Author Topic: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?  (Read 2940 times)

Focus_on_the_fire

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Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« on: June 16, 2022, 09:55:48 PM »
When things started to get bumpy with the stock market, DH was okay. Now that it's gone on for a while we're seeing more red days than green, he's started to get upset about the losses. We aren't in the danger zone, but seeing six figure drops is rough.

I've been talking to him about how continuing to buy shares will give us the advantage during recovery. I also tried the "long haul" conversation, but nothing is really connecting.

Is anyone else in a similar situation? If so, do you have any tips for me to help ease his concerns?

Dicey

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2022, 10:24:35 PM »
1. Don't look.
2. Buy.
3. If you must look, track number of shares, not value of shares.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2022, 10:26:19 PM by Dicey »

ToTheMoon

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2022, 10:35:10 PM »
Have him read through the JL Collins stock series...that is what I do when I start to feel even the slightest bit irrational!

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2022, 10:41:11 PM »
1. Don't look.
2. Buy.
3. If you must look, track number of shares, not value of shares.

Have him read through the JL Collins stock series...that is what I do when I start to feel even the slightest bit irrational!


Oh, this is great. I hadn't read this. Thanks!

Not Sure

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2022, 10:46:20 PM »
I track net-worth rather than just investments.  Since we are still contributing and have substantial non-investment assets, net-worth is much more stable.

vand

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2022, 01:46:08 AM »
Markets will test you in different ways.

While the Covid Crash was a test of holding your nerve in the midst of sheer panic, this is a test of patience, discipline, and your investor's temperament to keep focus on the long term and ignoring the short term gyrations. In a way it's much more difficult that surviving the Covid crash, because mental capital finite and is being used every day.

It's easy to have patience and discipline and a long term goal when the market is going the way you want; it's much more difficult when it's going against you.


You cope with it by making sure you have something else that gets you excited every day, totally separate from the wealth building thing. Personally I just bought myself a new set of rollerblades. I used to skate a lot but haven't for many years, and I'd like to rekindle my enthusiasm for it. It will give me something else to do while we are waiting for the markets to deliver the upside. Whatever your thing is that is irreverent but you're totally into... it helps puts everything into perspective.

Wolfpack Mustachian

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2022, 03:50:04 AM »
1. Don't look.
2. Buy.
3. If you must look, track number of shares, not value of shares.

I'll echo this. I update my spreadsheet pretty much whenever I remember a year has gone by and I've not updated it. The people I know who actually invest make comments about how bad their 401ks are this day or that. I nod but just don't check.

I'm multi years from pulling the plug. The evaluation of his I'm doing can be handled when I update overall spreadsheets and look at my current withdrawal rates given how I stand at years end. When I'm retired in sure I'll keep a closer eye on it because it'll merit it, but for now, I'm not going to look at it and certainly if I do, do as dicey said and only pay attention up how many shares I've accumulated.

maizefolk

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #7 on: June 17, 2022, 04:08:01 AM »
I will just echo what others have said. Once a person's investments are on autopilot there is no reason they need to be checking their accounts, following the financial news, or tracking how many days were read or green. And if it is making him feel worry and he doesn't need to do it, the absolute best thing he can do to keep calm is to stop.

Patient: "Doctor, it hurts when I hold my arm like this."
Doctor: "Then don't do hold your arm like that!”

Freedomin5

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2022, 04:16:28 AM »
You haven't lost any money unless you sell.

Stocks are now "on sale" -- makes sense to buy more.

reeshau

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #9 on: June 17, 2022, 04:35:41 AM »
Speaking from the post-FIRE perspective, I am also managing / looking at my cash pile, as part of my net worth.  Whatever is happening now, the cash pile will cover quite a few months, and so things aren't "bad" until that starts to look low.  I don't need to sell anything during the current market "weather," so I can still consider the long-term performance of my equities.  This is a consideration vs. return optimization / 100% equities portfolio.

I'm still thinking I entered this downturn a little light on cash, because there is a lot I would like to buy, but am leaning more on the first thought above.  I'm just at he point where I've settled into an ongoing level of cash, after having gotten a severance and had my home equity in cash b3fore the March 2020 swoon, and home and car purchase heading into the gangbusters 2020 recovery.

