Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)

[RWD]

My company overcontributed to my HSA. Again. The contribution form even has a "100%" checkbox that I used and they still messed it up... I guess I need to plan on slightly less than max since they can't seem to figure this out (even though the 401k contributions cut off at max just fine).

My company does not calculate HSA contributions or do a max cut off.  We have to be aware of our pass-through plan contribution amount, subtract that, and pick a contribution amount that doesn't go over the max.

Totally lame

Name and shame!  What company is contracted to do the payroll?  It must be a small outfit if they don't get HSA cut-offs right.

My company uses UltiPro. Wikipedia says they have 5,000+ employees, so not a small outfit at all.

More follow-up on my HSA saga... HSA Bank has a new interface but still has links which use the old interface. Sometimes the same information is available on both sides. The new interface says I over-contributed by ~$20. The old interface says I over-contributed by 14 cents... The 14 cents number matches my own accounting and is probably fine for tax-filing purposes but still annoying.

But then... I just checked my W-2 form and it says I over-contributed by more than $300! Good grief, I don't even know how they could be that far off. I sent an e-mail to our accounting department, hopefully they can just issue me a corrected W-2.

Wow, this wasn't even just me. HR sent out an e-mail to everyone at the company that contributed to an HSA last year. The e-mail is worded carefully to make it sound like it was UltiPro's fault, but if you read closely it sounds like HR and/or accounting just didn't notice some changes and used the software incorrectly. So now they have to send corrected W-2s to everyone...

Update: Going on two months and still no fix... Supposedly they will get the W-2C forms out next week... I've never waited this long to file taxes ever.

[Sibley]

My company overcontributed to my HSA. Again. The contribution form even has a "100%" checkbox that I used and they still messed it up... I guess I need to plan on slightly less than max since they can't seem to figure this out (even though the 401k contributions cut off at max just fine).

My company does not calculate HSA contributions or do a max cut off.  We have to be aware of our pass-through plan contribution amount, subtract that, and pick a contribution amount that doesn't go over the max.

Totally lame

Name and shame!  What company is contracted to do the payroll?  It must be a small outfit if they don't get HSA cut-offs right.

My company uses UltiPro. Wikipedia says they have 5,000+ employees, so not a small outfit at all.

More follow-up on my HSA saga... HSA Bank has a new interface but still has links which use the old interface. Sometimes the same information is available on both sides. The new interface says I over-contributed by ~$20. The old interface says I over-contributed by 14 cents... The 14 cents number matches my own accounting and is probably fine for tax-filing purposes but still annoying.

But then... I just checked my W-2 form and it says I over-contributed by more than $300! Good grief, I don't even know how they could be that far off. I sent an e-mail to our accounting department, hopefully they can just issue me a corrected W-2.

Wow, this wasn't even just me. HR sent out an e-mail to everyone at the company that contributed to an HSA last year. The e-mail is worded carefully to make it sound like it was UltiPro's fault, but if you read closely it sounds like HR and/or accounting just didn't notice some changes and used the software incorrectly. So now they have to send corrected W-2s to everyone...

Update: Going on two months and still no fix... Supposedly they will get the W-2C forms out next week... I've never waited this long to file taxes ever.

Messing up payroll is pretty serious, and W-2 forms are included in the payroll umbrella. If they can't get payroll done properly, that dings them pretty hard in my eyes. Not because payroll is easy, it's not. It's because there's so many ways to outsource payroll so it is done properly that it becomes easy.

In other words - you should take a hard look at the company overall.

[RWD]

Update: Going on two months and still no fix... Supposedly they will get the W-2C forms out next week... I've never waited this long to file taxes ever.

Messing up payroll is pretty serious, and W-2 forms are included in the payroll umbrella. If they can't get payroll done properly, that dings them pretty hard in my eyes. Not because payroll is easy, it's not. It's because there's so many ways to outsource payroll so it is done properly that it becomes easy.

In other words - you should take a hard look at the company overall.

We're a subsidiary of a multi-billion dollar international company (bought us out a few years ago). I'm not particularly worried about not getting paid. Long term though I don't think our company has great prospects. Parent company is really stingy and it has resulted in so much turnover that progress on major projects has ground to a crawl.

But my job is pretty cushy (though severely underpaid) and I probably don't need to work much more than another year. So I'm not that motivated to look elsewhere at this time.

[jinga nation]

In many prior years, I always had to fill out a W-4 to withhold more than the "Regular" amount, due to having additional income from investments, rentals, roth conversions, whatever.

