I think the big problem is when someone is in debt and is still paying a tithe.
I am not really versed in this, but isn't holding debt frowned upon in the bible?
Something like you are a slave if you borrow, you should pay it back etc.
And if money is lent, shouldn't it be interest free?
We are living in very different times and I think that prioritizing paying off debt over the tithe makes common sense and could also be justified by the bible.
"Should people borrow to do the work of the Lord? If a person knowingly violates biblical principles, it’s wrong, no matter how noble the purpose. It is unlikely that God would direct anyone to violate His Word to accomplish His work. Since borrowing is not God’s best for His people, why would He endorse borrowing in order for His work to be accomplished?" ( http://www.cbn.com/finance/crownborrowingquestions.aspx?mobile=false)
These quotes were also interesting:
http://www.openbible.info/topics/borrowing_money
After all debts are paid, it makes sense to tithe, be generous and potentially slow down your FIRE plans based on your faith.
Nope, you hit the nail on the head.
The pop culture representation of the prayer "forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us" is more accurately translated into the vernacular as "forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors."
At least, that's what I was told at Jesus school!
You think of the whole of what religion asks you to do (or not do), that's proper living. Any piece of it you don't do, that's sin. The idea is that we sanctify ourselves by trying to live as close to sin-free as possible.
So someone with debt is, strictly speaking, committing a sin. Debt really should be avoided. We make all sorts of rationalizations for mortgages, but they are just that. Other debts are even worse. Jesus makes a special point of faulting both the borrower
and the lender.
Seeing the tithe line item, or really any significant charity from an indebted person, you want to nudge them toward sanctifying themselves first, as reasonably as is practicable.
Probably best not to think of it as an IOU situation with respect to you and big G. If you are in debt, then spending that money to get out of debt is WHY big G let you have that money in the first place. Remember that, and once you are out of debt put that surplus to good use.
Alternatively, you can point out that being in debt is living in sin regardless. So like...what's a little more sin by not tithing for a little bit. You can't really check that spiritual box for "finances" with heavy debt. So to the extent you are already in sin, big G doesn't equivocate. There's no partial credit when it comes to this stuff. You are either having an affair or not. Treating people kindly or not. Living a humble life or not. Managing your finances or not. You can't tithe and be in debt and be accomplishing much. There is forgiveness for your failings, a perfect and wonderful forgiveness as long as you are genuinely trying, but it isn't like one good thing cancels out another bad. Salvation is not a destination achieved once you reach a certain balance, it is a process, a path, of continual sanctification and renewal.
As for how to calculate the tithe, Reverend Lovejoy said it best: "That's off the top people! Not after taxes!"
But yea, I always had significant issues with where the church spent the money, so I'd donate time instead. The money stuff I find my own causes, frugal charities and the like. It's similar to my reasoning behind being willing to give a bum a sandwich but not cash.
As for the prosperity gospel, that's a load of absolute hogwash borne of a superficial understanding by some religious communities, and/or those who attend actual christian worship and don't hear what they are trying to say.
If you go to church long enough you'll see it eventually:
"Would everyone here who regularly gives as much as they can, and who have seen the Lord work in their lives to more than pay them back, please stand up?"
I hate to see it, because as a young person you simply Do. Not. Understand. The. Message. What you hear when this happens is the prosperity gospel, but that isn't what is being said.
As you force yourself to deliberately manage your money, to live below your means, in some cases well below your means, you receive far more in benefit than you would have gotten from that money. It isn't the "you will be financially rewarded, this is an investment."
It's the whole MMM argument. Learn to live on less, and you'll be better off. There is a diminishing utility to additional money, but it's hard to recognize that when you've never had any before. The parallels between the philosophy of MMM and what Jesus advises are many. Eschew the pursuit of things, there is no eternal satisfaction in them.
There is nobody on this forum doing MMM for awhile that can say living on a budget didn't save them more than 10%. That's what should be taught, but the prosperity gospel is all too often what people hear instead.