Author Topic: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?  (Read 11152 times)

KBecks2

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How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« on: June 29, 2015, 11:16:31 AM »
We're going to buy a used car soon, probably certified used.

Any comments on how you get the best price and handle yourself during negotiations?  I am wondering how to come up with our "max offer" price for a vehicle and stick to it.

We are likely looking at a 2013 - 2014 Honda.

Thanks!

nobodyspecial

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2015, 11:55:55 AM »
Hire an agent. Some friends hired somebody who find a list of cars (you pick model, age range, range of colors - and price range) negotiates the price and takes a commission. They are professional negotiators and don't have any leeway to say yes to the options package.
Don't know if this is common, and they could be in league with the dealers but it's worth it for me next time.

I am never buying a car from a dealer again (fortunately I bought a Subaru so I only need a new one every 20 years).

Another alternative would be to take members of the salesman's family hostage - not necessarily legal but probably still more moral than the dealership.



choppingwood

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2015, 02:50:21 PM »
I've bought three different cars from used car dealerships  -- two were attached to new dealerships, the other a true used car dealership.

I don't think I'd bother buying used for a car that is two years old. There isn't anything good that could put a car on the market that soon. I'd buy something older. If you are looking for something a little older, read LemonAid first.

Research the price (as per LemonAid).
Refuse all admin fees. (Admin fees?, you say in a puzzled fashion. Same reaction to all extra costs, like warranties, floor mats)
Insist that all problems be fixed before you pay for the car. (I want the air conditioner pumping out cold air before I pay for the car.)
Insist that everything discussed is on the paperwork exactly as discussed. (You promised the air conditioner would be fixed, not diagnosed.)
Insist that everything on the paperwork is carried out exactly as on the paperwork. (They threatened to back out on the deal because they didn't know the air conditioner needed replacing. I stood in the middle of the dealership, raising my voice slightly (not too much) and said they could back out of the deal and not give me the air conditioner repair/replacement they had promised as long as they gave me my cash deposit back right now. I got a new air conditioner on the vehicle.)
Take the time to think about what they are saying. The deal got better each time I got quiet.
They didn't want to take my old car as a trade-in. I didn't want to sell it myself. I pointed out unperceived value. (New tires.) They gave me a decent trade-in, but I was realistic about what I was expecting.
They needed some time to replace the air conditioner and wanted me to take my old car for a long weekend. I didn't want to risk taking the old car, something happening, and then losing the trade-in. They told me to take the old car or go without a car. I said I didn't like the choices. I got quiet. They gave me a free loaner from their service area, while they continued to refuse other people loaners from their sales area. They whispered to me while they were doing this.
If they were rude or condescending to me, I told them to stop.
I'd bring a book to read while waiting for them. Maybe a snack. Or a crock pot. (I'm joking now.) Looking like you are moving in might hurry them up.

Why did I do business with them? Great selection of good used vehicles. I've had the car a year. I love it. I haven't had any out-of-the ordinary maintenance for a car its age.
 
If I went back into that dealership, I think they would give me $200 to go away and not buy a car from them.

 
« Last Edit: June 29, 2015, 03:14:38 PM by choppingwood »

Cougar

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2015, 09:05:17 PM »


do everything chopper says and be reasonable in what youre trying to get in price or options or they'll just let you walk.

i'd bring a phone and not a book or they might think its just a waiting games, which it is; but you dont want them to know you know that and arent about to give in at the next offer.

when they bring you in for a sit down with the sales mgr, you've probably got as much as they want to give you, but i would still walk and leave your number and see if you can get a little more. let them know youre going to keep looking, i'd bet you get a call within an hour.

they are going to make money off you no matter what so every 100 dollars is just money you saved from whatever that amount is.

AM43

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2015, 09:08:18 AM »
#1 Rule be ready to walk out if you dont like the deal.
I did just that and saved at least 1K(new car purchase)at another place.
Remember, there are hundreds of vehicles to choose from, from countless dealerships and you'll find
what you are looking for.

r3dt4rget

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2015, 11:57:34 AM »
Realize that even with the best tricks and tips, every dealer will be a little different. When we went shopping for a particular model at one dealership, we had to walk away because they wouldn't budge $200 in price. The next week at another dealership we managed to get them down almost $2000 from what they had it listed. Final price was well below retail blue book. They were both Chevy dealers. The difference was the attitude each dealer had about defects. At the first dealer, I was pointing out faults in the paint and other things to negotiate a lower price. Their response was not to budge at all, and say that, "all used cars will have these problems, buy a new one if you want it to be nicer". The other dealer seemed to be more understanding and willing to reduce their asking price saying, "you're right, we'll take care of that paint chip for you, we didn't even notice it."

