Author Topic: Epic FU money stories  (Read 2350400 times)

former player

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3850 on: July 07, 2021, 04:39:25 PM »
Yes.

Can you go look for a new job with more pay and status?

swashbucklinstache

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3851 on: July 07, 2021, 05:00:20 PM »
I am starting to tire of repeatedly being put in a position where the truth is "no one knows, because my great-grandboss can't answer a simple question in 10 months" to a politically connected internal client of his, who already knows that's the answer but benefits from me being the one to say it out loud. I think I'll let my boss know that tomorrow and re-verbalize that I've bit my tongue for the last time on the matter and he should engage in serious CYA now if he hasn't already.

It's been almost two weeks! Anything new? Maybe you're not updating the forum because you're off on a beach somewhere enjoying your FU money ;-)
Sadly I'm getting 2-3 'requests' a day and didn't want to just spam the thread everyday!

The latest reading between the lines is that I think the great-grandboss is going to declare my boss accountable for these roles to not deal with it. For me that means that since it will then be a direct line up from me, as opposed to now where my "uncle" is accountable, it is more of a "reassignment" than a "we're interested in you taking on this stretch role if you're interested" deal. That should mean it is a little harder to say FU to my immediate boss than the faceless C suit, and doubly so because I'm senior enough in a fluid enough industry that this isn't really an inappropriate/uncommon sort of thing. (Consulting job descriptions are basically "get it done, level appropriately").

I proactively nipped that in the bud with my boss and made it clear that I do not care who is accountable for the role, my questions still stand. In the meantime I continue to take on the pieces that are interesting to me and either ignore, say no to, or do the others as slowly as possible.

The bigger piece is that, unfortunately, my main project work ends 6/30. We're a billable industry where you eat what you kill and I don't yet have anything lined up. So the closer we creep to that day the closer we get to me not really being able to say no, because I'd then be saying "instead of doing this role I would prefer to instead do nothing and still get paid for it." So I'm talking with my boss this week to try to find other project opportunities. If I get defaulted into the role I will still push for $$ up front and will make it very clear that I'm unhappy with being backdoored into things if we get there. It sucks, because this is a role that could be fun (strategy and process creation) and have outsized returns (growth) if a happy and motivated employee does it and "kept the lights on" returns if they're not.

I've also spent the weekend getting my resume in shape. My industry, tech/data, is on fire right now. I could credibly apply to senior individual contributor roles at better companies, senior analytics or product manager roles at peer companies, or associate/director of analytics positions at smaller companies. I got pinged last week by a big tech recruiter for a data science position that would double my total comp. We're talking this week. I'm not competitive really and they hand out interviews like candy but you only need one to say yes...

For context, I'm at 835k which is a 2.9% WR for my current expenses (24k avg. the last 8 years). My FIRE plans are atypical though, as they're either "I have no idea, I'm only 32, let's not lock us in to < 40k a year before life events" or "spend a few years AirBnbing in city centers where housing alone takes you to 4.5% WR, plus some seed money gifted for others' retirement, so maybe 1.3-1.6mm?" I'm saving 115k a year, so it would be ideal if this company would just stay reasonable for the next 1-3 years...
Well. 6/30 came and went and I have new "other" project so status quo was humming along. BUT, unrelated, today they walked the great grandboss out (hourly billable company = immediately removed at that level). Says the plan is for his C suit boss to cover until a hire is made, which is much less than ideal since that person knows nothing about what we do as a non-tech person... Person that's been trying to get me to do their job said interim boss was going to be meeting with us and we should talk about the future of these roles so we can shape them how we want them to be a.k.a. one more avenue to try and shove the work off his plate. Pretty sure I'm going to say if you want me in this role that is an immediate 50% base pay increase, and keep interviewing in the background all the while.

jinga nation

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3852 on: July 07, 2021, 05:21:22 PM »
Because I have FU money, am trying to be more assertive.

I have valuable and unique skills that are widely recognized in the company. At the same time, I have no authority or assistance. I have a ton of autonomy. Problem is a Mark Twain-like thing that happens where my successes become attractive to poachers.

