Author Topic: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...  (Read 4678 times)

PARedbeard

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That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« on: July 01, 2015, 07:34:38 AM »
DW has always had a frugal side. She came from a very loving, financially responsible family, and their values shine through in her. She and I have been discussing finances a lot--she is a full-time grade student, and I work at a non-profit, so being conscious about our spending habits is a necessity. Through all of this, though, she has talked about when we can afford "better" things and travel more frequently to further-afield locations. We live simply, and I know that she would appreciate a few more luxuries in our life--who wouldn't?

That is all starting to change!

This past weekend, we were at a family gathering in a HCOL area. The conversation turned to kids and finances, and one of my relatives said, "with an income of 100k, how can a family even live these days?" As she said that, DW made eye contact with me and imperceptibly shook her head. At that moment, I knew we were on the same page!

What was your moment with your SO?

Cat_Race

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2015, 08:45:50 AM »
That is great, congratulations!  Its a great feeling when you finally know you and your partner are on the same page.  My SO and I just had our own concrete moment only weeks ago, after a relationship of 4+ years.  But first...

The background is that I graduated college in 2012 in a STEM field (I had a job for after graduation before going into my senior year - very lucky), and one semester prior to my graduation my significant made the hard decision to go back to school to get a more marketable degree.  He was lucky and got a Research Assistant position in his masters program, but I was the primary source of income.  Being it was my first job with any significant income and with naturally frugal tendencies (though I hadn't discovered MMM yet) I began to talk about finances a lot because it was all new.  401k! Investing! our company ESPP plan! Budgeting! And rental costs (that I fully subsidized at that time)... And he just didn't get it.  I wonder if the discrepancy in life stages made him mad or if it was just simple disconnect in that it is hard to think about managing your money if you don't *think* you have any (any amount of money can be wasted or saved).  Either is not a really respectable reason but they are emotional ones that can be hard to counter with logic. 

I was able to convince him to pay off all his credit card debt (he was a good sport - I actually demanded it once I realized its existence in 2012), and a 12K loan to his grandfather for school - both before he graduated using his RA stipend and some modest internship income from summer 2014.  Things only compounded when I found MMM and finally felt justification and could put a goal to my financial, and ultimately life, choices.  But it was still this constant strain between us and he regularly said "I'm sick of talking about money".  A lot of our conversations didn't even mention money directly, they centered around big picture freedoms that he knew were related to my financial goals and he got defensive almost every time.  So yeah, he didn't make a ton with his RA stipend, but he blew a ton (percentage wise). He doesn't buy clothes, but was doing 40mi. roundtrip to school nearly 7 days a week (ie: driving up to study there rather than walking a block to a coffee shop/library), a cup or two of drip coffee from a shop every day, lunch out every day, cigarettes. Things so small and normal that it is easy to discount that you are really spending money at all.  But on ~1000k take home a month, you don't get those luxuries, especially not when someone else is paying for all of your real costs of living (housing, most groceries, parents still paid car and health insurance).  There's only so much you can tell someone though...many things need to be learned on one's own time.

Fast forward, he graduated in December 2014 and got his first job this January.  Although this is not the first time he is making a full time paycheck, the last few years of discussing how to manage it all properly must have sunk in.  He used to discount MMM as an abrasive blowhard, but he has been reading it with fervor lately, even sending me articles.  And I got a phone call at lunch on June 15th where he told me "I get it now" and he is so sorry for taking so long and that he "never wants to spend money again" (which I chalk up to 1st stage pendulum swing from the consumerist side).  But, he's put it in action too - started a side hustle and finalized setting up an i401k with Vanguard, stopped smoking, and started biking to work (as I've been suggesting since December, about a mile away along a bike path).  Just this morning he told me that he didn't buy a tank of gasoline for the entire month of June. 

The feeling of relief and excitement that we are finally firing on all cylinders as a team is the most incredible thing! It is very disheartening when one team member is essentially sabotaging another's goals, consciously or not.  So, yay!  MMM FTW.  I can finally say WE are working to FI before 2018!
« Last Edit: July 01, 2015, 08:48:33 AM by Cat_Race »

JuSp02

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2015, 09:19:52 AM »
There have been a lot of little moments.

