Author Topic: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)  (Read 10271 times)

NHguy

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HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« on: March 17, 2014, 10:53:36 AM »
[mod edit - NHguy asked me to remove his post for privacy reasons - he deleted his account, which made it so he no longer had edit permissions - oops!]
« Last Edit: March 18, 2014, 02:09:53 PM by MMM »

Jamesqf

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2014, 11:03:57 AM »
A Porsche in the garage doesn't do much to make anyone happy (unless you're obsessively into status symbols), nor will putting it under covers - not driving it - for the winter.  DRIVE THE DAMN THING!

If I were in your shoes, I'd sell the bike and the SUV, or the Porsche and SUV.  If you think of driving as more than just transportation, drive something that you enjoy.  Though I'd suggest that you could get 95% of the pleasure for 20% of the money by trading the Porsche for a nicely used Miata,

soccerluvof4

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2014, 11:09:14 AM »
Not to be a nit picker but in the opening part you said you have learned that "senseless acquisition of stuff hasn't made you happy" Then towards the bottom you say " should I drive them into the ground as they do bring a degree of pleasure.

Also if you don't want to deal with something that might save you a large portion of the 10k you paid (Porsche paid 50k sell to dealer for 40k) I would re-think that. Alot of money to be tossing away. If dealer is going to "take it off your hands for 40K" he obviously knows hes going to make out on the deal so post it on Craigs list. Don't throw good money after bad. Patience! Think if you haven't read it already you might want to read the Millionaire Next door or the Overspent American.

I was similar other than I am married 49 and 4 kids and have been selling my toys (recently 3 boats and 5 snowmobiles) for the same feelings your feeling. I am relieved and still have a vacation home to be rid off.

But not knowing anything else about your financial position I cant see a reason to own a Porsche and sure wouldn't just dump it to take easy way out. Get what you can!

Ftao93

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2014, 11:37:36 AM »
Local Craigslist probably isn't the way to get the most out of a 50k vehicle.

Surely there are some consignment auto sales people you could work with?

You'll take a hit, sure, but then they can deal with all the tire kicking, whackadoodle bozos that the internet is sure to invite, and no one will walk up to you and say " I haz $1000 and an expired bagel coupon, will you take that?"


Tetsuya Hondo

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2014, 11:57:50 AM »
Regarding unloading the Porsche, I understand your reservations about selling it private party, but you can increase your odds of getting a serious buyer and avoiding any non-homicidal ax wielding maniacs by advertising with local Porsche clubs, Porsche forums, or even Auto-trader. Once the snow finally clears, check out your local Cars and Coffee - most cities have events - and stick a for sale sign in the window. If you don't get anywhere through that, Carmax would probably pay more than your dealer for it.

And if all that fails, you can always donate to a worthy cause: me. :)

James

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2014, 12:09:55 PM »
I would do some research on where to sell the porsche in your area to a private party. That might mean CL, listing it by ad, consignment, etc. But try that for a month or two before going to a dealer. But definitely sell it, no reason to keep something like that in your garage when it doesn't give you pleasure equal to the cost. Just the upkeep alone makes it worth getting rid of it, and then consider the opportunity costs of the money that is tied up in the porsche.

The SUV should go, simply get a nice economical and fun to drive car. You can afford something nice after selling those two vehicles, but nothing fancy and no loan.

I would start with the other two vehicles because they are much bigger priorities and then figure out the bike. My gut tells me you already know it should go, but maybe it would be the one thing you keep for a while, but solve the big issues first of the porsche and SUV.

Forget about the % loss on the items, it isn't relevant. They are not worth any more than you can get for them at this point, so the money is already lost. I repeat, that money is already gone, selling them doesn't make you lose the money, it's already lost. The one and only question is whether you want to lose MORE money in depreciation and maintenance over time, along with the opportunity costs of the money tied up in those items.

Glad to hear you have other spending well in hand, but use that as an excuse to ignore the huge gains you can have by fixing the vehicle situation. Best of luck!