How to deal with this? Like, the one thing that keeps me going is my autonomy with my projects (which are collaborative, made even more difficult because I have no titular authority so I have to be diplomatic as fuck).

New guy just got hired days ago. Boss says, "Take your great ideas, and go work with him." Collaboratively, but with an implication that maybe I'll soon work *for* this guy.

I know it happens to men too, but as a woman in a male-dominated field, am so tired of being put under someone new -- who may or may not last and is often an idiot. (Yes of course I go in with an open mind, not a bad attitude, etc. etc.)

Asked my boss for a team to report to me and funding to grow the project. Response: "Sure! Talk to that new guy [whom I've never even met, not even in my department, but ostensibly similar skills to mine] and come up with a plan." I mean WTF????

Are my decades of experience and well documented years of results (highest in company) really meaningless in comparison to some "new guy" with a fancy title?

Leverage the FU money by finding another position externally.
Betcha in 24-48H when you give notice to current employer, you'll be given fancy title, more $$$, maybe a team, funding, etc. Magically appearing like a genie from an oil lamp.
At that point you decide if you want to stay or move on to the new employer.

Fru-Gal

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3853 on: July 07, 2021, 05:40:40 PM »
Quote
Yes.

LOL. Thanks for the responses. I did want to vent.

Also, sigh, you mean I have to be proactive...? 😂

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3854 on: July 07, 2021, 08:06:16 PM »
Because I have FU money, am trying to be more assertive.

I have valuable and unique skills that are widely recognized in the company. At the same time, I have no authority or assistance. I have a ton of autonomy. Problem is a Mark Twain-like thing that happens where my successes become attractive to poachers.

How to deal with this? Like, the one thing that keeps me going is my autonomy with my projects (which are collaborative, made even more difficult because I have no titular authority so I have to be diplomatic as fuck).

New guy just got hired days ago. Boss says, "Take your great ideas, and go work with him." Collaboratively, but with an implication that maybe I'll soon work *for* this guy.

I know it happens to men too, but as a woman in a male-dominated field, am so tired of being put under someone new -- who may or may not last and is often an idiot. (Yes of course I go in with an open mind, not a bad attitude, etc. etc.)

Asked my boss for a team to report to me and funding to grow the project. Response: "Sure! Talk to that new guy [whom I've never even met, not even in my department, but ostensibly similar skills to mine] and come up with a plan." I mean WTF????

Are my decades of experience and well documented years of results (highest in company) really meaningless in comparison to some "new guy" with a fancy title?

Leverage the FU money by finding another position externally.
Betcha in 24-48H when you give notice to current employer, you'll be given fancy title, more $$$, maybe a team, funding, etc. Magically appearing like a genie from an oil lamp.
At that point you decide if you want to stay or move on to the new employer.
^^^This

LibrarIan

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3855 on: July 10, 2021, 06:23:11 AM »
I started as a developer at a megacorp nine years ago. Great job for the most part. I found this site shortly after being hired and have developed a good amount of FU money. This has led me to cut a lot of the office environment bs out of my day.

For example, when I first got hired and really needed the job, I kept my mouth shut in meetings unless I was spoken to and if the others got off topic and wasted lots of time arguing or chatting, I would just sit there and wait it out. What else could I do? But with FU money, I don't tolerate pointless meetings anymore. Recently I was in a meeting when my coding partner and I could have been working on a big project. Two people started bickering and it became clear that productivity ended and time wasting was going to be the rest of the meeting. I interrupted the project manager and the developer she was arguing with and said, "Bob and I are going to get to work. Have a nice afternoon." And we left, with Bob looking kind of stunned. Afterwards he told me that he's never seen anyone leave a meeting early. One of the people arguing reached out and apologized for their behavior and thanked me for bringing them to their senses.

FU money has also given me the ability to stick up for myself. Just yesterday, a coworker promised during our morning standup meeting that she'd have some important requirements to me ASAP. My boss agreed that this was very important and that those requirements should be prioritized so I could get the work done that day (lol). The day goes by and I busy myself with other things while waiting. Ten minutes before I log off (we're mostly still working from home at this point), the coworker presented me with what I needed and let my boss know. Instead of my boss questioning why it took my coworker the entire day to do this, leaving me no time, my boss instead thanked this coworker and told me to get started on them immediately. I told her I was finishing up something and it was the end of the day. She said this needed to be done immediately (it really doesn't, trust me). I simply said that the requirements should have been to me hours ago and that I'd start on them Monday. I logged off and haven't heard a peep.

