Author Topic: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.  (Read 14009 times)

jennc123

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Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« on: March 02, 2015, 10:42:04 AM »
Hello Everyone,

I am  a happily married, woman to 4 kids ages: 13-16yrs who hasn't worked for 14 years ..by choice. 

I have always called myself a SAHM (Stay at Home Mom) but now that my kids are "older" that answer seems to perplex folks and I myself am looking to switch things up in terms of an answer.

I DID work in a corporate job for a Fortune 10 Company for 10 years and thought maybe I may go back into the workforce someday.  But now I realize that since we don't need the money, I hated the politics and I like my current lifestyle, I will never work 9-5 again.    Sooo I am "retired" then right??   

CheapskateWife

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2015, 10:45:28 AM »
You sound retired to me!

Perhaps "Lady of Leisure" is a better title :D


Secretly Saving

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2015, 10:46:47 AM »
Retired sounds right.  If you're sensitive from SAHM, I'd just say "I work at home or from home." 

2ndTimer

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2015, 11:00:15 AM »
i call myself RE since I don't have any kids.  It plays better now that I have grey hair

2lazy2retire

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2015, 11:06:53 AM »
SAHM - The IRP might want a word

jmusic

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2015, 11:20:26 AM »
SAHM - The IRP might want a word

IRP = Internet Retirement Police? 

DecD

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2015, 11:31:33 AM »
Not that my opinion matters- you can call yourself what you want!  But if my husband is also retired, I'd call it ER.  If he's still working to support us, I'd call it SAHM. 

Are we FI as a couple & we don't need either salary?  Then we're RE.  Are we happily living on one salary?  Then we've got one working parent and one SAH parent. 

MrsPete

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2015, 12:02:21 PM »
In my opinion:

A SAHM is a person who's at home with children right now . . . but who is likely to return to the work force in the future. 

Same person without children . . . I'd call a housewife, though that's an outdated term.

A person who really has no intention of returning to the work force, who financially doesn't need to return to the work force . . . is retired. 

And I'd assume that none of these people WANTS to return to work (or doesn't want to return NOW).  Being "between jobs" or unemployed would be a different category. 

lostamonkey

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2015, 01:49:42 PM »
In my opinion:
Stay at home parent: Someone who stays at home with children who are under 18. Intent to return to work is irrelevant.
Stay at home spouse/housewife: Someone who does not have kids or whose kids are over 18 who doesn't work, and lives on spouse's income
Retired: Has enough passive income to cover expenses. In order to be considered retired you need enough income to cover all family expenses with 0 active income contribution from a spouse.

RootofGood

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2015, 01:54:47 PM »
Sounds good to me.  Call yourself whatever you want.  Is your husband still working?  Are you guys FI? 

I have a still-working wife but we are FI (>2.7% withdrawal rate).  I also have 3 young kids and legitimately spend at least a couple hours per day on stay-at-home-dadding tasks.  I call myself retired here, but if someone asks (at the kids playground for example) if I'm a stay at home dad, I don't disabuse them of the notion. 

The good thing about being FI is you get to assign yourself a title.  And it can change over time. 

kiwigirls

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2015, 01:59:52 PM »
Not that my opinion matters- you can call yourself what you want!  But if my husband is also retired, I'd call it ER.  If he's still working to support us, I'd call it SAHM. 

Are we FI as a couple & we don't need either salary?  Then we're RE.  Are we happily living on one salary?  Then we've got one working parent and one SAH parent.
+1 IMO its a bit of a stretch to claim ER if you are still reliant on your husband's income each week/month.  The idea of ER is that you have income streams sufficient to sustain your lifestyle...(and hopefully your husband means more  to you than just an income stream!)  Also if your husband is still required to work you don't have that freedom to take off for long periods of vacation or both enjoy the best part of the day together.  I do think that we SAHM with children at school are the lucky ones though - we get to experience most of the freedom of RE years earlier than other people.
 

sjc0816

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2015, 02:17:47 PM »
This post applies to me, so I'm definitely following.  My kids are still in grade school, but with my youngest now in school full-day I get many of the same questions. "When are you going back to work?".....or "what are you doing now?"

