test

[thriftyc]

Hi all,

[Zamboni]

I think it's normal to feel crappy after a layoff, especially if you don't like the next job much, so don't beat yourself up too much about that.

What was it about the job that was a poor fit? It sounds like you need to find work you enjoy, or that has flexible hours, or both. Of course, if you are FI, then you can just find hobbies you like, but sounds like you are not quite there yet from what you write.

[nereo]

thriftycandian
Sorry to hear about the layoff but congrats on being o the cusp of FI when it happened.  Without knowing the specifics of your finances I'd say that you have a great deal of F-you money and can afford to not work for an extended period of time.  Having a wife who works part-time certainly helps as well.  What concerns me is that you feel so uncertain about what to do with your life going forward.

So - I think you are facing two real questions here
1) are you truly, completely FI right now (under whatever definition you want to make FI)
2) what do you want to do with your life going forward.

If the answer to #1 turns out to be "yes", then the answer to #2 is "do whatever makes you most happy".  But, if the answer to #1 is "I'm not sure" then you probably should seek out some sort of income/job.  The good news is that with your F-you money you have both time and flexibility.  You don't necessarily need an occupation that pays at the same rate as your earlier one - you don't even need an occupation in the traditional sense; part time gigs or a series of paid jobs might be enough for you.

I hope that helps somewhat.  IF you care to post hard numbers and expected annual spending rates I'd be happy to give more advice. What was your old job and what job(s) interest you now? What do you want to do once you never have to work again?

[zarfus]

There is nothing stopping you from getting another FT job in a year or three.

Without seeing your finances, I vote taking a little break to find your motivation again....even if it is just a test drive.

[Greenback Reproduction Specialist]

Well, I know the feeling, a layoff can take a real toll on ones motivation. Almost like a loss of purpose, its a strange thing. You planned for exactly what has happened, but being forced to take the leap vs being ready to take the leap are two different things. Some more details might help to get better advise from people here.

When you say, close to FI? How close are we talking? Conservatively, how long can you sustain? What are your expenses? How much do you have saved? What passive income do you currently have? What liabilities do you have?

How does the wife feel about the situation?

One thing I would highly recommend, stick to a routine, still get out of bed at a decent hour, get dressed for the day, and get out the house and go do something everyday. In my experience, sitting around only makes the lack of motivation worse. Its also important to put things in perspective, if you are close to FI, then financially you are probably just fine. There are people way worse off than you right now, you are a rock star compared to most people. So think BIG, and plan for a big vacation or whatever you have dreamed of doing when FIRE, maybe set dates, work out trip details, etc.

[nereo]

Here are some high level numbers:

-720K Invested in indexes

Income:
Wife part time:  $600-1220month depending on tips (she is a server and loves it)

Budgeted monthly expenses: $2600-$2700  (including a $250 misc "just because" amount and $150 for car depreciation)

I see what you mean.  Well just looking at your $720k invested, that's enough to passively generate about $2400/mo in income at 4% or $2100/mo at a very conservative 3.5% WR.  Combined with your wife's salary (even her minimum monthly take-home) you have enough to meet your budgeted monthly expenses.  However, absent her wife's take-home you're not quite there yet.

Good news: there's no rush for you in terms of employment, nor any need for you to look only at high-paying careers.  You can not work for years and you'll be fine, so long as your wife keeps her job.  Even then you might be ok. 

My suggestion:  Find what you want to do.  If you can find a job or part-time gig that pays just $24k/year you will be golden... you won't have to touch your investments at all.  This can be anything you want it to be - substitute teaching, seasonal employment, part-time etc.  Each year brings you closer to that pension and closer to less paid in child subsidy.  It will probably just be a year or two working at around this level before you can decide to never work again (if that's what you want to do).

[big_slacker]

Here are some high level numbers:

-720K Invested in indexes

Income:
Wife part time:  $600-1220month depending on tips (she is a server and loves it)

Budgeted monthly expenses: $2600-$2700  (including a $250 misc "just because" amount and $150 for car depreciation)

I see what you mean.  Well just looking at your $720k invested, that's enough to passively generate about $2400/mo in income at 4% or $2100/mo at a very conservative 3.5% WR.  Combined with your wife's salary (even her minimum monthly take-home) you have enough to meet your budgeted monthly expenses.  However, absent her wife's take-home you're not quite there yet.