FU money has also given the willingness to look for a permanent job working from home. The pandemic forced everyone at my job to work from home starting March 2020 and most are still doing this. Despite the great success the company has had in this work model, they suddenly decided that we "do our best work together" and that all employees will be in the physical office at least three days a week. I loooooove working from home and there isn't anything about my job that requires being at the office. The forced WFH experiment has proven that it works. The only reason they want developers back is micromanagement. I applied for permanent home work. The CIO himself has to approve it. My reasoning was honest - preference. I have already told my boss that if it's not approved I'll just find a job at any one of the abundant remote development jobs that are out there now. We'll see what happens.

It's a great feeling not to be tied down to a job.

BicycleB

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3856 on: July 10, 2021, 08:45:04 AM »
^Epic? Yep, works for me! :)

alcon835

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3857 on: July 10, 2021, 09:39:22 AM »
I started as a developer at a megacorp nine years ago. Great job for the most part. I found this site shortly after being hired and have developed a good amount of FU money. This has led me to cut a lot of the office environment bs out of my day.

For example, when I first got hired and really needed the job, I kept my mouth shut in meetings unless I was spoken to and if the others got off topic and wasted lots of time arguing or chatting, I would just sit there and wait it out. What else could I do? But with FU money, I don't tolerate pointless meetings anymore. Recently I was in a meeting when my coding partner and I could have been working on a big project. Two people started bickering and it became clear that productivity ended and time wasting was going to be the rest of the meeting. I interrupted the project manager and the developer she was arguing with and said, "Bob and I are going to get to work. Have a nice afternoon." And we left, with Bob looking kind of stunned. Afterwards he told me that he's never seen anyone leave a meeting early. One of the people arguing reached out and apologized for their behavior and thanked me for bringing them to their senses.

FU money has also given me the ability to stick up for myself. Just yesterday, a coworker promised during our morning standup meeting that she'd have some important requirements to me ASAP. My boss agreed that this was very important and that those requirements should be prioritized so I could get the work done that day (lol). The day goes by and I busy myself with other things while waiting. Ten minutes before I log off (we're mostly still working from home at this point), the coworker presented me with what I needed and let my boss know. Instead of my boss questioning why it took my coworker the entire day to do this, leaving me no time, my boss instead thanked this coworker and told me to get started on them immediately. I told her I was finishing up something and it was the end of the day. She said this needed to be done immediately (it really doesn't, trust me). I simply said that the requirements should have been to me hours ago and that I'd start on them Monday. I logged off and haven't heard a peep.

FU money has also given the willingness to look for a permanent job working from home. The pandemic forced everyone at my job to work from home starting March 2020 and most are still doing this. Despite the great success the company has had in this work model, they suddenly decided that we "do our best work together" and that all employees will be in the physical office at least three days a week. I loooooove working from home and there isn't anything about my job that requires being at the office. The forced WFH experiment has proven that it works. The only reason they want developers back is micromanagement. I applied for permanent home work. The CIO himself has to approve it. My reasoning was honest - preference. I have already told my boss that if it's not approved I'll just find a job at any one of the abundant remote development jobs that are out there now. We'll see what happens.

It's a great feeling not to be tied down to a job.

Glad to see FU money doing work in 2021!

FIPurpose

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3858 on: July 10, 2021, 02:18:22 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

JLee

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3859 on: July 10, 2021, 02:39:16 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

Much Fishing to Do

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3860 on: July 10, 2021, 03:06:20 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

JLee

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3861 on: July 10, 2021, 03:33:30 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

I suspect a huge part of it is old-school managers who are clinging to the "that's the way we've always done it" mindset (with a healthy dose of "if people are in the office, then there's no chance of them doing personal things on *gasp* company time!!11).

Purely speculation on my part, though.