I also assumed I would re-join the workforce at this time but it does NOT appeal to me (or my husband) at all.  I am volunteering a TON....and I get so much more pleasure out of volunteering than I ever did in my sales career pre-kids. Can't really define myself as a full-time volunteer....so I just tell people I'm a SAHM.  It has been tough not feeling silly or worthless saying that now....but as my husband keeps reminding me...."as soon as you start focusing on what other people think or do, things start to go downhill."  That helps to keep priorities in check. 




kib

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2015, 03:12:33 PM »
When I'm asked what I do, or what I "am", I find it helpful to focus on what I'm actually doing and not a label about my work status.  It shuts up the nosy parkers, and gives everyone else a nice handle for a conversation.  "This year I'm really working on getting the garden going.  I'm really hoping to grow at least 80% of our produce!"  "I've been putting together notes for a book of poems about Longwood Gardens."  Are you a writer?  I'd like to be!  "I'm hoping to run a marathon this fall, I'm redoing the family room, I'm studying Shakespeare I'm learning to make kombucha I'm meditating more I'm learning to play Hey Jude on the kazoo.  And what do you do?"
« Last Edit: March 02, 2015, 03:14:55 PM by frufrau »

forkneedlepen

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2015, 06:34:40 PM »
This is totally me. I've been a SAHM for almost 11 years. Our youngest will be in half day kindergarten next year. BUT, I've struggled with the SAHM term since I've been building my own side business. Yes, my husband provides the income that supports us but I do manage our rental properties. I guess I've just always felt like SAHM is too defining and doesn't allow much room for consideration outside of child rearing capabilities.

MayDay

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #14 on: March 02, 2015, 07:01:28 PM »
I'm mostly a SAHM, working part time for mental stimulation and a tiny bit of money, and debating going back to work more to speed up FI, vs. "retiring" since H makes a good income and the one working parent model is pretty awesome. 

I answer that I am retired in the scope of "what do you do all day" when my kids are at school.  I answer SAHM most of the rest of the time. 

orcas50

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2015, 07:47:57 PM »
When I'm asked what I do, or what I "am", I find it helpful to focus on what I'm actually doing and not a label about my work status.  It shuts up the nosy parkers, and gives everyone else a nice handle for a conversation.  "This year I'm really working on getting the garden going.  I'm really hoping to grow at least 80% of our produce!"  "I've been putting together notes for a book of poems about Longwood Gardens."  Are you a writer?  I'd like to be!  "I'm hoping to run a marathon this fall, I'm redoing the family room, I'm studying Shakespeare I'm learning to make kombucha I'm meditating more I'm learning to play Hey Jude on the kazoo.  And what do you do?"

I love this! As a SAHM for the past 9 years (kids age 9 and 11) with no need or intention to return to work, I say "I do yoga 5-6 days a week, am on the PTA Board, volunteer in the classroom, go hiking once a week in spring/summer/fall and am now thinking about becoming a certified yoga teacher." Things I do not mention: taking care of our home, cooking, cleaning, shopping, driving kids around, paying the bills, planning investments, planning vacations and other enriching family activities, helping with homework, planning/doing home improvement, gardening, taking care of our backyard chickens, reading avidly, reading MMM.....lots to fill the days.

Davids

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2015, 07:50:46 PM »
Housewife, Homemaker, do those terms still exist?

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2015, 07:55:54 PM »
Housewife, Homemaker, do those terms still exist?

My friend uses "Domestic Engineer" (ie, engineers are those who optimize processes... she optimizes related to domesticity).

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2015, 10:27:01 PM »
I've never like the term "stay at home parent" just because it's inaccurate. I've never seen a SAH parent that actually STAYS HOME. There's so many errands and trips and sports and museums and... and... and. I feel like it's a misnomer.

Cressida

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2015, 11:47:20 PM »
I'm sort of mystified by all of the stay-at-home parents who don't like the term. I thought this was the most recent preferred terminology, preferable to "housewife" and such. So what then do you all want to be called, given that this is the occupation you chose and therefore, presumably, see value in?

