FIRE movement (esp us pesky millennials) could break the economy? NYT article

[maisymouser]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/17/business/economy/millennials-retirement.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage

"A young generation of aggressive savers could leave central bankers with less room to cut interest rates, which they have long done to boost growth in times of economic trouble."

What are your takes on this, my beloved MMM community? I know MMM himself has opined that if more people were FIRE-driven the world would be a better place and there would be plenty of room for meaningful work/economy drivers.

[marty998]

If all the wealth concentrated in the hands of a the few thousand billionaires and families with $100m+ hasn't broken the economy, then your garden variety FIREd young millennial with several hundred thousand in the bank is not going to break it either. You'd need 100,000 of us just to match Jeff Bezos (assuming $1m each), let alone the other squillionaires out there.

There's much more wealth concentrated at the top than down the chain where we are. We're not going to make a difference unless you get the majority of the population on board, which is highly unlikely to happen...

[Bloop Bloop]

I don't think there are enough of us to make any real difference. I do agree with some things attributed to millennial savers in the article:

1. Low rates are obviously a sign of weakness in the economy. That means that I should not be paying full price for goods. After all, when businesses are hurting, that means consumers have more power.

2. Low rates are meant to stimulate spending but it doesn't have to be consumer spending. It could be investment. Asset prices rise when rates are low.

3. I am happy with a low inflation, low wage growth environment. The former means more stability with spending and investing. The latter, I can take care of myself.

4. Frankly, I don't care if there's a recession. I'm still young enough to ride out any bumps in the market ("time in the market" and all that). I'm going to back my earning capacity over that of the general market. If the economy is weak then I'm not going to help it out by spending. That's like asking a buyer to pay more at an auction to help the vendor.

[bacchi]

If all the wealth concentrated in the hands of a the few thousand billionaires and families with $100m+ hasn't broken the economy, then your garden variety FIREd young millennial with several hundred thousand in the bank is not going to break it either. You'd need 100,000 of us just to match Jeff Bezos (assuming $1m each), let alone the other squillionaires out there.

There's much more wealth concentrated at the top than down the chain where we are. We're not going to make a difference unless you get the majority of the population on board, which is highly unlikely to happen...

Yep.

Also, if enough people do FIRE, maybe it'll spur companies to think about why people are FIREing.

[mancityfan]

Interesting article, with lots of angles to it. As a boomer ( hit me up with an "OK Boomer" if you wish :-)) I can see huge changes in our economy related to the student debt crisis and generational issues. Student debt load will depress the housing market, a major driver for the entire economy. One thing that binds all the generational groups together is the need for the stock market to keep chugging along. Boomers liquidating assets, and a thrifty generation behind them, saddled with debt, does not inspire long term confidence.

[jim555]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

[dandarc]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

[jim555]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

Boomers don't spend their money, they are too cheap.  Big inheritances coming for patient Millennials.

[Zikoris]

Good. The economy probably needs a good breaking, given that current levels of overconsumption are otherwise going to kill us all and every other living thing on the planet.

[ChickenStash]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

Boomers don't spend their money, they are too cheap.  Big inheritances coming for patient Millennials.

You must hang with a very different group of Boomers than I do.

[solon]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

Boomers don't spend their money, they are too cheap.  Big inheritances coming for patient Millennials.

Or maybe for Gen X, the forgotten - again - generation!

[jim555]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

Boomers don't spend their money, they are too cheap.  Big inheritances coming for patient Millennials.

Or maybe for Gen X, the forgotten - again - generation!

We are always forgotten.

[mancityfan]

There is  Gen X? Sorry, could not resist :-)

[ixtap]

As of December 2019, only 70% of millenials have savings account and the vast majority have a savings account under $5000. If Millenials aren't spending, it isn't because of FIRE.

People seem to get the impression that FIRE is a popular concept just because there are lots of blogs and vlogs. Couldn't be further from the truth. It just isn't that common.

[Alternatepriorities]

As of December 2019, only 70% of millenials have savings account and the vast majority have a savings account under $5000. If Millenials aren't spending, it isn't because of FIRE.

People seem to get the impression that FIRE is a popular concept just because there are lots of blogs and vlogs. Couldn't be further from the truth. It just isn't that common.