Aegishjalmur

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3862 on: July 10, 2021, 04:52:46 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

I suspect a huge part of it is old-school managers who are clinging to the "that's the way we've always done it" mindset (with a healthy dose of "if people are in the office, then there's no chance of them doing personal things on *gasp* company time!!11).

Purely speculation on my part, though.



I think part of it is that and they spent big bucks on the office lease, furnishings, equipment, ect. So even though it's cheaper and more efficient to have workers work remotely, they are looking at all this other stuff they acquired and are not using and counting their pennies.  Sunk cost fallacy at its finest.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2021, 01:49:59 PM by Aegishjalmur »

Dicey

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3863 on: July 10, 2021, 06:20:42 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

A family member just told me he was already forced back.  and he works almost completely with people on the other coast.... I just don't get.  (I get that some bosses want to be controlling, or just a pain, but why in the world would the company think its worth paying big city downtown office building rent to do that.  I owned and ran a business for 10 years with 8 employees that didn't need to be in an office so there was no way I ever considered blowing money on rent when I knew they'd view working form home as a perk anyway (and sure made everyone a lot more flexible when for the feast and famine times)

I suspect a huge part of it is old-school managers who are clinging to the "that's the way we've always done it" mindset (with a healthy dose of "if people are in the office, then there's no chance of them doing personal things on *gasp* company time!!11).

Purely speculation on my part, though.
Another possibility is that they're paying for office space they haven't been using. They don't want to let good money go to waste. Nevermind about losing employees...

desk_jockey

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3864 on: July 10, 2021, 09:55:50 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

My suggestions to your roommate:
(a) go in for a day and take photos of the office for a work-at-home zoom background, so that people can choose to believe you're in the office; or
(b) wear a heavy mask in the office and insure any speech on the zoom calls are muffled to the point that nobody can understand, so that eventually you get told to go home to take the calls.


Uturn

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3865 on: July 11, 2021, 08:53:05 AM »
I once worked for a company that did contract work for the government.  We were supporting networks in the middle East from TX. Every other week another engineer and I would swap working from home on Friday so that we could knock out tickets for a day without being interrupted. Then the company instituted a no work from home policy.  Their thinking was if you are remote, you are not as efficient. Never mind that even in the office, we were still remote to those that we supported.

So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.   

Alternatepriorities

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3866 on: July 11, 2021, 11:27:16 AM »
I once worked for a company that did contract work for the government.  We were supporting networks in the middle East from TX. Every other week another engineer and I would swap working from home on Friday so that we could knock out tickets for a day without being interrupted. Then the company instituted a no work from home policy.  Their thinking was if you are remote, you are not as efficient. Never mind that even in the office, we were still remote to those that we supported.

So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.

This was more or less the policy at DW's school office before the pandemic... Alaska had a large number of students learning remotely even before the pandemic. She works with a school's correspondence program. Pre pandemic she could work in any office in the state and count the day as a contract day. Work done from any other location didn't count... Despite all indications being that people working from home were as productive the past year (they served twice as many students without doubling the staff), it looks like they are returning to that policy now... DW just moved up a level and plans to fight to reinstitute a remote work option. We are FI, so this is a bit of and FU money battle.

BuffaloStache

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3867 on: July 13, 2021, 07:40:25 AM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

This is mostly my job. Fortunately my company hasn't forced us back yet. They tell us that they "expect" us to come in "on some sort of regular schedule", but that nothing is forced. So I've taken to coming into the office ~once a month in the morning hours, and then pick up lunch from one of my favorite takeout spots on the way home before working from home in the afternoons. If I'm pressed, I'll explain that this is a "regular schedule", haha. Most of the people I work with day-to-day (that are in the same state) also work fully remotely, so there's that as well.

...
So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.   

This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

rantk81

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3868 on: July 13, 2021, 07:53:56 AM »
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.


Uturn

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3869 on: July 14, 2021, 06:13:57 AM »

...
So then, instead of working from home, we would fly to the DC office and work a day from there.  Since no one knew who we were, there was no interruptions.  The bosses were ok with this because we were still in a company facility.   

