Author Topic: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise  (Read 18478 times)

guitar_stitch

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Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« on: February 24, 2015, 05:47:38 PM »
Not that we didn't already know about this, but it's nice to see it somewhere else.

http://lifehacker.com/ditching-your-commute-is-the-happiness-equivalent-of-a-1679698849

HawkeyeNFO

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2015, 09:26:52 AM »
OK, I call bullshit.  That's $800 a week.  Happiness equivalent, LOL.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2015, 10:01:54 AM »
I've shortened my commute and I would say my happiness has gone up immensely.  However, if I got rid of it entirely I wouldn't be happy.  Last year during a period where I couldn't drive I worked from home 3 days a week and hated it.

Vilgan

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2015, 12:29:01 PM »
A short, non driving commute was one of my main priorities when I moved. We paid more for our house and I mentally reduced the salary of any potential opportunity with a relevant commute by 30k which resulted in all jobs w/ a commute getting ignored. When one employer moved their HQ to change my commute from trivial to a pain, I promptly moved on to a different employer.

As a result, I'm SIGNIFICANTLY happier and healthier than I was back when I had to drive to work. I have a hard time imagining a realistic situation where I would drive 30+ minutes to work again.

Vilgan

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2015, 12:30:58 PM »
I've shortened my commute and I would say my happiness has gone up immensely.  However, if I got rid of it entirely I wouldn't be happy.  Last year during a period where I couldn't drive I worked from home 3 days a week and hated it.

Is that the commute? Or the lack of social contact with your coworkers?

Working from home has its own cons, but I have a hard time imagining the commute being one of them

Dimitri

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2015, 10:15:54 PM »
I would happily double my commute for an extra $40,000.  Currently it is 17 miles (25-30 minutes) each way.  Personally I find nothing unenjoyable about my commute at all.  My car is comfortable, reliable, and pleasant to drive. 

Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

tomq04

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2015, 11:15:25 PM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

You are on the MMM and "pitying" the poor people riding their bikes?!! You must be trollin'

I don't get to ride my bike more than a couple days a week, but when I do ride my bike, I pity the fools in their cars.

surfhb

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2015, 02:41:59 AM »
I'm with Dimitri on this

Because of my chosen career and certain lifestyle choices, I spend about 2 hours a day on my commute.    It's become my time of reflection, good music and books on tapes have improved my knowledge of a great many subjects.   

Living near my work ( Hollywood / Burbank) would be a soul sucking, God Awful experience

nanu

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2015, 06:01:01 AM »
^^
You are aware the if you live near work and your "commute" is lets say five minutes, you can use
the exact same time you were previously on the road for the same things, you just don't have to?

If you lived close you could walk to work, and then sit on a bench outside your office for the two hours
you would waste driving, listening to the same books on tape.
It would cost you less, be better for the environment, and be better for you on days that you are in a hurry get home early.
How exactly is having a commute better (all else being equal) is beyond me.

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2015, 08:08:21 AM »
I've shortened my commute and I would say my happiness has gone up immensely.  However, if I got rid of it entirely I wouldn't be happy.  Last year during a period where I couldn't drive I worked from home 3 days a week and hated it.

Is that the commute? Or the lack of social contact with your coworkers?

Working from home has its own cons, but I have a hard time imagining the commute being one of them

It was lack of social contact.
So getting rid of a commute entirely has negatives in other areas.

For me, I'd rather spend SOME time commuting so that I am working in an office with people.

Even if I was next door to work, there would be some commute, as I'd have to leave the house and walk there.  I'm in favor of a short commute.  Right now, I drive about 10 minutes in the morning and 15 in the afternoon.  It is quite excellent.

shotgunwilly

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2015, 08:42:58 AM »
I think the type of commute is relative.  I worked a job 30 miles away that I loved driving to in the morning and evenings.  Beautiful scenery, out in the country, not a ton of traffic.  I HATE driving the 5 miles to work i do now in terrible traffic. (And there's no way in hell i would bike around these people.)

surfhb

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2015, 11:13:20 AM »
^^
You are aware the if you live near work and your "commute" is lets say five minutes, you can use
the exact same time you were previously on the road for the same things, you just don't have to?

If you lived close you could walk to work, and then sit on a bench outside your office for the two hours
you would waste driving, listening to the same books on tape.
It would cost you less, be better for the environment, and be better for you on days that you are in a hurry get home early.
How exactly is having a commute better (all else being equal) is beyond me.

