Author Topic: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery  (Read 1921 times)

webguy

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Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« on: February 23, 2023, 07:26:22 AM »
I recently fired and have been dedicating a lot of my time to focusing on my health and fitness. I’d really like to learn more about nutrition and recovery on a more advanced level and as mustachians are an active and health conscious bunch I was wondering if anyone had any good resources they could recommend.

I already have a decent understanding of nutrition and have a balanced diet, but looking to learn more about optimizing macros for performance and recovery and things that professional athletes do to perform and recover optimally between playing.

For context, I’m 37 and lift 3 times a week, run twice a week, and play basketball, soccer, and pickleball. Im looking to optimize my nutrition and recovery so that I can play sports at an optimal level, so am specifically interested in nutrition and recovery from the perspective of someone who plays sports, not just lifts weights.

Any one got any recommendations? Books, courses, videos, etc? Thanks so much in advance!

Davnasty

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2023, 07:37:55 AM »
The first thing that comes to mind is the Huberman Lab podcast. MMM recently wrote a post about it.

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2022/09/30/lessons-from-the-badass-muscular-neurobiologist/

I'm currently listening to his guest series with Dr. Andy Galpin who works with lots of professional athletes. It's a six part series; you'd probably be interested in all of it but episodes 5 and 6 focus specifically on recovery and nutrition.

https://hubermanlab.com/guest-series-dr-andy-galpin-maximize-recovery-to-achieve-fitness-and-performance-goals/

https://hubermanlab.com/dr-andy-galpin-optimal-nutrition-and-supplementation-for-fitness/
« Last Edit: February 23, 2023, 07:39:55 AM by Davnasty »

Metalcat

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2023, 08:05:41 AM »
Just curious, why the need to optimize for performance? Are you looking to get into serious competitive sports?

It's extremely easy and cheap to optimize for overall general health, but it's extremely difficult and expensive to optimize for peak athletic performance.

I'm just wondering what's motivating the need to get so granular?

Also what is the specific goal? Because when you get that granular, you need to be specific in order to get the most effective advice.

Paper Chaser

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2023, 08:17:40 AM »
Keep lifting to support aging joints.
Stay as flexible as you can to avoid injury.
Eat balanced, nutritious food and stay hydrated.
Sleep a ton.

That's the gist of it without getting into crazy gimmicky things or expensive equipment.

Metalcat

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2023, 08:28:11 AM »
Keep lifting to support aging joints.
Stay as flexible as you can to avoid injury.
Eat balanced, nutritious food and stay hydrated.
Sleep a ton.

That's the gist of it without getting into crazy gimmicky things or expensive equipment.

That's the gist of general health, but not professional athlete level performance. Which is why I asked OP why they're aiming for that level of performance.

That level of performance as you age comes with astronomical risk of injury.

Ultra high performance does not equal optimal health. That's why the goal has to be clear.

My 50 year old husband is in optimal health and is ripped and strong as fuck, but his specific athletic performance at everything in terms of competitive ability is mediocre at best.

He's a reasonably fast runner, a reasonably fast swimmer, an okay basketball player, a reasonably skilled snowboarder, a low skilled martial artist, a mid skilled yoga and Pilates participant, a moderately skilled mountain biker, a low skill tennis player, and plateau'd with weight lifting a long time ago.

He'll be the guy who is fit and active at 80. Meanwhile his ultra high performance athlete friend who was a national champion in his sport is now 60 and obese due to blown out spine and knees and a nasty opioid habit.

I've known a lot of athletes and most of them systematically scale down their level of performance as they age.

But if someone wants to spend their retirement becoming a champion martial artist or competitive cyclist and wants to give those youngins a run for their money and is willing to take the risk of damage, then hey, all the power to them.

I know a few of those folks too who are hanging in running marathons in their 70s and somehow their joints are holding up.

