Author Topic: Planning for Aging without Family  (Read 10054 times)

Focus_on_the_fire

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Planning for Aging without Family
« on: September 18, 2021, 10:46:18 AM »
Hey everyone.

Not to turn the conversation morbid on a nice Saturday morning, but I'm in a situation that I was hoping some bright person here might be able to help me with. I am the youngest in my family and I don't have any children. It's not an issue now, but it wouldn't be too far fetched to assume that I would be the last one standing.

After amassing a 'stache, I'm thinking about what type of financial and health planning I would need in place to protect it and me in the event I wasn't able to appropriately make decisions for my welfare.

What I've read so far recommends finding a "trusted friend." As an introvert with my BFF across country, that's not quite as easy as you expect. Has anyone else considered this potential future? Is there something I could put into place with advisors? Or, should I get out of my comfort bunker and start making friends, joining a church or club STAT?

Thanks all.

Fire2025

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2021, 11:31:45 AM »
I love morbid on a Saturday morning!!  I've thought about this a lot.  I'm a childless female so chances are goodish I will out live my SO. My family is not an option, just not an option, and most of my friends are long distance also.

For me the most interesting example of "creative independence" in later life was a friend who was in his late 80's and got a younger housemate.  The housemate also had some disabilities, so could not live totally independently, and they formed an interesting co-op. 

My friend supplied the house and food.  The housemate handled general errands for them both.  My friend also paid for someone to clean the house weekly.  The housemate didn't handle any of my friends medical issues, but he did take my friend to medical appointments, when he could.  This worked wonderfully until my friend died peacefully, at home, at 98.  The housemate now lives in a group home with people his own age, but he says he preferred living with my friend, even with the challenges at the end.

I've also seen some "Golden Girls" type set-ups work really well for people.  But I'm not an introvert, so this may sound like torture to you. 

But these examples have made me feel the answer is to get creative.  We're all here, for the most part, because we have chosen an alternative lifestyle.  If we can get as creative with old age, as we are with our finances and getting to FIRE, I think we can make it work.

Dicey

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2021, 12:14:57 PM »
I was kind of like this. I was single and had a job that kept me on the road a lot. I had friends all over the country, but didn't see anyone I knew when I went to the grocery store.

Of course I was saving my ass off for my self-funded retirement, so I didn't want to do spendy things to make local friends. I started keeping my eyes open for fun/free things to do. I began volunteering at the library book sales, because, unlimited $1 books. I befriended the librarians. They're a great resource, because they know all the stuff that's going on and they don't make a lot of money, so they are great at stretching a buck. Through them, I found out about volunteer ushering (Free shows!), an interesting Arts Group ($35 annual dues), a program called Discover & Go that gets you into museums and other attractions free, and much more.

Through these things, I met more people and just followed anything that looked interesting. Someone asked me to join the steering committee of a civic event that was just starting up. Eleven years later, we've grown like crazy and I'm the co-chair of the event.*

Post-FIRE, I began volunteering at a nearby thrift store. OMG, I love it! I call it my Cheers Bar, because everybody knows your name. People who volunteer at thrift stores do so because they love them too. Even the very wealthy ones (like me now, lol) love a bargain. Now I have a whole raft of frugal friends!

Through these friends, I learn how people manage their lives as they age. There are lots of examples like the one @Fire2025 shared.

This may seem like an indirect answer to your question, but I promise you it works! Focus on building a strong social network first. You will never regret it!

Full disclosure: I did finally get married at 54 to a great guy a guy who has a Defined Benefit Pension, including reasonably priced healthcare. I feel like Cinder-fucking-rella (bonus points if you get the reference). The steps I took in all those years when I was sure spinsterhood was my fate have paid off in spades. And this includes all the saving and investing I did. We're rich beyond our wildest dreams and all the sacrifice was so, so worth it.

*Random tidbit: Not only do I now see people I know when I go to the grocery store, but because of the above event, I know every store manager of every grocery store in my town, which I think is hilarious. Of course, I shop at cheaper stores in a nearby town, but I know those managers by name, too!

One more thing: We have a lot of introverts here. Tailoring your activities to things that really interest you makes it much easier. I'm not suggesting you do the exact things I do, just that you follow your interests. For me, being involved in things which benefit the community came as a result of my love of reading, which is a most solitary pursuit. One thing just led to another...

cannotWAIT

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2021, 02:54:11 PM »
I ruminate about this a lot. A lot! I'm in my mid-50s, the childless only child of an only child. My 30-year marriage ended three years ago, and with it any expectation of having enough money to pay for some of the protections that family provide. I do have good friends but they're scattered all over and none of them live in the same town, and I think the most I could possibly expect from any of them is to hire someone to manage my finances for me. One of the main reasons I want to retire is to spend my time building community where I live.

Dicey, I would love to hear more examples of what you've learned about how people manage their lives as they age without family, because this is a real source of anxiety for me and encouraging stories are very thin on the ground. Any time I read about this topic, it ends up being a litany of comments about how the only people who get decent care in nursing homes are the ones with family to intervene. Or better yet, family to keep them out of the nursing home in the first place. I have thought about building an ADU on my property to live in and finding someone to live rent free in the main house in exchange for looking out for me. But I think if I end up in a nursing home, which family history suggests is likely, I'm basically fucked. I console myself that this is also true for many people with family, but it's not that much of a consolation!

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2021, 03:09:09 PM »
Thanks everyone for the responses. It's nice to know that I'm not alone in these concerns and you've given me a lot to think about. 

  • @Fire2025: The reminder to stay creative is an excellent one. I need to remind myself that in this too there is no one way to do it. I liked those suggestions.
  • @Dicey: I think volunteering has to factor into my approach. I have work friends, but when I FIRE I'm worried that those connections won't be strong enough to weather time. Oh, and I got the reference. Congrats to both you and your guy. So happy for you.
  • @cannotWAIT: You hit on my fear. I read the stories about people who need family to intervene as well. That's why I wondered whether there might be some kind of trust, attorney/CPA/health care advocate arrangement you could put into place to provide that coverage. However, it does seems to be social safety net at the end of the day.

 One thing to note, I'm probably not a true introvert. I'm more of a very lazy extrovert, so I'm taking some consolation in that. I may have options.

maizefolk

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2021, 03:59:26 PM »
Posting partially just to follow but also the emphasize that I think this is an important topic that probably should be discussed and planned for more. Hopefully still a number of decades off but given 1) my family structure and 2) my historical failure and making close friends post-20s, it's definitely something I think and worry about.

Kris

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2021, 04:03:31 PM »
I’m in my fifties, an only child, and childless myself. My DH has two daughters, but I don’t want to burden them with choices about my life and care if I can help it. I am thankful that I do have them, though. So, posting to follow and hopefully contribute if able.

