Author Topic: Property Taxes Killing Me  (Read 47757 times)

DA

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Property Taxes Killing Me
« on: September 29, 2016, 08:57:49 AM »
I live in one of those very high property tax states.  My mortgage is only about $750 a month.  My property taxes are about $590 a month.  High property taxes certainly make being a Mustachian harder.  First, they don't go away, unlike your mortgage.  In fact, they're likely to go up over time.  Second, if you want to invest in rental real estate, they destroy your profit margins.  Yes, to some extent rents are higher to account for high property taxes, but it doesn't cover the spread between this state and similar states with lower taxes.  A Mustachian--at least a retired one--would much rather have high state income taxes than high property taxes. 

What's stopping me from moving?  Family mostly.  I have a young child, and being close to family is helpful for my spouse and I, and is beneficial for the kiddo as well. 

Anyone else lamenting their sky high property tax bills?

Mississippi Mudstache

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2016, 09:02:55 AM »
That sucks. Are you considering a move to a low-tax area post-FIRE? I've lived in the South my whole life, so there's nothing to lament for me, as far as taxes go.

rob in cal

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2016, 09:11:42 AM »
    DA, those numbers are horrifying.  Basically you could rent a modest apartment in many fairly desirable locations in southern Europe for the same price as your monthly property tax.  Btw, if California had not passed Prop. 13 in 1978, I have no doubt that we'd have many similar stories.  (not that its a perfect law by any means, but its saved countless homeowners from massive property tax increases).

AM43

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2016, 09:15:07 AM »
Income Property mortgage $1500, taxes $1100 per month
Primary Property mortgage $2800, taxes $ 1200 per month
Combined taxes over $26K
How do you deal with this?
Its so out of control where we live.

Guesl982374

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2016, 09:20:42 AM »
Yup. Some people call this place Taxachusetts. I can't complain too much given that we have some of the best public schools systems in the country and plenty of high income opportunities (jobs & businesses). We will also most likely stay long term for family reasons and the schools.

Will we work a few extra years because of it? Yes. Are we (wife and I) making a conscious decision based on our value system? Yes.

The way to avoid the high property taxes: Live in a smaller space and/or rent.


Guesl982374

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2016, 09:22:41 AM »
    DA, those numbers are horrifying.  Basically you could rent a modest apartment in many fairly desirable locations in southern Europe for the same price as your monthly property tax.  Btw, if California had not passed Prop. 13 in 1978, I have no doubt that we'd have many similar stories.  (not that its a perfect law by any means, but its saved countless homeowners from massive property tax increases).

But doesn't this just shift the tax burden on the younger generation/new buyers?

FerrumB5

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2016, 09:25:33 AM »
Went from 7800 in 2015 to 8400 in 2016. Illinois

Jrr85

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2016, 09:38:18 AM »
Yup. Some people call this place Taxachusetts. I can't complain too much given that we have some of the best public schools systems in the country and plenty of high income opportunities (jobs & businesses). We will also most likely stay long term for family reasons and the schools.

Will we work a few extra years because of it? Yes. Are we (wife and I) making a conscious decision based on our value system? Yes.

The way to avoid the high property taxes: Live in a smaller space and/or rent.

It's still frustrating as hell that so much of the benefit from many great job opportunities are skimmed off by corrupt local and state government officials.  At least you have good schools to offset some of that pain.  Many places the corruption ruins the schools too.


rantk81

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2016, 09:42:05 AM »
Went from $2600 last year to $4000 this year.  Condo in Chicago.  My rental condos went up by a similar percentage too.  They also have hinted at another very large increase for next year.

honeybbq

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2016, 09:45:04 AM »
Yep, my house has a 10k+ a year tax bill.

Can't wait to sell it when I retire and move to a smaller, farther out house where the tax burden will be less.

The city does have some rules that if you are on a fixed income and retired and over 65 (?) you can have your tax bill decreased but I doubt I'll ever quality for such discounts.

I won't need a house that is in a good school district or close to work or as big when I'm retired, either.

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2016, 10:32:04 AM »
Renting doesn't even help that much; I live in Chicago and the rents are soaring because landlords' property taxes are going up as well. And I hear they're going to go up again? So that's going to get passed on to us renters.

We really want to move when our lease is up next spring because we hate our neighborhood but we're going to end up paying a lot more. (though, that'll probably happen in our current place as well so I guess we're screwed either way.)