I surf mornings before heading to my job......its a required activity.  That's what I meant by lifestyle choice.    Surfing basically costs me $400 a month extra by my calculation.     I carpool and maintain %40 savings rate this way.    It is what it is :)
« Last Edit: February 27, 2015, 11:16:56 AM by surfhb »

NoraLenderbee

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2015, 11:18:17 AM »
I'm much happier since I ditched my horrible commute (minimum 3 hours per day) for a 9-mile (one way) commute, but the horrible commute was attached to a horrible job and a horrible boss. Everything is better at my current job, including the salary. But $40K is a lot of money.

nanu

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2015, 11:21:22 AM »
I surf mornings before heading to my job......its a required activity.  That's what I meant by lifestyle choice.    Surfing basically costs me $400 a month extra by my calculation.     I carpool and maintain %40 savings rate this way.    It is what it is :)
So it's not the commute that makes you happy - what makes you happy is living at a particular place, and that location forces you to commute.
If you could teleport from your house to work, would you still prefer commuting?

surfhb

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2015, 11:27:40 AM »
I surf mornings before heading to my job......its a required activity.  That's what I meant by lifestyle choice.    Surfing basically costs me $400 a month extra by my calculation.     I carpool and maintain %40 savings rate this way.    It is what it is :)
So it's not the commute that makes you happy - what makes you happy is living at a particular place, and that location forces you to commute.
If you could teleport from your house to work, would you still prefer commuting?

Oh yes....I would love not having to drive into LA everyday!     

aspiringnomad

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2015, 12:48:28 PM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

I think this is the least mustachian thing I've read on these forums. Anyway, it takes me half the time to bike into work than it would to drive, so I pity the clown car crowd.

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2015, 01:50:46 PM »
If you could teleport from your house to work, would you still prefer commuting?

Wouldn't you still be commuting? Just by a teleportation machine instead of a car? 
Walking, biking, driving, flying, it's all commuting. 

nanu

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2015, 03:48:48 PM »
Wouldn't you still be commuting? Just by a teleportation machine instead of a car? 
Walking, biking, driving, flying, it's all commuting.
I suppose you could say it's still commuting, though that's just semantics.
Obviously, I was referring to "commuting by car", or whatever means of transportation he currently uses (I don't remember him saying)

GetItRight

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2015, 05:58:46 PM »
I find the commute relaxing. I enjoy driving so my commute never bothered me. I find driving to be a nice mental transition to be ready for work and to wind down afterward. Driving is far less stressful than my previous walk, get two trains, walk a bunch more, through cold and rain and snow often times, and of course the antics on the trains ranging from loud juvenile antics to violent episodes. So much more relaxing to not have to deal with that city stuff.

Maybe it's different for me as I've usually had the flexibility to shift my schedule around toavoid the peak of rush hour. Though these days that usually means coming in early and leaving late, but I'm paid by the hour so I may as well if the work is there. 50-60 hour weeks get old at times but since I've learned of FIRE and been on that track it doesn't bother me much as it's only temporary. All other factors being equal, I would not trade lower disposable income (after housing/commute) with a shorter commute to a longer time to retire and consider myself $40k better off every year.

One Noisy Cat

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2015, 07:50:00 PM »
     I once went from a 25 mile commute to a 3 block bike ride commute. I wouldn't say it was a $40,000 raise but in the five digits. Real nice to go from filling gas tank every six days to "how do I work this pump thingy" though.

Hedge_87

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2015, 08:54:22 AM »
     I once went from a 25 mile commute to a 3 block bike ride commute. I wouldn't say it was a $40,000 raise but in the five digits. Real nice to go from filling gas tank every six days to "how do I work this pump thingy" though.
that's what both DW and I did this year. I used to have a 25 mile round trip commute and DW had a 30 mile round trip In the other direction. this cost us ~$400 a month in gas alone. Also wearing out our vehicles and costing money in repairs. Then there was the ever present risk of hitting a deer and totaling one of our vehicles (last year alone I pulled up on 8 different deer Vs car accidents on my morning commute and had numerous close calls myself.)

She has 2 blocks to walk to the school she teaches at. We actually live closer to the school than the teacher parking lot is to the school. She has used her new found free time to open up a part time art studio thing. She teaches art classes and then makes and sells some of her creations. We are only a few months into this venture but it seems like it is turning into a pretty lucrative and enjoyable side hustle. (I think we made $800 last month with maybe 10 hrs of "work").

I get to walk her to school every morning And then take off on my bike and ride the 7 blocks to work (or take a quick 30 minute bicycle adventure through town). Also due to the nature of my job as an electrical lineman I often get called into work in the nastiest weather imaginable. It is nice not having to risk driving my own personal vehicle into work in crappy conditions.

thebrowze

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2015, 06:25:25 PM »
Due to the specialized nature of my work, if I were to ditch my commute and find something closer to home it would cost me probably in the neighborhood of $100k to $125k per year in total compensation, at least initially.  My commute costs me about $450/month and 2 and a half hours a day, so from a purely monetary perspective it's absolutely worth it for now.

The calculus may change when DW and I start having kids, but for now I will suck it up and keep growing the 'stache as fast as I can.

GetItRight

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2015, 07:01:36 PM »
I used to have a 25 mile round trip commute and DW had a 30 mile round trip In the other direction. this cost us ~$400 a month in gas alone.

