Author Topic: Epic FU money stories  (Read 2805069 times)

Loren Ver

  • CM*MW 2023 Attendees
  • Handlebar Stache
  • *
  • Posts: 1231
  • Location: Midwest USA
  • I Retired. Yah!
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4400 on: December 02, 2022, 12:36:47 PM »
@fuzzy math What a great way to end the year and start fresh.  Whew!  Sorry things went down so horribly, but I am glad you can go forward on your own terms!

@afuera your story warms my heart.  I even told it to my DH as I thought it was soo good!  "I found a way to make it work."  Indeed you did.

rpr

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 718
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4401 on: December 02, 2022, 01:01:30 PM »
Just Wow!

Good on you for standing up, fuzzy math!

okits

  • CMTO 2023 Attendees
  • Senior Mustachian
  • *
  • Posts: 13059
  • Location: Canada
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4402 on: December 02, 2022, 03:25:31 PM »
Way to go, and wow, good time to completely bail and save yourself.

This is exactly it.  It sounds like a horrendous situation and you are the "winner" by extricating yourself as quickly as possible, sustaining as little damage as possible.  Congratulations on quitting and for all your and your spouse's work (financial, practical, and mental) to be in a good position to do it.

I hope you have a very merry and unstressful Christmas!

BicycleB

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5269
  • Location: Coolest Neighborhood on Earth, They Say
  • Older than the internet, but not wiser... yet
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4403 on: December 02, 2022, 09:00:42 PM »
Well done, @fuzzy math!

You have the emails and text messages stored outside the company’s email system?

Sorry to harp on these things you probably did, just recalling lock-out examples I’ve seen. Best wishes.

Zamboni

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3885
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4404 on: December 03, 2022, 06:56:58 AM »
@fuzzy math your story is a huge win.

Instead of quitting primarily because of the poor treatment exhibited by HR & administration's plan to "farm you out," you also got to quit with timing that made the point to the MD staff that it is also quite unethical to cut costs so much that worker safety and patient care is sacrificed.

I'll support the prior statements that you should make yourself a hard copy folder of your written efforts to communicate safety concerns and keep it at your house. While it seems unlikely that anything will ever come of it even if they do try to throw you under the bus, it is not uncommon for people who are either leaving or already gone to be blamed for all problems large and small.

Trifle

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5968
  • Age: 57
  • Location: Outside, NC, US
    • In The Garden
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4405 on: December 04, 2022, 03:24:44 AM »
While it seems unlikely that anything will ever come of it even if they do try to throw you under the bus, it is not uncommon for people who are either leaving or already gone to be blamed for all problems large and small.

This is so true.  I'm a former hospital exec, and this happens all the time. 

BikeFanatic

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 826
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4406 on: December 04, 2022, 07:24:55 AM »
Great job gettin The hell out of there! Former ICU RN here, I am so glad you stood up for your principals.
I bet most there will secretly support your decision and may be emboldened by it also. I worked for one company like yours and I was aghast at the cost cutting, the patient danger, and the retention of incompetent employees, you say accident prone which is a great word for it. I so wish I had reported them to dept of public health. I was New ish and really could not believe the incompetence  was all the way up the chain and really institution wide.
My next job was at a real hospital that really cared about people and not just money. Epic FU to them Fuzzy math.

LightTripper

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2434
  • Location: London, UK
  • Rural Londoner. Lazy workaholic. Confused.
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4407 on: December 07, 2022, 07:37:06 AM »
Congratulations @fuzzy math !

Gremlin

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 581
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4408 on: December 07, 2022, 06:17:36 PM »
We track our spending in a spreadsheet.  For the current month we itemise everything in one tab.  But then we keep a historical record by spending category by month in a different tab.  Ie, I can tell you that I spent $2.10 on groceries on the 4th of December, and I can tell you that I spent $842.65 on groceries in July 2018, but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.

Anyway, we have been tracking our monthly spend by category for about 14 years and each month we populate an extra column in the spreadsheet.  This month we have reached column FU in the Excel spreadsheet.

I pointed out to Mrs G that that represented FU money.  She just rolled her eyes at me and walked off in disgust...

jinga nation

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2707
  • Age: 247
  • Location: 'Murica's Dong
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4409 on: December 07, 2022, 06:58:43 PM »
We track our spending in a spreadsheet.  For the current month we itemise everything in one tab.  But then we keep a historical record by spending category by month in a different tab.  Ie, I can tell you that I spent $2.10 on groceries on the 4th of December, and I can tell you that I spent $842.65 on groceries in July 2018, but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.