The first dealer called us about 2 weeks later, asking if we had looked at other cars. We told them we already bought from another dealership and got a great deal. I assume they were calling to accept our offer after all, because they had nothing to say after that! Why else would you call randomly 2 weeks later, if not to give in?

Lis

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2015, 12:10:28 PM »
Have a penis.

No, seriously, the amount of sexist jackasses who work at dealerships is staggering. When I bought my car (new, unfortunately preMustachian days), I can't tell you how many sleazy sales guys said they needed to talk to my husband, boyfriend, or father to make sure I knew what I was asking for. The quiet stares of disbelief are typically viewed as the tiny female brain being unable to process car talk.

KBecks, not sure if this would be a problem for you, but be prepared to walk away while holding your middle finger high up in the air (after you drop all your car knowledge on them). Some people are so set in their ways you won't be able to convince them otherwise.

chevelle57

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2015, 12:34:42 PM »
One option I've used recently was negotiating the final price of the car after all the fees we added in.  This made it easier for me to figure out what all was coming out of my pocket at the end of the sale.  I've had it where you negotiate a price then they and $1000-1500 in fees.  Also if they wont budge on price of the car for sale you might be able to get them to come up on what they are giving you for your trade in.  I had an older jeep that was a mechanics nightmare.  I managed to get them up to 2K for it (I figured it was only worth 1000 to 1500)

Jeddy

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2015, 01:15:02 PM »
1. Figure out what car(s) you're willing to buy (Geo Metro? Toyota Camry? Jeep Wrangler?)
2. Figure out what year(s) you're willing to go with (2000 and newer? 2005 and newer? 2008 - 2010? Any age?)
3. Search around the websites of your local car dealerships - find cars that match your parameters
4. Utilize a site like KBB.com to figure out the going rate for the car(s) you've found
5. Contact the dealerships VIA EMAIL (unless you want them calling you multiple times a day, every day, for the rest of eternity) with your fair price that you're willing to pay (researched via a site like KBB.com) and let them know that the price you are stating is the OUT THE DOOR PRICE. You have no interest in their fees or taxes - you are looking for a OUT THE DOOR price.
6. If you have a vehicle to trade in, DO NOT TELL THEM - when they ask about a trade in, say you don't think so, or outright say no - EVEN IF YOU FULLY INTEND TO TRADE IN. Know why they are generous with trade-ins? Because they jack the price of the vehicle up to compensate for it. Once you get your OUT THE DOOR price, THEN bring up the topic of a trade-in.

I've purchased a few vehicles utilizing the above methods and I always feel I've paid a fair price without the hassle of actually dealing with used car dealers. You're going to be repeatedly requested (although their tone is more along the lines of being 'told') to come in - you have no reason to come in.

If you do choose to actually go in, your BEST negotiating asset is to simply get up and leave - not NEEDING a car puts the ball in your court. Don't like how they treat you? Get up and leave. Don't like what they are trying to tack onto the price? Get up and leave. Don't like the bait and switch or up-sell they are trying to pull off? Get up and leave. If they know you can and WILL get up and leave, their 'tactics' go straight out the window and you'll have a much better time/better outcome.

Also - any dealership worth their salt will provide you with a Carfax report. It's not YOUR responsibility to get one, it's the dealerships. They are not 100% reliable, but they can offer SOME peace of mind.

When buying a car, you need to have done all of your research up front - know what you want, how much you're willing to pay, and then start the process - dealerships make their money off of people who don't know what they want or how much they are wanting to pay ahead of time. Know your stuff before you start the process, conduct the whole process with zero emotion, and deal with them digitally to save yourself the hassle. Only deal with out the door prices and your car buying experience will be much easier/better.

Good luck!
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 01:16:53 PM by Jeddy »

choppingwood

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #9 on: June 30, 2015, 01:26:20 PM »
...seriously, the amount of sexist jackasses who work at dealerships is staggering. When I bought my car (new, unfortunately preMustachian days), I can't tell you how many sleazy sales guys said they needed to talk to my husband, boyfriend, or father to make sure I knew what I was asking for.