I don’t have a savings account... letting 5000 little green employee$ lay about earning 0.01% interest is a terrible idea... maybe that’s why we’re mostly FI.

It seems to me that having interest rates already near 0 “leaves central bankers with less room to cut interest rates”. Or at least it did until they started setting negative rates in some parts of the world. Seems like owning a share of a bunch or productive companies and/or property is the best bet for us peons who can’t understand why someone would pay someone else to loan them money...

[HPstache]

As of December 2019, only 70% of millenials have savings account and the vast majority have a savings account under $5000. If Millenials aren't spending, it isn't because of FIRE.

People seem to get the impression that FIRE is a popular concept just because there are lots of blogs and vlogs. Couldn't be further from the truth. It just isn't that common.

I don’t have a savings account... letting 5000 little green employee$ lay about earning 0.01% interest is a terrible idea... maybe that’s why we’re mostly FI.

It seems to me that having interest rates already near 0 “leaves central bankers with less room to cut interest rates”. Or at least it did until they started setting negative rates in some parts of the world. Seems like owning a share of a bunch or productive companies and/or property is the best bet for us peons who can’t understand why someone would pay someone else to loan them money...

Agreed...  I hate this stat, and I've seen it a lot.  If 70% of Millennials did not have $5,000 in a RETIREMENT account, that would make me a little more concerned.

[RFAAOATB]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

Boomers don't spend their money, they are too cheap.  Big inheritances coming for patient Millennials.

As long as end of life care and reverse mortgages don’t drain everything first.

[ixtap]

As of December 2019, only 70% of millenials have savings account and the vast majority have a savings account under $5000. If Millenials aren't spending, it isn't because of FIRE.

People seem to get the impression that FIRE is a popular concept just because there are lots of blogs and vlogs. Couldn't be further from the truth. It just isn't that common.

I don’t have a savings account... letting 5000 little green employee$ lay about earning 0.01% interest is a terrible idea... maybe that’s why we’re mostly FI.

It seems to me that having interest rates already near 0 “leaves central bankers with less room to cut interest rates”. Or at least it did until they started setting negative rates in some parts of the world. Seems like owning a share of a bunch or productive companies and/or property is the best bet for us peons who can’t understand why someone would pay someone else to loan them money...

Agreed...  I hate this stat, and I've seen it a lot.  If 70% of Millennials did not have $5,000 in a RETIREMENT account, that would make me a little more concerned.

Yeah, sorry, that is a mere 66% of millenials who have ZERO in retirement accounts.

So, again, FIRE is not why millenials aren't spending money.

[American GenX]

There is  Gen X? Sorry, could not resist :-)

Wholesale painting of so-called generations with one brush is absolutely ridiculous.

[frugalecon]

Color me skeptical. For every article like the one linked above, there is another like the following: https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/12/03/precariousness-modern-young-adulthood-one-chart/

I think we will need to see a lot more data to conclude that the millennials will wreck the economy through oversaving. I work in a group that has a fair number of millennials, and I have never gotten a FIRE vibe off of any of them. I see plenty of trips to Disney with the kids, rental of storage units to store excess crap, and similar to think that any of them are extreme savers. Maybe 10% of income, but that doesn’t really get you out of the labor force that quickly.

[Bloop Bloop]

It's interesting to see that it's the people who are succeeding in the current economy (people on this forum) who don't care about its performance, and the people who are struggling who need a strong economy so that they have jobs.

[Telecaster]

Or maybe for Gen X, the forgotten - again - generation!

But we have the coolest name!  Suck it Millennials! 

[Buffaloski Boris]

All right. I feel a (maybe) epic rant coming on.

So let me get this straight. Millions of people who are young today or even those of us who are a bit older are supposed to continue to work, why? So that we can help the Fed out?! What the hell are these people smoking! Like I give two rats rears about the Fed!

Further, did any of these geniuses ever stop for a moment and wonder why people might want to quit their jobs and retire early? Could it be because their jobs SUCK? Oh no, not that. Anything but that. It must be because these younger people are selfish, self-centered, spoiled, unpatriotic, and downright wicked! Never because corporate America made a choice back around 2008 to communicate in both word and deed that employees don’t matter. I can’t imagine why people would want to leave toxic workplaces, disloyal employers, and the firm knowledge that the nanosecond your continued employment might be less than optimal, that you will get told to hit the bricks.

