Author Topic: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?  (Read 4406 times)

Fishindude

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #50 on: September 08, 2021, 08:34:06 AM »
Your little burn barrel isn't gonna matter in the grand scheme, but from a CO2 perspective, if you care about global warming, it is far far better to put that stuff in the ground than to put it in the atmosphere. 

Ironically, one of the best things we can do for the environment is to keep growing trees for cutting them down to make stuff, and then growing more.   That systems fails if you burn the stuff you made from them, releasing the carbon back into the atmosphere, whereas if you bury it, that keeps it out of the system.

In my defense, I've planted over 40,000 trees on our place.

jpdx

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #51 on: September 08, 2021, 12:54:35 PM »
Here's info for the Portland, Oregon metro area:

https://www.oregonmetro.gov/tools-living/garbage-and-recycling/recycling-whats-happening

It says "Nearly all of the items that belong in your recycling bin at home or at work in the greater Portland area are getting recycled."

chemistk

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #52 on: September 08, 2021, 01:27:27 PM »
I was curious, I took a look at our area's numbers, for 2020 (didn't bother looking at earlier years) approximately 44% (261k tons) of the total tonnage of waste material was sorted as recycling. Only 4% of the total tonnage went to landfill while the remainder was sent to the county WTE facility.

However, the county transfer station actually doesn't process the recyclables, but instead sorts them (if possible) and then sells them to one of a handful of local recycling centers. I looked at each's website but they're all fairly bare-bones websites and don't publish easily accessible reports. At least two of them do have a dedicated sorting and disposition facility and I think I've heard of a third's site actually processing recyclables.

After that, I have no idea where those facilities sell it to. It's definitely not going to landfill in the county, as only the county WMA has access to the landfill, none of the individual haulers do. I suspect that non-sortable and/or compromised stuff goes back to the WTE stream - that facility actually brings in a net positive revenue for the county (last year's surplus was something close to $1mm), as it handles waste from neighboring counties too. Given that, it also would make sense that the recyclers are not selling it back to the county because they'd be selling everything for WTE as a loss.

Since this supply chain exists, I would be inclined to say that the output from the local recyclers is actually used as intended but capitalism also creates some weird incentives so it's not completely impossible to think that it ends up in a landfill in another state. Still, that's highly unlikely. 

The Guru

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #53 on: September 10, 2021, 06:27:52 AM »
this thread has got me thinking about my own community's recycling program:

I know that aluminum gets recycled since it never makes it to the bin; I collect it separately (along with cans from work) and sell it. Which I guess deprives the program of its best moneymaker.

The township where live collects glass but the city nearby doesn't. Interestingly I've seen glass recycling bins pop up- even in the township. Maybe I should take the glass there- there's a collection site literally on my way to work. It would seem to be a better certainty that it is in fact being recycled-presumably  no private concern is going to the effort to collect anything just to throw it out.

Then there's paper. The township collects paper larger than a certain size. Since I shred the rest and add it to my compost bin maybe I should just discard all paper that way. The garden could sure use the organic material.

Car Jack

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #54 on: September 10, 2021, 06:52:25 AM »
Our town is covered by a "for profit" company who does general trash and separate, single stream recycling.  I've toured their facility, which is only a mile from my house and they do, indeed sell everything they can.  They tell me that the Chinese change in % pure has dropped them out of the buying market but India will take anything.  They simply pay less.

Personally, I keep steel and aluminum and when I have enough, go to the scrapyard and actually get cash.  I have a small trailer and load up with steel...mostly desktop cases as I eScrap for profit and fun.  (fun for me) 

As for plastics, I've watched a number of videos and learned that the little recycling symbol started as a way to identify what each plastic material was.  That's all well and good, but not all numbers can be recycled and many can only be burned.  We do have a trash burning facility maybe 15 miles away and they generate electricity, but of course it's very inefficient as they have to add a lot of natural gas.  In any case, on the plastic side, there were early proposals to change the little recycle triangle so only materials that are actually recyclable get it and the plastics industry opposed this and eventually got their way.  The strategy was that consumers don't look at the number and know whether or not it's recyclable.  They see the triangle and feel like it must be fine to throw into the recycling bin.  You really need to know what numbers recycle and which don't.

Another fun fact......there's actually nothing wrong with landfills and a lot of trash really should go into them.  Modern landfills are properly designed with methane catching pipework installed in layers as trash and dirt are filled.  What's done with the methane...I don't know.  It's not a great heating gas, but I do know that some landfills in my state do use it for things like highway department garages.....along with waste oil heaters.  The last glass recycling facility in my state closed.  One point made was that glass isn't far removed from sand.  So simply putting it into a landfill really isn't a bad thing.  Heck.....half of Boston is built on landfill and is full of glass and pottery.  Dig into Back Bay and you end up with tons of colonial era trash.

