No Ragrets

[tn3sport]

The subject line is a joke lifted from the movie, We Are The Millers.  -- had a kid that got a big tattoo across his chest that read "NO RAGRETS". misspelled of course.  It was the funniest line in the movie.

At any rate, I'm a bit stuck in a dilemma that I imagine is common for most peeps targeting a FIRE retirement.

I'm a good 6 to 8 years off from FIRE and trying to decide when to pull the trigger. I could do it at 6 years and live comfortably or do it at 8 years have have luxury. Not Kardashian luxury, but just be able to purchase some of the finer things, as new, versus used. I like a new motorcycle every 4 or so years. I like a new Waverunner every 4 or 5 years. I want a new car every 6 years. These are expensive assets. Retiring at 6 years means buying used. Retiring at 8 years gives me enough cushion to be able to buy them as new.  So, it might sound like the answer is simple, just work the extra 2 years.  Understand that watersports and motorcycles are my hobby.

The dilemma:
In recent months, I've lost some friends. One was 53, died if heart attack, but had retired early and was enjoying life up to that point. He worked part-time as a youth umpire, fished from a small boat or the shore, and lived a minimal existence.  He seemed content.

The other friend was 63, he was still working and was a millionaire several times over. He owned beach houses and luxury homes. Yet, he continued to work even though he had more than enough money. He too had a heart attack and is now dead. He never had a retirement to enjoy what he had. His beach house sits empty as its too big for his widow to manage.

I also lost another friend that was only a month into his retirement. He quit work at 62 and moved to Florida, diagnosed with an aggressive cancer and is now dead. All in a month...

I think both these guys worked too long and should of retired sooner.  I know hindsight is 20/20.

I want to know if any post-FIRE peeps have any regrets about leaving the work-force too early. Or, better yet, any advise on how to determine the right time to pull the trigger.

[zephyr911]

I'm a good 6 to 8 years off from FIRE and trying to decide when to pull the trigger. I could do it at 6 years and live comfortably or do it at 8 years have have luxury. Not Kardashian luxury, but just be able to purchase some of the finer things, as new, versus used. I like a new motorcycle every 4 or so years. I like a new Waverunner every 4 or 5 years. I want a new car every 6 years. These are expensive assets. Retiring at 6 years means buying used. Retiring at 8 years gives me enough cushion to be able to buy them as new.  So, it might sound like the answer is simple, just work the extra 2 years.  Understand that watersports and motorcycles are my hobby.

You're debating a range of options that doesn't even overlap with that of the average forum member.

Almost nobody here would work an extra 2 years for a tiny increase in average newness of all your expensive toys. Most would shave years off the clock just by dialing down your requirements, or even picking one hobby and dropping the other. We're the people who buy all those toys you talk about after you've taken the 50-75% depreciation hit and bought another one. The ones who fix up the bike when you discard it, not the ones paying showroom prices and sending thousands up in smoke just riding it home.

If FIRE was a huge priority for you, you could start out BROKE today and reach it in the timeframe you're talking about. Assuming you're not broke, you could get there a lot faster with only minor adjustments. The choices are all yours, as long as you're fully cognizant of the results.

[partgypsy]

Wow, you know a lot of people who die young.

[Eric]

[Hall11235]

For me, MMM is about spending on your passions and optimizing everything else for FIRE. If driving a new car gets your propeller hat a-whizzing, then maybe those extra two years are worth it. What if you bought a used "luxury" vehicle? What is the reason it needs to be new? Usually answering these questions can get at the heart of why you really want something.

Your post starts with these two men who died early...
The man who retired early "seemed content," while the second worked himself to death (my assumption that his job was stressful). Which one resonates with you more? Would you rather work those two extra years for a new car or spend those two extra years being with family and friends (maybe a leading question, but that's how I look at it).

[Eric]

I realize that you'd like to plan ahead for this.  It's easy for me to say that I'd absolutely retire at the shorter end, but I don't value the same stuff that you do.  But considering you're 6-8 years away, I bet by the time you're close, you'll automatically know what to do.  And of course, it doesn't have to be all or nothing.  You could do new on some things, used on others.  Or stop full time work and do some part time work that also allows you to advance some of these hobbies.  I'd stay the course and realize that this will be clearer when you're there.

[Amasa]

I agree with zephyr's sentiment above -- most people here would probably not work 2 extra years to buy slightly newer things.

It seems like your dilemma is tied to the fact that you've lost people recently, some of whom may not have taken full advantage of the retirement they worked hard for.
The trouble I see with making that a dilemma is that you have no idea when you're going to die. Sure, you can extend the length of time you're statistically likely to live, but no one has any idea how long they will actually live.

One thing that I've been trying to do with my own life (which is hopefully somewhat useful to you) is to maximize the amount of time I spend doing what I want to do NOW, even far, far away from FI. If I'm saving 50% of my income, that means that I have the freedom to work half as much as I am working now* and spend more time with my family or doing what I love, even if only temporarily. For instance, if my family were going through a rough time, I could even stop working entirely for a few months just to be with them. In my situation, since my wife and I are both working and we have flexible spending habits, I have the freedom to stop working entirely whenever I want to.**

The idea of living like you are retired already has been described in other places as well, although I can't find a definitive source that I probably I picked up the idea from. I think MMM wrote about living like you are already retired? Maybe it was somebody else?

