, or just doesn't command the extreme salaries here that seems normal elsewhere.

ender

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #213 on: October 07, 2016, 07:11:20 AM »
Honestly a huge difference in that perception is cost of living and its one that people often forget to consider.

$100k in SF/Seattle is a lot different than $100k in the Midwest.

teen persuasion

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #214 on: October 07, 2016, 07:28:38 AM »
It's about college major choices, mobility and willingness to move around for income mainly.  At 34 currently almost everyone I am friends with earns 6 figures except the teachers and liberal arts majors.

Have you talked to the average American?   Avg American is an idiot!  How the hell is he/she supposed to get through a major like math, finance, engineering, etc?  That's the most common path to getting to $100K by age 30.   This is not even mentioning other factors. 

I think some of you guys live in a bubble.  What appears to be easy to me and you is not so easy for most other people.         

And again personal choices.  Yes the average American is an idiot, but you know whose fault that is, that individuals (barring of course those with disabilities and probably below poverty level individuals).  With the Internet nowadays, and free classes on everything from how to fix your car to your house to free lessons in programming it is their personal choice to remain an idiot.  Libraries are free, and provide free internet, and most schools have both of those things.  Learn something that someone else wants and teach yourself ways to make it better.

You don't like working in McDonalds, you don't like being a cashier in Walmart...do something about it instead of whine that it's not fair or not average.  The US by and large, has a consumeristic spending problem, NOT a lack of opportunity problem especially for those in the middle class.

Had to comment on this one, since you so nicely mentioned "free" libraries.  Not everyone can educate themselves up to high salaries.  Some jobs just never pay that well, regardless of the education required.  Think about the consequences of everyone increasing their salaries to $100k - the costs get passed on.

My "free" library's entire budget is $103k.  Book budget, utilities, subscription services, ALMs fees, supplies, and yes personnel costs.  How much would our tax need to increase to pay each of our staff $100k annually?  How much would our ALMs fees increase when Central's staff also earns $100k each?  And so on.  Now, would the library tax on the school tax bill still be ~$25 for an average home, or would it be many multiples more?  What about the farmers, whose library tax is higher than average, since it's based on property value (we're a rural area, and it's a bone of contention)?  Pass it on as a cost of doing business, in higher food prices, naturally.

cerat0n1a

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #215 on: October 07, 2016, 09:04:37 AM »
One of the more interesting aspects of living as an expat abroad in a few different countries, and having family in the UK and Australia, is that you get to see how different socieities function.  Americans are probably more blind than they realize to just how different our society is to the UK (and much less informed on current events on that side of the pond).  Since the article was written about UK wealth, I think we've missed some key discussion points that their economy has been in a quagmire for quite some time.  The Brexit event didn't happen in isolation, but it also isn't a sign of better things to come.  I also think that an outsized chunk of the difference between generations NW comes from homeownership and investments and has very little to do with increased consumption or less income.   

Spot on. It's been interesting to see how far from the original post the thread has gone. The economic circumstances for people of my age are massively different to those 10 or 20 years younger, because of housing, pensions & university. Nothing to do with iPhones etc.

Anyone in Britain who is old enough to have owned a house over the past couple of decades has had a huge boost to their NW for not much effort.

The house I bought for 75k in 1999 would go for well over 300k now, meanwhile the FTSE-100 is at the same level it was in 1999. Houseprice rises have massively outstripped inflation. The population of the country has increased significantly, but relatively few new houses are built. Not many people in their twenties or early thirties own a home in the south of England.

A further big difference is pension provision. People aged 50+ often have company or government pensions which paid out a percentage of final salary and were typically hugely more generous than the offer today, almost all such schemes are closed to new entrants.

Finally, people of my generation received a free university education - our fees were paid and we received a grant for living costs. Being frugal and working during my degree meant that I finished my degree with cash in the bank. Today's graduates will be starting out at least 50k in debt.

One can make the point that times were much harder when I was a child - the house I lived when I started school had no heating and no inside toilet, three children sharing a bedroom. That would be considered unsuitable for human habitation in the UK today. Nevertheless, it is indisputable that we have had a free ride in comparison to younger people.

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #216 on: October 07, 2016, 02:17:16 PM »
Thanks for the encouragement cerat0n1a (if that's your username, I shudder to think what the password is :).  One other thing I heard about in the UK was that folks were converting their garage into living space and seeing tremendous ROI.  That trend has probably played out by now, but seemed like a nice one-time boost for the homeowner class this past decade.

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #217 on: October 07, 2016, 05:17:42 PM »
The salaried earning market is practically a zero-sum game. Whatever you earn, someone else does not.

Same goes for the ideas market. You can't invent something that already exists.
Those are extraordinary claims.

What I mean is that if you earn a salary, someone else is not earning it. Fact, when companies outsource positions to India, the people whose jobs are outsourced lose said jobs. Besides, I said practically. There exists some jobs where you create value.

I don't know how you can disagree with the second paragraph. Maybe you have a time traveling machine?