Shor

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2014, 12:26:32 PM »
You see these funny little toys, and you note that they are liabilities in the way of you being truly free from a consumerism mindset. No, it is not hypocritical for you to be here. If anything, this site is exactly what you need to shrug off your silly toy syndrome and seek what is truly important for you.

I see that you've already eliminated most of the miscellaneous expenses which most people find unable to do without, so you already have the correct mindset here. I think, for you, a good exercise will be to find out what it is you enjoy doing, and putting more focus on that in your life.

When you take that 911 Porsche out for a drive, what is it that you enjoy there? Is it the vroom vroom driving fast? Is it the challenge of pushing yourself to the limit? Or maybe you enjoy competing against others and winning every time (granted you pay a boatload for that win... but...) or maybe it's that look of wonder and envy as all eyes turn towards you as you ride up.

Whatever the case, find a healthy way to fuel that accomplished feeling. Some people find it from volunteering their time and making the world a better place for others. Some people find it in exercise, group exercising, competitive exercise, becoming the best 'James' that you can be. Some people focus on technical skills, or still others just find it in the work they day each day.

You should find what fits for you, and then you will have no qualms with dropping those silly toys so you can truly free yourself from them, and focus on what actually makes you feel happy and accomplished.

MrFancypants

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2014, 01:16:24 PM »
If the Porsche is bugging you....  make it go away.  It's too expensive of a toy to be uncertain about.

If you want to unload it quick, I would encourage you to consider Carmax as a possible place to sell it.  You may not get TOP dollar, but they'll get you pretty close.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2014/03/should-you-sell-your-car-at-carmax/

It sounds like you have enough and can legitimately afford the car.  But the question is....  does having it add anything to your life?  If it doesn't add anything, I would get rid of it to make space for something that does.

MrMoneyPinch

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2014, 01:59:43 PM »
A Porsche in the garage doesn't do much to make Antone happy (unless you're obsessively into status symbols), nor will putting it under covers - not driving it - for the winter.
I know we are all for deserved face punches, but reality has to be taken into account: Porsche + snow = expensive wreck.  That's why he puts it in a garage.
He took care of all the small stuff that sting, and asks for tips for the last big things.  What I am doing is: I have one summer toy, and it's staying.   Which is the one your heart prefers?

nawhite

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2014, 02:06:14 PM »
What are you giving up for having $40k of assets locked up in a car? You don't seem to be using the car much so would you get more use out of one of these? Do any of these sound like a better use of your money?

A small apartment you could rent out.
A 1/4 share in a timeshare somewhere you love to go.
$1600 cash every year for the rest of your life (4% SWR).
57 Walt Disney season passes good at any resort around the world
Animals to support 8 African villages (not households, villages) http://www.heifer.org/gift-catalog/animals-nutrition/gift-ark-donation.html
A room named after you at your Alma Mater
A whole house renovation with all of the work done by contractors and designed by an interior designer
Annual Membership at a hoidy-toidy country club
Facetime with almost any politician in the country (and likely a vote on an issue that matters to you)
Best seats in the house at 100 Broadway musicals for you and a guest.
9 Round-the-world flights (10 stops in different countries) for 2 people
An amazing used RV and hookup/camping fees for 1-2 years
Being able to stop working your job and do something else 1-2 years early
That Porsche?

(Note, many of these are not at all "mustacian." The goal here is to figure out what matters to the OP since it apparently isn't driving fancy cars.)

AlexK

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2014, 02:09:52 PM »
I second the idea of selling the Porsche and BMW and buying another motorcycle which costs less to insure. Almost any motorcycle is fast enough to satisfy a gearhead's need for speed. Sometimes it's more fun to drive a slow bike fast than a fast bike slow anyway. My DRZ400 costs $20/year to insure and it feels crazy fast after driving a Geo Metro, especially off road but I don't know if you have that option in NH.

An idea for selling the Porsche: find a local Mustacian who is good at selling stuff. Have him sell the car and split the difference between what he sells it for and what the Porsche dealership offered. I am such a person but I live across the country. A good way to sell your Porsche would be to list it on ebay with a bazillion pictures and no reserve auction with starting bid set to what the dealership offered. The ebay fee for a car is really low last time I sold one, <$200 (check this first because it fluctuates).

forward

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2014, 03:26:01 PM »

Thanks for sharing this cautionary tale.  The rest of your lifestyle seems pretty mustachian, the vehicles are not and you are paying interest on one of them.  Think about it, each month the 911 is sitting in the garage it is worth a little less and you are paying the bank interest for that.

