MMM Will Own a Tesla Within Two Years

[nereo]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Um - I think you're looking at it backwards.  The volt is only all-electric for 38 miles.  It's great for people who do short trips (less than 19 miles each way).  On longer trips the fuel efficiency is rated at 42mpg - worse than a Prius.  So it's not an improvement for long road trips and it wouldn't be used for short trips where the Volt excels.

I'm not knocking the volt - it's just the wrong car for their driving style.

[libertarian4321]

My wife has pretty much locked into a new Tesla Model 3 when it's time to get rid of her 6-year old BMW (probably about 2 years).  She hasn't pre-ordered, but she's about 90% sure of buying a Tesla next time around.

I might buy one myself one day, which would be a big departure from my current Chevy Truck (which I just finished ranting about keeping for a while).

After we test drove a Model S last year, we were sold on dumping at least one of the gas guzzlers (her car) for a Tesla, and maybe both.

[forummm]

My wife has pretty much locked into a new Tesla Model 3 when it's time to get rid of her 6-year old BMW (probably about 2 years).  She hasn't pre-ordered, but she's about 90% sure of buying a Tesla next time around.

I might buy one myself one day, which would be a big departure from my current Chevy Truck (which I just finished ranting about keeping for a while).

After we test drove a Model S last year, we were sold on dumping at least one of the gas guzzlers (her car) for a Tesla, and maybe both.

Teslas are excellent. But Leafs are great too if you're not looking to drive around the country in the vehicle and don't want to spend as much.

[undercover]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Tesla is American. The Volt is FUGLY...and the Bolt for that matter. The Model 3 is actually a car I'd want to buy if I needed a car.

[nereo]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Tesla is American. The Volt is FUGLY...and the Bolt for that matter. The Model 3 is actually a car I'd want to buy if I needed a car.

::shrug::  I guess I don't care much what a car looks like. It's a tool to get me and my stuff from point A to B.  Deciding what car to purchase is just an excel spreadsheet to me... (initial cost, cost-per-mile, est. longevity, est. repairs w minimum thresholds for cargo capacity and occupants (4)).

[forummm]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Tesla is American. The Volt is FUGLY...and the Bolt for that matter. The Model 3 is actually a car I'd want to buy if I needed a car.

::shrug::  I guess I don't care much what a car looks like. It's a tool to get me and my stuff from point A to B.  Deciding what car to purchase is just an excel spreadsheet to me... (initial cost, cost-per-mile, est. longevity, est. repairs w minimum thresholds for cargo capacity and occupants (4)).

Me too. Looks are just marketing. It's a way for manufacturers to turn a commodity (transportation) into a "differentiated" (in your mind) product that can command non-commodity pricing power. They tell you that looks matter and then you believe them and pay them more for fulfilling the perceived need that they created inside you.

[undercover]

I'll give the Volt a point for being around longer and being able to find a used one - but the Tesla 3 is undeniably better in about every way. Still not worth it as a reasonable human being to purchase one at this point in time. I don't generally care about how a car looks, but then again I don't generally treat every purchase in a methodical and "practical" way, either. Looks and feels are important and junk.

[Metric Mouse]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Tesla is American. The Volt is FUGLY...and the Bolt for that matter. The Model 3 is actually a car I'd want to buy if I needed a car.

::shrug::  I guess I don't care much what a car looks like. It's a tool to get me and my stuff from point A to B.  Deciding what car to purchase is just an excel spreadsheet to me... (initial cost, cost-per-mile, est. longevity, est. repairs w minimum thresholds for cargo capacity and occupants (4)).

Me too. Looks are just marketing. It's a way for manufacturers to turn a commodity (transportation) into a "differentiated" (in your mind) product that can command non-commodity pricing power. They tell you that looks matter and then you believe them and pay them more for fulfilling the perceived need that they created inside you.

Interesting thought, Forummm. Is there any product or category of product where this is not the case? It seems that anything that could be differentiated from another item that fulfills the same need would be subject to this marketing tactic.

[ecomic]

Yeah, we will all own a Tesla within 2 years. I think its cool.

[MoneyCat]

I'm looking forward to it fifteen years from now when it will be time to replace my hybrid with an electric car. My wife may need to replace her plug-in hybrid sooner, though, because she drives a lot for work.

