So hard spending money

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

We recently bought a home, have a budget of $20-25k to spend on landscaping, but it's been so hard to spend the money. There are some things that have to be done, but majority is just superficial wants. Granted once we complete these superficial wants, it's going to look great, plus a bonus of improving the environment by replacing grass with drought tolerant plants. Since I've started reading the MMM forum, I've found it more difficult to justify spending. One thing that helps is we got a 21 mos 0% credit card, so rather than paying for the whole thing at once, we will chip away at it even though we have the money-I feel better holding on to the cash and slowly letting it go, more mental thing. Now, I have to convince myself not to pay off the card early. It all just feels so superficial, but when I think about how we will spend our time utilizing the space and the type of space we are creating, it's easier to stomach. Our savings rate is over 50% and we "only" have a fat mortgage. Seriously lame first world problem as so many people are suffering.

Do you guys have trouble spending money?

[rdaneel0]

I do not have trouble spending money even though I rarely do it. I think this is because when I spend on essentially anything I do a ton of research, wait for the best possible time of year according to sales, and then pull the trigger. Since I'm only buying what I truly need or what will make my life significantly better (e.g. you don't "need" a couch to survive, but having a couch is much nicer than having folding chairs, which is what I used to have in the living room). Since I'm so comfortable with the purchase I'm making and the amount I'm spending I don't usually feel uneasy.

(warning: facepunch ahead)

I wonder if you're having trouble spending the money because you're spending a massive sum on what you've admitted are superficial wants? I cannot even conceive of spending $20k-$25k on LANDSCAPING after plunking down the money on a new home! What are you having done? Why is it so much? Can't any of it be a DIY job? You still have a savings rate listed so I'm guessing you're not FIRE yet, I'm just curious to hear the rationale on spending so lavishly (what could be a downpayment) on something totally unnecessary (more trees? a patio?).

[Megma]

I have this problem for large sums, I've wanted to get our shower redone since we bought our house 3 years ago. It's original in the house from the late 70s and looks like crap. I got quotes two years ago and that was the end of it...I can't bring myself to pull the trigger because it's so much money (~3k).

I have restarted the shower fixing enthusiasm recently...I think I'm going to do it now.

[marty998]

You're spending more on your landscaping that my total expenses for one year, and I live very happily with my partner and our three cats. I have a legitimate, genuine question : what are you doing on a FIRE Forum, what do you want to learn from this community, or share with this community? Spending $20K on landscaping is RIDICULOUS.

Spending $20k is ridiculous, but seen as investing $20k to improve the value of your asset may not be so far-fetched...

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

(warning: facepunch ahead)

I wonder if you're having trouble spending the money because you're spending a massive sum on what you've admitted are superficial wants? I cannot even conceive of spending $20k-$25k on LANDSCAPING after plunking down the money on a new home! What are you having done? Why is it so much? Can't any of it be a DIY job? You still have a savings rate listed so I'm guessing you're not FIRE yet, I'm just curious to hear the rationale on spending so lavishly (what could be a downpayment) on something totally unnecessary (more trees? a patio?).

I have no qualms with the face punch and have been doing it regularly, wait till you read the details-probably more punches coming my way. We saved for the house for several years, but putting the down pmt on a house in CA is definitely nerve-wracking. The only necessity we are having done is a retaining wall because the current one is falling apart and is a hazard = about $5k; next is the patio-wanted to get rid of a lot of the grass = $9k; front and backyard-remove grass plus plants, mulch, etc = $4500-$5k. Covered patio--$4k.  I can't DIY a retaining wall and pavers, but removed some grass, plan to do some mulching, majority planting (can do this very slowly). 

Once we are done with all this, we are done with doing anything else for several years in terms of tweaking the house. Any problems with the house are budgeted for. What I think the issue has to do with is letting go of money, especially on things that are wants. I've budgeted the crap out of this, I know we can afford it AND still retire in our 40s. 

That's more the issue, do you have difficulty letting go of the money on wants?

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

You're spending more on your landscaping that my total expenses for one year, and I live very happily with my partner and our three cats. I have a legitimate, genuine question : what are you doing on a FIRE Forum, what do you want to learn from this community, or share with this community? Spending $20K on landscaping is RIDICULOUS.

Spending $20k is ridiculous, but seen as investing $20k to improve the value of your asset may not be so far-fetched...

Nope, don't see the house as an asset since we don't plan to ever sell it. This is it. I have an image in my head, created the design, and now am hiring people to do most of it. Majority of it is a total want. 

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

I have this problem for large sums, I've wanted to get our shower redone since we bought our house 3 years ago. It's original in the house from the late 70s and looks like crap. I got quotes two years ago and that was the end of it...I can't bring myself to pull the trigger because it's so much money (~3k).

I have restarted the shower fixing enthusiasm recently...I think I'm going to do it now.

Damn my perspective on "so much money" is way off. 3k doesn't seem like a lot, but when i think about it in terms of a shower, I totally see where you are coming from.

