Author Topic: moved to Kauai yesterday (Read 15761 times)

clarkfan1979 · « **on:** August 17, 2015, 01:53:55 AM »

I arrived on island yesterday. I have had a lot of friends and family tell me that Hawaii in general is too expensive to live. I looked at some apartments yesterday. Studios are around 1,000/month, 1 bed/1 bath around 1,200/month, 2 bed/2 bath around 1,500/month and 3 bed/2 bath houses are around $2,000/month. I left Florida and rented my house out for $1,600/month. I will probably get a 2 bed/2 bath condo for $1500 to start. How is it going to be drastically more expensive.

I went to Costco today. Most of the items are the same as Florida. Some are more expensive, but some are less expensive. It probably depends on your diet. I was pleasantly surprised to find boneless ribeye for $7.99/lb. if you buy the large package. It's not even on sale. I thought beef was supposed to be crazy expensive?

Utilities are more expensive, but you don't need heat or a/c.

Gas is currently 2.95/gallon at Costco. I paid $3.40/gallon 3 days ago in Seattle.

My wife and I are going to fly back to the mainland twice a year at $700/flight. However, we are going to get an Alaska Airlines card and should get 2 flights a year for free.

Anything else I'm missing?

fishnfool · « **Reply #1 on:** August 17, 2015, 04:54:20 AM »

I think Hawaii is expensive for people who move there without a good plan and solid income. Many people are struggling to make it there working 2 to 3 jobs. But as you said, many costs aren't much more depending on where you moved from. Here in the bay area of California most costs are comparable to Hawaii.

Good luck with your move!

Aloha

OneDollarAtATime · « **Reply #2 on:** August 17, 2015, 06:12:45 AM »

I would think if you avoid the tourist traps (and there are lots of them), you'll be fine.

Also, you may not think of Hawaii as 'expensive' but I suspect a lot of your fellow MMM'ers would say 'well, it's not cheap!'

Enjoy the island life!

Roots&Wings · « **Reply #3 on:** August 17, 2015, 06:50:31 AM »

Quote from: clarkfan1979 on August 17, 2015, 01:53:55 AM

Anything else I'm missing?

Income taxes? That would be the biggest one for me. Though if I recall correctly, you weighed this relative to the income you'd be earning in FL vs. HI and it was basically a wash for you.

Hope you find a nice place to rent close to work, and enjoy beautiful Kauai!

justajane · « **Reply #4 on:** August 17, 2015, 06:56:31 AM »

Kauai is absolutely stunning!

I just remember the $4 avocados, but if you eat smart, I think you'll be fine.

EscapeVelocity2020 · « **Reply #5 on:** August 17, 2015, 07:04:09 AM »

You gotta search 'Nords' here or on http://www.early-retirement.org

People can live anywhere, but some places it's easier to be wealthy (like if the Jones all enjoy six figure incomes which is why they are there). But you can also endure the 'hardship' and withstand the effects of looking poor. Easier to do when you are young.

MakingSenseofCents · « **Reply #6 on:** August 17, 2015, 07:49:45 AM »

Sounds like you will be well. Have fun! I'm jealous :)

Lski'stash · « **Reply #7 on:** August 17, 2015, 08:01:52 AM »

From what I've read (seriously considering moving there in retirement or buying a property there in the future), Hawaii is expensive for people who still need to work for a living and for those who try to live exactly the same way as on the mainlands. Jobs are hard to come by, unless they can find a work-from-home situation because most of the tourism jobs are done by Native Hawaiian's. Also, meat and dairy products are expensive, so if a person is a red-meat eater, they are going to spend a lot more on food.

If you don't mind those, and you don't mind the slower pace, sounds like the perfect place to go to me!

latetotheparty1977 · « **Reply #8 on:** August 17, 2015, 08:10:20 AM »

Moving to Kauai? Sounds like pure heaven to me. Who cares about a few dollars extra for things: like you said, not having to pay AC and heat is huge.
Also, there is a Costco amid waterfalls, rainbows and green cliffs bordering the ocean?

AZDude · « **Reply #9 on:** August 17, 2015, 09:39:54 AM »

I've never been, but I've heard its overcrowded there and thus the idea of "paradise" is misleading. That being said, getting away from the big city on one of the smaller islands would be the way to go, if you had a good work situation that could handle it or were FIRE.