The first time I bought a car (brand new) I took my father with me, and he distracted the salespeople while I had a good look at the cars. (I was buying the car.) When I had finished, I would let my father know, and he would say goodbye to the sales rep and away father and daughter went.

Flash forward a few decades to this recent encounter with the used car dealership. At the time I was working for a teachers' association, so they thought I was a teacher. They were sort of nice to me because of that, and I got a couple of breaks I wasn't expecting. But I kept saying no to their ideas of how they could drive the price up. It was only over the course of the whole negotiation that they found out that the teachers' association was a union and that I did collective bargaining on behalf the association with its own employees. By then it was too late.

That being said I'm sure they made some money. And I got a decent price.


Spork

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2015, 01:45:59 PM »
A lot of what is said above is good advice.  Mostly to know what price you are willing to pay and just say no when it gets above that mark.

One more bit I will add: dealerships are all commission based and they have numbers they have to meet every month.  Yes, this is even true of the used market if buying from a name brand dealership.   So: go the last day of the month.  Seriously.  Walk in there with a particular car in mind and a particular price.  Tell them.  They say no, thank them for their time and leave.   ...or try to.  They're not going to let you leave if your price is even close to the value of the car.

Don't finance with them (and I'd say don't finance with them EVEN IF THEY OFFER YOU STUPID LOW FINANCING).

Don't trade anything in.

They want to use a 4-square form on you... where they put monthly payment, price, trade-in, down payment.  Don't let them.  They're doing math gymnastics.  They know what they're doing and can do it fast.   If you only have price in there... there are no tricks to play.

forummm

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2015, 02:43:57 PM »
If going used, why not go Craigslist? You'll save a ton. And on a 2 year old car, it will still be under warranty. You can buy a supplemental warranty if you want one.

bzzzt

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2015, 06:21:08 PM »
Find out the laws in your state as far as sales tax and private party sales.

In Illinois, any dealership purchase is subject to sales tax (6.5% IIRC). Private party purchases under $15k are subject to a flat tax based on model year. The last vehicle I bought cost $10k and I only paid $79 tax because I bought it private party.

We bought a used SUV as my wife's new mommy-mobile. We saved enough money in taxes buying private party to put fuel in it for a year.

I'm not a tax cheat, I'm just using the law to my advantage.

paddedhat

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2015, 08:48:15 PM »
A lot of what is said above is good advice.  Mostly to know what price you are willing to pay and just say no when it gets above that mark.

One more bit I will add: dealerships are all commission based and they have numbers they have to meet every month.  Yes, this is even true of the used market if buying from a name brand dealership.   So: go the last day of the month.  Seriously.  Walk in there with a particular car in mind and a particular price.  Tell them.  They say no, thank them for their time and leave.   ...or try to.  They're not going to let you leave if your price is even close to the value of the car.

We picked up a new CRV a few years back for $500 UNDER invoice, because the dealer was trying to become the highest volume CRV dealer in the state, and he couldn't let us walk, since it was the last day of the month.

Don't finance with them (and I'd say don't finance with them EVEN IF THEY OFFER YOU STUPID LOW FINANCING).

Can't imagine what your issue is on this one. I have gone in with extremely low rate quotes from my credit union, and had the dealer beat them. It might of only been a savings of $10-12 a month but it adds up. Why I would pass up on this is beyond me. In all cases they flipped the loan to a local, reputable lender, and there never was an issue. The only screwing I ever got was from a Nissan dealer who added a warranty to the loan after we left. The loan was with Nissan Credit, who quickly removed the charge. Later Nissan misread a $200 payment, due to my sloppy check writing skills, as a $700 payment, adding $500 in instant equity. Karma...............................

Don't trade anything in.

Again, this is far from a settled deal. I have traded stuff in that would not been very profitable on Craigslist, and gotten the tax advantage, and registration savings, from doing so. Give the tax savings ,and PITA of selling privately, there are plenty of cases where a trade is in your best interest.

They want to use a 4-square form on you... where they put monthly payment, price, trade-in, down payment.  Don't let them.  They're doing math gymnastics.  They know what they're doing and can do it fast.   If you only have price in there... there are no tricks to play.