However, this year, I tried something different.  I applied for a credit card, with a $200 reward sign-up bonus, 2% cash back on all purchases, and a 0% promo APR until July 2024.  I used that credit card to make a very large 2023-Q1 estimated tax payment to the IRS (which included a 1.85% fee).  It was enough "spent" to harvest the $200 initial bonus, plus a lot of additional 2% reward.  I really cranked down the withholding on my W-4, and I plan on just using my "larger paychecks" throughout the year to buy short term T-Bills until it's time to pay off the CC before the promotion expires.  Thanks Wells Fargo! You can get your $180/month minimum payments in the meantime :D

Quarterly payments gang!  People who are going to FIRE will need to get used to it anyway.

Dearest CPA aka wife said the same thing. LOL!

[markbike528CBX]

In many prior years, I always had to fill out a W-4 to withhold more than the "Regular" amount, due to having additional income from investments, rentals, roth conversions, whatever.

However, this year, I tried something different.  I applied for a credit card, with a $200 reward sign-up bonus, 2% cash back on all purchases, and a 0% promo APR until July 2024.  I used that credit card to make a very large 2023-Q1 estimated tax payment to the IRS (which included a 1.85% fee).  It was enough "spent" to harvest the $200 initial bonus, plus a lot of additional 2% reward.  I really cranked down the withholding on my W-4, and I plan on just using my "larger paychecks" throughout the year to buy short term T-Bills until it's time to pay off the CC before the promotion expires.  Thanks Wells Fargo! You can get your $180/month minimum payments in the meantime :D

Quarterly payments gang!  People who are going to FIRE will need to get used to it anyway.

Dearest CPA aka wife said the same thing. LOL!

Quarterly tax payments only apply if you expect to owe more than $1000 in taxes.
If you only have long term capital gains and qualified dividends, then as long as they are under $88,000 (married filing jointly), then your tax will be zero.
https://www.gocurrycracker.com/never-pay-taxes-again/ 
https://engaging-data.com/tax-brackets/?fs=1&reg=27000&cg=88000&yr=2023  <———Edit to add

That said, in the future, I’ll be drawing down the tIRA and 401k, so will then have enough ordinary income to go above 1000 and I’ll have to join the ranks of the quarterly payers (MPP).

[ixtap]

I can't keep up. Financial Samurai just posted about going back to work to pay for the kids' college, but I thought he went back to work a couple of years ago? My MPP? I clicked.

[SwordGuy]

I can't keep up. Financial Samurai just posted about going back to work to pay for the kids' college, but I thought he went back to work a couple of years ago? My MPP? I clicked.

Should we ask the moderators to cross-post this to the Hall of Shame?  :)

[Loren Ver]

In many prior years, I always had to fill out a W-4 to withhold more than the "Regular" amount, due to having additional income from investments, rentals, roth conversions, whatever.

However, this year, I tried something different.  I applied for a credit card, with a $200 reward sign-up bonus, 2% cash back on all purchases, and a 0% promo APR until July 2024.  I used that credit card to make a very large 2023-Q1 estimated tax payment to the IRS (which included a 1.85% fee).  It was enough "spent" to harvest the $200 initial bonus, plus a lot of additional 2% reward.  I really cranked down the withholding on my W-4, and I plan on just using my "larger paychecks" throughout the year to buy short term T-Bills until it's time to pay off the CC before the promotion expires.  Thanks Wells Fargo! You can get your $180/month minimum payments in the meantime :D

Quarterly payments gang!  People who are going to FIRE will need to get used to it anyway.

Dearest CPA aka wife said the same thing. LOL!

Quarterly tax payments only apply if you expect to owe more than $1000 in taxes.
If you only have long term capital gains and qualified dividends, then as long as they are under $88,000 (married filing jointly), then your tax will be zero.
https://www.gocurrycracker.com/never-pay-taxes-again/ 
https://engaging-data.com/tax-brackets/?fs=1&reg=27000&cg=88000&yr=2023  <———Edit to add

Unless your state requires taxes and gets fussy (charges) if you don't pay them before the end of the year.  My MMP, I have yet to get them right for more than 1 year in a row.  My income is too unpredictable.  I am getting money back this year for over payment (by three of the 4 payment), the year before that underpayment.  Before that, pretty good.  I just don't like being charged a fee for being wrong (under), I'd rather over pay, the money is in a checking account so it isn't like I am losing any growth on it.  I'd just rather not over pay by much.

