The Money Mustache Community
General Discussion => Welcome and General Discussion => Topic started by: Zamboni on May 01, 2019, 06:37:28 AM
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This is a Canadian TV series that someone mentioned on this board a few years ago.
At the time, I couldn't watch it (no cable + I'm not Canadian). But now it is on YouTube.
So I've watched 3.5 episodes and I'm enjoying it so far. Trying to watch them in order starting with the first season (other than the first one I watched which had a higher view count.) It's nice that she has widely different income situations. I'm going to gradually catalog the basics about each situation here in case it helps anyone decide which one to watch.
First one I watched: dual income with decent money to work with but very spendy . . . she proclaimed them the worst she had seen. They were very pretty people who have likely always gotten away with keeping things pretty on the outside while not really attending to what is behind the facade.
S1E1: one income. Guy trying to start a restaurant/catering business while also working a side hustle, stay-at-home-mom, middle of the road spending, small children. They were adorable and I hope it worked out.
S1E2: one income, money extremely tight, newly wed with new baby. Wife "worked" in the arts and seemed very entitled and honestly I felt sorry for the husband.
S1E3: high income, astronomical spending. She's been oblivious but is now having a wake up call and freaking out. He wants to stay in denial at the beginning, feels he "deserves to have what he wants." Teenagers eat a lot = Gail gave them $1000 per month for food, which honestly makes me feel better about my grocery bill. Lol, are these my neighbors?
S1E4: spouse income imbalance, 3 kids playing expensive sports. $12K per year on youth hockey and soccer, wow! He makes more money than she does & resents his spending being restricted because of it.
S1E5: hoping for first baby. I really like her idea for this one: live on maternity leave level spending for a month (or two) to see if you can do it and put the money saved from that in a fund to buy items for baby.
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I am Canadian and I watched this show years ago. I really like Gail Vaz-Oxlade.
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Yes, at first I thought she was going to bug me, but now I really like her. In the first one I watched (not S1E1, I should try to figure out which one it was) she was pretty fed up with the couple, I think, and it showed. They had lived with his parents after they got married for a couple of years and gotten used to free-loading, basically, rather than paying their own way.
Parents, push those fledglings out of the nest and do NOT let them come back . . . you won't be doing your kids any favors if you do!
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I really wish they would reboot this show with modern cameras. The techniques are great but it's really hard to watch something in 420p in this day and age.
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I loved that show in it's first run. There's also a show called "Life or Debt" (American) that's kind of similar, but the host gets the family to run themselves like a business, always focusing on the bottom line. It's good too.
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I binged watched a bunch of episodes on Amazon Prime after the first posting on MMM a year or two ago. Loved it!
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I enjoy the show from time to time, but it is very painful to watch other times. It baffles me how some people can live the way they do. I would be so stressed out.
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guilty pleasure show for me. Always makes me feel so good about our spending
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I really like this show, and the Life or Debt one, and I even let the kids watch them - they've learned a lot, haha! The only thing I get frustrated with is that TDDUP treats the majority of expenses as "fixed" and that they can't be changed. Car payments, electric usage, cable, etc. I think I've only seen one episode where she makes someone sell a house they can't afford. I would love to see a more hard-core facepunch version of this done in current years. Sell the car, take the bus or bike, cut the cable, chop the cell phone, grow a garden, shoot for a 40-50% savings rate, etc. I also wish she would be more transparent and thorough with her computing of the debt and spending figures - sometimes I don't think they're entirely straight - manipulated for shock value maybe.
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People don't react well to the suggestion that they sell their home. In the 4 episodes I've watched, she's suggested selling the home to two of the couples.
In one case they seemed like they were kind of already making peace with the idea as the wife was on the verge of hitting the highway on her own anyway if things didn't change and a couple of their kids were at or near college age.
In the other, both people were like "absolutely not." The husband seemed to think he could make up the $1200 a month shortfall DJ'ing (didn't work out in the short term.)
My son watched it with me. He didn't understand why people are so attached to their houses. I don't get it either, honestly. It's such a get out of jail move for a lot of people to unload the money pit.
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My son watched it with me. He didn't understand why people are so attached to their houses. I don't get it either, honestly. It's such a get out of jail move for a lot of people to unload the money pit.
Because when you've never done anything of worth and you've never grown into a good person you can be proud of, you have to use things to feel successful.
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My son watched it with me. He didn't understand why people are so attached to their houses. I don't get it either, honestly. It's such a get out of jail move for a lot of people to unload the money pit.
Because when you've never done anything of worth and you've never grown into a good person you can be proud of, you have to use things to feel successful.
I don't think it's just that. People's homes are repositories of memories, and the attachment can be very emotional, especially when someone's raised children in the home. Or if they've put a lot of sweat equity into the place. Hell, I wanted to buy my parents' house for these very reasons, but good sense prevailed after a while and I didn't do it. But it was really tempting.
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Plus moving (especially if it involves selling a house) is just such a massive project--packing everyone's stuff, finding a new place, doing all the cleaning and repairs to get a house market ready, not to mention that depending on who pays what costs, you can end up fronting quite a bit of money that will take awhile to recover through cheaper housing costs. That is a lot of pain points to overcome, especially since a lot of these relationships are already under a strain! And if you look at cognitive biases, humans are wired to prefer the pain they know over uncertainty. Look how hard we have to argue on the boards just to get people to look for new jobs when their current situations are far from ideal. I can see why people would be resistant.
The one thing I wish from all these life make-over shows is that they would go back in a year or so to see how people are doing. I always wonder who stuck with the changes, and who backslid.
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The one thing I wish from all these life make-over shows is that they would go back in a year or so to see how people are doing. I always wonder who stuck with the changes, and who backslid.
This!! Would love to re-visit some of the couples.
It's my guilty pleasure show and I was far too excited when seasons 4,5, 6 & 7 appeared on YouTube. Have also got my daughter watching and gave her a copy of one of Gail's books for Christmas (2nd hand of course!). We both love it. Hubby now has a "bike jar" and is keen to save instead of buying coffee.