I don't mean to pick on you in particular but a few people in this thread are throwing out some pretty hefty numbers for monthly gas costs. My winter vehicle gets ~15 MPG and with a similar commute I spend $130-ish, less these days with lower fuel prices (don't worry, costs less than a Prius per mile including cost of vehicle and my summer vehicle is nearly 50 MPG). Doing the math on your numbers at $3/gallon your average MPG between two vehicles would be 8.25 and at $4/gal 11 MPG, but worse if those numbers are at current gas prices. I'm a car guy and all for horsepower and big displacement engines but something doesn't add up. There aren't many vehicles that get below 10 MPG in normal driving.

starterstache

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2015, 07:20:38 PM »
I used to have a 25 mile round trip commute and DW had a 30 mile round trip In the other direction. this cost us ~$400 a month in gas alone.

I don't mean to pick on you in particular but a few people in this thread are throwing out some pretty hefty numbers for monthly gas costs. My winter vehicle gets ~15 MPG and with a similar commute I spend $130-ish, less these days with lower fuel prices (don't worry, costs less than a Prius per mile including cost of vehicle and my summer vehicle is nearly 50 MPG). Doing the math on your numbers at $3/gallon your average MPG between two vehicles would be 8.25 and at $4/gal 11 MPG, but worse if those numbers are at current gas prices. I'm a car guy and all for horsepower and big displacement engines but something doesn't add up. There aren't many vehicles that get below 10 MPG in normal driving.

I'm guessing they probably drive a lot on weekends too for various entertainment.  Therefore, the $400/month figure is probably commute plus recreation, which I can easily see between two cars.

MoneyCat

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2015, 07:25:56 PM »
When I went from a 45 minute each way commute to a 15 minute each way commute, my happiness increased immensely, especially since I was also no longer paying tolls for the right to do something unpleasant.  I can see it feeling like a $40,000 raise to not have to commute at all.

starterstache

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2015, 07:26:50 PM »
I live around 35 miles from my workplace, but I'm fortunate that I can keep commuting costs low in a number of different ways:

1.)  Ability to work from home two days per week
2.)  Daily vanpool from home city to office - only costs ~$100/month

This has allowed our family to only have one car; which certainly helps keep the overall maintenance, insurance, and gas costs relatively low.

Obviously this requires some sacrifices, but moving within biking distance to work would mean a house that costs 3x what I paid for my current residence.  I don't think that would make financial sense, even if it 'felt' like I received a 40k a year raise :)

GetItRight

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2015, 07:45:01 PM »
I'm guessing they probably drive a lot on weekends too for various entertainment.  Therefore, the $400/month figure is probably commute plus recreation, which I can easily see between two cars.

That's what I figure, but doing 2x-4x the miles for recreation as for work and claiming those dollars as savings from working closer to home is a bit of false advertising. I genuinely don't understand the big deal on this forum about commute costs, as even with a relatively low MPG vehicle my total commute costs are fairly trivial in the scheme of things. Then again I've never bought a new car and never spent more than a few thousand on a vehicle. I crunch numbers on cost per mile and TCO, ROI of MPG improvements, etc.

I just don't get it, but for me living relatively frugally and paying a few thousand a month to student loans I think my perception of what is a lot of money is different than most people. Most friends and coworkers seem to think $100 is a lot of money (i.e. friend saying how hard it is to pay even an extra $100/mo on his mortgage), to me it's pocket change because it's so small in the scheme of things. Once my student loans are paid off I see the stash growing insanely fast as I see about 90% of those student loan payments going to investments for FIRE and 10% going to living a little with more vacations and other luxuries. I feel out of touch with most people I know in that regard.

Hedge_87

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2015, 08:20:27 PM »
I used to have a 25 mile round trip commute and DW had a 30 mile round trip In the other direction. this cost us ~$400 a month in gas alone.

I don't mean to pick on you in particular but a few people in this thread are throwing out some pretty hefty numbers for monthly gas costs. My winter vehicle gets ~15 MPG and with a similar commute I spend $130-ish, less these days with lower fuel prices (don't worry, costs less than a Prius per mile including cost of vehicle and my summer vehicle is nearly 50 MPG). Doing the math on your numbers at $3/gallon your average MPG between two vehicles would be 8.25 and at $4/gal 11 MPG, but worse if those numbers are at current gas prices. I'm a car guy and all for horsepower and big displacement engines but something doesn't add up. There aren't many vehicles that get below 10 MPG in normal driving.
Ok let me rephrase, our gas bill was not strictly for commuting to work. There were several times we would have extra driving during the evening's or on weekends to maintain something of a social life.
My pickup is a 2001 dodge ram 1500 I know throw some face punches my way but this thing is going to stay until it completely dies and is so rusty I can't bolt new parts onto it. It seemed to make around 12 mpg. DW car is a 2001 buick century which gets 26-28 mpg. I am one of those people who never let the gas gauge go below 1/2 full. it seemed like I used to have to fill up once a week which ran ~$60 a pop. the buick has a broken fuel gauge so we just run it 300 miles per fill up (around $30 each). This always seemed to happen 3-4 times a month. so by my math and I have receipts to back this up
pickup $60x4=$240
car $30x4=$120
total $360 then I would normally round up this budget item to account for some long distance traveling. This budget item is now ~$100 a month because we do still use the vehicles. sorry for the confusion.