Since you are actually there, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts. Everyone dreams of moving there, but it never seemed realistic.

zephyr911 · « **Reply #10 on:** August 17, 2015, 09:45:24 AM »

I'd love to hear more as things progress. I grew up on Oahu and DW and I constantly entertain the idea of moving back.
It's more likely that we'll try to set up a small second home if we can get it at least cash-flow neutral as a vacation rental, but a lot is still up in the air.

Bob W · « **Reply #11 on:** August 17, 2015, 10:29:26 AM »

Say hi to my niece who lives in the Princeville area as a lettuce farmer. Kauai is awesome.

I think you will find groceries a bit higher in general. I think you get into the ultra pricy housing when you want a view, access or ocean front scene. If you are up in the hills in a typical residential area it is more reasonable.

No heat, no AC is nice. You could really solar heat your water and solar power the rest of your electric needs very easily.

Be sure to hike the north coast in your time there. My niece has been there forever and never done it.

I may end up spending the winters there in a few years. A tent and a couple of motorbikes is all we will need.

forummm · « **Reply #12 on:** August 17, 2015, 11:45:08 AM »

Congrats on the move!

I've read that Costco maintains prices on the islands similar to those on the mainlands. So you're seeing food prices far below what they are in a regular grocery store. It's great that you have the Costco option. I remember 20 years ago milk being like $5/gallon.

zephyr911 · « **Reply #13 on:** August 17, 2015, 11:58:25 AM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 10:29:26 AM

Be sure to hike the north coast in your time there. My niece has been there forever and never done it.

<3
Did it when I was 17. One of the most beautiful places I've ever been.

Bob W · « **Reply #14 on:** August 17, 2015, 12:03:59 PM »

Quote from: zephyr911 on August 17, 2015, 11:58:25 AM

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 10:29:26 AM
Be sure to hike the north coast in your time there. My niece has been there forever and never done it.
<3
Did it when I was 17. One of the most beautiful places I've ever been.

Was it as dangerous as they lead you to believe. I mean falling to your death sorta stuff.

zephyr911 · « **Reply #15 on:** August 17, 2015, 12:19:17 PM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 12:03:59 PM

Was it as dangerous as they lead you to believe. I mean falling to your death sorta stuff.

Wanna know how you avoid falling off cliffs? Don't walk off the edge.

I've honestly never thought of that trail as dangerous to a self-aware individual.There are spots where you can get to the edge of a cliff if you want. In particular, I remember crawling up to one viewpoint and carefully peeking over the edge, and looking straight down, hundreds of feet (I guessed maybe 800 at the time) to the water. Far enough that you'd die, for sure. But I don't remember a single spot where such a precipice sneaked up on you, or was within tripping distance of the path.

Caveat: I have not hiked the last few miles of it but would be surprised if it differed much. I believe the terrain actually gets less steep on the approach to Kalalau. Have always wanted to go back and do the entirety someday.

EDIT: I did find this pic of mile 7 that could be alarming for some people:

peeps_be_peeping · « **Reply #16 on:** August 17, 2015, 12:23:38 PM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 12:03:59 PM

Quote from: zephyr911 on August 17, 2015, 11:58:25 AM
Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 10:29:26 AM
Be sure to hike the north coast in your time there. My niece has been there forever and never done it.
<3
Did it when I was 17. One of the most beautiful places I've ever been.

Was it as dangerous as they lead you to believe. I mean falling to your death sorta stuff.

No. It is not that dangerous. Around mile 7 the trail is right on the edge of a rocky cliff that drops straight off to the sea. But it is still wide enough for two people to pass each other, and there are plenty of rocks to grab.

Edit: That photo is exactly what I was describing. It's about a 1/4 mile stretch. Hold on to the rocks and you'll be fine.

Roots&Wings · « **Reply #17 on:** August 17, 2015, 01:46:15 PM »

Waimea Canyon State Park is also not to be missed! One of my highlights anyway:

Bob W · « **Reply #18 on:** August 17, 2015, 01:52:39 PM »

OK, so that picture is the one I'm thinking of. That definitely rules me out. Terrible vertigo. Don't think I would want to take my 8 year old on that either.