Actions have consequences, and corporate America is slowly but surely starting to learn that “F— You!” cuts both ways. They sowed this culture of indifference towards human beings. I invite them to Reap the whirlwind.

[Bloop Bloop]

I don't think this has anything to do with Corporate America. If anything, most of our FIRE plans are based on Corporate America to some extent, since we all invest in shares and many of us get our income from corporations.

[BigMoneyJim]

I just organically read this article and came to MMM to either find or post it here.

I could go on a long rant, but suffice to say the whole article triggered me.

(For what it's worth, I'm smack in the middle of Gen X these days, although for much of my life I was outside the ranges of the major generation labels.)

To me it's a lot like saying the rise of index fund investing will break the market or that FIRE popularity in general will break the world. Or that electric vehicles or renewable power aren't sustainable.

But to target the young adult generation's FIRE goals in particular? WTF? Responsible saving and spending will wreck the economy? WTF is wrong with our economy, then?

I retired four months ago at age 49.5. Somehow I'm not part of the "problem"?

[maisymouser]

But to target the young adult generation's FIRE goals in particular? WTF? Responsible saving and spending will wreck the economy? WTF is wrong with our economy, then?

Great question. I'd personally point to a model of continual, non-stop, never-ending growth being the foundation upon what we base worth on. That, or a failure to transition to UBI as automation steps in to make life more efficient.

[Paper Chaser]

Agreed...  I hate this stat, and I've seen it a lot.  If 70% of Millennials did not have $5,000 in a RETIREMENT account, that would make me a little more concerned.

Not sure about specific account totals, but the overall savings rate isn't drastically different from either Gen X or Boomers according to a T Rowe Price study linked in the OP's article:

[DadJokes]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

[LWYRUP]

If all the wealth concentrated in the hands of a the few thousand billionaires and families with $100m+ hasn't broken the economy, then your garden variety FIREd young millennial with several hundred thousand in the bank is not going to break it either. You'd need 100,000 of us just to match Jeff Bezos (assuming $1m each), let alone the other squillionaires out there.

There's much more wealth concentrated at the top than down the chain where we are. We're not going to make a difference unless you get the majority of the population on board, which is highly unlikely to happen...

My thoughts exactly.  Jeff Bezos can collect $100 billion but it's gonna be blinx maxing his 401k that collapses the economy?

[Aelias]

First, it's worth noting that the inequality at play throughout the society at large is also playing out in the millennial generation.  A wealthy minority of millennials are saving a lot and working toward an early retirement.  The majority of millennials are saving and investing very little and live financially precarious lives.  These things are both simultaneously true.

But, if I'm getting this article right, the current "system" needs a critical mass of individuals willing to work in conventional, full time employment as long as they're physically able (i.e. "die at your desk") and it needs those individuals to spend almost all of what they earn regardless of environmental impact or whether all this spending improves their lives.  In other words, if we don't all spend our entire lives as good little consumers, the system will break down.

Well, if that's the case, maybe the system should break down.  Seems like not a great system.

[merula]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

I'm betting that if you had asked Boomers how many expected to retire before 60 in 1975, you would get a similar response to what Millennials are saying today. Everyone *wants* it, fewer are willing to save for it, and it only becomes obvious that it's not in the cards the closer you get to retirement.

Though I do think the data in the graphic showing that more Millennials are saving <15% in their 401ks than GenX is indicative of some greater tendency to save across the generation as a whole.

Or maybe for Gen X, the forgotten - again - generation!

But we have the coolest name!  Suck it Millennials! 

You've definitely got us there. I also think, as an older Millennial, that watching Gen X's values and consuming the books/TV/music/movies Gen X created formed the basis of how Millennials see the world. We're right there with you on the "everything you've been told is bullshit" aspect. I think the way we differ is the classic Gen X mindset is "so fuck it", where the classic Millennial mindset is "so I'm going to do something". Which might be because Gen X is so overlooked while Millennials have the numbers to make change happen.

[Paper Chaser]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

It's almost as if people haven't bothered to do any math, and are just hoping or assuming that things will sort themselves out, but surely that's not the case right? Right?