This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

I would usually fly in late Thursday and back out Friday evening.  Getting out of DC on Friday evening sucks.  There was nothing nice about it.  But I could go on all day about the dumbassery that went on at that company.

markbike528CBX

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3870 on: July 14, 2021, 07:37:56 AM »
...snip....
But I could go on all day about the dumbassery that went on at that company.
Please do.
I'd suggest the "Overheard at work" thread.
Or tell Scott Adams so he can put it in "Dilbert" if he hasn't done so already.

jinga nation

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3871 on: July 14, 2021, 09:29:22 AM »
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

I would, if I could bill travel time. I used to to do this at a previous employer. Billing started 2H prior to flight. and ended 1H after flight, or when I got to client site. Just had to make sure to log everything. This was in the late 2000s. Wife was working long CPA hours and in grad school; didn't have kids.
I've done 16 hour days to fill in for someone at another regional site for some very important tests that are planned months in advance; fortunately it was very rare. Stopped doing it and then quit that employer when they changed the rules and didn't appreciate the efforts of the engineers to step in at the last minute. They had the gall to say "you should appreciate you have a job" during the last housing meltdown.
Didn't have FU money at the time, but did find a better job for a 30% raise and FU'd the department manager. Some bridges can be burnt.

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3872 on: July 14, 2021, 09:35:43 AM »
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

BuffaloStache is me when I took a job involving loads of travel. rantk81 is me two years later.

I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting. Boss was surprised and disappointed. My carbon footprint says thank you to my FU money.

jinga nation

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3873 on: July 14, 2021, 09:42:08 AM »
This is amazing! Would you fly into DC and home on the same day? Sounds like a quick way to rack up air miles, and get paid to sit on an airplane and read books/watch movies/etc. (one of the best perks of business travel, IMO).

That actually sounds pretty miserable to me.  I find it extremely stressful and draining to go through the air-travel-rigmarole.... twice in one day (in addition to doing actual work) sounds awful.

BuffaloStache is me when I took a job involving loads of travel. rantk81 is me two years later.

I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting. Boss was surprised and disappointed. My carbon footprint says thank you to my FU money.

One morning meeting for a trans-continental flight? I would try and turn this into a minimum 5-day trip aka boondoggle. There so much corporate jargon I could use to justify up the chain.

NorthernIkigai

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3874 on: July 14, 2021, 10:37:54 AM »
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3875 on: July 14, 2021, 10:49:32 AM »
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

bbqbonelesswing

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3876 on: July 14, 2021, 05:50:07 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

This is so accurate. I've been going back to the office a few days per week, but my customers are spread out all over the globe. We have no in-person meetings unless it's a rare big visit. It makes no sense; I can take a call from my apartment just as easily as I could from an office. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that our CEO doubled down and bought a new office building in 2019...

SwordGuy

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3877 on: July 14, 2021, 06:15:50 PM »
Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

I know a lot of people who haven't learned a truthful lesson about Covid yet.   At least 45% of the folks in my county haven't learned yet.

Plina

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3878 on: July 15, 2021, 12:53:52 PM »
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

Here the companies are making big savings on travel and minimized offices. There is no way they can justify going back to precovid level of travel.

Playing with Fire UK

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3879 on: July 15, 2021, 02:54:56 PM »
I just declined to fly from London to south America for a one morning meeting.

I thought the UK time zone was only 1 hour behind Central European Time, not 2 years behind...

Ridiculous right? It's as if we've managed to unlearn everything Covid taught us.

Here the companies are making big savings on travel and minimized offices. There is no way they can justify going back to precovid level of travel.

I'm sure that's true for some companies in the UK. Mine seems to be looking to show clients that we care about them by flying half way around the world to shake their hand and share our germs. I'm not sure it's what our clients want...

pasadenafr

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3880 on: July 15, 2021, 03:10:20 PM »
I've noticed that at least half of the software dev jobs out there now are offering 100% remote work. I really don't know what these companies are thinking that they can force workers back to the office.

My roommate is being forced back in the office, where he spends the day on Zoom calls with other people who aren't at his location anyway.  It's ridiculous.

This is so accurate. I've been going back to the office a few days per week, but my customers are spread out all over the globe. We have no in-person meetings unless it's a rare big visit. It makes no sense; I can take a call from my apartment just as easily as I could from an office. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that our CEO doubled down and bought a new office building in 2019...