Sell the 911, there are some good ideas about how to do it on here.  Because it sounds like you live alone and you would appear to the outside observer to have money with a 911 sitting in your garage, I would personally avoid having a lot of random people coming to your house to look at it.  Then if you really want a fun car buy a miata or an s2000 or wrx or something.

Sell the motorcycle.  Buy a less expensive one.

Sell the big suv, buy something economical.  Get an inexpensive hobby.  You should be FI in a couple of years at this rate.

Forcus

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2014, 04:35:51 PM »
. One interesting observation re: the 911:  even after only putting 400ish miles on it .... Ive not been out once where i haven't had at least one person come up to me and compliment me on the car.

My daily drivers in high school were a 1962 International 4x4 pickup with 13,000 miles and a 1969 Plymouth Roadrunner I picked up for $2500. I couldn't stop anywhere for gas without being accosted (in a good way) by folks who loved seeing old stuff on the road or "had one just like it". There are cheaper ways to get compliments if that makes you warm and fuzzy. No reason you can't get that and be frugal at the same time.

MrFancypants

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2014, 05:31:36 PM »
Get an inexpensive hobby. 

Unfortunately, sometimes you don't choose your passions, and occasionally they are expensive.  Still, when it comes to cars and motorcycles, there are ways to scratch that itch without spending $50,000 on a single car (like you pointed out in another part of your post).

Primm

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2014, 05:36:38 PM »
My daily drivers in high school were a 1962 International 4x4 pickup with 13,000 miles and a 1969 Plymouth Roadrunner I picked up for $2500. I couldn't stop anywhere for gas without being accosted (in a good way) by folks who loved seeing old stuff on the road or "had one just like it". There are cheaper ways to get compliments if that makes you warm and fuzzy. No reason you can't get that and be frugal at the same time.

My daily driver is a 1965 Nissan Cedric that we got for free from some guy we'd never met, just because he knew we'd take care of it. I'm the same as Forcus, can't take the thing out of the driveway without comments, people yelling "Nice car!" at me, and the looks and screams I get from the kids when I drive past a school are priceless.

bondo

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2014, 10:33:36 PM »
Is that BMW an s1000RR?  want to sell it?

Jamesqf

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2014, 10:41:36 PM »
I know we are all for deserved face punches, but reality has to be taken into account: Porsche + snow = expensive wreck.  That's why he puts it in a garage.

Nonsense, assuming the OP's a halfway competent driver.  If not, he probably shouldn't be driving anything.    And he could (assuming he hasn't already) sign up for a performance driving school.

The real questions here are whether he can afford the Porsche in the first place, and if so, whether he gets his money's worth in pleasure.

James

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2014, 06:51:33 AM »
Just to give some perspective, it could be a lot worse. For me it was buying a $450k house at the top of the market and selling it last year for $320k. Everything is relative, don't beat yourself up about your choices in the past.  Maybe it was the porsche purchase and resulting realization that it didn't bring great happiness that tripped a trigger that will result in both a greater enjoyment in life and better financial outlook for the rest of your life.

I have been out biking on my $1200 mountain bike and had that exact same thought, "OMG I love this thing". Use that information to inform your decisions, but don't let it control your decisions.

TomTX

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2014, 07:19:51 AM »
You are falling for the "Sunk Cost Fallacy" - however it happened, you are where you are. Decide where you want to (should) be - and make it happen. The losses from selling are less than the losses from depreciation, insurance, maintenance, et cetera.

Sell the Porsche.  Figure what your time is worth - would you spend 40 hours for $8,000? That's $200 per hour after tax! Sounds like you should be able to get at least $48,000 on the private market, especially since Spring is almost here. Good time to sell fancy go-fast.

Sell the motorcycle. Same deal.

