Author Topic: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)  (Read 4865828 times)

charis

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3083
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9450 on: October 26, 2022, 07:59:07 AM »
This happened the first year my husband became eligible for a 401k (mid-year).  I think he did ask first if he could do 100% after all other deductions, and they didn't know the answer, or really even understand the question.  It turned out that, no, it would be 100% of the gross pay.  Obviously dollar amount is better, but we didn't know what that would be in advance.

FrugalShrew

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1817
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9451 on: October 26, 2022, 05:23:57 PM »
Oh, thank goodness for you mustachian peeps who understand these MPPs, @Dicey and @charis--although I'm sorry you guys had to experience these frustrations, too!

HR knew what I wanted to do & literally helped me sign up. They clearly never had anyone trying to contribute so much before & tried to discourage me from doing it, actually.

If IRA's and 401(k)'s didn't have separate contribution limits, with 401(k)'s being so much higher, it wouldn't be as big of an issue. It makes me feel so powerless to depend on my employer to be able to contribute my own dang money.

I wish health insurance and retirement accounts could just be totally decoupled from employment!

Dicey

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 21571
  • Age: 65
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9452 on: October 26, 2022, 06:13:02 PM »
Part of the problem is they have to leave room for deductions, which can be variable. For example, our healthcare was deducted from the first check of the month and dental (much smaller) was deducted from the second. Typically they'll set a limit of something like 75-80% to make sure there's room for all the other things.

The other issue is they are simply not used to dealing with people who know how to save money. My HR totally thought I was nuts.

Alternatepriorities

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1445
  • Age: 42
  • Location: Alaska
  • Engineer, explorer, investor
    • Alternate Priorities
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9453 on: October 26, 2022, 06:26:16 PM »
HR knew what I wanted to do & literally helped me sign up. They clearly never had anyone trying to contribute so much before & tried to discourage me from doing it, actually.

Looking back now I seriously wonder if maxing out my 401k reduced the size of my raises at my first job. I didn't realize then that the size of raise could be negotiable and when HR saw I was maxing out my retirement accounts they wrongly concluded that I wasn't that motivated by money... After a couple of years I forced the issue and got my salary caught back on par, but it never felt quite right there again.

Sibley

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7115
  • Location: Northwest Indiana
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9454 on: October 26, 2022, 06:41:21 PM »
My tiny company and even tinier HR/payroll really can't handle variability. Luckily, I've been able to just set a level percentage.

Hadilly

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 458
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9455 on: October 27, 2022, 07:13:22 AM »
I have a question related to the increases that are available once you turn 50 in 401(k) plans. So, my husband does a 403B and also has an individual Roth 401(k). It’s my understanding that the catch-up provisions theoretically allow him to put 30k total in each account. This is also my understanding that employer contributions in the 403B count towards the 61K cap. 457 contributions, which also have a catch-up provision, do not count towards the 61K cap.

 I’ve emailed our accountant, but he has not gotten back to us. Anyone care to weigh in?

charis

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3083
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9456 on: October 27, 2022, 09:02:09 AM »
I have a question related to the increases that are available once you turn 50 in 401(k) plans. So, my husband does a 403B and also has an individual Roth 401(k). It’s my understanding that the catch-up provisions theoretically allow him to put 30k total in each account. This is also my understanding that employer contributions in the 403B count towards the 61K cap. 457 contributions, which also have a catch-up provision, do not count towards the 61K cap.

 I’ve emailed our accountant, but he has not gotten back to us. Anyone care to weigh in?

What's the 61K cap?

dcheesi

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1302
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9457 on: October 27, 2022, 09:15:18 AM »
I've come to the conclusion that no bank issues said guarantee, ever.

I got one from first republic back when treasury direct required it for everyone

My bank (a regional bank, not one of the big national ones) will do it for their own customers. I know only because I happened to be at the bank when the person being helped next to me asked for a medallion signature guarantee. They weren't a bank customer so the answer was "no".
Just because that's their policy, doesn't mean that MSGs are actually attainable. I've been trying to get one for an inherited stock plan, and it seems that you need to check off all the boxes, and find a branch/employee that actually does them (which they don't tell you online or at a corporate level, you have to call each individual branch), and hope that the person who has the certifications is willing to do it that day. Oh, and you need a super-recent account statement to verify the value, so there's a very small time window to get it done each time you receive a statement.

I talked to my estate attorney about this, and she said that she has other clients whose probate process has been held up for over a year, just trying to chase down a @!#$@% Medallion for one little account just like this...

Hadilly

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 458
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9458 on: October 27, 2022, 12:39:41 PM »
@charis, there is a 61k cap on contributions to 401k plans. That is, assuming I am reading and understanding everything correctly. So, I think that the two plans, 403b and Roth 401k can’t exceed 61k in employer and employee contributions.

I mean, I hope we can have enough money to max it all!

Imma

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3196
  • Location: Europe
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9459 on: October 27, 2022, 03:00:08 PM »
I have problems understanding all the people fretting over the high heating etc. prices here in Germany.

One, I often can't fathom how they even got so high monthly rates anyway. (Though it did make me appreciate how fucking wasteful SFH are, when people paying per month what I pay in a year.)

Second, they clearly could not have had a savings rate above 10% if the increase means they are in the negative. If I point that out and sometimes add they should try to save, also in other areas, they say: It's impossible to save with minimum wage!
To which I then answer that I live on 20% less than minimum wage (yesterday got an 166€ manga packed from Japan, so wasteful!) and I get ghostet. Why???

If the situation in DE is anything similar to NL, I definitely understand how some people get in trouble. I don't feel sorry at all for rich people with a big TV in every room and a jacuzzi in the garden, and there's no need to put the heat on 24C. But prices have gone up so massively it's no surprise that people are feeling the hurt. We are very frugal and our own bills went up from €75 to €340/month and our groceries cost around €10 more every week. That's a lot. We can afford it but we don't have kids.