Pigeon

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2016, 10:45:34 AM »
My property taxes are around $550/month.  It doesn't bother me because we have great schools and services.  Great schools are very important to me, and not just for my own kids.

rob in cal

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2016, 10:53:20 AM »
  In terms of California, its really a crap shoot depending on when you buy. If you buy at the top of the market you'll have much higher taxes then if you bought at the bottom of the market.  Personally, I'd like to see no personal residence property tax, or maybe a 500k exemption, replaced by higher county sales taxes and maybe higher state income taxes.

accolay

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2016, 10:54:53 AM »
Wow. We pay just over 4k/annum for TWO properties per year and I was thinking it was a little much. What do your states do with the money?

Vilgan

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2016, 10:59:13 AM »
I far prefer the high sales tax approach of WA state. People label it as regressive and it is, but since groceries are excluded it also gives people a lot of freedom to decide how much tax they actually want to pay. I'm happy to let tourists and consumers shoulder the burden and pay a fairly minimal amount of tax compared to my income.

Property tax on home assessed at 600K: 4800
Income tax: 0
Sales tax paid: 10% of a small amount is still fairly small

monte0930

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2016, 10:59:51 AM »
You guys are making feel good about my property tax now, just went up from $1600/yr to $1700/yr. Primary residence in AZ :)

rantk81

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #16 on: September 29, 2016, 11:00:14 AM »
Wow. We pay just over 4k/annum for TWO properties per year and I was thinking it was a little much. What do your states do with the money?

They use the money to pay for over-promised unsustainable pension plans, to those employed by the state and local governments.

accolay

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #17 on: September 29, 2016, 11:04:35 AM »
Wow. We pay just over 4k/annum for TWO properties per year and I was thinking it was a little much. What do your states do with the money?

They use the money to pay for over-promised unsustainable pension plans, to those employed by the state and local governments.

Wait... I may have read another thread about that where those plans were going to go broke or something? Either way- holy crap!

Prairie Stash

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2016, 11:10:14 AM »
I live in one of those very high property tax states.  My mortgage is only about $750 a month.  My property taxes are about $590 a month.  High property taxes certainly make being a Mustachian harder.  First, they don't go away, unlike your mortgage.  In fact, they're likely to go up over time.  Second, if you want to invest in rental real estate, they destroy your profit margins.  Yes, to some extent rents are higher to account for high property taxes, but it doesn't cover the spread between this state and similar states with lower taxes.  A Mustachian--at least a retired one--would much rather have high state income taxes than high property taxes. 

What's stopping me from moving?  Family mostly.  I have a young child, and being close to family is helpful for my spouse and I, and is beneficial for the kiddo as well. 

Anyone else lamenting their sky high property tax bills?
High taxes suck, don't you make up for it through lower income tax? What's your total tax bill? Why invest in real estate if stocks perform better; what's your capital gains tax like where you live?

Being a mustachian means optimizing, if property taxes are high it usually means you pay less in other areas. Try looking at the entire picture and you might be no worse than comparable families in other starts.

Nate R

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2016, 11:14:03 AM »


Anyone else lamenting their sky high property tax bills?

Yep. I expect my taxes to be about $4700 this year for a house asessed at <160K. I bought (and live in) a duplex, because I couldn't stomach the thought of paying $400/mo in property taxes alone on a paid off single family home. This way, we'll eventually live housing cost-free, I hope.


AM43

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #20 on: September 29, 2016, 11:16:15 AM »
Wow. We pay just over 4k/annum for TWO properties per year and I was thinking it was a little much. What do your states do with the money?

Waste, mismanagement, law suits, unrealistic benefits for public employees and list goes on.

DA

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #21 on: September 29, 2016, 11:18:14 AM »
That sucks. Are you considering a move to a low-tax area post-FIRE? I've lived in the South my whole life, so there's nothing to lament for me, as far as taxes go.

Can't say for sure.  FIRE is a long way off, and there are just too many variables. 

Silrossi46

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #22 on: September 29, 2016, 11:20:47 AM »
440,000 dollar 4 bedroom 3 bath on .75 acre in suburban nj ...............2016 taxes 13,100/ year...........

Lulee

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #23 on: September 29, 2016, 11:26:24 AM »
New Hampshire, like our brethren in Taxachusetts, have high property taxes but don't have an income tax as well.  Mom's house which she can't seem to sell for 150K has taxes of about $4,200 per year.  The school system has a lot to do with this as a recent article in a local paper showed --- they've struggling to cut down on health care costs and hope to return one million dollars to tax payers this year, mostly based on such savings.