darkadams00

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2015, 10:17:39 PM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

I bike commute in all four seasons (and in NC this means 7" of snow this week and near 70 degrees next week!!). I look at this picture in reverse--anybody can jump in a car, turn a key, push pedals, and turn a wheel to move from point A to point B safely. But drivers probably zipped too fast by the ice sculpture someone carved in their yard to even notice, admire, and take a picture to share with friends. They missed all the wildlife in the neighborhoods, on the greenways, and near the streams and creeks. They missed the crisp air of a frosty morning permeating a calm, quiet downtown lit by streetlights glowing with amber halos. They missed a chance to immerse themselves in their environment. They missed a chance to awaken fully in the morning and unwind gracefully in the evening.

Instead, they chose to sit in parking lots erroneously called "interstate highways." They chose to pass neighborhoods, businesses, and other drivers without a second glance. They chose to wait two light changes at a busy intersection instead of meandering through a quiet nearby neighborhood street. They chose to interact with their surroundings using only their sense of sight--and used that sense distractedly. They chose to get frustrated at drivers who stopped suddenly, didn't start quickly enough, pulled out too late, didn't turn in soon enough, didn't use their turn signal, drove too slowly, and passed too closely.

Missing out? Not me. Too poor? Not me. Hating my commute? Not me. I can afford to buy a bigger house, a more expensive car, and I do own a closet of awesome clothes. But I sure do love that 40-minute ride. Pity me? Pffft. Whatever.

Dimitri

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2015, 11:15:47 PM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

I bike commute in all four seasons (and in NC this means 7" of snow this week and near 70 degrees next week!!). I look at this picture in reverse--anybody can jump in a car, turn a key, push pedals, and turn a wheel to move from point A to point B safely. But drivers probably zipped too fast by the ice sculpture someone carved in their yard to even notice, admire, and take a picture to share with friends. They missed all the wildlife in the neighborhoods, on the greenways, and near the streams and creeks. They missed the crisp air of a frosty morning permeating a calm, quiet downtown lit by streetlights glowing with amber halos. They missed a chance to immerse themselves in their environment. They missed a chance to awaken fully in the morning and unwind gracefully in the evening.

Instead, they chose to sit in parking lots erroneously called "interstate highways." They chose to pass neighborhoods, businesses, and other drivers without a second glance. They chose to wait two light changes at a busy intersection instead of meandering through a quiet nearby neighborhood street. They chose to interact with their surroundings using only their sense of sight--and used that sense distractedly. They chose to get frustrated at drivers who stopped suddenly, didn't start quickly enough, pulled out too late, didn't turn in soon enough, didn't use their turn signal, drove too slowly, and passed too closely.

Missing out? Not me. Too poor? Not me. Hating my commute? Not me. I can afford to buy a bigger house, a more expensive car, and I do own a closet of awesome clothes. But I sure do love that 40-minute ride. Pity me? Pffft. Whatever.

Hey, if you like bicycling to work in 7" of snow then more power to you.  Doesn't sound like fun to me.  When I get to work I'm neither hot nor cold.  I don't freeze in the winter and I'm not sweating in the summer.  And I couldn't care less about missing out on taking pictures of someone's yard.  My friends don't have the slightest bit of interest about what I see on my commute. 

I drive on an interstate highway but certainly don't sit in traffic.  As Kai Ryssdal says, "Let's do the numbers."  17 miles with my longest commute time of 30 minutes is 34 miles per hour.  A good bit of that is local driving.  I don't live in LA.  :)  And I don't sit through two changes of the light.  If I had to wager, I suspect I get my commute over little bit quicker than you in terms of MPH (and absolutely in terms of time).

Driving a car is relaxing, enjoyable, and frankly fun.  It would have been even more fun if I gave into my inner Id last year and bought a Dodge Challenger SRT8-Core but I resisted and bought a Toyota Camry.  Anyway, I stopped riding a bicycle when I grew up and went off to college with my mother's 1972 BMW Bavaria (1 Corinthians 13:11 http://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/13-11.htm).  But to each his own.  Enjoy your bike ride.  I'll keep driving to work.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2015, 07:10:26 AM by Dimitri »

Tabaxus

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2015, 07:41:45 AM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

I bike commute in all four seasons (and in NC this means 7" of snow this week and near 70 degrees next week!!). I look at this picture in reverse--anybody can jump in a car, turn a key, push pedals, and turn a wheel to move from point A to point B safely. But drivers probably zipped too fast by the ice sculpture someone carved in their yard to even notice, admire, and take a picture to share with friends. They missed all the wildlife in the neighborhoods, on the greenways, and near the streams and creeks. They missed the crisp air of a frosty morning permeating a calm, quiet downtown lit by streetlights glowing with amber halos. They missed a chance to immerse themselves in their environment. They missed a chance to awaken fully in the morning and unwind gracefully in the evening.