This reminds me of my previous job. We used to work shifts, where we had to be in the office at 8am (ok). Then we outsourced that work, and stopped doing shift things, but we were still expected to show up at 8am (🙄). The thing is, most - if not all - of my job involved working with people on the East coast or in Europe (I was based on the West coast) so I had non-stop calls in the early morning. Most of the time starting at 6am or 7am, sometimes (rarely) earlier, and back-to-back until 8 or 9am. So most days, I would show up in the office somewhere between 8:30 and 9:30am. Before that, I was online in the chat app.

My boss kept bitching about it and told me that if I couldn't be there at 8am, then I should come in before my calls and take them from the office. Main reason was that it looked bad for the rest of the team. Never mind that none of us actually needed to be there at 8am, and never mind that when I was showing up after everybody, I had already been working for 3 hours to their (or his) 30 minutes.

I always refused and there was nothing he could do about it except dinging me during my annual review.

Oh and since we were hourly, and our useless "shifts" ended at 5pm, he also got to pay me overtime lol.

mm1970

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3881 on: July 16, 2021, 11:21:53 AM »
Quote
FU money has also given the willingness to look for a permanent job working from home. The pandemic forced everyone at my job to work from home starting March 2020 and most are still doing this. Despite the great success the company has had in this work model, they suddenly decided that we "do our best work together" and that all employees will be in the physical office at least three days a week. I loooooove working from home and there isn't anything about my job that requires being at the office. The forced WFH experiment has proven that it works. The only reason they want developers back is micromanagement. I applied for permanent home work. The CIO himself has to approve it. My reasoning was honest - preference. I have already told my boss that if it's not approved I'll just find a job at any one of the abundant remote development jobs that are out there now. We'll see what happens.

This is funny.  We have been working *mostly* from home since March 2020 also, except for the 15% of people who need to be in person to run equipment.  In the last few months, more people have been going in because they are vaccinated.  Lots of people love working at home - saves on commute, fewer distractions.

The company has been saying since May that we'll be returning to the office in September.  At least weekly, we are told to think about this and plan for this.  Also: they realize that WFH is attractive to many, so it will be allowed, for a maximum of 2 days a week.  In summary:
- plan for returning to the office
- discuss with your manager
- we aren't going to be specifying the details company-wide, you have to work it out for your manager
- it can be 3 days at the office/ 2 days at home, or 4/1, but you MUST be in the office at least 3 days
- but work it out with your manager :P
- (obvious lack of discussion about the 2 employees who live in other states - they were kept on FT after they moved away)
- obvious lack of discussion about how we have employees in Asia that we work with daily
- tiny bit of discussion (brought up by me) that new equipment is going into the building and we are losing office space.
- tiny bit of discussion about our growing COVID cases locally

But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?  I mean, I have late afternoon meeting with Asia 3-4 days a week, and I really don't want to be at the office until 6:30 or 7 pm 3-4 days a week.  If I take them from home, I can eat dinner while working...

Anyway, fun times.

rantk81

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3882 on: July 16, 2021, 12:02:00 PM »
This is funny.  We have been working *mostly* from home since March 2020 also, except for the 15% of people who need to be in person to run equipment.  In the last few months, more people have been going in because they are vaccinated.  Lots of people love working at home - saves on commute, fewer distractions.

The company has been saying since May that we'll be returning to the office in September.  At least weekly, we are told to think about this and plan for this.  Also: they realize that WFH is attractive to many, so it will be allowed, for a maximum of 2 days a week.  In summary:

Hah, I'm hearing the exact same wishy-washy stuff from my employer.

Fun fact: I was on-boarded to this company during the Covid WFH, and have never met another co-worker in person, nor seen the inside of an office.  Even still, I've been performing great, and have received sparkling perf-evaluations from the people I work with and report to.


Dave1442397

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3883 on: July 16, 2021, 12:25:02 PM »
After a lot of futzing around by HR, and with conflicting messages coming from various levels of management, it looks like I'll be full time remote once the dust settles.