Loren

[talltexan]

I can't keep up. Financial Samurai just posted about going back to work to pay for the kids' college, but I thought he went back to work a couple of years ago? My MPP? I clicked.

Should we ask the moderators to cross-post this to the Hall of Shame?  :)

Sam is click-baity, and many of his posts have problems, but his post about day-trading and how stressful it was was a godsend, it made it so apparent that even when you are making money, it's awful to live through.

[Alfred J Quack]

I don't think that there's much point to a bell on a bike.  At least not for the vast majority of people.  Most people are already equipped with a loud noise making device that can be activated instantly without the danger of removing your hands from the brakes.

Wut? Why would I remove my hands from the brakes? I just use my left thumb to ring the bell. 4 fingers on the left hand and all of the right hand are still available for braking if needed.

I'm guessing that you're riding a flat bar bike for short trips off the road most of the time, right?

Because honest curiosity here:


Where should a bell be located so that I can keep my hands over the brakes and ring it with my thumb?

I know this one, you should mount it on your helmet so you'll ring it everytime you shake your head at ignorant pedestrians! /sarcasm

[RWD]

My company overcontributed to my HSA. Again. The contribution form even has a "100%" checkbox that I used and they still messed it up... I guess I need to plan on slightly less than max since they can't seem to figure this out (even though the 401k contributions cut off at max just fine).

My company does not calculate HSA contributions or do a max cut off.  We have to be aware of our pass-through plan contribution amount, subtract that, and pick a contribution amount that doesn't go over the max.

Totally lame

Name and shame!  What company is contracted to do the payroll?  It must be a small outfit if they don't get HSA cut-offs right.

My company uses UltiPro. Wikipedia says they have 5,000+ employees, so not a small outfit at all.

More follow-up on my HSA saga... HSA Bank has a new interface but still has links which use the old interface. Sometimes the same information is available on both sides. The new interface says I over-contributed by ~$20. The old interface says I over-contributed by 14 cents... The 14 cents number matches my own accounting and is probably fine for tax-filing purposes but still annoying.

But then... I just checked my W-2 form and it says I over-contributed by more than $300! Good grief, I don't even know how they could be that far off. I sent an e-mail to our accounting department, hopefully they can just issue me a corrected W-2.

Wow, this wasn't even just me. HR sent out an e-mail to everyone at the company that contributed to an HSA last year. The e-mail is worded carefully to make it sound like it was UltiPro's fault, but if you read closely it sounds like HR and/or accounting just didn't notice some changes and used the software incorrectly. So now they have to send corrected W-2s to everyone...

Update: Going on two months and still no fix... Supposedly they will get the W-2C forms out next week... I've never waited this long to file taxes ever.

"Next week" turned into next next week, but it is finally fixed (according to e-mail, haven't verified for myself yet)! Only took 68 days from when I reported the problem (recall this affected all HSA-contributing employees)... And barely have a week left to file my taxes now. Fortunately I have them all filled out and ready to go, just need to double-check the W-2c numbers.

[ixtap]

When we went on an international trip last year, I begged DH to confirm his debit PIN. He did not and was not able to withdrawal any money. Luckily, I had no issues with my card, but I asked him to sort it before our next international trip. Since we are leaving tomorrow, he decided to try it today. And he finally noticed that his card expired over a year ago. And that is how we found out that our bank does not automatically send a new debit card upon expiration if you never actually use your debit card.

[Dicey]

When we went on an international trip last year, I begged DH to confirm his debit PIN. He did not and was not able to withdrawal any money. Luckily, I had no issues with my card, but I asked him to sort it before our next international trip. Since we are leaving tomorrow, he decided to try it today. And he finally noticed that his card expired over a year ago. And that is how we found out that our bank does not automatically send a new debit card upon expiration if you never actually use your debit card.

Justifiable homicide.

[TomTX]

"Next week" turned into next next week, but it is finally fixed (according to e-mail, haven't verified for myself yet)! Only took 68 days from when I reported the problem (recall this affected all HSA-contributing employees)... And barely have a week left to file my taxes now. Fortunately I have them all filled out and ready to go, just need to double-check the W-2c numbers.

Sounds more like it was a problem that required a Mustachian to get your employer's mess sorted out. Sounds like it was a problem for anyone who had made HSA contributions - they just didn't know it.

I guess your new MPP is that your old one turned out to not actually be a MPP...

