Author Topic: bicycle tax  (Read 7150 times)

sol

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bicycle tax
« on: February 20, 2013, 09:07:02 PM »
My state government just proposed a new transportation bill that includes a $25 tax on all bicycle purchases over $500.  Does anyone know how common such taxes are in other places?

I'm mostly fine with the idea, as long as bicycle taxes come with bicycle infrastructure.  And because I don't see myself ever buying a bike new for that much money.  Still, part of me feels that bike lanes should be paid for by car taxes on the thought that they reduce the number of cars on the road, reducing congestion and road wear for drivers.

AnonymousCoward

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2013, 10:23:46 PM »
Taxes on specific items exist for revenue (eg hotel taxes), to disincentivize (eg cigarette taxes), or to offset externalities (eg gas taxes to pay for road maintenance).

Revenue and disincentive are unlikely, leaving option three. Presumably that means paying for bike infrastructure.

Like you I'm of the opinion that the benefits of bike infrastructure apply to all road users, not just bikes. So a bike tax doesn't make sense to me.

I'm also not a fan of earmarking taxes for specific expenses because it's just a bookkeeping trick. One dollar spent by the earmarked fund is one dollar less from the general fund. If the state wants to fund bike infrastructure they should make room in the budget. If there is no room in the budget increase revenue in the usual way.

Is there an article that explains the proposal?

dragoncar

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2013, 10:30:03 PM »
I wonder how much revenue they think this will create...

Googled and found it:

http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2013/02/washington_considers_25_bicycl.html

Apparently the $100k/year they think it will bring in is "largely symbolic"

squashroll

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2013, 10:41:50 PM »
Sol,
If yer in the Seattle area join Cascade Bicycle Club, they fight for all causes bicycle.  Personally I would love to send $25 towards bike advocacy, no new purchase needed.   
time to hit craig's list :/ 

gooki

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2013, 12:40:14 AM »
I highly expect this will create more expenses in administration than it will generate in income.

marty998

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2013, 12:56:35 AM »
Sounds like a car company CEO has been lobbying your government. "ohh I'm a tiny little multinational who needs some help standing up to the big bad immensely powerful bicycle constituency. Help me gov'nur....help meeeee"

I'm also not a fan of earmarking taxes for specific expenses because it's just a bookkeeping trick. One dollar spent by the earmarked fund is one dollar less from the general fund. If the state wants to fund bike infrastructure they should make room in the budget. If there is no room in the budget increase revenue in the usual way.

It seems the fashionable way for governments to levy increased taxes these days. Cons the sheeple into believing their taxes go to a specific purpose. It all ends up in consolidated revenue to be wasted in the usual manner.

GuitarStv

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2013, 06:26:08 AM »
I pay road taxes already.  My bicycle does significantly less damage to roadways than a large truck.  Why am I being given an additional tax to use a method of transportation that requires less maintenance and upkeep from the government?

I bike 90% of the time on regular roads with no bike lane with no problem.  Where's the benefit of this new tax?

anastrophe

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2013, 06:48:06 AM »
This is a strange policy move to fix the wrong problem--people believe cyclists don't pay for infrastructure so force them to chip in extra to make a point? I guess if you think money changes beliefs that directly, it might work, but eeeehhh...I don't think it's the right solution for that PR problem.

jrhampt

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2013, 08:07:31 AM »
I don't think we have one for bikes (yet), but we do get a yearly property tax on our trailer that we use to haul wood on occasion. 

Guitarguy

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2013, 10:21:58 AM »
Ridiculous. The should be a tax BREAK for bikes, not a tax. One bike on the road means one less car on the road.

Jamesqf

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2013, 10:27:51 AM »
Think of it as psychological warfare.  The biggest complaint from the glued-to-their-SUV sorts is that cyclists don't pay gas taxes, so that money shouldn't be "wasted" on things like bike lanes.  If bike users pay tax, you can just tell them to STFU.

James

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2013, 10:30:21 AM »
I highly expect this will create more expenses in administration than it will generate in income.

I agree.  Like sol I wouldn't get too uptight about the idea of the thing, but I'd be cynical about it having any affect for good or bad, just an added bureaucracy.

TheDude

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2013, 10:33:18 AM »
I don't think there should be a tax on bicycles as you already pay sales tax. There are several reasons I believe this:

1. I think car fees should be based on engine size and weight. No engine no tax.
2. I don't like bike trails (to many kids and walkers) and I don't like bike lanes (to dirty) so other than enforcement of current rules there is not much else I  want.

destron

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2013, 10:35:39 AM »
I wonder how much revenue they think this will create...

Googled and found it:

http://blog.oregonlive.com/commuting/2013/02/washington_considers_25_bicycl.html

Apparently the $100k/year they think it will bring in is "largely symbolic"

In L.A., within the last few years they passed an increase on the sales tax to fund public transportation projects. I am completely willing to pay for more train lines or dedicated bus lines, but the reality is the money for the projected 30 years of the tax has already been spent. I suspect that the $100k estimate just means that they want to spend that much money on something (if Washingtonians are lucky, on bicycle infrastructure) and pretend that the project is fully funded.

tooqk4u22

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2013, 10:43:12 AM »
I don't think there should be a tax on bicycles as you already pay sales tax. There are several reasons I believe this:

1. I think car fees should be based on engine size and weight. No engine no tax.
2. I don't like bike trails (to many kids and walkers) and I don't like bike lanes (to dirty) so other than enforcement of current rules there is not much else I  want.