I haven't seen the four square trick in years. That said, if a salesman put one on the table, I would tell him I'm leaving, since he wants to play games, and he is probably better off playing with himself.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 08:53:52 PM by paddedhat »

Spork

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2015, 10:21:23 PM »
A lot of what is said above is good advice.  Mostly to know what price you are willing to pay and just say no when it gets above that mark.

One more bit I will add: dealerships are all commission based and they have numbers they have to meet every month.  Yes, this is even true of the used market if buying from a name brand dealership.   So: go the last day of the month.  Seriously.  Walk in there with a particular car in mind and a particular price.  Tell them.  They say no, thank them for their time and leave.   ...or try to.  They're not going to let you leave if your price is even close to the value of the car.

We picked up a new CRV a few years back for $500 UNDER invoice, because the dealer was trying to become the highest volume CRV dealer in the state, and he couldn't let us walk, since it was the last day of the month.

Don't finance with them (and I'd say don't finance with them EVEN IF THEY OFFER YOU STUPID LOW FINANCING).

Can't imagine what your issue is on this one. I have gone in with extremely low rate quotes from my credit union, and had the dealer beat them. It might of only been a savings of $10-12 a month but it adds up. Why I would pass up on this is beyond me. In all cases they flipped the loan to a local, reputable lender, and there never was an issue. The only screwing I ever got was from a Nissan dealer who added a warranty to the loan after we left. The loan was with Nissan Credit, who quickly removed the charge. Later Nissan misread a $200 payment, due to my sloppy check writing skills, as a $700 payment, adding $500 in instant equity. Karma...............................

Don't trade anything in.

Again, this is far from a settled deal. I have traded stuff in that would not been very profitable on Craigslist, and gotten the tax advantage, and registration savings, from doing so. Give the tax savings ,and PITA of selling privately, there are plenty of cases where a trade is in your best interest.

They want to use a 4-square form on you... where they put monthly payment, price, trade-in, down payment.  Don't let them.  They're doing math gymnastics.  They know what they're doing and can do it fast.   If you only have price in there... there are no tricks to play.

I haven't seen the four square trick in years. That said, if a salesman put one on the table, I would tell him I'm leaving, since he wants to play games, and he is probably better off playing with himself.

My issues with dealer financing are related to the 4 square form.  They'll quote you a price.  Then they'll ask if you want some wicked low financing.  They take it back, juggle the numbers and end up charging you more.  Now, it's perfectly possible you'll check the math and it all works out.  But its a likely trick to catch a little more on the bottom line.

...and that's my issue with trade ins as well.  You'll negotiate a deal and then... they'll pitch some "new deal" on the trade... juggling math fast and furious. 

I prefer one number: price please.  I don't care about monthly.  I don't care about anything else. 

chesebert

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #15 on: July 01, 2015, 03:16:02 AM »
We're going to buy a used car soon, probably certified used.

Any comments on how you get the best price and handle yourself during negotiations?  I am wondering how to come up with our "max offer" price for a vehicle and stick to it.

We are likely looking at a 2013 - 2014 Honda.

Thanks!

carmax.com

no negotiation required and you can get bumper-to-bumper warranty from carmax (extra cost but might be worth it - probably not in your case given Honda is pretty reliable overall).

Also, 2013-2014 is waaay too new, go for cars that are at least 5 years old to get that sweet depreciation.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2015, 03:18:45 AM by chesebert »

anotherAlias

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2015, 04:04:47 AM »
Wow I didn't realize that negotiating for a used car was still a thing.  In my area, all the dealerships have a 'no haggle' price on their used cars.  The price on the car is the price you pay.  I guess they want to focus their salesmen on new cars.  When I bought my last car, I walked in and told the. The two cars that I had picked out online.  They took my license and handed me the keys.  My boyfriend and I tested them both out.  I decided which I wanted and wrote out a check.  Easy peasy. 

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2015, 04:42:22 AM »
I check all three major book value sources (NADA, Kelley Blue Book, and Edmunds).  They aren't perfect, but they'll get you in the ballpark for a realistic price.  I like that KBB gives you a range, which helps in figuring out the negotiating range.  Edmunds usually gives the lowest number, so I'll typically use that as a starting point.  You absolutely must determine the highest price you are willing to pay, accounting for options, mileage, and condition of the vehicle, before you walk on the lot.  Pay absolutely no attention to the list price.  Then, as many other folks have already noted up-thread, you must be willing to walk if they won't give you that price.  Some dealers won't be able to meet your price because they paid too much for the car.  In my experience, they'll simply say "sorry" and let you leave.  If this happens a few times, your price is probably too low.  But if you are anywhere near their bottom line price, they will move heaven and earth to get you to stay.  This is when you really have to stick to your guns.  You've got them on the hook, so don't give in to higher counter-offers, up-sells, etc.