Instead, they chose to sit in parking lots erroneously called "interstate highways." They chose to pass neighborhoods, businesses, and other drivers without a second glance. They chose to wait two light changes at a busy intersection instead of meandering through a quiet nearby neighborhood street. They chose to interact with their surroundings using only their sense of sight--and used that sense distractedly. They chose to get frustrated at drivers who stopped suddenly, didn't start quickly enough, pulled out too late, didn't turn in soon enough, didn't use their turn signal, drove too slowly, and passed too closely.

Missing out? Not me. Too poor? Not me. Hating my commute? Not me. I can afford to buy a bigger house, a more expensive car, and I do own a closet of awesome clothes. But I sure do love that 40-minute ride. Pity me? Pffft. Whatever.

Hey, if you like bicycling to work in 7" of snow then more power to you.  Doesn't sound like fun to me.  When I get to work I'm neither hot nor cold.  I don't freeze in the winter and I'm not sweating in the summer.  And I couldn't care less about missing out on taking pictures of someone's yard.  My friends don't have the slightest bit of interest about what I see on my commute. 

I drive on an interstate highway but certainly don't sit in traffic.  As Kai Ryssdal says, "Let's do the numbers."  17 miles with my longest commute time of 30 minutes is 34 miles per hour.  A good bit of that is local driving.  I don't live in LA.  :)  And I don't sit through two changes of the light.  If I had to wager, I suspect I get my commute over little bit quicker than you in terms of MPH (and absolutely in terms of time).

Driving a car is relaxing, enjoyable, and frankly fun.  It would have been even more fun if I gave into my inner Id last year and bought a Dodge Challenger SRT8-Core but I resisted and bought a Toyota Camry.  Anyway, I stopped riding a bicycle when I grew up and went off to college with my mother's 1972 BMW Bavaria (1 Corinthians 13:11 http://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/13-11.htm).  But to each his own.  Enjoy your bike ride.  I'll keep driving to work.

Bolded is ridiculous, unnecessarily insulting, and seems completely out of place on this forum.

I will never be a bike commuter--I can't, medical issues (get vertigo on two-wheeled things)--but certainly wish that I could.  Dreading the day when I have to move somewhere that isn't within my 1-2 mile walking distance to work.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2015, 07:43:29 AM by Tabaxus »

darkadams00

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #31 on: March 02, 2015, 11:01:47 AM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

I bike commute in all four seasons (and in NC this means 7" of snow this week and near 70 degrees next week!!). I look at this picture in reverse--anybody can jump in a car, turn a key, push pedals, and turn a wheel to move from point A to point B safely. But drivers probably zipped too fast by the ice sculpture someone carved in their yard to even notice, admire, and take a picture to share with friends. They missed all the wildlife in the neighborhoods, on the greenways, and near the streams and creeks. They missed the crisp air of a frosty morning permeating a calm, quiet downtown lit by streetlights glowing with amber halos. They missed a chance to immerse themselves in their environment. They missed a chance to awaken fully in the morning and unwind gracefully in the evening.

Instead, they chose to sit in parking lots erroneously called "interstate highways." They chose to pass neighborhoods, businesses, and other drivers without a second glance. They chose to wait two light changes at a busy intersection instead of meandering through a quiet nearby neighborhood street. They chose to interact with their surroundings using only their sense of sight--and used that sense distractedly. They chose to get frustrated at drivers who stopped suddenly, didn't start quickly enough, pulled out too late, didn't turn in soon enough, didn't use their turn signal, drove too slowly, and passed too closely.

Missing out? Not me. Too poor? Not me. Hating my commute? Not me. I can afford to buy a bigger house, a more expensive car, and I do own a closet of awesome clothes. But I sure do love that 40-minute ride. Pity me? Pffft. Whatever.

Hey, if you like bicycling to work in 7" of snow then more power to you.  Doesn't sound like fun to me.  When I get to work I'm neither hot nor cold.  I don't freeze in the winter and I'm not sweating in the summer.  And I couldn't care less about missing out on taking pictures of someone's yard.  My friends don't have the slightest bit of interest about what I see on my commute. 

