Dealing with realtors (selling my parents' house)--advice please

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

My parents both died earlier this horrible pointless year, and I am finally close to being finished clearing their tons and tons of hoarded stuff from their house. (Junkluggers taking it to charity after my innumerable hours sorting and taking stuff to trash!) I am an only child and have had to deal with all of their innumerable issues since near the beginning of the year. My wife has been helping me out, but we live an hour drive from their house and it has been incredibly burdensome!!!

Anyway, it is a mobile home in a senior mobile home park in Southern California. (They own the house free and clear, but not the land--I am still paying monthy rent and other expenses!) It is a nice enough park, and everyone keeps their property up pretty well. Homes range from about $90K for an older one, up to $240K for a brand new, perfect specimen. We have been discussing selling with a realtor who has sold many homes in the park. She is also recommended by the park manager, who my mother liked and trusted.

We have only been discussing things informally, and she came in and looked around a few times. We have agreed on an asking price. The house is structurally good; I had a very good mobile home inspector look over everything about one year ago. However, the interior looks like crap from years of neglect, poor health, dementia. etc. The realtor advised (and I agree!!) that we just sell it as-is, as a fixer upper. She advised that even if we spend a ton of money and time trying to make it perfect, a large percentage of buyers want to do their own thing, and will want to rip it all out! She is pretty confident it will sell quickly given the crazy house market (especially in SoCal!!)

Do you have any advice on how to proceed with the realtor?

The Yelp reviews are few, but pretty good. I have her business card and license number.

I have a good lawyer, who will have a look at the listing agreement. I also have a friend who is a realtor (out of the area, does not want to deal with it), and he advised: 1.) Don't sign up for more than a 90 day listing period; 2.) Make serious buyer pay up-front fee "ernest money" deposit to collect if they back out; 3.) Make the buyer pay at least 50$/day for every day they are late! (Importantly, I am still paying rent, utilities, insurance, gardening, etc until the place is sold!!)

Any other advice on this? Thanks.

[Zamboni]

Good luck to you, and I've read your other thread and I'm sorry this has all been so terrible in every way. *Hugs*

When we've sold we've always had 3 realtors come by to give us their assessment (what they would recommend listing it for, what work (if any) they recommend, etc.) So, I'd probably get two more quotes before listing. Most are eager to be the listing agent and you could probably space appointments 90 min apart on the same day and they'd never see each other (meeting, coffee or lunch break for you, meeting, back home you go.) That's what I've always done before listing, anyway. I also got quotes from Zillow and OpenDoor . . .not sure if those types of "we buy houses" services buy mobile homes.

I understand the "as is" idea, but I will say that the realtor is not being total honest with you, imho. Often even seemingly very minor improvements like a deep cleaning and a fresh coat of white paint on everything and some mulch around the entrance area can lead to a much better showing, which leads to higher offers. Toss in some very cheap but brand new neutral carpet or imitation wood vinyl plank flooring, and the place will look way, way better to buyers. Remember, what's in her interest is to sell your property as quickly as possible . . . maximizing your profit really doesn't get her much more commission. I agree that a gut and remodel is often not money that can be recouped, but if you interview a couple more realtors you might get some ideas of little cheap things you could do or have done very quickly to make it show better.

I agree that you should keep the seller's agent engagement timeframe short, and that you should definitely expect a decent change of earnest money from buyers (although really that is something that buyer's decides to offer to show they are serious, not something the seller's agent sets.)

I write all of this not knowing how bad the condition really is, and I know you are ready to just be finished with this project, so please take my advice about stuff like fresh paint with a grain of salt.

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

Thanks very much for the kind words and advice.

I think this realtor knows how fed up I am with the whole situation, paying rent, all the other expenses, and my time, time, time, and energy, etc. Recently, she said "I just want to stop the bleeding." I told her that I do too, but I don't want to just take the first lowball offer that rolls in. I don't HAVE TO sell it this week or even month. She thinks that a three week to month listing should be sufficient to get a good range of offers. I know people are interested, as other residents of the park have been asking about it, saying they know someone who wants to buy a fixer-upper.