This.
Back when everyone had a good enough job to become a Millionaire, the good jobs hadn't yet been outsourced.  And by "everyone" we really meant [the white, male fraction of ]everyone over here, not those Asians over there.  And what happened because so many jobs went over there is that fewer people over there starved to death.  In the generation since average wealth here dipped a bit, it skyrocketed over there.  The metrics being compared here are selectively excluding some vital parts of the story.
I'm not insensitive to the plight of GenY in the west.  It's pretty dismal in certain places no matter how educated because the competition has changed for them.  In addition to globalization, there is another demographic item: life expectancy.  Old folks are hanging around longer, hanging onto the wealth they've got.  And some of them are even hanging onto jobs.  Law and Academia are famously full of people who are productively plugging away at it in their 60s and 70s, never ceding opportunity to younger folks who have the same level of drive and education.  Look at Queen Elizabeth never letting her son ascend to the throne for the most famous example. 
Prior generations in the West didn't face this competition. 

ender

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #218 on: October 07, 2016, 05:49:28 PM »
The house I bought for 75k in 1999 would go for well over 300k now, meanwhile the FTSE-100 is at the same level it was in 1999. Houseprice rises have massively outstripped inflation. The population of the country has increased significantly, but relatively few new houses are built. Not many people in their twenties or early thirties own a home in the south of England.

Can we stop cherry picking "if you bought a house in <pretty much the worst time to have dumped tons of money into the market in the past 40 years> you would have way beat the market return!" dates?

What if you had bought the house in 2002? Or 1995? Suddenly a very different picture.

I mean I get it. Houses might be more expensive compared to market returns. But picking some of the worst possible times to have bought houses is just intellectually dishonest.

Frankly, people get lucky and unlucky based on when they make major life decisions like buying a house. Plenty of people have bought houses and lost crazy amounts of money on them by having unlucky timing, too.  Some poor chap who bought a house in 2007 probably still has a negative real return on housing, even in the UK and even though "housing prices have massively outstripped inflation."

Quote
One can make the point that times were much harder when I was a child - the house I lived when I started school had no heating and no inside toilet, three children sharing a bedroom. That would be considered unsuitable for human habitation in the UK today. Nevertheless, it is indisputable that we have had a free ride in comparison to younger people.

It is indisputable?

No, it's because older generations were willing to deal with... not having much money by... not wanting crazy expensive lifestyles at age 22 out of college. You grew up in a house with 3 kids sharing a bedroom. How many of these poor millennials having such a rough lifestyle now would even consider that? Oh right. NONE OF THEM. How many families of 5 living in a 2 bedroom house do you know?

It really frustrates me when people confuse lifestyle inflation through standards inflation with hardship.


If every generation's expectation is a better standard of life than their parents' generation life will always be harder.

arebelspy

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #219 on: October 07, 2016, 06:04:32 PM »
If every generation's expectation is a better standard of life than their parents' generation life will always be harder.

I don't follow.  I could maybe see this argument being true in the case that the expectation isn't met, and even then I wouldn't say it's harder, I would say that their view on it is coming from a disappointed viewpoint, so naturally it seems worse.
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ender

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #220 on: October 07, 2016, 06:10:08 PM »
If every generation's expectation is a better standard of life than their parents' generation life will always be harder.

I don't follow.  I could maybe see this argument being true in the case that the expectation isn't met, and even then I wouldn't say it's harder, I would say that their view on it is coming from a disappointed viewpoint, so naturally it seems worse.

I guess what it comes down to is that most people try to achieve the lifestyle of their parents by the time they are 25 and are naturally disappointed. This feels particularly true in the "millennial" generation, which corresponds to a lot of the "life is so hard for you" sentiment.

I don't know how true it was in the "boomer" generation. Maybe it was equally as true then as it is now. I don't know.

use2betrix

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #221 on: October 07, 2016, 06:30:46 PM »
Not many people get rich when they don't hold themselves accountable for their successes and failures, which is a trend I always see amongst these threads about higher income earners.

arebelspy

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #222 on: October 07, 2016, 06:52:32 PM »
If every generation's expectation is a better standard of life than their parents' generation life will always be harder.

I don't follow.  I could maybe see this argument being true in the case that the expectation isn't met, and even then I wouldn't say it's harder, I would say that their view on it is coming from a disappointed viewpoint, so naturally it seems worse.

I guess what it comes down to is that most people try to achieve the lifestyle of their parents by the time they are 25 and are naturally disappointed. This feels particularly true in the "millennial" generation, which corresponds to a lot of the "life is so hard for you" sentiment.

I don't know how true it was in the "boomer" generation. Maybe it was equally as true then as it is now. I don't know.

This idea (along with the seeing the best of friends' lives on social media making people unhappy) became a very popular theory a few years ago due to a few internet articles, and it makes sense at first blush.  I'm not sure I 100% buy it though.

I mean, yes, sure, in theory.  I just don't think the majority of people do this, and it's actually more millennial bashing.

Having it called out as a thing helped though, I think.  Easier to get perspective when you realize that.
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use2betrix

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #223 on: October 07, 2016, 07:00:15 PM »
If every generation's expectation is a better standard of life than their parents' generation life will always be harder.