Despite the lack of an income tax, there are lots of other ones to help supplement the property taxes.  We' ve got ones on gas, cigarettes, and restaurants for instance.  Some folks along the borders with Vermont and Massachusetts come over to our side for purchases because they feel it saves enough to be worth the trip so I'm guessing that these are comparatively lower than the neighbors.

DA

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #24 on: September 29, 2016, 11:34:51 AM »
My property taxes are around $550/month.  It doesn't bother me because we have great schools and services.  Great schools are very important to me, and not just for my own kids.

I always wonder why people think there's such a strong link between spending on schools and the quality of the school.  For increased spending to improve educational outcomes, it would have to be true that either:  (i) the current teachers are slacking, but paying them more would motivate them to work harder; (ii) there is a massive gap in the skills between the teachers hired at the lower wage and the teachers the school could hire at a higher wage, (iii) more or highly-paid administrators would improve educational outcomes, or (iv) the physical environment of the school is in such bad shape that it actually detracts from learning, and more money is needed to repair it. 

Color me skeptical that any of these are true.  The most likely to be true is (ii), but union rules would prevent a mass firing of current teachers in any case.  Further, teachers in high property tax areas are usually already well-paid, when you factor in vacation time (25% -33% of the year off, with NO BLACKBERRY to check), gold-plated pensions that are available in one's late-50s, in addition to the decent pay relative to actual marketable skills. 

It seems to me that when people talk about "great public schools," they mean "schools full of the well-adjusted and intelligent children of successful upper-middle-class people."  But you could drop those kids into any of the "worst schools in the country" and they'd be fine.  From my vantage point, I see lots of public schools wasting obscene amounts of money on unnecessary luxuries like new football stadiums, swimming pools, etc.  The complaint about the old facilities is that they are old, as if that makes them unusable.  The real impetus is that the administrators want to one-up their peers in neighboring communities, and also a very shady quid pro quo between government contractors and school district officials.  What I care most about is the school's curriculum, and unfortunately for me, public schools usually have the worst curriculums (flavor of the month, progressive nonsense, new math, etc.). 

BTW, this should not be construed as an attack on Pigeon.  I think a big part of finding a "great school" for your children is just finding one that gives you a good feeling, that your kids like, and which has a curriculum you trust.  If Pigeon has found that, I'm happy for her.  But where I live, a significant portion of our outrageously high property taxes are wasted on educational spending. 

MMM98

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #25 on: September 29, 2016, 11:47:15 AM »
I have not heard of anyone who willingly pays high property taxes and NOT brag about how great their schools are.

We are on move from the 49th or 50th lowest property tax state to a middle of the road tax state.  And you know it doesn’t matter as each of the above posters have noted you stay or move for many reasons and usually property taxes is a very small (If at all) factor on why you stay or leave.

For the record the low property tax state does have excellent schools whereas the mid tax state does not.  How can that be?  Well in low tax state teachers make 40K, the schools were inexpensive to construct and with new infrastructure cheap to maintain.  In mid tax state it is the polar opposite.  My point is high tax does not equate to excellent schools, not at all.

We can certainly argue that better paid teachers make better teachers but the point is in an inexpensive state teachers can be employed for less.  Heck most everyone is, but the truth is the public in general loves to hate any sort of public employee’s salary

FireHiker

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #26 on: September 29, 2016, 01:05:44 PM »
Goodness do I feel your pain. Our property taxed are approximately $15k a year. We have MUCH more house than we need, but it is 2 miles from work (we carpool if we have to drop kids off further away, which will end in June when the youngest is out of preschool, and then we will walk or bike!!) and we LOVE our community and schools. I am counting down until we can move to a much less expensive place! We definitely fell into the housing part of the "keeping of with the Joneses" thing (moved December 2012 to brand new construction, still pains me to think about it). Found the FIRE community in the last 6-12 months and we are working on everything else we can cut/reduce. The property taxes though are definitely the biggest reason why we will move when the kids are out of school (or sooner if the right situation arises).

Jrr85

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #27 on: September 29, 2016, 01:12:15 PM »
My property taxes are around $550/month.  It doesn't bother me because we have great schools and services.  Great schools are very important to me, and not just for my own kids.