(I'm not saying I don't see value in it. I'm just asking.)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2015, 12:17:44 AM by Cressida »

Luckyvik

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #20 on: March 03, 2015, 11:56:50 PM »
I want to be a SAHNM stay at home non-mum


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ltt

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2015, 04:11:24 AM »
Same here.  Four children, ages 10 to 17.  No desire to return to work.

I typically say I'm a SAHM, since I definitely don't consider myself to be "retired."  Most women who are SAHMs are extremely busy people.  Since I do pretty much all of our financials/financial planning/investing, I'm starting to like the term "fund manager." LOL!!!!

retired?

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2015, 04:29:13 PM »
Perhaps say "I take care of the kids".  What was that one.....domestic engineer.  At 13-16 there is still a lot to do.

Retired doesn't sound quite right since your corporate job was 14 years ago.  Of course, as many have noted, it doesn't matter.  Or, shouldn't.  I'd use 'retired' once the kids have flown the coop.

At first, I was glad no one really asked me.  Now, I am waiting for someone to ask.  People I encounter on a regular basis don't seem to care OR, they assume I am working full time.

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2015, 04:43:57 PM »
I want to be a SAHNM stay at home non-mum


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When I FIRE, I'll say I'm a stay at home mom to my fur baby. 

Thegoblinchief

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2015, 05:52:38 AM »
Ahhh, semantics. Don't put overmuch importance on labels. Don't make the words more important than the reality.

To complete strangers, more to be provocative than anything else, I say I'm retired. I'm 30 and depending on the current condition of my face carpet, often I look younger than that.

The most accurate term (for me) is a Radical Homemaker.

For all those SAH folks who aren't familiar with it, "Radical Homemakers" by Shannon Hayes is an awesome book, and very Mustachian in that it's about self-sufficiency and developing community resources instead of having to solely rely on money and boughten services/goods. Really neat book that those I've recommended it have almost universally praised - especially if they're in a funk about their stay-at-home status.

Both labels "retired" and "radical homemaker" are odd enough that, if the person is quizzical, it offers me a chance to offer a sound byte level of explanation about the joys of simple living.

Neustache

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2015, 06:14:53 AM »
For me, the difference is this...I'm not actually free.

I have a job, and it's a job I love most of the time, but its' still a job.  If I want to take off and run an errand, well, there's a three year old I've got to get ready, his mood might make the errand less than fun, and there's a time limit as I have to be home at a certain time for the bus to drop off my 6 year old.

I often don't get out much, especially in the winter, because the idea of getting the little one ready and in and out of car seats while it's below freezing out, just sounds the opposite of fun. 

So while I like to joke about being retired, the reality is there's a bunch of constraints put on me by virtue of being a SAHM.  When I'm retired, it will be a freedom I will not have had for awhile. 

Again, I've really enjoyed my time as a SAHM.  However, it's not the same as being retired for me, not by a long shot. 


MrsPete

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2015, 12:27:50 PM »
"Domestic engineer" makes me roll my eyes a bit.  It sounds like you, yourself don't think "mom" is enough, so you're gussying it up -- and it has the opposite impression:  It sounds fake and self-aggrandizing.  It sounds insecure. 

gnomemom

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2015, 01:07:31 PM »
I guess there are enough stay at home moms where I am that no one really questions my status.  I just tell people I stay home.  That's the end of it ;)  I agree with the previous poster that Domestic Engineer sounds like you're trying too hard - not my style. 

Bracken_Joy

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2015, 01:56:01 PM »
"Domestic engineer" makes me roll my eyes a bit.  It sounds like you, yourself don't think "mom" is enough, so you're gussying it up -- and it has the opposite impression:  It sounds fake and self-aggrandizing.  It sounds insecure.

It's not like she's saying it with severity and pinched eyebrows while writing the term on DMV paperwork. She's a very humorous person, and that's her take on things. She also calls herself a "hausfrau" which is the german term for a housewife. Maybe you would have to know her, but I don't think anyone has ever met her and thought, "trying too hard and self-aggrandizing" and instead thinks "goofball with a clever streak".

RootofGood

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2015, 02:12:25 PM »
"Domestic engineer" makes me roll my eyes a bit.  It sounds like you, yourself don't think "mom" is enough, so you're gussying it up -- and it has the opposite impression:  It sounds fake and self-aggrandizing.  It sounds insecure.