Freedomin5

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2021, 04:31:30 PM »
There are Continuing Care Retirement Communities that have independent housing options when you are still able to live independently. They can arrange weekly cleaners and they have a service that can take you to your medical appointments if you don’t drive, among other services. Then, when you require more intensive care, you get assisted living services. The better ones will also organize social events so you can stay active and get to know some neighbors.

Quote
CCRCs provide a continuum of care, meaning that they provide various levels of care as residents age. As such, these all-inclusive senior communities include independent living, assisted living, and nursing home care in one location, thereby allowing seniors to live in just one location, even as their needs change over time.

In addition, make sure your will and health directive are up to date and keep a copy at your lawyer’s, then make sure that when you move into the CCRC, they have the contact information of your lawyer on file. If you have older siblings, do they have kids (ie, nieces and nephews) that you trust to be the executor of the will and of your directives? If not, your lawyer sometimes will do it for a fee.

As an introvert, the abovementioned ideas to volunteer at a bunch of places or (even worse) live with a roommate sound absolutely draining and exhausting.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2021, 04:35:25 PM by Freedomin5 »

Sibley

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2021, 04:48:40 PM »
Freedomin5 - just because you're an introvert doesn't mean its good for you to stay at home all day and never have contact with people. Want evidence? Look at the past 18 months. Yes, the introverts weathered the lockdown better than extroverts, but that doesn't mean that they weren't negatively impacted. Longer term, solitude is going to do some pretty bad things to your head. Find some level of engagement that is enjoyable and doable. You don't have to spend 60 hours a week volunteering.

Freedomin5

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2021, 04:54:03 PM »
I don’t think one should stay home all day with no contact with people, hence my comment about social events, staying active, and getting to know neighbors.

dang1

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2021, 06:27:48 PM »
my childless 76 yr old aunt, her husband died last year after a long illness. She was already renting an extra room in her house, to a woman friend, added another renter to occupy the other room. 2 weeks ago, she started working as a dining assistant, at a nursing facility nearby. She's thinking about started a zumba club at her work. This is a woman who shocked me by dancing atop a table at her 70th birthday at a Cuban nightclub in LA, with her zumba clique- i was like: omg, don't fall off! . She talks about returning to the home country when she's not so energetic anymore. Within the family compound back in the home country, there's the main house, and adjacent, a college-age student boarding house.

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2021, 10:15:25 AM »
There are Continuing Care Retirement Communities that have independent housing options when you are still able to live independently. They can arrange weekly cleaners and they have a service that can take you to your medical appointments if you don’t drive, among other services. Then, when you require more intensive care, you get assisted living services. The better ones will also organize social events so you can stay active and get to know some neighbors.

Quote
CCRCs provide a continuum of care, meaning that they provide various levels of care as residents age. As such, these all-inclusive senior communities include independent living, assisted living, and nursing home care in one location, thereby allowing seniors to live in just one location, even as their needs change over time.

In addition, make sure your will and health directive are up to date and keep a copy at your lawyer’s, then make sure that when you move into the CCRC, they have the contact information of your lawyer on file.

We have a highly rated one in the area. The waiting list is years to get a house, so I'm keeping that in my back pocket for my 70s.

Quote

 If you have older siblings, do they have kids (ie, nieces and nephews) that you trust to be the executor of the will and of your directives? If not, your lawyer sometimes will do it for a fee.


I have a niece, but she's not local and we are more holiday relatives than having any significant relationship, so that's why I'm thinking you're right, it will have to be an attorney. 

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2021, 10:17:28 AM »
my childless 76 yr old aunt, her husband died last year after a long illness. She was already renting an extra room in her house, to a woman friend, added another renter to occupy the other room. 2 weeks ago, she started working as a dining assistant, at a nursing facility nearby. She's thinking about started a zumba club at her work. This is a woman who shocked me by dancing atop a table at her 70th birthday at a Cuban nightclub in LA, with her zumba clique- i was like: omg, don't fall off! . She talks about returning to the home country when she's not so energetic anymore. Within the family compound back in the home country, there's the main house, and adjacent, a college-age student boarding house.

This made me smile. Your aunt sounds like a kick!

henramdrea

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2021, 07:26:17 PM »
In my years and travels as a healthcare professional, I've worked at/for a few very nice CCRC's.  They're not all created equal so you'd want to look at how they're structured and underwritten (if they're a non-profit) and what type of healthcare floor they operate (skilled nursing, assisted living, long-term).  Some of these like skilled nursing, may not be an option for the smaller facilities.  Most will have an assisted living option.  Assisted living varies in what it offers for "assistance".  Some only offer meals, housekeeping, laundry, transportation.  Others will offer personal care such as assist with dressing and bathing.  Sometimes extra fees apply for self-care and transportation. 

You'd have to look into these more closely to see how they work and if they're for you.

The one I worked for in the 90's was pretty fancy.  $250K to buy in, and then $1800/month.  They had a good charity program there too where residents would donate a certain amount and it would cover residents who would run into financial troubles due to health issues.  They also donated nicely to a yearly employee gift (usually around Christmas time) of about $500.  I still remember it as being a great place to work.

Zamboni

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2021, 07:44:06 PM »
Volunteering doesn't have to be a draining extroverted activity. Just saying. We have lots of volunteers that do things like manage our webpage, write articles for our newsletter, manage the treasury, etc. They mostly do these from home, with a short meeting once very month or two. After a few years, you feel like you know the person and would help them, even though you only saw them a few times a year.

BZB

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2021, 09:46:35 PM »
I'm planning to move into a cohousing development, which is an intentional multigenerational community of private homes, with shared green spaces and a common house for shared meals. The homes are designed for aging in place. I heard someone say once that after age 50, most people's lives contract. The pandemic seems to be magnifying that. I have a friend who lives alone and is in her 70's, and isolation seems to have aged her more.  She has no family nearby, but there are a couple of neighbors and friends she talks to. The first several years after she retired she kept busy with travel, having people over for dinner or visiting their homes, and just generally being social. We used to go for walks once a week. Now she spends much of her time watching TV or scrolling her iPad, with an occasional trip to the grocery store. Health problems have limited her mobility, and she's lost confidence in walking and driving. I think if she were in a community like cohousing she would be doing so much better.

RedmondStash

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2021, 11:41:33 AM »
Great topic, great answers.

Posting to follow.

cannotWAIT

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #17 on: September 20, 2021, 12:20:39 PM »
I've looked at a lot of CCRCs. There are some very nice ones and it seems that people really like them. At their best, they can provide everything that cohousing does, except for the diversity in ages, but with the guarantee of help in your own home. The nice ones are very expensive, though. Like, hundreds of thousands of dollars just to get in, then 4-5K a month.

I think cohousing is an attractive prospect for community while you're still able to do everything yourself, especially if you value living among not just people your own age (which I do), but they're not really a solution for the problems of aging. If you need help getting dressed in the morning or remembering to take your medication, it's not going to be reasonable to expect anyone there to help you. But in theory you would at least be less isolated and have people who would, you know, find you when you fall down the stairs.