[forummm]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Tesla is American. The Volt is FUGLY...and the Bolt for that matter. The Model 3 is actually a car I'd want to buy if I needed a car.

::shrug::  I guess I don't care much what a car looks like. It's a tool to get me and my stuff from point A to B.  Deciding what car to purchase is just an excel spreadsheet to me... (initial cost, cost-per-mile, est. longevity, est. repairs w minimum thresholds for cargo capacity and occupants (4)).

Me too. Looks are just marketing. It's a way for manufacturers to turn a commodity (transportation) into a "differentiated" (in your mind) product that can command non-commodity pricing power. They tell you that looks matter and then you believe them and pay them more for fulfilling the perceived need that they created inside you.

Interesting thought, Forummm. Is there any product or category of product where this is not the case? It seems that anything that could be differentiated from another item that fulfills the same need would be subject to this marketing tactic.

Yes, it's an incredibly common tactic. Budweiser tries to convince you that their beer is different and better than Coors because they have really interesting looking horses and Americana attractive people have fun while drinking it. Coke and Pepsi. Etc. Some things are so ingrained in you from a lifetime of marketing that you don't even realize it. Like the reality is that Coke doesn't really taste good--certainly not enough to drink it all the time, and certainly not enough to differentiate it from other cola products. But people all over the world got accustomed to that particular taste and the psychology around it from all the ads and believe they like it (the sugar and caffeine reinforce it).

[Gin1984]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

Tesla is American. The Volt is FUGLY...and the Bolt for that matter. The Model 3 is actually a car I'd want to buy if I needed a car.

::shrug::  I guess I don't care much what a car looks like. It's a tool to get me and my stuff from point A to B.  Deciding what car to purchase is just an excel spreadsheet to me... (initial cost, cost-per-mile, est. longevity, est. repairs w minimum thresholds for cargo capacity and occupants (4)).

Me too. Looks are just marketing. It's a way for manufacturers to turn a commodity (transportation) into a "differentiated" (in your mind) product that can command non-commodity pricing power. They tell you that looks matter and then you believe them and pay them more for fulfilling the perceived need that they created inside you.

Interesting thought, Forummm. Is there any product or category of product where this is not the case? It seems that anything that could be differentiated from another item that fulfills the same need would be subject to this marketing tactic.

Yes, it's an incredibly common tactic. Budweiser tries to convince you that their beer is different and better than Coors because they have really interesting looking horses and Americana attractive people have fun while drinking it. Coke and Pepsi. Etc. Some things are so ingrained in you from a lifetime of marketing that you don't even realize it. Like the reality is that Coke doesn't really taste good--certainly not enough to drink it all the time, and certainly not enough to differentiate it from other cola products. But people all over the world got accustomed to that particular taste and the psychology around it from all the ads and believe they like it (the sugar and caffeine reinforce it).

"Coca-Cola includes as an ingredient a coca leaf extract prepared by a Stepan Company plant in Maywood, New Jersey. The facility, which had been known as the Maywood Chemical Works, was purchased by Stepan in 1959. The plant is the only commercial entity in the USA authorized by the Drug Enforcement Administration to import coca leaves, which come primarily from Peru. Approximately 100 metric tons of dried coca leaf are imported each year. The cocaine-free leaves are sold to The Coca Cola Company, while the cocaine is sold to Mallinckrodt, a pharmaceutical firm, for medicinal purposes."
The coca leaf extract might also....

[nereo]

Seems time to dust off this thread;

MMM apparently bought a Leaf (not a Tesla), and one that was new (though rebated) at that.
https://twitter.com/mrmoneymustache/status/778990684086738944/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

[dandarc]

Seems time to dust off this thread;

MMM apparently bought a Leaf (not a Tesla), and one that was new (though rebated) at that.
https://twitter.com/mrmoneymustache/status/778990684086738944/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Gah.  Just when I was over jonesing for a leaf to replace my car MMM goes and buys one.  I think keeping my Sentra as long as possible is the smarter move financially, but I really want a Leaf.

[Fireball]

Seems time to dust off this thread;

MMM apparently bought a Leaf (not a Tesla), and one that was new (though rebated) at that.
https://twitter.com/mrmoneymustache/status/778990684086738944/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Gah.  Just when I was over jonesing for a leaf to replace my car MMM goes and buys one.  I think keeping my Sentra as long as possible is the smarter move financially, but I really want a Leaf.