If your DH needs some homework to do to keep him busy, send him after some I bond purchases.  At least they won't go down!

Ron Scott

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #10 on: June 17, 2022, 05:33:20 AM »
There is nothing odd, or wrong, about being generally risk-averse. Two approaches to handle this:

1. If your concerns have you considering selling assets in a down market when you don’t need to sell for living expenses, reduce you exposure to stocks over time. Swings is net worth are typically lower in portfolios with less exposure to equities.

2. Generate a greater than average net worth before retiring.

It is difficult—and often a waste of time—to try convincing a risk-averse person they are wrong to be concerned.

theninthwall

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2022, 06:05:43 AM »
This thread was helpful for me: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/investor-alley/optimistic-contrarian-article-thread/

It’s easy for others to say “Just don’t look!”, but when all the news is bad some people (me included) can’t help but think about it. I also find that most family and friends think what we are doing is impossible, so the doubt in my mind also grows.
So it’s nice to get a few rays of sunshine to think about in the above thread.

GnomeVader

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #12 on: June 17, 2022, 06:09:29 AM »
Have him read through the JL Collins stock series...that is what I do when I start to feel even the slightest bit irrational!

Can you please provide a link.
Thank you

Dave1442397

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #13 on: June 17, 2022, 06:10:11 AM »
I always like to use these as reminders.


ATtiny85

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #14 on: June 17, 2022, 07:20:56 AM »
I always like to use these as reminders.

Yeah, I think those pictures really provide a good perspective. You buy stocks for the long term, so look at the long term.

Dicey

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #15 on: June 17, 2022, 08:19:52 AM »
Have him read through the JL Collins stock series...that is what I do when I start to feel even the slightest bit irrational!

Can you please provide a link.
Thank you
G-o-o-g-l-e will get you there.

ETA: lest anyone think my reply snarky, I checked. It took four keystrokes. J-l-space-c.

Jim's a god in FIRE circles.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2022, 10:23:42 AM by Dicey »

BC_Goldman

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #16 on: June 17, 2022, 08:46:56 AM »
My to is to focus on the amount you are investing/saving vs the value of the accounts.

I'm down significantly from the end of the year. I was a little bothered at the new balance as of the end of last month. Last night I looked again and saw I had dropped another 9ish%. This time I was actually happy because the stock sale is really getting good! I know that eventually it will come back and I will be in even better shape because I'm still buying now.

I just have to keep my head down and put in money every paycheck.

Villanelle

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2022, 08:59:39 AM »
The MMM forums, or an occasional comment on NPR, are the only way I know what the market is doing.  I check my balances 2x/yr to rebalance or change future allocations to steer me closer to my target AA.  That's it.

Consequently, I don't know how much I'm down (or up).  And  don't care, since it isn't actionable information for me.  (We are still accumulating.)  Maybe some people would feel more stress because of that, but for me, it works very well. 

ALso, if you don't have an  IPS, I suggest doing that.  Then if/when he gets squirrely, you can refer back to what he said he wanted to do in a less-emotional state of mind

GnomeVader

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2022, 09:36:05 AM »
Have him read through the JL Collins stock series...that is what I do when I start to feel even the slightest bit irrational!

Can you please provide a link.
Thank you
G-o-o-g-l-e will get you there.

ETA: lest anyone think my reply snarky, I checked. It took four keystrokes. J-l-space-y.

Jim's a god in FIRE circles.

Thank you - Love the Answer.

WSUCoug1994

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2022, 10:14:49 AM »
This is my favorite line of all time -

Warren Buffett once said that it is wise for investors to be “fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful.”

Dicey

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2022, 10:24:34 AM »
Have him read through the JL Collins stock series...that is what I do when I start to feel even the slightest bit irrational!

Can you please provide a link.
Thank you
G-o-o-g-l-e will get you there.

ETA: lest anyone think my reply snarky, I checked. It took four keystrokes. J-l-space-c.

Jim's a god in FIRE circles.

Thank you - Love the Answer.
Whoops. Autocarrot strikes again. Fixed.

DrinkCoffeeStackMoney

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2022, 11:04:35 AM »
To the OP:

As you know you haven't really lost a dime unless you sell at this point and history tells us it will all come back plus more. On paper we're down about $100k since January 1st of this year and I'm still buying all I can. If your SO can't handle the fluctuations try to get them not to look at it.