Good news: there's no rush for you in terms of employment, nor any need for you to look only at high-paying careers.  You can not work for years and you'll be fine, so long as your wife keeps her job.  Even then you might be ok. 

My suggestion:  Find what you want to do.  If you can find a job or part-time gig that pays just $24k/year you will be golden... you won't have to touch your investments at all.  This can be anything you want it to be - substitute teaching, seasonal employment, part-time etc.  Each year brings you closer to that pension and closer to less paid in child subsidy.  It will probably just be a year or two working at around this level before you can decide to never work again (if that's what you want to do).

My thoughts as well. Training, consulting and the like instead of the more pressure/results oriented world of sales might be a good place to start. You already know how to stand in front of people and talk which is half the battle.

[Cap_Scarlet]

..... took another job a few weeks back but quit that as it was not the right fit

What does that mean?

[mathlete]

Do you budget for fun stuff? Vacations?

[okits]

How guaranteed is the kids subsidy? (Edited because I missed your age in the first post.)

If I were in your position, I would be highly motivated to focus on my spending instead of rushing to get another job. Is that $250/mo actually being spent, or there only as a buffer?

If you post a full expenses case study, we may be able to help point out areas to target.

I am 42 and wife is 44.  The subsidy is guaranteed until the kids are 18 - then drops off.  Kids are 12,10 and 8.  It could go up to about $1000/month if income drops to below 30K

The not-yet-implemented Canada Child Benefit will be an interesting factor.  The election platform states it's income-tested, so if it's implemented that way you could be FI, lower-income, and receive somewhere in the neighbourhood of $4-5k per kid per year.  That is some serious dough when your family's expenses are sub-$30k a year.

Agree with many others that you should find a fun job to earn a little cash and relax a little.  Even if you save nothing and only cover living expenses you are in fantastic shape.

[nereo]

How guaranteed is the kids subsidy? (Edited because I missed your age in the first post.)

If I were in your position, I would be highly motivated to focus on my spending instead of rushing to get another job. Is that $250/mo actually being spent, or there only as a buffer?

If you post a full expenses case study, we may be able to help point out areas to target.

I am 42 and wife is 44.  The subsidy is guaranteed until the kids are 18 - then drops off.  Kids are 12,10 and 8.  It could go up to about $1000/month if income drops to below 30K

Well... while I';m not advocating it, with the subsidy you could just call yourself FI/RE now.  with an $1k/mo subsidy your monthly expenses could be met with only a 2.2% WR, and that's before ever factoring in your wife's income.  You fall in that ironic trap where earning $40k/year might mean tighter finances than earning $20k.

I seriously think you are fine financially, and your main focus now should be on finding what will make you happy that you might be able to generate some income from.  If you can stash away another 2-3x expenses ($62k-91k) through either market gains or additional savings over the next several years you'll have no problem making ends meet even if the pension never comes, the subsidy disappears and your wife decides she never wants to work.

[Mr. Green]

One of the things I find so reassuring about that "cusp of FI" state is that you could quit working full-time and take a minimum wage job and still accomplish the goal. If you intended to build a $1 million stash and draw $40,000 a year from that following a 4% SWR then you could get to $750,000, run into head winds and decide to bail, drawing $30,000 from your stash and working part-time for the other $10,000. Maybe you'd have a chance to decompress and eventually work your way back into a full-time job or maybe you wouldn't. This is the position I'm in currently, and it's somewhat liberating in itself because maintaining the status quo is no longer necessary if you really don't want to.

[Northwestie]

I think the above suggestion to "decompress" a bit is a good one.  If you can either take some time off from job thing or just work PT for a bit this may give you time to contemplate your next move.  Best of luck.

[AZDude]

Maybe find some part-time work, just to bridge from full time to retired?

[ulrichw]

It doesn't sound like you're in a field where your knowledge will quickly become obsolete, so my advice would be to take a year off (assuming your spouse is ok with this, of course).

Once the year is over, re-evaluate, but focus the year on doing what you'd be doing if you were retired.