Missy B

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2021, 02:01:19 PM »
I'm planning to move into a cohousing development, which is an intentional multigenerational community of private homes, with shared green spaces and a common house for shared meals. The homes are designed for aging in place. I heard someone say once that after age 50, most people's lives contract. The pandemic seems to be magnifying that. I have a friend who lives alone and is in her 70's, and isolation seems to have aged her more.  She has no family nearby, but there are a couple of neighbors and friends she talks to. The first several years after she retired she kept busy with travel, having people over for dinner or visiting their homes, and just generally being social. We used to go for walks once a week. Now she spends much of her time watching TV or scrolling her iPad, with an occasional trip to the grocery store. Health problems have limited her mobility, and she's lost confidence in walking and driving. I think if she were in a community like cohousing she would be doing so much better.

Agree completely. Community like that, especially when it is very close physically, makes a massive difference as people age. If you're on a walker, having people within safe and easy walker-distance  can mean the difference between having friends or not. And i think it's important to have a mix of ages too.

This is a really big issue, and I'm glad to see other people are thinking about this too. I still hear people going on about how they're going to move to (random distant tinyville) and buy/build their dream home in the country at 65, with a total focus on how special their physical location is and no real investigation of the local culture/community or what will happen if they can't drive, need special services, help, or home care. In complete denial of the reality of aging.

My bf's parents did this exact thing, and the last 5 years have been like watching a train wreck in slow motion. It actually ended up worse than I thought for a couple of reasons, one being covid. They haven't made friends and are angry, depressed, and lonely but won't consider moving.

FIRE Artist

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #19 on: September 20, 2021, 02:15:38 PM »
I'm planning to move into a cohousing development, which is an intentional multigenerational community of private homes, with shared green spaces and a common house for shared meals. The homes are designed for aging in place. I heard someone say once that after age 50, most people's lives contract. The pandemic seems to be magnifying that. I have a friend who lives alone and is in her 70's, and isolation seems to have aged her more.  She has no family nearby, but there are a couple of neighbors and friends she talks to. The first several years after she retired she kept busy with travel, having people over for dinner or visiting their homes, and just generally being social. We used to go for walks once a week. Now she spends much of her time watching TV or scrolling her iPad, with an occasional trip to the grocery store. Health problems have limited her mobility, and she's lost confidence in walking and driving. I think if she were in a community like cohousing she would be doing so much better.

What is your timeline for making this move?  What age will you be when trying to join such a community? 

elliha

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2021, 02:22:45 PM »
If you are in this situation my first priority now would be investing in my health. Yes, there are all kinds of solutions when you get old but if you have good health you will always have more options. My MIL is 83 and still lives without any help in house that is some distance away from us. I don't know if she will manage all of her life, of course, but I am sure she is greatly helped by her good health and will continue to be even if she does need help later on. So, the right now thoughts should really concentrate on being able to handle life on your own for as long as possible.

tygertygertyger

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #21 on: September 20, 2021, 02:32:57 PM »
Posting to follow, as I expect this situation for myself too. I have a partner but we're childless. A friend and I have agreed to be old ladies together. She claims her kids will take care of me, but I don't really expect that!

I've been making inroads toward community where we live now, but we're planning to move soon, so I'll need to start again.

We do have a vague plan to build a cohousing building/community with our friends, but for many reasons, I don't really expect that to be the solution.

OtherJen

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2021, 03:48:15 PM »
Husband and I are also childless, so this is definitely on our minds. I'm an only child, and he has one sister with two kids. We certainly don't expect our niece and nephew to take care of us in addition to their own parents.

I have several elderly friends in their 80s and early 90s who live in an apartment community for retired people; most of them have children that don't live in the area. They all have independent apartments, do their own cooking, still drive, etc., but there are a lot of volunteer and social groups on the campus to provide companionship. As they age and need more help, they can move into an assisted living facility while still being in a place that is familiar, with people that they know. That doesn't sound like a bad option to me if we can afford it.

Dollar Slice

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #23 on: September 20, 2021, 05:33:17 PM »
If you are in this situation my first priority now would be investing in my health.

Healthy people always think it's their fault they're healthy, but a lot of it is luck. My dad has been a health nut his whole life because his dad died very young, but now my dad's showing early signs of dementia, he has a pacemaker, and he's got an autoimmune disease that's seriously affecting his quality of life. He did everything right, but guess what: shit happens.

Likewise, having family doesn't always protect you from ending up alone in your old age - an acquaintance of mine with heart problems and mental health issues had her daughter and her husband predecease her, now she has no family and no income or savings and is in a really bad situation.

I'm almost guaranteed to end up alone and childless (on the ace spectrum and 100% don't want kids) so I have vague plans to go into some kind of assisted retirement community or shack up with friends. Or just jumping off a bridge as a backup plan if I'm in serious misery and things are really not fun any more... :-/  (The plans you make when you've had chronic pain since your early 20s!)

kite

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #24 on: September 20, 2021, 05:53:47 PM »
Hey everyone.
....
 I'm thinking about what type of financial and health planning I would need in place to protect it and me in the event I wasn't able to appropriately make decisions for my welfare.

...
 Has anyone else considered this potential future? Is there something I could put into place with advisors? Or, should I get out of my comfort bunker and start making friends, joining a church or club STAT?

Thanks all.

How timely.  I'm on my third relative with dementia, currently serving as primary care giver for two of them (and two is too many).  I think plenty about how it will go when it's my turn to be dependent. 

The first one had a nice chunk of change saved, a decent pension and long term care insurance. She also had an advanced directive and a niece appointed as P.O.A.  Bless her for doing all of that!  What she failed to do, however, was make her own home accessible. Since her home wasn't livable in the months after a broken hip and later, a broken femur, she spent longer in nursing homes than she wanted. And because that time was necessitated not from her medical condition, but because of her house, LTC wouldn't cover long stretches of it.  It only kicked in when her Alzheimer's advanced to a certain point.

The take-away for me was twofold:  Get rid of all the trip hazards and make my home accessible BEFORE I need it to be accessible.  My aunt tripped and fell in her own home.  She couldn't navigate the steps during recovery in order to bathe, which required more time in a facility.   Fortunately she was well cared for in one of the best places around and had enough money to cover the expenses until she passed.  But one month's fees for assisted living would more than have covered the necessary modifications. She didn't do it and spent 10x that much on monthly rent for a really cute assisted living apartment, desperate to go home again.

The second relative to get dementia is my Mom.  No LTC, but her estate planning paperwork is in order. Her home is not one floor, but it is navigable for her in her declining state. An extra set of handrails on each staircase has been a tremendous benefit. She's had a few friends in the closest nursing home in our town and has expressed that if/when the time comes, that is the one she wants to go to.  It is also one of the better ones. For now, she's still at home. She weighs about 125lbs. I can lift her when needed.