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Plus moving (especially if it involves selling a house) is just such a massive project--packing everyone's stuff, finding a new place, doing all the cleaning and repairs to get a house market ready, not to mention that depending on who pays what costs, you can end up fronting quite a bit of money that will take awhile to recover through cheaper housing costs. That is a lot of pain points to overcome, especially since a lot of these relationships are already under a strain!
This is why I assumed that Gail almost never gave the advice to sell the home. It's a long-game fix and depending on the local housing market, might not resolve itself for a year or more. That doesn't fit into the 1-month timeline of the show. Hopefully, though, the cold hard facts of housing costs did wake up some of the couples. I'd love to see a follow-up.
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The one thing I wish from all these life make-over shows is that they would go back in a year or so to see how people are doing. I always wonder who stuck with the changes, and who backslid.
Some of the episodes have updates. They look like they are available here (https://www.slice.ca/til-debt-do-us-part/episode-guide/ (https://www.slice.ca/til-debt-do-us-part/episode-guide/)), just search for "update" in the episode list.
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Canadians: what is "hydro"? I assumed it was water, but then one participant was talking about new home expenses and said: hydro, gas, water, and insurance. Did she just misspeak, or is hydro water?
The show Clean House did a follow up visit show after a couple of seasons . . . everyone kept the place fairly neat still, but I didn't totally buy it because they had already given them advance notice that they were coming to film.
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We started getting our electricity using water to turn turbines.Companies that did this always had "hydro-electric" in there names.So came to referred to as "hydro".
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Canadians: what is "hydro"? I assumed it was water, but then one participant was talking about new home expenses and said: hydro, gas, water, and insurance. Did she just misspeak, or is hydro water?
The show Clean House did a follow up visit show after a couple of seasons . . . everyone kept the place fairly neat still, but I didn't totally buy it because they had already given them advance notice that they were coming to film.
Hydro is power / electricity expense. Short for hydro-electric power generation. Bit of a regional thing in Canada - my part of world (East Coast) tend to just call it power.
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I didn't know it was on you-tube, maybe I'll go back and binge watch it. I used to watch it when it was on the air, and the sister shows: princess (about entitled young people, usually women, sponging off other people), and money moron (where one partner would nominate their spouse).
And part of watching it was to feel smug about how good I was (and I know I waste lots). I always assumed it was really trumped up for TV. That no one could be that oblivious about their spending. I get how folks may not realize how money is trickling through their fingers one latte at a time, but not to the tune of -$5,000 a month. I really liked the aspect where she had folks track their spending. If you haven't been paying attention, it's always an eye opener to see there the money goes. I really liked that she always included a little for entertainment, not much but something, even if it was a pizza every two weeks. And the idea of finding fun free/cheap things for entertainment.
And the idea of money jars are good for people that can't be trusted with a credit card. When the jar is empty, stop spending.
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Thanks, @cowman and @Dogastrophe!
Is having an animal in your screen name a Canadian thing, too?
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the sister shows: princess (about entitled young people, usually women, sponging off other people), and money moron (where one partner would nominate their spouse).
Ohhh, these sound hilarious! I would never nominate someone for something called Money Moron (even if they are one, and I know plenty), but Princess I could nominate some folks to be on and feel no guilt.
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I will binge watch this today, sounds like great Sunday afternoon TV.
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Thanks, @cowman and @Dogastrophe!
Is having an animal in your screen name a Canadian thing, too?
I have an animal as my screen name and avatar too, it might be a Canadian thing.
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My screen name is the name of my parents' cat. Must be a Cdn. thing. :)
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Part of the fun of watching these for me is how not dramatic Canadians are about everything. You thought your wife had racked up $50K in consumer debt and it really is $130K . . . Surprise! And the guy doesn't flip his lid? Amazing.
Watched a couple of these today with my other half and had to keep reassuring my other half that none of this has anything to do with us. Yes, other half, you are quite responsible. We have drama here even without money problems!
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I loved this show and clean house. I have watched all the episodes.
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Yes, love Niecy Nash and the whole crew on Clean House!
S1E6 Young couple, early 30's, service jobs: Image is everything, baby! They are sweet under their vain exteriors, but they've always relied on being cute and looking good and that caused them to refuse to grow up. Dude spent $500/month on convenience store candy!
S1E7 Shopaholics, debt collectors are calling: $97K combined income . . . and still resort to payday loan places . . . owe money to EVERY ADULT in their extended family . . . have declared bankruptcy twice . . . yikes! These are the relatives we all dread and avoid.
S1E8 Young couple, he's a contractor, small child, learned TONS: money is tight, but they learned how to quote jobs so he doesn't lose money, basic business accounting, saying "no" to buying things for their daughter, paying themselves first, budgeting money for monthly debt pymt.
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Okay, I’m now addicted and binging on this. Thanks for the hydro clarification...really confused when she said hydro, water, gas, etc. I was like wait did she just list the same thing twice using different words? Also for a while I was thinking water was a big expense in Canada since it kept being listed after the mortgage.. Lol
I think it’s interesting how she changes the plan based on each couple she situation. Like some folks get monthly budgets and their ccs hidden. Others she actually shreds them and puts them on a weekly budget! I also really like how she makes them do their own work and planning - I think the lessons prob stick better that way. And she comes off genuine, with a compassionate but tough love approach that seems very reasonable. She’s cutting their expenses a bunch and putting them on a budget but not suggesting the more mustachian things that might be too much of a system shock to these folks.
I could NOT believe the guy who was making his own lunches was spending so much. Like what? At that point just buy your lunch because you’re spending so outrageously it’s doing nothing but giving you the illusion of frugality.
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Binge watching it too. Thanks for telling me its on youtube. I dont use it enough for tv shows but now I do.
Would love it if she did follow up shows. Gail's retired now but did recently cowrite another book "CEO of Everything", for people who find themselves suddenly single. She's a gem.
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^Ooooh, I'll have to check out that CEO of Everything book. Thanks for the tip about that!
I think it’s interesting how she changes the plan based on each couple she situation. Like some folks get monthly budgets and their ccs hidden. Others she actually shreds them and puts them on a weekly budget!