I also think that she thinks that any extra time spent fixing up the place is time down the drain in terms of this scorching hot housing market. She was gently nudging me in July to get it listed, but I told her we had to go through all the rest of the stuff in the house.

I asked her about the same cosmetic issues you mention. She said that the only thing she would recommend is a good deep cleaning of the bathrooms, kitchen, and dust, vacuum, etc. I will also ask her, in addition to that, how she would spend 500$ to spruce the place up, including exterior stuff.

However, I am so very tired of this damn house taking my time and energy, I am not too eager to do much more. The drive on the freeway is horrible--we are usually quite lucky with traffic because we go down there about noon and come back about 8PM, but still I really hate SoCal, the freeways (my work commute is pretty short, although now thankfully I am fully remote)!

[SunnyDays]

If people have expressed interest directly to you, why go through an agent at all?  Get their contact info and work with them directly.  If the market is that hot, it will still sell quickly and you’ll save yourself some money.

[Zamboni]

I'm not in SoCal, but she may be right that little cosmetic fix ups don't matter in this market. It's insane right now.

If everyone is reasonable, then a real estate transaction without a seller's agent can go smoothly. However, lots of buyers are complete and total flakes rather than reasonable. And, it would be more of your time down the drain for showings, etc.

In your shoes, with all you have been through and what you describe in terms of your commute there & lack of experience with real estate transactions, it seems like letting an agent handle it for you makes sense.

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

I'm not in SoCal, but she may be right that little cosmetic fix ups don't matter in this market. It's insane right now.

If everyone is reasonable, then a real estate transaction without a seller's agent can go smoothly. However, lots of buyers are complete and total flakes rather than reasonable. And, it would be more of your time down the drain for showings, etc.

In your shoes, with all you have been through and what you describe in terms of your commute there & lack of experience with real estate transactions, it seems like letting an agent handle it for you makes sense.

Indeed! If I have to drive down that goddam freeway through the bowels of HELL A to my parents' house after Sept is over, I'm gonna do something crazy with my money, like buy an Audi or Glashütte, or both! (Or pay a chauffeur to drive me while I sit in the back seat with my eyes closed!!!)

[former player]

I would think that a deep clean is the way to go: kitchen, bathroom, carpets, upholstery, anything else that can be washed is washed, including paintwork.  It is astonishing how well people react to clean and how badly they react to dirty, and without even realising it most of the time.

[Zamboni]

I'm facing this right now as well with MIL's home. My SO is very stressed out by everything! It's about the same drive time you are facing, although with less traffic, which is a blessing. But the drive itself is one of the major, major hurdle to getting things done. Your desire for a chauffeur is completely understandable after all of that.

It sounds like you're nearly to the finish line. Around here the "list at recommended or slightly low but have a set time during which offers are accepted" seems to work really well. Listing higher than recommended on purpose is definitely a gamble. I don't think I'd do that unless I had a lot of my own market research (which in the past I have sometimes had . . . depends upon how much you know about the condition of the properties that recently sold in that neighborhood.)

[Dicey]

The market for all kinds of housing in SoCal is insane.  Price it too low and you're going to get multiple offers. Go with the current agent and let the market determine the price. People tend to trust an agent who is well known in the area, which is to your advantage. Deep cleaning is also the best answer, hands down. Instead of wasting time interviewing other agents, sign with this one and get to the cleaning!

I agree with the lawyer's first two points, but #3 is bullshit. It may not even be legal in CA. Hardly anything closes exactly on time and it's often out of the buyer's control. Typically, the seller has to grant any requests for extension anyway.*

*When I sold my condo, mortgage rates had just dropped and nothing was closing on time. I granted a one-week extension. By the second time they needed an extension, I'd learned the buyer was in marketing for a specific snack I liked. I said I'd give them the extension in exchange for some product samples. She gave me a bag full of every flavor. Months after closing, I was thrilled to discover a whole wad of coupons for free product, redeemable at any retailer, at the bottom of the bag. I was thrilled! They still own the place, and I run into them often. So glad I wasn't a jerk. Two caveats: They were pre-qualified and pre-approved, so I knew their loan would ultimately get approved. Theirs was also the highest bid, and well over asking.