Hopefully, even if you do decide (and it would be a decision) to work full time for 6 years, you still find yourself living a fulfilling life during that time, and not simply waiting 6 years to live a fulfilling life afterward.

*for the same pay
**no FI if I took this option forever, but it is an option

[zephyr911]

One thing that I've been trying to do with my own life (which is hopefully somewhat useful to you) is to maximize the amount of time I spend doing what I want to do NOW, even far, far away from FI.

That right there - NOT extreme frugality - is the core essence of Mustachianism.

He's gone to great pains to emphasize this in a few different articles, since the misconception is so easy to come to.

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/02/22/getting-rich-from-zero-to-hero-in-one-blog-post/
"The bottom line is this: by focusing on happiness itself, you can lead a much better life than those who focus on convenience, luxury, and following the lead of the financially illiterate herd that is the TV-ad-absorbing Middle Class of the United States today (and most of the other rich countries). Happiness comes from many sources, but none of these sources involve car or purse upgrades. No matter what the herd or the TV set tells you, this is the truth."

See also:
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2014/11/23/not-extreme-frugality/
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/10/02/what-is-stoicism-and-how-can-it-turn-your-life-to-solid-gold/

[Amasa]

One thing that I've been trying to do with my own life (which is hopefully somewhat useful to you) is to maximize the amount of time I spend doing what I want to do NOW, even far, far away from FI.

That right there - NOT extreme frugality - is the core essence of Mustachianism.

Thank you! I'm glad to know that someone else thinks I'm on the right track.

Also, thank you for the article links! Those are some really good ones. I think the more specific idea that I was trying to think of before (but couldn't pin down) was the idea that you can evaluate jobs or purchases based on whether you would do the work or buy the thing for free. If you wouldn't do it for free, don't do it (especially for purchases, but also seemed applicable to jobs). Can't remember where that idea is from, but I've been trying to work it more and more into my daily patterns of thought.

[EAL]

I say keep working. My grandfather was a successful real estate broker with his own business. He always said, "When you retire you die." For him, he enjoyed his job and retirement was in luxury as he was very successful. You need something to keep you going. He retired in his early sixties and died a few months after. He had a stroke in his big nice house. Doctor's said he would have lived if they found him sooner. Had he been working, he probably wouldn't have been alone when he had a stroke. He certainly wouldn't have gone that long without being found. Keep working!

[Eric]

I say keep working. My grandfather was a successful real estate broker with his own business. He always said, "When you retire you die." For him, he enjoyed his job and retirement was in luxury as he was very successful. You need something to keep you going. He retired in his early sixties and died a few months after. He had a stroke in his big nice house. Doctor's said he would have lived if they found him sooner. Had he been working, he probably wouldn't have been alone when he had a stroke. He certainly wouldn't have gone that long without being found. Keep working!

You do realize that this is forum based around early retirement, right?  Was that not clear when you signed up?  This anecdote, while a sad story, is terrible advice.  If you're going to die soon, the last thing you should be doing is wasting your time at work.

[Cassie]

I also knew various people that died right after or before retiring.  One reason we retired at 53 & 58. However, 6 months in to it we missed working so now work p.t. for ourselves in our fields.  I did not think I would want to work again but 3 years later we still enjoy it.  When you get 6 years down the road you will know what to do. If you don't you could always go to p.t.

[Kansas Beachbum]

NO RAGRETS

Not one?  Not even a letter?  :-)

Agree with most here who feel life's too short to spend that extra couple years working just so you can have a new boat every few years.  To each his own, though. 

[rocketpj]

I look at my uncle, the richest person I know personally, and he is massively overweight and working 70 hour weeks at age 63.  We know where this story is going, and it's a damn tragedy.  Multiple properties in multiple jurisdictions, and rarely uses them.

Then I look at my folks, who both pulled the trigger at 55 and have been out for over a decade.  Happy, more money than they can really use.  No debt, great pensions, boatloads of savings.  Happy as clams, they see my kids multiple times a week, golf/fish/garden/hike/volunteer constantly.

What they don't do is buy new vehicles or squander their cash.  My uncle does, and my dad (his older brother) is likely to outlive him by decades.

Life is choices and none of us know how much time we have.  Make your choices as if you might not see next Xmas.

[The_path_less_taken]

The only guarantee you have is this very instant: you are alive now. You should do something you love every single day of your life: without exception.

But it doesn't necessarily have to be in a 4 year old car or motorcycle. Just saying.

As for retirement versus delaying it for two years...if that lifestyle truly makes you that happy, then the two years is worth it. But nothing is set in stone. You could possibly ramp down work, or work part time, or consult or whatever....ask for what you want. Chase what you want.

But at your core, you have to really KNOW what you want, and what truly makes you happy. And I'm  guessing the waverunner and the car ain't it.

What is?

[Outlier]

Not even one? https://www.tumblr.com/search/no%20ragrets%20gif