You got it. Keeping that Sentra is the better move in almost every way.

[Shor]

What about the Volt? Fantastic car, can get a good price used, with the amount of diving he does/would do, 90% would but electric only but you have the gas assist for road trips. And it's an American car. American innovation - that's pretty badass too.

A good friend of mine has one.  To be honest, the tech in the car at least works.  Some very cool feature makes it approach worth it, for certain people.  I can afford one and passed, but for my friend it makes him very happy to have a car that pulls itself out of his tight garage with the push of a button, while he is inside.

I wouldn't 100% knock it unless you have tried it.

Very interesting perspective.
I too wouldn't get a Tesla. Even if I was worth millions, I still wouldn't get a Tesla 'just because'.

A large chunk of this forum is in the crowd of 'if I can afford it, then I'm going to go and buy it' or 'well this hobby is important, so I will spend extra here and cut back elsewhere'

To me, this new toy is... hmm how to say this, cool but not exciting. It's cool that they have these fancy new features and are innovating what cars can do for their owner. Automated driving, a full electric super highway, high speed/efficiency electric engine and battery capacitors. Tesla is definitely pushing the barrier forward on what we should expect out of future car models, and other areas.

But to me, that's where it ends. These are cool applications of technology, but there is so much more information and applicable use that we can get out of the tech we have.
I'm excited for the future not because the Tesla is so new and innovative as it is, but because there's so much further that we can go.

[libertarian4321]

Probably a Tesla Model 3?

[Metric Mouse]

Seems time to dust off this thread;

MMM apparently bought a Leaf (not a Tesla), and one that was new (though rebated) at that.
https://twitter.com/mrmoneymustache/status/778990684086738944/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

He bought a NEW car? Crazy...

[With This Herring]

Per that Twitter link you posted, it looks like there is still time for Alex321's prediction of a Tesla in two years to come true:

Mr. Money Mustache ‏@mrmoneymustache Sep 23
@kurtelia @timpierc Because Leaf is much cheaper,  plenty of range,  and hatchback. Plus I can always switch cars later if desired.

[nereo]

Per that Twitter link you posted, it looks like there is still time for Alex321's prediction of a Tesla in two years to come true:

Mr. Money Mustache ‏@mrmoneymustache Sep 23
@kurtelia @timpierc Because Leaf is much cheaper,  plenty of range,  and hatchback. Plus I can always switch cars later if desired.

This is true.  However, I'm willing now more than ever to double-down on my prediction that he won't buy a Tesla in the allotted time.
My guess is this new leaf will keep him happy for several years. I don't seem him able to upgrade to a Tesla without spending many thousands more, and I will have lost my faith in the man if he starts spending $15k+ every single year on another car.

[Gondolin]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

[nereo]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

What??  You're not seriosuly confusing a $90k Tesla with a $14k Leaf are you? They aren't even in the same ballpark. the only similarity they share is that they are both EVs.

[Cassie]

Your prediction was right on! It does not matter what type of new electric car he actually bought.

[MrMoogle]

I remember reading this thread back in April.  I had thought it said EV though, and had forgot it said Tesla.  I'm still pretty surprised he bought it.  I know he's a techy nerd, but still.  On the other hand, if this is all the lifestyle creep he does, that's pretty good considering how much NW he has.

[JLee]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

What??  You're not seriosuly confusing a $90k Tesla with a $14k Leaf are you? They aren't even in the same ballpark. the only similarity they share is that they are both EVs.

You do realize that the Model 3 is $35k, right?  Check the pre-incentive price on the Leaf, too.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

I wonder how much his blog influenced his decision between a Tesla and Nissan Leaf.  I get the impression he views the Leaf as more accessible to the general public (and more in-line with the blog's low cost ethos), but he certainly has the money for a Tesla (especially as a business expense, offsetting only a tiny taxable slice of the income), acknowledges Tesla as a superior product, and has more respect for Musk than for the faceless entity that is Nissan...  It's interesting to compare his Leaf post to The Oatmeal's Tesla post (http://theoatmeal.com/comics/tesla_model_s).