Next take away:  Don't weigh too much. Get enough exercise to maintain physical strength, especially upper body strength. Reinforce handrails and put in grab bars where I will find them useful. Evaluate the places near me to choose which one I would accept when the time comes.

The third is not yet diagnosed with dementia, but it's there.  This isn't my first rodeo.  He's an even bigger challenge because he still retains just enough control over his own life to be dangerous to himself and others. Numerous car accidents, can't manage his own medication, can't prepare food for himself or arrange to feed himself. Won't bathe. Won't stay put for a home health aid or Meals-on-Wheels to bring food to him.  He wanders. Destroys technology, like cell phones or TV remotes and then goes banging on neighbor's doors at all hours demanding immediate help. He's been sexually inappropriate (like millions of other men in cognitive decline). He weighs 220. I can't lift him, even with help. Every time he's fallen or is stuck in a chair, I need to call 911.

The take away:  Don't spend all my money on Nascar collectibles and lottery tickets. Take care of my teeth. Bathe.

People make (and talk about) vague plans to ensure they don't face the same fate.  Or they have a concrete plan to commit suicide before becoming that far gone.  But there can be a really long road between the beginning of the decline and the end of life, where people live beyond the point they said they would make the drastic move and they are no longer capable.  Perhaps I'll be like my father, no cognitive decline but with failing eyesight, unable to drive for about 10 years before he died.  Can I hire a car-service or walk to everywhere I want to go when driving is no longer possible? Maybe I'll be like my aunt with several falls & breaks.  I wear the type of watch that will let my husband know if I've fallen.  He can track my location when I'm out on a training run.  We're remodeling now (in our 50's) making everything as accessible as possible in our single story home. I decided I need the curb-less shower before I need the curb-less shower. 

I'm heeding my doctor's advice on preventing dementia.  I've been told there is a connection between untreated hypertension in one's 50's and vascular dementia later on.  I've also been told they call Alzheimer's "Diabetes Type III" and believe there is a link to sugar intake.
I think there is a catch-22.  My mother & her sister were healthy living, vegetable eaters who got plenty of exercise and were never overweight. They lived into their 90's and had long stretches of dementia.   My father's family was full of smokers. Their declines were shorter, involved vision loss.  My in-laws were alcoholics. Death was sudden and swift, each of them before age 75. It's tempting to pick up a really bad habit so I don't outlive my money.

In the meantime, I need to refresh all my in-case-of-emergency instructions, advance directive stuff.  I do have a spouse, so there is a 'primary' person.  I also have quite a big extended family. 

I would encourage you to get out of your comfort zone and join a church.  People need people.  Even introverts.  A faith community is a group committed to each other, it is where those in need can meet those with something to offer.  And what organized religions all recognize is that people move between these states of needing and being needed throughout their lives, of being dependent and of being able to help. The Abrahamic religions all have this in common.  So do groups like the American Legion or recovery communities and very likely some dedicated agnostics or other groups I'm unqualified to speak about.

Long before you begin that decline into dependency, you will probably have needs.  Some of them might even be right now or within the next few days.  You may also have something to offer to someone near you who needs it, even if it's just toilet paper. Really, join a church or whatever.

As far as your legal affairs, there is quite a bit you can do with a trust. The trustee doesn't need to be a friend or family member.  But whether or not it is financially worthwhile can depend on the size of your estate.  Talk to the eldercare or family law person who prepares your Will, POA, Advanced Directive or Healthcare Proxy.  Your executor or emergency contact can still be that BFF who lives far away. 

BZB

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #25 on: September 20, 2021, 06:08:40 PM »
@FIRE Artist
Quote
What is your timeline for making this move?  What age will you be when trying to join such a community?
In 2 years, age late 40's

Metalcat

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #26 on: September 20, 2021, 06:28:53 PM »
I really don't get this concept of introverts not having friends. I'm friends with tons of hardcore introverts, all of whom have excellent social supports. Introverts are often better at making deeper bonds with people because they tend to be better listeners than the hardcore extroverts.

There's a difference between being introverted and socially awkward. You can't change being an introvert, but social skills are very learnable.

At the end of the day, good solid relationships are what will make the difference in your quality of life as you age. They don't have to be relatives, I've worked with enough seniors to know that really involved families are rare.

But I also grew up in a community where it's the norm for older women to live collectively, for very senior neighbours to be looked after by community members who are also seniors, but younger. My mom has a stable of 3 senior widowed men that she looks after. My step mom has two very senior ladies whose medical care she manages. It's also not unusual for widowed folks to move in with other empty nesters. Senior roommates are common there. No one gets left behind.

I think that with the increase of child free people, and the general disdain for retirement homes, I think communal living among seniors will become more and more the norm. And this will create a community of support.

There's a communal housing for seniors apartment complex that was just built a block from my house.

The boomers are such a massive population with so much money that they will drive changes in the way that elder care is handled. They pave a whole new path for the rest of us to follow because many of them know they can't count on their broke, burnt out kids to do it.

If a place doesn't exist for what I want, I'll just buy a building and make it myself if I need to.

FIRE Artist

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #27 on: September 20, 2021, 08:09:27 PM »
@FIRE Artist
Quote
What is your timeline for making this move?  What age will you be when trying to join such a community?
In 2 years, age late 40's

Nice!  The ones that I see popping up in my province all seem to be apartment based, which is a bummer.  It also seems that units with more than one bedroom are reserved for families to purchase.  I think I would have to be much older before I would consider living in a small apartment, I enjoy my yard and in home studio space too much to give that up.

Missy B

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #28 on: September 20, 2021, 08:25:35 PM »
Hey everyone.
....
 I'm thinking about what type of financial and health planning I would need in place to protect it and me in the event I wasn't able to appropriately make decisions for my welfare.

...
 Has anyone else considered this potential future? Is there something I could put into place with advisors? Or, should I get out of my comfort bunker and start making friends, joining a church or club STAT?

Thanks all.

How timely.  I'm on my third relative with dementia, currently serving as primary care giver for two of them (and two is too many).  I think plenty about how it will go when it's my turn to be dependent. 

The first one had a nice chunk of change saved, a decent pension and long term care insurance. She also had an advanced directive and a niece appointed as P.O.A.  Bless her for doing all of that!  What she failed to do, however, was make her own home accessible. Since her home wasn't livable in the months after a broken hip and later, a broken femur, she spent longer in nursing homes than she wanted. And because that time was necessitated not from her medical condition, but because of her house, LTC wouldn't cover long stretches of it.  It only kicked in when her Alzheimer's advanced to a certain point.

The take-away for me was twofold:  Get rid of all the trip hazards and make my home accessible BEFORE I need it to be accessible.  My aunt tripped and fell in her own home.  She couldn't navigate the steps during recovery in order to bathe, which required more time in a facility.   Fortunately she was well cared for in one of the best places around and had enough money to cover the expenses until she passed.  But one month's fees for assisted living would more than have covered the necessary modifications. She didn't do it and spent 10x that much on monthly rent for a really cute assisted living apartment, desperate to go home again.