Anyway, we have been tracking our monthly spend by category for about 14 years and each month we populate an extra column in the spreadsheet.  This month we have reached column FU in the Excel spreadsheet.

I pointed out to Mrs G that that represented FU money.  She just rolled her eyes at me and walked off in disgust...

Is that a FIRE Dad Joke? :-p

RWD

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6597
  • Location: Arizona
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4410 on: December 07, 2022, 10:00:41 PM »
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

Ladychips

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1451
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4411 on: December 07, 2022, 10:36:31 PM »
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

Trifle

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5968
  • Age: 57
  • Location: Outside, NC, US
    • In The Garden
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4412 on: December 08, 2022, 04:23:28 AM »
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

+1!   Although now I'm feeling a bit inferior, because I round my daily spending records up and down to the nearest dollar haha . . .

dcheesi

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1309
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4413 on: December 08, 2022, 05:31:30 AM »
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

+1!   Although now I'm feeling a bit inferior, because I round my daily spending records up and down to the nearest dollar haha . . .
Are you recording things by hand? I've always downloaded transactions from my banks, so it's easier not to round, or otherwise massage the numbers.

FWIW, I used to use spreadsheets like Gremlin's; I'd have a new one for each year, so in theory, if I could find the one from 2018 I could tell you the exact transactions. Nowadays I use GnuCash; it's frustratingly limited or awkward in some ways, but I'm much less likely to fool myself with a bad formula calculation, or summing the wrong group of cells...
« Last Edit: December 08, 2022, 05:33:12 AM by dcheesi »

Trifle

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5968
  • Age: 57
  • Location: Outside, NC, US
    • In The Garden
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4414 on: December 08, 2022, 05:43:36 AM »
[...] but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.
I just checked and I actually went grocery shopping on July 6th, 2018. Spent $93.55 on groceries, $15.47 on supplies. Sales tax was $7.77 making the total bill $116.79.

Sometimes GnuCash feels like my diary.

I love this forum so much...you are my tribe...

+1!   Although now I'm feeling a bit inferior, because I round my daily spending records up and down to the nearest dollar haha . . .
Are you recording things by hand? I've always downloaded transactions from my banks, so it's easier not to round, or otherwise massage the numbers.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

BuffaloStache

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1298
  • Location: The boring middle accumulation phase
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4415 on: December 08, 2022, 09:38:35 AM »
Jumping in here late (It's been a while since I caught up) to congratulate @fuzzy math . Well done and congrats! I second the suggestion to print out (or otherwise back-up) all of the emails and texts if you can.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

I also have a custom excel spreadsheet that I enter info into by hand. I've also not found the bank-imported categories to leave a lot wanting, but also I use several different banks/credit cards to maximize rewards (Chase, CitiBank, CapitalOne, etc.) and they each seem to export slightly differently. If I had a lot more time I could write some macros to pull out the info from each organization I need and streamline recurring effort, but I haven't found the motivation for it yet. Plus, it took me several years to get the spreadsheet exactly how I like it, which I know is arbitrary but it's something. Finally, with a simple excel document I can back it up easily, and can open it on 90%+ of computers without installing separate software.

NorCal

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1500
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4416 on: December 08, 2022, 12:20:29 PM »
Jumping in here late (It's been a while since I caught up) to congratulate @fuzzy math . Well done and congrats! I second the suggestion to print out (or otherwise back-up) all of the emails and texts if you can.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

I also have a custom excel spreadsheet that I enter info into by hand. I've also not found the bank-imported categories to leave a lot wanting, but also I use several different banks/credit cards to maximize rewards (Chase, CitiBank, CapitalOne, etc.) and they each seem to export slightly differently. If I had a lot more time I could write some macros to pull out the info from each organization I need and streamline recurring effort, but I haven't found the motivation for it yet. Plus, it took me several years to get the spreadsheet exactly how I like it, which I know is arbitrary but it's something. Finally, with a simple excel document I can back it up easily, and can open it on 90%+ of computers without installing separate software.