Holy moly I didn't actually noticed how much she was tailoring things, but now that I think back she definitely treated the cards differently for different people. I had noticed that some folks got monthly money jars and some got weekly . . . I wonder if that has anything to do with how often the people get paid, or if it is just based upon the varying levels of impulse control?
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It seemed to me that weekly jars happened more with the lower income folks, but also those whose cc debt (vs personal loans, student loans, etc) was completely out of control.
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Binge watching it too. Thanks for telling me its on youtube. I dont use it enough for tv shows but now I do.
Would love it if she did follow up shows. Gail's retired now but did recently cowrite another book "CEO of Everything", for people who find themselves suddenly single. She's a gem.
Have you read this @Awesomeness? I too like Gail but wonder if the book For those of us in the US, there might be too many differences in our SS systems for example, not to mention retirement accounts. My countty library system doesn't have the book and Amazon would be the only alternative.
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Binge watching it too. Thanks for telling me its on youtube. I dont use it enough for tv shows but now I do.
Would love it if she did follow up shows. Gail's retired now but did recently cowrite another book "CEO of Everything", for people who find themselves suddenly single. She's a gem.
Have you read this @Awesomeness? I too like Gail but wonder if the book For those of us in the US, there might be too many differences in our SS systems for example, not to mention retirement accounts. My countty library system doesn't have the book and Amazon would be the only alternative.
"CEO of Everything" is probably her only book I haven't read - I just got the e-book from the library yesterday based on Awesomeness's mention. But think of her as a more sensible version of Dave Ramsey. She is really good at getting people to sort out their finances, cut back on stupid spending, get out of debt and start saving for the future. The differences between the Canadian and American systems can be figured out from other sources.
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Binge watching it too. Thanks for telling me its on youtube. I dont use it enough for tv shows but now I do.
Would love it if she did follow up shows. Gail's retired now but did recently cowrite another book "CEO of Everything", for people who find themselves suddenly single. She's a gem.
Have you read this @Awesomeness? I too like Gail but wonder if the book For those of us in the US, there might be too many differences in our SS systems for example, not to mention retirement accounts. My countty library system doesn't have the book and Amazon would be the only alternative.
"CEO of Everything" is probably her only book I haven't read - I just got the e-book from the library yesterday based on Awesomeness's mention. But think of her as a more sensible version of Dave Ramsey. She is really good at getting people to sort out their finances, cut back on stupid spending, get out of debt and start saving for the future. The differences between the Canadian and American systems can be figured out from other sources.
Not yet, I did watch an interview on youtube where she talked in good detail what it's about. Gail just divorced for the third time then cowrote this book. I'm 18 months out from a horrible divorce and was glad to hear I had done a few things she mentioned, mainly changing beneficiaries and getting your estate in order so you don't leave things to your ex, I couldn't do that fast enough. I studied the SS system for hours to understand it and protect myself, it's pretty confusing. Like everything else it reaffirmed that I won't remarry or blend finances w anyone again.
My library didn't have it but it's on my list now.
In the interview she did touch on what you're mentioning about the different systems. Maybe RetiredAt63 will give us a heads up on that.
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OK, I'll admit that after reading this thread, I went and binge watched the first season of Till Debt Do Us Part.
I've just got one question. I've had many Canadian friends over the years who have relocated to the USA and their Quebecian or Newfoundland accents were readily identifiable. But I was not prepared for how thick Gail's accent was. In fact, at first I was wondering what far away country she was from as it didnt seem to match the quality or depth of Canadian accents I've encountered (and I lived only 100 miles from the Canadian border).
So my question is, What part of canada do people speak like this and is it common or unique to a particular ethnic background/location? I really could not get beyond it, despite liking the show.
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She was born in Jamaica and moved to Canada (Ontario) in her late teens. Her current accent is a bit of both.
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Binge watching it too. Thanks for telling me its on youtube. I dont use it enough for tv shows but now I do.
Would love it if she did follow up shows. Gail's retired now but did recently cowrite another book "CEO of Everything", for people who find themselves suddenly single. She's a gem.
Have you read this @Awesomeness? I too like Gail but wonder if the book For those of us in the US, there might be too many differences in our SS systems for example, not to mention retirement accounts. My countty library system doesn't have the book and Amazon would be the only alternative.
75% of the finance books I read are US-based. The differences are not so great.
One interesting point in one of Gail's books that would not apply to you -- how to keep your mortgage inside your RRSP (like an IRA).
I very much liked her money rules book, and the book about boundaries and relationships -->how to not be the patsy to your greedy / money sucking / dependent relative (even if they are your kid / parent / SO).
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OK, I'll admit that after reading this thread, I went and binge watched the first season of Till Debt Do Us Part.
I've just got one question. I've had many Canadian friends over the years who have relocated to the USA and their Quebecian or Newfoundland accents were readily identifiable. But I was not prepared for how thick Gail's accent was. In fact, at first I was wondering what far away country she was from as it didnt seem to match the quality or depth of Canadian accents I've encountered (and I lived only 100 miles from the Canadian border).
So my question is, What part of Canada do people speak like this and is it common or unique to a particular ethnic background/location? I really could not get beyond it, despite liking the show.
Do you live in PA? I found many Americans from that area had a hard time putting aside my "unqiue Canadian Accent". (or maybe it is cultural thing to talk about someone's accent ad naseum if you are from the PA region?). My accent has hints of ND in it, for reference, slightly different from Central Canada, does not get noticed on the prairies or west coast.
As other said -- there is a bit of Jamaican in Gail's accent, but not overly much.
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OK, I'll admit that after reading this thread, I went and binge watched the first season of Till Debt Do Us Part.
I've just got one question. I've had many Canadian friends over the years who have relocated to the USA and their Quebecian or Newfoundland accents were readily identifiable. But I was not prepared for how thick Gail's accent was. In fact, at first I was wondering what far away country she was from as it didnt seem to match the quality or depth of Canadian accents I've encountered (and I lived only 100 miles from the Canadian border).
