How many car purchases is too much in a lifetime?

[Fuperw84]

I'm ashame to admit this but I just purchased/traded in my 17th car. During the 2020 pandemic I switched cars 6 times. My wife says I have a problem. I've lost so much money trading in cars. I currently own 4 cars. Is this normal? How do I stop this.

[2Birds1Stone]

It's not normal.

You do have a problem.

Start with why. Why do you feel you need to trade in cars? They are a (usually depreciating) tool to get you from point A to point B. You clearly don't sound like a gearhead/car guy.....so what gives?

[Tasse]

This is not normal. And if your wife says it is a problem, it definitely is.

[nereo]

I’m not worried about the number of times - I’m concerned with the statement “I’ve lost so much money trading cars”. If you were swapping out high mileage cars every year or two but braking even each time (or even turning a profit) I’d say well done. But your post suggests you are losing a small fortune - maybe six figures over the last half decade?

[Fuperw84]

I lost at least $5k every time I have traded in. I'm 38 years old with a 10month and 3 years old daughter. I currently have 4 cars 2 already paid off. I'm getting the urge to trade in again for a newer car and end up with another auto loan. I get bored easily and love the thrill of driving a "new" car. I have $40k in savings and own 1 rental property.

[Fuperw84]

I constantly use the excuse of safety as the reason to switch cars. As soon as something is wrong with my car, even a flat tire I feel its unsafe and want to buy a different car to transport the kids. I have a financial adviser and putting money monthly in whole life insurance, 401k and savings account. I am saving monthly for my daughter's college monthly.

[nereo]

I constantly use the excuse of safety as the reason to switch cars. As soon as something is wrong with my car, even a flat tire I feel its unsafe and want to buy a different car to transport the kids. I have a financial adviser and putting money monthly in whole life insurance, 401k and savings account. I am saving monthly for my daughter's college monthly.

Is this your real reason, or the excuse you give to yourself to justify the loss?
I’d argue constantly changing cars makes you less safe as your are constantly having to relearn exactly where all the controls are and getting a feel for the blind spots, braking sdistances and length of each vehicle.

[Metalcat]

This does not sound healthy and if it were me I would proactively seek professional help to address what sounds like a compulsive behaviour.

On the bright side, this is VERY resolvable. You don't have to feel compelled to replace your car or like your car is unsafe if you don't want to. This is something that's a lot easier to address than you might feel it is.

[SunnyDays]

This sounds problematic to me. The fact that you say you're ashamed to admit it means that you know you have a problem.
It's not about the cars, it's about something else.  It's up to you to decide whether you want to get down to the root of the issue. 
Even if you didn't lose money with each trade in, it's costing you in other ways, like effort and the time spent researching/buying car after car. 
As they say about addictions, "You can never have enough of what you don't really want."

[kpd905]

If you get a flat tire, you fix or replace the tire.

When an appliance stops working in your house do you fix/replace it or go find a new house?

[Must_ache]

Financial suicide, that is.  Pick out a nice car that you enjoy living in when you don't have a home anymore.

[Villanelle]

It would be one thing if you got to 17 by purchasing >$1000 cars with many years and many thousand of miles, and driving each one until the wheels feel off (figuratively, or literally).  Still maybe not optimal, but kind understandable.

But it seems you are buying new or not-cheap cars, and then just trading because you are... bored?  See something shinier and newer?  Didn't bother to research well?  Or some combo of all those things.

That's definitely not normal.  It's crazily wasteful.  It's a sign of some larger, unaddressed problem in the same what that people would look at a person who buys tens of thousands of dollars of stuff from the Home Shopping Network, and has those items sitting around, many times used or worn only once (or not at all). 

People would look at the person and almost universally agree that not only was it not normal, and not only is it wasteful, it's unhealthy and problematic, and probably a sign of a larger issue or unfulfilled need.

WHY are you doing this?  When you bought a car--presumably one that you liked a lot because you did buy it, after all--and 2 months later you decide you need a different car, what are you telling yourself?  What is the supposed reason?

Is that reason worth trading your financial security for?  Worth losing your home for?  Worth bankruptcy?  Worth losing your wife over?  (IDK the details of your finances, but since you mention losing money and your wife's comments, it seems fairly safe to infer that you don't have tens of millions of dollars that would make these choices still wasteful, but likely not a major financial factor.)  So again, what do you tell yourself to justify this?  What do you get out of this?

How do you stop?  You either decide to stop and then stop, just like someone might quit smoking or start working out.  Or, you get assistance from a mental health professional.

