Is it possible for someone on FiRE to collect the Fed's $600/week unemployment?

[FIREin2018]

if you FiREd, that means you voluntarily stopped working.
that also means you can't collect state unemployment.

But how about the Federal supplemental $600/week?

[MoseyingAlong]

What I've read is that you need to qualify for some state UI to qualify for the Fed supplement. It's not a stand alone payment.

[Catica]

if you FiREd, that means you voluntarily stopped working.
that also means you can't collect state unemployment.

But how about the Federal supplemental $600/week?

It's only for those who get unemployment benefits

[pressure9pa]

What I've read is that you need to qualify for some state UI to qualify for the Fed supplement. It's not a stand alone payment.

Correct.  The Feds are supplementing the states.  The rules of the individual states which vary quite a bit still generally apply. 

[nereo]

if you FiREd, that means you voluntarily stopped working.

The above statement is not necessarily true.  Many start their retirement reluctantly via job-loss, and only embrace it once they've been unable to return to work for a while and/or discover they CAN be retired.

Ergo, the rest of your assumptions depend on the above.

If you lost your job and are searching/available for work, then you can (generally) claim unemployment.  If you have no intention of going back to work, then you (generally) cannot.

[Alternatepriorities]

It seems like there are quite a few Mustachians (including MMM) who are FIRE and have hobby that make enough money that it's actually a business and they are ... Normally self employed people can't file for UI because we don't pay into it, but Alaska has waived that requirement for the time being. I still have work for now, but I've helped a few others here who don't.

Whether or not a FI person should apply for UI is another debate, and one for which i have less answers. I don't like the idea of punishing the financially responsible, but I also don't think miserly millionaires should be picking up free food from the pantry.

[dresden]

I don't like the idea of punishing the financially responsible, but I also don't think miserly millionaires should be picking up free food from the pantry.

love this quote!

[Alternatepriorities]

I don't like the idea of punishing the financially responsible, but I also don't think miserly millionaires should be picking up free food from the pantry.

love this quote!

Thanks!

You don't happen to have any wisdom on where the line is?

[effigy98]

You qualify if you had job income. Gig work is an easy one. I plan on using unemployment to retire and drag it out untill SS kicks in when my company does layoffs. There are ways to work 3 months each year and reset the clock to stay on unemployment for decades.

[bacchi]

I don't like the idea of punishing the financially responsible, but I also don't think miserly millionaires should be picking up free food from the pantry.

love this quote!

Thanks!

You don't happen to have any wisdom on where the line is?

Comfort level?

If you're lean FIRE and the current market scares you, then take it. Your hobby money helps you sleep at night and avoid SORR.

If you're not bothered by the market drop and you're flush with cash and liquid assets, then don't take it. SORR is always out there but you've got years to worry about it.

[Alternatepriorities]

That sounds like mitigating SORR in lean FIRE by privatizing profits and socializing the risk. I'm currently not morally comfortable with planning on that. Given what a disorganized mess the benefit programs have been the past month I definitely couldn't recommend depending on it. 

[bacchi]

That sounds like mitigating SORR in lean FIRE by privatizing profits and socializing the risk. I'm currently not morally comfortable with planning on that. Given what a disorganized mess the benefit programs have been the past month I definitely couldn't recommend depending on it.

Given the circumstances, lean FIRE adherents might actually need the money now. At least one blogger has admitted their lean ex-pat lifestyle collapsed with the restrictions.

[Alternatepriorities]

That sounds like mitigating SORR in lean FIRE by privatizing profits and socializing the risk. I'm currently not morally comfortable with planning on that. Given what a disorganized mess the benefit programs have been the past month I definitely couldn't recommend depending on it.

Given the circumstances, lean FIRE adherents might actually need the money now. At least one blogger has admitted their lean ex-pat lifestyle collapsed with the restrictions.

That begs the question if a FIRE that lean is a moral hazard. Lean FIRE is a calculated risk and anyone who can do math well enough to achieve FIRE knows it. I get uncomfortable when that calculation includes assuming the poor consumer suckas who are still working will bail us out if we miscalculated.

[Padonak]

That sounds like mitigating SORR in lean FIRE by privatizing profits and socializing the risk. I'm currently not morally comfortable with planning on that. Given what a disorganized mess the benefit programs have been the past month I definitely couldn't recommend depending on it.

Given the circumstances, lean FIRE adherents might actually need the money now. At least one blogger has admitted their lean ex-pat lifestyle collapsed with the restrictions.

Who's that?

[bacchi]

That sounds like mitigating SORR in lean FIRE by privatizing profits and socializing the risk. I'm currently not morally comfortable with planning on that. Given what a disorganized mess the benefit programs have been the past month I definitely couldn't recommend depending on it.

Given the circumstances, lean FIRE adherents might actually need the money now. At least one blogger has admitted their lean ex-pat lifestyle collapsed with the restrictions.

That begs the question if a FIRE that lean is a moral hazard. Lean FIRE is a calculated risk and anyone who can do math well enough to achieve FIRE knows it. I get uncomfortable when that calculation includes assuming the poor consumer suckas who are still working will bail us out if we miscalculated.

Eh, anyone who doesn't have enough to cover their expenses for 6 months is living a financial life that's morally hazardous. I.e., probably a majority of Americans. We could drastically reduce unemployment benefits if we put that qualifier on approval.

But we don't. It's based on whether someone was working and now is not. That's it. Whether they spend their money on booze and blow or food and rent doesn't matter. They could use it to pay Netflix before the rent and that's their choice.