Personally, I advise against trading in.  You are pretty much guaranteed to pay more overall.  Selling a used car private party is not that big of a deal.  The buyer is responsible for paying taxes, registration fees, etc.  I just recently sold a 2001 Hyundai Elantra 2 days after I listed it.  It cost me $25 to list it on AutoTrader.  I got my asking price, which was $600 over the estimated trade-in value.  Again, the key is doing some research to figure out what it is worth, considering options and condition.  Price it a few hundred over what you think you can get for it, then be willing to negotiate down to your bottom line price.  Over-pricing is the big mistake that most people make when trying to sell a car private party.  You turn people off and it sits on the market for a while.

paddedhat

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #18 on: July 01, 2015, 06:38:57 AM »
I have repeatedly found that KBB is significantly higher than reality in my market. It is also used as a marketing tool by sellers, particularly big dealers, who want to create a false sense of value buy posting the inflated KBB retail, then offering "sales" like, "one thousand off KBB retail on every used car on our lot today".  I bought a sharp, used Scion that KBB valued at $16,997. The dealer had some internet only sale of $13,997. I called and offered them a bank check for $11,800, out the door, if it looked as good in person, as it did on line. They countered with $11, 884, since that was their math for a $11K sale and the taxes, fees and plates. In the end I bought the car for nearly six grand less that KBB's bullshit retail price. I got a fair deal on a great car that only a fool would of paid $17K for. 

Chris22

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #19 on: July 01, 2015, 08:05:39 AM »
We are likely looking at a 2013 - 2014 Honda.


Any reason you are going used with a Honda of that vintage?  Is it just because you think you'll save money?

Given the tremendously high resale of Hondas, a 1-2 year old car with low miles is barely any cheaper than a new one. 

My suggestion is:

A) just buy a new Honda
B) buy a 1-2 year old car that isn't a Honda or Toyota and has much higher depreciation
C) buy a Honda (or Toyota) older than 1-2 years. 

Otherwise you get all the bad sides of buying a used car (unknown history, possible abuse) and very little upside (you are going to pay 90-95% of the original MSRP).

waffle

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #20 on: July 01, 2015, 08:16:36 AM »
Wow I didn't realize that negotiating for a used car was still a thing.  In my area, all the dealerships have a 'no haggle' price on their used cars.  The price on the car is the price you pay.  I guess they want to focus their salesmen on new cars.  When I bought my last car, I walked in and told the. The two cars that I had picked out online.  They took my license and handed me the keys.  My boyfriend and I tested them both out.  I decided which I wanted and wrote out a check.  Easy peasy. 

CarMax is the only place I've seen where no haggle actually means no haggle. Chances are if you walked in and paid sticker price you overpaid...

Spork

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #21 on: July 01, 2015, 08:31:31 AM »
Wow I didn't realize that negotiating for a used car was still a thing.  In my area, all the dealerships have a 'no haggle' price on their used cars.  The price on the car is the price you pay.  I guess they want to focus their salesmen on new cars.  When I bought my last car, I walked in and told the. The two cars that I had picked out online.  They took my license and handed me the keys.  My boyfriend and I tested them both out.  I decided which I wanted and wrote out a check.  Easy peasy. 

CarMax is the only place I've seen where no haggle actually means no haggle. Chances are if you walked in and paid sticker price you overpaid...

Maybe it's regional... Maybe local competition makes it such that no-haggle is the norm.  But yeah... around here it is not.  We paid a few grand under asking price at a dealership a couple of years back.  In fact, the price I was willing to pay got a chuckle and a "I wish you'd called and asked before you drove an hour and a half... There is no way we'd get close to that". 

But that's what we ended up paying.  It was the end of the month.  We were willing to walk out.  And (we found out by luck) the sales guy was quitting in a week (and hadn't even told his boss yet... but somehow told us.)  So he might have been willing to get one last commission check, no matter how little it was.

Bob W

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #22 on: July 01, 2015, 08:37:33 AM »
Whoever talks first loses.   