Well there used to be a luxury tax (in excess of sales tax) on cars over a certain dollar amount in the US and are some in other countries, so this could simply be a form of that - taxing conspicuous consumption because you are rich and if you can afford this than you can afford to pay more taxes.  Sounds ridiculous but if the average bike (likely sold at walmart) is $100 then five times that amount would certainly be a luxury.

kendallf

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2013, 11:19:44 AM »
Think of it as psychological warfare.  The biggest complaint from the glued-to-their-SUV sorts is that cyclists don't pay gas taxes, so that money shouldn't be "wasted" on things like bike lanes.  If bike users pay tax, you can just tell them to STFU.

+1

This is one of THE most frequent comments I get when I mention Jacksonville's status as one of the worst cities in the US for safe cycling, and the need for more cycling infrastructure funding.  I would happily pay such a tax, or even an annual registration tax similar to cars, to shut down this knee jerk reaction.

Jacksonville is currently fighting over a repeal of new construction impact fees that are earmarked for transportation, which currently provide most of the funding for any bike related projects in the city.  One of the most frequent comments on news stories and social media regarding the fight is the "those *@$~! cyclists should pay their own way"..

cambridgecyclist

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2013, 11:22:54 AM »
  I think an additional tax on cycling creates a disincentive towards riding bicycles. The fact is that anyone who commutes by bicycle already pays a disproportionately higher amount of tax since the amount of wear and tear  bicycle causes on roads is negligible compared to the damage that automobiles do. Use taxes like gas taxes, excise tax, registration and licensing fees and tolls don't cover all of the costs for automobile-friendly infrastructure as it is -- the bulk of the tax revenue comes from property tax -- and if anything, people who are primarily cyclists and are living in a residence are already subsidizing automobile road use.
  Perpetuating misconceptions and creating laws based on them only encourages people to maintain their misunderstanding.

BuildingFrugalHabits

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2013, 12:16:29 PM »
  I think an additional tax on cycling creates a disincentive towards riding bicycles. The fact is that anyone who commutes by bicycle already pays a disproportionately higher amount of tax since the amount of wear and tear  bicycle causes on roads is negligible compared to the damage that automobiles do. Use taxes like gas taxes, excise tax, registration and licensing fees and tolls don't cover all of the costs for automobile-friendly infrastructure as it is -- the bulk of the tax revenue comes from property tax -- and if anything, people who are primarily cyclists and are living in a residence are already subsidizing automobile road use.
  Perpetuating misconceptions and creating laws based on them only encourages people to maintain their misunderstanding.

^^^^  This!

capital

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2013, 08:51:57 AM »
In most jurisdictions, local streets (the ones people ride bikes on) are generally paid for out of property/income taxes, as opposed to via the gas tax.

JamesL

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2013, 10:37:30 AM »
We'd be getting double taxed then, because I'd be willing to bet most of us have cars, even though we bike commute when we can. I pay registration that is supposedly paying for the wear and tear my car does to the road.

Therefore, the more bike lines and the better infrastructure in general they provide for bicyclists will provide them a great ROI (less wear on the roads). Plus we could always throw in the health care costs it would save Big Brother. That alone is the most powerful argument for spending money on making our society bike friendly.

No Name Guy

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Re: bicycle tax
« Reply #20 on: February 27, 2013, 01:53:23 PM »
All who have commented on how little wear and tear bikes (and for that matter, pedestrians) do.

While strictly true that bikes do little damage, not all road maintenance is needed as a result of traffic breaking down the surface or damaging the structure of the pavement.  Dedicated bike ways / multi use trails need regular maintenance the same as roads.

Examples of routine maintenance that would accrue no matter what the traffic load include weather induced damage, such as freeze thaw cycles breaking up pavement, falling trees both directly blocking the route and up turned root balls ripping holes, land slides (happens often enough here in the hilly and wet PNW) and the like.  Additionally, there's normal debris removal / sweeping - ever see the roads after a good wind storm?  Yeah, again, here in the PNW they're liberally sprinkled with branches and other debris (at least in my area they are - probably less so in down town Seattle).  Bike ways / multi use trails here (like the Burke Gilman that runs from the Ballard neighborhood of Seattle to the UW, then north around Lake Washington where it turns into the Sammamish River Trail and goes to Marymoor Park - check the Wikipedia entry for info) would soon over grow if the brush / brambles / sticker bushes on either side in many places weren't cut back on a regular basis.  Drainage must be maintained on a regular basis else the road bed will be undermined and fail, or a land slide induced due to over saturation, creek crossing would wash away, etc.  Bridges must be inspected on a regular basis for structural integrity and repairs made as needed (from corrosion or the myriad other environmental causes, or just regular protective painting).  In snow prone areas, would the dedicated bike / pedestrian routes need to be plowed and de-iced, or left for natural melting / clearing?  Roots growing under the paving need to be periodically removed and the paving restored to a even grade (it sure sucks to hit a root caused swell in the pavement on a skinny high pressure tired road bike, doesn't it?).

It would be interesting to know how much is spent maintaining the 27 miles of the Burke Gillman / Sammamish River Trail per annum.  As it gets zero vehicle traffic, this would be a good data point on what it would cost (in the PNW at least) to maintain dedicated bike / pedestrian ways.

The point being, that you just can't build bike ways or multi use trails (no matter the funding source) and walk away from them expecting them to be maintenance free since "bikes don't damage pavement".  These dedicated routes have to be kept up no matter how "light" the traffic is as the pavement wear and tear is but one aspect of road / bike way / multi use trail maintenance.