Is there no way around that section like going up and over through the jungle?

zephyr911 · « **Reply #19 on:** August 17, 2015, 02:13:31 PM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 01:52:39 PM

OK, so that picture is the one I'm thinking of. That definitely rules me out. Terrible vertigo. Don't think I would want to take my 8 year old on that either.

Is there no way around that section like going up and over through the jungle?

Only one trail that I know of.

You could still spend three nights on the trail and hike the majority of it - camp at Hanakapiai the first night, Hanakoa (mile 5 or 6, IIRC) the second night, then go out as far as you're comfortable (stop at mile 7) and back to Hanakapiai for night 3.
There's also a super-sweet side hike up the valley from Hanakapiai to a pool and waterfall - maybe a mile each way.

Bob W · « **Reply #20 on:** August 17, 2015, 02:20:56 PM »

Quote from: zephyr911 on August 17, 2015, 02:13:31 PM

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 01:52:39 PM
OK, so that picture is the one I'm thinking of. That definitely rules me out. Terrible vertigo. Don't think I would want to take my 8 year old on that either.

Is there no way around that section like going up and over through the jungle?
Only one trail that I know of.

You could still spend three nights on the trail and hike the majority of it - camp at Hanakapiai the first night, Hanakoa (mile 5 or 6, IIRC) the second night, then go out as far as you're comfortable (stop at mile 7) and back to Hanakapiai for night 3.
There's also a super-sweet side hike up the valley from Hanakapiai to a pool and waterfall - maybe a mile each way.

Sounds like a plan. Is a permit required to camp?

Have you ever done the walk through the abandoned rail tunnel or biked it if that is possible?

zephyr911 · « **Reply #21 on:** August 17, 2015, 02:26:45 PM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 02:20:56 PM

Sounds like a plan. Is a permit required to camp?

Yes.

Quote

Have you ever done the walk through the abandoned rail tunnel or biked it if that is possible?

No, not familiar with that.

efish · « **Reply #22 on:** August 17, 2015, 05:21:20 PM »

I'm totally jealous. :) That's my ultimate goal, either Kauai or Big Island.

Speaking of not wanting to take kids, I was on one of the Waimea Canyon trails last summer and there was a family with two 3-4 year old kids that were walking out ahead of us on a spine that had sheer drop offs of hundreds of feet on both sides. I finally had to ask my husband to turn around and head back to the trail head, because it was making me too tense watching those little kids stumble and dance around on the edge of the precipice with mom and dad saying "no, don't do that, honey" over and over again to zero effect. It's definitely a place you could die without trying very hard, which is awesome when it's all consenting adults, but little kids that didn't know any better and their idiot parents shouldn't have been there. It's raw nature, it's spectacular, but there are very few guard rails. :)

We never got to the North Shore trail, it was closed because of hurricanes that were expected to make landfall while we were there. Got to go back one of these days. :)

clarkfan1979 · « **Reply #23 on:** August 17, 2015, 10:46:34 PM »

Thank you for all the positive encouragement. I went to Walmart today. It wasn't bad, but I think Amazon is better. I will set up my Amazon Prime account tomorrow. Shipping is free, even for Hawaii.

For those that missed my post about a month ago, my previous salary was $42,600 and $48,000 with an extra course in Florida. After 30 years of service, my base salary would only top out at $52,000. Great started job, but no potential for salary growth. Their pay doesn't even keep pace with inflation and a few people that have been there for 7-8 years make less than the new folks.

New job base pay is $54,000 and $60,000 with an extra course. I could only teach 1 extra course in Florida. I might be able to teach more than 1 extra course in Hawaii based on need. I would like to have as much documented income as possible because I would like to buy a place in 2 years.

They have automatic 3-4% raises every year that is negotiated with the union. We also get an additional 8% for promotions. After 30 years of service, I would top out around $120,000. For the pension they argue that the school contributions 15% of my salary and I contribute 8% of my salary. I would prefer a 401K, but pension is the only option.

I will try to do an update once every month.

Gumbo1978 · « **Reply #24 on:** August 18, 2015, 06:32:50 AM »

Congrats! I'll be vacationing there next Sept.

wenchsenior · « **Reply #25 on:** August 18, 2015, 09:02:00 AM »

Congratulations! Suspect you'll do fine with a MMM mentality.