But if you're on a low income (for example, a single person on government assistance at net €1050 per month, or on minimum wage at net €1600 per month) it's hard. I'm also a frugal person but if you have some money saved up, living on a lower amount is much easier than really living on benefits or minimum wage. For example, if you live on a really low income you're likely renting, and most landlords do very little maintenance because there's always been a housing shortage in NL, beggars can't be choosers so the units get rented out anyway. So many rental houses are very energy inefficient. It doesn't matter if the house has single glazing because the landlord won't pay the bills. A frugal homeowner such as myself has made their home energy efficient. My friend is renting a house so damp, the landlord actually put it in her lease that she's obligated to heat the house to at least 16C. She can't afford that, if she gets caught she's facing eviction (she's been looking for another place for two years but it's hard as a single person on disability).

Also, many people on low incomes, such as my friend, have health issues which not only mean they can't work at all or only parttime, but it also means they often have high medical costs. If you're on a low income you get about €100 in healthcare subsidies from the government, but that doesn't help a lot if you're spending €300. Personally, I also have health issues and I pay even more than that out of pocket every month, and I don't get any special expensive care. Just my travel costs for the medical treatment that keeps me alive (literally) is like €40/month, then there's insurance, copays, medication my insurance doesn't cover, dentist and occasional physical therapy.

So, no, those people never managed to save 10% and now in a short period of time their energy bills have tripled and groceries have become massively more expensive, while minimum wage and benefits only go up once a year. It's a challenge for a lot of people and in my neighbourhood I've seen a massive increase in poverty in a very short period of time.

LennStar

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3444
  • Location: Germany
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9460 on: October 28, 2022, 03:19:01 AM »
I have problems understanding all the people fretting over the high heating etc. prices here in Germany.

One, I often can't fathom how they even got so high monthly rates anyway. (Though it did make me appreciate how fucking wasteful SFH are, when people paying per month what I pay in a year.)

Second, they clearly could not have had a savings rate above 10% if the increase means they are in the negative. If I point that out and sometimes add they should try to save, also in other areas, they say: It's impossible to save with minimum wage!
To which I then answer that I live on 20% less than minimum wage (yesterday got an 166€ manga packed from Japan, so wasteful!) and I get ghostet. Why???

But if you're on a low income (for example, a single person on government assistance at net €1050 per month, or on minimum wage at net €1600 per month) it's hard.
I live on not much more than assistance. Way less than the new minimum wage of 12€/hour.

Quote
My friend is renting a house so damp, the landlord actually put it in her lease that she's obligated to heat the house to at least 16C.
That's a standard clause in Germany (though could be 12 or 14, in my case it's 14) to prevent mold and that is acutally a bigger problem for insulated houses since the walls don't let water through.

Quote
Also, many people on low incomes, such as my friend, have health issues which not only mean they can't work at all or only parttime, but it also means they often have high medical costs.
Yeah, of course there are people who are hit hard, single parents with several children for example - but the people complaining the loudest (which I am refering here to) in most case are not parents or don't feel like they are, since they never mention expenses for children.

Those who are really hit hard don't have time to complain on twitter is my guess.

What I do see complaining are people with an max 3 year old SUV, or they complain about heating their SFH or that they can no longer afford a vacation or going out to eat after they paid 40€+ per person for a concert 200km away and a hotel stay.

What I see are not people who have problems putting food on the table (they seldom mention it like a truly poor person would), but people who are used to luxuries they bought in the past that were way above their income (from an MMM POV) and are now whining that they no longer can afford it.
I was on assistance in various constellations for a decade too. I know what it means when you have "no money left", those people clearly have not, they just spend too much, and that is why I can't understand them.
And I can't even punch them in the face!

Alfred J Quack

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 410
  • Location: Netherlands
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9461 on: October 28, 2022, 07:17:38 AM »
I have problems understanding all the people fretting over the high heating etc. prices here in Germany.

One, I often can't fathom how they even got so high monthly rates anyway. (Though it did make me appreciate how fucking wasteful SFH are, when people paying per month what I pay in a year.)
I'm guessing you still have a long-running contract? I'm still on 25ct per kWh with about 2000kWh last year in usage which includes heating and hot-water and solar production already subtracted. If I was on some of the more expensive contracts (which you can't sign for long-term in NL at the moment) I'd have to pay close to a full €1 per kWh.

What I expect is that lower income families are less diligent in finding the cheapest contract and typically won't take a long-term contract. That said, long term contracts has been unavailble in NL since about april so anyone who's contract is finished  in that timeframe gets verky high tariffs.

LennStar

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3444
  • Location: Germany
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9462 on: October 28, 2022, 08:49:09 AM »
I have problems understanding all the people fretting over the high heating etc. prices here in Germany.

One, I often can't fathom how they even got so high monthly rates anyway. (Though it did make me appreciate how fucking wasteful SFH are, when people paying per month what I pay in a year.)
I'm guessing you still have a long-running contract? I'm still on 25ct per kWh with about 2000kWh last year in usage which includes heating and hot-water and solar production already subtracted. If I was on some of the more expensive contracts (which you can't sign for long-term in NL at the moment) I'd have to pay close to a full €1 per kWh.

What I expect is that lower income families are less diligent in finding the cheapest contract and typically won't take a long-term contract. That said, long term contracts has been unavailble in NL since about april so anyone who's contract is finished  in that timeframe gets verky high tariffs.

I am not sure what you mean with long term contracts. Those don't run out here. But prices can change anytime. I am on 32 cents. The cheapest I could currently get is 60 cent. Means 35€ more per month, not exactly leg breaking. Many people pay more for their phone contract just to get the latest model.

Imma

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3196
  • Location: Europe
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9463 on: October 28, 2022, 10:20:50 AM »
I have problems understanding all the people fretting over the high heating etc. prices here in Germany.