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

You're spending more on your landscaping that my total expenses for one year, and I live very happily with my partner and our three cats. I have a legitimate, genuine question : what are you doing on a FIRE Forum, what do you want to learn from this community, or share with this community? Spending $20K on landscaping is RIDICULOUS.

Awesome that you spend that much...Once we pay off the house, our spending will only be $36k and that's for southern California, which is awesome. It was about that much while we rented. I like this thread, it's helping me realize how 20k on landscaping is ridiculous, and ok to do if that's what I want IF I'm still saving responsibly.  Granted, I also never mentioned our household income, which is comfortable and that information would have perhaps changed some of the comments. But, again the point has more to do the ability to spend.  I'm not a mustachian role model on this forum, but am to majority of the people who know me.  Perhaps this is me spending in moderation and landscaping is something I can enjoy and never get tired of since it's my home and a place I spend majority of my time at.

[skip207]

Landscaping is expensive.  But its one of those jobs you have to do right first time.  Its easy to cheap out but it will cost you more in the long run.  In the UK the main issue is water, it rots timber quickly and you have to spec high quality fencing, decking etc because if you don't and save a few quid at the start you will find yourself replacing it all in less than 10 years.

[Guesl982374]

I like to think of it in terms of a percentage. Is spending a non-reoccurring $3,000 when you have $1MM a lot? Well its 0.3%, so no (think: MMM building his studio, he's already FI, its a one-off cost even though its expensive). Spending $25K when you have $430K in NW (and still building towards FI) is spending 6% of your wealth. That is way too much for, in your words, "superficial wants". Major facepunch.  I would pay for to fix the major safety hazards and start DYI if the landscaping is extremely important to you.

[Raenia]

Since there's actually several separate landscaping projects here, I'd split it up over a few years to soften the blow of spending so much.  Fix the retaining wall properly this year, since that is a real need, not just a want. Build the patio next year or the year after.  Remove the grass yourself, as much as possible.  There's no need to drop 20k all at once, here.

[skip207]

DIY is defo an option.  There is virtually nothing you cant do with hand tools in the garden.  Sure it takes longer but it can be done.
Materials are not cheap, but labour is the killer so saving that might save 50%.  Just depends on the skill set required I guess though, I would try most jobs but stuff like paving or stone work is way out of my comfort zone.

[Jenny1974]

We just finished building a new home in December.  We acted as GC and did a lot of work ourselves.  Landscaping was no different.  I paid $150 to have a landscape designer come out and put together a plan with low maintenance plants and DH and I did the ground prep and planting.  Saved thousands doing it ourselves and we are thrilled with the results.  I just couldn't justify spending a boatload of money on something that was a want rather than a need.

[tipster350]

I recently put in a patio and am thrilled with the purchase. It improved my experience of living in my home and being able to enjoy being able to spend time in my yard. I didn't go for fancy, I put in just enough patio with just enough visual interest to be functional for my needs and not an eyesore. It's getting heavy use and worth every penny for the years of enjoyment ahead.

There is much more I want to do in terms of landscaping but all of it pales in comparison when measured against cost vs. return in lifestyle improvement.

[Finallyunderstand]

Recently spent $5k on new patio and trees at our house.  Wish we had done it 6 years ago when we moved in. 

[PhilB]

I can really identify with your problems here.  Although some would have it that anyone who dares to post on MMM should be living a dhal and rice in a one room apartment and retiring the instant they have the money to cover that lifestyle, most of us are rather less extreme!  What does probably unite us all is that we are very good at waiting for that second marshmallow - and that can be where problems arise if we end up doing without marshmallows for decades to be able to have LOADS of marshmallows in retirement.  Once you get too set in the mindset of not spending money, it can become really hard to spend money that you know you can afford on things you know will make your life better - in your case having a beautiful outside space that will hopefully be a constant source of joy to you.  I have several things on my 'wants' list that I know I should just go and buy, but it's really hard as they are not needs (I am FI, but still working to add a little more padding).  I try to take inspiration from my father on the lines of 'if you can't be a good example be a horrible warning'.  He spent decades desiring a wood-turning lathe but couldn't bring himself to spend the money until he was well into his sixties and missed out on so many years that he could have been enjoying his hobby.  I have the same tendencies as him so I have to keep reminding myself that you do indeed only live once.

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

I can really identify with your problems here.  Although some would have it that anyone who dares to post on MMM should be living a dhal and rice in a one room apartment and retiring the instant they have the money to cover that lifestyle, most of us are rather less extreme!  What does probably unite us all is that we are very good at waiting for that second marshmallow - and that can be where problems arise if we end up doing without marshmallows for decades to be able to have LOADS of marshmallows in retirement.  Once you get too set in the mindset of not spending money, it can become really hard to spend money that you know you can afford on things you know will make your life better - in your case having a beautiful outside space that will hopefully be a constant source of joy to you.  I have several things on my 'wants' list that I know I should just go and buy, but it's really hard as they are not needs (I am FI, but still working to add a little more padding).  I try to take inspiration from my father on the lines of 'if you can't be a good example be a horrible warning'.  He spent decades desiring a wood-turning lathe but couldn't bring himself to spend the money until he was well into his sixties and missed out on so many years that he could have been enjoying his hobby.  I have the same tendencies as him so I have to keep reminding myself that you do indeed only live once.