I drive on an interstate highway but certainly don't sit in traffic.  As Kai Ryssdal says, "Let's do the numbers."  17 miles with my longest commute time of 30 minutes is 34 miles per hour.  A good bit of that is local driving.  I don't live in LA.  :)  And I don't sit through two changes of the light.  If I had to wager, I suspect I get my commute over little bit quicker than you in terms of MPH (and absolutely in terms of time).

Driving a car is relaxing, enjoyable, and frankly fun.  It would have been even more fun if I gave into my inner Id last year and bought a Dodge Challenger SRT8-Core but I resisted and bought a Toyota Camry.  Anyway, I stopped riding a bicycle when I grew up and went off to college with my mother's 1972 BMW Bavaria (1 Corinthians 13:11 http://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/13-11.htm).  But to each his own.  Enjoy your bike ride.  I'll keep driving to work.

Just for accuracy, 7" of snow fell, but I rode in while it was beginning to snow and a couple days later as soon as the snow melted down appreciably to a couple inches. With that said, the only reason I responded in such a way was to underscore your use of one-sided logic, stereotypes, and general disdain for activities in which you choose not to engage. Some people ride bikes, exercise at the gym, run, Crossfit, take karate, rock climb, hike, sail, canoe, play basetball/tennis/golf, etc. They have various reasons to do so. To not do one of those activities is to choose to miss out on various things that make that activity interesting to folks who regularly participate. The same applies to people like myself who drive minimally or not at all. If my drive included scenic rides in the mountains or winding country roads, I might be more interested. They wouldn't, so I'm not. If cars excited me like they did when I was younger, I might be more interested (although I can now pay cash for the Porsche I admired when I was a teen but choose to invest the funds instead). I respect a driver's choice, but it is a choice.

Regarding commute time, you've proven my point regarding choices. As soon as the temps hit 45 degrees I bike further on purpose. My commutes stretch an additional 3-6 miles per day and more than 15 extra miles on most Fridays. Why? I am having a great time. I'm not trying to minimize my commute. I'm optimizing my life in a way that works for me. When I always drove, I rarely took the longest way to get somewhere. And I don't know many people who do when they're driving. But as soon as people begin to make a habit of outdoor exercise--walking, running, biking, hiking particularly--the longer route often becomes appealing.

On a totally unrelated note, as a Christian, I think condescension accompanied by Bible verses is bad form at best and probably a turn off for anyone who might even consider a discussion on the matter. If you think I'm reading too much into your comments, see the comment that followed your latest post as well as the rest of the responses to your original post.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #32 on: March 02, 2015, 11:56:00 AM »
That might be the "best" use of a bible quote I've ever seen. 


dunhamjr

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #33 on: March 02, 2015, 12:29:43 PM »
seems a little too black and white for me.

i would def be happier with a shorter commute.
but i would not be as happy if the way that the commute was cut short was because i was turned full time WFH.

i also think putting the number at $40k/yr is ridiculous.

lots of people INCREASE their commutes for way less than $40k/yr bumps.

Unique User

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #34 on: March 20, 2015, 01:11:34 PM »
I'm talking with a company about a role that would increase my base by $40k (which is a pretty big jump for me, more than 40%) and is a promotion, but would involve a 30-45 min commute each way.  Possibility of working from home 2-3 days a week.  We're renters so we could also move closer, but the kiddo would have to change school districts. I'm really torn since it could move our FI timeline up at least a year, probably more.  What would you do? 
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 01:18:31 PM by Unique User »

Gone Fishing

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #35 on: March 20, 2015, 01:49:52 PM »
A little different way to look at it, but there is no way I'd take a $40k pay cut to get rid of my 70 mile round trip commute, all else being equal.  I work around 230 days a year so that 1 hour commute would be worth around $174 per day. Pretty good return if you ask me.

The more important point is that after $50-70k/yr or so, extra money doesn't really make you any happier, it just keeps you around.

Bob W

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #36 on: March 20, 2015, 01:56:35 PM »
If only that were true!   My commute is on a noncrowded 4 lane for about 10-12 miles one way.   When I'm not relaxing while driving I am usually on the phone with a client.   My work day begins when I set foot in the vehicle.   

I actually like my commute.   I do work from home some now but find it unrewarding and a soul drain.   My coworkers are too cool I guess?    I'm still searching for the balance.   I suppose ideally a 10-15 walk to work would be best for me.   That would give me time to transition.  So that will be a future thought. 

MrsCoolCat

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #37 on: March 21, 2015, 01:32:45 PM »
Yeah, I have to drive and I HATE IT. I only drive 13 miles each way yet in South Florida it takes anywhere from 40-50 minutes of hell. And in the evening coming home, forget it. Sometimes it's 55 minutes that I can never get back and that's one way. I can't not drive and it's definitely not safe to ride bikes or otherwise. Seriously, FL is the most dangerous state for bikers! I would take a pay cut if I could work closer but I live in suburbia and the only close jobs are at the mall, in restaurant and possible at a doctor's office. That's why I'm trying to be FI and not be forced to drive. Also, working from home is not an option at the moment. I'd love to though.

aschmidt2930

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #38 on: March 21, 2015, 02:03:31 PM »
I'm talking with a company about a role that would increase my base by $40k (which is a pretty big jump for me, more than 40%) and is a promotion, but would involve a 30-45 min commute each way.  Possibility of working from home 2-3 days a week.  We're renters so we could also move closer, but the kiddo would have to change school districts. I'm really torn since it could move our FI timeline up at least a year, probably more.  What would you do?