I'm a big proponent of reusing.  I worked decades ago as a volunteer at the town's voluntary recycling center before curbside was being done.  Half of trash generated is paper.  Paper does have a market.  No, it doesn't pay much, but it's better than just throwing it out.  For the town, getting paper out of the trash stream saved on tipping charges as the town had no landfill and shipped trash a half hour away on the interstate.  These days, when grocery shopping, I bring my own paper bags and since these days, paper bags are wicked thin, I triple or even quadruple the bags so they can actually hold the bottles of soda or cans of vegetables without breaking.  I reuse them till they're hopelessly ripped and then use those to line other bags for my paper recycling which I bring to the recycling center on the weekend.  In the winter, I use a wood fired furnace to heat the house, so the paper bag becomes an "anything burnable" bag which I use to get the furnace going in the morning.  Bag of paper....bag of twigs and sticks....small wood kindling and light it off.  The saving of heating oil is pretty dramatic.  We have oil for backup heat and for water heating.

Fishindude

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #55 on: September 10, 2021, 07:29:34 AM »
Another fun fact......there's actually nothing wrong with landfills and a lot of trash really should go into them.  Modern landfills are properly designed with methane catching pipework installed in layers as trash and dirt are filled.  What's done with the methane...I don't know.  It's not a great heating gas, but I do know that some landfills in my state do use it for things like highway department garages.....along with waste oil heaters.  The last glass recycling facility in my state closed.  One point made was that glass isn't far removed from sand.  So simply putting it into a landfill really isn't a bad thing.  Heck.....half of Boston is built on landfill and is full of glass and pottery.  Dig into Back Bay and you end up with tons of colonial era trash.

All of the landfills in this area extract the methane and pipe it to a building powering 3-4 very large Caterpillar engines and electrical generators.   The electricity goes out on the grid and I assume it's an income stream for these companies.

AMandM

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #56 on: September 10, 2021, 11:21:19 AM »
My county has a fancy materials sorting facility, where single-stream recycling is sorted into steel, cardboard, paper, aluminum, and plastic. Until Covid hit, they offered public tours. Now they have a video showing the sorting processes and bales of sorted materials, but it's not totally clear how much of the bales get sold.

Gone Fishing

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #57 on: September 11, 2021, 09:19:03 AM »
Dropped off recycling this morning and someone has taken the time to make up illustrated sorting directions.  Leads me to believe they are at least trying to make saleable loads.

slackmax

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #58 on: September 16, 2021, 08:08:07 AM »
 Where I live, they force you to pay $17 per quarter for curbside recycling on your city water bill,
 and you have to  pay again for trash pickup (private).  I wonder where all the dirty plastic
stuff goes. People toss all sorts of junk into the curbside recycling bins.

They also have a free recycling site where you can dump stuff. 

I have never seen a report on what happens to it all, around here. Would be interesting.

Retire-Canada

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #59 on: September 16, 2021, 08:24:06 AM »
I have never seen a report on what happens to it all, around here. Would be interesting.

When I was commenting up thread I did a quick Google search and found a bunch of useful information about the results of our recycling program.

Plina

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #60 on: September 18, 2021, 12:14:15 AM »
I'm generally opposed to any and all new regs or laws, but I could get behind some legislation that would start targeting all of this waste and litter.
Package as many liquids as possible in aluminum or steel
More reusable, re-fillable multi-use containers
Eliminate all of the bags, paper and plastic when eating indoors at any restaurant (washable dishes)
All soda and beer bottles returnable, reusable

I keep about a half mile of road by our placed cleaned up and 90% of the litter is fast food or empty beer or booze containers

I agree with all of this. The only solution I can really see working is to make the manufacturers and buyers of packaging materials responsible for the cost of their collection and disposal/recycling.

As a consumer, I'd also really appreciate if the packaging waste were included in the item's specs so I could know ahead of time whether it was going to generate a waste issue for me. For example, this summer I bought a filing cabinet from Ikea and a closet organizer from a US company. They were very similar, flat packed, particle board products. However, the Ikea one had minimal packaging that was easily recycled curbside. The US product was packed with an excessive amount of plastic and styrofoam. If I'd know that ahead of time, I probably would've picked a different item.

In fact, I've noticed this trend with other items as well. My German brand vaccuum came with a tiny amount of packaging that was easily recycled, whereas US branded items default to massive amounts of styrofoam packaging. I strongly suspect, Europe has stricter waste regulations that motivate manufacturers to simply minimize the amount of packaging when they design their products.

A lot of manufacturers have a responsibility for the end of life of their products. The package producers as well as some electronics. The responsibility of producers are constantly extended in the EU. Textile is coming up. There has been built a textile storting facility last year in Sweden. The plastic recycling industry has also opened a major recycling facility this year. Generally, the recycling of plastics are troublesome.

moneypitfeeder

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Re: Is Your Recycling Program Legit?
« Reply #61 on: September 21, 2021, 04:35:54 PM »
In all of the cases I'm aware of these bins are placed around the county so they can claim to have a recycling program, making them eligible for grants, etc.   The truth is, those dumpsters go straight to the landfill and the stuff is dumped and buried with all of the rest of the solid waste.   There is no viable market for these "recyclable" materials, so they don't sort them or do anything with the material.

Do you have any advice on how to tell what your area is doing? Our city has the "single bin" for recyclables too, and I've often wondered how much actually does get processed. In our area we did have to go to only several locations in the city for glass pickup and not curbside, since the broken glass was apparently causing a problem for the rest of the sorting line.