[RWD]

"Next week" turned into next next week, but it is finally fixed (according to e-mail, haven't verified for myself yet)! Only took 68 days from when I reported the problem (recall this affected all HSA-contributing employees)... And barely have a week left to file my taxes now. Fortunately I have them all filled out and ready to go, just need to double-check the W-2c numbers.

Sounds more like it was a problem that required a Mustachian to get your employer's mess sorted out. Sounds like it was a problem for anyone who had made HSA contributions - they just didn't know it.

I guess your new MPP is that your old one turned out to not actually be a MPP...

Well my original post on the HSA saga was from having accidentally over-contributed. Because I am Mustachian I was maxing my HSA but they didn't cut me off at the limit. Originally I thought this was $20 over because of the way it was being reported online but on further verification it was only like 14 cents. So basically not a problem either (rounds down on taxes), but pretty annoying nonetheless to get warnings about over-contribution.

The incorrect W-2 was just further manifestation of employer accounting incompetence.

[ixtap]

When we went on an international trip last year, I begged DH to confirm his debit PIN. He did not and was not able to withdrawal any money. Luckily, I had no issues with my card, but I asked him to sort it before our next international trip. Since we are leaving tomorrow, he decided to try it today. And he finally noticed that his card expired over a year ago. And that is how we found out that our bank does not automatically send a new debit card upon expiration if you never actually use your debit card.

Justifiable homicide.

Luckily, he has many redeeming qualities. Following up on the practical just isn't one of them.

[dividendman]

When we went on an international trip last year, I begged DH to confirm his debit PIN. He did not and was not able to withdrawal any money. Luckily, I had no issues with my card, but I asked him to sort it before our next international trip. Since we are leaving tomorrow, he decided to try it today. And he finally noticed that his card expired over a year ago. And that is how we found out that our bank does not automatically send a new debit card upon expiration if you never actually use your debit card.

Justifiable homicide.

A true LOL moment.

[Alfred J Quack]

I am in that position right now. I got encouraged (pushed) into a VP position I did not want and knew I wasn’t ready for and I am crashing and burning. It’s not good. I am trying to learn a new field while still stuck doing my old job, the new job, managing staff and doing subpar work all around.  It is not good for me or anyone around me. I can see how I might enjoy aspects of the work if I can ever get ahead and stop just putting out fires… but will that day ever come? 

I guess my MPP is that I do plan to downshift in a couple years. I might be more motivated to invest more at work but I’ve checked out early. Or maybe this is just burnout and stress talking and not a MPP but I do wish I had not taken the promotion.

@PMG I feel your pain. I was in this position 8-10 years ago. I remember tentatively inquiring about requesting a demotion so that I could go back to work that I loved and was good at, but when I got laughed at "NOBODY wants to be demoted! EVERYBODY wants to be where you are now!", I let it slide as my mental health spiralled. In hindsight, I should have pursued it, and recommend that you consider doing the same - before your health and reputation suffer irreparably.

PM me if you want tips or commiseration.

Been there too, for different reasons. Had a combination of 2 jobs where one was 25% of the hours and the other 75%. The business wanted the 25% fulltime but my co-workers expected me to fill the gap when someone took the day off/sick for the 75%. I told my boss, either give me one or the other fulltime which ended up dropping the 25% as a demotion.

Best choice I ever made!

[oldladystache]

I'm planning on a couple very large purchases this year, so I've been gradually moving money from stocks to short term treasury bills and CDs.

Now that it's time to take out some of that money to spend it, it's very painful to close accounts that are earning so much interest.

[getsorted]

People on Facebook keep sharing a meme that says, "If you skip your coffee every day, you will save $2,000, which will never buy a house in this market so you might as well just have the coffee!"

It drives me bonkers because $2,000 happens to be what I put down to buy my house in 2020.

[dignam]

...and I don't get why some will sit in a drive through line for 15 minutes to pay a ridiculous amount for coffee, when it's faster, cheaper and better tasting to brew at home.

[Alternatepriorities]

People on Facebook keep sharing a meme that says, "If you skip your coffee every day, you will save $2,000, which will never buy a house in this market so you might as well just have the coffee!"

It drives me bonkers because $2,000 happens to be what I put down to buy my house in 2020.

Not to mention that 2k per year invested and compounded for a standard forty year career is over 400K which happens to be the median price of a house...