But that's why it's important to have specific goals and understand the specific trade offs and risks of those goals and act accordingly.

webguy

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2023, 06:40:54 AM »
The first thing that comes to mind is the Huberman Lab podcast. MMM recently wrote a post about it.

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2022/09/30/lessons-from-the-badass-muscular-neurobiologist/

I'm currently listening to his guest series with Dr. Andy Galpin who works with lots of professional athletes. It's a six part series; you'd probably be interested in all of it but episodes 5 and 6 focus specifically on recovery and nutrition.

https://hubermanlab.com/guest-series-dr-andy-galpin-maximize-recovery-to-achieve-fitness-and-performance-goals/

https://hubermanlab.com/dr-andy-galpin-optimal-nutrition-and-supplementation-for-fitness/

This is awesome - thanks so much. I started listening to the series yesterday and it’s really good so far. I really appreciate you sharing the resource!

webguy

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2023, 06:46:10 AM »
Just curious, why the need to optimize for performance? Are you looking to get into serious competitive sports?

It's extremely easy and cheap to optimize for overall general health, but it's extremely difficult and expensive to optimize for peak athletic performance.

I'm just wondering what's motivating the need to get so granular?

Also what is the specific goal? Because when you get that granular, you need to be specific in order to get the most effective advice.

Thanks for the question! The main reason I train is to be able to perform better in the sports I play, so I guess the question is why wouldn’t I want to optimize for performance and recovery? That way I can perform at my best when I’m playing and recover quicker after training/playing for the next time. Just looking to learn more about nutrition and recovery especially to see what else I can add to what I’m already doing.

Metalcat

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2023, 06:53:25 AM »
Just curious, why the need to optimize for performance? Are you looking to get into serious competitive sports?

It's extremely easy and cheap to optimize for overall general health, but it's extremely difficult and expensive to optimize for peak athletic performance.

I'm just wondering what's motivating the need to get so granular?

Also what is the specific goal? Because when you get that granular, you need to be specific in order to get the most effective advice.

Thanks for the question! The main reason I train is to be able to perform better in the sports I play, so I guess the question is why wouldn’t I want to optimize for performance and recovery? That way I can perform at my best when I’m playing and recover quicker after training/playing for the next time. Just looking to learn more about nutrition and recovery especially to see what else I can add to what I’m already doing.

I was asking because nutrition for performance can get extremely complex and expensive depending on what your specific goals are.

Since it's a frugality site, we aim to hit the right balance of spending and benefit. You can easily fall down an expensive rabbit hole of nutrition and supplement optimization. So knowing specific goals helps tailor the advice.

You've been given really good resources already though for what it sounds like you are looking for.

sjlp

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2023, 09:21:01 AM »
Good for you for taking this time to improve your health! I liked the Plant-Based Athlete book for understanding the difference between fueling for different types of sports and activities. It's for vegans though the principles apply even if you eat other foods. He also has a website and blog. I think for an age group athlete it is definitely possible to optimize your nutrition with real foods and without getting drawn into all the supplements and snake oil. I also like the courses from NASM but they cost money and likely the information is out there for free or lower cost.

Extramedium

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2023, 10:48:25 AM »
Some other good sources based on evidence, discussing both high level performance and general health and longevity are Layne Norton’s podcast “The Beauty and the Geek”, and Peter Attila’s “The Drive”.  The latter largely concentrated on increasing both life- and health-span.

I totally get the idea of trying out your sport-specific athletic capabilities.  Sounds like a fun project!

Metalcat

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2023, 10:53:51 AM »
Some other good sources based on evidence, discussing both high level performance and general health and longevity are Layne Norton’s podcast “The Beauty and the Geek”, and Peter Attila’s “The Drive”.  The latter largely concentrated on increasing both life- and health-span.

I totally get the idea of trying out your sport-specific athletic capabilities.  Sounds like a fun project!

Attila gets into some pretty nonsense stuff, IMO, but he's got a lot of decent info.

slappy

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2023, 01:12:14 PM »
Mind Pump is a good podcast for fitness.