The second relative to get dementia is my Mom.  No LTC, but her estate planning paperwork is in order. Her home is not one floor, but it is navigable for her in her declining state. An extra set of handrails on each staircase has been a tremendous benefit. She's had a few friends in the closest nursing home in our town and has expressed that if/when the time comes, that is the one she wants to go to.  It is also one of the better ones. For now, she's still at home. She weighs about 125lbs. I can lift her when needed.

Next take away:  Don't weigh too much. Get enough exercise to maintain physical strength, especially upper body strength. Reinforce handrails and put in grab bars where I will find them useful. Evaluate the places near me to choose which one I would accept when the time comes.

The third is not yet diagnosed with dementia, but it's there.  This isn't my first rodeo.  He's an even bigger challenge because he still retains just enough control over his own life to be dangerous to himself and others. Numerous car accidents, can't manage his own medication, can't prepare food for himself or arrange to feed himself. Won't bathe. Won't stay put for a home health aid or Meals-on-Wheels to bring food to him.  He wanders. Destroys technology, like cell phones or TV remotes and then goes banging on neighbor's doors at all hours demanding immediate help. He's been sexually inappropriate (like millions of other men in cognitive decline). He weighs 220. I can't lift him, even with help. Every time he's fallen or is stuck in a chair, I need to call 911.

The take away:  Don't spend all my money on Nascar collectibles and lottery tickets. Take care of my teeth. Bathe.

People make (and talk about) vague plans to ensure they don't face the same fate.  Or they have a concrete plan to commit suicide before becoming that far gone.  But there can be a really long road between the beginning of the decline and the end of life, where people live beyond the point they said they would make the drastic move and they are no longer capable.  Perhaps I'll be like my father, no cognitive decline but with failing eyesight, unable to drive for about 10 years before he died.  Can I hire a car-service or walk to everywhere I want to go when driving is no longer possible? Maybe I'll be like my aunt with several falls & breaks.  I wear the type of watch that will let my husband know if I've fallen.  He can track my location when I'm out on a training run.  We're remodeling now (in our 50's) making everything as accessible as possible in our single story home. I decided I need the curb-less shower before I need the curb-less shower. 

I'm heeding my doctor's advice on preventing dementia.  I've been told there is a connection between untreated hypertension in one's 50's and vascular dementia later on.  I've also been told they call Alzheimer's "Diabetes Type III" and believe there is a link to sugar intake.
I think there is a catch-22.  My mother & her sister were healthy living, vegetable eaters who got plenty of exercise and were never overweight. They lived into their 90's and had long stretches of dementia.   My father's family was full of smokers. Their declines were shorter, involved vision loss.  My in-laws were alcoholics. Death was sudden and swift, each of them before age 75. It's tempting to pick up a really bad habit so I don't outlive my money.

In the meantime, I need to refresh all my in-case-of-emergency instructions, advance directive stuff.  I do have a spouse, so there is a 'primary' person.  I also have quite a big extended family. 

I would encourage you to get out of your comfort zone and join a church.  People need people.  Even introverts.  A faith community is a group committed to each other, it is where those in need can meet those with something to offer.  And what organized religions all recognize is that people move between these states of needing and being needed throughout their lives, of being dependent and of being able to help. The Abrahamic religions all have this in common.  So do groups like the American Legion or recovery communities and very likely some dedicated agnostics or other groups I'm unqualified to speak about.

Long before you begin that decline into dependency, you will probably have needs.  Some of them might even be right now or within the next few days.  You may also have something to offer to someone near you who needs it, even if it's just toilet paper. Really, join a church or whatever.

As far as your legal affairs, there is quite a bit you can do with a trust. The trustee doesn't need to be a friend or family member.  But whether or not it is financially worthwhile can depend on the size of your estate.  Talk to the eldercare or family law person who prepares your Will, POA, Advanced Directive or Healthcare Proxy.  Your executor or emergency contact can still be that BFF who lives far away.
Gold. Thanks for posting.

OzzieandHarriet

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #29 on: September 20, 2021, 10:41:35 PM »
I worry about this quite a bit, too. I'm married, my husband is two years younger and I suspect will outlive me, but who knows? We have no kids, and our families, while not awful, are not people we'd want to fall back on in dire straits. I'll be turning 64 soon; I did one of those life expectancy calculators the other day and it told me I'd live to be 98! My immediate reaction was NO!!! Based on my family genetics, living that long is not likely, but again, who knows?

I'm both an introvert AND socially awkward, so I don't have many friends. Frankly, I wonder how I even managed to get married to someone nice. One or two in my circle might help me in an emergency as long as I'm local to them, but nothing more than that.

The co-housing thing interests me a lot.

At one point some years ago, after going through some end-of-life experiences with our parents, we went to a lawyer and had wills and related papers drawn up, but aside from it being out of date, this lawyer didn't do a very good job of it and it all needs to be redone.

elliha

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #30 on: September 21, 2021, 02:08:10 AM »
If you are in this situation my first priority now would be investing in my health.

Healthy people always think it's their fault they're healthy, but a lot of it is luck. My dad has been a health nut his whole life because his dad died very young, but now my dad's showing early signs of dementia, he has a pacemaker, and he's got an autoimmune disease that's seriously affecting his quality of life. He did everything right, but guess what: shit happens.

Likewise, having family doesn't always protect you from ending up alone in your old age - an acquaintance of mine with heart problems and mental health issues had her daughter and her husband predecease her, now she has no family and no income or savings and is in a really bad situation.

I'm almost guaranteed to end up alone and childless (on the ace spectrum and 100% don't want kids) so I have vague plans to go into some kind of assisted retirement community or shack up with friends. Or just jumping off a bridge as a backup plan if I'm in serious misery and things are really not fun any more... :-/  (The plans you make when you've had chronic pain since your early 20s!)

I come from a family with great genetic risk heart problems and I have several relatives that have as you described dropped dead. You have to process that possibility regardless of how you live if you are in that type of situation. I have, therefore I realize that I could not keep living like I had a hundred lives. I have now done what I can to try to keep type 2 diabetes and high blood pressure from becoming a further added problem to the genetic risk. I might still drop dead at 56 like my dad but I have done what I can do. I am not a health nut and taking health to the point where it is the only thing you think of is not what I am talking about. I mean keeping health as a consideration to make your life as healthy as possible for as long as possible. Most will have health problems of some kind if they live long enough but if that happens at 75 instead of 55 makes a shit load of difference. You mention dementia, do you know that this is believed to be partially linked to insulin resistance which is in turn linked to your eating habits? That means that changes in diet can prevent or delay the onset of this. It is a never a given and this is important to remember, that I agree with.

