Author Topic: Helpful motorists and optimal cycling behavior  (Read 3630 times)

norvilion

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Helpful motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« on: May 07, 2013, 04:18:39 PM »
Let me preface this little story by saying that I am mostly baffled by the motorist that offered advise as I was on the last stretch of my biking commute this afternoon. I am fully willing to accept the chance that I was, indeed, incorrect; however I'm pretty sure I interpreted the warnings of more experienced bikers correctly.

I have a 4 mile commute each way from my parking spot to work. Most of it is bike trails and riding through the park, but the last stretch riding back from work involves a slow speed one lane road. Just as I was on the last 400 meters or so someone driving a huge pickup rolls down his window and pulls beside me (no oncoming traffic, though he was in their lane I realized later, too tired at that moment to connect the dots). he says to me in a tone indicating he was genuinely trying to be helpful "Hey, you need to ride on the right side of the lane, we'll give you plenty of room when we pass so you don't need to worry about that." Being tired and not really having any experience with this I reply back an automatic "Quick way of getting yourself run over". This creates a back and forth for a few rounds where he tries to correct the error of my ways and I try to explain that riding to the right creates a real safety hazard. Finally he says he's an avid cyclist and he's just trying to help me out, and I try to end the conversation saying that perhaps I'd researched it wrong.

If he'd been loud or a jerk about it I would have just shrugged it off. Given that he was polite the entire time there are two options- I'm wrong or he was woefully misinformed. I tend to ride somewhere between the absolute middle of the road and the right tire track, so it may be that I'm  farther over than I need to be. On the other hand pretty much every biker I see in Nashville rides on the side in fly-by-driver territory so there does seem to be a pervading culture of potentially unsafe driving.

Anyone have similar stories to tell or definite opinion on who was correct in this situation?

EDIT: Modified title, looks like despite my research I was the one ill-informed ^_^;;;
« Last Edit: May 08, 2013, 07:13:16 AM by norvilion »

Jamesqf

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2013, 04:28:33 PM »
I think you, and the people who advocate always* biking in the middle of the lane, are in the wrong.  First, it's the opposite of the "Share the Road" philosophy: you the biker are asking drivers to give you consideration, but not showing consideration in return.  Second, I think (based on decades of riding in traffic) that it is usually less safe.  The people who hit you mostly do it unintentionally.  If you're riding in the middle of the lane, and the driver behind you is yakking on his cell phone, he is not even going to see you.

*Of course there are some situations where it's the right thing to do.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 08:14:44 PM by Jamesqf »

jpo

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2013, 04:32:32 PM »
I don't know what's technically correct, but I also ride on a one-lane-each-way road to and from work for a segment. What I do is:
  • If there's oncoming traffic, or we are going around a curve and there could be oncoming traffic, I safely take the center of the lane just about as early as I spot the oncoming car.
  • If there's no oncoming traffic, I ride to the right within my ~3 feet of the edge of the road.

Even doing this, it's amazing how a few people will try to pass at the last second and almost cause head-on collisions with oncoming traffic going the opposite way.

Also, if I was on this stretch of road for more than ~1/2 mile, and cars were backing up behind me, I would pull over to let them pass. But, it's only a half mile and traffic usually flows just fine.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 04:34:50 PM by jpo »

Fletch

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2013, 04:46:19 PM »
His opinion is also probably colored by the fact that he is a cycler too, because of course *he* sees you and would give you plenty of room, but the problem isn't with him. If you don't trust the majority of people in a car on that road, and its a low speed limit for a short distance, do whatever makes you feel safest and most visible. I agree about "sharing the road" point though, if you can hear the car behind you and you know they see you, moving over to let them past seems safe and polite.

mpbaker22

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2013, 04:51:50 PM »
This depends on a lot of factors.  Some 2 lane roads are safe to have 2 cars and another one parked.  If there aren't any parked cars, you can take that lane.  There's a road in the city near me that is 4 lanes and has 2 parking lanes, but isn't really wide enough for them.  In this case, I just take the entire right lane because it's not really big enough for a car to pass anyway, so they'll need an entirely free lane. 

In your case, I would say ride as close to the right as you feel comfortable.  Usually 1-3 feet.  If at any point you feel it's unsafe for cars to pass, say there's a car coming at you in the other lane, move more to the center and prevent passing until it is once against safe.

norvilion

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2013, 05:00:29 PM »
Thanks for all the replies. Typically I do move over to the side at intervals during that phase of the ride (I almost always pull over at the halfway point of the 0.8 mile stretch), however this time traffic seemed a bit slower than usual and there seemed more oncoming cars than usual. I'd previously heard the rule that you really need to pull over if you have more than a couple cars behind you but good to hear a bit more clarification on road etiquette.