So my question is, What part of Canada do people speak like this and is it common or unique to a particular ethnic background/location? I really could not get beyond it, despite liking the show.
Do you live in PA? I found many Americans from that area had a hard time putting aside my "unqiue Canadian Accent". (or maybe it is cultural thing to talk about someone's accent ad naseum if you are from the PA region?). My accent has hints of ND in it, for reference, slightly different from Central Canada, does not get noticed on the prairies or west coast.
As other said -- there is a bit of Jamaican in Gail's accent, but not overly much.
Not PA, I used to live south of Montreal on the US side. Jamaica? Funny, my wife is Jamaican, and I just dont hear it from Gail.
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It was a pretty good show. Gail mostly applied common sense finances to couples who were careless with their money. I liked the episodes where high income couples were having money problems, Gail always found thousands of dollars of frivolous monthly spending. Couples with low incomes and children were tough to watch, sometimes there wasn’t a lot they could do.
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Interesting that Gail spent her early years in the Caribbean!
I was going to watch all of these, but once in a while a couple just rubs me too much the wrong way right at the start . . . so I'm going to skip those since I value my life energy.
Onward with the summaries!
S1E10: The ostrich and the bull: $60K combined income, 11 yrs married, one young daughter who thinks they are "poor" because of money stress which is obviously causing her stress. He always kept his individual account, while she only had their joint account . . . I think this is what caused Gail to emphasize the expense split by income: he pays 3/5, she pays 2/5, of all bills.
On a personal note, this guy looks just like the best, nicest boss I ever had (for 3 years back in my early 20's.) So, I want them to succeed based just upon that. Weird, huh?
S1E11: live-in extended family, one child, low income. She has the steady income and he works erratically . . . 60% of their income goes to home & utilities. Ouch! Family first, but all of the burden and responsibility is falling on her. Spending far exceeds income. Gail helps them get the other adults to pitch in, and she puts pressure on him to step up and grow up.
S1E12: shopaholics. Income of $100K, but they spend $11K a month on all kinds of shopping, tanning, etc. Very disorganized about getting bills paid, so creditor are calling. Also, "bags" of milk? I'm learning a ton about Canadian every day life watching this show. . .
S1E13: the big red jacked up boy toy. This is my favorite one so far. Young couple expecting a baby and clueless about money. They owned 3 trucks and a car (and a motorcycle, snow mobile . . .) Gail breaks down their astounding transportation expenses.
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Book report time. I read her CEO book and there is very little financial stuff in it. It is a book about the changes we have to deal with when we are newly widowed or divorced (she was freshly divorced, her co-writer was widowed). Lots of good stuff, but not a finance book.
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Great show. Finishing up the 1st season, only episode 2 has seen a check of less than $5000. The wife was pissed about it, too.
The S1E1 couple is apparently doing well, at least according to the comments on youtube. Some of the other couples, though -- I doubt they made it because I'm not convinced that one month can change someone's lifetime habits. Give up smoking in a week? Stop being a lay-about (S1E11) because someone scolds you? Unlikely.
It is amazing that couples earning $90k resort to payday loans.
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S1E10: The ostrich and the bull: $60K combined income, 11 yrs married, one young daughter who thinks they are "poor" because of money stress which is obviously causing her stress. He always kept his individual account, while she only had their joint account . . . I think this is what caused Gail to emphasize the expense split by income: he pays 3/5, she pays 2/5, of all bills.
On a personal note, this guy looks just like the best, nicest boss I ever had (for 3 years back in my early 20's.) So, I want them to succeed based just upon that. Weird, huh?
I thought it was really weird how he didn’t want her to have an individual account and set off controlling red flags. I’m really glad Gail pushed back against him on this, although I can’t help to think that lady might have needed her own account...
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^Yeah, that weirded me out, too. He just looked like my old boss, but definitely didn't have the same personality.
Also, as a divorce survivor, I bet that CEO book is worth the read.
I'm now on season 2. Here's the first 3 in that:
S2E1: too little $$$. Family of 5 trying to live on $34K. She got laid off 2 years ago and filled the time void with shopping. 16 credit cards . . . and in the cycle of paying one card from another card every month. Their house is more than they can afford, but it will also cost them money to move. They seemed committed to turning it around.
S2E2: young, lazy, sassy, and spoiled. Lisa's brother, if you are reading, please don't give her any money! And husband, bruh, stop thinking with your dick and drop this toxic parasite. I was starting to think all Canadians were nice folks, but Lisa has proven me wrong.
S2E3: High income, high burn rate, high debt. Another family of 5. I liked how Gail involved the older two children in the expense cutting discussion. Husband has fully bought into constant optimization principle. OMG! You can be paid in Canada to be a rent-a-goalie?! That's it, I'm moving north, and it's not just because of Trump after all . . . it's because I'm becoming a professional netminder. Also, I think this is my new fav. She was sweet and sincere, the kids pitched in, and he was all in and had a crazy giant walrus mustache. Good stuff!
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Hiring out a goalie usually provides just enough money to help the goalie buy his / her goalie equipment, and it is very hard to play your rec team without a goalie (or a SH_T goalie)... Most teams do have a team member as a goalie but it is a thing.
I would liken it to ski "ambassadors" at the hill that provide free tours and in exchange get seasons passes and a ski jacket with the mountain logo on it. You work for 1-2 days a month and get a free annual ski pass. It offsets an expensive hobby.
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Interesting that Gail spent her early years in the Caribbean!
I was going to watch all of these, but once in a while a couple just rubs me too much the wrong way right at the start . . . so I'm going to skip those since I value my life energy.
S1E12: shopaholics. Income of $100K, but they spend $11K a month on all kinds of shopping, tanning, etc. Very disorganized about getting bills paid, so creditor are calling. Also, "bags" of milk? I'm learning a ton about Canadian every day life watching this show. . .
bags of milk is a regional thing and raises other Canadian eyebrows just a much. Still the way of 4L milk purchases (gallon) in ontario and Quebec, but the west has gone over to plastic jugs though they did have bags for awhile when I was a kid. It was weird to move to Quebec and find them come back again.
