Author Topic: In praise of video game consoles  (Read 2088 times)

obstinate

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In praise of video game consoles
« on: May 27, 2020, 08:59:07 AM »
I know that video games are not a particularly Mustachian habit. I should be chopping down trees or gardening or improving my home or something else like that. But, I find that despite this knowledge, I really enjoy playing games. So naturally the question occurs: how to do it most efficiently, with respect to Mustachianism? Maybe this could be relevant to you, or if you have kids who game, you can advise them using this information. Using this knowledge, it's actually feasible for kids to game under their own steam on an allowance or chore money.

For the longest time, I have been a PC gamer, but recently I started playing games on my PS4, and I have to say that the level of efficiency that can be achieved on a console is almost absurd. Game consoles allow the purchase and resale of used games, which means if you're willing to wait a month or two after a game comes out, you can basically pay nothing to play it. You just buy the game and resell it when you are done with it. Moreover, consoles seem to hold their value very well. I was looking online for a Playstation 4 to buy for my brother, thinking I could get something cheap to send to him. But it turns out there was nothing available for less than $200, and most systems were going for closer to $300. For your reference, the console launched priced at $400 eight years ago. I imagine after the PS5 comes out there will be a glut of used consoles on the market, but even with that, working Playstation 3 consoles are selling for $100 on Ebay today, fifteen years after it first came out.

So here's the plan:

  • Buy a new console near launch for $400-500.
  • Buy used games 1-2 mo after launch.
  • Sell games after you're done with them for nearly the same price you bought them for.
  • Buy new console eight years later.
  • Sell old console for ~$100.

Under this regime, a Mustachian gamer can game on consoles for approximately $50/year, plus Ebay fees for games they trade. This level of efficiency just isn't possible on PC. For one thing, few tradeable PC games are launching these days. For another thing, PCs are much more expensive than consoles. They also don't hold value as well. An eight year old gaming PC is basically worthless today.

Anyway, this was a stupid rumination on my part, but perhaps someone else will derive some value from it.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2020, 09:04:31 AM by obstinate »

JLee

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2020, 09:03:21 AM »
Epic has been giving PC games away for free every week and with Steam sales, Humble Bundles/etc, games are close to (and sometimes actually) free.

If you can't find PS4's under $200 now, I should sell mine - I paid about $220 for it 4-5 years ago.

obstinate

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2020, 09:07:30 AM »
JLee, that's true! But you can't choose the games, and many AAA games will never be available for free. Of course, if the game you want does go free, that works out great. Using the techniques I mentioned, you can pick essentially any game that gets a physical release and play it for free. Even considering free games, you'll still end up paying more for a gaming PC than a console, with little chance of reselling it for any significant amount.

As to the price of used PS4s, go on Ebay and tick the "Sold Items" checkbox (link) to see what things are actually going for. It's a great way to get a sense of the used market price.

ohio4life

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2020, 09:09:08 AM »
Yeah, you can game for pretty cheap nowadays. I agree reading or gardening or bike riding are more beneficial and rewarding, but gaming is no longer the rich man's hobby it was when I was a kid (80s and 90s). I made a similar post on a different thread, but you made a much better argument than me. I always sell the previous gen tech before moving into the new gen which I am starting to regret. Like most people I have a nostalgia for things right now and would like to play some older games. I guess that is where mini consoles and emulators come into play.

JLee

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2020, 09:12:12 AM »
JLee, that's true! But you can't choose the games, and many AAA games will never be available for free. Of course, if the game you want does go free, that works out great. Using the techniques I mentioned, you can pick essentially any game that gets a physical release and play it for free. Even considering free games, you'll still end up paying more for a gaming PC than a console, with little chance of reselling it for any significant amount.

As to the price of used PS4s, go on Ebay and tick the "Sold Items" checkbox (link) to see what things are actually going for. It's a great way to get a sense of the used market price.

Grand Theft Auto V was just free last week. :)

If you want to play new games on launch, it's not going to be free -- eBay fees/shipping will consume a lot of your apparent margin.

obstinate

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2020, 09:27:53 AM »
Even with all those fees, a recent game can be played for less than $10 (~$4 shipping and 9% eBay fee), and you'd have to play really a lot of games before that added up to more than the price difference between PCs and consoles.

Regarding other hobbies being more beneficial: man I wish I liked gardening as much as gaming. But I also wish I liked salad as much as I like donuts. In the latter case, since donuts really are quite harmful to your health, I avoid them. But I've yet to convince myself that I actually prefer salad! Gaming, in a context where you're doing everything you need to do to be a good husband, father, and friend, and taking care of your body, is probably at least not actively harmful.

Khaetra

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2020, 09:48:43 AM »

Grand Theft Auto V was just free last week. :)

If you want to play new games on launch, it's not going to be free -- eBay fees/shipping will consume a lot of your apparent margin.

Yep and I grabbed it!

As an old broad who has played video games since Pong (and has owned every system since plus pc's), gaming is one of my top three hobbies.  I do subscribe to Xbox GamePass (look for deals on card subs) and love the idea that I can get a crack at some first-rate games (Forza Horizon 4, Red Dead Redemption 2, etc.) without buyers remorse.

vand

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #7 on: May 27, 2020, 11:25:41 AM »
I don't play that many videogames any more, but I do I agree that they can be money very well spent if you are happy enough to buy second-hand games and trade them.

It's cheap entertainment, and some game are so well crafted that they leave a lasting impression years after playing them. However, I think there's also a valid argument that all those hours you wind up playing can rob you of time to pursue other more productive stuff.. so everything in moderation..

lexde

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In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #8 on: May 27, 2020, 12:36:37 PM »
I’ve put so many hours on my Switch. It makes me happy, it gives me an escape, it helps me alleviate stress.