One, I often can't fathom how they even got so high monthly rates anyway. (Though it did make me appreciate how fucking wasteful SFH are, when people paying per month what I pay in a year.)
I'm guessing you still have a long-running contract? I'm still on 25ct per kWh with about 2000kWh last year in usage which includes heating and hot-water and solar production already subtracted. If I was on some of the more expensive contracts (which you can't sign for long-term in NL at the moment) I'd have to pay close to a full €1 per kWh.

What I expect is that lower income families are less diligent in finding the cheapest contract and typically won't take a long-term contract. That said, long term contracts has been unavailble in NL since about april so anyone who's contract is finished  in that timeframe gets verky high tariffs.

I am not sure what you mean with long term contracts. Those don't run out here. But prices can change anytime. I am on 32 cents. The cheapest I could currently get is 60 cent. Means 35€ more per month, not exactly leg breaking. Many people pay more for their phone contract just to get the latest model.

In NL, most people lock in their rate for a set amount of time. I always got a 1 year contract, which most people do, I think, although some people lock their rates in for 3 or 5 years.

My one year contract expired in February so I've been on the variable rate ever since (no company offers a long term fixed rate now). For electricity I pay €0,89 per kwH now and natural gas is €3,44 per cubic meter. Plus the fixed cost of being on the net (nearly €1 per day) plus taxes. I totally get why people can't afford that.

I'm not on twitter so I have no idea if rich people who could easily cut back are complaining there, I'm just reporting what I see among my friends and family. A lot of people I know have fallen from "low income but just about manageable" to food and heat insecurity in a matter of months. My friends with kids notice that way more of their kids' friends don't get fed properly at home. They'll skip breakfast and maybe get a sandwich or pot noodles for dinner and much less fruit, vegetables and protein than they used to get because those categories have become very expensive. A local church here runs a soup kitchen and it used to be mainly for the homeless, but now I see people in the line who look just like you and me (I walk past it when I go home from work). The food pantry around the corner is much busier than last year, but their food parcels are getting smaller because of the high demand.

One of my friends (the one who needs to turn the heating to 16 according to her rental contract, which is not standard here - most rental contracts say 12) has actually turned off the heater completely, so she doesn't even have hot water now. Just by turning it on, the heater burns nearly 1 cubic meter of gas per day, it's a very old model. The house has single pane glazing and literal holes in the wall, if the landlord is so concerned about mold then he should do maintenance. Her house hasn't been updated since the 60s. So just by turning it off she saves like €1300 per year.

Rosy

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2732
  • Location: Florida
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9464 on: October 28, 2022, 12:15:18 PM »
I just spoke with my friend in Germany and she told me the large apartment complexes have taken to shut off hot water at six in the evening. Electricity is at a premium.
She owns a nice, big three-story house and tells me her oil price has tripled and yet she's only locked into that price until January and worries it may go up from there.
Being retired she could no longer live on just her "Rente" sort of the equivalent of the American Social Security. If she didn't have other assets she couldn't even hold onto her own house, much less live well.
She's a true penny pincher but even a penny pincher (who is retired and lives on a fixed income) cannot withstand and absorb such sky-high increases. 

So yeah, @Imma owning your own home and being able to outfit it with energy-efficient measures and keeping up with maintenance is a huge plus.
Not just for personal comfort but for your ability to have money left to save and live a decent lifestyle.

@LennStar  - you have a point, however,
People who lived on the fringe and barely made it and those who happily spent whatever extra they had available are hit the hardest.
Reduced income due to forced essential spending is a real thing one is allowed to groan about:).
IMO this isn't a time to gloat because we are MMMrs and have had time and enough knowledge to bolster our defenses and feather our financial nests.

Anyone can learn to manage their money better. It is never too late.
Who is to say that the children of those thoughtless spenders are not getting a lesson in how not to handle their own finances in the future?

LennStar

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3444
  • Location: Germany
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9465 on: October 30, 2022, 04:03:34 AM »
Being retired she could no longer live on just her "Rente" sort of the equivalent of the American Social Security.
Not quite. If it's the normal state "Rente" then it's more like an insurance - you paid during your work time and get out a percentage of the income of today's working income. Though because of demographics it's been with added general tax income for years.
There is a "Sozialrente" if that state pension and other incomes is not enough - that is a social security thing.

And speaking of social security (for workign age) it used to be that heating and warm water were paid for as you paid, up to a certain amount.
With a doubling or even tripling of that amount, everyone will be breaking that ceiling. I wonder how this will be handles. I would have linked it to the energy use of the house anyway long ago (it's law for a decade or so that every renter has to get a "Energieausweise" - a one-pager listing the propable energy use based on type of the house, insulation etc.
But I guess if you did that it would turn out people on social security are not wasting energy and you lose a point you can feel superior about the lazyasses...

Quote
Reduced income due to forced essential spending is a real thing one is allowed to groan about:).
Yeah, but as I said those don't seem to be complaining.
It more seems to be gigh middle income spendypants and the same people who last year complained about Fridays for Future and that the kids should go back to shool and earn money before they can tell people they should change their life and use up less ressources.

Sibley

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7115
  • Location: Northwest Indiana
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9466 on: October 30, 2022, 08:13:11 PM »
I'm not thrilled about some of these comments. Lack of empathy isn't a good thing.

Children have no control over the family budget, and yet they're more vulnerable to cold and poor food than their parents. The elderly may have been shitty at managing money but they're also far more vulnerable to the cold. Not being able to afford heat WILL kill some of them, especially if they're also stinting on food.

Skyrocketing energy prices have a real, human cost. No one deserves to shiver in theirs beds, unable to stay warm. Even if they're terrible with managing money.

Imma

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3196
  • Location: Europe
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9467 on: October 31, 2022, 08:02:06 AM »
Being retired she could no longer live on just her "Rente" sort of the equivalent of the American Social Security.
Not quite. If it's the normal state "Rente" then it's more like an insurance - you paid during your work time and get out a percentage of the income of today's working income. Though because of demographics it's been with added general tax income for years.
There is a "Sozialrente" if that state pension and other incomes is not enough - that is a social security thing.

