California Drought = Higher Food Prices

[Trying225]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-17/15-reasons-why-your-food-prices-are-about-start-soaring

[jordanread]

bacon has skyrocketed up 22.8 percent

Oh dear god, we're doomed. :-)

Some very interesting stats though. Better get my garden planted. It's just a shame that it's illegal here to capture rain water.

[reginna]

bacon has skyrocketed up 22.8 percent

Oh dear god, we're doomed. :-)

Some very interesting stats though. Better get my garden planted. It's just a shame that it's illegal here to capture rain water.

Just wondering, how do they know if you have a rain barrel (or two)?

[arebelspy]

Some very interesting stats though. Better get my garden planted. It's just a shame that it's illegal here to capture rain water.

Just wondering, how do they know if you have a rain barrel (or two)?

There's lots of illegal things you can do they probably won't know about.  That usually isn't the point.

[aclarridge]

bacon has skyrocketed up 22.8 percent

Oh dear god, we're doomed. :-)

Some very interesting stats though. Better get my garden planted. It's just a shame that it's illegal here to capture rain water.

Why would it be illegal?

[jordanread]

bacon has skyrocketed up 22.8 percent

Oh dear god, we're doomed. :-)

Some very interesting stats though. Better get my garden planted. It's just a shame that it's illegal here to capture rain water.

Why would it be illegal?

I can't figure out the justification either. But it is the law. Some restrictions have been lessened, but I think we still are considered to have the harshest water harvesting laws in the country.

Just wondering, how do they know if you have a rain barrel (or two)?

There's lots of illegal things you can do they probably won't know about.  That usually isn't the point.

Actually, the meter readers from the Utility company can and do report you. I am missing a gutter, and had a couple of buckets collecting the water that rolled off, and got a warning from them. Not even a barrel, just a 3 gallon bucket. I've thought about some ways to get around it, but arebelspy is right, the law is the problem.

[greaper007]

It's illegal because apparently water that falls on the ground is supposed to be a municipal ownership item.   Having rain barrels stops rain water from flowing into reservoirs and aquifers. 

I don't get it though.   If I have a rain barrel I'm still going to let the water flow on the ground where the excess that isn't absorbed by plants will flow into the groundwater, I'm just doing it over a longer period.   In fact, if you use drip irrigation you'll lose less water to evaporation and more will be flowing into the aquifer.

Honestly, kentucky bluegrass in the mountain west should be considered illegal way before rain barrels should.   This is just an instance of laws not catching up to modern times.

[jordanread]

It's illegal because apparently water that falls on the ground is supposed to be a municipal ownership item.   Having rain barrels stops rain water from flowing into reservoirs and aquifers. 

I don't get it though.   If I have a rain barrel I'm still going to let the water flow on the ground where the excess that isn't absorbed by plants will flow into the groundwater, I'm just doing it over a longer period.   In fact, if you use drip irrigation you'll lose less water to evaporation and more will be flowing into the aquifer.

Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear. I remember what they were saying the justification was, but it doesn't make any sense to me.

[nawhite]

It's illegal because apparently water that falls on the ground is supposed to be a municipal ownership item.   Having rain barrels stops rain water from flowing into reservoirs and aquifers. 

I don't get it though.   If I have a rain barrel I'm still going to let the water flow on the ground where the excess that isn't absorbed by plants will flow into the groundwater, I'm just doing it over a longer period.   In fact, if you use drip irrigation you'll lose less water to evaporation and more will be flowing into the aquifer.

Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear. I remember what they were saying the justification was, but it doesn't make any sense to me.

It actually isn't a municipal ownership thing, it is a private ownership thing. There is a farmer way downstream on the eastern plain who has been using X acre-feet of water per year and according to state law, he has a right to the water that has always been flowing in the river next to his farm because he started using it first. Add that up to all the farmers in the state and all of the water in all of the rivers has been accounted for. Water rights in Colorado are decided on a "first in use, first in right" basis so technically according to state law, if you use the water that falls on your land (or your house) you are stealing water from people downstream who own those water rights.

It's silly, but at the same time it discourages people from using more water than necessary. If you can't use a rain barrel and have to water all of your plants with municipal water you pay for, you will probably grow fewer irrigation-requiring plants because the municipal water is expensive.

Currently the only exemption for rain barrels in Colorado is for people who do not have access to municipal water and use a well. They can use a rain barrel because the thinking is that the water will go into the water table anyway. If someone started doing large scale irrigation farming with the water flowing off a large warehouse, the state would probably come down on them even if they technically didn't have municipal water.