Dollar Slice

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #31 on: September 21, 2021, 02:22:43 AM »
You mention dementia, do you know that this is believed to be partially linked to insulin resistance which is in turn linked to your eating habits? That means that changes in diet can prevent or delay the onset of this. It is a never a given and this is important to remember, that I agree with.

Yes, I'm aware that dementia is linked to obesity/diabetes/etc. My dad, like I said, is a health nut - exercises daily, watches what he eats and is very slim (under 20 BMI). So, again, healthy people always think it's their fault that they're healthy, but often it's just a case of: shit happens. Or shit doesn't happen. You can do your best, but don't count on any outcome, good or bad. My grandma who smoked and barely touched a fruit or vegetable as long as I knew her lived until 88 and was healthy and sharp as a tack until the last year or two. My grandma on the other side (not my dad's side, so it's not genetic) who was a nurse, very slim, never smoked, etc. had a really terrible end of life experience with drawn out disability (walker/wheelchair, a number of broken bones including both hips and her pelvis in three separate falls) and dementia.

My point is that not that you shouldn't do your best to be healthy, but that it's a lot more of a crapshoot than people like to believe, and you should prepare for all eventualities.

I had a co-worker who was a heavy drinker and smoker and basically refused to save for retirement because he was convinced that he would be dead before then. Don't be that guy. Or his inverse, the person convinced they don't need to plan for elder care because they exercise and eat right.

Dicey

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #32 on: September 21, 2021, 05:54:53 AM »
@kite, thank you for every word of that advice. Solid gold indeed.

henramdrea

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #33 on: September 21, 2021, 06:58:22 AM »
@kite I appreciate your post and all you've learned!  I'm an occupational therapist, and have been working with older folks for about 30 years as my main clientele.  If I could get them to have the same insights you're coming to have, my job would be pretty easy!  I'm still amazed at the number of older people who simply believe they'll "be just fine" seemingly forever.  Many just hope they'll peacefully cease to exist one day without all the drama between old age, poor health and eventual death.  As you've found, you can't plan for absolutely everything, but you can plan for the bigger things:  accessible housing, access to healthcare, access to community, access to activity.  Notice the common word there?  Access.  That's what you can control and plan for.  Something else you've done which I applaud is to gain knowledge.  Information is out there and a lot of it is free thanks to the internet.  Setting up POA's, trusts, wills, and searching for the best communities to age in are very valuable activities at this point in our lives!

former player

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #34 on: September 21, 2021, 07:38:14 AM »
Does anyone have any ideas for protecting one's pet in the situation where one dies suddenly at home - or, I guess, dies slowly after having become completely incapacitated by something like a stroke.  If you live alone, how long would it take for someone to find you and would your pet survive for that period?

I live alone, and it might take up to a week for me to be found (no longer, I think, as I do have some regular social engagements at which I would be missed, even after 18 months of pandemic).  My worry in that situation would be for my dog - he is a bit too big to make a dog door for.

I have thought about setting up an app that notifies someone if not checked every so often but I suspect that the false positives would be too high for it to be practical.

Metalcat

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #35 on: September 21, 2021, 07:42:33 AM »
Does anyone have any ideas for protecting one's pet in the situation where one dies suddenly at home - or, I guess, dies slowly after having become completely incapacitated by something like a stroke.  If you live alone, how long would it take for someone to find you and would your pet survive for that period?

I live alone, and it might take up to a week for me to be found (no longer, I think, as I do have some regular social engagements at which I would be missed, even after 18 months of pandemic).  My worry in that situation would be for my dog - he is a bit too big to make a dog door for.

I have thought about setting up an app that notifies someone if not checked every so often but I suspect that the false positives would be too high for it to be practical.

There are absolutely services that check in regularly with solo seniors, or you could set up a check in with a friend or neighbour.
My mom checks in with the solo men she tends to twice a week.

Anon-E-Mouze

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #36 on: September 21, 2021, 07:58:29 AM »
Does anyone have any ideas for protecting one's pet in the situation where one dies suddenly at home - or, I guess, dies slowly after having become completely incapacitated by something like a stroke.  If you live alone, how long would it take for someone to find you and would your pet survive for that period?

I live alone, and it might take up to a week for me to be found (no longer, I think, as I do have some regular social engagements at which I would be missed, even after 18 months of pandemic).  My worry in that situation would be for my dog - he is a bit too big to make a dog door for.

I have thought about setting up an app that notifies someone if not checked every so often but I suspect that the false positives would be too high for it to be practical.

It is also a good idea to make a clear arrangement with someone you trust to be your pet's "godparent", when you die, and to provide a sum for your pet's care in your will.

OzzieandHarriet

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #37 on: September 21, 2021, 08:31:21 AM »
A few years ago a neighbor around the corner from us died suddenly, alone in her house. She was only 62, looked to be fit and active. The people across the street from her noticed that newspapers were piling up on the front porch and called the police. She had two adult sons but both lived elsewhere. It was sad, and who wants to die that way, but at the same time - no long, drawn-out lonely old age for her either.

The advice to join a church here reminded me that my parents got involved with a synagogue when they were in their 60s, even though they weren’t religious, partly because my father started wondering what kind of funeral he’d have. When the time came, those people were nowhere to be seen, not even the rabbi. So that may not be a solution for everyone.


Dee18

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #38 on: September 21, 2021, 08:41:23 AM »
My mother's cousin died a few years ago at the age of 97.  She had never married and was an introvert.  My sister and I, to our surprise, were among the heirs so I learned a lot about how she had arranged her affairs. She had an accountant and a trusts and estate lawyer (from a 2 person firm in her town) that she had known for years.  The accountant had been handling her bills since she turned 90.  All documents were up to date and these two professionals had become her friends over the years.  They clearly respected her and cared about her.  For her living situation she had a paid companion that she had found through her church because my cousin wanted to stay in her home until the end.  This woman cared for my cousin during the last 3 years of her life when she was wheelchair bound (sadly due to misdiagnosis of a treatable medical condition).  The woman was paid well ($60,000/year plus living in the home and all food) and made my cousin's last years a true joy--taking her sailing, on overnight trips, debating politics, etc.

 I met all of these people when I spent a few days in her town for her memorial service.They handled everything smoothly with good communication so I decided I want to follow at least some of her path, as I am also single and do not want to ask a friend to handle the work of settling my estate.   I am probably at least a couple of  decades away from the end, but this experience made me think of the future.  I already had a will and revocable trust, but I have since found a financial advisor and made sure my young adult daughter (my only child) has met with him a couple times already.  I am currently debating a move to another state (renting there to try it out) and plan to revise my legal documents after that move. I plan to find an attorney who will also serve as executor.  I enjoy handling my finances now but have promised my daughter I will hire an accountant as soon as there is a need.

 In contrast to her cousin, my mother resisted making any plans for her living situation ahead of time until the crisis of a broken hip in her 90s. (She needed to be in a different situation but refused to make the transition until then.)  She still insists on handling her finances, although she cannot do so eadequately which causes a lot of tension.  Her total resistance to dealing with the inevitable has made her visits with me and my sibling revolve around problems to solve instead of enjoying each others' company and doing fun activities.