Good luck to you.

caleb

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #22 on: June 17, 2022, 11:18:08 AM »
Getting away from internet service for a few days or weeks usually does me good, especially when the headlines are bad.

mistymoney

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2022, 12:29:37 PM »
I always like to use these as reminders.

Not quite as reassuring as you might think. The 1929 crash didn't hit bottom until 1932?! And didn't get back to the previous top until the early 50's?

so 25 years.....that would be hard to handle....

then there is 66-86, pretty flat.

If you keep buying - ok, much better than just waiting. But if you already pulled the plug, not so great.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2022, 12:31:18 PM by mistymoney »

mistymoney

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2022, 12:38:11 PM »
I always like to use these as reminders.

Not quite as reassuring as you might think. The 1929 crash didn't hit bottom until 1932?! And didn't get back to the previous top until the early 50's?

so 25 years.....that would be hard to handle....

then there is 66-86, pretty flat.

If you keep buying - ok, much better than just waiting. But if you already pulled the plug, not so great.

So the only way out is to keep buying! That is my tip.

Turtle

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #25 on: June 17, 2022, 02:04:17 PM »
1. Don't look.
2. Buy.
3. If you must look, track number of shares, not value of shares.

You've inspired me to go do some share number comparisons.

On my older stock accounts (Which I basically did Dogs of the Dow as I contributed, set to DRIP, and don't look at often) the DRIP alone has increased my share numbers by between 1.2-7.7% over the past year.  For what my current individual basket is, I don't expect more DRIP additions until July.

For employer 401k which is getting active max contributions from me and an employer match, the increases range from 12.6-27.7% over the past almost 12 months.  There's one more paycheck before I can do a true 12 month comparison, so those numbers will actually be a little bit higher.

Definitely a more positive thing to be focusing on -- thank you for the idea!

PDXTabs

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2022, 02:12:29 PM »
He sounds very human. Most people are like this. I'm not sure exactly what the best tack is. I would try pointing out that everything is losing right now.

Leave your money in cash? Lose to inflation, guaranteed.
Leave your money in crypto? That's down like a rock.
Leave your money in bonds? That's down too.

At least your equities are continuing to pay dividends and now you get to reinvest those dividends while stocks are on sale.

Omy

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2022, 03:51:37 PM »

2. Generate a greater than average net worth before retiring.

It is difficult—and often a waste of time—to try convincing a risk-averse person they are wrong to be concerned.

Yep. I'm VERY risk averse, and I haven't broken a sweat during this recent downturn.

1) We saved a lot more than we needed before FIREing.
2) We have rental income that covers most of our expenses.
3) We paid off our houses prior to FIREing and have no debt.
4) We have 5-10% in cash/savings bonds to avoid selling equities at a loss.
5) We track net worth quarterly and don't look at it more frequently.
6) We can start collecting social security in a couple years, if needed.

Most of these are arguably suboptimal choices, but I sleep like a baby knowing that we've over planned and over saved.

*I just re-read this and it sounded very braggy. That wasn't my intention. My being extremely risk averse caused us to come up with strategies that would keep me from panicking during downturns. So far it's working.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2022, 04:01:06 PM by Omy »

PDXTabs

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2022, 04:02:17 PM »
It is difficult—and often a waste of time—to try convincing a risk-averse person they are wrong to be concerned.

Yep. I'm VERY risk averse, and I haven't broken a sweat during this recent downturn.

I also consider myself pretty risk-averse. But you have to ask yourself what risks you are worried about.

Eg, I don't own rentals because they have too much idiosyncratic risk for me. But some people love them and that's okay too. My portfolio is 99% global market cap weighted equities because what could possibly be safer than a slice of the world economy (in the long run)? Any currency could fail, any government could fail, and my portfolio wouldn't go to zero. If my portfolio does go to zero I will regret not having spent all that money on bullets and beans.

Dicey

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #29 on: June 17, 2022, 08:42:04 PM »

2. Generate a greater than average net worth before retiring.

It is difficult—and often a waste of time—to try convincing a risk-averse person they are wrong to be concerned.

Yep. I'm VERY risk averse, and I haven't broken a sweat during this recent downturn.