GetItRight

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #23 on: July 01, 2015, 11:48:34 AM »
Figure out market price for the vehicle, subtract an appropriate amount for anything it needs, apply subjective adjustment for whether it is exactly what you want or just close. If asking price is equal to or below that number, you're golden. If asking price is higher, make your take it or leave it offer. This does not seem very complicated to me?

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #24 on: July 02, 2015, 04:25:02 AM »
I have repeatedly found that KBB is significantly higher than reality in my market. It is also used as a marketing tool by sellers, particularly big dealers, who want to create a false sense of value buy posting the inflated KBB retail, then offering "sales" like, "one thousand off KBB retail on every used car on our lot today".  I bought a sharp, used Scion that KBB valued at $16,997. The dealer had some internet only sale of $13,997. I called and offered them a bank check for $11,800, out the door, if it looked as good in person, as it did on line. They countered with $11, 884, since that was their math for a $11K sale and the taxes, fees and plates. In the end I bought the car for nearly six grand less that KBB's bullshit retail price. I got a fair deal on a great car that only a fool would of paid $17K for.

Again, focus on the range that KBB gives, not just the midpoint price.  In my experience, that range is pretty wide and leaves a lot of room on the low side.  Also, again, use all three major online book value services, and start out at or below the lowest.  The point is not to pay exactly what KBB or Edmunds says you should pay; the point is to get a ballpark idea of what is realistic.

Just out of curiosity, how did you arrive at your $11,800 offer on the Scion?

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #25 on: July 02, 2015, 04:34:44 AM »
Whoever talks first loses.   

Not necessarily.  If you start with your bottom line price and stick to your guns, you can win.  A few years ago when I bought my son's first car, I checked out the car, test drove it, then walked into the sales room and offered $4,000 cash for it.  Much squirming and incredulity ensued.  But the salesman didn't let me walk.  It took about an hour of talking, but I ended up buying the car for $4,000 because it was clear that I was serious about plunking down the cash on the spot, and it was also clear that I wasn't going to budge off of that price.  As we were leaving, another salesman whispered to me that I had gotten the car for $40 over cost.  I have no idea whether that was true, but he had no incentive to lie to me since the deal was already done.  It may have helped that it was December 31 and they were trying to get inventory off of the lot.

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #26 on: July 02, 2015, 08:17:24 AM »
Just out of curiosity, how did you arrive at your $11,800 offer on the Scion?

Having wasted far too much time at dealers trying to find a rationally priced, Honda or Toyota in excellent condition, I had switched to monitoring all the regional craigslist action. The plan was to jump on something, cash in hand, within a few hours of it getting posted. That's literally how fast good cars were selling in this region, last year. It was so bad that I laughed at a Dealership sales manager who was holding firm of a decent 4 Y.O stripper Corolla at $2K below the original MSRP. His 'tude was that he would find a buyer at that price, if not me, the next sucker.

When I saw the Scion, it looked great online, and better in person. I was tired of looking, and gave them a low, "take it or leave it, give me an answer by noon today, or I'm moving on", price. It was at a Porsche dealer who doesn't put things on the lot until the car is as perfect as they can make it. It had new low profile performance tires, new brakes all the way around, new inspection, etc.... When I said I wanted to take it today, the salesman refused. Even thought it looked clean, he said it was in no condition to hand over to a customer. It need to be detailed, checked and fueled before I get the keys. I picked the thing up the next day and it looked like it was prepped for a car show, they even shampooed the interior. Overall it was an amazing end to a task that I hate doing.

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #27 on: July 04, 2015, 03:58:00 AM »
Just out of curiosity, how did you arrive at your $11,800 offer on the Scion?

Having wasted far too much time at dealers trying to find a rationally priced, Honda or Toyota in excellent condition, I had switched to monitoring all the regional craigslist action. The plan was to jump on something, cash in hand, within a few hours of it getting posted. That's literally how fast good cars were selling in this region, last year. It was so bad that I laughed at a Dealership sales manager who was holding firm of a decent 4 Y.O stripper Corolla at $2K below the original MSRP. His 'tude was that he would find a buyer at that price, if not me, the next sucker.