(Assuming this is real.)

[Dreamer40]

Yes, this is a problem if you want to retire someday or have any financial goals at all. I’m in my 40s and I’ve only owned 3 cars (including my current one) in my entire life. And I’ve always had and used a car. Each car can last many years and none were remotely unsafe. There is almost never a good reason to own more than one car per driver at a time. Even that is more than many of us need. It’s ok to find yourself in situations where owning an additional vehicle might be convenient (like it would be great to have truck around on the day you want to haul something). But that doesn’t justify buying one. It’d be cheaper and easier to have that random thing delivered or rent a truck for the day. It’s ok to be inconvenienced occasionally.

As for how to stop doing this… if you can’t just stop on your own right now, then it sounds like an addiction and should be treated as such. A therapist can help you figure out what’s really going on and give you effective strategies. That doesn’t mean you’ll be in therapy forever. Just commit to meeting with somebody a few times and see if it resolves the problem.

[curious_george]

The answer to this great question is 42.

You can continue buying cars until you have bought 42 cars.

Once you hit 42 though you cannot buy another car beyond this number of cars, forever, until the end of time.

Choose wisely. Buy Toyota.

[nereo]

Choose wisely. Buy Toyota.

Well, which one is it?

[Wolfpack Mustachian]

It's a big problem financially because of its scale. Tons of other people do have similar problems with a variety of consumeristic items, but my biggest concerns would be the following:

1. A compulsion for new cars is singlehandedly one of the worst consumeristic tendencies in terms of financial damage.

2. It seems like your compulsion is increasing over time. It sounds like you went 35 years having 11 cars. Not great by any stretch, but then it got worse. 6 times during the 2020 pandemic......I'm not sure how you're defining the pandemic, but even if it's 3 years, that's going from 11 cars over, say 18 years of driving time to 6 cars over just a 2-3 years. It seems that your problem is only increasing.

Please seek help before you financially ruin not just yourself but your family.

[JupiterGreen]

This is not normal. And if your wife says it is a problem, it definitely is.

Haha.

Yes as others have said, it does sound like a problem. I don't think the number of cars is the issue, maybe you buy old cars and they don't last. But you said you are losing a ton of money, so you are really engaging in self-harm behavior. That's not good, therapy might help.

[clarkfan1979]

I'm ashame to admit this but I just purchased/traded in my 17th car. During the 2020 pandemic I switched cars 6 times. My wife says I have a problem. I've lost so much money trading in cars. I currently own 4 cars. Is this normal? How do I stop this.

I would try to address it. My parents are friends with a couple that divorced over this problem. The overall problem was money. The gentlemen would trade in 3-4 cars/year. He was not a gear head and did not add any value to the cars. Over the course of about 15-20 years of doing this, they eventually ran out of money and divorced. At one point in time they owned a 500K home in Florida and had a 300K vacation home/cabin in Northern Wisconsin that she inherited from her parents. She now lives in a trailer park in the Midwest. 

[ATtiny85]

It’s great that you posted. Hopefully you keep the dialogue going. There a lot of addicts on the board, from drugs to hoarders to alcohol to attention to abuse to gambling. Based on my reading, they seem to see some benefit from “posting it out” here.

Good luck, you are on a tough path if you keep burning bucks on something like transportation.

[Omy]

In addition to the $5000 loss each time you trade in a car, you are incurring a lot of insurance and maintenance costs keeping multiple cars that you don't need.

I also know lots of people who've divorced over money (including me...my ex had crazy spending habits). It's time to decide if having a shiny new car every year is worth risking your family's financial well-being over.

[LD_TAndK]

I think the mustachian thing to do would be to develop a bicycle addiction instead

[GilesMM]

Normal would be to own 1-2 cars per family and drive them 8-10 years thus purchasing a car (used!) every 5-10 years.

[slappy]

Based on your post history, you should probably seek therapy for this compulsive behavior.

[tomorrowsomewherenew]

The OP also posted about losing $117k in stocks a couple years back, and having $190k in student loans.

Compulsively trading cars and stocks is highly concerning and self-destructive behavior. I think you should turn over your finances to your wife and let her handle the bills and investments from here on out. I also think you need to be visiting a therapist at least weekly, and see if they think you need to be referred to a psychiatrist.

This needs to be under control before it spirals into something even more damaging and destructive.

[Samuel]

Based on your post history, you should probably seek therapy for this compulsive behavior.