1) We saved a lot more than we needed before FIREing.
2) We have rental income that covers most of our expenses.
3) We paid off our houses prior to FIREing and have no debt.
4) We have 5-10% in cash/savings bonds to avoid selling equities at a loss.
5) We track net worth quarterly and don't look at it more frequently.
6) We can start collecting social security in a couple years, if needed.

Most of these are arguably suboptimal choices, but I sleep like a baby knowing that we've over planned and over saved.

*I just re-read this and it sounded very braggy. That wasn't my intention. My being extremely risk averse caused us to come up with strategies that would keep me from panicking during downturns. So far it's working.
It's okay to brag here, @Omy. Except we call it "sharing facts" or somesuch, not that awful "b" word.

eyesonthehorizon

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2022, 10:45:33 PM »
I didn't hear it as a brag, either. It sounds like honest assessment of multiple strategies. Enviable, though, even as I grit my teeth & hold onto my DPOYM membership card.

My main tip: Track shares accumulation, and/or passive income projections. The latter can feel more tangible to a nervous mind.

NorthernIkigai

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #31 on: June 18, 2022, 01:08:55 AM »
1. Don't look.
2. Buy.
3. If you must look, track number of shares, not value of shares.

I have a different strategy: I look even more often in times when values are falling. I’m very risk averse in real life, but have taught myself over the years to embrace risk on the stock market. Since discovering the concept od early retirement I have even raised my stock allocation, since I now have a goal to invest towards, rather than just a general “oh, it’s good to save”. This also means  I don’t have spare cash lying around to invest in times like these!

I enjoy seeing the swings and learning how I react to them. This is not for everyone, of course.

Dicey

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #32 on: June 18, 2022, 05:17:36 AM »
I didn't hear it as a brag, either. It sounds like honest assessment of multiple strategies. Enviable, though, even as I grit my teeth & hold onto my DPOYM membership card.

My main tip: Track shares accumulation, and/or passive income projections. The latter can feel more tangible to a nervous mind.
Wait! With interest rates escalating rapidly, and inflation a raging bonfire, don't you feel just a little bit smug amazingly brilliant? Asking for a friend.

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #33 on: June 18, 2022, 07:02:18 AM »
Markets will test you in different ways.

While the Covid Crash was a test of holding your nerve in the midst of sheer panic, this is a test of patience, discipline, and your investor's temperament to keep focus on the long term and ignoring the short term gyrations. In a way it's much more difficult that surviving the Covid crash, because mental capital finite and is being used every day.

It's easy to have patience and discipline and a long term goal when the market is going the way you want; it's much more difficult when it's going against you.


You cope with it by making sure you have something else that gets you excited every day, totally separate from the wealth building thing. Personally I just bought myself a new set of rollerblades. I used to skate a lot but haven't for many years, and I'd like to rekindle my enthusiasm for it. It will give me something else to do while we are waiting for the markets to deliver the upside. Whatever your thing is that is irreverent but you're totally into... it helps puts everything into perspective.

Thanks for the perspective. I think you're right on separating wealth building from life in general. I think he's been huddled around the TV a bit too much lately. :) Getting out will do us both some good.

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2022, 07:04:06 AM »
You haven't lost any money unless you sell.


Oh, I'm stealing this! Thanks

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2022, 07:15:41 AM »
There is nothing odd, or wrong, about being generally risk-averse. Two approaches to handle this:

1. If your concerns have you considering selling assets in a down market when you don’t need to sell for living expenses, reduce you exposure to stocks over time. Swings is net worth are typically lower in portfolios with less exposure to equities.

2. Generate a greater than average net worth before retiring.

It is difficult—and often a waste of time—to try convincing a risk-averse person they are wrong to be concerned.

Our position is solid and neither of us are taking about selling. A lot of people are in a very different boat, so I feel grateful for that.

I don't want to suggest that his concerns are wrong. I get a twitchy feeling when I look at things too. I was hoping instead for ways or ideas to minimize the anxiety and keep things in perspective.

I really liked the suggestion above about getting out and doing things separate from the finances for that reason. For a lot of people, I think it's hard not to get hooked into watching the tickers right now.

Fomerly known as something

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2022, 07:16:13 AM »
1. Don't look.
2. Buy.
3. If you must look, track number of shares, not value of shares.