Almost all municipal water in Colorado comes from public works projects to store water and divert it from one river to another. About 70% of Denver's city water comes from the west (far) side of the continental divide and is diverted through tunnels in the mountains. Lake Dillon in Summit County is purely a water storage project created to get water into a tunnel that comes out near Bailey, CO. Almost all of the water in Lake Dillon will eventually water lawns in Denver.

I follow water law and usage a lot so if you have questions about how silly Colorado is (note: its silly because there are way more people living here than rainfall can supply), let me know.

[jordanread]

It's illegal because apparently water that falls on the ground is supposed to be a municipal ownership item.   Having rain barrels stops rain water from flowing into reservoirs and aquifers. 

I don't get it though.   If I have a rain barrel I'm still going to let the water flow on the ground where the excess that isn't absorbed by plants will flow into the groundwater, I'm just doing it over a longer period.   In fact, if you use drip irrigation you'll lose less water to evaporation and more will be flowing into the aquifer.

Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear. I remember what they were saying the justification was, but it doesn't make any sense to me.

It actually isn't a municipal ownership thing, it is a private ownership thing. There is a farmer way downstream on the eastern plain who has been using X acre-feet of water per year and according to state law, he has a right to the water that has always been flowing in the river next to his farm because he started using it first. Add that up to all the farmers in the state and all of the water in all of the rivers has been accounted for. Water rights in Colorado are decided on a "first in use, first in right" basis so technically according to state law, if you use the water that falls on your land (or your house) you are stealing water from people downstream who own those water rights.

It's silly, but at the same time it discourages people from using more water than necessary. If you can't use a rain barrel and have to water all of your plants with municipal water you pay for, you will probably grow fewer irrigation-requiring plants because the municipal water is expensive.

Currently the only exemption for rain barrels in Colorado is for people who do not have access to municipal water and use a well. They can use a rain barrel because the thinking is that the water will go into the water table anyway. If someone started doing large scale irrigation farming with the water flowing off a large warehouse, the state would probably come down on them even if they technically didn't have municipal water.

Almost all municipal water in Colorado comes from public works projects to store water and divert it from one river to another. About 70% of Denver's city water comes from the west (far) side of the continental divide and is diverted through tunnels in the mountains. Lake Dillon in Summit County is purely a water storage project created to get water into a tunnel that comes out near Bailey, CO. Almost all of the water in Lake Dillon will eventually water lawns in Denver.

I follow water law and usage a lot so if you have questions about how silly Colorado is (note: its silly because there are way more people living here than rainfall can supply), let me know.

Thanks for that. I was just doing some research on it, and found when they changed the law in 2009 for the addition of some well rights. At the top of the document it says this:

Colorado water law declares that the state of Colorado claims the right to all moisture in the atmosphere that falls within its borders and that “said moisture is declared to be the property of the people of this state, dedicated to their use pursuant” to the Colorado constitution. According to the constitution, water must be appropriated according to priority of appropriation. As a result, in much of the state, it is illegal to divert rainwater falling on your property expressly for a certain use unless you have a very old water right or during occasional periods when there is a surplus of water in the river system. This is especially true in the urban, suburban, and rural areas along the Front Range. This system of water allocation plays an important role in protecting the owners of senior water rights that are entitled to appropriate the full amount of their decreed water right, particularly when there is not enough to satisfy them and parties whose water right is junior to them

It's just a flyer (http://water.state.co.us/DWRIPub/Documents/DWR_RainwaterFlyer.pdf) and since I'm at work, didn't want to dig too much into the statutes. I'll keep you in mind nawhite, if I have questions like that.

Also, didn't mean to hijack the thread from the OP...
:-)

[greaper007]

Thanks for the clarification.   I think I'll still put some barrels in the backyard this summer and long term I'd love to build a grey water system.   Has anyone done this?

[jordanread]

Thanks for the clarification.   I think I'll still put some barrels in the backyard this summer and long term I'd love to build a grey water system.   Has anyone done this?

Haven't done it, but researched quite a bit as I looked into earthships. It seems kind of neat and there are a lot of good resources out there (see http://earthship.com/Systems/water).

[phred]

could you collect rainwater running downslope into your fishpond and use that?  Many of us let the water run while waiting for it to "turn" hot; we should be able to collect that somehow into a covered outdoor barrel.

[phred]

Anyway, consider moving up some of your bulk food buying -- such as pistachios and perhaps almonds

[aclarridge]

Those laws still sound unreasonable to me...I could understand having a law that prevents people from collecting too much rainwater, but a small amount for personal use should be allowed. Ah well. Colorado has a lot of other things going for it.