When I saw the Scion, it looked great online, and better in person. I was tired of looking, and gave them a low, "take it or leave it, give me an answer by noon today, or I'm moving on", price. It was at a Porsche dealer who doesn't put things on the lot until the car is as perfect as they can make it. It had new low profile performance tires, new brakes all the way around, new inspection, etc.... When I said I wanted to take it today, the salesman refused. Even thought it looked clean, he said it was in no condition to hand over to a customer. It need to be detailed, checked and fueled before I get the keys. I picked the thing up the next day and it looked like it was prepped for a car show, they even shampooed the interior. Overall it was an amazing end to a task that I hate doing.

But where did the $11,800 number come from?  Just a guess?  Or did you do some form of market research?

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2015, 06:15:02 AM »
But where did the $11,800 number come from?  Just a guess?  Or did you do some form of market research?
  Seems a bit silly to be asking a member here if they just take "guesses" when making a purchase of this magnitude, eh?  The offer was based on local NADA private sale numbers, and several local craigslist deals where similar cars were listed and sold within hours. In reality I paid $11K for the car, and had made the 11.8 offer based on an out the door, figure including state sales tax, plates and some allowance for transaction costs. It seems that negotiating on an out the door price is a necessity anymore, since so many dealers pad the bottom line with hundreds in absolute bullshit fees.

Monkey Uncle

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2015, 06:47:26 AM »
But where did the $11,800 number come from?  Just a guess?  Or did you do some form of market research?
  Seems a bit silly to be asking a member here if they just take "guesses" when making a purchase of this magnitude, eh?  The offer was based on local NADA private sale numbers, and several local craigslist deals where similar cars were listed and sold within hours. In reality I paid $11K for the car, and had made the 11.8 offer based on an out the door, figure including state sales tax, plates and some allowance for transaction costs. It seems that negotiating on an out the door price is a necessity anymore, since so many dealers pad the bottom line with hundreds in absolute bullshit fees.

Sorry if my persistence seems silly, but the OP specifically asked how people come up with their bottom line price.  Since you shared a story about getting a great deal, I figured it was important to explain how you came up with your number.

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #30 on: July 04, 2015, 07:03:39 AM »
You may also get some info from https://www.truecar.com/#/. If you have USAA, GEICO,  and probably others they also have affiliate links that are supposed to include more perks. Might help you get to a price point. (I haven't used them myself but heard of them through work and made a note in case of future purchases.)

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #31 on: July 04, 2015, 07:27:29 AM »
Here's how I did it the last time.  I went into the dealership having had already looked at their used cars on the internet and knowing which ones I was interested in looking at.  Of these, there was a range of prices, within the amount I planned to pay.   

I went there, looked at them all, made the selection, made an offer, which they refused.  (I got the same story about no haggling on price).  But the price they were asking was in excess of blue book.  They also told me they would rather have me finance they pay cash, so that was not an incentive to budge on the price.   

So I left.  I figured the car wasn't going anywhere at THAT price, and I was right.  I went back in after a week and a half and offered them my price again.  They accepted.

By researching what you want to look at up front, at no point in time should you need to be discussing with the dealer the max amount you are willing to pay.  Figure out what kind of car you want and do research online before you go, would be my best advice.  I think I made a spreadsheet to track all the potentials at nearby dealers. 

3Mer

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Re: How to Negotiate a used car at a dealership?
« Reply #32 on: July 04, 2015, 07:34:09 AM »
Here's how I did it the last time.  I went into the dealership having had already looked at their used cars on the internet and knowing which ones I was interested in looking at.  Of these, there was a range of prices, within the amount I planned to pay.   

I went there, looked at them all, made the selection, made an offer, which they refused.  (I got the same story about no haggling on price).  But the price they were asking was in excess of blue book.  They also told me they would rather have me finance they pay cash, so that was not an incentive to budge on the price.   

So I left.  I figured the car wasn't going anywhere at THAT price, and I was right.  I went back in after a week and a half and offered them my price again.  They accepted.

By researching what you want to look at up front, at no point in time should you need to be discussing with the dealer the max amount you are willing to pay.  Figure out what kind of car you want and do research online before you go, would be my best advice.  I think I made a spreadsheet to track all the potentials at nearby dealers.
Oh, and I asked for another dealer to help me when I went back.  I didn't like the first guy's attitude.  The second one was an older gentleman and I think he knew I didn't want to hear the sales pitch.  The whole thing took less than 45 minutes that time.   The guy congratulated me on purchasing the car "on my own", being a single woman.  Since he was an older gentleman, I didn't take offense to it but instead thought it was kind of funny.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!