I’ll add, look at asset allocation not share value.  I was checking in on my TSP account last night because they just revamped their system and it’s causing issues so wanted to make sure nothing got changed.  I didn’t look at the value at all, I do know I’m still roughly at a 70/30 split as a should be.

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #37 on: June 18, 2022, 07:27:29 AM »
Original OP here:

Wanted to give a follow up. DH and I talked last night about the state of our investments. Thanks to the thoughtful and helpful replies, I was able to share some thoughts that seemed to help put things in perspective. It was really a great conversation. Today, we're stepping away from the computer and going for a nice day hike in the rain.

Thanks for helping me out folks.

Dicey

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #38 on: June 18, 2022, 08:28:29 AM »
Original OP here:

Wanted to give a follow up. DH and I talked last night about the state of our investments. Thanks to the thoughtful and helpful replies, I was able to share some thoughts that seemed to help put things in perspective. It was really a great conversation. Today, we're stepping away from the computer and going for a nice day hike in the rain.

Thanks for helping me out folks.
Hooray!

I deliberately made my original answer brief. Here are a couple of real-life tidbits you can share with him.

In mid-2008, when I was single and planning a self-funded retirement on a modest income, I decided to do a Year of Extreme Frugality in order to hasten my time to FIRE. I was accumulating shares at a good clip during the recession. When the economy recovered, my portfolio saw huge gains and I hit FIRE four years later. I thought it was just dumb luck that I chose that time period to really knuckle down, but I have to say understanding a down market is a huge opportunity, not a reason to panic, is what really made the difference.

Now I'm married. We recently paid cash for a small property, intending to get a mortgage after we closed and got it fixed up. Then mortgage rates soared and we're not done with the renovations. (You can't get a mortgage on a place that's gutted, lol.) Now the market is On Sale, and our pile 'o cash is er...busy.  it's kind of killing us that we aren't able to go on a Stock Market Shopping Spree. Yup, the market is down and all we want to do is buy, buy, buy!

« Last Edit: June 18, 2022, 12:07:38 PM by Dicey »

Wolfpack Mustachian

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #39 on: June 18, 2022, 10:38:49 AM »
Original OP here:

Wanted to give a follow up. DH and I talked last night about the state of our investments. Thanks to the thoughtful and helpful replies, I was able to share some thoughts that seemed to help put things in perspective. It was really a great conversation. Today, we're stepping away from the computer and going for a nice day hike in the rain.

Thanks for helping me out folks.
Hooray!

I deliberately my original answer brief. Here are a couple of real-life tidbits you can share with him.

In mid-2008, when I was single and planning a self-funded retirement on a modest income, I decided to do a Year of Extreme Frugality in order to hasten my time to FIRE. I was accumulating shares at a good clip during the recession. When the economy recovered, my portfolio saw huge gains and I hit FIRE four years later. I thought it was just dumb luck that I chose that time period to really knuckle down, but I have to say that understanding that a down market is a huge opportunity, not a reason to panic, is what really made the difference.

Now I'm married. We recently paid cash for a small property, intending to get a mortgage after we closed and got it fixed up. Then mortgage rates soared and we're not done with the renovations. (You can't get a mortgage on a place that's gutted, lol.) Now the market is On Sale, and our pile 'o cash is er...busy.  it's kind of killing us that we aren't able to go on a Stock Market Shopping Spree. Yup, the market is down and all we want to do is buy, buy, buy!

I'll also echo this. I have a loose retirement goal of 4 years from now. I'm stoked the stock market is down so I can buy at these levels. I would have been nervous if it had been a full on bull run for the next 4 years even though it would have likely taken me to my number.

Catbert

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #40 on: June 18, 2022, 12:47:13 PM »
Might not help OP, but when the market is down I think "should I do Roth conversions to convert more shares for less tax or do I capital losses I can harvest to offset gains?'  I try to focus on the individual numbers and taxes rather than looking at the total and thinking, "OMG I lost 100K in x period of time."