[mm1970]

I'm not in SoCal, but she may be right that little cosmetic fix ups don't matter in this market. It's insane right now.

If everyone is reasonable, then a real estate transaction without a seller's agent can go smoothly. However, lots of buyers are complete and total flakes rather than reasonable. And, it would be more of your time down the drain for showings, etc.

In your shoes, with all you have been through and what you describe in terms of your commute there & lack of experience with real estate transactions, it seems like letting an agent handle it for you makes sense.

Indeed! If I have to drive down that goddam freeway through the bowels of HELL A to my parents' house after Sept is over, I'm gonna do something crazy with my money, like buy an Audi or Glashütte, or both! (Or pay a chauffeur to drive me while I sit in the back seat with my eyes closed!!!)

I legit LOLd.  I hate Los Angeles.

[wageslave23]

The market for all kinds of housing in SoCal is insane.  Price it too low and you're going to get multiple offers. Go with the current agent and let the market determine the price. People tend to trust an agent who is well known in the area, which is to your advantage. Deep cleaning is also the best answer, hands down. Instead of wasting time interviewing other agents, sign with this one and get to the cleaning!

I agree with the lawyer's first two points, but #3 is bullshit. It may not even be legal in CA. Hardly anything closes exactly on time and it's often out of the buyer's control. Typically, the seller has to grant any requests for extension anyway.*

*When I sold my condo, mortgage rates had just dropped and nothing was closing on time. I granted a one-week extension. By the second time they needed an extension, I'd learned the buyer was in marketing for a specific snack I liked. I said I'd give them the extension in exchange for some product samples. She gave me a bag full of every flavor. Months after closing, I was thrilled to discover a whole wad of coupons for free product, redeemable at any retailer, at the bottom of the bag. I was thrilled! They still own the place, and I run into them often. So glad I wasn't a jerk. Two caveats: They were pre-qualified and pre-approved, so I knew their loan would ultimately get approved. Theirs was also the highest bid, and well over asking.

+1

Realtors don't do sh*t. Sign with this one, if you don't have a decent offer in the first two weeks you are over priced.  The market is what it is and your house will sell for about what it's worth regardless of realtor.  Don't put anymore time or thought into this.

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

The market for all kinds of housing in SoCal is insane.  Price it too low and you're going to get multiple offers. Go with the current agent and let the market determine the price. People tend to trust an agent who is well known in the area, which is to your advantage. Deep cleaning is also the best answer, hands down. Instead of wasting time interviewing other agents, sign with this one and get to the cleaning!

I agree with the lawyer's first two points, but #3 is bullshit. It may not even be legal in CA. Hardly anything closes exactly on time and it's often out of the buyer's control. Typically, the seller has to grant any requests for extension anyway.*

Thanks very much for your thoughts. The points I listed above were advice from my realtor friend (not lawyer) who sells many houses in SoCal, including the insanely expensive area we live in (we are renters, but we have a very good deal). I can see his point, but will discuss with the realtor.

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

The market for all kinds of housing in SoCal is insane.  Price it too low and you're going to get multiple offers. Go with the current agent and let the market determine the price. People tend to trust an agent who is well known in the area, which is to your advantage. Deep cleaning is also the best answer, hands down. Instead of wasting time interviewing other agents, sign with this one and get to the cleaning!

I agree with the lawyer's first two points, but #3 is bullshit. It may not even be legal in CA. Hardly anything closes exactly on time and it's often out of the buyer's control. Typically, the seller has to grant any requests for extension anyway.*

*When I sold my condo, mortgage rates had just dropped and nothing was closing on time. I granted a one-week extension. By the second time they needed an extension, I'd learned the buyer was in marketing for a specific snack I liked. I said I'd give them the extension in exchange for some product samples. She gave me a bag full of every flavor. Months after closing, I was thrilled to discover a whole wad of coupons for free product, redeemable at any retailer, at the bottom of the bag. I was thrilled! They still own the place, and I run into them often. So glad I wasn't a jerk. Two caveats: They were pre-qualified and pre-approved, so I knew their loan would ultimately get approved. Theirs was also the highest bid, and well over asking.