My DH came from a comfortable upper-middle class family who never talked or thought about money. At the beginning of our relationship, he would order food multiple times a week and wouldn't think twice about dropping $200 on a dinner. We probably spent thousands a month on food. He's been on board with the idea of MMM from the beginning, but theory and practice are two entirely different beasts. He's given me a lot of push back over trimming our expenses and there have been plenty of arguments over how I'm making his life boring. But, after a year and a half, the push back has gotten less and less and there have been more and more "moments" when it has become clear that not only is he onboard, but he's been growing a pretty nice mustache himself. The latest one was this weekend when I had a moment of weakness and said we should order dinner. He looked at me and, despite our six figure net worth and the thousands we keep as a cushion in our checking account, said, "Are you sure? Can we afford it? I could just cook something."

alice76

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2015, 09:29:16 AM »
My husband started to get it when we began tracking net worth every quarter. It was intoxicating for him to witness how much progress we could make in little time with a Mustachian mindset! Another a-ha moment was when we realized that we'd have more cash flow if he worked PT from home and was a sahd. It cut out his soul-sucking commute, plus he is well-suited to be the chief nurturer.

Bracken_Joy

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2015, 09:37:58 AM »
That is great, congratulations!  Its a great feeling when you finally know you and your partner are on the same page.  My SO and I just had our own concrete moment only weeks ago, after a relationship of 4+ years.  But first...

The background is that I graduated college in 2012 in a STEM field (I had a job for after graduation before going into my senior year - very lucky), and one semester prior to my graduation my significant made the hard decision to go back to school to get a more marketable degree.  He was lucky and got a Research Assistant position in his masters program, but I was the primary source of income.  Being it was my first job with any significant income and with naturally frugal tendencies (though I hadn't discovered MMM yet) I began to talk about finances a lot because it was all new.  401k! Investing! our company ESPP plan! Budgeting! And rental costs (that I fully subsidized at that time)... And he just didn't get it.  I wonder if the discrepancy in life stages made him mad or if it was just simple disconnect in that it is hard to think about managing your money if you don't *think* you have any (any amount of money can be wasted or saved).  Either is not a really respectable reason but they are emotional ones that can be hard to counter with logic. 

I was able to convince him to pay off all his credit card debt (he was a good sport - I actually demanded it once I realized its existence in 2012), and a 12K loan to his grandfather for school - both before he graduated using his RA stipend and some modest internship income from summer 2014.  Things only compounded when I found MMM and finally felt justification and could put a goal to my financial, and ultimately life, choices.  But it was still this constant strain between us and he regularly said "I'm sick of talking about money".  A lot of our conversations didn't even mention money directly, they centered around big picture freedoms that he knew were related to my financial goals and he got defensive almost every time.  So yeah, he didn't make a ton with his RA stipend, but he blew a ton (percentage wise). He doesn't buy clothes, but was doing 40mi. roundtrip to school nearly 7 days a week (ie: driving up to study there rather than walking a block to a coffee shop/library), a cup or two of drip coffee from a shop every day, lunch out every day, cigarettes. Things so small and normal that it is easy to discount that you are really spending money at all.  But on ~1000k take home a month, you don't get those luxuries, especially not when someone else is paying for all of your real costs of living (housing, most groceries, parents still paid car and health insurance).  There's only so much you can tell someone though...many things need to be learned on one's own time.

Fast forward, he graduated in December 2014 and got his first job this January.  Although this is not the first time he is making a full time paycheck, the last few years of discussing how to manage it all properly must have sunk in.  He used to discount MMM as an abrasive blowhard, but he has been reading it with fervor lately, even sending me articles.  And I got a phone call at lunch on June 15th where he told me "I get it now" and he is so sorry for taking so long and that he "never wants to spend money again" (which I chalk up to 1st stage pendulum swing from the consumerist side).  But, he's put it in action too - started a side hustle and finalized setting up an i401k with Vanguard, stopped smoking, and started biking to work (as I've been suggesting since December, about a mile away along a bike path).  Just this morning he told me that he didn't buy a tank of gasoline for the entire month of June. 

The feeling of relief and excitement that we are finally firing on all cylinders as a team is the most incredible thing! It is very disheartening when one team member is essentially sabotaging another's goals, consciously or not.  So, yay!  MMM FTW.  I can finally say WE are working to FI before 2018!

This is wonderful! Kudos to both of you sticking with it even when your views weren't quite lining up. Two blog posts you may enjoy now that you're both on the MMM train: http://www.frugalwoods.com/2015/03/16/how-insourcing-strengthened-our-marriage/  and   http://www.frugalwoods.com/2014/08/18/behind-the-scenes-of-a-happy-frugal-marriage/

StockBeard

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2015, 10:11:37 AM »
Interestingly, I'm the one reading this forum/blog, and yet I'm the one who wasn't frugal.

I don't think my wife and I had that "moment" yet, because our reasons are not the same, so we're still not aligned it seems:
My wife comes from a family with no money, so she's always been extremely careful about it. I come from a wealthy family, always had a well paying job, but recently realized I was tired of my job, and I wanted out.