What if I'm a state certified licensed official real engineer and I work on domestic projects at my house? 

I actually call myself a domestic diva (or DD for short).  Which is pretty funny given the amount of facial hair I have and my totally disdain for all things diva. 

That term, domestic diva, isn't trademarked by me, so everyone please feel free to adopt (or adapt) that to suit your own purposes. 

tmac

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2015, 03:12:58 PM »
I usually tell people I "manage the house and kids," even though technically I'm employed part-time in the business we own. It's easier, since I work from home and it's only a few hours per week. No one needs my life story.

I don't like any of the various labels, except "radical homemaker." That's got a nice ring to it. But the labels don't come up much. Except from my sister, who just calls me a "housewife" with as much derision as she can manage.

I was wondering about the RE vs. SAHM too, mostly because my work won't actually end, even when we're FI. So unlike DH, I will never retire from my job. The best I can hope for is that the kids will be out eventually and that DH will split the work with me. So I'll have a quarter-time, non-paying job after that. :)

Cookie78

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #31 on: March 05, 2015, 03:25:26 PM »
I want to be a SAHNM stay at home non-mum


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When I FIRE, I'll say I'm a stay at home mom to my fur baby.

+1 !!!

madamwitty

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #32 on: March 05, 2015, 05:01:40 PM »
Our FI is a few years out. Intellectually, I think that when I stop working because we are FI, I would be RE. But emotionally, I feel like I would still count as a SAHM unless DH RE's with me. Maybe it's because I would get stuck with more of the parenting and household duties due to his decision to continue working.

Rika Non

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #33 on: March 05, 2015, 05:34:53 PM »
I like the term "housewife"  since it sort of implies you're married to the house (or feels like it most days).

I'm looking forward to when I can claim that title.
:)

kiwigirls

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #34 on: March 05, 2015, 09:25:43 PM »
Same here.  Four children, ages 10 to 17.  No desire to return to work.

I typically say I'm a SAHM, since I definitely don't consider myself to be "retired."  Most women who are SAHMs are extremely busy people.  Since I do pretty much all of our financials/financial planning/investing, I'm starting to like the term "fund manager." LOL!!!!
+1 

MrsPete

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #35 on: March 06, 2015, 06:15:01 AM »
"Domestic engineer" makes me roll my eyes a bit.  It sounds like you, yourself don't think "mom" is enough, so you're gussying it up -- and it has the opposite impression:  It sounds fake and self-aggrandizing.  It sounds insecure.

It's not like she's saying it with severity and pinched eyebrows while writing the term on DMV paperwork. She's a very humorous person, and that's her take on things. She also calls herself a "hausfrau" which is the german term for a housewife. Maybe you would have to know her, but I don't think anyone has ever met her and thought, "trying too hard and self-aggrandizing" and instead thinks "goofball with a clever streak".
I'm not sure who "she" is because this term has been in use for decades.  I've always thought -- to borrow another poster's words -- that it was a "trying too hard" term, regardless of who's using it.

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #36 on: March 06, 2015, 06:22:23 AM »
"Domestic engineer" makes me roll my eyes a bit.  It sounds like you, yourself don't think "mom" is enough, so you're gussying it up -- and it has the opposite impression:  It sounds fake and self-aggrandizing.  It sounds insecure.

It's not like she's saying it with severity and pinched eyebrows while writing the term on DMV paperwork. She's a very humorous person, and that's her take on things. She also calls herself a "hausfrau" which is the german term for a housewife. Maybe you would have to know her, but I don't think anyone has ever met her and thought, "trying too hard and self-aggrandizing" and instead thinks "goofball with a clever streak".
I'm not sure who "she" is because this term has been in use for decades.  I've always thought -- to borrow another poster's words -- that it was a "trying too hard" term, regardless of who's using it.

Just up the thread from you I had posted, "
My friend uses "Domestic Engineer" (ie, engineers are those who optimize processes... she optimizes related to domesticity). "
I assumed that is what you were referencing when you posted that.