Take a look at https://www.tillerhq.com/.  It's a feed that pulls in financial data directly into Excel or Google Sheets in a standardized format.  I'm a spreadsheet person too, and it saves me a ton of work.

elysianfields

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 518
  • Location: Asia
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4417 on: December 08, 2022, 10:50:29 PM »

Join your Trades' Union, folks, or your employee association, whatever it's called.  As a single person going up against a big organisation you haven't a hope, as part of a group with the same aims you've got a chance of evening up the score.

I cannot count the number of times that my union has intervened to keep management from doing really stupid things that would hurt not just my colleagues and me, but the institution as well.  I'm a lifetime member and it's been well worth it.

alcon835

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 779
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4418 on: December 09, 2022, 07:20:59 AM »
We track our spending in a spreadsheet.  For the current month we itemise everything in one tab.  But then we keep a historical record by spending category by month in a different tab.  Ie, I can tell you that I spent $2.10 on groceries on the 4th of December, and I can tell you that I spent $842.65 on groceries in July 2018, but I can't tell you what I spent on groceries on the 6th of July 2018.

Anyway, we have been tracking our monthly spend by category for about 14 years and each month we populate an extra column in the spreadsheet.  This month we have reached column FU in the Excel spreadsheet.

I pointed out to Mrs G that that represented FU money.  She just rolled her eyes at me and walked off in disgust...

This here is the real FU money!

lhamo

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3127
  • Location: Seattle
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4419 on: December 09, 2022, 08:43:11 AM »
Jumping in here late (It's been a while since I caught up) to congratulate @fuzzy math . Well done and congrats! I second the suggestion to print out (or otherwise back-up) all of the emails and texts if you can.

Yes, by hand.  I don't like how the bank info comes over; it doesn't work with the categories I like to keep

I also have a custom excel spreadsheet that I enter info into by hand. I've also not found the bank-imported categories to leave a lot wanting, but also I use several different banks/credit cards to maximize rewards (Chase, CitiBank, CapitalOne, etc.) and they each seem to export slightly differently. If I had a lot more time I could write some macros to pull out the info from each organization I need and streamline recurring effort, but I haven't found the motivation for it yet. Plus, it took me several years to get the spreadsheet exactly how I like it, which I know is arbitrary but it's something. Finally, with a simple excel document I can back it up easily, and can open it on 90%+ of computers without installing separate software.

Take a look at https://www.tillerhq.com/.  It's a feed that pulls in financial data directly into Excel or Google Sheets in a standardized format.  I'm a spreadsheet person too, and it saves me a ton of work.

I still haven't bit the bullet and paid for Tiller, but might in 2023.  At least one of the founders is/was part of the MMM tribe -- met him at Camp Mustache 2016.

RetiredAt63

  • CMTO 2023 Attendees
  • Senior Mustachian
  • *
  • Posts: 20789
  • Location: Eastern Ontario, Canada
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4420 on: December 09, 2022, 09:47:05 AM »

Join your Trades' Union, folks, or your employee association, whatever it's called.  As a single person going up against a big organisation you haven't a hope, as part of a group with the same aims you've got a chance of evening up the score.

I cannot count the number of times that my union has intervened to keep management from doing really stupid things that would hurt not just my colleagues and me, but the institution as well.  I'm a lifetime member and it's been well worth it.

I was a union member my whole working life.  My union brought so much value to my life*, even though I sometimes disagreed with its position.  I was a teacher - our union negotiated pay, workload (of course this massively affects the students), working conditions, leaves, health insurance, pensions, the whole bit.  When your employer is the provincial government you need all the leverage you can get.

* Before I started teaching (1975, so long ago) our union had negotiated maternity leaves.  This was long before provincial and federal maternity leave laws.  Before our union got that, a teacher who went on maternity leave had no guarantee her job would be there for her when she was ready to go back to work.

Sandi_k

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1595
  • Location: California
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4421 on: December 09, 2022, 09:53:28 AM »
* Before I started teaching (1975, so long ago) our union had negotiated maternity leaves.  This was long before provincial and federal maternity leave laws.  Before our union got that, a teacher who went on maternity leave had no guarantee her job would be there for her when she was ready to go back to work.

Before FMLA was created under Pres. Clinton and Labor Secretary Reich in 1993, NO ONE had a job for them waiting if they had to take time off for medical reasons. And women working as teachers and nurses were frequently fired when they began to show.

We haven't even had 30 years of FMLA protections yet - it wasn't all that long ago when this sort of sexism and discrimination was "baked into" the labor landscape.