Zikoris

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #41 on: June 18, 2022, 04:09:32 PM »
Look at it as a learning experience. You learned that your investments are totally out of whack with your (his) actual risk tolerance. Base your future investment decisions on that information, and choose a more appropriate portfolio. Whatever company you invest with probably has some sort of online questionnaire to help you figure out your realistic risk tolerance and what sort of portfolio is a good fit for that.

jpdx

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #42 on: June 18, 2022, 04:47:55 PM »
I'm not at all concerned that stocks are falling; I am concerned that stocks and bonds are falling simultaneously. This makes difficult choices for rebalancing and/or drawing-down in FIRE.

Malossi792

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #43 on: June 19, 2022, 06:15:26 AM »
I'm not at all concerned that stocks are falling; I am concerned that stocks and bonds are falling simultaneously. This makes difficult choices for rebalancing and/or drawing-down in FIRE.
Emphasis mine. I think that in fact it doesn't? I mean you just sell the asset that's a higher percentage of your aa than it should be, right?
I would imagine that it doesn't feel good, though...

rmorris50

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #44 on: June 19, 2022, 08:10:12 AM »
Always hard to watch the markets go down, it’s human. But for many of us here I imagine the risk of enriching heirs is still much greater than spending our NW to zero before we die.


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lutorm

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #45 on: June 20, 2022, 06:39:38 PM »
I'm not at all concerned that stocks are falling; I am concerned that stocks and bonds are falling simultaneously. This makes difficult choices for rebalancing and/or drawing-down in FIRE.
The values of existing bonds are falling because it's more advantageous to buy new, higher yielding, bonds. If you're going to invest in bonds now, I think it makes more sense to buy short-term treasury bonds directly rather than investing in a bond fund. Especially if you are building a "bond tent" for drawing down in initial FIRE. Yes, you're leaving some money on the table by not buying longer-term bonds, but the yield curve is pretty flat (it was even inverted last week, I think). By holding bonds to maturity you're not exposed to the falling bond market, and when the short-term ones mature you can likely roll them into higher-yielding ones given the high likelihood of further interest rate hikes.

Missy B

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #46 on: June 21, 2022, 11:45:48 PM »
I'm going to suggest something a little different. Ask DH if he would be more comfortable putting new money into a cash account. Seeing the cash buffer growing may calm his nerves, and I do believe you will not miss out by waiting a few months.
It really does take a while to learn to steel yourself to market gyrations, and if he isn't there yet I think respecting his anxieties, which have a truthful root, will allow him to grow confidence at his own pace.

Having said that, all the advice to not look is sound and the mark of a mature investor.
I look because I might do trading. If I'm not trading, no need. If I was doing auto-pilot market etf buys as I think most here are, I would never look, because why?

Viking Thor

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2022, 07:30:03 PM »
This sounds very basic but I suggest to do more stress relieving activities like the hike you mentioned. Especially those that provide some exercise because it takes your mind of it at the time and elevates your mood.

For me that might be things like running, biking, lifting weights, playing with my dog or taking him for a walk. Even to some extent yard work if it's straightforward and not stressful.

Others might do music, art, etc.

This is a good reminder as now I'll try to take my own advice and commit to doing at least 30 minutes exercise 3 of the next 4 days. (I know that's a very modest commitment).

vand

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #48 on: June 23, 2022, 04:20:43 AM »
I always like to use these as reminders.

Charts are useless for predicting how you will feel when you investments are in a deep drawdown. That is why so many people go wrong just looking at charts.

eyesonthehorizon

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Re: Tips to Calm Market Jitters?
« Reply #49 on: June 23, 2022, 06:15:41 AM »
I didn't hear it as a brag, either. It sounds like honest assessment of multiple strategies. Enviable, though, even as I grit my teeth & hold onto my DPOYM membership card.

My main tip: Track shares accumulation, and/or passive income projections. The latter can feel more tangible to a nervous mind.
Wait! With interest rates escalating rapidly, and inflation a raging bonfire, don't you feel just a little bit smug amazingly brilliant? Asking for a friend.
Mostly unbelievably lucky. The timing happened to work out really well despite soaring prices when I bought from just a year prior. Housing also seems to have been the only expense I might have personally been exposed to which has gone up significantly with inflation so far. My other bills have hardly budged even though I expected to pay much more for food & necessities. I've never been exposed to inflation before, so I'm much more jittery waiting to see if that shoe will drop than I am about the wanderings of the market.