So, today, we try to save more, but not for the same reasons. She likes that I'm spending less, but she doesn't fully understand that I want to stop working.

doubled85

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2015, 03:28:36 PM »
I'm not sure if there's been one watershed moment but more little moments. My special lady friend has always been relatively thrifty. Sure, she likes nice things but she shakes her head at a lot of the typical status symbols. However, we'll be talking over dinner or something and she'll just say something like "you know, it's a really good idea that we're working on all of this saving just in case of X." X can be things like having a baby and going to one income or starting a private practice or whatever.

Lucky Girl

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2015, 06:10:36 AM »
I have only just "converted" to a more frugal lifestyle and a goal of FIRE myself, so I find I really need to keep my expectations for my DH in check.  While I have always been money-aware and good at saving for retirement, I also always have loved the expensive clothes, fancy cars, and $200 dinners.  DH would always be the one to go for the cheaper option, until I started increasing our lifestyle.

So when I suddenly put on the breaks, stopped buying clothes and talking about retiring in 5 years DH thought I had had a conversion experience (it kinda was!).  He figured I would just move on to a new fad in a few months.  And he also makes 3/4 of our income, so in that way there has always been a power imbalance.  He continues to buy new things without much regard to my savings goals.  However, even with our spendypants ways we still save 50% of income. 

I have wisely toned down the MMM rhetoric, couching many of my changes in terms of environmental concerns instead of needing to save money.  We do track our investments and savings on a quarterly basis (and have for 10 years).  When we sat down a few months ago to do our tracking I showed him the 25x investment rule as a way of thinking when we could retire.  He thought I was crazy.  Fast forward to last night, he sat down with me to review our investments again and seemed a bit more interested in where we were headed.  He was excited about our progress and said "we're getting there" (even though markets are down--damn Greece!)

He is still not fully on board with reducing spending, and he will never be okay with buying things in thrift stores.  But we are making baby steps on the idea of retiring early (we are 37 and 38, and should have no problem retiring in 10 years even with our high spending--I just want to bring that number below 10 years!).  Yay for moving forward!

PARedbeard

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2015, 06:39:24 AM »
Lucky Girl-- it is so wonderful that you and your spouse sit down and go over numbers! My wife and I discuss budgets and finances pretty often, yet she isn't all of that interested in the nuts and bolts of where we keep our money. Last night, we started discussing some purchases that we will need to make before the end of the year (tires for the car, an exterior door to replace one that is starting to rot away, and various insurance/tax bills). She wasn't fully aware how much we had and where. Though I've shown her around our account before, she seemed to take a very real interest in our long-term plan.

Like I said, she isn't a spendthrift at all, and she has always been supportive of my FI goals, yet it is wonderful to see her get more and more engaged and more and more excited!

2Birds1Stone

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2015, 07:32:23 AM »
Still waiting for this moment, a few times I really got my hopes up but it was a false alarm.

MrsStubble

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2015, 07:43:52 AM »
My husband came in the other day to tell me he was going through his garage and selling the excess off so we could boost our savings.   I didn't even hint or ask him about it. 

Neustache

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #11 on: July 02, 2015, 08:25:47 AM »
Other than hobbies, my DH is pretty naturally frugal.  He's doubled his income over the past 7 years (I've been a SAHM during that time) but other than a new Versa (paid off now) and sitar lessons, he doesn't spend a bunch.  He's more amused by my goals (he says I'm always moving the goalposts, but he doesn't mind!) and isn't super bought into retiring early, especially since 10 years of wages is a million dollars for us - said it'd be hard to let that go.


UNTIL....he got a cold.  And while he worked from home, he didn't feel free to just rest, he still worked.  He could have rested, his job is great, but there was that nagging feeling of not being sick enough to truly take a sick day.  After that point, he started bringing up the idea of retiring when he was 45 (or semi-retiring) whereas before it was always me bringing it up. 

It's fun now that he sees it as a real possibility and not just one of my pipe dreams. 

Bracken_Joy

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Re: That Moment when you know your SO gets it...
« Reply #12 on: July 02, 2015, 09:16:31 AM »
DH was finally game to go to a goodwill recently! And he bought a pair of jeans! This was a hard sell. I didn't have a piece of completely new clothing until I reached high school- everything was hand-me-downs and thrift stores. He, on the other, has never worn used clothing, hand-me-down or otherwise. Never really thought about it until I noticed how resistant he had always been to thrifting... but he finally is coming around that we won't be insta-infested with bed bugs or anything!