(Mom was a nurse, aunts were teachers in those days).

partgypsy

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5227
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4422 on: December 09, 2022, 12:27:12 PM »
Fuzzy Math -I have noticed many occasion where management is out of touch with clinical side, but this takes the cake. Way to go!

Afuera - Man you were going to kick but or chew bubble gum, but you were out of bubble gum.

Thank you for the engrossing and ultimately satisfying endings.

RetiredAt63

  • CMTO 2023 Attendees
  • Senior Mustachian
  • *
  • Posts: 20789
  • Location: Eastern Ontario, Canada
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4423 on: December 09, 2022, 01:14:57 PM »
* Before I started teaching (1975, so long ago) our union had negotiated maternity leaves.  This was long before provincial and federal maternity leave laws.  Before our union got that, a teacher who went on maternity leave had no guarantee her job would be there for her when she was ready to go back to work.

Before FMLA was created under Pres. Clinton and Labor Secretary Reich in 1993, NO ONE had a job for them waiting if they had to take time off for medical reasons. And women working as teachers and nurses were frequently fired when they began to show.

We haven't even had 30 years of FMLA protections yet - it wasn't all that long ago when this sort of sexism and discrimination was "baked into" the labor landscape.

(Mom was a nurse, aunts were teachers in those days).

This was Quebec (see reference to provinces above).  Not sure when Canadian legislation came in.  But definitely after 1975.  Hmm, should also check to see when EI benefits covered mat leave.  American unemployment insurance covers mat leave?  I hope.

Edit - oops I was off a bit.  So federal in 1971 (22 years before the US), some provinces before that. 

https://canadianlabour.ca/who-we-are/history/maternity-parental-benefits/
« Last Edit: December 09, 2022, 01:17:23 PM by RetiredAt63 »

Zamboni

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3885
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4424 on: December 09, 2022, 07:20:21 PM »
I spent $11.29 on groceries on July 6, 2018, lol.

Congrats on reaching FU Money!

Money Badger

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 527
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4425 on: December 09, 2022, 08:23:21 PM »
@fuzzy math and @afuera,  Both epic examples of standing up for principles and priorities.  The common thread is poor leadership leads to business problems, then scared managers then stupid attempts to bully people into bailing them out for minor profits.   F-that.   

CurledMoss

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 85
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4426 on: December 10, 2022, 07:51:23 AM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2022, 07:54:07 AM by CurledMoss »

Saffron

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 47
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4427 on: December 10, 2022, 12:33:24 PM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s


RetiredAt63

  • CMTO 2023 Attendees
  • Senior Mustachian
  • *
  • Posts: 20789
  • Location: Eastern Ontario, Canada
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4428 on: December 10, 2022, 01:08:38 PM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

Now I'm wondering if Curled Moss was in Ottawa last February?   /s

BicycleB

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5269
  • Location: Coolest Neighborhood on Earth, They Say
  • Older than the internet, but not wiser... yet
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4429 on: December 10, 2022, 02:09:12 PM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Obviously not everyone agrees with your view of COVID rules, but congrats on being secure enough to pull trigger at the time of your choosing. I'd say that being able to do what you feel is right is epic.

Abundant life

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 490
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4430 on: December 10, 2022, 05:37:32 PM »
Quote
Obviously not everyone agrees with your view of COVID rules, but congrats on being secure enough to pull trigger at the time of your choosing. I'd say that being able to do what you feel is right is epic.
Kudos to you BB - what a courteous and respectful response :)

Zamboni

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3885
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4431 on: December 10, 2022, 08:29:07 PM »
Having the financial security that you can leave a job for whatever reason, big or small, is an epic FU money story. You shouldn't stay at a job if you disagree strongly with what they are telling you to do. Congrats, CurledMoss!

Obviously the pandemic made people re-evaluate their employment situation for all kinds of reasons.