There is always someone happy to justify screwing your future self over to give your present self some comfort. Some say "the greatest trick the devil ever pulled off was convincing the world he didn't exist". Maybe the Mustachian equivalent is, "The greatest trick marketing ever pulled off is convincing our friends to sell their products for them".

[getsorted]

...and I don't get why some will sit in a drive through line for 15 minutes to pay a ridiculous amount for coffee, when it's faster, cheaper and better tasting to brew at home.

My monthly coffee spend is $6 and I'm trying to give that up!

Not to mention that 2k per year invested and compounded for a standard forty year career is over 400K which happens to be the median price of a house...

There is always someone happy to justify screwing your future self over to give your present self some comfort. Some say "the greatest trick the devil ever pulled off was convincing the world he didn't exist". Maybe the Mustachian equivalent is, "The greatest trick marketing ever pulled off is convincing our friends to sell their products for them".

I am half convinced Starbucks produced this meme.

I made the mistake of talking about this on Facebook and someone told me "People need JOY!" And they do need joy, but joy is entirely accessible outside of $7 coffees on a daily basis.

I think that's what bothers me the most. Of course people need comfort and joy. But you don't have to waste your money and sabotage your financial security to have either comfort or joy.

[Freedomin5]

...and I don't get why some will sit in a drive through line for 15 minutes to pay a ridiculous amount for coffee, when it's faster, cheaper and better tasting to brew at home.

My monthly coffee spend is $6 and I'm trying to give that up!

Not to mention that 2k per year invested and compounded for a standard forty year career is over 400K which happens to be the median price of a house...

There is always someone happy to justify screwing your future self over to give your present self some comfort. Some say "the greatest trick the devil ever pulled off was convincing the world he didn't exist". Maybe the Mustachian equivalent is, "The greatest trick marketing ever pulled off is convincing our friends to sell their products for them".

I am half convinced Starbucks produced this meme.

I made the mistake of talking about this on Facebook and someone told me "People need JOY!" And they do need joy, but joy is entirely accessible outside of $7 coffees on a daily basis.

I think that's what bothers me the most. Of course people need comfort and joy. But you don't have to waste your money and sabotage your financial security to have either comfort or joy.

But but but…the Starbucks commercial told them that the only way they can experience joy is to buy a $7 super-double-espresso-venti-caramel-mocha-latte-frappacino-with-oat-milk-sprinkles-and-whipped-cream!

[Extramedium]

...and I don't get why some will sit in a drive through line for 15 minutes to pay a ridiculous amount for coffee, when it's faster, cheaper and better tasting to brew at home.

Im with you here.  I'll occasionally splurge on a coffee while out and about, as a true treat.  But I don't kid myself that it's significantly better than my own, and even then I feel a little silly and fancy.  It's not a denial of living the good life to make your own delicious coffee!

[jinga nation]

...and I don't get why some will sit in a drive through line for 15 minutes to pay a ridiculous amount for coffee, when it's faster, cheaper and better tasting to brew at home.

Im with you here.  I'll occasionally splurge on a coffee while out and about, as a true treat.  But I don't kid myself that it's significantly better than my own, and even then I feel a little silly and fancy.  It's not a denial of living the good life to make your own delicious coffee!

Yes! Can buy good quality coffee, and have it in a variety of ways, depending on the equipment one has at home. More fun to experiment. Sugar syrups are for sheeple.

My coffee MPP is that since I've graduated to buying good beans from local roasters and doing a fresh daily grind for the French Press, I now want to explore roasting green beans, wet or dry method, etc (based on another thread on these forums). A potential rabbit hole. Also related, Ze Wife likes to "complain/comment" about my purchases, but enjoys the delicious outcomes.

[merula]

I'm so disheartened by those messages and memes.

People deserve joy, absolutely, on a philosophical and humanist level. Under capitalism, no one deserves anything but what they can pay for.

They're using humanist arguments within a capitalist framework, and now if you say "maybe make coffee at home and bike instead of uber, don't make the billionaires richer", you're interfering with THE JOY THAT THEY DESERVE AS HUMANS.

[getsorted]

I'm so disheartened by those messages and memes.

People deserve joy, absolutely, on a philosophical and humanist level. Under capitalism, no one deserves anything but what they can pay for.

They're using humanist arguments within a capitalist framework, and now if you say "maybe make coffee at home and bike instead of uber, don't make the billionaires richer", you're interfering with THE JOY THAT THEY DESERVE AS HUMANS.

Wow, very well said.