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Loved this show years ago and used to watch it as inspiration when I was getting my student loan under control.
I actually 'froze' my credit card (in the freezer) and went to using cash exclusively (Gail was a big influence on my spendy younger-self!)
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Zamboni, thanks for starting the thread and the info about the show. Love it, even my wife and kids are enjoying it. Season 2, episode 2, now that was hilarious and sad. But it was interesting to see a couple actually fail during the month of coaching by Gail, to lend some diversity of results.
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Gail lives nearby and she is just as much of a straight talker when calling out the local mayor!
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Gail lives nearby and she is just as much of a straight talker when calling out the local mayor!
I would LOVE to see that!
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Follow her on Twitter if you'd like to get an idea of what she's really like. I think she's awesome and a great advocate but many find her overwhelming.
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Okay okay, here is where I admit that we had a milk box on our stoop when I was a kid . . . everyone had them, and the local dairy delivered filled bottles for the number of empty bottles you put out. So bags of milks seems crazy weird to me.
I have not been updating this although I have continued watching. They were getting repetitive, but then I hit S2E13 THE WEDDING EPISODE! Slightly new format, and this one is really hitting close to home since I'm thinking about tying the knot myself. Fortunately my other half and I are older and wiser than these kids, and there's always inspiration in Gail's firm but kind manner.
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Okay okay, here is where I admit that we had a milk box on our stoop when I was a kid . . . everyone had them, and the local dairy delivered filled bottles for the number of empty bottles you put out. So bags of milks seems crazy weird to me.
I have not been updating this although I have continued watching. They were getting repetitive, but then I hit S2E13 THE WEDDING EPISODE! Slightly new format, and this one is really hitting close to home since I'm thinking about tying the knot myself. Fortunately my other half and I are older and wiser than these kids, and there's always inspiration in Gail's firm but kind manner.
Wait until you get to Season 4 and see the problems "Stinky" brings to the table.
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This seems like a dare to jump ahead to the stinky episode. Hmmmm.
Okay, edited to add that I am now watching the episode with Stink. He is a pretty boy.
But right off the top I gots to say this: does literally every dude in Canada play hockey? And golf? Kind of a winter fun/summer fun combo pack up there? And where are all the hockey playing Canadian chicks? I mean, I get why the chicks aren't golfing, cause golf sucks.
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This seems like a dare to jump ahead to the stinky episode. Hmmmm.
Okay, edited to add that I am now watching the episode with Stink. He is a pretty boy.
But right off the top I gots to say this: does literally every dude in Canada play hockey? And golf? Kind of a winter fun/summer fun combo pack up there? And where are all the hockey playing Canadian chicks? I mean, I get why the chicks aren't golfing, cause golf sucks.
Hah. Women golf.
You forgot curling. !!! Oh the drama at work when curling season overlaps with golf. People that don't play hockey curl. Co ed teams. Lots of adult leagues for all these sports.
Bowling used to be more common and faded out in the 80's... (5 pin bowling, not 10pin)
Prairies: Golf, Hockey, Curling. Ringette for younger women. Some hockey for adult women
BC: More $$ goes towards housing and there is more to do so not as common. More women play hockey here than in the prairies, I find. I have a team or two I could ask to join if I played and I did take a "power skate for hockey" class to warm up to try it and never did finally join...
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Oh yeah, curling . . . It's like bocci in that you can mostly keep one hand free to hold your beer.
I've switched to Money Moron today.
Season 1 Episode 3. Wow, that table got turned pretty quick! I've never seen anything quite like that guy.
Gail summed it up perfectly:
"You know what? Working is a lot easier than living with an asshole."
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Oh yeah, curling . . . It's like bocci in that you can mostly keep one hand free to hold your beer.
I've switched to Money Moron today.
Season 1 Episode 3. Wow, that table got turned pretty quick! I've never seen anything quite like that guy.
Gail summed it up perfectly:
"You know what? Working is a lot easier than living with an asshole."
Gail has such good lines. And she is right.
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Thanks for the thread, after reading it, I binged pretty much the whole thing in the last month or so. I also started another one that she did called "money moron."
Kind of sad to see so many situations where people have no clue what they are doing, but at the same time it seems she is a great help to them by the end.
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Yeah, she manages to help most of the people, which is great. It's startling how many people shop for entertainment.
MMM seems to have it nailed down: cars, eating out, shopping as entertainment. These are the main things that crush people financially.
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Thanks for posting this and suggesting this show on YouTube. I started watching it and am through the first season and into season 2. I like how she rewards the couples who follow through and even do extra, while not rewarding the extraordinarily lazy.
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^I'm glad you found it!
I'm finding Money Moron is mostly the same show as Til Debt Do Us Part except that not all of the folks are married couples. She also hones in on people she can really help in terms of getting their debt paid off pretty fast.
For example, I just watched MM S2E5: they made $90K combined, had $11K in credit card debt, owed his parents $14K, and a home equity line of credit of $30K from a kitchen renovation and pool addition. I could see how this type of debt could build up pretty fast. Unfortunately his rate of paying the HELOC was so low that it would take 356 years to pay it off! They also had no plan for retirement. Gail helped this couple a lot with just some basic common sense. Getting debt free isn't that hard as long as you catch yourself before it gets completely out of control.
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Serious question: several people on the show (who are renting) seem to have a "line of credit" on which they owe $20-$30K.
How is this possible? Credit card consolidation lines of credit? Why do banks give people these?
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Serious question: several people on the show (who are renting) seem to have a "line of credit" on which they owe $20-$30K.
How is this possible? Credit card consolidation lines of credit? Why do banks give people these?
???
Most people I know have a personal line of credit of some sort. The banks offer them all the time. They have an interest rate usually between 4-7%. When I got my latest LOC offer, it specifically was marketed in terms of reducing credit card payment interest, so yeah, I would assume that's what most people are using it for.
Is this not a thing outside Canada?
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Serious question: several people on the show (who are renting) seem to have a "line of credit" on which they owe $20-$30K.