I feel fortunate to have seen these contrasting approaches from two women who were both well off financially, both introverts, both well-educated. It made me realize that my daughter's life will be better for my spending money on hiring some professionals than leaving her a bit more inheritance. 

elliha

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #39 on: September 21, 2021, 08:55:56 AM »
You mention dementia, do you know that this is believed to be partially linked to insulin resistance which is in turn linked to your eating habits? That means that changes in diet can prevent or delay the onset of this. It is a never a given and this is important to remember, that I agree with.

Yes, I'm aware that dementia is linked to obesity/diabetes/etc. My dad, like I said, is a health nut - exercises daily, watches what he eats and is very slim (under 20 BMI). So, again, healthy people always think it's their fault that they're healthy, but often it's just a case of: shit happens. Or shit doesn't happen. You can do your best, but don't count on any outcome, good or bad. My grandma who smoked and barely touched a fruit or vegetable as long as I knew her lived until 88 and was healthy and sharp as a tack until the last year or two. My grandma on the other side (not my dad's side, so it's not genetic) who was a nurse, very slim, never smoked, etc. had a really terrible end of life experience with drawn out disability (walker/wheelchair, a number of broken bones including both hips and her pelvis in three separate falls) and dementia.

My point is that not that you shouldn't do your best to be healthy, but that it's a lot more of a crapshoot than people like to believe, and you should prepare for all eventualities.

I had a co-worker who was a heavy drinker and smoker and basically refused to save for retirement because he was convinced that he would be dead before then. Don't be that guy. Or his inverse, the person convinced they don't need to plan for elder care because they exercise and eat right.

Thin people can be insulin resistant, it is not just for fat people.

I get your point, health is not a given whatever you do but if you know you risk being on your own at the end of life doing what you can now is going to be more important. I am not saying that the financial side is not important, I just didn't comment on that since so many other people have given good advice there.

Dollar Slice

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #40 on: September 21, 2021, 09:14:35 AM »
Thin people can be insulin resistant, it is not just for fat people.

So it's your opinion that my dad has insulin resistance in spite of a lifetime of eating right, exercising daily, being slim, and having no symptoms of insulin resistance? Fascinating.

Like I said: plan for all eventualities. Even if you're irrationally convinced that doing everything right will mean you can't get sick, you might get hit by a car while you're out exercising and end up a paraplegic. Shit happens, and it often happens to people who did nothing to deserve it.

Anon-E-Mouze

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #41 on: September 21, 2021, 11:06:31 AM »
My mother's cousin died a few years ago at the age of 97.  She had never married and was an introvert.  My sister and I, to our surprise, were among the heirs so I learned a lot about how she had arranged her affairs. She had an accountant and a trusts and estate lawyer (from a 2 person firm in her town) that she had known for years.  The accountant had been handling her bills since she turned 90.  All documents were up to date and these two professionals had become her friends over the years.  They clearly respected her and cared about her.  For her living situation she had a paid companion that she had found through her church because my cousin wanted to stay in her home until the end.  This woman cared for my cousin during the last 3 years of her life when she was wheelchair bound (sadly due to misdiagnosis of a treatable medical condition).  The woman was paid well ($60,000/year plus living in the home and all food) and made my cousin's last years a true joy--taking her sailing, on overnight trips, debating politics, etc.

 I met all of these people when I spent a few days in her town for her memorial service.They handled everything smoothly with good communication so I decided I want to follow at least some of her path, as I am also single and do not want to ask a friend to handle the work of settling my estate.   I am probably at least a couple of  decades away from the end, but this experience made me think of the future.  I already had a will and revocable trust, but I have since found a financial advisor and made sure my young adult daughter (my only child) has met with him a couple times already.  I am currently debating a move to another state (renting there to try it out) and plan to revise my legal documents after that move. I plan to find an attorney who will also serve as executor.  I enjoy handling my finances now but have promised my daughter I will hire an accountant as soon as there is a need.

It is also a good idea for everyone (not just older people) to provide a written document to each financial institution that holds assets for the person (e.g. bank accounts and investment accounts) and: 1) naming a "Trusted Contact Person" (TCP) whom the institution can contact if they have concerns about potential financial exploitation of the account holder; and 2) authorizing the financial institution to temporarily decline to execute instructions if the financial institution has reasonable grounds to believe that financial exploitation has occurred, is occurring or is imminent. The TCP concept is only about communication - the TCP doesn't have any power to act on your behalf (unless you provide that power to them in another document like a POA).

The TCP is someone whom you trust to receive sensitive information in such a communication from the financial institution and understand the steps that should be taken if an issue arises. They also should be someone who is very unlikely to motivated to act against your interests. For example, it wouldn't be a good idea for the TCP to be a major beneficiary in your will, your paid companion, your significant other, or the financial adviser who is receiving commissions from transactions in your account - because those people all have financial incentives to act against your interests.

kite

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #42 on: September 21, 2021, 11:30:24 AM »
@kite I appreciate your post and all you've learned!  I'm an occupational therapist, and have been working with older folks for about 30 years as my main clientele.  If I could get them to have the same insights you're coming to have, my job would be pretty easy!  I'm still amazed at the number of older people who simply believe they'll "be just fine" seemingly forever.  Many just hope they'll peacefully cease to exist one day without all the drama between old age, poor health and eventual death.  As you've found, you can't plan for absolutely everything, but you can plan for the bigger things:  accessible housing, access to healthcare, access to community, access to activity.  Notice the common word there?  Access.  That's what you can control and plan for.  Something else you've done which I applaud is to gain knowledge.  Information is out there and a lot of it is free thanks to the internet.  Setting up POA's, trusts, wills, and searching for the best communities to age in are very valuable activities at this point in our lives!

Thanks!
I grew up seeing my best friend's mother care for her mother who'd had a stroke. Nana was left paralyzed on one side and lived for at least 15 years with them.
The lesson for me was that disability was a normal, inevitable part of life that will have consequences for finances, housing, relationships, careers & travel.  I'm often stunned that others are frequently oblivious or in denial about what has a very high probability of occurring. 

FIRE calculations predicated on no disability can be completely blown to smithereens when someone in the family becomes incapacitated.  I think it is the most frequently overlooked group of expenses among this cohort. 

BicycleB

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #43 on: September 21, 2021, 12:27:54 PM »
Excellent thread!

I think it's important, especially after age 40, to complete specific plans.