NorthernIkigai

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #12 on: May 09, 2025, 03:28:11 AM »
Someone here recommended the ZOE podcast a couple of years ago. I'm still listening to it! Its main focus is on food but they also have a lot of episodes on training, from different points of view and for different phases of life. I love how they always look into the scientific basis of things, and also are very clear when there is no or scant evidence for various health claims.

I also find Michael Greger's books great, and comparing their nitty-gritty focused detail with the slightly more what-can-a-normal-person-do viewpoint of ZOE is very interesting.

GuitarStv

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Re: Learning about sports nutrition and recovery
« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2025, 07:57:41 AM »
I've been involved in various sports (some competitive) for quite a while now.  I've always been interested in nutrition and recovery for this reason.  Honestly, the field is not really well understood and there is a lot of conflicting advice that you'll run across.  The sport you're trying to optimize for (or more correctly the activities you're performing) will also change the type of recovery that works best.  Training and recovery for a long distance cycling event is very different from training and recovery from competing in a Jiu Jitsu tournament.  And both are different from doing a power lifting event.  I also have a strong suspicion that different genetic backgrounds will have some impact in what types of foods help you the most and the correct amount of sleep.

A few universals that seem to hold though:
- Sleep is the greatest performance enhancing drug.  The more that I sleep, the better I retain newly learned skills, the faster I recover from injury, the better my concentration is.
- Healthy eating habits (lots of fruits/veggies, some lean meats, complex carbs, not too much sugar or salt) will improve and maintain performance better than any other fad diet.  Avoid heavily processed foods as a general rule.
- Alcohol is bad for you.  It messes with your sleep, slows your recovery, and serves no benefit.
- Don't get fat.  If you gain a significant amount of fat (like 40+ lbs over your lean weight), you can make these fat cells shrink and lost much of the weight . . . but the fat cells will be hanging around with you for the rest of your life.  They never actually go away.  In many cases, you'll have jiggly bits around the midsection no matter what exercise/diet you follow so you've got to make peace with that.  In many sports, this will prevent you from reaching the highest levels.
- Age matters (a lot).  Regardless of what you do, your ability to recover worsens as you age.  You sleep worse with age, which impacts recovery but it's deeper than that.  Your body just stops doing things as well - it doesn't build muscle as easily (hormonal changes), and soreness will last for longer.  Temper your expectations as you age or be ready for disappointment.  That said, you can maintain a high level of athletic ability much more easily than gaining it from scratch . . . so by continuing to be active you can fight off many of the negatives that people tend to associate with aging.
- Supplementation is a pretty big field of bullshit with a few exceptions.  Protein powder helps for recovery, muscle building, and to prevent muscle loss when cutting weight.  Creatine seems to have benefits for many sports - increasing power endurance, enhancing sleep, having a protective effect from concussions, improving cognitive function, etc.  Caffeine can also help especially with endurance sports if used as performance enhancer and not as a daily thing you're addicted to.  Beet root juice probably gives a small improvement to endurance.  I guess hormonal stuff with 'roids as well, but the knock on negative effects have never made this an appealing option in my mind.
- Hydration is important.  But people seem to overly focus on this.  It's only really an issue if you're exercising heavily for a couple hours (maybe just more than an hour in very warm conditions).  Again, this is a thing where I think you've got to figure out what works for you personally.  Weigh yourself before and after exercise to get an idea how much you need to rehydrate.  You also need to figure out how much liquid you can drink during your sport to avoid that horrible sloshing feeling in your stomach.  I'll easily kill three liters of weak gatorade on a five hour bike ride in the middle of the summer and then have lost seven or eight lbs when I get home.  For a two hour session of rolling in jiu-jitsu I might drink two liters of water, but I find I don't seem to benefit from electrolytes or sugar like on the bike (maybe because of the explosive start/stop nature of the activity vs the constant low drain from cycling?).
« Last Edit: May 09, 2025, 08:09:16 AM by GuitarStv »