And speaking of social security (for workign age) it used to be that heating and warm water were paid for as you paid, up to a certain amount.
With a doubling or even tripling of that amount, everyone will be breaking that ceiling. I wonder how this will be handles. I would have linked it to the energy use of the house anyway long ago (it's law for a decade or so that every renter has to get a "Energieausweise" - a one-pager listing the propable energy use based on type of the house, insulation etc.
But I guess if you did that it would turn out people on social security are not wasting energy and you lose a point you can feel superior about the lazyasses...

Quote
Reduced income due to forced essential spending is a real thing one is allowed to groan about:).
Yeah, but as I said those don't seem to be complaining.
It more seems to be gigh middle income spendypants and the same people who last year complained about Fridays for Future and that the kids should go back to shool and earn money before they can tell people they should change their life and use up less ressources.

I think that American social security works exactly like Rente - it's an insurance and you get what you pay for, if you don't pay in, you don't get anything.  What we think of as social security here in Europe is what Americans call welfare. Now heating costs are such a big news item, I've learned that some sort of subsidy for heating is part of welfare or old age pensions in many countries! Sounds very generous, we never had anything like that in NL. Our welfare is not generous at all. It's really a struggle, designed to be so uncomfortable that not claiming it is the easier option.

Right now our government has decided that from January, energy companies have to charge 2019 prices for electric / gas use up to the use of an "average" household and anything over that, they can charge market prices. That sounds great (my bills will get a lot lower) but it's not actually helping the people who need it most, such as low income people living in cheap rentals, which are often not insulated at all so use much more energy than the "average" household, or people who have a low income because of a disability and use more energy because of their disability (such as charging electric wheelchairs or mobility scooters, kidney dialysis equipment or equipment that helps them breathe) . But it will be a great help to working class and lower middle class households with children, for them this will be making the difference between making ends meet and not making it.

@LennStar Maybe it's also because we're in different countries. It would be quite taboo here for newspapers to publish woe-is-me articles about people who can't afford to charge their brand-new Tesla's anymore. Obviously there will always be people nitpicking over other people's budget (such as why are they eating anything but rice and beans) but most of the people I see in those articles really are in deep poverty with no easy way out. Even MMM has claimed in one of his old articles that his methods work best for people who have lots of disposable income but waste it, not for those truly on the poverty line. Although I think he did do a case study once about someone who was actually working poor. For those with lots of disposable income, a period like this might be a lesson: let's be more frugal with energy, let's use the bike instead of the car, let's take the train instead of the car. But for many people this is an extremely difficult period.

@Sibley I get what you mean. Honestly, I feel like a lot of people here don't have first-hand experience of living in poverty. I know a lot of people here are of the "nothing needed but rice, beans and water" school, too. I've always been frugal, I've never been in debt, I've always found creative ways to make ends meet, but living an extremely spartan lifestyle when it's not a choice and not something you know is temporary is hard and it's not an experience that somehow makes you a better person.

FrugalShrew

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1817
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9468 on: November 03, 2022, 10:50:22 AM »
I recently became eligible for the 401(k) at work and wanted to put as much in as I could in the remainder of this tax year. It's been awhile since I've had access to a 401(k) and its higher contribution limit, so I was excited.

I won't be able to hit the max, but I wanted to put every penny I had in my paycheck towards the 401(k). HR helped me sign up for the contribution, and I selected the max contribution allowed in our system: 80%. (At that point, I'm wondering why I can't do 100% of my net paycheck, but I go with the 80%).

Unfortunately, my next paycheck comes, and instead of 80% being taken out, what's been taken out is $0!

I follow up with HR--it turns out that it was 80% of gross, which was more money than was available given other deductions for taxes, health insurance, etc. So the system defaulted to $0. Why would it do that instead of putting in as much as it could??

Responses I have gotten:
-Can't you just invest in an IRA?
-I told you 80% was too much.

Hopefully I've fixed it for the next paycheck, but grrr it's frustrating that I missed out on this last one!

So my 401(k) saga continues. The flat amount ended up not taking effect the next paycheck--apparently by the time I made the online election, it was too late for that paycheck--even though I had followed up with HR right away after the 80% didn't work and made the change as soon as they advised it. At that point, HR could have done a manual override with a paper form, but did not communicate that clearly.

Then I realized from looking at the paper form that it also could have been used to implement my desired contribution for the first paycheck where I was eligible to contribute to the 401(k)--despite HR having told me it was not possible to do anything other than the automatic contribution for the first paycheck.

So that is now 3 paychecks where I wanted to contribute my whole net paycheck to my 401(k), and instead have been able to contribute nothing (well, except for the automatic contribution from my first paycheck). This MPP doesn't feel that fun, although I keep trying to tell myself it's only money. What is the point of financial security if I get just as upset about money? But I think the bigger issue is the bad advice, confusing bureaucracy, and lack of sympathy/being blamed.

When I asked if we could retroactively fix the last 2 paychecks because I have been clear with HR what I wanted to do from the outset (before I realized I got bad advice on the 1st paycheck, too), I was lectured that making a correct 401(k) election is the employee's responsibility.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2022, 11:00:19 AM by FrugalShrew »

solon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2272
  • Age: 1822
  • Location: CO
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9469 on: November 03, 2022, 11:07:38 AM »
I recently became eligible for the 401(k) at work and wanted to put as much in as I could in the remainder of this tax year. It's been awhile since I've had access to a 401(k) and its higher contribution limit, so I was excited.

I won't be able to hit the max, but I wanted to put every penny I had in my paycheck towards the 401(k). HR helped me sign up for the contribution, and I selected the max contribution allowed in our system: 80%. (At that point, I'm wondering why I can't do 100% of my net paycheck, but I go with the 80%).

Unfortunately, my next paycheck comes, and instead of 80% being taken out, what's been taken out is $0!