I always wonder why people think there's such a strong link between spending on schools and the quality of the school.  For increased spending to improve educational outcomes, it would have to be true that either:  (i) the current teachers are slacking, but paying them more would motivate them to work harder; (ii) there is a massive gap in the skills between the teachers hired at the lower wage and the teachers the school could hire at a higher wage, (iii) more or highly-paid administrators would improve educational outcomes, or (iv) the physical environment of the school is in such bad shape that it actually detracts from learning, and more money is needed to repair it. 

Color me skeptical that any of these are true.  The most likely to be true is (ii), but union rules would prevent a mass firing of current teachers in any case.  Further, teachers in high property tax areas are usually already well-paid, when you factor in vacation time (25% -33% of the year off, with NO BLACKBERRY to check), gold-plated pensions that are available in one's late-50s, in addition to the decent pay relative to actual marketable skills. 

It seems to me that when people talk about "great public schools," they mean "schools full of the well-adjusted and intelligent children of successful upper-middle-class people."  But you could drop those kids into any of the "worst schools in the country" and they'd be fine.  From my vantage point, I see lots of public schools wasting obscene amounts of money on unnecessary luxuries like new football stadiums, swimming pools, etc.  The complaint about the old facilities is that they are old, as if that makes them unusable.  The real impetus is that the administrators want to one-up their peers in neighboring communities, and also a very shady quid pro quo between government contractors and school district officials.  What I care most about is the school's curriculum, and unfortunately for me, public schools usually have the worst curriculums (flavor of the month, progressive nonsense, new math, etc.). 

BTW, this should not be construed as an attack on Pigeon.  I think a big part of finding a "great school" for your children is just finding one that gives you a good feeling, that your kids like, and which has a curriculum you trust.  If Pigeon has found that, I'm happy for her.  But where I live, a significant portion of our outrageously high property taxes are wasted on educational spending.

I think it's just people that haven't lived many places.  If they did, they would realize there are lots of places with low taxes and good schools, and places with high taxes and terrible schools.  What's really funny to me is that most of the people I hear talk about not minding their high taxes because of the good schools aren't actually in a good school system.  Their particular school (which captures a disproportionate share of the affluent areas in a school district and has affluent students and involved parents) is good, but other people in the same city (or whatever the taxing authority is for the schools) are paying the same high tax rates while still being stuck with crappy schools.  It's not the school that is sucking up tax money to be good.  The schools are good because of the mix of students and parents there, and it's other parts of the city that are sucking up and wasting money.


acroy

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #28 on: September 29, 2016, 01:17:35 PM »
Where are you OP? My tax rate is around 2.5% iirc

Mortgage: 640/mo on 130k 30yr fixed
Prop tax: 360/mo on 190k assessed value. Had to fight for that!
At least it's deductible...
When I FIRE, I will MOVE.

Public schools suck.

mm1970

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #29 on: September 29, 2016, 01:26:18 PM »
  In terms of California, its really a crap shoot depending on when you buy. If you buy at the top of the market you'll have much higher taxes then if you bought at the bottom of the market.  Personally, I'd like to see no personal residence property tax, or maybe a 500k exemption, replaced by higher county sales taxes and maybe higher state income taxes.

I bought near the peak.  For several years my prop taxes went down - the reassessed. (In CA)

mm1970

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #30 on: September 29, 2016, 01:27:28 PM »
    DA, those numbers are horrifying.  Basically you could rent a modest apartment in many fairly desirable locations in southern Europe for the same price as your monthly property tax.  Btw, if California had not passed Prop. 13 in 1978, I have no doubt that we'd have many similar stories.  (not that its a perfect law by any means, but its saved countless homeowners from massive property tax increases).

But doesn't this just shift the tax burden on the younger generation/new buyers?
To some degree, yes.  It hurts the schools, keeps elderly in their 4BR homes longer, causes home values to go up.

It makes it *much* harder for younger people to buy, and it can greatly affect how good the elementary school is.

Eurotexan

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #31 on: September 29, 2016, 02:46:33 PM »
I have two rentals in Dallas county. Both valued about the same. The rental in the great school system (HPISD) I pay $3500 a year in property taxes. For the rental in the awful, and I mean awful, school system (DISD) I pay $7000. Yes, the tax rates are that different.

That's a lot of money in property taxes.

stoaX

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #32 on: September 29, 2016, 03:02:15 PM »
Wow. We pay just over 4k/annum for TWO properties per year and I was thinking it was a little much. What do your states do with the money?