Prepare for contingencies:
1. Legal - immediately, complete the legal documents that arrange your affairs and manage/ dispose of your assets if you are incapacitated. In my US state, that means:
a. power of attorney ("durable power of attorney" - determines who will run your finances when you're in a coma)
b. medical power of attorney (determines who makes medical decisions when you're in a coma)
c. living will (authorizes medical personnel to NOT do painful things to keep you alive for 5 extra minutes, such as break ribs or intubate you)
d. will (who gets your stuff)
2. Immediately, make sure you have named beneficiaries for your financial accounts, and that they are up to date. In my state, these pass to the new person within days, and do not go through the will. The will only disposes OTHER assets, so get your beneficiaries up to date.
3. Relationships - Arguably, this is covered in 1a and 1b. But the human aspect is important. A thoughtful caring competent person who knows you is quite different from a hired stranger, a thoughtless friend, or an incompetent family member.

I'm single/childless/50something, but blessed with a thoughtful caring competent sister. She is the named person in all the documents above. That said, backup plans and things to make it easier are helpful. So you could do things like:

4. Clean house, pay bills, etc to ensure the decks are clear.
5. Build relationships with friends if possible to back up any family.
6. Specify who does what if trusted friends/family have limited skill sets.
7. Communicate - if one person handles money and one medical, make sure they know their role, are willing to do it, and have each other's contact info.
8. If you have specific desires/scenarios to prepare for, articulate them. Make a list of favorite dishes so caregivers know, for example.
9. To maximize prep, possibly research caregiving facilities; share your findings with your medical and financial power of attorney people.

I think specifics matter. In my family, my mom has specified that if she ever needs to be in an assisted living facility, she wants it to be near my sister and I, not her current location. This clarifies for us what to do if the event occurs.

Life in Balance

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #44 on: September 21, 2021, 04:44:55 PM »
I've started working on my plans, but have found it hard to decide who will be my personal representative/executor/POA, etc.  It makes sense to choose someone from a generation younger than me, but at the same time those folks seem really young to be making those kinds of decisions if something were to happen to me soon.  In the meantime, I'm filling out my Big Book of Everything (free downloadable PDF that organizes your information for whoever has to step in).

SmartyCat

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #45 on: September 21, 2021, 10:10:57 PM »
@kite, I love everything you posted (though not the part about being on deck for two people with dementia- sorry, that's brutal) Thank you.

I'm several years into taking on progressively more of my Mom's care, though she doesn't live with me. The bitterest pills to swallow haven't been the things that were genuinely out of her control- it's the things she could have done,  for years and years, and just didn't. The airy wave toward the hoarded "junk room" that was the tip of the iceberg - oh, you kids can take care of that when I'm gone. Refusing canes, hearing aids, walkers, wheelchairs, household help, until forced by utter physical inability to continue without them, while friends, family, and friendly bystanders rushed to her aid.

If DS turns out to be unavailable in the future, we have our attorney set up as alternate to handle our affairs if needed. In the meantime, we're trying to stay on top of what's in our power now.

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Linea_Norway

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #46 on: September 22, 2021, 12:35:40 AM »
DH and I are childless and our brothers who have children are living in another country. So I am thinking about this.

Some time ago I read about a facebook group of elderly people who would check on eachother by checking in online. This could be an easy option. But you would have to be registred with your address.

We are still looking for a house in a new location. My dream house would be laying remote and quiet. But I think it would be wise to live somewhere close to neighbours. And we should be actively looking around for community. It is on my list to have a grocery store on walking distance, although I currently want that for environmental reasons. I do expect us to have to move another time if we get older. We are now 50 and 48. I expect this next house to be suitable for the next 15-20 years, totally depending on our health.

If I end up alone, I think renting out a room in my house to a younger person might be a good idea.

slappy

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #47 on: September 22, 2021, 09:26:42 AM »
I've started working on my plans, but have found it hard to decide who will be my personal representative/executor/POA, etc.  It makes sense to choose someone from a generation younger than me, but at the same time those folks seem really young to be making those kinds of decisions if something were to happen to me soon.  In the meantime, I'm filling out my Big Book of Everything (free downloadable PDF that organizes your information for whoever has to step in).

You can it at any time. I would name someone you feel comfortable with now and then revisit in a few years. This is what we have done with the guardian for our children that is named in the will.

stoaX

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #48 on: September 24, 2021, 05:18:04 AM »
I've started working on my plans, but have found it hard to decide who will be my personal representative/executor/POA, etc.  It makes sense to choose someone from a generation younger than me, but at the same time those folks seem really young to be making those kinds of decisions if something were to happen to me soon.  In the meantime, I'm filling out my Big Book of Everything (free downloadable PDF that organizes your information for whoever has to step in).

You can it at any time. I would name someone you feel comfortable with now and then revisit in a few years. This is what we have done with the guardian for our children that is named in the will.

Good point.  When making decisions like these I have the erroneous tendency to treat them like they are irrevocable, but they are not. The decision that's right for today may need to be changed 10 years from now... and that's ok.

Focus_on_the_fire

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Re: Planning for Aging without Family
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2021, 07:56:10 PM »
My mother's cousin died a few years ago at the age of 97.  She had never married and was an introvert.  My sister and I, to our surprise, were among the heirs so I learned a lot about how she had arranged her affairs. She had an accountant and a trusts and estate lawyer (from a 2 person firm in her town) that she had known for years.  The accountant had been handling her bills since she turned 90.  All documents were up to date and these two professionals had become her friends over the years.  They clearly respected her and cared about her.  For her living situation she had a paid companion that she had found through her church because my cousin wanted to stay in her home until the end.  This woman cared for my cousin during the last 3 years of her life when she was wheelchair bound (sadly due to misdiagnosis of a treatable medical condition).  The woman was paid well ($60,000/year plus living in the home and all food) and made my cousin's last years a true joy--taking her sailing, on overnight trips, debating politics, etc.

 I met all of these people when I spent a few days in her town for her memorial service.They handled everything smoothly with good communication so I decided I want to follow at least some of her path, as I am also single and do not want to ask a friend to handle the work of settling my estate.   I am probably at least a couple of  decades away from the end, but this experience made me think of the future.  I already had a will and revocable trust, but I have since found a financial advisor and made sure my young adult daughter (my only child) has met with him a couple times already.  I am currently debating a move to another state (renting there to try it out) and plan to revise my legal documents after that move. I plan to find an attorney who will also serve as executor.  I enjoy handling my finances now but have promised my daughter I will hire an accountant as soon as there is a need.

 In contrast to her cousin, my mother resisted making any plans for her living situation ahead of time until the crisis of a broken hip in her 90s. (She needed to be in a different situation but refused to make the transition until then.)  She still insists on handling her finances, although she cannot do so eadequately which causes a lot of tension.  Her total resistance to dealing with the inevitable has made her visits with me and my sibling revolve around problems to solve instead of enjoying each others' company and doing fun activities.

I feel fortunate to have seen these contrasting approaches from two women who were both well off financially, both introverts, both well-educated. It made me realize that my daughter's life will be better for my spending money on hiring some professionals than leaving her a bit more inheritance.

Thank you so much for sharing this. The difference between the two of them is really eye-opening. I agree with you that your mother's cousin's approach is easier for everyone in the long run.

 

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