Author Topic: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?  (Read 5632 times)

migman

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Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« on: July 07, 2014, 06:20:28 PM »
Hi all

I have a particular nice problem but am still not sure which way to go...

I and my OH have great jobs in Canada making ~170k/yr. We both like our jobs and, for the most part, enjoy the people that we work with. However, we have been planning on leaving Canada for Australia for a number of years and now a pretty good opportunity has arisen. I have been offered a government job with a salary of 90k + benefits (~10k less than I make here). The dilemma is that we are probably only three years away from FI if we stay here (very low cost of living) but certainly to go to Oz will set us back quite a few years (higher cost of living, only 1 income for the first while, likely lower total income once we are both working). I think if we went to OZ, FI would be more like 6 years away but it has the advantage of getting a new experience and much less working hours so maybe that is worth the trade. What would you do?

lizzzi

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2014, 06:41:18 PM »
Why not just stay in Canada for three years, and when you are FIRE, go to Australia at that point? You'd be totally free to do whatever you wanted once you got there. Unless you really want to live in Australia as soon as you can, I would just wait.

Gray Matter

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2014, 07:11:18 PM »
I would go.  It sounds like it's something you've wanted to do for some time, and these opportunities don't come along all that often.  And I couldn't tell from your post, but would being FI in a low COL area in 3 years allow you to move to a high COL in Oz at that time?  I'd rather be building/living the life I want now even if it pushes back FIRE.  But that's just me.

deborah

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #3 on: July 07, 2014, 07:33:58 PM »
Where abouts in OZ?

Erica/NWEdible

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2014, 07:34:59 PM »
Are you planning on living in Aus when you are FIRE regardless?

travelbug

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2014, 11:06:15 PM »
As an Australian, I would stay in Canada and become FI first, then move. At least you have more options then as it's sooooo expensive to live here.

Goldielocks

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2014, 11:20:06 PM »
On the other hand, new employer may mean a moving allowance and other settling in assistance, a work visa that can be turned into part time work visa later on.or permanent resident visa.. Etc.  It is much better to move with employer.

I would go but find the ERE style accommodation there, (with A\C), and one car/bike and keep food costs down. 

Maybe you are a already FIRE for a simpler lifestyle?

What an opportunity!

Thegoblinchief

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2014, 06:49:35 AM »
The fewer working hours would be attractive. You could consider it just a way to downshift as you move towards FI.

Plus, depending on your tastes, climate in Aus is better than most of Canada ;)

migman

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2014, 06:19:09 PM »
Thanks everyone. To elaborate...

Though I would be FI in Canada in 3 years, this would not be the case in Oz. We have PR visas and would have to move in the three year window to keep them so we expected that we would end up working a while longer in Oz once we moved (but we would always have the safety net of being FI if we went nearly anywhere else). We would be going to Darwin so it is extra expensive in areas that are hard to cut... We own a house here worth 80k (rent would be 700/month) but the same place there would be about 650k (rent at 700/week). Even to rent a Garden shed with no washroom and no kitchen (actually advertised on Gumtree) is $1100/month and I don't think I could sell my wife on the virtues of "shed living." On the other hand, so what if we stop saving money at breakneck speed. We could save less but we could have a much better lifestyle at the time and probably get back to a higher savings rate in a couple years. My wife would probably do a graduate degree there at first (not available in our current remote Canadian location) which would certainly be nice for her (a taste of ER). Have any of you mustachians given up/delayed the dream of FI for a interesting opportunity? If so, would you do it again?

Lukim

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2014, 07:31:18 PM »
I would make the move while the opportunity is there - otherwise your PR will lapse and you may have problems getting it again.

I am an Australian - but have lived and worked outside of Australia for the past 27 years - however, I still spend about 25% of each year in Australia (its still "home").

Taxes in Australia are high and Darwin is probably one of the most expensive places in Australia to live (but salaries are also higher there).

I suggest you look at it as an adventure and an opportunity for a few years.  Darwin has easy access to Indonesia (Bali) and Singapore so it would give some great opportunities to travel (and spend money) while you are there.

I have always taken the view that if an opportunity comes up, take it.

You can always go back to Canada in 3 years (or you may decide to settle in Australia or Indonesia or Singapore or.......)


ch12

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2014, 08:34:48 PM »
TEven to rent a Garden shed with no washroom and no kitchen (actually advertised on Gumtree) is $1100/month and I don't think I could sell my wife on the virtues of "shed living." On the other hand, so what if we stop saving money at breakneck speed. We could save less but we could have a much better lifestyle at the time and probably get back to a higher savings rate in a couple years. My wife would probably do a graduate degree there at first (not available in our current remote Canadian location) which would certainly be nice for her (a taste of ER). Have any of you mustachians given up/delayed the dream of FI for a interesting opportunity? If so, would you do it again?

I think that you can move to Australia and make a little less and spend more. It sounds like a fantastic opportunity, and the weather is nicer. The culture is less hurried, or so I've been told my Australian aunt. Your pace of life will be better, even if you have to pay more. You aren't supposed to put your nose to the grindstone until you hit FI; it's not a time of intense sacrifice. You are supposed to enjoy your life and the journey, and sometime along the way FI is a goal post that you pass.

There are plenty of people here who cut back to 30 hour weeks and took the 25% pay cut, just so they'd have more time with their families and for life in general. Heck, Mr. Money Mustache himself in Year 8 took a 20% pay cut for Fridays off. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/09/15/a-brief-history-of-the-stash-how-we-saved-from-zero-to-retirement-in-ten-years/

urbanista

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2014, 09:32:09 PM »
$90K (assuming super is not included) will net you $5,579 monthly.

With average rent $450 pw, (a low end 2-bed apartment/unit) , you are left with about  $3600 monthly. Buy a car and see another ~ $400 go out of the window. Expect utilities to run at ~ $300-500 monthly, especially if you run an aircon. Food will run about $700 at a bare minimum. Unfortunately, Darwin is expensive place.

Another thing is the weather: it is 33C all year and humid/rainy - do you like this sort of weather? I do, but many people hate it.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2014, 09:34:16 PM by urbanista »

Roland of Gilead

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2014, 09:43:07 PM »
What is Australian immigration like?  Do they just take anyone or do you have to be in a desired field?   

It may turn out that taking a job in Australia makes it easier to immigrate there.   I remember reading something about a limit on length of stay for others.

urbanista

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2014, 09:45:30 PM »
migman already got his PR visa so immigration is not relevant for him

Roland of Gilead

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2014, 09:56:18 PM »
migman already got his PR visa so immigration is not relevant for him

What I meant was if he lets the visa expire (by continuing to work in Canada until FIRE'd) he may find it impossible to immigrate to Australia as a early retiree.  This is hearsay  so you Australians can set me straight, but my understanding is you can only stay a few months unless you post a fairly large bond.

Lukim

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Re: Move Overseas or stick it out a few more years?
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2014, 10:24:27 PM »
For a business investment visa (as opposed to an employment visa) which allows a person to live permanently in Australia you need to show you have A$5,000,000 (US$4,700,000) available to invest in Australia.

You can just invest the money in managed funds (including international funds as long as the fund is registered in Australia).