[GuitarStv]

If you're not riding a bike regularly, you're already missing out on the joy you deserve as a human.

[getsorted]

If you're not riding a bike regularly, you're already missing out on the joy you deserve as a human.

I read this in Don Draper's voice, in front of an illustrated poster for Specialized.

[Dave1442397]

If you're not riding a bike regularly, you're already missing out on the joy you deserve as a human.

Some people would disagree :) Not me, though, I'm at 2,538 miles so far this year.

[Metalcat]

If you're not riding a bike regularly, you're already missing out on the joy you deserve as a human.

I read this in Don Draper's voice, in front of an illustrated poster for Specialized.

ME TOO!!!

[eyesonthehorizon]

I'm so disheartened by those messages and memes.

People deserve joy, absolutely, on a philosophical and humanist level. Under capitalism, no one deserves anything but what they can pay for.

They're using humanist arguments within a capitalist framework, and now if you say "maybe make coffee at home and bike instead of uber, don't make the billionaires richer", you're interfering with THE JOY THAT THEY DESERVE AS HUMANS.

Stunned ovation over here. This is exactly it.

[glacio09]

I'm so disheartened by those messages and memes.

People deserve joy, absolutely, on a philosophical and humanist level. Under capitalism, no one deserves anything but what they can pay for.

They're using humanist arguments within a capitalist framework, and now if you say "maybe make coffee at home and bike instead of uber, don't make the billionaires richer", you're interfering with THE JOY THAT THEY DESERVE AS HUMANS.

Stunned ovation over here. This is exactly it.

I hate with a fiery passion the word deserve. Do I have some nice things? Yes. Do I spend more on coffee than I probably should? Absolutely. But I don't deserve any of these things. I have enough money in the bank and I wanted it therefore I got it. My self worth as a human being or the morality of my choices up to this point has nothing to do with the amount in my bank account. I know people who are super lazy and have made truly stupid decisions that have far more money than me. I also know people who have worked their fingers to the bone and are the nicest sweetest people ever and yet are still scraping by.

Conflating wealth or consumerism and morality is just an excuse to deny human rights to the poor because if they "deserved" things they wouldn't be in that position in the first place. Grumble. I swear I'm becoming more leftist the more money I get. Or more likely to end up in prison because I slapped someone who "deserved" their frappacino.

[dandarc]

I'm so disheartened by those messages and memes.

People deserve joy, absolutely, on a philosophical and humanist level. Under capitalism, no one deserves anything but what they can pay for.

They're using humanist arguments within a capitalist framework, and now if you say "maybe make coffee at home and bike instead of uber, don't make the billionaires richer", you're interfering with THE JOY THAT THEY DESERVE AS HUMANS.

Stunned ovation over here. This is exactly it.

I hate with a fiery passion the word deserve. Do I have some nice things? Yes. Do I spend more on coffee than I probably should? Absolutely. But I don't deserve any of these things. I have enough money in the bank and I wanted it therefore I got it. My self worth as a human being or the morality of my choices up to this point has nothing to do with the amount in my bank account. I know people who are super lazy and have made truly stupid decisions that have far more money than me. I also know people who have worked their fingers to the bone and are the nicest sweetest people ever and yet are still scraping by.

Conflating wealth or consumerism and morality is just an excuse to deny human rights to the poor because if they "deserved" things they wouldn't be in that position in the first place. Grumble. I swear I'm becoming more leftist the more money I get. Or more likely to end up in prison because I slapped someone who "deserved" their frappacino.

You're definitely not the only one.

[LennStar]

You aren't leftist enough if you haven't been called a Nazi at least once for denying someone something they "deserve".

[merula]

You aren't leftist enough if you haven't been called a Nazi at least once for denying someone something they "deserve".

100%, and thank you, I almost never feel leftist enough*

I've been salty about this whole thing since I listened to a podcast that described "the inherent conservative nature of personal finance". I realize they're right on the whole (and they were talking about Rich Dad Poor Dad specifically, so I get it), but the entire FIRE movement is personal finance for people who believe in avoiding the spending traps the ownership class want us to believe are 'the basics', so we can sell as little labor as possible over a lifetime.

*Spouse's family has been socialist for a century, it's a lot to compare myself to :)

[ChpBstrd]

I hate with a fiery passion the word deserve. Do I have some nice things? Yes. Do I spend more on coffee than I probably should? Absolutely. But I don't deserve any of these things. I have enough money in the bank and I wanted it therefore I got it. My self worth as a human being or the morality of my choices up to this point has nothing to do with the amount in my bank account. I know people who are super lazy and have made truly stupid decisions that have far more money than me. I also know people who have worked their fingers to the bone and are the nicest sweetest people ever and yet are still scraping by.