After reading those other posts I would not use the word "probably" in regards to needing therapy. OP needs serious treatment for compulsive gambling, stock speculating, and spending addictions. He's trying to white knuckle his way through issues that regularly destroy lives, futures, and families.

[patchyfacialhair]

Reading your post history, OP, you need Dave Ramsey, and probably therapy.

Seriously, you're probably book smart but have no common sense at all. Once you get your mind right, then go to Dave Ramsey's baby steps and don't deviate at all from his rules. His rules are sub-optimal when you're talking to a Mustachian audience, but for you, you'll need to demonstrate that you can do simple basic level 1 stuff with your finances before leveling up. Good luck!

[Just Joe]

If safety is your reason then how about finding ways to adjust your lifestyle so you aren't in cars as much? Prob safer to walk and use trains?

I used to flip cheap cars when I was single and it would make car ownership nearly free or profit me a little. I flipped dozens of cheap cars most of which were suffering from neglect rather than actually worn out. Fix it, drive it for a few months, sell it, repeat. Interested in that? I was on a shoestring budget all the time b/c I was young and poor.

These days we drive 20+ and 9+ year old cars b/c cars are just expensive. We wear out the older one, mostly save the nice one for trips. I supplement my miles with an ebike. DW and I also carpool to work to reduce our total miles and TCO. 

Any interest in classic cars? That's about the only way I know a regular person with a full time job can flip cars and make any profit. Several of us in my family do this. Specialize in a particular brand or style. Restore, repair, etc all DIY. Sell it, repeat. Returns can be quite profitable but requires 100s of hours of your time, a garage, tools, knowledge, etc.

RE: safety - consider the financial safety of your family. They need a home and an income they can rely on as much as possible. The stories homeless people tell can be tales of sudden changes. One day they were getting by, and then the next they were struggling before landing on the street. Sudden unemployment or health problem can be the cause. A year's income in savings would have been helpful. Not a nicer car.

A story I'll never forget was that of a friend of a friend. Couple were DINKS and really obsessed with their grown up toys. New cars, new trucks, new boats, new motorcycles, etc. They were buying vehicles, upgrading same vehicles with whatever the cool accessories were of the moment, and then selling them at some loss just a few months later before buying the next round of toys. These were two married people with four full time jobs just barely staying ahead of their spending. I remember a story of them selling one toy b/c the newer version was ~8 mph faster than the old one. And a vehicle they sold b/c the accessory installer put a mounting hole in the chassis rail an inch from the correct position. No structural problems, was invisible to anyone not under the vehicle, etc - but they immediately sold the vehicle b/c it was no longer "perfect".

End story: divorce, bankruptcy, and long term health problems. Can't imagine any of vehicle specs matters now.

[TomTX]

I constantly use the excuse of safety as the reason to switch cars. As soon as something is wrong with my car, even a flat tire I feel its unsafe and want to buy a different car to transport the kids. I have a financial adviser and putting money monthly in whole life insurance, 401k and savings account. I am saving monthly for my daughter's college monthly.

You need therapy/counseling for the car behavior.

Separately saying "I have a financial adviser and putting money monthly in whole life insurance" seems to confirm you are quite gullible when a sales guy wants to sell you something.

[rantk81]

I thought this thread was a troll, until I saw the OP registered their account back in 2017.

[Omy]

8 years here and 41 posts...and doesn't understand finances at all? Sounds fishy.

[RWD]

8 years here and 41 posts...and doesn't understand finances at all? Sounds fishy.

They come by periodically to complain/vent about how they've screwed up their financial life but never listen to any of the feedback/advice. They like the idea of having fixed their bad habits but don't want to actually put in the effort.

[Villanelle]

I lost at least $5k every time I have traded in. I'm 38 years old with a 10month and 3 years old daughter. I currently have 4 cars 2 already paid off. I'm getting the urge to trade in again for a newer car and end up with another auto loan. I get bored easily and love the thrill of driving a "new" car. I have $40k in savings and own 1 rental property.

You are 38 with 2 young kids and have only $40k in savings.  You say that like it means you are in a solid financial position, but if that were my situation, I'd be terrified.  You are one job loss and a few months away from not being able to pay your bills.  You are a failed roof and dead refrigerator on that rental property from having almost no savings.

You can't afford a new car.  You can't even afford the cars you have.

You are bored with your life and trying to fix that with temporary adrenaline hits from buying cars. That's a massive problem.  Several massive problems, actually.  You've proven that buying a new car doesn't actually fix your dissatisfaction.  It just blurs it for a month or two.  At the cost of $5000+ for that month. 

Get a hobby, preferably one that is very low cost.  Spend time with your family.  If you don't enjoy doing that, then figure out why and solve that problem. 

Just as you've been told repeatedly in the past, this is an genuine problem and you need to address it before it becomes a crisis.   

[stealthwealth]

I'm 45 and on car number two, so I'm probably an outlier....

[moof]

Age 45, and on car #5.
'83 hand-me-down POS Ford Ranger I barely drove before giving back to my parents when I finished college and went off to work.
'98 brand new Dodge Dakota, since you need a new reliable car when you start working, right?  What a moron move...
'02 band new Toyota Tundra, since I wanted 4WD.  Major moron move.
'11 used Nissan Leaf to keep miles off the truck that was expensive to drive (and soon had transmission troubles and was ditched).
'15 Toyota Prius to replace the dead truck.

Best move has been the cargo bike and not commuting by car.  We average maybe 5-6,000 miles a year total driving.  We need 2 cars just often enough that we have a mental block over ditching the Leaf and going single car.  With both paid off the cost is kind of below our radar.  Pretty sure that is sub-optimal.

[PDXTabs]

I lost at least $5k every time I have traded in. I'm 38 years old with a 10month and 3 years old daughter. I currently have 4 cars 2 already paid off. I'm getting the urge to trade in again for a newer car and end up with another auto loan. I get bored easily and love the thrill of driving a "new" car. I have $40k in savings and own 1 rental property.

I'm 39 and my car is eight years old. I will only replace it in two years so that my son can drive it. I have three kids and another 0 in my savings.

You should pick a cheaper hobby like poker or smoking cigarettes at the bar.

[deborah]

My cars have lasted me 9 years each, on average. This includes the one that was written off after a year, when a bus didn’t realise I was stopped waiting for an ambulance (lights and sirens going) to cross the road and ploughed straight through me at speed. That car was safe enough. I survived, and didn’t need to stay in hospital. What more do you want in the way of safety?

[GuitarStv]

I'm 45 and on car number two, so I'm probably an outlier....

Definately.

I'm 42 and still on car number one.  Hoping to retire and sell the car without ever buying another.  :P

[TomTX]

I'm married, so it's a bit challenging to disentangle it all.

However, if we look at "my" car, I'm on car #2 (purchased cheap and used 4+ years ago) - and I turn 50 this year.

[Freedomin5]

Not only should you stop trading in cars, you should probably sell at least two of your four cars. Why do you need four cars?

And yes, it’s not normal. I’m in my 40s and have owned two cars. I currently have no car, though to be fair, I live in a city with a great public transportation system.

[curious_george]

In the past 20 years I have spent 8 grand on 2 vehicles.

I sold my first car for 300 dollars after the transmission failed and the frame had rust holes in it that I could put my fist through and the engine was burning a quart of oil every 500 miles and the brake lines rusted out.

I can sell my current vehicle for 6 grand.

So I have spent $1,700 dollars on vehicle depreciation in 20 years of driving.

You need a cheaper hobby.

[taco_sushi]

As a car guy myself, recently FIRED, this is my observations and advice:

1) Usually you're spending money on impulse buys like this because of a larger problem that you're not solving. So you're filling that void, with the purchase of another new car. Figure out what that is - and solve that.

2) To help curb spending on unnecessary new cars, enter the cost of a new car into a 4% Fire calculator, and see how many years you'll add to your FIRE timeline. Ask yourself, are you okay to accept X more years, for a year car experience again this year?

3) If you are a car enthusiast like me, things you can do to kick the urge --
i) I'll watch long POV drives on youtube with my headphones for different rides. Pretty fun. Ideally they recorded in 4K. 
ii) Splurge on a rental when you go on vacation (Not all the time, but when it makes sense to you)
iii Go rent that exotic car for a long weekend on Turo. Will cost you several hundreds, but not thousands like picking up 6 new cars in 2020! 

And I agree with others, you don't need 4 cars. It's a luxury to have that. I would plug what you get if you sold those 2 cars, and invested into index now, and how much time that shaves off your FIRE timeline.  See if that's worth it to you!  GL

[Dicey]

DH bought his Ford F150 brand new in 2002. Paid $20k cash out the door. It has <110k miles on it. He does his own repairs. It still looks good and runs great. Compared to Mr. Dicey, you are definitely a cautionary tale, if not a complete bullshitter.