Sell the SUV, unless you are always (like multiple times a week) hauling SUV-loads of stuff that you could not handle in a car + trailer.

Buy a good bicycle.

Buy an economical car - if you do need to haul stuff, get one that you can mount a Class II hitch. Mounting a hitch on my Hyundai was an easy DIY, using the neighbor's floor jack and a bit of a hand from MrsTX. Then you can pick up a used trailer/hitch mount bike rack/cargo tray for hauling your stuff around.

http://hitches4less.com/trailer-hitch-classes.html

If you still need a motorcycle after all that, get something cheap and cheerful. Unless you track race or do things that are illegal and dangerous on public roads, you never get even 50% of the performance you paid for with that BMW.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2014, 07:24:01 AM by TomTX »

oceanowl

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2014, 09:47:24 AM »
I'm not a car person, so don't really know about this, but if you don't drive the car/bike all that often, is there a way you could rent that kind of high end vehicle a few times a year to get your "fast car" kicks in? I have a friend who I know rented some fancy schmancy car in italy for a day, (I have no idea what kind) and fulfilled a dream of driving something fancy in a fancy place. Surely that would be cheaper than the daily upkeep, and might give you the chance to try out different kinds?

MrFancypants

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2014, 09:52:51 AM »
I'm not a car person, so don't really know about this, but if you don't drive the car/bike all that often, is there a way you could rent that kind of high end vehicle a few times a year to get your "fast car" kicks in? I have a friend who I know rented some fancy schmancy car in italy for a day, (I have no idea what kind) and fulfilled a dream of driving something fancy in a fancy place. Surely that would be cheaper than the daily upkeep, and might give you the chance to try out different kinds?

There are track events where you can rent time in any sort of exotic car you can imagine along with an instructor to teach you how to drive it properly.  They aren't cheap, but you get to fully enjoy the performance of these vehicles in a safe environment and ultimately cost less than the depreciation of a luxury vehicle like a Porsche 911.

MissPeach

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #21 on: March 18, 2014, 10:29:54 AM »
I agree with a lot of the other posts. My advice for the future is not to buy things on a whim and really make sure it's something you want. It won't make you happy but if you think through your purchases, even if they are expensive, you can at least feel good about the money spent.

In your situation considering you love driving I would make sure to get something that you'll still be happy with but consolidate to one reasonable vehicle. Buy it used and let someone else take the depreciation on it. Or take a trip to one of those driving schools in Germany once per year. Figure out what the best use of the money is. I would think the experience of a trip like that and the bragging rights would be worth more and be more fulfilling.

SugarMountain

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #22 on: March 18, 2014, 11:01:11 AM »
Your bike costs $1k per year for insurance?  Shop around.  When I was riding it, my VFR 750, which is classified as a sport bike was about $130.  I know State Farm has "sunny day" policies where they assume you will be riding it relatively infrequently.

I suffer a bit from your disease -- BMW M Roadster, Audi Allroad, VFR 750 (been sitting for years, trying to get it running so I can sell it).  But, I did a few things right, I bought them all used with low miles for 2/3rds or less than what they'd have been new.  I'll probably keep the Bimmer forever, it's worth the $12-15k to me.  The rest not so much.  I'm actually trying to get the bike going so I can sell it, as it's been sitting since 2007. (Sell your BMW and buy my VFR! ;-)

As for the Porsche, if you want to sell it, I'd throw it on Craigslist for a week and see if you get any nibbles before selling to a dealer.  What is it?  A 993 may actually be increasing in value.  I considered getting one of those when I got the BMW in 2004 and they seem to cost as much or more as they did 10 years ago.  So you can also rationalize it as an investment if it is actually appreciating.

MrFancypants

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #23 on: March 18, 2014, 11:16:21 AM »
  buy my VFR! ;-)


If I were still riding I'd consider picking it up, especially if it's a '98-'01 model (or earlier).  Honda's old V-4 makes sweet, sweet music.

luigi49

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2014, 11:20:05 AM »
Keep us updated as how much you sold it. thanks

SugarMountain

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2014, 11:21:00 AM »
It's a '90 with 21,000 miles on it.  Staintune exhaust.  It really does look and sound great (when it's running, I got it going on 3 cylinders over the weekend, but will probably need to pull the carbs to get it really running.)  Top speed is supposedly 155.  I suspect that is accurate as I've had it to 135 and it had more to give, but I chickened out.  Ah, youth.