I'm very anti-commute, but I would probably take that commute for a 40k increase in my base.  Would be a tough decision though.

choppingwood

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #39 on: March 21, 2015, 02:08:32 PM »
At a workshop I went to in San Francisco, I was talking about living in a small city, where I could walk to work downtown, through a safe, tree-lined beautiful neighbourhood, and be there in about twenty minutes. And that people who lived in the suburbs of that city took about 25 minutes to get to work, driving on four-lane streets rather than multiple-lane highways. Grown men in the group, who lived in large cities and had not been able to connect work and home distances, began to tear up.

KiwiMust

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #40 on: March 23, 2015, 01:37:59 AM »
Every time I (walk home to pick up my car, then) drive anywhere after work I am grateful that live a 15 minute walk from work, I actually would prefer it was a half hour walk for health benefits, even then my commute would be faster than 80% of my colleagues who drive. Traffic just makes me angry, certainly worth a big wad of cash to me to be able to avoid it 355 days a year. An old colleague of mine and I discussed it and realized while both of us left work 'needing' a glass of wine, I relaxed enough during my walk to not feel the need once I got home, whereas she still 'needed' it after her commute, so I save on gas, (arguably) gym membership, (probably) psychiatrist bills and wine :-)

Stachetastic

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #41 on: March 23, 2015, 07:04:30 AM »
I often feel like I'm the only one on these forums that uses a car for work. I'm a social worker, and every job I've had has involved using my car for home visits, off site meetings, court hearings, etc. While I have lived within a couple miles of my office, not taking my car has never been an option. Unless you count the short time I rode a scooter, but even then I had to plan ahead and hope I would not have to transport any clients those days. I'm jealous of those who can walk or ride a bike to the office, but then I just remind myself that with my old, paid-for, 35mpg daily driver, I'm making the most of my mileage reimbursement. 

FiguringItOut

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #42 on: March 23, 2015, 09:31:29 PM »
In 2008-2010 I had a job that was 17 miles and 20 minutes from my house.  It was heaven.  I had time to see my kids off to school in the morning.  I had time to relax and do family things in the evening.  I would do all grocery/household shopping one weekday evening so that I didn't have to spend time on the weekend doing it.

Then my job moved far far away.  They offered pretty hefty compensation packages to those employees that agreed to stay on for 2 years after the move.  The package was good enough that I signed the agreement and started commuting by car around 1.5 to 2 hours each way.  I can tell you that after I did it for about a months I realized that I was not a sustainable situation.  The good thing though is that the company got bought out and we all got laid off and got to keep our full compensation package that was supposed to last two years. 

The bad thing is that I was without a job for year after that.  When I finally got a new job, I was just so happy to have a job that 1hr and 45min each way commute by public transportation was the least of my problems.  Been doing it for 3.5 years now.  It's getting old now. 

This summer I will be moving and hopefully reducing my commute to between 25 and 40 min by public transportation and also by about $200 per month. 

I can't wait!



Ricky

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #43 on: March 24, 2015, 07:05:51 AM »
Admittedly, if I was so poor that I had to walk, ride a bike, or take the bus then I probably would hate my commute.  Those are the people who I pity when I see them on their way to work in the morning.

I bike commute in all four seasons (and in NC this means 7" of snow this week and near 70 degrees next week!!). I look at this picture in reverse--anybody can jump in a car, turn a key, push pedals, and turn a wheel to move from point A to point B safely. But drivers probably zipped too fast by the ice sculpture someone carved in their yard to even notice, admire, and take a picture to share with friends. They missed all the wildlife in the neighborhoods, on the greenways, and near the streams and creeks. They missed the crisp air of a frosty morning permeating a calm, quiet downtown lit by streetlights glowing with amber halos. They missed a chance to immerse themselves in their environment. They missed a chance to awaken fully in the morning and unwind gracefully in the evening.

Instead, they chose to sit in parking lots erroneously called "interstate highways." They chose to pass neighborhoods, businesses, and other drivers without a second glance. They chose to wait two light changes at a busy intersection instead of meandering through a quiet nearby neighborhood street. They chose to interact with their surroundings using only their sense of sight--and used that sense distractedly. They chose to get frustrated at drivers who stopped suddenly, didn't start quickly enough, pulled out too late, didn't turn in soon enough, didn't use their turn signal, drove too slowly, and passed too closely.