Shane

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1665
  • Location: Midtown
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4432 on: December 11, 2022, 06:38:37 AM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Saffron

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 47
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4433 on: December 11, 2022, 07:25:52 AM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Edit: I’m all for using FU money to bypass workplace BS. But this case in my opinion is using FU money to justify personal unreasonableness.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2022, 07:37:33 AM by Saffron »

Shane

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1665
  • Location: Midtown
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4434 on: December 11, 2022, 07:37:55 AM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter. Friends who religiously wore masks everywhere, as well as people we know who never wore masks anywhere, almost all of them got sick from Omicron. In January 2022, at the peak of the Omicron surge, it was Restaurant Week in Center City Philadelphia. Every. single. night. we were out eating and drinking in jam-packed restaurants. It was hilarious watching the posers come in wearing their masks from the hostess stand to their tables. Then, they'd take their masks off, so they could eat, drink, talk, laugh, and have a great time, for an hour and a half, but be sure to put their masks back on, before they went back outside again.

LennStar

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3693
  • Location: Germany
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4435 on: December 11, 2022, 08:02:28 AM »
That reminds me of the interviewed Ukrainian.

"No, we no longer go into the cellar when the air raid alert comes. It's two or three times a day! You can't be in the cellar all the time! Yes, my neighbor died last week, but all I got was scratch the arm."

Of ourse it was stupid going to a restaurant at that time. Still, if everyone wore their mask if possible (hard when you are eating after all), the risk to get infected there would be a lot lower.

In those cases I always wonder if it is the widespread inability of people to understand statistics/percentages/risk or simply "I don't care what happens, but I don't want to admit I am an egoistic asshole".

grantmeaname

  • CM*MW 2023 Attendees
  • Walrus Stache
  • *
  • Posts: 5982
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Middle West
  • Cast me away from yesterday's things
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4436 on: December 11, 2022, 08:02:37 AM »
the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'

RetiredAt63

  • CMTO 2023 Attendees
  • Senior Mustachian
  • *
  • Posts: 20789
  • Location: Eastern Ontario, Canada
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4437 on: December 11, 2022, 08:36:40 AM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter. Friends who religiously wore masks everywhere, as well as people we know who never wore masks anywhere, almost all of them got sick from Omicron. In January 2022, at the peak of the Omicron surge, it was Restaurant Week in Center City Philadelphia. Every. single. night. we were out eating and drinking in jam-packed restaurants. It was hilarious watching the posers come in wearing their masks from the hostess stand to their tables. Then, they'd take their masks off, so they could eat, drink, talk, laugh, and have a great time, for an hour and a half, but be sure to put their masks back on, before they went back outside again.

I still haven't had Covid.  But I wear my N95 mask 100% of the time I am in a building, I do not take it off at all, I don't eat in restaurants.  With more cases and particles lasting longer in cold air, and our nose's immune response being much less in cold air, I am now wearing my mask between the car and the building. 

I've read that roughly 15 minutes of exposure is the tipping point for infection.  Of course this is a rough estimate, since it doesn't account for how many viral particles are actually in the air.  But over an hour of exposure?  Hah.

alcon835

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 779
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4438 on: December 11, 2022, 10:33:29 AM »
This is a truly fantastic conversation to have over in a different thread :)

SwordGuy

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8963
  • Location: Fayetteville, NC
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4439 on: December 11, 2022, 11:25:23 AM »
This is a truly fantastic conversation to have over in a different thread :)

They have FU money and don't have to care what you or I think.  :)

Which doesn't mean you aren't right...

Shane

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1665
  • Location: Midtown
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4440 on: December 11, 2022, 11:58:59 AM »
Not epic. But I'm well established... I was working seasonal for mndot and I had enough of their childish covid daily pre screens and covid authoritarian rules. One day the boss (which is a good guy) said the pencil pushes have a new rule that we have to wear a mask now when we go into gas stations. I quit the next day. That was about 1 year ago.

Cool story bro. You sure showed them with their perfectly reasonable requests during the worst respiratory pandemic in a century. /s

By December, 2021, everyone who wanted to be was already double, maybe triple, vaxxed. So, no, it wasn't "perfectly reasonable" for an employer to require workers to put on masks in order to pump gas. Most employees didn't have the ability to push back against unreasonable government mandates. Glad @CurledMoss had the means to tell those whiny fuckers, FU!

Perhaps you don’t remember that December 2021 was the height of the Omicron wave? You know, the variant that started infecting people again despite vaccination status?

And when it’s characterized as  “just pumping gas” it sounds reasonable, but my bet is the the rule was “mask when interacting with others” because that’s what it was at my government org.