I follow up with HR--it turns out that it was 80% of gross, which was more money than was available given other deductions for taxes, health insurance, etc. So the system defaulted to $0. Why would it do that instead of putting in as much as it could??

Responses I have gotten:
-Can't you just invest in an IRA?
-I told you 80% was too much.

Hopefully I've fixed it for the next paycheck, but grrr it's frustrating that I missed out on this last one!

So my 401(k) saga continues. The flat amount ended up not taking effect the next paycheck--apparently by the time I made the online election, it was too late for that paycheck--even though I had followed up with HR right away after the 80% didn't work and made the change as soon as they advised it. At that point, HR could have done a manual override with a paper form, but did not communicate that clearly.

Then I realized from looking at the paper form that it also could have been used to implement my desired contribution for the first paycheck where I was eligible to contribute to the 401(k)--despite HR having told me it was not possible to do anything other than the automatic contribution for the first paycheck.

So that is now 3 paychecks where I wanted to contribute my whole net paycheck to my 401(k), and instead have been able to contribute nothing (well, except for the automatic contribution from my first paycheck). This MPP doesn't feel that fun, although I keep trying to tell myself it's only money. What is the point of financial security if I get just as upset about money? But I think the bigger issue is the bad advice, confusing bureaucracy, and lack of sympathy/being blamed.

When I asked if we could retroactively fix the last 2 paychecks because I have been clear with HR what I wanted to do from the outset (before I realized I got bad advice on the 1st paycheck, too), I was lectured that making a correct 401(k) election is the employee's responsibility.

Keep pressing on your HR people. This is something they CAN correct manually. They might not be aware they can do that, or they might not want to, but just keep asking.

Also, it doesn't matter whose responsibility it is. Whether yours or theirs is irrelevant. You want to change the current situation, without finding fault.

FrugalShrew

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1817
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9470 on: November 03, 2022, 11:34:10 AM »
Thanks, @solon! Just to clarify, when you say HR can correct the issue manually, are you referring to prospectively or retroactively?


solon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2272
  • Age: 1822
  • Location: CO
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9471 on: November 03, 2022, 02:17:04 PM »
Thanks, @solon! Just to clarify, when you say HR can correct the issue manually, are you referring to prospectively or retroactively?

Retroactively. They can go back three paychecks and make it so none if this ever happened. They can make it the way it would be if everything had gone smoothly from the beginning.

FrugalShrew

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1817
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9472 on: November 03, 2022, 03:21:40 PM »
@solon, do you have any suggestions on who to talk to, since both lower level HR & higher level HR have said no, it cannot be fixed retroactively? Or should I just be more insistent?

solon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2272
  • Age: 1822
  • Location: CO
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9473 on: November 03, 2022, 04:03:44 PM »
@solon, do you have any suggestions on who to talk to, since both lower level HR & higher level HR have said no, it cannot be fixed retroactively? Or should I just be more insistent?

You need to talk to payroll. That may be in-house, or they may outsource it. I know it can be done though, because I'm the HR/payroll guy at our company.  I have had to retroactively fixed errors before. I just call our outsourced payroll processor and tell them what I want to happen, and they take care of it, including adjusting any withholdings that may have changed. To be clear, they will make the adjustments on the current or future pay checks, they can't actually change a past paycheck. In your case it may take several paychecks to get caught up, since you want such a high contribution rate. Or you may need to give them the money, since it went to you instead of the 401k account. The longer I type the more confusing this is getting.

And you need to be more insistent.

FrugalShrew

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1817
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9474 on: November 03, 2022, 04:44:11 PM »
You need to talk to payroll. That may be in-house, or they may outsource it. I know it can be done though, because I'm the HR/payroll guy at our company.  I have had to retroactively fixed errors before. I just call our outsourced payroll processor and tell them what I want to happen, and they take care of it, including adjusting any withholdings that may have changed. To be clear, they will make the adjustments on the current or future pay checks, they can't actually change a past paycheck. In your case it may take several paychecks to get caught up, since you want such a high contribution rate. Or you may need to give them the money, since it went to you instead of the 401k account. The longer I type the more confusing this is getting.

This is all super helpful, thank you! I figured I would need to send back the money, in order for the contribution to be made. But knowing that it is possible is a great starting point (and knowing some of the mechanics, like that it would happen through future paychecks, backs up my position, too).

And you need to be more insistent.

Haha, I guess I could have predicted the answer to that one. Not my favorite thing to be, but I can if needed.

TomTX

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5310
  • Location: Texas
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9475 on: November 03, 2022, 05:50:36 PM »
I have a question related to the increases that are available once you turn 50 in 401(k) plans. So, my husband does a 403B and also has an individual Roth 401(k). It’s my understanding that the catch-up provisions theoretically allow him to put 30k total in each account. This is also my understanding that employer contributions in the 403B count towards the 61K cap. 457 contributions, which also have a catch-up provision, do not count towards the 61K cap.

 I’ve emailed our accountant, but he has not gotten back to us. Anyone care to weigh in?
IIRC 401k and 403B share the same cap. Contributions to either count toward the cap.
457 has its own entirely separate cap, unaffected by other contributions.

jinga nation

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2560
  • Age: 247
  • Location: 'Murica's Schlong
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9476 on: November 04, 2022, 06:35:13 AM »
i keep finding extra days/hours to take time off, so the problem is deciding when to. this is doubly weird because I don't work more than 8H/day.

I'm already off for Thanksgiving week and the last 10 days of December. Decided to take additional days off, got them "approved" (technically, just informing my team and manager that I will not be working).
Last night, while running the numbers, found there's 2 additional days to take off. Planned a day off for some home renovation work, and now have 8H left - thinking of 2 half days for longer distance bike rides in the cooler weather.

(i work for a professional consultancy on long term contracts, so have to hit minimum billable hours for the year, any time after that I can take time off or work. last year i worked 0.5H over minimum and took ~5.5 weeks off. The goal this year is to be right on the mark.)