Conflating wealth or consumerism and morality is just an excuse to deny human rights to the poor because if they "deserved" things they wouldn't be in that position in the first place. Grumble. I swear I'm becoming more leftist the more money I get. Or more likely to end up in prison because I slapped someone who "deserved" their frappacino.

Yea, 90% of the time when we hear someone talking about something being "deserved" it is for one of the following goals:

1) To justify harming someone who "deserves" to be harmed by us, the righteous justice warriors of the universe who do not ourselves "deserve" harm in exchange for the harm we do to others, or

2) To justify harming oneself by using one's money in a counterproductive way.

Bottom line is nobody gets the life they deserve. Some people are born with terrible deformities from day one. Some live in a place where they starve or get murdered no matter how hard they work, and are legally prohibited from leaving such places only because they're already there. Mother nature gives cancer to children and infects aid workers with malaria or river blindness. People across the planet are suffering terribly, and few if any of them deserve it. Capitalism is more like a highly effective system for incentivizing people to work hard for extended periods of time, not a system to impose fair outcomes on the world. If people understood that the universe is inherently unfair, and this concept of "deserving" does not exist outside our own heads, life would start to make more sense.

[zolotiyeruki]

I don't see how abstaining from consumerism makes someone a leftist.  Isn't capitalism all about economic exchange being voluntary?

But back on topic....

I have a MPP:  we have a sprinkler system that has a burst pipe.  I dug it up and diagnosed it last night, and the repair requires a whole four inches of pipe and a few crimp bands.  The hardware store only sells the pipe in rolls of one hundred feet.

[Alfred J Quack]

I have a MPP:  we have a sprinkler system that has a burst pipe.  I dug it up and diagnosed it last night, and the repair requires a whole four inches of pipe and a few crimp bands.  The hardware store only sells the pipe in rolls of one hundred feet.

Sounds like copper tubing? Chances are you can get it at a pet-store too because it may be used in aquarium systems.

As for my own MPP:
I'm currently 3 for 3 on job interviews (where one is my current employer). I'm still on the fence but I'm also kind of stressed about leaving my current employer. My wife doesn't like that option because we "only" have 50k in the bank (and no mortgage)...

[zolotiyeruki]

I have a MPP:  we have a sprinkler system that has a burst pipe.  I dug it up and diagnosed it last night, and the repair requires a whole four inches of pipe and a few crimp bands.  The hardware store only sells the pipe in rolls of one hundred feet.

Sounds like copper tubing? Chances are you can get it at a pet-store too because it may be used in aquarium systems.

It's black poly pipe, and in 1" diameter, so aquarium tubing won't cut it

[RWD]

I have a MPP:  we have a sprinkler system that has a burst pipe.  I dug it up and diagnosed it last night, and the repair requires a whole four inches of pipe and a few crimp bands.  The hardware store only sells the pipe in rolls of one hundred feet.

Sounds like copper tubing? Chances are you can get it at a pet-store too because it may be used in aquarium systems.

It's black poly pipe, and in 1" diameter, so aquarium tubing won't cut it

There's gotta be a cut-to-length option, right? Something like this maybe?

[eyesonthehorizon]

I'm so disheartened by those messages and memes.

People deserve joy, absolutely, on a philosophical and humanist level. Under capitalism, no one deserves anything but what they can pay for.

They're using humanist arguments within a capitalist framework, and now if you say "maybe make coffee at home and bike instead of uber, don't make the billionaires richer", you're interfering with THE JOY THAT THEY DESERVE AS HUMANS.

Stunned ovation over here. This is exactly it.

I hate with a fiery passion the word deserve. Do I have some nice things? Yes. Do I spend more on coffee than I probably should? Absolutely. But I don't deserve any of these things. I have enough money in the bank and I wanted it therefore I got it. My self worth as a human being or the morality of my choices up to this point has nothing to do with the amount in my bank account. I know people who are super lazy and have made truly stupid decisions that have far more money than me. I also know people who have worked their fingers to the bone and are the nicest sweetest people ever and yet are still scraping by.