The good thing about this company is that once they put a label on you, it tends to be non-removable, so once I get classified as a remote worker, that should be the end of it.

I save a lot of money by staying home. I've put 1,237 miles on my car so far this year. If I were driving to work, it would be 72 miles round trip every day, plus a $5 bridge toll.

bbqbonelesswing

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3884 on: July 16, 2021, 04:04:03 PM »
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.

BicycleB

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3885 on: July 16, 2021, 04:32:11 PM »
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.

Aha! The limit is not what they say. It's what you do.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNwtgUkeKv8

Rural

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3886 on: July 17, 2021, 08:07:53 AM »
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

JLee

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3887 on: July 17, 2021, 10:08:43 AM »
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

Plina

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3888 on: July 17, 2021, 12:14:28 PM »
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

Imma

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3889 on: July 17, 2021, 12:58:16 PM »
But...is anyone REALLY going to be checking?

At our company, no. Pre-covid I had the ability to work from home 2 days a week. Nobody kept track, so many people just worked fully remote.


Similar situation here. We're supposedly going to be back fully in person in fall, just in time for the big Delta surge, no masks and under 30% vaccinated. I do need to be there for one class (I'm one of the few vaccinated, and I'll mask). Trying to decide if I'll go in to work from my office with door shut and window open one other day, or not. No one will know, and I'd get the mission critical project I need to finish up done better and quicker from home.

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

Many orthodox Christians in my country oppose vaccination as a matter of principle (not just Covid, all vaccination). It's God's divine Providence that makes us sick or healthy. If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

In these orthodox communities outbreaks of diseases like measles and polio happen every decade. When someone ends up in hospital, the church community pays the medical bills.

AMandM

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3890 on: July 17, 2021, 04:40:48 PM »

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

edited to fix quote formatting
« Last Edit: July 18, 2021, 01:31:35 PM by AMandM »

Model96

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3891 on: July 17, 2021, 06:38:25 PM »
Proof that education is the most powerful tool on Earth, but still not powerful enough to neutralise the most powerful force on Earth, which is stupidity.

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3892 on: July 17, 2021, 08:17:44 PM »

Oh that is rough. If it were me I probably wouldn't go in either.

My employer has announced that all employees must be vaccinated by a specific date, and if they don't comply (or provide HR with a medical or religious reason otherwise) they will no longer be employed.  I'm surprised they took that step, but frankly I'm glad to see it and I hope more companies do the same.

What kind of religious reason can you have?

IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

I find it highly ironic that the name of the church is Christian Scientists. They certainly don't seem to embrace science.

edit: fixed the formating cause it bugs me
« Last Edit: July 18, 2021, 08:30:02 AM by Sibley »

snowball

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3893 on: July 17, 2021, 11:19:55 PM »
If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

I don't understand why, if getting vaccinated or taking other reasonable precautions is playing God, going to the hospital is fine...Surely, if it's God's will that you get sick, you should also leave your recovery completely up to him, and not be interfering with the outcome he's decided on for you.

I feel it's because these people don't really have the courage of their convictions, when push comes to shove.  It's easy to refuse preventative care; you can choose to believe nothing bad is going to happen.  Not so easy to refuse treatment after you're sick and maybe staring death in the face.

(I know there are those who do refuse to go to the hospital.  I respect that a whole lot more, except when it comes to them refusing to take their kids...that's infuriating.)

kina

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3894 on: July 18, 2021, 04:54:41 AM »


IIRC, Christian Scientists and Jehovah's Witnesses are opposed in principle to all vaccinations. Christian Scientists are opposed to medical interventions in general, and I *think* Jehovah's Witnesses refuse injections (along with transfusions, IVs, tattoos, and piercings) because they constitute mutilation of the body as created by God.

@AMandM , you are misinformed. I am not a JW but have a relative who is. They will accept IV's except for blood transfusions. No problem with injections (this person is fully Covid--as well as other--vaccinated), I don't know about tattoos and piercings but doubt that they are prohibited. Also the 'reasoning' you state is incorrect. The transfusion thing has to do with the "drinking of blood" that is a Hebrew prohibition (related to idol worship). I don't consider it the same thing but my relative and the JW religion does.