Alfred J Quack

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 410
  • Location: Netherlands
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9477 on: November 05, 2022, 06:11:12 AM »
IMO this isn't a time to gloat because we are MMMrs and have had time and enough knowledge to bolster our defenses and feather our financial nests.
I heartily agree with this. I've checked with family whether the general compensation everyone gets (thanks government) is enough to get them through the winter. My mom still has a long-term contract and my syster is doing OK, I still haven't spoken to my brother who I think is the one that'll be in trouble financially. If he needs it, I'll transfer  it to him.


ricelife

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 51
  • Location: Canada
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9478 on: November 15, 2022, 06:43:18 PM »
new to the thread and didn't read previous replies!

But here's my most recent story:
Payroll forgot to pay one of my weeks of pay since I just came back from maternity leave (so basically was living off the government cheque for the past 18 months). They were panicked that I needed the money so they sent a wire out to my bank. Bank doesn't accept wires so they are calling me asking where they can wire the money too.
I'm too lazy so I told them to add it to my next paycheque

solon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2272
  • Age: 1822
  • Location: CO
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9479 on: November 15, 2022, 07:59:42 PM »
new to the thread and didn't read previous replies!

But here's my most recent story:
Payroll forgot to pay one of my weeks of pay since I just came back from maternity leave (so basically was living off the government cheque for the past 18 months). They were panicked that I needed the money so they sent a wire out to my bank. Bank doesn't accept wires so they are calling me asking where they can wire the money too.
I'm too lazy so I told them to add it to my next paycheque


solon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2272
  • Age: 1822
  • Location: CO
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9480 on: November 15, 2022, 08:00:57 PM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.

Dicey

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 21571
  • Age: 65
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9481 on: November 15, 2022, 09:16:42 PM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.
Wow, nice catch!

ChpBstrd

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5864
  • Location: A poor and backward Southern state known as minimum wage country
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9482 on: November 15, 2022, 09:18:07 PM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.
Wow, nice catch!
It's just so sad that it never happened before.

Alternatepriorities

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1445
  • Age: 42
  • Location: Alaska
  • Engineer, explorer, investor
    • Alternate Priorities
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9483 on: November 17, 2022, 11:30:56 AM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.

This is a perfect MPP!

TomTX

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5310
  • Location: Texas
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9484 on: November 17, 2022, 03:43:26 PM »
When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.
Since I hit 50 next year, I pinged our 401/457 administrator about this very issue. They claim it will be handled automagically. We shall see.

DeniseNJ

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 752
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9485 on: November 18, 2022, 07:22:30 AM »
Since I hit 50 next year, I pinged our 401/457 administrator about this very issue. They claim it will be handled automagically. We shall see.
That's my new favorite word!
« Last Edit: November 18, 2022, 12:51:16 PM by DeniseNJ »

jinga nation

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2560
  • Age: 247
  • Location: 'Murica's Schlong
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9486 on: November 18, 2022, 12:23:16 PM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.

feature/change wasn't tested before? use case testing doesn't happen at the software vendor?
or do they believe in "we test in production"?

ixtap

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4361
  • Age: 50
  • Location: SoCal
    • Our Sea Story
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9487 on: November 18, 2022, 12:25:36 PM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.

feature/change wasn't tested before? use case testing doesn't happen at the software vendor?
or do they believe in "we test in production"?

Folks run into this frequently both here and bogleheads. I suspect that the vendor doesn't see it often enough to bother updating their code from a manual switch.

dcheesi

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1302
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9488 on: November 18, 2022, 01:46:13 PM »
Here's mine:

I'm the payroll administrator at a small company. I run payroll every other Monday, and pay day is four days later on Thursday. When I do the Monday payroll, I always sneak a peek at my own pay stub. I feel a little guilty because it feels like I have inside information. I can see my pay stub four days before any one else.

When I ran payroll on Monday of this week and looked at my pay stub, it wasn't right. The amount of of my 401k contribution was significantly lower than it should have been. I checked the settings and nothing had changed, our payroll processor just wasn't withholding enough. So I figured it must be a back-end error in their system. I called and emailed, they were baffled. It took two people two days to find the problem. The problem was that I hit the max of $20.5k and so the system cut me off. But I'm 50+, so my limit should have been $27k. This was the first time they had seen that problem.

feature/change wasn't tested before? use case testing doesn't happen at the software vendor?
or do they believe in "we test in production"?

Folks run into this frequently both here and bogleheads. I suspect that the vendor doesn't see it often enough to bother updating their code from a manual switch.
Could even be argued to be a safety "feature"; no risk of bad data triggering an automatic switch, leading to excess contributions that then have to be walked back. Safer to wait until an employee requests/complains, and then manually verify their elligibility.

Goldielocks

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7065
  • Location: BC
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9489 on: November 24, 2022, 05:06:07 PM »
Okay, I have one, a pet peeve, if you will.

This thanksgiving, (Im Canadian, so it is 1 month ago) for the first time, I was confronted by the "tupperware" request.   Yes, someone brought tupperware to thanksgiving and expected me to fill it with "leftovers".

I worked GD hard to make my house ready and to prepare a 10 dish meal for 15 people.  I did not ask anyone to bring anything, but was gifted an appetizer (my sister) and a bottle of wine (my parents).  (Thank-you! So nice!)

I rely on the extra food after the big meal to keep me fed for the next 2+ weeks.  ( I am single).  I own a freezer.   No, I do not want to make my food disappear from my house.   It was EXPENSIVE to serve your ass.   I am FIRED and living on $300 a month food budget., and 35% of it went to hosting that meal.