Undecided

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2013, 05:04:11 PM »
You say it's a one-lane road, but also that the truck was in the oncoming lane while the driver spoke to you. So I'm not sure what the setting is. If you mean that it's a two-lane road (one lane in each direction) that's narrow enough that two motor vehicles and one bicycle won't fit comfortable across it, then jpo's advice to discourage drivers from making unsafe passes in the face of oncoming traffic is good advice (with the major exception that if drivers in the oncoming lane have a dotted line and can pass slower motor vehicles in their lane, I would likely stay as far right as possible; if you think being squeeze-passed by a car moving in the same direction as you is scary, you wouldn't believe how it feels when it's an oncoming car). As a general matter, though, defaulting to "somewhere between the absolute middle of the road and the right tire track" likely means you're often riding farther from the edge of the road than you need to be. I don't know whether Jamesqf is right that doing so would make you more likely to get hit (I've been solidly in the shoulder both times that I've been hit while riding), but it does make you more likely to have conflicts with motor vehicle drivers, likely without otherwise improving your situation. Although there are very few instances of this being true, California law is actually decent advice on this subject. To paraphrase: If you're moving more slowly than the prevailing speed of traffic, ride as far right as practicable. You have the best view of the relevant section of road and should use your judgment to decide how far right to ride (and considering "the squeeze pass" is valid), but it's unlikely that it will typically mean riding between the typical tire tracks.

skyrefuge

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2013, 08:09:24 PM »
I'll add another vote for what appears to be the prevailing opinion: move towards the middle if there is a danger of a car unsafely squeezing past you, but otherwise, stay as far to the right as is practicable. The position you described should not be your default position.

The reason riding too far to the right is a safety issue is not because a driver will somehow fail to see you; if a driver is so blind that he can't see you on the right edge of the road, he won't see you in the center of the road either.  The safety issue is that drivers may attempt to squeeze past you in a space that's too small to safely do so, and will either sideswipe you off the road or force an oncoming car off the road.

If you ride with a mirror, that makes it easy to keep an eye on both oncoming cars and cars behind you, and know when you need to slide over to the middle to "block".

Jamesqf

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2013, 08:21:45 PM »
...if a driver is so blind that he can't see you on the right edge of the road, he won't see you in the center of the road either. 

Sure, but what I meant is that if you're riding to the right, and an oblivious driver comes from behind, there is a fair chance that s/he will miss you, never even noticing that you were there.  If you were in the middle of the lane...  Well, I think "splat!" pretty well covers it.

You also have less distance to cover to dodge, if you happen to see/hear the car coming from behind.  I've never actually been hit (knock on wood!), but I have had to hit the ditch a few times.

norvilion

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2013, 05:30:15 AM »
I do feel a bit bad about my response at this point then, was following the advise I'd seen here and didn't realize the issue was more complicated than that. I'll try keeping to the right as much as I can next time and see how it works out for that road. I imagine the site and video may be more focused on multi-lane roads or something (or flat out follows the 'if its on the internet it must be true' principal). Again, thanks for helping out in this matter.

Rickk

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2013, 06:12:50 AM »
I will throw in my two cents here as well.
I usually ride in the center to right track as well, but when I see a car coming up in my mirror I decide if it is safe for them to squeeze by, and then move over to the right if things look ok. 
If I don't feel there is enough space for me to go to the right and have them pass, then I continue to block until I can get over to the side.
I think the people in the cars appreciate seeing you in the road and then making space for them before they get up to you (at least that is what I hope).
This also puts me in the default safe position of blocking, not in the unsafe position of being stuck on the right side being run off the road.
I don't think there is a right or a wrong answer here - except make sure your safety comes first!

GuitarStv

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Re: "Helpful" motorists and optimal cycling behavior
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2013, 06:26:34 AM »
Claiming the lane is a special case for me . . . typically I stay to the right of the road.  Many things however (bad ruts, obstacles, sewer grates, parked cars) can cause me to move over to the centre of the lane.  Staying to the right of the road does not mean cycling one inch from the curb though, that's a recipe for disaster.  I stay about two feet from the edge of the road at all times, and usually at least a foot in the lane.  I also try to be careful to let vehicles behind me pass as soon as possible . . . it's not fun biking with a line of cars driving angry behind you!

 

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