42 is still young, you have many potential earning years ahead of you. Your year should help inform you in a few ways:
- You'll learn how you'd spend your time (your 7 months probably already gave you a taste of this) and how much you enjoy it
- You'll see how much financial pressure you feel
- You'll identify whether you would like to have more spending money or not

It sounds like you're a little burned out - time is a great perspective-builder, in my opinion, and you're financially able to take the time.

I did this once when I was around 40, though retirement was no option for me at the time. It was a great time, though, and it recharged the batteries (I'm now 48 and still working).

[Koogie]

Chin up, man.  It's just a cold, crappy winter getting to you... :o)         

The double whammy of the layoff and then the sh*tty job right after are probably getting to you.   Time to relax for a little bit and appreciate what you got.   Maybe tell yourself that you'll cut yourself some slack, take the next few months off until the weather is good and then go look for a good job in the spring.  You got skills, attitude and age on your side.   Jobs will flow.

I'm about the same age and a little ahead moneywise (no kids) but I get where you are coming from.  My FIRE dream fell apart last year (I am FI but only semi-RE and might never get to RE) and once that goal is out of reach (or feels that way) it can be a bitch staying motivated.
But with 3 kids, bills to pay, etc..  you've gotta realize that you are internalizing a lot of pressure to "produce" even if you know logically you're damn near set FI-wise.    Put it on pause for a bit and start fresh again in the spring. 

p.s.  I'm local so if you ever feel like going out for a drink and yapping to someone who gets it, drop me a line.   Cheers.
   

[backyardfeast]

Edit: Cross-posted with you; real estate sounds like a good possibility, depending on the market in your area.  Could give you flexible hours, power over how many clients you take on, a little income...
___
I agree with others.  Between the child benefit, the proposed tax breaks, and other credits that you might now be eligible for with a reduced income, you can basically call yourself FI and RE.  Given that you knew you were so close, what were your plans for when you reached FI?  What were you thinking you might do with the rest of your years, especially given that you still have some years ahead with your kids in school and your wife (presumably) continuing to work?

It sounds like it's not so much time to find a new job, as to figure out what this next chapter of your life might be.  Once you've got some direction there, you can decide what kind of low-key work you might enjoy to supplement your living expenses for a while.

As a comparison (also at 42 ;) ) I'll be working for a while yet, but DH is ready for a major life change.  We're aiming for a larger homestead property, and I've told him all he needs to do is make the property revenue-neutral.  So he will be spending some of his time earning enough from "farming" to get us reduced taxes and cover farm expenses.  He will also pick up side handyman jobs, and possibly also get a part-time (likely minimum-wage) job without a commute.  We will be covering our expenses off my income; his work will cover all the extras and allow us to save a little more.  It looks like you could easily do the same (cover extras, a little savings, etc--not farm! :) )?

[DollarBill]

Sounds like you need to Tame your Mammoth!

http://waitbutwhy.com/2014/06/taming-mammoth-let-peoples-opinions-run-life.html

[ETBen]

Agree with many others. Losing a job can hit you harder than you expect, mentally. But work PT at something you like.  Forget about what kind of job you are "supposed to" do at your career point.

[Zamboni]

Loved taming the mammoth!

OP, sounds like you are in good shape financially. My suggestion would be to give yourself permission to do whatever you want. That could mean mostly chilling out or it could mean taking a barely paying job doing something you love like hosting "lego building camps" for little kids, umping little league T-ball, volunteering at the museum, learning to cook or woodwork, starting a blog or a "consulting" business, whatever. I'd probably get certified to ref my favorite sport for fun, exercise, and a little $$$.

Whatever it is, find a way to make it look like you are employed during this time on your resume so that it doesn't seem you have an employment gap if you decide to go back to work. Because people expect a guy your age to keep working. It's bullshit, and you don't need to work right now, but it's true. The good news is that almost no one will contact your current employer when and if you apply for another job, so you can just incorporate yourself and call it a job on your resume if you want. If they ask you about customers for your consulting business, just say you wish you could tell them more but you signed confidentiality agreements with your clients and you take those obligations seriously. If they ask about revenue or assets of your company, just quote your stash and/or the gains on your stash. It's all a game, so play it well my friend!

Good luck to you.