[Paper Chaser]

You've definitely got us there. I also think, as an older Millennial, that watching Gen X's values and consuming the books/TV/music/movies Gen X created formed the basis of how Millennials see the world. We're right there with you on the "everything you've been told is bullshit" aspect. I think the way we differ is the classic Gen X mindset is "so fuck it", where the classic Millennial mindset is "so I'm going to do something". Which might be because Gen X is so overlooked while Millennials have the numbers to make change happen.

I also think that most older Millenials were reaching adulthood and just starting out in the world right around 2008/9 and that will impact their views regarding finances/investing and how unstable a normal job in the workforce can actually be. When the system crashes, the job market sucks, you're strapped with fresh student loans, and your Boomer parents 401k just lost 40% overnight that can strike fear in a young person, or it can motivate a person to take control of what they can control in order to not suffer the same fate.

[dougules]

One point that this article seems to miss is that most of us who are working towards FIRE aren't actually "saving"; we're investing.  People seem to have trouble with that.  I spend my whole paycheck and save very little money.  I'm just spending it on things that should keep their value and make me a return.  I'm spending nonetheless.  Those dollars immediately go to whoever decides to sell their shares to Vanguard, so money is not losing any velocity with me. 

Or maybe for Gen X, the forgotten - again - generation!

Shhhhhh.  I've decided I like Gen X being the forgotten generation.  We get to sneak under all the mud slinging. 

[hadabeardonce]

Over the weekend I saw that article and this video:

How U.S. Consumers Help Prop Up The World Economy (CNBC Video)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Zw0Eook7WI

Always be buying more garbage.

[TVRodriguez]

If all the wealth concentrated in the hands of a the few thousand billionaires and families with $100m+ hasn't broken the economy, then your garden variety FIREd young millennial with several hundred thousand in the bank is not going to break it either. You'd need 100,000 of us just to match Jeff Bezos (assuming $1m each), let alone the other squillionaires out there.

There's much more wealth concentrated at the top than down the chain where we are. We're not going to make a difference unless you get the majority of the population on board, which is highly unlikely to happen...

Your comment ties in with this quote from the article:

"Retirement saving behavior is not the only driver causing economic torpor and lower rates. Inequality has left a small number of people with more money than they can realistically spend." 

The writer acknowledges that it's not just millennials' habits, but also the fact that the 0.01% have so much that they can't spend it if they tried.

[Buffaloski Boris]

The writer acknowledges that it's not just millennials' habits, but also the fact that the 0.01% have so much that they can't spend it if they tried.

So naturally they write an article critiquing millennial savings habits. Because, well, the .01% are their bosses.

[Bloop Bloop]

I question the fundamental assumption that -

1. Any given person should feel an obligation to help the economy;

2. The economy growing (by economists' measures) is necessarily a good thing.

I disagree with both of the above.

[LightStache]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

I agree with others that savings rates not matching goals is probably a partial culprit.

But other macro explanations include the Great Wealth Transfer from boomer parents as well as saving outside of retirement accounts. It would be reasonable to save 20% in taxable until first home purchase at, say, 35 y/o and then switch over to 401K.

[ixtap]

I will say, my in laws, who raised 3 millennials (ish, depending on your cut off, but yeah definitely millennials) seem shocked  not just that we have enough savings to retire early, but that we expect to retire at all without counting on an inheritance. Which is funny, because he didn't come into his own inheritance until he was in his 70s and there wasn't much of it.

[raincoast]

Color me skeptical. For every article like the one linked above, there is another like the following: https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/12/03/precariousness-modern-young-adulthood-one-chart/

I think we will need to see a lot more data to conclude that the millennials will wreck the economy through oversaving. I work in a group that has a fair number of millennials, and I have never gotten a FIRE vibe off of any of them. I see plenty of trips to Disney with the kids, rental of storage units to store excess crap, and similar to think that any of them are extreme savers. Maybe 10% of income, but that doesn’t really get you out of the labor force that quickly.

I'm a millennial working a well-paid professional job in an HCOL area. Hardly any of my colleagues are serious about saving, and most seem to be spending all of their six-figure salaries as they come in. When I mention contributing to retirement accounts, I get stares. One jokes about needing to marry rich to pay off his student loans. Some are aware of FIRE, but treat it as a joke.