Perhaps you're the one not remembering that almost EVERYONE got sick from Omicron last winter. Friends who religiously wore masks everywhere, as well as people we know who never wore masks anywhere, almost all of them got sick from Omicron. In January 2022, at the peak of the Omicron surge, it was Restaurant Week in Center City Philadelphia. Every. single. night. we were out eating and drinking in jam-packed restaurants. It was hilarious watching the posers come in wearing their masks from the hostess stand to their tables. Then, they'd take their masks off, so they could eat, drink, talk, laugh, and have a great time, for an hour and a half, but be sure to put their masks back on, before they went back outside again.

I still haven't had Covid.  But I wear my N95 mask 100% of the time I am in a building, I do not take it off at all, I don't eat in restaurants.  With more cases and particles lasting longer in cold air, and our nose's immune response being much less in cold air, I am now wearing my mask between the car and the building. 

I've read that roughly 15 minutes of exposure is the tipping point for infection.  Of course this is a rough estimate, since it doesn't account for how many viral particles are actually in the air.  But over an hour of exposure?  Hah.

At least you're being consistent. I totally respect mandates requiring employers and businesses to allow anyone who wants to, to mask up, wfh, or whatever, if they perceive themselves to be at high risk. The rest of us, who aren't high risk, should be allowed to live our lives as we feel comfortable, imho.

Captain FIRE

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1186
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4441 on: December 11, 2022, 02:16:49 PM »
At least you're being consistent. I totally respect mandates requiring employers and businesses to allow anyone who wants to, to mask up, wfh, or whatever, if they perceive themselves to be at high risk. The rest of us, who aren't high risk, should be allowed to live our lives as we feel comfortable, imho.

*scratches head*
You are ok with a mandate to allow people to wear personal protective equipment that doesn't affect anyone else?
That's....I just don't even know how to describe it, it's such a mind boggling thing to say because it's so basic.

Should we pass a law that allows people to wear glasses if they want/need for health reasons?

ATtiny85

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 957
  • Location: Midwest
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4442 on: December 11, 2022, 05:28:45 PM »
the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'

I agree, but have seen it stated in our halls.

The plural of anecdote is data.

grantmeaname

  • CM*MW 2023 Attendees
  • Walrus Stache
  • *
  • Posts: 5982
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Middle West
  • Cast me away from yesterday's things
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4443 on: December 11, 2022, 05:56:41 PM »
OMG amazing find

eyesonthehorizon

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1034
  • Location: Texas
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4444 on: December 11, 2022, 06:49:09 PM »
At least you're being consistent. I totally respect mandates requiring employers and businesses to allow anyone who wants to, to mask up, wfh, or whatever, if they perceive themselves to be at high risk. The rest of us, who aren't high risk, should be allowed to live our lives as we feel comfortable, imho.

*scratches head*
You are ok with a mandate to allow people to wear personal protective equipment that doesn't affect anyone else?
That's....I just don't even know how to describe it, it's such a mind boggling thing to say because it's so basic.

Should we pass a law that allows people to wear glasses if they want/need for health reasons?
This. Akin to saying "we should respect the rights of the concerned to drive sober if they perceive themselves to be at high risk of crashing." The risk to be considered is that posed to everyone in the public space, not just one given "driver." If you have no choice (economic or otherwise) but to be on the road with drivers who are each permitted to decide if sobriety is right for them, the fact that you can wear a seat belt to reduce your odds of death & the severity of your injuries (like a vaccine providing improved but less than sterilizing immunity) is a cold comfort.

For that same reason I want to give a little credit, because work from home was also included in the above suggested list - most societies haven't even come close; the Netherlands is the only place I've heard of introducing legislation to allow it when it's feasible for a given role. It'd be good for everyone to have the option: it would reduce road congestion & attendant aggravation, oil consumption from both redundant transport & pointless idling in traffic, parents passing along everything their kids pick up at school.

As nice & consistent a sentiment as it is, since it has not been made a priority, we're stuck with a system of de facto coercion of exposure to risk, regardless of awareness or perception of the level of risk. Any society requires a baseline of negotiation, but increased coercion on any group will always breed increased tension across the board. FI reduces the levers for coercion.

I do think it's a very good thing - for the individual & for society as a whole - that someone who doesn't see a point in masking in public during an uncontained respiratory pandemic could simply quit their job & remove themselves from a group who set a requirement to mask in public. There's no one who does not benefit from that state of affairs & the outcome. I frankly wish everyone society-wide could be given that power.