GreenSheep

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3895 on: July 18, 2021, 05:19:42 AM »
If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

I don't understand why, if getting vaccinated or taking other reasonable precautions is playing God, going to the hospital is fine...Surely, if it's God's will that you get sick, you should also leave your recovery completely up to him, and not be interfering with the outcome he's decided on for you.

I feel it's because these people don't really have the courage of their convictions, when push comes to shove.  It's easy to refuse preventative care; you can choose to believe nothing bad is going to happen.  Not so easy to refuse treatment after you're sick and maybe staring death in the face.

(I know there are those who do refuse to go to the hospital.  I respect that a whole lot more, except when it comes to them refusing to take their kids...that's infuriating.)

This reminds me of that old joke about a person stranded on a desert island, convinced God is going to save them. A boat stops by and offers to help, and they tell the boat no, they're sure that God is going to save them, so they'll wait for God. Then a helicopter, a few other things... insert creative modes of transportation here. All of them are told no thanks, God is going to come save me. The person ends up dying and going to heaven, where they ask God what happened. And God says, "Well, I tried! I sent a boat, a helicopter, etc.! What more did you want?!"

LennStar

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3896 on: July 18, 2021, 08:30:04 AM »
That's like the joke where one prays to win in the lottery until finally one day God screams "At least play the lottery!"

If God decides we're going to be sick, we can use all available methods to get healthy again, but if we get a vaccination we're basically playing God ourselves. They oppose insurance and seatbelts for the same reason.

I don't understand why, if getting vaccinated or taking other reasonable precautions is playing God, going to the hospital is fine...Surely, if it's God's will that you get sick, you should also leave your recovery completely up to him, and not be interfering with the outcome he's decided on for you.
Not to mention that if God wants you to get sick, he can f*** well do it even if you are vaccinated! It's blashemy to think that a vaccination can oppose God's will!!!
(Also how do you know if the sickness cames from God or Satan?)

RyanAtTanagra

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3897 on: July 18, 2021, 09:11:06 AM »
Can we get back to epic stories?

Dicey

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3898 on: July 18, 2021, 10:08:31 AM »
Can we get back to epic stories?
Sure. Got one?

RyanAtTanagra

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Re: Epic FU money stories
« Reply #3899 on: July 18, 2021, 10:54:44 AM »
Can we get back to epic stories?
Sure. Got one?

Hah, should have expected that.  Ok fiiiiine.  Not super epic, but I was recently reminded of how having a stash gives you so many more options that you otherwise may never even see.

I went to 32-hour (4-day) weeks about 18 months ago at work.  My workload had been diminishing for a while, and I had been making good progress on savings, so I decided to take advantage of it.  So I took a 20% paycut, which was all well and good.  Then 3 months later the pandemic hit, putting a temporary (we'll see) stop to bonuses, which was another 20% cut, which was still ok.  Then mid-pandemic we bought a house and expenses went way up, which was still..... ok-ish.  But we also bought knowing there were renovations and changes we wanted to make, which are expensive, so I'm feeling a shortage of money for the first time in over a decade.

So I debated going back to 40 hours, which they would let me if I asked.  But I've also wanted to try out contract work, which is hard to get going when you have a full time job (and many hobbies).  But now I essentially have an extra day I can devote to it, so I started working on figuring out how the contracting world works.   I got my first potential gig via a recommendation from a friend, had a phone call w/ the owner, and what he's needing is exactly what I do.  Halfway through the conversation he asks me how much it would cost him to just bring me on full time, which caught me off guard and made me stop to think.  I turned him down (we're still going forward with contract work), because a) I'm not looking to commit to 40-hr full time employment, probably ever again, and b) I actually like my job and company (and the industry we're in), and am not looking to leave it quite yet.

It was a good moment for a couple reasons.  1)  I knew I didn't dislike my job, but didn't realize how much I enjoyed it until I was presented with an offer to leave, and didn't want to, and 2) I suddenly had several paths in front of me that I got to choose from, which just doesn't happen when you are (or feel) stuck in a job that takes all your time an energy.  Having a stash, if nothing else, just gives you breathing room to step back and take a look around.