YES, THIS!  Love that line from you father.  I save a lot, to the point that i think the people around me think we are a bit extreme. I'm concerned I'm going to save save save and forget that eventually we can spend...in the end I know we will have saved too much b/c my pension alone covers our expense once we pay off the house, which we could do in a few years--but the mustachians in another thread made great points that made me decide to invest all of it instead (great problem to have).

I budgeted $10k/year to spend as we like on our house b/c I had a feeling I would run into this problem of not wanting to spend the money.

After the responses, decided to do some of it myself, and can save maybe $1500. I sorta hurt myself from all the digging, so still need someone to assist even though I would feel so accomplished to do all the landscaping myself.

It's the hardscaping that's approximately $18-$19,000.  My mom is very successful, but i've watched her be cheap with her hardscaping, and the cost of her fixing it is insane. I rather do it well the first time which is why we went with more reputable companies and material.

Coincidently, I live off of dhal and rice, it's my fave food.   

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

You're spending more on your landscaping that my total expenses for one year, and I live very happily with my partner and our three cats. I have a legitimate, genuine question : what are you doing on a FIRE Forum, what do you want to learn from this community, or share with this community? Spending $20K on landscaping is RIDICULOUS.

Spending $20k is ridiculous, but seen as investing $20k to improve the value of your asset may not be so far-fetched...

I actually looked into improving the value of the house by doing the hardscaping, and was amazed to see the potential increase in value it would have since we are going with the higher end materials. Wouldn't have really put much thought into it, but this was helpful to learn, thanks for mentioning it.

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

Since there's actually several separate landscaping projects here, I'd split it up over a few years to soften the blow of spending so much.  Fix the retaining wall properly this year, since that is a real need, not just a want. Build the patio next year or the year after.  Remove the grass yourself, as much as possible.  There's no need to drop 20k all at once, here.

Technically we are not dropping it all at one. I guess I used some leverage by getting the 0% card that expires in nearly 2yrs.  That allows me to invest more along the way vs. drop the 20k all at once.  Side note-We don't have debt aside from mortgage, and I already have the $$ to pay the amount owed.    I decided to try and remove as much grass as possible. I even am thinking that bad ass patio cover can wait 2 yrs. I budgeted for $23k, but it's more the perspective of spending on things I want, when I've been so focused for years on only spending on necessities with few, inexpensive wants. My car is 11yrs old, TV 13yrs old, holes in clothes.  My kids probably have the fewest toys out of all their friends--kids seriously should not have crazy amount of toys...sorry went on a tangent

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

Recently spent $5k on new patio and trees at our house.  Wish we had done it 6 years ago when we moved in.

See, that's what' i've been thinking. Do i really need to delay the gratification if I don't have to?  We delay it all the time, for so many things. I'm truly excited about the transformation.  But, also think some things I can tweak to decrease the cost--b/c that's the story of my newly adopted life--being frugal can be a love/hate relationship sometimes.

[Mrs. Healthywealth]

Update: One of the response on this thread asked "why are you on a FIRE forum? What do you hope to learn from this community?" 

Well we decided to decrease the amount of work and do all the landscaping myself (lot of muscle building) along with not have a patio cover.  Total savings: $10,000 yay!

I was open to your feedback and appreciate the input :)

[nouveauRiche]

I have this problem for large sums, I've wanted to get our shower redone since we bought our house 3 years ago. It's original in the house from the late 70s and looks like crap. I got quotes two years ago and that was the end of it...I can't bring myself to pull the trigger because it's so much money (~3k).

I have restarted the shower fixing enthusiasm recently...I think I'm going to do it now.

I WISH we could remodel our ugly bathrooms for $3k each!  I'm expecting more like $10k each - which is why we haven't done it.

[elaine amj]

I am in the same boat. Am renovating my basement bedroom right now and choking a bit at the costs.

And of course, there's about a hundred other projects in the house that I would love to do - but have been putting them off as I classify them as wants. Stuff like:
- refacing/replacing our old bathtub as the paint is chipped in multiple spots
- replacing our aging front closet door that continually runs off its tracks despite how many times we put it back together
- replacing the ancient peeling shutters at the front of my house.
- replacing my entire backyard fence (I don't know when I'll ever be able to work up the nerve for this).

I started up another thread recently about how I hate paying for home renos and it seems like the consensus is - annual home renos/updates are the norm and I should budget $3-5k/yr for it.

It has been hard for me to swallow because we have refused to do any home updates in the past few years as we got more serious about FIRE. Now I need to add it to my FIRE budget which of course, adds considerably to my FIRE number. I've tried doing without - and honestly, my house looks terrible and just gets worse each year.

It all just feels like I am indulging my wants though. I have no angst paying for necessary home maintenance- just all this stuff I consider cosmetic.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk