Author Topic: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America  (Read 4778 times)

ProxyRetired

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Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« on: September 12, 2022, 09:30:32 AM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/heres-what-a-2-million-retirement-looks-like-in-america-11661702455

#2... $6900 a month in pension and he's worried about market shifts...

GuitarStv

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2022, 09:38:11 AM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/heres-what-a-2-million-retirement-looks-like-in-america-11661702455

#2... $6900 a month in pension and he's worried about market shifts...

Wow, the spend is very high for each of the people featured.  Is this what traditional retirements look like?

jinga nation

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2022, 09:45:41 AM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/heres-what-a-2-million-retirement-looks-like-in-america-11661702455

#2... $6900 a month in pension and he's worried about market shifts...

Wow, the spend is very high for each of the people featured.  Is this what traditional retirements look like?

^ this. Family of 4 in MCOL city in FL (could be medium high now), in clown house with pool, and we don't spend this much, and we aren't super super mustachians. (I'd accept the deserved facepunches from some on the forums.)
There's a hardcore mustachian out there reading this WSJ article and going full throttle on a punching bag.

ROFL laughing when one of the case study folks said they'd move to FL to reduce costs/taxes. Y'all seen our property taxes plus high home/auto insurance, plus optional flood insurance?
« Last Edit: September 12, 2022, 10:15:56 AM by jinga nation »

RWD

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2022, 09:46:03 AM »

AMandM

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2022, 11:30:39 AM »
Wow, the spend is very high for each of the people featured.  Is this what traditional retirements look like?

Well, this is the WSJ. It's been coming to our house for the past couple of months because DS signed up for a student trial subscription. It's amazing to see the spending level assumed by both the feature articles (RE section featuring only multimillion dollar houses) and the ads (six-figure cruises).

wageslave23

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2022, 12:18:19 PM »
There is absolutely no point to this article. Their retirement budgets are double the median household income. Why not ask Michael Jordan what his retirement spending looks like? $500 million doesn't go as far as you'd think after all...

FireLane

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2022, 06:08:02 PM »
I have $2 million and I'm retired. Where's my WSJ profile?

Granted, I have to make my stash last longer, but their burn rates are ridiculous. I'm honestly surprised that people who worked a lot longer than I did, in jobs that probably paid as well as or better than mine, weren't mega-wealthy by the time they retired at a standard age. Some of them still have mortgages they're paying off!

I guess I shouldn't be surprised. They must have been spending like crazy throughout their working careers. When you're used to living on $100,000 a year with every luxury, it'll be hard to save much even on an exorbitant salary.

jinga nation

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2022, 10:44:16 AM »
the pushing of unneeded products by media makes it easy to use the extra/disposable income to inflate lifestyle. As Carlin put it:
Quote
“A house is just a place to keep your stuff while you go out and get more stuff.”

This whole article can be summarized with:
Quote
"Bulls**t is truly the American soundtrack."

Duke03

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2022, 02:10:41 PM »
I glanced at the numbers because all these articles are the same.  None of these people have a money problem they all have a SPENDING problem.  Geez all but one spends over 100k a year and even they spend 92k... We are a family of 4 that lives a very good life, and our spending comes nowhere near 100k a year...

FIRE Artist

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2022, 07:00:32 PM »
I have $2 million and I'm retired. Where's my WSJ profile?

Granted, I have to make my stash last longer, but their burn rates are ridiculous. I'm honestly surprised that people who worked a lot longer than I did, in jobs that probably paid as well as or better than mine, weren't mega-wealthy by the time they retired at a standard age. Some of them still have mortgages they're paying off!

I guess I shouldn't be surprised. They must have been spending like crazy throughout their working careers. When you're used to living on $100,000 a year with every luxury, it'll be hard to save much even on an exorbitant salary.

the mortgages really get me as well.  One of them had a 400k mortgage, how you have that into retirement is beyond comprehension for me. 

JupiterGreen

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2022, 07:49:49 PM »
I have $2 million and I'm retired. Where's my WSJ profile?

Granted, I have to make my stash last longer, but their burn rates are ridiculous. I'm honestly surprised that people who worked a lot longer than I did, in jobs that probably paid as well as or better than mine, weren't mega-wealthy by the time they retired at a standard age. Some of them still have mortgages they're paying off!

I guess I shouldn't be surprised. They must have been spending like crazy throughout their working careers. When you're used to living on $100,000 a year with every luxury, it'll be hard to save much even on an exorbitant salary.

the mortgages really get me as well.  One of them had a 400k mortgage, how you have that into retirement is beyond comprehension for me.

Yeah the article is madness all around, it would be nice if they had even one person with a reasonable retirement budget.

Abe

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2022, 07:51:09 PM »
My family spends a large amount (by far taxes is the biggest fraction, then a mortgage that is about 10% of our income), but our budget fits and we save 2x what we spend. Some money-saving tips for rich people:
1) no fancy private schools, you’re paying for public school already.
2) that Lexus isn’t any nicer than a Toyota.
3) you don’t “need” to stay in a fancy resort in Spain just because your friends do.
4) mow your lawn and do your laundry. its not hard.
5) stop drinking all that fancy alcohol.
6) that dinner at the restaurant wasn’t worth it. Also, see #5.

I’m pretty sure that’s what most of my neighbors waste their money on…and why I’ll be retired while my kid still thinks I’m cool and I can go on camping trips with them.

I do think the WSJ and NYT retirement articles are written just to make us hate the people featured.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2022, 07:53:09 PM by Abe »

AccidentialMustache

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2022, 09:29:17 PM »
I do think the WSJ and NYT retirement articles are written just to make us hate the people featured.

I'd say they're written to get eyeballs, to convert those into advertising dollars. Hate is just a convenient way to get those eyeballs to provide free advertising as they pass it on to others "look at this shit!"

Disclaimer: I did some time in the online ad industry and my views may be overly cynical.

rantk81

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2022, 06:02:12 AM »
Well, I have $2M  (actually a touch under that after yesterday's market action)... but I'm not retired yet.  I could be, but it would be tight given some of my circumstances.

Everyone has their own situation.  Sometimes that situation is that a family can't help themselves by wasting an extra $3000/month on non-essentials.  Other times, people need to support extended family members.

But yeah, that article is kind of click-bait-y with the some of the ridiculous expenses of those people...
« Last Edit: September 14, 2022, 06:54:54 AM by rantk81 »

jinga nation

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2022, 07:20:51 AM »
I do think the WSJ and NYT retirement articles are written just to make us hate the people featured.

I'd say they're written to get eyeballs, to convert those into advertising dollars. Hate is just a convenient way to get those eyeballs to provide free advertising as they pass it on to others "look at this shit!"

Disclaimer: I did some time in the online ad industry and my views may be overly cynical.

Not in the online ad industry, but i have very similar views. The article did the job.
At a cloud provider conference, visited a vendor booth. They were overly proud of their product which tracks your mouse movements and actions on websites, to "measure user experience and behavior". A lot of news websites use this product. (I should look up the name.)

Just Joe

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2022, 08:58:02 AM »
Not in the online ad industry, but i have very similar views. The article did the job.
At a cloud provider conference, visited a vendor booth. They were overly proud of their product which tracks your mouse movements and actions on websites, to "measure user experience and behavior". A lot of news websites use this product. (I should look up the name.)

How does that work? Is that something I can block with EFF plugins or uBlock Origin? Web surveillance drives me batty.

Turtle

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2022, 09:02:12 AM »
I do think the WSJ and NYT retirement articles are written just to make us hate the people featured.

I'd say they're written to get eyeballs, to convert those into advertising dollars. Hate is just a convenient way to get those eyeballs to provide free advertising as they pass it on to others "look at this shit!"

Disclaimer: I did some time in the online ad industry and my views may be overly cynical.

Hate makes brains shut down - which makes for easier picking of pockets.  Or just outright conning into handing over money, for that matter.

jinga nation

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2022, 01:35:15 PM »
Not in the online ad industry, but i have very similar views. The article did the job.
At a cloud provider conference, visited a vendor booth. They were overly proud of their product which tracks your mouse movements and actions on websites, to "measure user experience and behavior". A lot of news websites use this product. (I should look up the name.)

How does that work? Is that something I can block with EFF plugins or uBlock Origin? Web surveillance drives me batty.

IIRC the rep said it was embedded in the webpage code. I tried looking at the conference map from 2019 to find the vendor but the only copy I could find was grainy. No bueno. Meanwhile using browser-based ad/tracker blockers and a pi-hole is the next best thing. (Configured my ISP's router to advertise the pi-hole as default DNS server.)

ddoren

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2022, 05:39:23 PM »
Just got around to reading this article. Wow. What a mess. $144k a year in expenses, but yes the bagged salads are your problem. My head nearly popped off.

mistymoney

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2022, 05:47:34 PM »
i guess I didn't see much amiss in these stories.

#1
2M, 144k spend
has a pension over 80k/year "after taxes and insurance" - then wife is still working with 400k saved
3.2% WR, not counting any of wife's earning that may be used.

#2
1.5M, 100k spend
Seems the most worrying position, but he must have pretty good soc sec, earning over150K for a lot of years?
'Social Security checks help him pay for the townhome’s upkeep, which he estimates to be about $2,000 a year.' this makes no sense to me...
6.6% WR  not counting soc sec which i think must be more than 2k/year - but he's 84 already! so - I think in good enough shape to make it to 100....

#3
1.8M, 110k spend
25k in soc sec
4.25% WR - Has 2 properties to rely on.


#4
1M, 92k spend
44k in social security, has keep some income all these years, earned 40k so far this year.
0.4%WR
But bottom of article says theya re spending 9200/month which would be 1.3%WR
Wife still working, she doesn't have much savings called small, not specified

They aren't super frugal, but if they were a friend, I wouldn't be concerned about their finances....

Metalcat

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #20 on: September 14, 2022, 06:58:17 PM »
i guess I didn't see much amiss in these stories.

#1
2M, 144k spend
has a pension over 80k/year "after taxes and insurance" - then wife is still working with 400k saved
3.2% WR, not counting any of wife's earning that may be used.

#2
1.5M, 100k spend
Seems the most worrying position, but he must have pretty good soc sec, earning over150K for a lot of years?
'Social Security checks help him pay for the townhome’s upkeep, which he estimates to be about $2,000 a year.' this makes no sense to me...
6.6% WR  not counting soc sec which i think must be more than 2k/year - but he's 84 already! so - I think in good enough shape to make it to 100....

#3
1.8M, 110k spend
25k in soc sec
4.25% WR - Has 2 properties to rely on.


#4
1M, 92k spend
44k in social security, has keep some income all these years, earned 40k so far this year.
0.4%WR
But bottom of article says theya re spending 9200/month which would be 1.3%WR
Wife still working, she doesn't have much savings called small, not specified

They aren't super frugal, but if they were a friend, I wouldn't be concerned about their finances....

It's more that they spend a lot and feel quite stressed about their expenses, and reading between the lines, perhaps the still working spouses feel a lot of pressure to keep working because of that money stress.

I think the point is that it's a bit weird that all of these people should be perfectly fine.

Cassie

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2022, 02:00:48 PM »
Not feeling sorry for any of these people as they have lots of fat they could trim.

farmecologist

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #22 on: September 23, 2022, 08:28:38 AM »
We were laughing at this article in another thread...especially at the $6900 a month pension.  My apologies to use the cliché term 'boomers',  but the article is pretty much about "what a $2 Million wealthy *boomer* retirement" looks like. 

First of all, the vast, vast majority of non-'boomer' folks have no pension whatsoever...and even for the lucky few that do, the amount will be vastly less than $6900 a month.  Frankly, even formerly high paying pension programs have been cut back substantially...or cut altogether.  No disrespect to the 'boomer' folks though....I'd certainly take a $6900 pension if I had the opportunity!

Personal note.   At my large corporation, the pension program was cut off a long time ago now.  There was a cutoff age where if you were old enough, you would still get the FULL pension...and everyone else was SOL ( hint : I was SOL..haha ).   Was it fair?  Absolutely not...but the only ones to get a pension at all were 'boomers'.  The last of them retired just a couple years ago.  So yeah...the pension I was promised when I hired on was erased just like that.  Luckily, I didn't count it in any of our retirement planning, etc...

It was pretty funny working with these people and hearing them constantly whine about if they could retire or not.   WTF man...they have social security, and a huge freaking pension.   I suspect their story would be similar to some of the stories in this article. 
« Last Edit: September 23, 2022, 08:30:32 AM by farmecologist »

Sandi_k

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #23 on: September 23, 2022, 08:51:07 AM »
We were laughing at this article in another thread...especially at the $6900 a month pension. 

So yeah...the pension I was promised when I hired on was erased just like that.  Luckily, I didn't count it in any of our retirement planning, etc...


Just a note, but if you were vested in that pension, they cannot take it away unless they file bankruptcy, per ERISSA. And then the Pension Guarantee Benefits Corp would step in with a reduced pension amount for you. It takes 5 years to vest.

So if you vested, there may be a frozen benefit for you; it might not be what you'd planned on initially, yeah - but there would be something, by Federal law. Once you've vested, those funds are locked away, and owed to you.

Turtle

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #24 on: September 23, 2022, 02:33:39 PM »
I worked some place like that, where the cash value pension was changed a couple years after I was hired.

I've got 12670 dollars sitting there earning a very measly amount of interest.  It'll get cashed out as part of my first year of retirement.

Spouse's company did away with cash value pension also, but their existing balances got rolled into their 401k which was a much better deal than mine.

Michael in ABQ

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2022, 03:18:37 PM »
Not in the online ad industry, but i have very similar views. The article did the job.
At a cloud provider conference, visited a vendor booth. They were overly proud of their product which tracks your mouse movements and actions on websites, to "measure user experience and behavior". A lot of news websites use this product. (I should look up the name.)

How does that work? Is that something I can block with EFF plugins or uBlock Origin? Web surveillance drives me batty.

IIRC the rep said it was embedded in the webpage code. I tried looking at the conference map from 2019 to find the vendor but the only copy I could find was grainy. No bueno. Meanwhile using browser-based ad/tracker blockers and a pi-hole is the next best thing. (Configured my ISP's router to advertise the pi-hole as default DNS server.)

One popular software tool that does this is called Hotjar. You have to add some code to a website (almost certainly JavaScript). It looks like if you have cookies disabled it can't work. My understanding is you can basically record every mouse movement and click a user makes. Typically, though you would look at a heatmap of where users are moving the mouse or clicking to see if some button is being ignored or if users are getting to the checkout page, then clicking away to a returns page to see what the policy is. This might lead a website owner to add a tagline on the checkout page about the return policy to prevent customers from potentially clicking away and never coming back.

farmecologist

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Re: Here’s What a $2 Million Retirement Looks Like in America
« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2022, 03:25:09 PM »
We were laughing at this article in another thread...especially at the $6900 a month pension. 

So yeah...the pension I was promised when I hired on was erased just like that.  Luckily, I didn't count it in any of our retirement planning, etc...


Just a note, but if you were vested in that pension, they cannot take it away unless they file bankruptcy, per ERISSA. And then the Pension Guarantee Benefits Corp would step in with a reduced pension amount for you. It takes 5 years to vest.

So if you vested, there may be a frozen benefit for you; it might not be what you'd planned on initially, yeah - but there would be something, by Federal law. Once you've vested, those funds are locked away, and owed to you.

I guess I should have elaborated.  Everyone that was 'under the age line' for the VERY lucrative traditional pension was put into a 'cash balance plan'.  It is NOT a pension and is a way for companies to offload their pension obligations.  Basically the cash has just been sitting there for many years now and has been losing value because the interest rate being paid is FAR lower than inflation.  It's a complete sham...