[nereo]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

What??  You're not seriosuly confusing a $90k Tesla with a $14k Leaf are you? They aren't even in the same ballpark. the only similarity they share is that they are both EVs.

You do realize that the Model 3 is $35k, right?  Check the pre-incentive price on the Leaf, too.

...and you realize that the Model 3 Tesla isn't even available, right (and won't be for another year at least...).  THe purchase price is what matters.  You can't compare a $14k Leaf purchase to a P85/P90 that go for $70k-100k.

[JLee]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

What??  You're not seriosuly confusing a $90k Tesla with a $14k Leaf are you? They aren't even in the same ballpark. the only similarity they share is that they are both EVs.

You do realize that the Model 3 is $35k, right?  Check the pre-incentive price on the Leaf, too.

...and you realize that the Model 3 Tesla isn't even available, right (and won't be for another year at least...).  THe purchase price is what matters.  You can't compare a $14k Leaf purchase to a P85/P90 that go for $70k-100k.

MMM Will Own a Tesla Within Two Years
« on: April 18, 2016, 07:39:24 AM »

I'd bet they'll be on the road before April 2018.

[nereo]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

What??  You're not seriosuly confusing a $90k Tesla with a $14k Leaf are you? They aren't even in the same ballpark. the only similarity they share is that they are both EVs.

You do realize that the Model 3 is $35k, right?  Check the pre-incentive price on the Leaf, too.

...and you realize that the Model 3 Tesla isn't even available, right (and won't be for another year at least...).  THe purchase price is what matters.  You can't compare a $14k Leaf purchase to a P85/P90 that go for $70k-100k.

MMM Will Own a Tesla Within Two Years
« on: April 18, 2016, 07:39:24 AM »

I'd bet they'll be on the road before April 2018.

The bet isn't whether Tesla will have the model 3 available before April 2018.  It's whether MMM will own one (or another Tesla) by then.  I still bet not, especially because he now has a new Leaf to play around with... Pete doesn't seem like the sort to swap something out for a loss less than 18 months later.

[EscapeVelocity2020]

But he missed out on an exciting opportunity to also research self-driving tech...  Ironically, I bet he would've received more attention to Tesla posts than Leaf posts and the extra business expense of a Tesla would've paid off (or put even less of a dent in his ongoing income surplus), and he would've been happier.  I really think MMM dropped the ball by not buying a Tesla (even if he had to do it at the 90k price point, acknowledging that a 35k option would be available in a year or two...).

[undercover]

By his own chart in his post, he should've went with a $70k Tesla since his NW is over $2M :) IMHO, this is a case of frugal vs cheap. He went cheap.

[nereo]

By his own chart in his post, he should've went with a $70k Tesla since his NW is over $2M :) IMHO, this is a case of frugal vs cheap. He went cheap.

Hmmm... I disagree.  The Tesla is more than he (or really anyone) needs.  Yes, he has the assets to pay for one and have it not impact his financial independence, but it wouldn't get him to his destination any faster, and in all likelihood it wouldn't increase his happiness much more than than having a Leaf would.

[MrMoogle]

By his own chart in his post, he should've went with a $70k Tesla since his NW is over $2M :) IMHO, this is a case of frugal vs cheap. He went cheap.

Hmmm... I disagree.  The Tesla is more than he (or really anyone) needs.  Yes, he has the assets to pay for one and have it not impact his financial independence, but it wouldn't get him to his destination any faster, and in all likelihood it wouldn't increase his happiness much more than than having a Leaf would.

I disagree too.  Which chart are you talking about?  If it's the cash flow one, a $70k Tesla would not be net positive.  I haven't looked into his data, but I'm surprised the Leaf was, although it's just barely. 

[EscapeVelocity2020]

Which chart are you talking about? 

(Figure 1 - Car Decision Chart) http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/car-decider3.jpg

[MrMoogle]

Ah, don't you start at the top and once you meet the first requirement, stop?  That would be step 3, Nissan Leaf.  Why would you keep going?

[EscapeVelocity2020]

I don't think MMM was applying the car chart to himself (or he would not have bought a car, or bought a Tesla once his NW crested 2M - according to the chart).  It would have been cool if he addressed whether he considered a Tesla.  He posted glowingly about the self driving and raves about Musk.