Meanwhile, my millennial friends who are not as well paid struggle to pay the rent.

The group of millennials who are able and willing to pursue FIRE are a minority. Mortgages and student loan payments lock up more millennial money than what my generation are investing.

[bigblock440]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

1st, The 15% in the chart referenced 401ks specifically, people could be saving in IRAs, HSAs, Real estate, or taxable brokerage accounts as well
2nd, using the shockingly simple math as a quick reference, 15% savings rate puts you at 43 working years, so fairly close and a few tweaks or good years could cut that down
3rd, student loans, houses, babies, etc. could mean they're not saving now, but plan to aggressively save later (or are counting the loan payments as savings)
4th, yes, it could be that they're not actually planning and are just guessing. 

[dd564]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

Keep in mind this data is largely from surveys.
People may be more optimistic at a young age about their future 20-30 years from now than reality.

I would say 90% of the 22% who plan to retire before 60 have zero idea what amount they would actually need to retire at any age, let alone prior to 60.  I would also guess 50% of them are not married to a spouse who will also help dictate how successful their retirement plans are.

[StarBright]

But other macro explanations include the Great Wealth Transfer from boomer parents as well as saving outside of retirement accounts. It would be reasonable to save 20% in taxable until first home purchase at, say, 35 y/o and then switch over to 401K.

^ I agree the bolded might be a real thing in the middle and upper middle classes. Both of our families talk about wanting to leave "substantial" amounts to us. We don't count on it because we know things can change. But if our parents left us even a quarter of what they want to leave us, combined with our own savings it would easily be enough to FIRE in 15 years and likely fat FIRE. Since most folks my age aren't gaming out possible scenarios where everything goes wrong, I bet plenty of people take their parents at their word when they say they plan to leave them a few hundred thousand in real estate and cash.

I'm a millennial working a well-paid professional job in an HCOL area. Hardly any of my colleagues are serious about saving, and most seem to be spending all of their six-figure salaries as they come in. When I mention contributing to retirement accounts, I get stares. One jokes about needing to marry rich to pay off his student loans. Some are aware of FIRE, but treat it as a joke.

Meanwhile, my millennial friends who are not as well paid struggle to pay the rent.

The group of millennials who are able and willing to pursue FIRE are a minority. Mortgages and student loan payments lock up more millennial money than what my generation are investing.

Maybe it is an income level thing? I'm a millennial working in a decently paid professional job that is based in a HMCOL (Low compared to NY, SF or Boston, but high compared to most other places in the US) city. Most of us make mid to high five-figure salaries and out of a company of just under 30, I know at least four other coworkers who openly talk about saving a lot to retire early. Three of them are millennials and one of them is Gen Z. Maybe making less than six figures makes us feel less secure?

[raincoast]

I'm a millennial working a well-paid professional job in an HCOL area. Hardly any of my colleagues are serious about saving, and most seem to be spending all of their six-figure salaries as they come in. When I mention contributing to retirement accounts, I get stares. One jokes about needing to marry rich to pay off his student loans. Some are aware of FIRE, but treat it as a joke.

Meanwhile, my millennial friends who are not as well paid struggle to pay the rent.

The group of millennials who are able and willing to pursue FIRE are a minority. Mortgages and student loan payments lock up more millennial money than what my generation are investing.

Maybe it is an income level thing? I'm a millennial working in a decently paid professional job that is based in a HMCOL (Low compared to NY, SF or Boston, but high compared to most other places in the US) city. Most of us make mid to high five-figure salaries and out of a company of just under 30, I know at least four other coworkers who openly talk about saving a lot to retire early. Three of them are millennials and one of them is Gen Z. Maybe making less than six figures makes us feel less secure?
[/quote]

It might be a lawyer thing. Lawyers are notoriously bad at saving money, since the lawyer lifestyle is quite expensive, and typically have big student loans. For many of my colleagues their retirement plan is to make partner.

It may also be about life stage - lawyers start their careers later, so my fellow junior associates are still paying off loans and saving for down payments in the land of the $1 million tear down, and can’t see beyond that to retirement saving. The two associates I know who are seriously investing are 5-10 years older than me.