Conflating wealth or consumerism and morality is just an excuse to deny human rights to the poor because if they "deserved" things they wouldn't be in that position in the first place. Grumble. I swear I'm becoming more leftist the more money I get. Or more likely to end up in prison because I slapped someone who "deserved" their frappacino.

You're definitely not the only one.

Yeah, the more I have the more left I lean, from a pretty conservative start, because the difference between me now & me when I was hungry & scandalously underpaid, is solely that now I'm treated far better, for working fewer hours in a cleaner, safer job, at a less breakneck pace, for several times more money. I know the quality of my peers, & it is not broadly higher than when I was blue collar.

One of my MPPs is moving to a nice neighborhood (not a wealthy one) which has raised my exposure to smug assurances that I'd "get it" when I had some money, often, bizarrely, from people with less than I have. I have to choose between distaste for their metric of worldly experience & the tremendous temptation to use their belief in metric to emphasize how very mistaken they are. Haven't slipped yet.

[PMG]

I have a MPP:  we have a sprinkler system that has a burst pipe.  I dug it up and diagnosed it last night, and the repair requires a whole four inches of pipe and a few crimp bands.  The hardware store only sells the pipe in rolls of one hundred feet.

Sounds like copper tubing? Chances are you can get it at a pet-store too because it may be used in aquarium systems.

It's black poly pipe, and in 1" diameter, so aquarium tubing won't cut it

Try a buy nothing group and try your local hardware store and ask the neighbors. Someone is bound to have some they would share.

[Alternatepriorities]

I have a MPP:  we have a sprinkler system that has a burst pipe.  I dug it up and diagnosed it last night, and the repair requires a whole four inches of pipe and a few crimp bands.  The hardware store only sells the pipe in rolls of one hundred feet.

Sounds like copper tubing? Chances are you can get it at a pet-store too because it may be used in aquarium systems.

It's black poly pipe, and in 1" diameter, so aquarium tubing won't cut it

Hose and hose clamps? Might not be the official way to fix it but I know of at least one place it held for years and years…

[Alternatepriorities]

Back to coffee for a minute. I was on a long drive Monday and stopped for a coffee. Just a  16 oz Americano. The lady told me $5.70. I couldn’t do it. I apologized and said I just can’t spend that much on coffee. She looked a bit shocked and maybe a little hurt. The last time I got an Americano was less than a year ago and it was under $3. I guess I’ll start taking my jet boil and areo press on road trips.

[getsorted]

Back to coffee for a minute. I was on a long drive Monday and stopped for a coffee. Just a  16 oz Americano. The lady told me $5.70. I couldn’t do it. I apologized and said I just can’t spend that much on coffee. She looked a bit shocked and maybe a little hurt. The last time I got an Americano was less than a year ago and it was under $3. I guess I’ll start taking my jet boil and areo press on road trips.

I take instant packets with me and get hot water from gas stations in a travel mug. I ask but they have never charged me. (I put the instant coffee in afterwards, in the car). Also do this on planes, because plane coffee is terrible.

[Alfred J Quack]

One of my MPPs is moving to a nice neighborhood (not a wealthy one) which has raised my exposure to smug assurances that I'd "get it" when I had some money, often, bizarrely, from people with less than I have. I have to choose between distaste for their metric of worldly experience & the tremendous temptation to use their belief in metric to emphasize how very mistaken they are. Haven't slipped yet.

You're the oddball to them if they knew, why "waste away" when you can afford luxury? Would that be considered their sense of entitlement speaking?

[charis]

One of my MPPs is moving to a nice neighborhood (not a wealthy one) which has raised my exposure to smug assurances that I'd "get it" when I had some money, often, bizarrely, from people with less than I have. I have to choose between distaste for their metric of worldly experience & the tremendous temptation to use their belief in metric to emphasize how very mistaken they are. Haven't slipped yet.

I've be so tempted to let something slip.  I had a coworker in payroll who is aware of my retirement and HSA contributions and once let this little comment fly, in the context of her own retirement account (at least 20 years in), "I think people would be pretty surprised if they knew how much was in there." 

[dignam]

There was a period earlier in my career where I would buy my daily coffee on the way to work.  At some point I realized it was expensive and wasteful (and home-ground coffee is much tastier).  That said, if that's what people want to spend their money on, that's their choice.  I'm sure some people are financially well off enough that $6 daily coffee isn't going to make a big difference, BUT that is the minority I'm sure.

One thing I will never understand is waiting in a long drive through line for coffee for 15-20 minutes.  The line for the Dunkin near me spills out into the street some mornings.