How is this possible? Credit card consolidation lines of credit? Why do banks give people these?
???
Most people I know have a personal line of credit of some sort. The banks offer them all the time. They have an interest rate usually between 4-7%. When I got my latest LOC offer, it specifically was marketed in terms of reducing credit card payment interest, so yeah, I would assume that's what most people are using it for.
Is this not a thing outside Canada?
I think it is less common in the US. Homeowners and business owners will typically have lines of credit. Certainly some people outside of those groups use LOCs, but it’s just not as ubiquitous as credit cards. I’ve never had a personal LOC, nor known anyone who used one where I was familiar enough with their financial situation that we would be discussing this sort of thing.
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Serious question: several people on the show (who are renting) seem to have a "line of credit" on which they owe $20-$30K.
How is this possible? Credit card consolidation lines of credit? Why do banks give people these?
???
Most people I know have a personal line of credit of some sort. The banks offer them all the time. They have an interest rate usually between 4-7%. When I got my latest LOC offer, it specifically was marketed in terms of reducing credit card payment interest, so yeah, I would assume that's what most people are using it for.
Is this not a thing outside Canada?
I think it is less common in the US. Homeowners and business owners will typically have lines of credit. Certainly some people outside of those groups use LOCs, but it’s just not as ubiquitous as credit cards. I’ve never had a personal LOC, nor known anyone who used one where I was familiar enough with their financial situation that we would be discussing this sort of thing.
Not all homeowners here have a line of credit. Husband and I don't, and we're 15 years into our mortgage. We avoid interest-bearing non-mortgage debt like the plague.
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Okay, yeah, probably I have been offered these types of "bank products" in the mail. I always just assumed they would be tied to my house.
When I see the folks making $20K or $30K who are renters and have a $20K-$30K line of credit debt on this show, well I just think that's irresponsible of the banks. Predatory lending is clearly alive and well.
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A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
People will get them as emergency fund backup or bridge financing if they are temp. Short. The larger amounts are often for debt consolidation loans. I think the US has these by that name? The bank sees that the client had insurious interest rates but is stable and can make monthly payments and a lower rate helps a lot. They see an opportunity to make 7% interest with modest risk and the client saves the 14% or more interest in CC's.
These could also be consolidation of car loans, student loans and CC's all together, too, for lower net interest.
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So easy in North America to get into debt . . . thus the name of the show.
I've been bouncing around rather than watching the episodes in order. Latest one I watched had a husband who kept refinancing their house to take out more and more equity and thought that was being smart. Gail pointed out how amortizing your steak dinner over 30 years is a bad idea even if the interest rate is low.
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A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
Maybe the limits are different here in Ontario?
DH and I each have ~30K personal unsecured LOCs. We use them as an e-fund.
As for pp calling it predatory lending, can someone explain that to me?
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My wife has a LOC for around $36K (prime + 1%) and we have a joint LOC for $35K (prime + 0.5%); both unsecured. We've had these for 15 years and 10 years, respectively.
When we bought our condo the bank tried to convince us that we should set up a HELOC to take advantage of it's "great" rate ... but wanted an extra 1/4% on the mortgage rate. o.O
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A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
Maybe the limits are different here in Ontario?
DH and I each have ~30K personal unsecured LOCs. We use them as an e-fund.
As for pp calling it predatory lending, can someone explain that to me?
The above poster who mentioned predatory lending was describing the situation of someone with an annual income of $20-$30K who managed to rack up an equivalent amount of unsecured LOC debt at a fairly high interest rate. Obviously that is not your situation.
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A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
Maybe the limits are different here in Ontario?
DH and I each have ~30K personal unsecured LOCs. We use them as an e-fund.
As for pp calling it predatory lending, can someone explain that to me?
The above poster who mentioned predatory lending was describing the situation of someone with an annual income of $20-$30K who managed to rack up an equivalent amount of unsecured LOC debt at a fairly high interest rate. Obviously that is not your situation.
Reading too quickly on my phone. I totally missed the "making 20-30K" part.
Yeah, I would be seriously questioning a bank lending that much unsecured to people with such low incomes. Is that a common thing?
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A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
Maybe the limits are different here in Ontario?
DH and I each have ~30K personal unsecured LOCs. We use them as an e-fund.
As for pp calling it predatory lending, can someone explain that to me?
The above poster who mentioned predatory lending was describing the situation of someone with an annual income of $20-$30K who managed to rack up an equivalent amount of unsecured LOC debt at a fairly high interest rate. Obviously that is not your situation.
Reading too quickly on my phone. I totally missed the "making 20-30K" part.
Yeah, I would be seriously questioning a bank lending that much unsecured to people with such low incomes. Is that a common thing?
I don’t know. I hope not.
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I'm starting to agree with Dave Ramsey that banks and lenders are, for many people, the enemy. While I don't agree with everything Dave says, there is definitely a pattern of people thinking "oh cool, this interest rate is only 5%!" Most don't seem to realize that racking that rapidly up to $60K, which is easy to do with home repairs, cars, vacations, etc. now means the bank is getting $3000 of your take home pay each year . . . and that's $3K every year in addition to any dent you try to make a dent in the principal.
A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
Maybe the limits are different here in Ontario?
DH and I each have ~30K personal unsecured LOCs. We use them as an e-fund.
As for pp calling it predatory lending, can someone explain that to me?
Based upon what a financial advisor has told me, thinking of a LOC as an e-fund is dangerous. The terms of most LOC's allow the bank to cancel it, freeze it, or even recall it at their whim. While I've never heard of that happening, he said he'd seen people lose their jobs, think "good thing I can use my line of credit!" and then the bank computers notice that their paycheck is no longer being deposited and trigger the LOC getting frozen. LOC's and CC's are not e-funds. An e-fund is your own actual saved money that you can access within a few days.
Back on topic, I just had a fun time watching TDDUP collide with Hoarders:
Money Moron Mike and Celeste Season 2 Episode 2
Wow, they were a very cute couple, and you could tell that Gail really liked them right off the bat.