I don't follow.  I could maybe see this argument being true in the case that the expectation isn't met, and even then I wouldn't say it's harder, I would say that their view on it is coming from a disappointed viewpoint, so naturally it seems worse.

I guess what it comes down to is that most people try to achieve the lifestyle of their parents by the time they are 25 and are naturally disappointed. This feels particularly true in the "millennial" generation, which corresponds to a lot of the "life is so hard for you" sentiment.

I don't know how true it was in the "boomer" generation. Maybe it was equally as true then as it is now. I don't know.

Except for those that made more at 25 on their own than their parents ever made combined in their life.

This year, at 28, I have probably made 2x as much as my parents ever have in their life. Yet - they have bachelors and masters degrees and I only have an associates degree. My parents are the perfect example of boomers.

Again, it's there for those that want it. You may not always do what you love, live where you love, or work just 40 hr work weeks, but it can be done.

People are like "omg I only make 50k, but I chose a major I loved and will only live in one city and I won't work over 40 hrs a week."



arebelspy

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #224 on: October 07, 2016, 07:16:14 PM »
[Humblebrag]
...
People are like "omg I only make 50k, but I chose a major I loved and will only live in one city and I won't work over 40 hrs a week."

I chose a major I loved, a job I loved (not related to that major) and haven't regretted it for a second.

Money is just money.  The literal years of my life (4 of university, 8 of working) I would not trade for more money.

You can mock people who make that choice, but if I were doing it all over, I'd do it the same.

You may enjoy selling yourself for money, but not all of us do.  :)
I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about me, this Business Insider profile tells the story pretty well.
I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

cheapass

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #225 on: October 07, 2016, 07:26:34 PM »
I chose a major I loved, a job I loved (not related to that major) and haven't regretted it for a second.

Money is just money.  The literal years of my life (4 of university, 8 of working) I would not trade for more money.

You can mock people who make that choice, but if I were doing it all over, I'd do it the same.

You may enjoy selling yourself for money, but not all of us do.  :)

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that during your early working career, you weren't bitching and moaning about your situation and blaming those greedy 1%ers because you weren't living like a Kardashian right out of school.

arebelspy

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #226 on: October 07, 2016, 07:53:51 PM »
I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that during your early working career, you weren't bitching and moaning about your situation and blaming those greedy 1%ers because you weren't living like a Kardashian right out of school.

I think the actual amount of people that do this is very, very small.

There are a large majority of us that recognize some problems with the current status quo, especially as it applies to wealth and income equality, but to paint everyone who vocalizes recognition of this problem as "bitching and moaning" is not correct, IMO.
I am a former teacher who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and am now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about me, this Business Insider profile tells the story pretty well.
I (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out the Now page to see what I'm up to currently.

use2betrix

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #227 on: October 08, 2016, 03:11:17 AM »
[Humblebrag]
...
People are like "omg I only make 50k, but I chose a major I loved and will only live in one city and I won't work over 40 hrs a week."

I chose a major I loved, a job I loved (not related to that major) and haven't regretted it for a second.

Money is just money.  The literal years of my life (4 of university, 8 of working) I would not trade for more money.

You can mock people who make that choice, but if I were doing it all over, I'd do it the same.

You may enjoy selling yourself for money, but not all of us do.  :)

You are a very rare exception. You also managed to retire in 8 years so of course there were no complaints about money lol.

Not everyone can make a ton of money doing something they truly enjoy, and often times it's a trade off. If someone decides to make that trade off, however, they probably shouldn't spend their time complaining about it or blaming others.

cerat0n1a

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Re: Wealth of people in their 30s has 'halved in a decade'
« Reply #228 on: October 08, 2016, 10:49:19 AM »
What if you had bought the house in 2002? Or 1995? Suddenly a very different picture.

I mean I get it. Houses might be more expensive compared to market returns. But picking some of the worst possible times to have bought houses is just intellectually dishonest.


No - you're completely wrong. Just comparing the actual point when I did buy a house.

If you'd bought a house in the UK in 1995 or 2002, or indeed any other time in the past, your returns have significantly outstripped wages. The ratio of average (mean) house price to average (mean) full time earnings was 2.87 in 1995. It's 5.89 today. In London it's closer to 10. Unlike the US, our average wages have grown significantly ahead of price inflation in that time too. It's harder to do the comparison with the stock market (huge gearing/leverage available to buy a house in the form of mortgages) but for most middle class middle aged people in British almost all of their net worth is in the form of housing.

Quote
Some poor chap who bought a house in 2007 probably still has a negative real return on housing, even in the UK and even though "housing prices have massively outstripped inflation."

Again, you're assuming US experience translates to UK. 2007 was indeed a peak and you'd have been significantly down on your house by 2008, but again, by now, you're well ahead.

As a reminder, the original article linked by the OP is giving factual data about the fact that people in their 30s in the UK have on average half the net wealth of people the same age a decade ago. For anyone living here, that's a statement of the obvious. Things have got harder financially, on average for young people than they were for people my age.

I was a millionaire at thirty - got lucky with a tech start-up. Somebody who is thirty today could do the same. It's not that there aren't opportunities, or ways to save money. But it's a fact that young people in Britain are poorer on average than people the same age in the recent past.