Tetsuya Hondo

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2014, 11:22:38 AM »
... once these are gone i can really focus on accelerated savings (beyond the 17k a year in 401 and 10% of my net in company stock).

Be careful about acquiring too much company stock. It should only make up a small percentage of your portfolio as you don't want to put too many eggs in one basket. I know a number of people that have been badly burned on their company stocks. Diversification is your friend.

Shor

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2014, 11:40:39 AM »
I believe you have the correct mindset to set your life straight. At first you fell in to a trap thinking that thing A or thing B might make you happy. Fortunately for you, you got the opportunity to get said dream things, and realize that this is not what makes you happy at all.

Consider the point that a lot of people don't get that chance, and end up always chasing around some mystical consumerism dream. i.e. they were able to afford the BMW, but if they could 'just get that Porsche' suddenly everything would be perfect.

You have the experience to move forward from this. Find that thing you love, and pour your time in to it. If anything, I envy the awesome position you are putting yourself in.
Let us know how the sales turn out and, more importantly finding your true passion in life! Or maybe you already have something your are passionate about; you certainly have your spending under tight discipline!

Peter

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #28 on: March 18, 2014, 12:48:01 PM »
This is wildly off topic NHguy, but I'm very interested in hearing about your decision to not marry nor have kids. Clearly you have a career, house, money, and are marriage material. Do you have regrets about it? Do you think part of your journey to find happiness through expertly engineered rear-wheel-drive horse power is an attempt to fill an emptiness that could have been family? Do you have any other family members nearby that you are close with?

Not meaning to pry at all, it's just difficult to find mature, successful, single men to gain perspective from. I ask as a late 20s guy who is not very interested in getting married or having kids, but worries that it may lead to an unfulfilled life further down the road. Any thoughts you are willing to share would be much appreciated.

Jamesqf

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2014, 12:59:27 PM »
This is wildly off topic NHguy, but I'm very interested in hearing about your decision to not marry nor have kids.

Who says it was entirely HIS decision?  There are two people involved in that decision, you know.  Can't speak for him, but while I could readily have settled for a spouse who'd see me as little more than a sperm donor and source of child support, women who I could actually see as a partner were and are pretty rare.

MrFancypants

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #30 on: March 18, 2014, 02:18:34 PM »
This is wildly off topic NHguy, but I'm very interested in hearing about your decision to not marry nor have kids.

Who says it was entirely HIS decision?  There are two people involved in that decision, you know.  Can't speak for him, but while I could readily have settled for a spouse who'd see me as little more than a sperm donor and source of child support, women who I could actually see as a partner were and are pretty rare.

On this note...  I had made the decision that by 50 I would either be happily married and building a family, or I'd have a Porsche.

I made it to 33 before getting hitched, because I decided to be careful and follow my instincts when dating.  The wait was worth it, as the person I married was as close to "love at first sight" as it gets.

The thing I realized early on was that forcing a relationship into marriage could lead to a lifetime of pain, which could cause me to miss out on finding the person I was truly meant to be with.  A Porsche may not have been as deeply fulfilling as a loving wife and family, but it's a pretty big upgrade over a miserable marriage, a divorce, and all the things that go along with that.

somepissedoffman

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2014, 02:29:02 PM »
A Porsche may not have been as deeply fulfilling as a loving wife and family, but it's a pretty big upgrade over a miserable marriage, a divorce, and all the things that go along with that.

That would be a good slogan for Porsche's next marketing campaign.

MrFancypants

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Re: HUGE mistakes(s)... (rant warning)
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2014, 07:42:00 PM »
A Porsche may not have been as deeply fulfilling as a loving wife and family, but it's a pretty big upgrade over a miserable marriage, a divorce, and all the things that go along with that.

That would be a good slogan for Porsche's next marketing campaign.

LOL