Waste, mismanagement, law suits, unrealistic benefits for public employees and list goes on.

My city spent $440,000 for a sign on the way into town with the city's name on it.  I can't for the life of me figure out how it could cost that much.... 

moof

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #33 on: September 29, 2016, 03:04:42 PM »
    DA, those numbers are horrifying.  Basically you could rent a modest apartment in many fairly desirable locations in southern Europe for the same price as your monthly property tax.  Btw, if California had not passed Prop. 13 in 1978, I have no doubt that we'd have many similar stories.  (not that its a perfect law by any means, but its saved countless homeowners from massive property tax increases).

But doesn't this just shift the tax burden on the younger generation/new buyers?
Yep, prop 13 really distorts things in unfair ways.  Neighbors with identical houses can pay drastically different taxes for identical services.  The money has to come from somewhere, so the new arrivals and young folks get the shaft.  Somehow you'd think that would run afoul of the equal protection clause, but apparently it does so only by the spirit of the law.

Here in Oregon we have a somewhat more sane system.  The taxes don't reset after a sale, so only new houses get the full brunt of full property taxes in a hot market rather than just new buyers (property taxes for the prior year are listed in the adverts).  Our 35 year old house is assessed at about 80% of fair market value for property taxes, so the relative disparity is much less than California.

On the downside Oregon has much less progressive income tax, only the first $5k is taxes at the lower 5%, the rest is 9% (9.9% for very high earners).  I'll pay 1/4 the state income taxes if I retire to California instead of Oregon, but properly taxes might make up for the delta.

On the whole I don't mind paying my fair share of taxes, I just wish the system we had was more uniform and progressive.

EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #34 on: September 29, 2016, 03:10:05 PM »
I've lived in Ohio (state income tax / low property tax), Tennessee (no state income tax), and now Texas (no state income tax, high property tax area).  It is SO FANTASTIC, while I'm working, to avoid filling out and paying state income taxes!  Holy crap, I will NEVER complain!!  With property taxes, you have some control over how much house you buy and know the tax rate where you buy.  It sucks, in Texas at least, that they reassess your house every year and generally get more property tax, but uou are also free to sell at any time if it is 'killing you'.  You can optimize. 

But sure, when you FIRE you will probably want to figure out ways to lower propery tax and will not having to worry about having or not having state income tax, and you won't have to live close to work.  But if you are doing your FIRE planning right, you should have a good grip on your future tax situation in relation to where you will live.   

scottish

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #35 on: September 29, 2016, 03:35:20 PM »
You guys in the US with the high property taxes.   Do you also pay income tax to your state?  Or is it just federal income tax?

moof

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #36 on: September 29, 2016, 03:42:30 PM »
You guys in the US with the high property taxes.   Do you also pay income tax to your state?  Or is it just federal income tax?

Locally...
Oregon:  I pay 0% sales tax, 9% income tax, and about 1.5% property tax.
Washtington (just 10 miles away) pays 0% income taxes, 6.5-9.9% sales tax, and similar 1-2% property taxes.

Everyone has the same rules for federal tax rules, which are bizantine and mostly rigged in favor of those with resources to be rich but appear poor for legal purposes.

State tax rate vary wildly from state to state, and somewhat from county to county.

"Freedom" at its finest.

Jack

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #37 on: September 29, 2016, 03:50:24 PM »
Locally...
Oregon:  I pay 0% sales tax, 9% income tax, and about 1.5% property tax.
Washtington (just 10 miles away) pays 0% income taxes, 6.5-9.9% sales tax, and similar 1-2% property taxes.

I've been wondering: how practical is it for people in your area to earn all their income in Washington and do all their spending in Oregon?

postvmvs

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #38 on: September 29, 2016, 04:47:05 PM »
In northern NJ property tax on a modest house is approaching the $10K/year mark.

Heck, I know a guy with a 1BR 1BA 900 sq ft house (no sewers or town water) paying over $9K/year.

stoaX

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #39 on: September 29, 2016, 04:52:52 PM »
Locally...
Oregon:  I pay 0% sales tax, 9% income tax, and about 1.5% property tax.
Washtington (just 10 miles away) pays 0% income taxes, 6.5-9.9% sales tax, and similar 1-2% property taxes.

I've been wondering: how practical is it for people in your area to earn all their income in Washington and do all their spending in Oregon?