My husband and I occasionally kick around the idea of living on the Big Island, but realistically it probably isn't very practical because of family obligations. We plan to vacation in Hawaii several more times at least, though. So much outdoor stuff to do...it's fantastic. Those pics posted above make me want to start planning immediately!

Roots&Wings · « **Reply #26 on:** August 18, 2015, 10:55:04 AM »

Quote from: clarkfan1979 on August 17, 2015, 10:46:34 PM

I went to Walmart today. It wasn't bad, but I think Amazon is better.

The one thing I liked Walmart for was the Mauna Loa dry roasted macadamia nuts with sea salt, which became a favorite food treat. Cheaper there than if you visit the farm and buy directly.

Look forward to your future updates!

pdxbator · « **Reply #27 on:** August 18, 2015, 11:05:42 AM »

Wow congrats on the move! I've been to several of the islands and am definitely looking at Kauai or the Big Island for retirement while healthy. The island life seems quite perfect, but I do sometimes wonder about feeling cramped there, and no seasons.

Axecleaver · « **Reply #28 on:** August 18, 2015, 01:38:58 PM »

Congrats Clark, you are going to love it there. Learn to fish in the surf and you can still pull in some nice catches in Kauai, not so much on Oahu which is overfished. The way to live frugally in Hawaii is to buy the stuff that is cheap. That seems obvious, but what I saw a lot of people doing is trying to live the same way as they did on the mainland. That's why people think it's expensive. They also freak out when they see milk at $10 a gallon. So, skip the dairy and eat more mangoes and you'll be fine.

Expensive
Blueberries and apples
Grocery Store Chicken - it's all imported. But, tons of feral chickens and supposedly you can trap them without too much trouble. Especially in Kauai where the chickens outnumber people.
Dairy, there is one dairy in Oahu but very small. This means cheese, yogurt, butter, etc.
Atlantic seafood (Lobster, Cusk, Cod)

Cheap
All kinds of Pacific fish and seafood. Sashimi grade tuna for $4-5 a pound in the grocery store. Blue Marlin. Oh, I miss this the most about Hawaii.
Poke - I ate this 2-3x a week, endless variety
Mangoes, apple bananas, papaya, sometimes pineapple (many are imported now from the Philippines)
Taro - I enjoyed poi but it really makes a big difference where you get it. Taro chips and bread was good, too, and cheap.
Beef - there are several herds on the big island and one on Oahu.
Pork
Lettuce and greens (12 month growing season)

Electricity is expensive, and fuel is all imported and tends to be more expensive. Solar is very popular and makes a ton of sense there (very close to equator so makes electricity efficiently 12 months of the year). There is a VAT tax on everything, which is how the islands run efficiently, they get a ton of tax money from the military and tourist populations. Look for Kama'aina (local) prices, which are available almost everywhere if you ask for them.

Quote

I do sometimes wonder about feeling cramped there, and no seasons.

I never experienced Island Fever, but some mainland folks had trouble with it. The Big Island is pretty big, so if this is a concern, that's a good place to plan to go. The islands do experience seasons. It's somewhat subtle, but there is a rainy season (Winter) when the big waves come to town and a dry season (Summer).

Basenji · « **Reply #29 on:** August 18, 2015, 03:19:11 PM »

Damn that sounds awesome. Have a great time!

Cranky · « **Reply #30 on:** August 18, 2015, 03:57:04 PM »

My in-laws lived happily on Maui for many years, and mostly complained about the price of milk.

I think if you actually want to buy a place to live, real estate is more expensive everywhere there than it is most places in Florida, but you certainly get to live in a great place.

mm1970 · « **Reply #31 on:** August 19, 2015, 02:57:57 PM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 01:52:39 PM

OK, so that picture is the one I'm thinking of. That definitely rules me out. Terrible vertigo. Don't think I would want to take my 8 year old on that either.

Is there no way around that section like going up and over through the jungle?

Ditto!

sixup · « **Reply #32 on:** August 19, 2015, 05:32:37 PM »

Very cool.

The Napali Coast hike is a goal of mine. We tried it a few years ago, were going to camp at the beach, but wife had really junk gear and we had to turn around.

Kauai is a little weird for me though. A little too country. Maybe that was just a bad first impression at the time. I live in Maui now. Kind of a middle ground between Oahu city and empty country.