I'm a red panda

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #37 on: March 06, 2015, 07:05:50 AM »
I know a number of people who were stay at home Moms until their kids finished high school.  After that, they were retired.

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #38 on: March 06, 2015, 09:43:32 AM »
For me, the difference is this...I'm not actually free.

I have a job, and it's a job I love most of the time, but its' still a job.


This.

My DH is RE.  He worked full time out-of-the-home for many years, and left when he qualified for full pension benefits.  He did not seek (or find, or take) another position of paid employment.

We have a kid, who is now in elementary school.  In addition to public school, we do make use of a lot of (paid for) organized kids' activities, because we are fortunate to have a bunch of great ones around us and frankly, they do a much better job (and involve a lot more kids, which DS appreciates) than DH (or I) would of engaging DS's interests and providing him with opportunities to do new things.

We also do a lot of stuff with DS ourselves -- me in the time I'm not at my office/working, and DH other times (or all 3 of us together).  And we have a wonderful in-town grandparent who typically does stuff with DS for 4-8 hours per week without our involvement.

And DH is the "fall back" for caring for DS, and of course has been called into service a bunch lately, what with all the snow days.

I often don't call him a SAHP as that isn't really what he wants his role to be and indeed there are many ways in which our household is organized that are more similar to those in which both parents are WOH than not (see above).  So I tend to call him a SAHH or RE.  But even with that, what he does is a big job and not one whose importance I downplay, or whose ability to generate exhaustion I underestimate. 

(Another non-fan of the "domestic engineer" label here, though I did appreciate the one of my mom's friends who, feeling similarly annoyed at people's reaction to the "SAHM" or "housewife" label in an earlier era would tell people that she ran "a home-based injury prevention program")

Victoria

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #39 on: March 06, 2015, 02:54:31 PM »
I am a sahm and I will consider myself retired when my husband retires. Not because of an ability to live off of passive income but because the housework will be equally shared i.e. no longer mainly my responsibility. It's a big job to keep house and raise kids and all that planning.

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #40 on: March 07, 2015, 03:49:42 PM »
I agree with the SAH and RE distinction. However, in social circumstances, I would opt for RE. People put way too much emphasis on other people's job, but if you do not feel comfortable saying you're a stay at home wife or mother, retired is not too far from reality. You've worked, you've retired from the workforce and you are not currently looking to go back. Nobody needs to know who you rely on (yourself or your husband) to pay the bills.

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #41 on: March 07, 2015, 05:32:38 PM »
I like the response above about just saying what you're doing.  Gardening, yoga, in between picking up the kids, etc.  When I ask someone at a dinner party or church or whatever, "What do you do?" I'm not looking to categorize them and write them off.  I'm just trying to make conversation, get to know you better, find some common ground etc. 

My husband used to tell me that at work social events i wasn't allowed to ask women this question.  Because if the answer was "housewife"  "SAHM" "supporting my husband's  career"  it would put that woman on edge and make her defensive.  That never sat quite right with me.  I'm really proud of my chosen career and love talking about what I do.  I would hate to think someone wouldn't ask me because they were worried the answer was SAHM and would somehow offend me. 

Own it! Hopefully it was your choice to be a whatever-it-is-you do.  Be proud.  And don't hesitate to say, "Well, I'm focusing on the kids and our household so my husband can work on his career.  But I've also lately started doing a lot of Crossfit and thinking about early retirement for us both and optimizing our family's finances."  Because the person who is asking might just be looking to get to know you better and find some common ground and conversation pieces.

Rpesek6904

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Re: Difference between a SAHM and RE? Your opinion please.
« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2015, 09:04:09 AM »
My wife stays home with three kids ages 3,1, three months. I call her our CFO (Chief Financial Officer). We run a small business that grossed quite a lot last year. She "stays at home" but also keeps books, runs payroll, taxes, manages our online presence (including building an awesome website), created and manages the company 401k and more (all from home).  She used to be a Deloitte accountant. But, I'm the face of the business and generally known as frugal/money oriented so I think people think I'm "trying to hard." Whatever, my wife is awesome.

Just throwing out another title option for the spouses that manage the money earned by their other half :)

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!