To put it another way, it's called unemployment insurance for a reason.

[bacchi]

Given the circumstances, lean FIRE adherents might actually need the money now. At least one blogger has admitted their lean ex-pat lifestyle collapsed with the restrictions.

Who's that?

I don't remember where I read that so...discount it. It's entirely possible I made it up.

But it may have come from the NYT article a few weeks about FIRE.

Earlier this month, Eric Richard was in Bali, Indonesia, enjoying the tropical weather and carefree life of a retiree. Last summer, at 29, Mr. Richard had quit his job as a corporate operations manager to become a “digital nomad.”

Now he is hunkered down at his parents’ house in Michigan, having returned to the United States as concerns over the coronavirus outbreak grew and travel bans were put in place around the world. He is in self-isolation as a precaution. And in recent weeks, he said, he has seen his net worth drop by more than $100,000.
[...]
Not only did he retire less than a year ago, but he also practices “lean FIRE” — generally defined as a net worth of between $500,000 and $1 million (as opposed to the $1 million and greater many accumulate before “firing”).

And with the current travel restrictions, Mr. Richard and others can’t live in a cheap foreign country, a common FIRE tactic known as “geographic arbitrage.”
[...]

Not a blogger.

[Boll weevil]

I don't like the idea of punishing the financially responsible, but I also don't think miserly millionaires should be picking up free food from the pantry.

love this quote!

Thanks!

You don't happen to have any wisdom on where the line is?

For me, currently somewhere less than $600/week.

The company I work for has cut us to 4 days a week and is working with the state to get us prorated unemployment (1/5 the weekly benefit). The only thing we have to do is register a bank account if we want direct deposit. All the other paperwork is taken care of.

If the prorated state unemployment was the only money at stake, I’d have opted out by now. But we’ve been told we’re eligible for the $600/week from the feds.

Down the one path are my principles. On the other is $600/week, the knowledge that a principled stand on my part would make zero difference to the ~$3T deficit (after CARES Act; would probably have been $1T+ even without the pandemic) or the $23T debt. My employer is working with the state to get me on the second path. Inertia, you’ve won for now.

[Alternatepriorities]

That sounds like mitigating SORR in lean FIRE by privatizing profits and socializing the risk. I'm currently not morally comfortable with planning on that. Given what a disorganized mess the benefit programs have been the past month I definitely couldn't recommend depending on it.

Given the circumstances, lean FIRE adherents might actually need the money now. At least one blogger has admitted their lean ex-pat lifestyle collapsed with the restrictions.

That begs the question if a FIRE that lean is a moral hazard. Lean FIRE is a calculated risk and anyone who can do math well enough to achieve FIRE knows it. I get uncomfortable when that calculation includes assuming the poor consumer suckas who are still working will bail us out if we miscalculated.

Eh, anyone who doesn't have enough to cover their expenses for 6 months is living a financial life that's morally hazardous. I.e., probably a majority of Americans. We could drastically reduce unemployment benefits if we put that qualifier on approval.

But we don't. It's based on whether someone was working and now is not. That's it. Whether they spend their money on booze and blow or food and rent doesn't matter. They could use it to pay Netflix before the rent and that's their choice.

To put it another way, it's called unemployment insurance for a reason.

I guess I could see drawing the line between people who planned to work some (barista FIRE) and people who just think more money would be nice. And even in the later case, they are pretty much throwing money out of helicopters so why not pick some of it up... I just wonder where that logic will lead our society after a couple more debt fueled cycles.

[FIREin2018]

You don't happen to have any wisdom on where the line is?

For me, currently somewhere less than $600/week.

The company I work for has cut us to 4 days a week and is working with the state to get us prorated unemployment (1/5 the weekly benefit). The only thing we have to do is register a bank account if we want direct deposit. All the other paperwork is taken care of.

If the prorated state unemployment was the only money at stake, I’d have opted out by now. But we’ve been told we’re eligible for the $600/week from the feds.

Down the one path are my principles. On the other is $600/week, the knowledge that a principled stand on my part would make zero difference to the ~$3T deficit (after CARES Act; would probably have been $1T+ even without the pandemic) or the $23T debt. My employer is working with the state to get me on the second path. Inertia, you’ve won for now.

wait.. even if you get partial state unemployment and still work 4days/week, you get the full $600/week from the Feds?!?!

thats a no brainer.. TAKE IT!!!

wished I was laid off late last year to take advantage of the Fed's $600/week offer.
I was laid off late 2018 and decided to FiRE back then :(

[Linea_Norway]

I am living in another country and voluntarily quit working this year. I just got confirmed I can get about €600 a week from June. For 104 weeks in total and I have to do some documentation every other week.
This amount will easily cover our housing expenses for that period. According to DH I shouldn't feel guilty about it, as I have never been on governmental support and only ever paid taxes.

[Laura Ingalls]

Sure have a part-time post retirement job and get laid off or furloughed from it.

[Padonak]

I am living in another country and voluntarily quit working this year. I just got confirmed I can get about €600 a week from June. For 104 weeks in total and I have to do some documentation every other week.
This amount will easily cover our housing expenses for that period. According to DH I shouldn't feel guilty about it, as I have never been on governmental support and only ever paid taxes.

Yeah definitely go for it. Just like many responsible mustachians, I'm pretty sure you and your family have paid the government many times more than you can possibly get back even if you apply for each and every benefit you may be entitled to.