Jeremy E. · « **Reply #33 on:** August 19, 2015, 05:34:39 PM »

Maybe you can figure out what "snaps" means. Also "howler".

bagap · « **Reply #34 on:** August 19, 2015, 06:24:25 PM »

Sounds like a dream come true! LOVE Hawaii in general and it sounds like you have some solid plans...congrats :)

Dicey · « **Reply #35 on:** August 20, 2015, 09:00:37 AM »

Quote from: AZDude on August 17, 2015, 09:39:54 AM

I've never been, but I've heard its overcrowded there and thus the idea of "paradise" is misleading. That being said, getting away from the big city on one of the smaller islands would be the way to go, if you had a good work situation that could handle it or were FIRE.

Since you are actually there, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts. Everyone dreams of moving there, but it never seemed realistic.

There are more places in Hawaii that are not overcrowded and it's pretty easy to avoid the ones that are, AZDude. Perhaps it's misleading to mislabel something as misleading if you haven't been there ;-). Or maybe it's just a mustachian way of trying to drive RE prices down before you get there. Either way, don't knock it 'til you've tried it.

honeybbq · « **Reply #36 on:** August 20, 2015, 09:29:22 AM »

Quote from: Bob W on August 17, 2015, 01:52:39 PM

OK, so that picture is the one I'm thinking of. That definitely rules me out. Terrible vertigo. Don't think I would want to take my 8 year old on that either.

Is there no way around that section like going up and over through the jungle?

I've done the Kalalau trail. I'm an experienced and seasoned backpacker. It IS dangerous, it IS scary. People do die on it. Backpacker magazine lists it as one of the 10 most dangerous hikes. Probably because it attracts casual hikers as opposed to climbers and mountaineers. It is not for an afternoon stroll or someone who has issues (as you've mentioned) with vertigo or being a klutz. It was definitely not 2 people wide when I did it 5-6 years ago. I do not know a way around it unless you bushwhack with a machete.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalalau_Trail#Notable_accidents_along_the_trail

and you definitely need a permit and they are VERY serious about it.

That said, it is absolutely beautiful, and the hippies that live back there are friendly and awesome. Be sure to bring them their mail from the trailhead.

Telecaster · « **Reply #37 on:** August 20, 2015, 10:06:00 AM »

Quote from: forummm on August 17, 2015, 11:45:08 AM

Congrats on the move!

I've read that Costco maintains prices on the islands similar to those on the mainlands. So you're seeing food prices far below what they are in a regular grocery store. It's great that you have the Costco option. I remember 20 years ago milk being like $5/gallon.

I visited the Big Island a couple years ago and rented a condo with a kitchen. We hit Costco first thing and stocked up on essentials. And you're right. Prices were a little higher than the mainland, but not a whole lot. Housing seemed to be cheaper than in Seattle. I sort of had a fantasy of retiring there and becoming a gentleman coffee farmer or something.

I think if you manage it correctly, living in Hawaii could be perfectly cost effective especially if you want a rural lifestyle.

Cassie · « **Reply #38 on:** August 20, 2015, 11:00:42 AM »

When we were on vacation & are on a tour our guide said he grew up there & loved it. He also said that most people that move their move back to the mainland within 2-3 years mainly because they get "island fever" so to speak. He said that because the islands are small there are only so many places to go & visit, drive, etc & people start to feel confined. I thought that was interesting. It certainly was beautiful.

clarkfan1979 · « **Reply #39 on:** August 20, 2015, 11:50:58 PM »

Yes, I have heard of island fever. However, I get one month off during the winter break and 3 months off during the summer break. We will be spending most of that time on the mainland, mostly Denver. As a result, island fever shouldn't be a big deal for us.

Cassie · « **Reply #40 on:** August 21, 2015, 09:30:45 AM »

That sounds wonderful!

Thegoblinchief · « **Reply #41 on:** August 21, 2015, 10:41:59 AM »

Hope it works out for you. Are you going to update here in this thread or in a journal?

Nords · « **Reply #42 on:** August 22, 2015, 12:10:42 PM »

Quote from: clarkfan1979 on August 17, 2015, 01:53:55 AM

I arrived on island yesterday. I have had a lot of friends and family tell me that Hawaii in general is too expensive to live. I looked at some apartments yesterday. Studios are around 1,000/month, 1 bed/1 bath around 1,200/month, 2 bed/2 bath around 1,500/month and 3 bed/2 bath houses are around $2,000/month. I left Florida and rented my house out for $1,600/month. I will probably get a 2 bed/2 bath condo for $1500 to start. How is it going to be drastically more expensive.