[nereo]

Ah, don't you start at the top and once you meet the first requirement, stop?  That would be step 3, Nissan Leaf.  Why would you keep going?

Yeah... I suspect that decision chart was a bit tongue-in-cheek... as is it's a pretty piss-poor decision tree.  There's no logical progression, no binary logic at all.  What if you are worth $2MM, retired and only need it to go on occasional road trips - do you get a Tesla, a Honda Fit or rent a car?

Hmm... maybe if I get bored I'll try making a better one...

[Alex321]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

lol. Thanks, Gondolin.

I was wrong on the make, but correct in the larger sense that MMM is finding the lifestyle that he preaches rather boring. So he couches it in things like "promoting a new technology," but basically it boils down to the fact that he's a car and tech guy at heart, and he didn't want to spend the next 15 years driving the same Scion, even though that makes more sense in terms of frugality and "badassity."

[TomTX]

Don't be surprised if Tesla comes out of the woodwork and "gives him" one, I am pretty sure he wrote the article with that intent anyway.

Tesla doesn't give cars to anyone. Tesla doesn't discount (new) cars for anyone. Everyone pays the same price.  No special deals for prominent bloggers or celebrities. Even Elon Musk pays full price when he buys a new Tesla.

[Metric Mouse]

Don't be surprised if Tesla comes out of the woodwork and "gives him" one, I am pretty sure he wrote the article with that intent anyway.

Tesla doesn't give cars to anyone. Tesla doesn't discount (new) cars for anyone. Everyone pays the same price.  No special deals for prominent bloggers or celebrities. Even Elon Musk pays full price when he buys a new Tesla.

Not even the LAPD catches a break.

[arebelspy]

Here to congratulate OP on his prescient prediction. You can quibble that it's not a Tesla bit really, OP was spot on.

lol. Thanks, Gondolin.

I was wrong on the make, but correct in the larger sense that MMM is finding the lifestyle that he preaches rather boring. So he couches it in things like "promoting a new technology," but basically it boils down to the fact that he's a car and tech guy at heart, and he didn't want to spend the next 15 years driving the same Scion, even though that makes more sense in terms of frugality and "badassity."

You may be right.  It was a disappointing change.  The bulk of his life hasn't changed, though, and given his 400k+ annual income from the blog, keeping everything the same except for a car upgrade is still pretty impressive, IMO.

How many people out there wouldn't change their lifestyle (save for a single luxury purchase) if they're suddenly making a half a million a year?

Very, very, very few.  Still seems pretty Mustachian to me, when I think about it that way.

[Cassie]

I have no problem with the purchase. I also don't think it dilutes his message which is to spend $ on things that you value. At this point in his life he wanted the car.  Spending within your means is an old fashioned idea that has fallen out of favor and as a result people are finding themselves in massive debt. Saving $ for retirement is an excellent idea and our country is at an all time low for having savings.  I also love that he questions working until 65. We all have choices and he makes those choices real instead of spending like crazy and working at jobs that people may hate.

[Metric Mouse]

I have no problem with the purchase. I also don't think it dilutes his message which is to spend $ on things that you value. At this point in his life he wanted the car.  Spending within your means is an old fashioned idea that has fallen out of favor and as a result people are finding themselves in massive debt. Saving $ for retirement is an excellent idea and our country is at an all time low for having savings.  I also love that he questions working until 65. We all have choices and he makes those choices real instead of spending like crazy and working at jobs that people may hate.

I think the fact that he would value a new car would show a lot about him.  No one's too perfect for a facepunch! 

[Cassie]

Everyone should have at least the experience of one new car in their lifetime:))

[srob]

I think that he still showed incredible restraint buying the leaf. Wasn't it only 13k or something after rebates/incentives/credits? I don't think it represented a change in his mantra at all. I remember him hinting a long time ago that a tesla might be a worthy purchase if you can afford it, in part to support the mission of electric cars. I paid more than that for my used camry this year, and I don't have near the passive income that he does, and I have a whole bunch more mouths to feed. If I were in his shoes, it would have been very tempting to get the tesla.

[With This Herring]

Everyone should have at least the experience of one new car in their lifetime:))

I have.  I drove a rental for two days, HATED IT, and was glad to find a replacement old car quickly.  No more new cars for me!  :)