I exercised mine to insist on working from home. It is reprehensible that it took being FI to make that a viable option, however.

Captain FIRE

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1186
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4445 on: December 11, 2022, 08:06:11 PM »
For that same reason I want to give a little credit, because work from home was also included in the above suggested list - most societies haven't even come close; the Netherlands is the only place I've heard of introducing legislation to allow it when it's feasible for a given role. It'd be good for everyone to have the option: it would reduce road congestion & attendant aggravation, oil consumption from both redundant transport & pointless idling in traffic, parents passing along everything their kids pick up at school.

[Snip]

I do think it's a very good thing - for the individual & for society as a whole - that someone who doesn't see a point in masking in public during an uncontained respiratory pandemic could simply quit their job & remove themselves from a group who set a requirement to mask in public. There's no one who does not benefit from that state of affairs & the outcome. I frankly wish everyone society-wide could be given that power.

I'm not sure if Shane meant individuals who want to WFH (in which case I agree with you) or companies who want to allow their people to WFH (which is how I thought he meant it, and I see as falling under the PPE/driving sober/wearing eyeglasses categories of "of course...").

Strong agree to your last point though.

former player

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8888
  • Location: Avalon
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4446 on: December 12, 2022, 02:18:59 AM »
For that same reason I want to give a little credit, because work from home was also included in the above suggested list - most societies haven't even come close; the Netherlands is the only place I've heard of introducing legislation to allow it when it's feasible for a given role. It'd be good for everyone to have the option: it would reduce road congestion & attendant aggravation, oil consumption from both redundant transport & pointless idling in traffic, parents passing along everything their kids pick up at school.

[Snip]

I do think it's a very good thing - for the individual & for society as a whole - that someone who doesn't see a point in masking in public during an uncontained respiratory pandemic could simply quit their job & remove themselves from a group who set a requirement to mask in public. There's no one who does not benefit from that state of affairs & the outcome. I frankly wish everyone society-wide could be given that power.

I'm not sure if Shane meant individuals who want to WFH (in which case I agree with you) or companies who want to allow their people to WFH (which is how I thought he meant it, and I see as falling under the PPE/driving sober/wearing eyeglasses categories of "of course...").

Strong agree to your last point though.
Shane may have had in mind the batshitcrazy proposals in some parts of the USA to pass laws which would have required schools and businesses to stop people from wearing masks.

Not sure if any of those proposals ever came into effect but proposals along those lines were certainly in the news.

Shane

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1665
  • Location: Midtown
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4447 on: December 12, 2022, 03:17:43 AM »
Reasonable/unreasonable is subjective. Some employers think it's reasonable to require workers to come back to the office full time. Those with FU money get to choose whether or not they want to do that. Other employers think it's reasonable to require that employees wear masks while they're pumping gas. If you have FU money, it gives you the ability to tell an employer to fuck off if you feel like it.

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it. Conversely, if an employee doesn't want to wear a mask while pumping gas, the employer shouldn't be able to fire her for not wearing a mask. It works both ways.

A close relative underwent organ transplant surgery during the covid-19 pandemic. Even though most of his colleagues have already returned to working full-time in the office, relative's employer is respecting his choice to continue working from home, indefinitely, because he is at high risk.

Not all employers are reasonable, though. That's why I said I supported government mandates requiring that employers respect employees' choices to wfh(when possible), mask/not mask, etc. Anyone who doesn't think there are workplaces, all over the US, where workers are under intense pressure to NOT wear masks, you might want to step out of your privileged little bubble, once in a while. I promise you, there are many, many workplaces where you wouldn't last a week if you insisted on wearing a mask, and that's not right, imho.

RWTL

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 682
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4448 on: December 12, 2022, 03:59:53 AM »

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it.


Do you think doctors and nurses in the operating room should be able to choose whether they have to mask?   And why?

Shane

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1665
  • Location: Midtown
Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #4449 on: December 12, 2022, 04:47:49 AM »

As I said above, I support mandates requiring employers to respect employees' personal choices. If an employee doesn't feel comfortable working without a mask, employers shouldn't be allowed to fire him because of it.


Do you think doctors and nurses in the operating room should be able to choose whether they have to mask?   And why?

Of course surgeons should be required to wear masks while performing surgery. Should surgeons be required to wear masks while sitting at a desk, working on a laptop? No, of course not. The choice should be up to the individual.