Missing out? Not me. Too poor? Not me. Hating my commute? Not me. I can afford to buy a bigger house, a more expensive car, and I do own a closet of awesome clothes. But I sure do love that 40-minute ride. Pity me? Pffft. Whatever.

Hey, if you like bicycling to work in 7" of snow then more power to you.  Doesn't sound like fun to me.  When I get to work I'm neither hot nor cold.  I don't freeze in the winter and I'm not sweating in the summer.  And I couldn't care less about missing out on taking pictures of someone's yard.  My friends don't have the slightest bit of interest about what I see on my commute. 

I drive on an interstate highway but certainly don't sit in traffic.  As Kai Ryssdal says, "Let's do the numbers."  17 miles with my longest commute time of 30 minutes is 34 miles per hour.  A good bit of that is local driving.  I don't live in LA.  :)  And I don't sit through two changes of the light.  If I had to wager, I suspect I get my commute over little bit quicker than you in terms of MPH (and absolutely in terms of time).

Driving a car is relaxing, enjoyable, and frankly fun.  It would have been even more fun if I gave into my inner Id last year and bought a Dodge Challenger SRT8-Core but I resisted and bought a Toyota Camry.  Anyway, I stopped riding a bicycle when I grew up and went off to college with my mother's 1972 BMW Bavaria (1 Corinthians 13:11 http://biblehub.com/1_corinthians/13-11.htm).  But to each his own.  Enjoy your bike ride.  I'll keep driving to work.

I remember when I used to throw in sarcastic pretentious comments on Internet forums, but then I grew up and went to college.

The fact that you consider driving a Challenger @ 34mph "more fun" than a Camry at the same speed really says it all. This forum isn't for you, which you clearly already realize since you haven't registered.

And I'm pretty sure you burned yourself by saying you took your mom's car.

MrFancypants

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #44 on: March 24, 2015, 07:29:13 AM »
I enjoy my drive to work.  Rowing gears is therapeutic.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2015, 08:32:08 PM by Mykl »

Ricky

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #45 on: March 24, 2015, 09:59:19 AM »
I enjoy my drive to work.  Rowing gears is therapeutic.

*edit* - also, the Camry, while being a good and very pleasant vehicle, isn't much fun to drive.  I'm fairly certain that the statement "a Challenger SRT-8 is more fun to drive than a Camry" is factually correct, at least for those of us who don't view driving as a chore.  Unfortunately for Dimitri there are a variety of vehicles out there that are more fun to drive than a Camry, but cost about the same as said Camry but significantly less to own and operate than the SRT-8.

I'm sorry, but no. If you're averaging 34mph and its a commuter car subject to the same speed limit as everyone else, there's no way it could be more fun. If that's your definition of fun then that's fairly depressing. I mean I guess I could imagine the thrill of driving a status symbol for about a month, but the associates costs would quickly shoot that down.

Now, taking it to the track is different.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2015, 10:01:27 AM by Ricky »

AJ

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #46 on: March 24, 2015, 10:16:55 AM »
There is a difference between saying you would trade your commute for $40k and saying the two result in equivalent happiness increases. People make trade-offs for things other than happiness (like security, status, etc.)

Personally, I would trade my lovely 2.25 mile walking commute along the river for $40k, but I agree that it would have a net negative result on my moment-by-moment happiness. But it would let me FI faster, so it would be worth it for a limited duration. Plenty of people are also in the position where $40k would result in a large increase in their security, and would therefore be willing to trade out happiness.

MrFancypants

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #47 on: March 24, 2015, 12:27:11 PM »
I'm sorry, but no. If you're averaging 34mph and its a commuter car subject to the same speed limit as everyone else, there's no way it could be more fun. If that's your definition of fun then that's fairly depressing. I mean I guess I could imagine the thrill of driving a status symbol for about a month, but the associates costs would quickly shoot that down.

Now, taking it to the track is different.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2015, 08:31:51 PM by Mykl »

MrFancypants

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #48 on: March 24, 2015, 12:42:13 PM »
^ again, if you think of driving as a chore, then it doesn't matter what you're in, it sucks.

But to someone who does enjoy operating cars, saying that at an average speed of 34 mph that a Camry is as fun as an SRT-8 is absurd.

golden1

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Re: Ditching Your Commute Is the Happiness Equivalent of $40k raise
« Reply #49 on: March 24, 2015, 12:52:46 PM »
I believe it.  My commute blows - only 18 miles but I either leave my house before 5:30am to avoid it or sit in bumper to bumper traffic for 1.5 hours +.  I choose the first option, but it is still tough to get up so early.  If I could lose the commute on this job, I would be thrilled.  It would add so much to my life, better quality sleep, the ability to exercise in the morning instead of the evening etc...  However I couldn't afford give up $40K of my salary, no matter how mustachian I lived. 

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!