+1

Realtors don't do sh*t. Sign with this one, if you don't have a decent offer in the first two weeks you are over priced.  The market is what it is and your house will sell for about what it's worth regardless of realtor.  Don't put anymore time or thought into this.

This makes sense, thank you!

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

I'm not in SoCal, but she may be right that little cosmetic fix ups don't matter in this market. It's insane right now.

If everyone is reasonable, then a real estate transaction without a seller's agent can go smoothly. However, lots of buyers are complete and total flakes rather than reasonable. And, it would be more of your time down the drain for showings, etc.

In your shoes, with all you have been through and what you describe in terms of your commute there & lack of experience with real estate transactions, it seems like letting an agent handle it for you makes sense.

Indeed! If I have to drive down that goddam freeway through the bowels of HELL A to my parents' house after Sept is over, I'm gonna do something crazy with my money, like buy an Audi or Glashütte, or both! (Or pay a chauffeur to drive me while I sit in the back seat with my eyes closed!!!)

I legit LOLd.  I hate Los Angeles.

Please spell it correctly: Loss Angeles (or HELL A)!! ;)

[nancy33]

Facing this now also in CA with my parent’s’ house (not mobile home) we had three realtors and a property manager come. We got an estimate of what it would rent for from the property manager and three different written proposals for selling it from realtors. One proposed a lower percentage commission even! This is a home worth over a million. One realtor wants a bunch of stuff done and staged. One says it will sell right away if we do nothing to it. It is nice having three written proposals to choose from…not sure if it is worth it with a mobile home though. Do you need an appraisal for the estate? It was required for us. I am so sorry it sucks being an “adult orphan”

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

This clause I am finding in more than one realtor's listing agreement:

"If action is instituted to enforce this agreement, the prevailing party shall receive reasonable attorney's fees."

Is this common in realtor listing agreements?

My lawyer told me to strike this, " As seller, you are not going to contractually agree to finance your realtor’s lawsuit against you."

Not sure what to think here. I have a feeling they will tell me to take it or leave it. That's the way it ALWAYS goes. I am horrible at negotiating.  Me, individual, has not a snowball's chance in hell negotiating with a *****CORPORATION*****! I believe the other side knows that I absolutely hate negotiating and am always overwhelmed with five hundred quadrillion other problems and have no desire to argue with them.

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

Words cannot express how sick I am of all this... I will walk away before I try to sell this goddam house myself.

[former player]

This clause I am finding in more than one realtor's listing agreement:

"If action is instituted to enforce this agreement, the prevailing party shall receive reasonable attorney's fees."

Is this common in realtor listing agreements?

My lawyer told me to strike this, " As seller, you are not going to contractually agree to finance your realtor’s lawsuit against you."

Not sure what to think here. I have a feeling they will tell me to take it or leave it. That's the way it ALWAYS goes. I am horrible at negotiating.  Me, individual, has not a snowball's chance in hell negotiating with a *****CORPORATION*****! I believe the other side knows that I absolutely hate negotiating and am always overwhelmed with five hundred quadrillion other problems and have no desire to argue with them.

The big thing in any contract is to have an end date; no realtor listing agreement should run for more than 3 months.  There also needs to be clarity about what happens when it ends, eg "the fees will be payable if the property is purchased by a person who has been given a viewing by the realtor before the end date and the realtor continues all the real estate work necessary to complete the transaction".

If something ever comes up in a business discussion that you are not immediately certain about then 1) give yourself a bit of time to think about it (not too much unless it's really major) and then put your side in writing, so you are not bounced into an oral agreement.  For example "I'll think about that and send you an email later today".  If the person you are talking to isn't happy with that they can like it or lump it.