Vancouver Washington has always intrigued me as a place to live for just that reason....that and the chance to live in the Pacific Northwest.  I would, however, have to make sure there is extra money in the budget for umbrellas.

pbkmaine

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #40 on: September 29, 2016, 04:53:49 PM »
We left NJ where the taxes on our 1950 split level on 1/4 acre were $12,000. We pay $2,500 for the same size house on the same size lot in Florida.

BlueHouse

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #41 on: September 29, 2016, 06:17:02 PM »
Doesn't anyone here qualify for homeowner's deductions for their property tax?  For your primary residence, $67.5K is knocked off the assessed price and the taxable rate cannot increase by more than 10% per year.  So if your house value appreciates, your property tax grows at a slower rate (but still painful). 

Surprised I'm not hearing more of that. 

clarkfan1979

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2016, 07:20:41 PM »
Lake County, IL property taxes are around 2.5%-4%. Many people struggle financially or work 50+ hours a week to make it work.

Curbside Prophet

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #43 on: September 29, 2016, 07:32:20 PM »
Renting doesn't even help that much; I live in Chicago and the rents are soaring because landlords' property taxes are going up as well. And I hear they're going to go up again? So that's going to get passed on to us renters.

We really want to move when our lease is up next spring because we hate our neighborhood but we're going to end up paying a lot more. (though, that'll probably happen in our current place as well so I guess we're screwed either way.)

It's guaranteed to go up.  A lot.  Chicago and really IL in general is really screwed due to their vastly underfunded pensions.  You'll be picking up that bill.

moof

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #44 on: September 29, 2016, 07:48:43 PM »
Locally...
Oregon:  I pay 0% sales tax, 9% income tax, and about 1.5% property tax.
Washtington (just 10 miles away) pays 0% income taxes, 6.5-9.9% sales tax, and similar 1-2% property taxes.

I've been wondering: how practical is it for people in your area to earn all their income in Washington and do all their spending in Oregon?
Work in Oregon but live in Washington and you still get to pay Oregon taxes.

Live and work in Washington and you still, legally, are required to pay sales taxes on out of state purchases.  Plenty of people do it, but big items like cars are going to be hard to get away with.

Goldielocks

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #45 on: September 29, 2016, 07:55:06 PM »
I far prefer the high sales tax approach of WA state. People label it as regressive and it is, but since groceries are excluded it also gives people a lot of freedom to decide how much tax they actually want to pay. I'm happy to let tourists and consumers shoulder the burden and pay a fairly minimal amount of tax compared to my income.

Property tax on home assessed at 600K: 4800
Income tax: 0
Sales tax paid: 10% of a small amount is still fairly small

I don't think it is regressive, especially when there are often low income rebates and basic items like groceries and second hand goods are excluded.

Rather, it means that those that have more freed up money to spend, and choose to, pay more taxes. Those that have less money to spend pay less.

It ensures that snowbirds or visitors to the area contribute to the government services, too.


Thegoblinchief

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #46 on: September 30, 2016, 06:28:34 AM »
Move, become a politician, or stop complaining. Complaining about something you can't change is a pointless use of mental and emotional energy.

ender

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #47 on: September 30, 2016, 06:38:16 AM »
We pay about 1.7% of assessed value, but 1.45% of appraised value.

Sofa King

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #48 on: September 30, 2016, 07:33:06 AM »
We live 60miles from NYC in Orange County NY.  1000sf house. We pay $3,300 a year and that is cheap compared to most around here. It has doubled in the last 16 years since moving here.  Most of my friends are paying btwn $8,000 and $13,000 per year. Peoples pay is not keeping up with these taxes. There IS a breaking point for people.  I don't see how it can double again in the next 16 years.  Many home owners just do not have the $$$$ to pay this.  We have no children yet have to pay school tax. I feel this is not rite. Whether you rent or own they should make people who have kids pay a certain amount for each kid they put into the school system. Then maybe these people would think twice about having that 5th kid when they can't even afford to house and feed themselves.

lizzzi

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Re: Property Taxes Killing Me
« Reply #49 on: September 30, 2016, 07:48:40 AM »
Northeastern Ohio here. Have mid-century 1165 sq. ft. flat ranch on 2/3 acre in wonderful location facing walking trails and golf courses of huge Metropark.  Nearby Interstate to take me to major airports or anywhere else I want to go.  Property taxes yearly are $2265. Ohio income tax yearly is $560. This location is a best-kept secret, no question.