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Based upon what a financial advisor has told me, thinking of a LOC as an e-fund is dangerous. The terms of most LOC's allow the bank to cancel it, freeze it, or even recall it at their whim. While I've never heard of that happening, he said he'd seen people lose their jobs, think "good thing I can use my line of credit!" and then the bank computers notice that their paycheck is no longer being deposited and trigger the LOC getting frozen. LOC's and CC's are not e-funds. An e-fund is your own actual saved money that you can access within a few days.
Yeah, I literally don't worry about this.
I don't see any reality where multiple banks shut down multiple LOCs, where a small stockpile of cash is actually going to save me. It's just not a risk scenario I bother trying to mitigate.
The real problem with using LOCs as emergency funds is that because they are so low interest compared to CCs, people don't feel motivated to pay them off and so they carry a significant balance for years, as seen in a lot of episodes.
Typically, financial risks are mostly behavioural, not actually true financial risks.
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A personal line of credit or unsecured LOC are typically $5K and have an interest rate about 3% higher than a HELOC.
Maybe the limits are different here in Ontario?
DH and I each have ~30K personal unsecured LOCs. We use them as an e-fund.
I could be provincial, although BC and AB are similar.... also, it depends on the year when you got your LOC. I had a large-ish one, maybe $25k, that did not have any balance on it, originally set up around year 1999 for a small home reno then I paid off. Anyway the bank reduced it to $5k during the 2008 recession, to reduce the numbers on their books. After that, I found that most banks default to $5k max for a personal LOC unless you are asking for it for a very specific purpose like a renovation or to consolidate cc debt.
These are the exact opposite of predatory lending in my opinion -- low fees, rates are low (4-8%) and are a perfect counter-point to payday loans.'
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Based upon what a financial advisor has told me, thinking of a LOC as an e-fund is dangerous. The terms of most LOC's allow the bank to cancel it, freeze it, or even recall it at their whim. While I've never heard of that happening, he said he'd seen people lose their jobs, think "good thing I can use my line of credit!" and then the bank computers notice that their paycheck is no longer being deposited and trigger the LOC getting frozen. LOC's and CC's are not e-funds. An e-fund is your own actual saved money that you can access within a few days.
Yeah, I literally don't worry about this.
I don't see any reality where multiple banks shut down multiple LOCs, where a small stockpile of cash is actually going to save me. It's just not a risk scenario I bother trying to mitigate.
A lot of banks shut down HELOCs during the 2008 crash: https://money.cnn.com/2008/04/18/real_estate/heloc_freeze.moneymag/index.htm?section=money_pf (https://money.cnn.com/2008/04/18/real_estate/heloc_freeze.moneymag/index.htm?section=money_pf)
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Based upon what a financial advisor has told me, thinking of a LOC as an e-fund is dangerous. The terms of most LOC's allow the bank to cancel it, freeze it, or even recall it at their whim. While I've never heard of that happening, he said he'd seen people lose their jobs, think "good thing I can use my line of credit!" and then the bank computers notice that their paycheck is no longer being deposited and trigger the LOC getting frozen. LOC's and CC's are not e-funds. An e-fund is your own actual saved money that you can access within a few days.
Yeah, I literally don't worry about this.
I don't see any reality where multiple banks shut down multiple LOCs, where a small stockpile of cash is actually going to save me. It's just not a risk scenario I bother trying to mitigate.
A lot of banks shut down HELOCs during the 2008 crash: https://money.cnn.com/2008/04/18/real_estate/heloc_freeze.moneymag/index.htm?section=money_pf (https://money.cnn.com/2008/04/18/real_estate/heloc_freeze.moneymag/index.htm?section=money_pf)
As I said already, the risk of multiple large Canadian banks simultaneously shutting down multiple personal LOCs (not HELOCs), one of which is a business LOC, is just not something I spend any energy worrying about.
I worry about a lot of things, but this scenario isn't one of them.
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Based upon what a financial advisor has told me, thinking of a LOC as an e-fund is dangerous. The terms of most LOC's allow the bank to cancel it, freeze it, or even recall it at their whim. While I've never heard of that happening, he said he'd seen people lose their jobs, think "good thing I can use my line of credit!" and then the bank computers notice that their paycheck is no longer being deposited and trigger the LOC getting frozen. LOC's and CC's are not e-funds. An e-fund is your own actual saved money that you can access within a few days.
Yeah, I literally don't worry about this.
I don't see any reality where multiple banks shut down multiple LOCs, where a small stockpile of cash is actually going to save me. It's just not a risk scenario I bother trying to mitigate.
A lot of banks shut down HELOCs during the 2008 crash: https://money.cnn.com/2008/04/18/real_estate/heloc_freeze.moneymag/index.htm?section=money_pf (https://money.cnn.com/2008/04/18/real_estate/heloc_freeze.moneymag/index.htm?section=money_pf)
yes, this happened in the US, around that time our loc of 15K from our mortgage was frozen. It didn't make any sense, as it was tied to our mortgage and even at that time we had over 100K in equity. Apparently the bank was overleveraged and shut down accounts wholesale. I had it frozen again when going through divorce, and I guess I still have it? (probably still frozen). I'm not using it but it feels weird to close as it cost money and paperwork to open.
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That money article on the HELOC's being shut down was interesting mostly because of the date: April, 2008. Six months before the stock market crash.
I've been overseas all month (yay, me!) but I'm back to watching these, although now I'm going in random order and will only highlight those that raise my eyebrows or especially warm my heart.
Season 4, Episode 4: A mailman (played by John Travolta) marries the Queen of Versailles (played by Gillian Anderson) and they create an heir and a spare. Neither have any money, which is a source of great consternation for the Queen, who reminds us repeatedly that 1) she needs all of her queenly things and 2) she is an excellent mother. The prospect of running into peasants on an apartment building elevator is more than the Queen can endure.
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So happy to know about this show! I don't always agree with her financial advise, but I"m not a financial advisor. :)
I like the Wedding episode with the three couples who can't/won't get married bc of too much debt. I appreciate that she has them take on physical, financial, and emotional challenges.
It does make me so sad when people can't do basic math. When she asked the one couple who wanted to have a $50,000 wedding in 18 months how much they needed to save every month to reach their goal in time:
"500?"
"No."
"Each!"
"Nooo."
"1,000?"
"2,777! Every month!"
That's 2nd, 3rd grade math?!
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So happy to know about this show! I don't always agree with her financial advise, but I"m not a financial advisor. :)
I like the Wedding episode with the three couples who can't/won't get married bc of too much debt. I appreciate that she has them take on physical, financial, and emotional challenges.
It does make me so sad when people can't do basic math. When she asked the one couple who wanted to have a $50,000 wedding in 18 months how much they needed to save every month to reach their goal in time:
"500?"
"No."
"Each!"
"Nooo."
"1,000?"
"2,777! Every month!"
That's 2nd, 3rd grade math?!
maybe they think they'll get 40% returns........... :-)
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I just don't understand the "I want to have an $XXXXX wedding" crowd. Total craziness. Instead, why not prioritize what you think you want, figure out what the reasonable price range is for each item, then prioritize and trim what is less important to you. Because, let's be frank, there is not a single guest outside of your MIL who cares about the monogrammed napkins in your "wedding colors."
For example, if you want to have flowers, you can spend $100 or $10000. The exact same florist can come up with quotes at both ends of this spectrum. So, how important are the flowers to you? Are they $10K important?
Season 5, Episode 1: Young and sweet, with a side of clueless. Gail went around putting big "NOT PAID" stickers on everything in their apartment that wasn't paid off, including a dark brown leather living room set that he picked out without including his wife (Rookie mistake!) Then she had them play that old show The Newlywed Game.
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I remember watching this show when I had cable about 5 or so years ago. It was a good show. The amount of money people spend on 'stuff' astounded me'at the time. I watched this show before discovering MMM, but I was already fairly frugal. Never been in debt. If you can't afford it, don't buy it etc etc. Improved my ways since then though.
I remember one episode titled something like 'the guy just doesn't get it'. He was in huge debt. Play poker games with his friends all the time. By rounds at the bar all the time. Whilst the poor wife suffered at home worrying about their finances. They didn't get much of a reward because it was obvious the guy wasn't going to change his ways. I think the money she gave was in their daughters account, so the guy couldn't have access to it, and blow it straight away (which he would have done).
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I'm still going through the episodes in order. I think I'm in Season 5, but I'm not sure. Still thoroughly enjoying the show.
I laughed at the one with the couple who had two dogs, no kids, and who were still overspending a ton. I only laughed because the wife thought Gail's challenges were ridiculous...um, yes, of course they are, have you ever seen the show? This was season 4 or 5, so she must have known about the silly stuff Gail makes them do. And she didn't do the first challenge (of cleaning up dog poop) because she didn't want to expose her dogs to other dogs' germs?! Wow. She really was, um, interesting.
I was a bit dismayed at the one with the single dad who sleeps on his mom's couch, pays no rent, and who spends all his money on his new girlfriend. I felt bad that they dragged the kids into their "new apartment" and forced the kids to have to deal with this silly couple for the show. I mean, I get that he's their dad, but it's a lot of stress on a kid to move houses, plus to be forced to be with a new step-mom-figure, and it's more stress on the kid when the step-mom-figure is temporarily disabled-but-not-really. And then that is only their "new house" for a few days...I think it was just for the adults but not so much for the kids. But hopefully they really did learn some lessons. That girlfriend was so naive, and the dad was no prize.
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Lol, yes, the lady who only fed her dog the organic, fresh-never-frozen-or-dried dog food. Most of the time it makes sense how the pair got together, but that was a weird couple. She was right up there with the guy who said he should be spending more time taking care of his dogs than his kid . . . although at least she had the good sense not to have kids since she's all in on the dogs. I felt pretty sorry for that guy because it seemed like he had it pretty together financially until he hooked up with her.
Regarding the dad who sleeps on Mom's couch, I don't think I've seen that episode yet. In some respects I feel very thankful for having grown up in a poor neighborhood with huge exposure to a bunch of lay-about people of all genders. People never even try to hide that BS from the neighborhood kids, so we had a front row seat to watch them operate in their native habitat: it is a useful life skill to be able to spot lazy leeches from a mile away.
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I just saw the dog couple episode. Unbefreakinlievable. They were spending a mortgage payment on their dogs! And they weren't seriously committed to changing their lifestyle to the level dictated by their debt. Still clearly wanted to have their cake and eat it, too.
Also saw one about a couple who said their finances were good until they got married and together got into motorcycling. They had loans on 6? 7? motorcycles and credit cards for all the gear. Gail asked, "What made you think you could afford [some five-figure item]? You know you don't have [five-figure sum]!" The wife said, "The payment was only $344. I just think about the payments and whether we can swing that." Gail: "But you can't swing them."
I now can't remember whether this was the same couple that spent over $1k per month on a combination of fast food and health/diet supplements.
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I just saw the dog couple episode. Unbefreakinlievable. They were spending a mortgage payment on their dogs! And they weren't seriously committed to changing their lifestyle to the level dictated by their debt. Still clearly wanted to have their cake and eat it, too.
Also saw one about a couple who said their finances were good until they got married and together got into motorcycling. They had loans on 6? 7? motorcycles and credit cards for all the gear. Gail asked, "What made you think you could afford [some five-figure item]? You know you don't have [five-figure sum]!" The wife said, "The payment was only $344. I just think about the payments and whether we can swing that." Gail: "But you can't swing them."
I now can't remember whether this was the same couple that spent over $1k per month on a combination of fast food and health/diet supplements.
That episode really brought up some painful financial memories for me. Pre-mustache I would always think about whether or not I could "swing" an additional $50 a month or whatever the payment was. I remember looking over at my wife and she looked back at me and said, "Do you remember when you used to say that all the time?" Damn it killed me, but we are now doing much better and I can't remember the last time I said that statement out loud. Love the show so far. I'm afraid I'm reaching the final episodes. Now what to do...