[TVRodriguez]

I'm a millennial working a well-paid professional job in an HCOL area. Hardly any of my colleagues are serious about saving, and most seem to be spending all of their six-figure salaries as they come in. When I mention contributing to retirement accounts, I get stares. One jokes about needing to marry rich to pay off his student loans. Some are aware of FIRE, but treat it as a joke.

Meanwhile, my millennial friends who are not as well paid struggle to pay the rent.

The group of millennials who are able and willing to pursue FIRE are a minority. Mortgages and student loan payments lock up more millennial money than what my generation are investing.

Maybe it is an income level thing? I'm a millennial working in a decently paid professional job that is based in a HMCOL (Low compared to NY, SF or Boston, but high compared to most other places in the US) city. Most of us make mid to high five-figure salaries and out of a company of just under 30, I know at least four other coworkers who openly talk about saving a lot to retire early. Three of them are millennials and one of them is Gen Z. Maybe making less than six figures makes us feel less secure?

It might be a lawyer thing. Lawyers are notoriously bad at saving money, since the lawyer lifestyle is quite expensive, and typically have big student loans. For many of my colleagues their retirement plan is to make partner.

It may also be about life stage - lawyers start their careers later, so my fellow junior associates are still paying off loans and saving for down payments in the land of the $1 million tear down, and can’t see beyond that to retirement saving. The two associates I know who are seriously investing are 5-10 years older than me.
[/quote]

So true.  Lawyers are the worst (I'm a lawyer).  Sure, some of them hold onto what they earn, but so so many just spend every dollar of the $300K they are making, or, like my one friend, complain that their $150k bonus is "not even enough to pay for the kids' portion of my budget this year."  Sigh.

[jpompo]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

The 15% in the chart referenced 401ks specifically, people could be saving in IRAs, HSAs, Real estate, or taxable brokerage accounts as well

This jumped out to me as well. I'm a millennial and 15%+ into my 401k would put me over the annual contribution limit. I understand my situation is unique, but I can imagine people with a $50k income putting $3,000 into a 401k to get a match, and also maxing out an IRA. They answer that question with 6%, but their actual savings rate is 18%. I know they exist because I was one 10 years ago.

[DadJokes]

I'm curious how 22% of millennials plan to retire before 60 if only 20% are contributing 15% or more to retirement accounts. To do that, they need a bare minimum of 20% contributed, which I assume is even lower than 20% of millennials.

The 15% in the chart referenced 401ks specifically, people could be saving in IRAs, HSAs, Real estate, or taxable brokerage accounts as well

This jumped out to me as well. I'm a millennial and 15%+ into my 401k would put me over the annual contribution limit. I understand my situation is unique, but I can imagine people with a $50k income putting $3,000 into a 401k to get a match, and also maxing out an IRA. They answer that question with 6%, but their actual savings rate is 18%. I know they exist because I was one 10 years ago.

I would venture a guess that it's more people that want to retire before 60 but haven't actually done the math to determine how much they need to save. For 15% of your income to be more than the 401(k) contribution limit (in 2020), you'd need to make over $130k, which I doubt accounts for very many households in the study.

[merula]

The 15% in the chart referenced 401ks specifically, people could be saving in IRAs, HSAs, Real estate, or taxable brokerage accounts as well

This jumped out to me as well. I'm a millennial and 15%+ into my 401k would put me over the annual contribution limit. I understand my situation is unique, but I can imagine people with a $50k income putting $3,000 into a 401k to get a match, and also maxing out an IRA. They answer that question with 6%, but their actual savings rate is 18%. I know they exist because I was one 10 years ago.

I'm remarkably pedantic, but even I would've ignored the strict reading of the question and counted all of my retirement savings. It's actually pretty likely that the survey question included an "or similar retirement savings account" that was just left off of the table, since plenty of people have 403(b)s, 457(b)s or IRAs.

[mm1970]

With all these Millennials saving for FIRE the stock market should boom.

Or at least off-set the crash from the boomers selling in droves.

Boomers don't spend their money, they are too cheap.  Big inheritances coming for patient Millennials.

Or maybe for Gen X, the forgotten - again - generation!

We are always forgotten.

wait, who us?