I went to Costco today. Most of the items are the same as Florida. Some are more expensive, but some are less expensive. It probably depends on your diet. I was pleasantly surprised to find boneless ribeye for $7.99/lb. if you buy the large package. It's not even on sale. I thought beef was supposed to be crazy expensive?

Utilities are more expensive, but you don't need heat or a/c.

Gas is currently 2.95/gallon at Costco. I paid $3.40/gallon 3 days ago in Seattle.

My wife and I are going to fly back to the mainland twice a year at $700/flight. However, we are going to get an Alaska Airlines card and should get 2 flights a year for free.

Anything else I'm missing?

Shhhhhhh, dammit!! If you keep posting facts about Hawaii's cost of living then everyone will want to live here!!!

Just kidding. E komo mai and I'm glad the move is going well.

Quote from: clarkfan1979 on August 20, 2015, 11:50:58 PM

Yes, I have heard of island fever. However, I get one month off during the winter break and 3 months off during the summer break. We will be spending most of that time on the mainland, mostly Denver. As a result, island fever shouldn't be a big deal for us.

I've never understood island fever, either, but people are affected by it. The five-hour flight can be a drag if you do it more than a few times per year, but otherwise it's no worse than flying around the Mainland.

As the months go by you'll have to let us know how your Kauai transportation expenses (vehicle, bicycle, walking) compare to Florida. You probably didn't have to "winterize" there, either, so it might be a more objective comparison.

If you happen to blog about moving to Hawaii, I can pass you the offers I'm getting to advertise the islands. They ads won't make you rich but you'll save some time waiting for the companies to find you.

meadow lark · « **Reply #43 on:** August 24, 2015, 07:12:18 PM »

What is the situation with biting insects. I went to Maui once and had no problems, but I am super sensitive to bug bites.

rpr · « **Reply #44 on:** August 24, 2015, 09:37:49 PM »

I wish you good luck. You made the right choice in renting instead of buying especially in Kauai.

clarkfan1979 · « **Reply #45 on:** August 26, 2015, 10:09:24 PM »

To be honest, August is a little more hot and humid than I was originally anticipating. It would be fine if you had air conditioning at home. However, most people here don't do the a/c thing. It's probably fine 10 months out of the year, but August is a little less than perfect. I just wanted everyone to know that it's not all rainbows and sunshine on Kauai. Actually, that is not a good cliché here because it is all rainbows and sunshine. It's just a little more heat and humidity than I originally thought.

Nords · « **Reply #46 on:** August 26, 2015, 10:45:11 PM »

Quote from: clarkfan1979 on August 26, 2015, 10:09:24 PM

To be honest, August is a little more hot and humid than I was originally anticipating. It would be fine if you had air conditioning at home. However, most people here don't do the a/c thing. It's probably fine 10 months out of the year, but August is a little less than perfect.

I hear this a lot from malahini, but next summer you'll think it's cooler than it feels this summer. And in the winter of 2016 you'll be freezing.

After 26 years in the islands, I've lost every bit of cold-weather endurance that I gained by growing up in Pittsburgh.

Quote from: clarkfan1979 on August 26, 2015, 10:09:24 PM

I just wanted everyone to know that it's not all rainbows and sunshine on Kauai. Actually, that is not a good cliché here because it is all rainbows and sunshine.

Ha!

rpr · « **Reply #47 on:** August 26, 2015, 11:08:26 PM »

I've now been in Hawaii for more than 10 years. But I swear that it is getting hotter every year. The trade winds seem to have completely stopped. On Friday, an ac installer is going to come and give us a quote :(

El Marinero · « **Reply #48 on:** August 27, 2015, 01:55:17 PM »

Quote from: Lski'stash on August 17, 2015, 08:01:52 AM

if a person is a red-meat eater, they are going to spend a lot more on food.

I remember seeing all sorts of interesting fish in the stores, for far less that I'd expect ( I am used to Bay Area prices).

to paraphrase what others have said, adjust your lifestyle to the locale.

News:

Author Topic: moved to Kauai yesterday (Read 15761 times)

Thegoblinchief