Highly recommend it!

I love that the game memory is saved onto the console instead of game cards so I can borrow and lend games seamlessly. When a game hasn’t met my expectations, I can sell it used for near-retail value (Bought Skyrim for $45 on sale and sold it for $50).

Yes, the console and games are expensive, but when I spend 50-100 hours on a game (or way more, in the case of Animal Crossing) the hourly cost is small. Especially with my partner who plays now, too!
« Last Edit: May 27, 2020, 12:39:43 PM by lexde »

ketchup

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #9 on: May 27, 2020, 12:57:48 PM »
Gaming can be *very* frugal.  As long as you only buy quality games that retain their value, you can resell them later (sometimes even 5-10 years later) for nearly what you paid.  First-party Nintendo games (good ones at least) are a good fit here.  Pokemon games in particular essentially don't depreciate at all.  A Mario Kart 64 cartridge has been $25-35 used for about 20 years.

honeybbq

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #10 on: May 27, 2020, 01:05:02 PM »
I still play my old wii.

But I have been eyeing a switch for about a year now. It'll probably never happen.... but I think about upgrading.

LibrarIan

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2020, 02:10:49 PM »
I love gaming, too. I have found that switching to PC gaming has actually saved me money and taught me a lot of new computer skills.

When you console game, you have a closed environment on which to play specific games and you generally cannot update the hardware without buying a new console/version of the console (although there are exceptions). You can resell physical games, but things are moving so fast toward all digital and so many games are bogged down in DLC/exclusive downloads that reselling may not be something to bank on. This set up works for a lot of people obviously, but I think we can all do better.

PC gaming can certainly have a higher dollar cost at the outset. To build your own gaming PC, you are probably looking at something in the neighborhood of $1200 or more if you build with all new parts (but you can of course source used parts, which adds time but saves money). But there are numerous positives.

Firstly, you learn a lot about how computers work and what goes into them. You build one PC and you've already done more with the nuts and bolts of computing devices than most people ever will.

Secondly, the environment is not closed, so you can play many more games than what consoles offer. This comes with issues inherent to any freer computing environment. Settings may not jive, you may need to download extra stuff (drivers, updates, config files, etc.), you will run into weird errors, etc. But this is only provides further learning opportunities.

You didn't hear this from me, but if you're into retro gaming you can download emulators and their corresponding ROM files and essentially not have to pay for games. I know this is frowned upon in some circles, but honestly why hunt down some NES or Atari 2600 game in a retro store or on eBay and possibly pay a lot of money to be able to play that super old game when you could just download it.

For current games, Steam and GOG (probably others too) often have super steep sales. I got Watch Dogs 2 for $12.00 on a Steam sale when it was previously nearly $60.

If you want to update specific pieces of hardware, you can do this. Just find the new part, ensure it's compatible, and swap it out. It's your machine - you built it. Do what you want with it. And if you do it right, your machine will last as long or longer than a typical console life cycle. I've had my current PC since 2016 and it has held up very well.

Lastly, while consoles have become general entertainment stations over time, PCs are the ultimate one-stop-shop for all things entertainment. We don't use any consoles, set-top boxes, or other sorts of attachments for streaming services or other digital entertainment. We don't even have our TV's smart capabilities set up. We just run everything through the PC. Nice and streamlined.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2020, 07:32:59 AM by LibrarIan »

thesis

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2020, 02:25:24 PM »
Black Friday sales can be pretty good. I bought my PS4 for $200 this way. Granted, I'm always several years behind the latest-and-greatest.

As long as you aren't that person who buys every single game at "New" price, gaming is cheap compared to many other hobbies. Heck, even hiking often requires a car. Spending $400 on a console and a few hundred dollars on games is nothin'.

Xlar

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2020, 03:45:59 PM »
[Snip]

PC gaming can certainly have a higher dollar cost at the outset. To build your own gaming PC, you are probably looking at something in the neighborhood of $1200 or more if you build with all new parts (but you can of course source parts, which adds time but saves money).

[Snip]

I would add that you can build a solid gaming PC for a lot less than $1200! I built mine for just $300 using used components. Getting the experience actually putting together the machine was a lot of fun.

For a solid gaming computer you really need a solid GPU, most other components are not as important. I bought a used 1060 6GB GPU, an i7-3770 CPU (7 years old!), and 16GB of memory, a nice 450W PSU, and stuck it in a Dell Precision 1650 case using it's motherboard. I can play modern AAA games on high settings in 1080 gaming. I've been really happy with how it has turned out

Fish Sweet

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2020, 03:57:42 PM »
One more excellent thing to add about console gaming (and PC gaming to a lesser degree) is that if you have friends with similar tastes in games, buying physical copies and sharing/trading/swapping is so dang easy!  Two borrowed games from a friend = an additional 100 hours of easy free entertainment on a console I already own.

JLee

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2020, 08:52:21 PM »
One more excellent thing to add about console gaming (and PC gaming to a lesser degree) is that if you have friends with similar tastes in games, buying physical copies and sharing/trading/swapping is so dang easy!  Two borrowed games from a friend = an additional 100 hours of easy free entertainment on a console I already own.

On that note, if anyone is not aware -- you can also do this with Steam games!  https://www.pcgamesn.com/steam-family-sharing

AccidentialMustache

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Re: In praise of video game consoles
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2020, 10:25:58 PM »
Steam family sharing is a trap. To borrow, you have to be online. The moment the sharer wants to play a steam game at the same time, it will kick the borrower off. Note: I'm not talking about the same game -- different games, say lego star wars (DS) and civ 6 (me).

While you can toggle the sharer into offline mode, that doesn't work if you want to do something that is online multiplayer.