Of course, this request came from my new roommate's ex (mom of his kid), who declined the invite (invited because they co parent closely and I thought she would like thanksgiving with her kid, too), but asked her ex (my roommate) to fill up her tupperware.   She is 47 years old.   She has a job that pays more than double what my job pays.     She was the first one to do this, and she did not even show up to provide guest conversations.  I AM NOT A FREE TAKE OUT SERVICE. In the past, I have volunteered to plate some take away food (using cheap foil pie plates I have for that purpose) for the living alone broke college students (my nephews who were there), but that was 100% my choice, and a gift.

I don't think she has EVER hosted a large meal in her life.   Seems like HUGE MASSIVE ENTITLEMENT. 

Anyone else get these requests?   Does it drive you bonkers, too?

ARGHHHHHAHTHTAHFHGHGHGHTTHA!!!!!!

AMandM

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1590
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9490 on: November 24, 2022, 05:48:23 PM »
Ha, just today at our American Thanksgiving dinner, there was discussion of a NYT article that listed the three things a good guest should bring to Thanksgiving at someone else's house. One was your own Tupperwares to take leftovers home.

However, I didn't read the article. It may have said that the tupperwares are only to be used if the host offers leftovers.

Freedomin5

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5969
  • Location: China
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9491 on: November 24, 2022, 06:23:40 PM »
Okay, I have one, a pet peeve, if you will.

This thanksgiving, (Im Canadian, so it is 1 month ago) for the first time, I was confronted by the "tupperware" request.   Yes, someone brought tupperware to thanksgiving and expected me to fill it with "leftovers".

I worked GD hard to make my house ready and to prepare a 10 dish meal for 15 people.  I did not ask anyone to bring anything, but was gifted an appetizer (my sister) and a bottle of wine (my parents).  (Thank-you! So nice!)

I rely on the extra food after the big meal to keep me fed for the next 2+ weeks.  ( I am single).  I own a freezer.   No, I do not want to make my food disappear from my house.   It was EXPENSIVE to serve your ass.   I am FIRED and living on $300 a month food budget., and 35% of it went to hosting that meal.

Of course, this request came from my new roommate's ex (mom of his kid), who declined the invite (invited because they co parent closely and I thought she would like thanksgiving with her kid, too), but asked her ex (my roommate) to fill up her tupperware.   She is 47 years old.   She has a job that pays more than double what my job pays.     She was the first one to do this, and she did not even show up to provide guest conversations.  I AM NOT A FREE TAKE OUT SERVICE. In the past, I have volunteered to plate some take away food (using cheap foil pie plates I have for that purpose) for the living alone broke college students (my nephews who were there), but that was 100% my choice, and a gift.

I don't think she has EVER hosted a large meal in her life.   Seems like HUGE MASSIVE ENTITLEMENT. 

Anyone else get these requests?   Does it drive you bonkers, too?

ARGHHHHHAHTHTAHFHGHGHGHTTHA!!!!!!

Wait...you were asked to provide a take-out meal to someone who did not even attend your dinner?!?!  [FACEPALM]

That would be like my friend hosting a birthday party at a restaurant, me declining the invitation but asking my friend to order me a meal and doggie bag it for me.

I...can't...even...

Well, now we know why she's your roommate's EX.

Goldielocks

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7065
  • Location: BC
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9492 on: November 24, 2022, 06:36:56 PM »
Ha, just today at our American Thanksgiving dinner, there was discussion of a NYT article that listed the three things a good guest should bring to Thanksgiving at someone else's house. One was your own Tupperwares to take leftovers home.

However, I didn't read the article. It may have said that the tupperwares are only to be used if the host offers leftovers.
Ha!!

I saw a 4 minute clip from "the view" (or whatever that Whoopi G. talk show is) discussing this article today.  It's what prompted this forum post.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXsfQ6GLSNo

The two people who were in favour of the tupperware had these rationales for it.
1)  "There is so much food, Why do you want to waste it?"
UMMM.......  why do people throw away yummy leftovers?  That person had zero idea that people actually eat leftovers, I think?

2. Something about only bringing tupperware if it is someone you know, because stealing someone's tupperware after dinner (or plate) and never giving it back is worse.
The key message is that "There is no downside to Thanksgiving.... it's FREE. Let's be thankful that we have friends who are willing to feed us... for FREE".   WHAT?!!???

How does someone actually believe this? 

My thought is that there are a great number of grown ass adults (think parents who are 35+) who can afford to host or co-host, yet NEVER have taken that over, assume that it is free, or always their right somehow?  *

*I get that not everyone has space, but many people have the funds to help co-host with another, yet never think to do that.


Taran Wanderer

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9493 on: November 24, 2022, 07:28:04 PM »
We hosted Thanksgiving. We sent some leftovers home. We even gave away the containers for it. Of course they were randoms and old food containers that were cluttering up our Tupperware drawer. We’d never give away the good Tupperware!

Oh, also, while we hosted, it was a family effort - DM had a frozen Turkey, DW cooked it, MIL and grandkids baked pies, etc… so only fair to share the leftovers after as well.

Dicey

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 21571
  • Age: 65
  • Location: NorCal
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9494 on: November 24, 2022, 09:23:29 PM »
We had two guests for dinner. I sent them both home with to-gos, but man, it was hard to give up those yummy leftovers. In a fun mustachian note, I grabbed some old covered plate type take-out packaging from a dusty cupboard in the garage. One of them was from Cheesecake Factory. Hmmm, we took a guest there in 2015 2014 and used a gifted gift card! I have no idea when the other was acquired and yes, I washed them before filling them with leftovers. Neither person asked, but I wanted to be generous.

OTOH, we had two Costco pies for five people, so shipping some of that off with others was probably a good self-defense move.

Related: One of the guests was asked to bring ice cream, but apparently forgot. Fortunately, I had just enough left in the freezer. It's not normally something I keep on hand. ETA: lol, MPP indeed! Apparently, guest did bring the requested ice cream. DH intercepted it when our guest arrived and it went into the garage freezer, which is why I never saw it. Of course, neither thought to mention it.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2022, 11:46:51 PM by Dicey »

LennStar

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3444
  • Location: Germany
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9495 on: November 25, 2022, 03:00:48 AM »
I rely on the extra food after the big meal to keep me fed for the next 2+ weeks.  ( I am single).  I own a freezer.   No, I do not want to make my food disappear from my house.   It was EXPENSIVE to serve your ass.   I am FIRED and living on $300 a month food budget., and 35% of it went to hosting that meal.