Sorry this is so stressful at a difficult time for you.  Fortunately it's a "once and done" situation, if you can power through it now you never have to do it again.  If you are really at the end of your tether, can you ask your lawyer to deal with everything for you?  They will want to be paid their usual hourly fee for doing it but it sounds as though that could be worth it to you.

[ObviouslyNotAGolfer]

Thanks. I am in discussion with another realtor, and have a third in mind as well. I am not going to go nuts with comparisons, but I think I will just talk to three and make a decision.

Again, I think they will all have this clause about about reasonable attorney fees in their listing agreement. Is this a deal-killer in your opinion?

[former player]

Thanks. I am in discussion with another realtor, and have a third in mind as well. I am not going to go nuts with comparisons, but I think I will just talk to three and make a decision.

Again, I think they will all have this clause about about reasonable attorney fees in their listing agreement. Is this a deal-killer in your opinion?

My personal view (and I used to be a lawyer, although not in your country) is that you want to do everything possible to avoid getting into litigation in the first place, and if you can avoid getting into litigation then the issue of who pays for the litigation is irrelevant.

This is why an end date is so important: if both of you can walk away after a short time with no dispute on either side there will be no litigation, if you are both tied into a year long (or endless) contract with each of you unhappy with the other that's when litigation happens.

Apart from the end date the big question is: is there anything in the contract that you will want to sue the agent over or the agent will want to sue you over?   It's a good start that you desperately want to sell the property and the agent wants their money for selling the property, so you both have the same aim in mind at the start.  I suspect, given your attitude so far, that if something goes wrong despite this you are not going to sue, you are just going to wait out the contract and move on to someone else.  Also, I suspect that an agent is mostly only going to sue if they think you've done the dirty on them (eg the agent finds the buyer but you refuse to pay them, or somehow end up under contract to two different agents at the same time - don't do this), which again I don't think you'll do.

What I would suggest you do is write to the agent saying something along the lines of "my lawyer has told me to strike clause [paying for litigation] from the contract.  Apart from that clause I am happy with the terms, and I am keen to have the property sold as soon as possible, so I hope you can agree."

[Omy]

Ask each realtor that you interview how much more you will net by putting a little money into it. Most realtors know local contractors who can do the minimum to get the most out of a property and who can get it done in a week or two without your involvement. New paint and carpet and a deep clean can make a huge difference in price. Will $5k now net you $20k or more? If so it might be worth it to get more interested buyers in the door.

Also, make sure the agent plans to have a professional photographer take pictures.

[dcheesi]

Posting to follow, as we're in a similar situation.

Going as-is due to recent water damage in the basement (fully remediated, but left somewhat gutted), among other reasons. Even though we're leaving the basement alone, the realtor did recommend some smaller fixes to improve the upstairs and exterior appearance. Hopefully striking the right balance, but we'll see...

[Zamboni]

I'd imagine these are "docusign" electronic contracts, but if it is a piece of paper, then just literally cross out that clause with a single line using your pen, sign it, and don't say anything about it. They won't care either way I don't think. They only have that phrase in there because of the 1 out of 500 people who try to stiff them on the commission that they earned.

Good luck with it . . . it will be over soon.

[BlueHouse]

I'm so sorry you've been dealing with all this for so long.  Hang in there, you're near the finish line. 

What you've been through so far is exhausting, both physically and emotionally.  I do agree with the poster who said to slap some white paint on the walls but, I also know I've been through some emotionally-intensive things, and I prefer to just throw money at the problem -- sometimes that means accepting a lower price for the emotional piece of mind.  Remember, you're not losing money...just not recovering as much as you otherwise might have. 

So with that, I guess I would suggest signing with the easiest agent, get the home sold and off your mind. 

As for the contract, yep, just cross out anything you don't like.  I always drop a note that says "I crossed out x, y, and z" and I have NEVER had anyone challenge my changes, or even need to "run it by their lawyers".  Good luck and take care of yourself!