[OurTown]

Some people on the internet are real, others are trolls.  If this dude is a troll, then whatever.  If for real, then yes, the car purchases are a problem.  One car per adult, please.  DR would say pay cash, I am fine with paying 50% down, pay off the balance in 12 months.  Keep them rolling for an average of about 10 years.  Bank the money you have been wasting on payments. 

[MrGreen]

I owned more than my fair share of cars in my pre-Muatachian days. In total, I've had 7 cars in my life, 5 of them in my 20s. Though technically I don't own one now because we're a one car household. Six cars in one year sounds like a huge pain in the ass. Might as well just light some hundred dollar bills on fire!

[jinga nation]

8 years here and 41 posts...and doesn't understand finances at all? Sounds fishy.

They come by periodically to complain/vent about how they've screwed up their financial life but never listen to any of the feedback/advice. They like the idea of having fixed their bad habits but don't want to actually put in the effort.

And I doubt OP will be back to read the forum's responses and take actions to straighten up finances.
OP sounds like a now-distant friend of mine. "I have a financial advisor. FA will take care of everything." Proceeds to continue on bad financial moves.
OP's financial advisor, who advised a whole life policy. I don't think that's a term life policy. :Face Palm:

[TomTX]

I owned more than my fair share of cars in my pre-Muatachian days. In total, I've had 7 cars in my life, 5 of them in my 20s. Though technically I don't own one now because we're a one car household. Six cars in one year sounds like a huge pain in the ass. Might as well just light some hundred dollar bills on fire!

I'm almost 50 and the household (2 adults) have owned a total of 5 cars since we bought the first one (full price, but not hugely expensive - Saturn SL1) in 1995. Three of these have been low-end-used at $2,300-$3,500 each, one was half MSRP new due to stacking Cash for Clunkers + Air Check Texas(back when that was actually funded) + Manufacturer end-of-model-year incentive.

[Kris]

I think you know you have a problem. I also sense you really need therapy.

Your wife deserves better, dude.

[RetireOrDieTrying]

At 53 I have owned somewhere north of 100 cars and 40 motorcycles. I'm not kidding. I used to buy all kinds of old (60s and older) vehicles and fix them up. I would promptly sell them for nowhere nearly what I had in them, and do it all again. I wasn't a bad businessman, because I wasn't a businessman at all - I simply derived a great deal of satisfaction from taking something from a sad state to beautiful. It was kind of a White Knight syndrome for cars. Pay attention to that last sentence, 'cause although I think your manifestation is different, the psychological drivers are not.

Someone else in this thread mentioned that perhaps your behavior was indicative of an unfulfilled void somewhere. Based upon my own experiences, I would personally guess that's not far off the mark. Cars are not your issue; they are a *symptom* of your real issue. Although it might sound on the surface ridiculous to say "see a quality therapist" about buying cars, that's actually my genuine advice. Your actions sound like a form of addiction at the level you're exhibiting them. It's long been held that compulsive behaviors are attempts to close a (usually) completely unrelated gap, and they'll sadly never work. Only identifying and (hopefully) fixing the underlying issue(s) will.

Whether you think I'm being silly with my advice or not, at the very least you should recognize that this is a genuine peril to your future. If the issue is unresolved, then whether it's car turnover or some other harmful activity, your self-sabotaging behavior will continue, harming your future and potentially those around you by extension.

This might be a little anti-Mustachian, but don't be afraid to get a quality therapist. This is one case where the difference between the words "Cost" and "Value" can be significant.

I wish you all the very best in your struggle.

[use2betrix]

Last year I bought a Jeep wrangler for $28.5k, daily drove it for a year, and sold it for $27k.

2 years ago I bought a 2003 cobra for $38k. Drove it sparingly (low mile car) and recently sold it for $38k

In 2020 I bought a brand new Corolla hatchback put around 25k miles on it, and sold it for around a $1500-$2k loss

We’ve done decent selling a fair share of vehicles. Not every one, but they aren’t always terrible.

We currently have a nice 2020 F250 and 2023 crosstrek that I think we’ll be keeping for some time. The F250 has a 7 year 125k bumper to bumper warrant through Ford.

[alsoknownasDean]

OP I'm the same age as you and have owned six motor vehicles, the newest of which was nine years old when I bought it.

In terms of ownership periods:

Car 1: 3.5 years
Car 2: 5 months (written off)
Car 3: 3 years
Car 4: 4 years
Car 5: 6 years
Car 6: 2 years

The current car is 19 years old and I've decided to run out the clock on it and then buy an EV. Probably a good few years off as it's still very reliable and parts are readily available.

It seems the average period of car ownership is in the 3-5 year range.