Of course, this request came from my new roommate's ex (mom of his kid), who declined the invite (invited because they co parent closely and I thought she would like thanksgiving with her kid, too), but asked her ex (my roommate) to fill up her tupperware.   She is 47 years old.   She has a job that pays more than double what my job pays. 

Wow!

At our family events the attendees genereally try to stuff themselves as much as they can. And of course there are still leftovers. But those are for the hosting family as a matter of course and we work out depending on the amount who get's to eat the next 1 or 2 days off it. Tuppering does nearly never happen and then only if the hosts say they don't want it. I mean most things don't taste that appetizing the 3rd or even 4th time you warm them up anyway, so people don't fight over it.

PMG

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2938
  • Location: USA
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9496 on: November 25, 2022, 03:48:46 AM »
When my grandparents hosted holiday dinners they intentionally prepared excess (and guests brought sides with excess) so that everyone could take some leftovers home. Grandma used to bake a pumpkin pie for each family to take home. Grandma provided takeout containers. Now my brother hosts and preps the meat while the rest of the family brings the sides and there is less excess so less to go home but usually enough for a person to get a bit of their favorite dish. I usually stay out of it. It’s always felt a bit vulture-y to me. I asked my hosting brother yesterday how he felt about it and he was grateful because it meant less clean up work for him. He and his wife fixed up a couple “microwave dinners” and let everyone else empty things.

ETA. Gifting food is my grandma’s love language (not always a healthy one). She lead the meal trains at church and was the first to show up with food. She was also a very practical cook and likely to show up with a quart of hot soup and 3 freezer meals. She coupon shopped and kept a large pantry. She always sent us home from visits with food. When we were kids it was a paper goodie bag with peanuts, a juice box, a stick of gum and a piece of candy.  As adults it was a pound of butter, and triple coupon tomato soup. Seeing people taking leftovers home was very satisfying for her. My dear brother who hosts now bought her home… and inherited A family that feels very comfortable helping themselves. He said yesterday that his motto is “Where family is not all welcome, but never turned away.” Hah.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2022, 03:55:59 AM by PMG »

sonofsven

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1663
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9497 on: November 25, 2022, 08:32:51 AM »
We had two guests for dinner. I sent them both home with to-gos, but man, it was hard to give up those yummy leftovers. In a fun mustachian note, I grabbed some old covered plate type take-out packaging from a dusty cupboard in the garage. One of them was from Cheesecake Factory. Hmmm, we took a guest there in 2015 2014 and used a gifted gift card! I have no idea when the other was acquired and yes, I washed them before filling them with leftovers. Neither person asked, but I wanted to be generous.

OTOH, we had two Costco pies for five people, so shipping some of that off with others was probably a good self-defense move.

Related: One of the guests was asked to bring ice cream, but apparently forgot. Fortunately, I had just enough left in the freezer. It's not normally something I keep on hand. ETA: lol, MPP indeed! Apparently, guest did bring the requested ice cream. DH intercepted it when our guest arrived and it went into the garage freezer, which is why I never saw it. Of course, neither thought to mention it.

ixtap

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4361
  • Age: 50
  • Location: SoCal
    • Our Sea Story
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9498 on: November 25, 2022, 09:00:02 AM »
I feel like takeaways are appropriate for potlucks, as long as it is mostly an even distribution of the leftovers. I'll take some of your turkey, you can take some of my dressing.

My brother and SIL always just assumed and never asked and usually ended up taking almost everything home. And people generally just assumed they were that needy because of all the kids, never mind that he had the highest salary of anyone in their social group and particularly within our family.

Catbert

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3037
  • Location: Southern California
Re: Mustachian People Problems (just for fun)
« Reply #9499 on: November 25, 2022, 10:43:50 AM »
Okay, I have one, a pet peeve, if you will.

This thanksgiving, (Im Canadian, so it is 1 month ago) for the first time, I was confronted by the "tupperware" request.   Yes, someone brought tupperware to thanksgiving and expected me to fill it with "leftovers".

I worked GD hard to make my house ready and to prepare a 10 dish meal for 15 people.  I did not ask anyone to bring anything, but was gifted an appetizer (my sister) and a bottle of wine (my parents).  (Thank-you! So nice!)

I rely on the extra food after the big meal to keep me fed for the next 2+ weeks.  ( I am single).  I own a freezer.   No, I do not want to make my food disappear from my house.   It was EXPENSIVE to serve your ass.   I am FIRED and living on $300 a month food budget., and 35% of it went to hosting that meal.

Of course, this request came from my new roommate's ex (mom of his kid), who declined the invite (invited because they co parent closely and I thought she would like thanksgiving with her kid, too), but asked her ex (my roommate) to fill up her tupperware.   She is 47 years old.   She has a job that pays more than double what my job pays.     She was the first one to do this, and she did not even show up to provide guest conversations.  I AM NOT A FREE TAKE OUT SERVICE. In the past, I have volunteered to plate some take away food (using cheap foil pie plates I have for that purpose) for the living alone broke college students (my nephews who were there), but that was 100% my choice, and a gift.

I don't think she has EVER hosted a large meal in her life.   Seems like HUGE MASSIVE ENTITLEMENT. 

Anyone else get these requests?   Does it drive you bonkers, too?

ARGHHHHHAHTHTAHFHGHGHGHTTHA!!!!!!

Please just confirm that you just looked at your roommate like they had two heads and walked away.  Never be guilted into giving your leftovers away.  As you can see different families have different traditions - but nobody's tradition involved near strangers demanding and getting food from an event they didn't even attend.